Europa-List Digest Archive

Fri 05/30/14


Total Messages Posted: 11



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 04:56 AM - Re: Key Sanding................and Instrument Panel ventilation (John Wighton)
     2. 07:17 AM - Re: Europa-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 05/29/14 (Gary Leinberger)
     3. 08:07 AM - antennas (David Joyce)
     4. 08:51 AM - Re: antennas (rparigoris)
     5. 09:33 AM - Re: Key Sanding................and Instrument Panel ventilation  (Fred Klein)
     6. 09:59 AM - Re: Key Sanding................and Instrument Panel ventilation (spcialeffects)
     7. 10:44 AM - Re: antennas (Frans Veldman)
     8. 02:03 PM - Re: antennas (david park)
     9. 02:06 PM - |Arblast Propellar Spinner (Alan Carter)
    10. 03:17 PM - Castle Kennedy fly in (KENNETH ATKINSON)
    11. 04:00 PM - Re: Re: Key Sanding................and Instrument Panel ventilation (Tony Renshaw)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 04:56:24 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Key Sanding................and Instrument Panel ventilation
    From: "John Wighton" <john@wighton.net>
    Tony, Not sure on where the surface area discussion is going - or the objective. Regarding the panel, l installed 2off fans in a carbon frame above the 6 pack/EFIS hybrid panel in G-IPOD. This is the highest point hence hot air will collect here. It performs the de-mist function in the cockpit (no other heater is fitted). I can send some pics if needed. Regards John -------- John Wighton Europa XS trigear G-IPOD Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=424022#424022


    Message 2


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    Time: 07:17:12 AM PST US
    From: Gary Leinberger <Gary.Leinberger@millersville.edu>
    Subject: RE: Europa-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 05/29/14
    I have two fans on my panel - both in front of the pilot on top, about 4 inches in from the windshield. I need the cooling as I have a full IFR panel, with a Garmin 430 W that puts out more heat than my college year's Morgan (sport car) heater ever did (one would think by owning a Morgan one would learn from that about English engineering - I must be infected with something to build an English airplane) . I also have a temperature controlled thermostat with a timer so that on landing the fans run for up to 45 minutes after turning off the engine (I have a secondary battery and buss to run my backup attitude indicator and soaring buss). In the winter the fans also de-mist the windshield. It is important to have openings in the bottom so air can be drawn in. I realize the bottom of the panel doesn't fit that well but be sure you have sufficient area to allow air in. I also have a fan that has tubing blowing directly into the Garmin 430, 330 transponder and GRT HX EFIS. (Yes, I know - it is heavy but I think the real weight problem comes from the Jacuzzi in the back bay. And the A/C doesn't help.) (Just joking about the A/C and Jacuzzi.) By the way, despite all the IFR stuff and added weight I get 136 kts flat out at 1000 feet, which may be due in part to the high top which seems to make it faster than normal Europas despite more frontal area. Gary Leinberger N388SG Lancaster, Pa. USA ________________________________________ From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] on behalf of Europa-List Digest Server [europa-list@matronics.com] Sent: Friday, May 30, 2014 3:02 AM Subject: Europa-List Digest: 1 Msgs - 05/29/14 * ================================================= Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive ================================================= Today's complete Europa-List Digest can also be found in either of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser. HTML Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 14-05-29&Archive=Europa Text Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 14-05-29&Archive=Europa =============================================== EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive =============================================== ---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 05/29/14: 1 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 10:24 PM - Key Sanding................and Instrument Panel ventilation (Tony Renshaw) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 10:24:06 PM PST US From: Tony Renshaw <tonyrenshaw268@gmail.com> Subject: Europa-List: Key Sanding................and Instrument Panel ventilation Gidday, I want to air a hypothesis that key sanding does NOT matter what grade of paper, so long as you dull it off. The premise is that by roughening you are removing the gloss, and increasing the surface area. I am aware that the heavier the grade of paper you use, the more likely you are to damage the glass fibres within the matrix. So, I dont want advice on Grade of paper, but I do want to ask whether people think that this could be true: I believe there is a likelihood that whether you use 240 Grit paper, or 60 Grit paper, that the substrate will increase in surface area by the same amount. Thats my debate. I also believe there is a likelihood that the amount will be twice the surface area, but I dont know how to mathematically prove it, however Id like it explained in simple terms, what the actual formula is in someone elses view. In fact Ill go a step further and hypothesise that it is 1/2 surface area of a circle MINUS the are of the diameter of a similar radius circle. Im going to retract double, and reckon it is closer to a 50 % increase. Any takers? Anyone had enough red wine to give this consideration? There might be two guys out there in the Cottswalds, but they will probably just argue between themselves, so I thought Id air it to the greater Europa community. Regards Tony Renshaw P.S. I have an instrument panel fan, a computer fan, and I am wondering where would be the most advised place to put it? I am thinking midway between the main panel and the radio stack, behind the mono wheel gear retraction handle rebate, on the RHS. Whatdoyareckon?


    Message 3


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    Time: 08:07:02 AM PST US
    From: "David Joyce" <davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk>
    Subject: antennas
    I would be grateful if one of you experts in radio matters could tell me whether one can add a couple of metres of good quality coax cable to distance the stub antenna of a hand held Icom transceiver from the radio, positioning the stub aerial on top of the fuselage behind the pilot, without mucking up its function. I hasten to add that this is not for my Europa but for a Build a Plane project I am involved in which will rely on an Icom, but which picks up a load of ignition noise if positioned on the panel, just behind the engine. Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ


    Message 4


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    Time: 08:51:31 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: antennas
    From: "rparigoris" <rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us>
    Hi David The rubber duckie antenna is not all that good of an antenna. I have fooled with extending mine aft on the Europa and reception on the ground and performance was poor at best, no worst than when it was directly on the unit. A better solution for me was AAE and Balsa. It ends up weighing under 4 oz. and works about 70% as well for both VOR and Communication. http://www.europaowners.org/main.php?g2_itemId=31216 Ron Parigoris Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=424045#424045


    Message 5


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    Time: 09:33:35 AM PST US
    From: Fred Klein <fklein@orcasonline.com>
    Subject: Re: Key Sanding................and Instrument Panel ventilation
    On May 29, 2014, at 10:23 PM, Tony Renshaw <tonyrenshaw268@gmail.com> wrote: > =93 I believe there is a likelihood that whether you use 240 Grit paper, or 60 Grit paper, that the substrate will increase in surface area by the same amount=94. > Any takers? Anyone had enough red wine to give this consideration? =85too early in the morning for the wine=85intuitively, as I imagine a field of a given size covered w/ hemispheres=85an approximation of grit paper...as I imagine the surface area of the hemispheres as the hemispheres diminish in size=85I cannot escape the conclusion that the total surface area will increase in inverse proportion to the diameter of the hemispheres=85 =85nonetheless=85I can think of better reasons to avoid 60 grit when key sanding=85 > P.S. I have an instrument panel fan, a computer fan, and I am wondering where would be the most advised place to put it? I am thinking midway between the main panel and the radio stack, behind the mono wheel gear retraction handle rebate, on the RHS. Whatdoyareckon? I reckon putting in 3 those 120 mm computer fans @ $10 each were the was easiest decision I=92ve had to make regarding my panel=85I=92m uncertain at this time whether or not I=92ll use the little louvered vents intended to direct airflow towards the windscreen. F.


    Message 6


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    Time: 09:59:57 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Key Sanding................and Instrument Panel ventilation
    From: "spcialeffects" <spcialeffects@aol.com>
    Hi john, I'd be interested in seeing a few pics please. Thanks Frank Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=424054#424054


    Message 7


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    Time: 10:44:54 AM PST US
    From: Frans Veldman <frans@privatepilots.nl>
    Subject: Re: antennas
    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 05/30/2014 05:06 PM, David Joyce wrote: > I would be grateful if one of you experts in radio matters could > tell me whether one can add a couple of metres of good quality coax > cable to distance the stub antenna of a hand held Icom transceiver > from the radio, positioning the stub aerial on top of the fuselage > behind the pilot, without mucking up its function. Yes you can do that, provided you create some artificial ground at the antenna connector (unless the airplane is made of metal). On the radio, the radio itself plus the person holding the radio are some kind of ground, but if you relocate the antenna you need something below the antenna to take over that function. (If you don't, the outer shield of the coax will take over that function, but this is probably not what you want). Note that the stub antenna of the hand held radio has less performance than a full quarter wave antenna. (Inside this stub antenna you will find a coil; it is still a quarter wave antenna but most of the length has been coiled up and doesn't radiate as much anymore.) Frans -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJTiM8dAAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVXs8QAJAIsCH7BC8PkH+OjdEWjDYn 8Su9JXiGaGDCqYC5kMJCPUMEr2AQVLqCnGxdo9VMHa09LJj3Jsa+DtXxxWGbiJTn g6NMNyiPDeuVu1bweGaAu1gG63Vm9snyrWKGyyLNksezZUR29QGwp8xUlrNxdTLk ckKlunoF1xURZfV9GWaunGlxzbTDaMgPBpD/l6Td1cgoeDflVH2rQOiscHY3ZxBN mmFVlyZRoK46geUEesR2pKDAOELISvGeMA5LYktWa3sVgBBQWDOAxIJ7ktdzx2vY U4f+e7tWEA+4wBQedbqXVLIr/cIqKLua/mOXHoM8UykaJEYMnzIO7HCvldyu8HLm ZzoiHRmPnoPSdQT8k3hhfsjaCEfCFCd7pcZowtE2u0v1RzTEH1UtdlU2Gn7lVj6I qeKGGR/qwxrLUN7kMDxbQX9n8+Jfj/WfzKz0zgWIhd8kQ/0KTbvr15l9LnfRy5Qh n9DQRlsD75TuGyEMIVR4XRS8IbK4zH32pQ3IM7+IvmlSqk546CP9FNPurW7cM1WZ E23h42riyY1YS4SeNBcAfX0ixv/x2Yb8XkH2vYZlfhzuCiVnMBVOC6Vyh/D7Jry6 FAnXhWGYpu31P5lYjfgZWuoTGErGUxXvz9XUgryHwbS3qbM0Ys4g7epsTWbSH7we CGTr9VsCBFndRVK1m4Td =/4la -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----


    Message 8


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    Time: 02:03:38 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: antennas
    From: david park <europa-list@matronics.com>
    I used a 4 or 5 foot extension intended for a GPS Antenna which ends up with with a window sucker plugged in to Icom one end and the Icom Antenna plugged in the window sucker end. Works perfectly used as stand by com. Dave Sent from my iPhone > On 30 May 2014, at 18:47, "Frans Veldman" <frans@privatepilots.nl> wrote: > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > >> On 05/30/2014 05:06 PM, David Joyce wrote: >> >> I would be grateful if one of you experts in radio matters could >> tell me whether one can add a couple of metres of good quality coax >> cable to distance the stub antenna of a hand held Icom transceiver >> from the radio, positioning the stub aerial on top of the fuselage >> behind the pilot, without mucking up its function. > > Yes you can do that, provided you create some artificial ground at the > antenna connector (unless the airplane is made of metal). On the > radio, the radio itself plus the person holding the radio are some > kind of ground, but if you relocate the antenna you need something > below the antenna to take over that function. (If you don't, the outer > shield of the coax will take over that function, but this is probably > not what you want). > Note that the stub antenna of the hand held radio has less performance > than a full quarter wave antenna. (Inside this stub antenna you will > find a coil; it is still a quarter wave antenna but most of the length > has been coiled up and doesn't radiate as much anymore.) > > Frans > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) > > iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJTiM8dAAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVXs8QAJAIsCH7BC8PkH+OjdEWjDYn > 8Su9JXiGaGDCqYC5kMJCPUMEr2AQVLqCnGxdo9VMHa09LJj3Jsa+DtXxxWGbiJTn > g6NMNyiPDeuVu1bweGaAu1gG63Vm9snyrWKGyyLNksezZUR29QGwp8xUlrNxdTLk > ckKlunoF1xURZfV9GWaunGlxzbTDaMgPBpD/l6Td1cgoeDflVH2rQOiscHY3ZxBN > mmFVlyZRoK46geUEesR2pKDAOELISvGeMA5LYktWa3sVgBBQWDOAxIJ7ktdzx2vY > U4f+e7tWEA+4wBQedbqXVLIr/cIqKLua/mOXHoM8UykaJEYMnzIO7HCvldyu8HLm > ZzoiHRmPnoPSdQT8k3hhfsjaCEfCFCd7pcZowtE2u0v1RzTEH1UtdlU2Gn7lVj6I > qeKGGR/qwxrLUN7kMDxbQX9n8+Jfj/WfzKz0zgWIhd8kQ/0KTbvr15l9LnfRy5Qh > n9DQRlsD75TuGyEMIVR4XRS8IbK4zH32pQ3IM7+IvmlSqk546CP9FNPurW7cM1WZ > E23h42riyY1YS4SeNBcAfX0ixv/x2Yb8XkH2vYZlfhzuCiVnMBVOC6Vyh/D7Jry6 > FAnXhWGYpu31P5lYjfgZWuoTGErGUxXvz9XUgryHwbS3qbM0Ys4g7epsTWbSH7we > CGTr9VsCBFndRVK1m4Td > =/4la > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > > >


    Message 9


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    Time: 02:06:26 PM PST US
    Subject: |Arblast Propellar Spinner
    From: "Alan Carter" <alancarteresq@onetel.net>
    Hi All. Just had my permit done, the only maintenance I can see is to grease the lead screw. However my spinner rotates un-evenly, i can only put the spinner on the same way round as the screws only line up that way. I have checked the rear back plate which is only about a mm out of true, I note there is another circular plate in front of the prop, but this plate does not attach to the spinner, at this same position on the spinner there is a row of screws ie imitation not used, They are just forward of the plate mentioned above, i was wondering if this is normal or should the screws be attached to this forward plate. The spinner plates seem to be made of thin aluminium backed with fibre glass to give it strength, the spinner is also thin fibre glass about 14 or 15" in length. The screws i have mentioned are forward of the plate so no means of fixing them to the plate, its the rear screws only that hold the spinner on. Regards. Alan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=424069#424069


    Message 10


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    Time: 03:17:36 PM PST US
    From: KENNETH ATKINSON <kennethatkinson178@btinternet.com>
    Subject: Castle Kennedy fly in
    Hi, =0A----- Sorry this is a bit late.=0A------Are th ere any other Europas likely to attend Castle Kennedy Fly-in tomorrow.=0A ----- I am flying in in the morning.=0A---=0A-- I thoro ughly enjoyed it last year-good food,lots of aircraft,model flying,nice cas tle to visit -see website!=0A-- =0A-- Ken-- G-CEKV


    Message 11


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    Time: 04:00:36 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Key Sanding................and Instrument Panel ventilation
    From: Tony Renshaw <tonyrenshaw268@gmail.com>
    Hi John, Re Key Sanding, I suppose the purpose is to legitimise why we do it, and its because Ive been doing work on the very thin sandwich skin of the fuselage. The cloth in question is so thin, and I believe any strong Grit will compromise the structure, so it got me thinking about what the goal really is. I reckon the goal is to abrade the matrix resin, without compromising or ideally even touching the entrapped glass, and in essence increasing the surface area in the process. I then wondered academically whether there was any difference in the surface area between one Grit and another, and I dont believe there is, SO, when key sanding, any grit will do if it roughens the surface and dulls it off. Thats all, just an academic exercise, but I know there are smarter guys than me on the list, so I asked. re: Instrument Panel Venting, I have kindly been sent a few photos but am always desiring seeing how others have done things, so yes, Id love to get some photos. Thanks John. Regards Tony Renshaw On 30 May 2014, at 9:55 pm, John Wighton <john@wighton.net> wrote: > > Tony, > > Not sure on where the surface area discussion is going - or the objective. > > Regarding the panel, l installed 2off fans in a carbon frame above the 6 pack/EFIS hybrid panel in G-IPOD. This is the highest point hence hot air will collect here. It performs the de-mist function in the cockpit (no other heater is fitted). > > I can send some pics if needed. > > Regards > John > > -------- > John Wighton > Europa XS trigear G-IPOD > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=424022#424022 > > > > > > > > > >




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