---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 06/16/14: 12 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:41 AM - Europa Club Mod Process (pmorgans) 2. 04:19 AM - Re: Trim damper and sticking the top on. (Richard Collings) 3. 05:02 AM - Re: Europa Club Mod Process (Brian Davies) 4. 05:10 AM - Re: LAA Night / IFR Trials (Brian Davies) 5. 07:17 AM - Noncontact fuel level indicator (Andrew Sarangan) 6. 07:41 AM - Re: Noncontact fuel level indicator (Pete Lawless) 7. 08:04 AM - Re: Noncontact fuel level indicator (Peter Zutrauen) 8. 02:02 PM - Re: LAA Night / IFR Trials (Steven Pitt) 9. 03:19 PM - Re: Re: Clevice \Forks debacle......... (Tony Renshaw) 10. 05:27 PM - Re: Europa Club Mod Process (pmorgans) 11. 07:02 PM - Soldering Advice (Tony Renshaw) 12. 07:32 PM - Re: Soldering Advice (rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:41:22 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Europa Club Mod Process From: "pmorgans" I would like to 'modify' Mod33 ( water drains ) on my XS to obtain shorter and lower level drain paths; I'd also like fit a gascolator on the feed pipe to the mechanical pump. I've tried using the Europa Club Mod Form but can't seem to get it to work. Should I go direct to the LAA? I don't want to re-invent the wheel so might even post my thoughts on the Forum for comment.[/i][/b] Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=424915#424915 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:19:13 AM PST US From: "Richard Collings" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Trim damper and sticking the top on. Will I understand your concern and agree with everything Fred has said, with hindsight I would have fitted/glued the headlining material and cut and trial fitted the carpets etc. More importantly I temporally mounted on both sides of the canoe a 25mm wide strip of 3mm steel on the inside of the mating flange with 5mm cheese headed bolts every 150mm, I then lowered the top on and into position made clearing holes so that I could remove the bolts/strips later after final gluing, and the used bolts with plate washers tapped into the steel strip instead of the clecoes. I used clecoes round the tail as per the manual. This allowed me to fit and refit the top and align everything before we finally glued the top on. This method reduces the humps you tend to create along the joint line and subsequently the amount of filler needed to smooth it out later. I was also able to make L brackets to support the baggage bay bulkhead and trial fit before the final gluing. One last thing, if like me you find it necessary to take the top on and off many times, I mackled up a simple overhead winch to do the job [there is no weight but its very unwieldy] and from memory as soon as glue gets involved the simplest of tasks can grow horns. Good luck. Richard From: Fred Klein Sent: Sunday, June 15, 2014 5:10 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: Trim damper and sticking the top on. Will, As tempting as it may be to cross the =93top bonding threshold=94, in my case I was content to mate top to canoe with clecos spaced at 12=94 o.c. until the very last possible moment=85that is=85until I had scoured the build manual thoroughly and literally could NOT find ANYTHING whatsoever which did not ABSOLUTELY REQUIRE the top to have been bonded on in order to accomplish it. And you have to be thinking of things you want to do with your build which are in addition to the standard kit which may have no mention in the manual. When I say use clecoes, I=92m not relying upon the dozen little threaded temporary fasteners which came w/ the kit, because IMO if you defer top bonding beyond the stage cited in the manual, it is critical to use a sufficient number of fasteners to ensure that the geometry of the fuselage is fixed and not subject to wobble or twist. I had bought (I think 100) of the push pull clecos which are popped in and out w/ a simple little proprietary tool. Doing this allowed me, for example, to fully install all my fuel pumps and plumbing, strobe power supply and wiring with ease=85I even sprayed my Zolatone finish w/ the canoe upside down and was able to hit the wells in the baggage bay without contortions=85(of course, I had to go back and hit the joint between top and canoe later but that was a snap and the color blended perfectly). Obviously, when approaching the various tasks out of sequence, one must keep in mind that things must be positioned for future maintenance, etc. But I recall marveling on a number of occasions how challenging many little tasks would have been if I had not followed the sequence that I had. When you finally reach the point of actual bonding, a tip I learned from Kingsley Hurst was to make up, in advance, some little fiberglass =93washers=94=85I think I made up some w/ 2 layers of BID and some w/ 4 layers of BID. So at every cleco, I would use a washer of the required thickness to bring the exterior surface of the top and canoe flush w/ one another thus saving the weight, time, and trouble of applying and sanding an excessive amount of filler to eliminate the appearance of a seam. I noted at each cleco the number and thickness of washers required. Of course this technique relies on the ability of Redux / flox to bridge the resulting gap resulting from the thickness of the washers, so use plenty of material to ensure the seam is fully filled and bonded. Good luck, Fred On Jun 14, 2014, at 4:34 PM, William Daniell wrote: Yesterday I got permission from the inspector to turn my canoe into and airplane. But before i stick the top on can I ask the general wisdom for gotchas. I have done installed pretty much everything I can,,,I think. All the tail assembly, the pitch containment plywood thing and the electrics. The coax for the antenna. Installed the battery the main gear and the flap actuator system, set the wing incidence... Anything else I should have done? ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:02:25 AM PST US From: "Brian Davies" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Europa Club Mod Process If you are "modifying" Mod 33, it is new mod and will need to be cleared by LAA Engineering. If you can find someone who has already made the changes you are thinking of that will help a great deal in speeding up mod approval so it would be worth sharing your ideas on the forum. Regards Brian -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of pmorgans Sent: 16 June 2014 11:40 Subject: Europa-List: Europa Club Mod Process --> I would like to 'modify' Mod33 ( water drains ) on my XS to obtain shorter and lower level drain paths; I'd also like fit a gascolator on the feed pipe to the mechanical pump. I've tried using the Europa Club Mod Form but can't seem to get it to work. Should I go direct to the LAA? I don't want to re-invent the wheel so might even post my thoughts on the Forum for comment.[/i][/b] Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=424915#424915 ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:10:45 AM PST US From: "Brian Davies" Subject: RE: Europa-List: LAA Night / IFR Trials It is not for me to reveal the aircraft being used. I will leave that to the owner. The initial trials start with demonstrating that the aircraft can meet the IFR stability requirements of CS-23. Once this is proven, the aircraft has to comply with the instrument, radio and electrical requirements of CS-23. It will then enter the test flight phase which will be a series of IMC and night trials , both simulated and real,. We are carrying out these initial trials on a small number of different aircraft to prove the process before seeking full approval from the CAA for the LAA to recommend exemption from the "daylight/VFR" Permit limitations for individual aircraft. Brian Davies -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sky Mail Sent: 14 June 2014 06:25 Subject: Europa-List: LAA Night / IFR Trials --> Hi UK Forumites I see that the LAA have just announced the start of night and IFR trials for PtoF aircraft and included the Europa in the list of trial aircraft. I assume the factory will be as absent as ever from Europa developments so does anyone know whose aircraft will be involved and what form these trials will take? Richard CC Sent from my iPad ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:17:21 AM PST US From: Andrew Sarangan Subject: Europa-List: Noncontact fuel level indicator The fuel tank is translucent. One can clearly see the fuel level by eye. So, it occurred to me why not build a fuel level sensor that attaches to the outside of the tank? I recently built such a unit with LED illuminators and detectors, and it works like a charm. It even shows the waves when the fuel is sloshing around. Only question is, how does the translucency of the tank change with time? If it becomes totally opaque in a few years, then this won't work. I can post further details of the device if anyone is interested. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:41:08 AM PST US From: Pete Lawless Subject: Re: Europa-List: Noncontact fuel level indicator Hi Andrew My tank is 12 years in use and you can still see through it. Be very interested to see details of your design. I have a flow meter and a tank float gauge but which would you believe if they disagreed? Thanks Pete G-RMAC Classic #109 On 16/06/14 15:15, Andrew Sarangan wrote: > > The fuel tank is translucent. One can clearly see the fuel level by > eye. So, it occurred to me why not build a fuel level sensor that > attaches to the outside of the tank? I recently built such a unit with > LED illuminators and detectors, and it works like a charm. It even > shows the waves when the fuel is sloshing around. Only question is, > how does the translucency of the tank change with time? If it becomes > totally opaque in a few years, then this won't work. I can post > further details of the device if anyone is interested. > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:04:00 AM PST US From: Peter Zutrauen Subject: Re: Europa-List: Noncontact fuel level indicator Very interesting! I would be very interested in the details. As an alternative, could a small tube made of a suitably resistant material (run against the outside of the tank) be used for the detector? Cheers, Pete On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 10:15 AM, Andrew Sarangan wrote: > > The fuel tank is translucent. One can clearly see the fuel level by > eye. So, it occurred to me why not build a fuel level sensor that > attaches to the outside of the tank? I recently built such a unit with > LED illuminators and detectors, and it works like a charm. It even > shows the waves when the fuel is sloshing around. Only question is, > how does the translucency of the tank change with time? If it becomes > totally opaque in a few years, then this won't work. I can post > further details of the device if anyone is interested. > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 02:02:52 PM PST US From: "Steven Pitt" Subject: Re: Europa-List: LAA Night / IFR Trials Thank you Brian for your response to Richard's question. I have been trying to get an official response from the LAA Engineering Department to include a piece in the next Europa Flyer (which is at the presses as we speak). The Club has been informed of these trials and we are delighted that a Europa has been included and as soon as we have more official information we will post it. Speaking to Brian Hope at Aeroexpo he said that he was in great demand at the show from people wanting to know more about the trials and what equipment will be acceptable in our Europas. However, we are a long way from having that information so can I ask for patience, please. No-one is more eager to know what is required than me. Regards Steve Pitt Chairman, Europa Club ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Davies" Sent: Monday, June 16, 2014 1:10 PM Subject: RE: Europa-List: LAA Night / IFR Trials > > > It is not for me to reveal the aircraft being used. I will leave that to > the owner. The initial trials start with demonstrating that the aircraft > can meet the IFR stability requirements of CS-23. Once this is proven, > the > aircraft has to comply with the instrument, radio and electrical > requirements of CS-23. It will then enter the test flight phase which > will > be a series of IMC and night trials , both simulated and real,. We are > carrying out these initial trials on a small number of different aircraft > to > prove the process before seeking full approval from the CAA for the LAA to > recommend exemption from the "daylight/VFR" Permit limitations for > individual aircraft. > > Brian Davies > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sky Mail > Sent: 14 June 2014 06:25 > To: europa-list > Subject: Europa-List: LAA Night / IFR Trials > > --> > > Hi UK Forumites > > I see that the LAA have just announced the start of night and IFR trials > for > PtoF aircraft and included the Europa in the list of trial aircraft. I > assume the factory will be as absent as ever from Europa developments so > does anyone know whose aircraft will be involved and what form these > trials > will take? > > Richard CC > > Sent from my iPad > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 03:19:12 PM PST US From: Tony Renshaw Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Clevice \Forks debacle......... Thanks Bud, You say solder must prevent wicking to prevent cracking....could you elabora te please? Regards Tony Renshaw Sent from my iPad > On 16 Jun 2014, at 12:20 pm, Bud Yerly wrote: > > Tony > I am out of town on family/Europa family visits combining work and pleasur e. Our first trip together for Anita and I in years. Short I phone answer: > > Please consult Allied Electronics (alliedelec.com). I use Amp/Tyco or Nor thwest D sub connectors. They have crimp connectors from #30-#18 gauge wire . Trim servos are normally #26 sized. > > Buy the pins and keep on hand in assorted bins. Aircraft avionics use mos tly 22,20 and for higher power 18. > > I buy the assortment of pins that cover a range. 22-24, 20-22, and for hi gher amps 18, > > Buy descent crimpers of the ratchet type and practice. > > I do D subs everywhere. If I need a interior quick disconnect I use a D s ub or the very small Molex with square connectors. > > Solder has to be practiced and MUST prevent wicking to prevent cracking. O f you are good at it go for it. > > Regards, > Bud > > > Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID > > > Tony Renshaw wrote: > > Hi Bud, > Reviewing my emails I noticed your thorough input below to my trim questio n. I posted recently, some time later, my conclusions, which aerodynamically I will vouch for, but, it is contrary to what you recommended. The manual o mits to tell you the orientation of the rivet pattern, which has been the ro ot of my dilemma. My components conflict because of the rivet head, which is a real irritation. I often build too fine tolerances, which is probably a c ommon perfectionist trait, but it commonly creates problems, like this one. I am chasing around trying to get all the pitch circuit sorted, with the to p on and off trying to get the counterweight throw sorted too, so that the t ailplane hits the bump stops before physical stops. As I did it years ago, I am relearning everything including soldering and fine wire connections for t he RC Allen servo and position gauge. I would like to know what form of conn ector you recommend on the fine wires of the poaition indicator? I could sol der on a D-Sub fitting but would prefer a Fast-On crimp but they dont seem t o suit below a #22 AWG wire. I also have to get the indicator's connector th rough the panel hole, because as i recall it is slid into the hole and rests in place with a surrounding flange. I am in Tokyo, so cant check at the mom ent, but the implication is that my connector needs to go through the hole, a nd the wires are not that long out if the position indicator to not get it r ight the first, or at a pinch, the second time. > Seems my cranked control sticks with my Tosten grips are going to give me g rief too, as they sit ontop if the stick, through a 1" insert, so the sticks have been cut down as much as possible but still conflict with my panel. I m ight have to cut and weld in an insert in the middle portion of the stick. I t currently doesnt seem to come back far enough at full aft stick, as its on ly mid thigh. I reckon it should come back till my left elbow is against the seat back would be a good geometry test, so I need to get it back more. I h ave a fence arrangement around the bottom of my sticks, to attach a leather b oot, and stop FOD jamming the controls, but it now makes iy very awkward for me to get in there to try and lengthen the link rod, to crank back the enti re range. So, still a work in progress, but I was told to work from the back forward, which is why I'm messing around with trim units. So Bud, if you've got any tips about small wire connectors, i'll soak it up with thanks. > Regards > Tony Renshaw > > > On 24 May 2014, at 12:03, Bud Yerly wrote: > >> Tony, >> In Annex E it says: >> Check that trim bellcrank does not contact TS05 push-rod when fully aft ( tab full up) and tailplane is >> >> trailing edge up. >> >> This should be in Chapter 19 also but is not as it is assumed when checki ng clearances. >> >> If I read you correctly, I am just repeating what others have said I am a fraid. With the stab full up and trim rod full down, the TS05, T shaped tri m push rod, should not contact the TS 03 bell crank long arm side where the t rim clevises attach at full up stab (I use 13 degrees full up). The clevis f rom the motor to the clevis on the TS03 butt against one another on the #8 r od attaching them. If you look with the stabs all done, trim tabs on, and f ully extended trim motor, look hard at the TS05 trim rod and it normally jus t contacts the clevis. Simply take it apart,(it is an airplane so if you ha ven't taken it apart and put it together 5 times, you are doing it wrong.) c ut 1/16 inch from each clevis and reassemble and test. 1/8 inch off each is the most I have done. At this time check the TS05 trim push rod does not r ub against the slot in the bulkhead it passes through. This is very hard to do with the top on. >> >> Nice to catch it now with the top off rather than go in and try to do it a fter the top is on, especially with the inspection hole size recommended by t he manual. >> >> Now something not in the manual and is very embarrassing: >> I found one of my aircraft with the nyloc nut which holds the TS03 to the TS04 (spring and washer thingy) and its check nut were loose. As the dampe r unit moves, it vibrated a bit and to my distress, the TS04 was a bit flopp y. This has never happened to me. Easy fix, a drop of Loctite and tighten u p was all it took. I use torque seal paint on all my bolts but never put it on my nylock / check nut on the drag / dampener bolt as I never thought thi s part would cause trouble... So a word to the wise, make this part of your final assembly check, and put a bit of torque seal paint on your nuts on th is part also. >> >> As far as mounting the trim servo, we do add an aluminum plate of .016 in ches with 4 nut plates riveted on to it and the plate Reduxed and riveted to the back side of the bulkhead. We use nut plates everywhere where we can't get to a nut easily. (Yes, it takes longer but we have not had good luck w ith gluing a nut on over time.) We also use a #6 Allen head screw to hold th e trim motor on since it is easier to put an Allen screw driver ball head on it than a wrench should the trim motor need to be changed some time in the w ay distant future. (I've never had a Mac Servo fail, but I have a D sub on it anyway, just in case.) >> >> Enjoy Building >> Bud >> >> >> >> >> >> >> From: tonyrenshaw268@gmail.com >> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Clevice \Forks debacle......... >> Date: Fri, 23 May 2014 08:02:24 +1000 >> To: europa-list@matronics.com >> >> Hi Bud, >> Could you please elaborate where the fouling is more specifically? I appr eciate knowing this, so I am thankful Bob brought it up. I have the top stil l off so its ideal I overcome these issues now. >> Regards >> Tony Renshaw >> >> >> >> On 23 May 2014, at 7:40, "Bud Yerly" wrote: >> >> Bob, >> You are right on the money. Every aircraft I have built needed about 1/8 off each clevis on the pitch mechanism to allow the trim bar to clear at fu ll elevator and trim travel. As for interpreting the English Language.... N o comment. >> Regards, >> Bud Yerly >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Fred Klein >> To: europa-list@matronics.com >> Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2014 10:30 AM >> Subject: Europa-List: Re: Clevice \Forks debacle......... >> >> Bobthank you for your attention to my build photo and for alerti ng me to this issue, however vexing you may find it. >> >> I am simply baffled to learn that you find =9Cthere is already enou gh shit flying about on the issue=9D and that it=99s an example s howing that =9Cpeople just can=99t read and interpret the Englis h language=9Dplease do not attempt to elaborateI can do without further discussion which you find unsuitable for posting on Matr onics. >> >> Fred >> >> >> On May 22, 2014, at 2:19 AM, Bob Harrison wrote: >> >> Hi! Tony /Fred. >> To try to help you over this vexed issue concerning the clevis forks I ju st spoke to a local friend on the issue ....his immediate response was that h e had removed =C2=BC=9D but when I questioned him further he started t o apply some engineering reason to the issue and suggested that we probably b oth removed 1/8=9D from each clevice to ensure there was adequate thre ad purchase left on both clevices. Which is the principle I would apply , th e only thing better is to remove it from one and check the operational clear ance as to whether it is necessary to do the other too. >> I=99m not publishing this on the Matronics site since there is alre ady enough shit flying about on the issue , people just can=99t read a nd interpret the English language ! >> Regards >> Bob H >> >> >> >> >> >> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matron href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com >> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c >> >> >> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> a-List"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List >> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> //forums.matronics.com >> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> >> >> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List >> http://forums.matronics.com >> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >> >> >> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> a-List"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List >> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> //forums.matronics.com >> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> > > > >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List > onics.com > ww.matronics.com/contribution > > > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 05:27:13 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Europa Club Mod Process From: "pmorgans" My XS is a Trike with the drains religiously installed as per Mod 33; utilising 2200mm of 8mm dia. tube from each outlet (large radius loops to prevent kinks without using fittings). The drains are positioned to the rear behind the wing root and protude from the skin; totally exposed, just waiting to be damaged. Level measurements of the drain tubes in the static position gives a max. tube C/L at 160mm above the tank oulet tube C/L. Altogether an unsatisfactory setup. From each tank oulet the drain tubes pass under/through both port and stbd. seat voids before looping back through the tunnel to the rear. On port and stbd. drains respectively are connected the sight gauge and fuel return. My mod. would be to intercept the existing drain tube through the cockpit floor and form the drain beneath each seat by cutting a 30mm hole through the external skin (away from the cockpit module bonded areas); and bonding a GRP top-hat section above the hole. The top-hat section would contain the CAV drain mounted on a bonded-in tee piece. This would give a drain length of about 300mm and a max. tube C/L level of 20mm above tank drain outlet. The sight gauge and fuel return would be connected to the vacant tee connection port and stbd. respectively. I've seen photographs of CAV drains connected directly to the tank drain outlets - but don't recall if these were UK models. I've attached a draft sketch section of proposal. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=424973#424973 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/fuel_drain_draft_172.pdf ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 07:02:38 PM PST US From: Tony Renshaw Subject: Europa-List: Soldering Advice Gidday, I read somewhere about using a different ratio solder from what seems to be more commonly available. Can someone confirm the ratios pleasesomething like 70/30. Thanks. Regards Tony Renshaw ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:32:10 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Soldering Advice From: rparigor@suffolk.lib.ny.us Hi Tony See: http://www.mcmaster.com/#general-purpose-solder/=sfvdr5 For electrical soldering I use 60-40 which stays plastic for a while, 63-37 which changes from liquid to solid very quick, works OK to add a joint to 60-40 since it has a lower melting point, I also like the 2% silver which has a melting point between the two which I use for high current joints, it's also probably the strongest. I use the 5 flux core .025" thick. I can solder very thick things with it, just twist it together (sometimes just keep folding in half a 6 foot length). I recently soldered some #2 wires with it, works fine. The Silver is the most expensive, if I could only have one solder, that would be it. My second choice would be 63-37 although 60-40 works pretty good too. Keep the tip clean on your soldering Iron, dip it in Flux helps, if you have some mildly dirty stuff, mildly activated Rosin flux works a treat. Ron Parigoris ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.