---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 07/31/14: 9 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:28 AM - Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query (Richard Collings) 2. 04:51 AM - Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query (David Joyce) 3. 05:28 AM - Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query (Tony Renshaw) 4. 05:28 AM - Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query (GRAHAM SINGLETON) 5. 07:20 AM - Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query (h&jeuropa) 6. 03:33 PM - Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query (pestar) 7. 03:48 PM - Re: Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query (Tony Renshaw) 8. 03:55 PM - Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query (Bud Yerly) 9. 09:49 PM - Re: Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query (Tony Renshaw) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:28:25 AM PST US From: "Richard Collings" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Shielded Strobe Light Query Hi Tony Just a thought, but if your position lights are LED, ie. very low current load, then you could use radio mic cable which you will have to get anyway to wire in your jack plugs. Changing the subject, I am coming down to Sydney in January next year and would like to meet you and look at your Europa, perhaps we could arrange something nearer the time. Regards Richard -----Original Message----- From: Tony Renshaw Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2014 11:40 AM Subject: Europa-List: Shielded Strobe Light Query Gidday, I am using AveoflashLP Ultra Aurora Nav/Strobe lights, that have their flasher units within the lights. There is 4 cables coming from each strobe, and to get quad core shielded is very hard, and expensive. The suppliers dont mention in their installation documentation that you need shielded wiring, and yet when pushed, they do. I am wondering if I just shield the positive cable, or whether I need to also shield the negative/earth, and the phase wire which goes to each strobe to keep them synchronised. Id be interested on what anyone thinks, and in fact whether shielding them all together could introduce a specific problem rather than just having one or two of the wires shielded. Regards Tony Renshaw Sydney Aussie ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:51:43 AM PST US From: "David Joyce" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Shielded Strobe Light Query Tony, Not clever enough to give you a definitive answer, but strongly suspect you should have all wires in a single sheath. You can incidentally buy nice cable sheath in various diameters which you can apply easily retrospectively over a bundle of wires. Can't remember where I got mine from now, but I found them by googling wire sheathing or something similar. Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ On Thu, 31 Jul 2014 10:27:43 +0100 "Richard Collings" wrote: > > > Hi Tony > Just a thought, but if your position lights are LED, ie. >very low current load, then you could use radio mic cable >which you will have to get anyway to wire in your jack >plugs. > Changing the subject, I am coming down to Sydney in >January next year and would like to meet you and look at >your Europa, perhaps we could arrange something nearer >the time. > Regards > Richard > > -----Original Message----- From: Tony Renshaw > Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2014 11:40 AM > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Subject: Europa-List: Shielded Strobe Light Query > > > > Gidday, > I am using AveoflashLP Ultra Aurora Nav/Strobe lights, >that have their flasher units within the lights. There is >4 cables coming from each strobe, and to get quad core >shielded is very hard, and expensive. The suppliers dont >mention in their installation documentation that you need >shielded wiring, and yet when pushed, they do. I am >wondering if I just shield the positive cable, or whether >I need to also shield the negative/earth, and the phase >wire which goes to each strobe to keep them >synchronised. Id be interested on what anyone thinks, >and in fact whether shielding them all together could >introduce a specific problem rather than just having one >or two of the wires shielded. > Regards > Tony Renshaw > Sydney Aussie > > > > > >Un/Subscription, >Forums! >Admin. > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:28:15 AM PST US From: Tony Renshaw Subject: Re: Europa-List: Shielded Strobe Light Query Hi David, Thanks for that advice. I didn't know about after market shielding, nor the single shielding. I suppose it makes sense, otherwise why have multi core with single shielding. Amazing how a little cross pollenisation of ideas can create positive synergy. Appreciated. Regards Tony Renshaw P.S. Quad Core shielded is bloody expensive. Oh well, only have to buy it once. (That's my wife excuse). Sent from my iPad > On 31 Jul 2014, at 9:50 pm, "David Joyce" wrote: > > > Tony, Not clever enough to give you a definitive answer, but strongly suspect you should have all wires in a single sheath. You can incidentally buy nice cable sheath in various diameters which you can apply easily retrospectively over a bundle of wires. Can't remember where I got mine from now, but I found them by googling wire sheathing or something similar. > Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ > > > On Thu, 31 Jul 2014 10:27:43 +0100 > "Richard Collings" wrote: >> Hi Tony >> Just a thought, but if your position lights are LED, ie. very low current load, then you could use radio mic cable which you will have to get anyway to wire in your jack plugs. >> Changing the subject, I am coming down to Sydney in January next year and would like to meet you and look at your Europa, perhaps we could arrange something nearer the time. >> Regards >> Richard >> -----Original Message----- From: Tony Renshaw >> Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2014 11:40 AM >> To: europa-list@matronics.com >> Subject: Europa-List: Shielded Strobe Light Query >> Gidday, >> I am using AveoflashLP Ultra Aurora Nav/Strobe lights, that have their flasher units within the lights. There is 4 cables coming from each strobe, and to get quad core shielded is very hard, and expensive. The suppliers dont mention in their installation documentation that you need shielded wiring, and yet when pushed, they do. I am wondering if I just shield the positive cable, or whether I need to also shield the negative/earth, and the phase wire which goes to each strobe to keep them synchronised. Id be interested on what anyone thinks, and in fact whether shielding them all together could introduce a specific problem rather than just having one or two of the wires shielded. >> Regards >> Tony Renshaw >> Sydney Aussie >> Un/Subscription, >> Forums! >> Admin. > > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:28:49 AM PST US From: GRAHAM SINGLETON Subject: Re: Europa-List: Shielded Strobe Light Query Tony & David=C2-=C2-=C2- =0AMy guess is that because you want to keep RF (caused by square waves in the strobe),=0Ayou should sheath the signal wires only.=0AFergus Kyle would know, maybe Bud does too=0AGraham=0A=0A=0A =0A=0A________________________________=0A From: David Joyce =0ATo: europa-list@matronics.com =0ASent: Thursday, 31 July 201 4, 12:50=0ASubject: Re: Europa-List: Shielded Strobe Light Query=0A =0A=0A- =0A=0ATony, Not clever enough to give you a definitive answer, but strongly suspect you should have all wires in a single sheath. You can incidentally buy nice cable sheath in various diameters which you can apply easily retr ospectively over a bundle of wires. Can't remember where I got mine from no w, but I found them by googling wire sheathing or something similar.=0ARega rds, David Joyce, G-XSDJ=0A=0A=0AOn Thu, 31 Jul 2014 10:27:43 +0100=0A"Rich ard Collings" wrote:=0A> --> Europa-List message p osted by: "Richard Collings" =0A> =0A> Hi Tony=0A> Just a thought, but if your position lights are LED, ie. very low current l oad, then you could use radio mic cable which you will have to get anyway t o wire in your jack plugs.=0A> Changing the subject, I am coming down to Sy dney in January next year and would like to meet you and look at your Europ a, perhaps we could arrange something nearer the time.=0A> Regards=0A> Rich ard=0A> =0A> -----Original Message----- From: Tony Renshaw=0A> Sent: Wednes day, July 30, 2014 11:40 AM=0A> To: europa-list@matronics.com=0A> Subject: Europa-List: Shielded Strobe Light Query=0A> =0A> --> Europa-List message p osted by: Tony Renshaw =0A> =0A> Gidday,=0A> I am using AveoflashLP Ultra Aurora Nav/Strobe lights, that have their flasher units within the lights. There is 4 cables coming from each strobe, and to get quad core shielded is very hard, and expensive. The suppliers don =99t mention in their installation documentation that you need shielded wir ing, and yet when pushed, they do. I am wondering if I just shield the posi tive cable, or whether I need to also shield the negative/earth, and the =9Cphase wire=9D which goes to each strobe to keep them synchro nised. I=99d be interested on what anyone thinks, and in fact whether shielding them all together could introduce a specific problem rather than just having one or two of the wires shielded.=0A> Regards=0A> Tony Renshaw =0A> Sydney Aussie=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> Un/Subscription,=0A> Forums - =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- - ============= ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:20:09 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query From: "h&jeuropa" Tony, Here is a link to AeroLED install instructions for a similar light which incorporates position light and strobe. Just follow the AeroLED instructions. You will only need 3 conductor shielded wire. Be sure you connect the shield, ground wire and a physical connection to the LED assembly all together at the wingtip. http://www.aeroleds.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Pulsar-Installation-Experimental.pdf We are using AeroLED and have no problem with noise or interference. Jim & Heather Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=427614#427614 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 03:33:38 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query From: "pestar" Tony You can get the necessary cabling from EDMO who are aviation distributors based out of Melbourne. I installed AeroLeds in my MCR-4S as they required the same type of 4 +1 shielded cabling. At that time EDMO had an office at Ardmore in New Zealand (walking distance from my hangar) so I sourced it from them at cost significantly less than paying retail from any of the "Golden Solder" companies. Cheers Peter -------- Peter Armstrong Auckland, New Zealand DynAero MCR-4S (Do not shoot me :) ). Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=427650#427650 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 03:48:34 PM PST US From: Tony Renshaw Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query Hi Peter, Thanks for that, and I'll call them soon. What's a "Golden Solder" company? Regards Tony R Sent from my iPad > On 1 Aug 2014, at 8:32 am, "pestar" wrote: > > > Tony > > You can get the necessary cabling from EDMO who are aviation distributors based out of Melbourne. I installed AeroLeds in my MCR-4S as they required the same type of 4 +1 shielded cabling. At that time EDMO had an office at Ardmore in New Zealand (walking distance from my hangar) so I sourced it from them at cost significantly less than paying retail from any of the "Golden Solder" companies. > > Cheers Peter > > -------- > Peter Armstrong > Auckland, New Zealand > DynAero MCR-4S (Do not shoot me :) ). > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=427650#427650 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 03:55:56 PM PST US From: "Bud Yerly" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Shielded Strobe Light Query Tony, Originally Aveo USA dealers mentioned that just a simple 18 gauge wire unshielded was enough for a simple strobe, nav, steady flashing unit needed. However, whenever you have a pulsing electrical device noise is a real concern. I would prefer to use a shielded wire on the strobe side of the wire. I'm sure you have downloaded as much as you can on the installation, but do look at some complaints about other strobe type led operations on emergency vehicles etc and radio interference. We try to do our due diligence but I prefer to be on the cautious side. Here is a comment from http://www.emcrules.com/2011/07/radio-interference-from-led-lighting.html they are engineers in the lighting industry. I quote: However, although today=92s LEDs are capable of long life, and delivering high light output levels with very little power consumption, most need to be paired with a drive circuit to provide constant current sourcing to operate in our homes and offices, and that=92s where the problem comes in. These switching drive circuits operate at increasingly higher frequencies, and in order to maintain the highest efficiency, and highest LED longevity possible, they also need to maintain very high slew rates. These factors contribute to the overall unwanted emissions from each individual lighting element, increasing the Electromagnetic background noise. End quote. This noise is in the VHF range so I have probably overcautiously decided to install shielded wire. The Aveo circuitry is in the light itself and a long way away from your radio gear, but noise is unwanted in a system. Even the flap motor, so twisted pairs at a minimum should be used. See the guys on the wiring installation attached. I talked to them. I tested the lights near my handheld radio and they are clean until a foot or so away, and when paired together in sync make a slight pulsed hiss. Now if you run the blue wire to put the strobes in sync that is a long pulsing wire. Probably should shield that one at a minimum. If you can shield both pulsed lights and tie the shield to your main ground bus and leave it open at the light it should work. Some RV guys are using non shielded wire and have no complaints. Some Zenith guys are having issues. But they both use the airframe as a ground. We use a separate ground wire which if properly done helps with noise. Regards, Bud Yerly ----- Original Message ----- From: Tony Renshaw To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2014 6:40 AM Subject: Europa-List: Shielded Strobe Light Query > Gidday, I am using AveoflashLP Ultra Aurora Nav/Strobe lights, that have their flasher units within the lights. There is 4 cables coming from each strobe, and to get quad core shielded is very hard, and expensive. The suppliers don=92t mention in their installation documentation that you need shielded wiring, and yet when pushed, they do. I am wondering if I just shield the positive cable, or whether I need to also shield the negative/earth, and the =93phase wire=94 which goes to each strobe to keep them synchronised. I=92d be interested on what anyone thinks, and in fact whether shielding them all together could introduce a specific problem rather than just having one or two of the wires shielded. Regards Tony Renshaw Sydney Aussie http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:49:32 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Shielded Strobe Light Query From: Tony Renshaw Hi Jim and Heather, Tried to send private message but email address below bounces. Can you give it to me off list please? Rgds Tony R. On 1 Aug 2014, at 12:19 am, h&jeuropa wrote: > > Tony, > > Here is a link to AeroLED install instructions for a similar light which incorporates position light and strobe. Just follow the AeroLED instructions. You will only need 3 conductor shielded wire. Be sure you connect the shield, ground wire and a physical connection to the LED assembly all together at the wingtip. > > http://www.aeroleds.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Pulsar-Installation-Experimental.pdf > > We are using AeroLED and have no problem with noise or interference. > > Jim & Heather > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=427614#427614 > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.