Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:44 AM - Tinnerman washers on cowling (Greg Fuchs)
2. 04:46 AM - anti-corrosion coating of tailwheel spring arm (Rowland Carson)
3. 05:43 AM - Re: Fuel Caps for the Europa Fleet. (g-fizy)
4. 06:36 AM - Re: Fitting new tail plane torque tube (alan_hunter1664)
5. 07:38 AM - Re: Re: Fuel Caps for the Europa Fleet. (Bud Yerly)
6. 07:45 AM - Re: Fuel Caps for the Europa Fleet. (europa089@aol.com)
7. 09:55 AM - 70mm Fuel Cap has production go. (Bud Yerly)
8. 10:23 AM - Re: anti-corrosion coating of tailwheel spring arm (David Joyce)
9. 12:03 PM - Re: Tinnerman washers on cowling (Greg Fuchs)
10. 01:14 PM - Classic Cowls and a 914 (Erich Trombley)
11. 02:40 PM - Re: Tinnerman washers on cowling (Fred Klein)
12. 02:43 PM - Re: Tinnerman washers on cowling (Fred Klein)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Tinnerman washers on cowling |
Hi Gang,
I am in the process of checking different methods to mount the Southco
fasteners onto the cowling as per the mod. It's definitely a bit more work
to get them properly in place in comparison to the stainless
screws/nutplates. Hopefully, the time spent now will come back later when
removing the cowling a bunch of times.
I have a quick question..
After countersinking the outer cowling to accept the center area of the
tinnerman washers, is the outer surface of the washer meant to be proud of
the cowling surface, or are they meant to sit flush? Though it may not cause
too much drag, wouldn't it make sense to countersink the whole washer, or am
I over-thinking it?
If they are meant to be proud, has anyone set them flush and how did that
work out?
Also, I notice that the fasteners don't sit quite flat to the face of the
tinnerman whereas the screw sat perfectly flat. Now I am going to have to
look into re-shaping the head on the fastener, or the bowl in the washer.
There's always something lurking around every corner to soak up my build
time..
Greg
Message 2
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| Subject: | anti-corrosion coating of tailwheel spring arm |
After a recent presentation at the Gloster Strut where the aircraft on display
had all its steel parts electro-phoretic coated, I made enquiries at the firm
the builder had used about anti-corrosion treatment on my tailwheel spring arm.
The guy I talked to advised that the EP coating is a bit like an epoxy paint,
and could start to go chalky after a few years. But as Id be liable for the
minimum charge anyway, he suggested I have instead a much more effective treatment
which is a type of zinc plating and results in a greenish finish that can
be sprayed over for cosmetic appearance. However, that process involves an acid
bath and could lead to hydrogen embrittlement if the arm is high-tensile steel.
He said it should be OK if the steel was not high-tensile - above about 60
ton or 1040 Newtons.
Does anyone know the specification of the steel used for the tailwheel arm?
Or - has anyone a better suggestion for corrosion protection?
in friendship
Rowland
| Rowland Carson ... that's Rowland with a 'w' ...
| <rowlandcarson@gmail.com> http://www.rowlandcarson.org.uk
| Skype, Twitter: rowland_carson Facebook: Rowland Carson
| pictures: http://picasaweb.google.com/rowlandcarson
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Caps for the Europa Fleet. |
hi looks like i will need a new cap made ,depends on the lead time
please let me no when you find out
thanks
jim davis
--------
owner g-fizy
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=428967#428967
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Fitting new tail plane torque tube |
I posed the question to Europa the same time I posted on here. I'll send the response
when I get it.
Alan
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=428980#428980
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Caps for the Europa Fleet. |
Jim,
It will be about a month. I remember from my families contracting
business, if a contractor gives a time frame, double it.
I'll need an address for shipping.
Regards
Bud Yerly
----- Original Message -----
From: g-fizy<mailto:jim.davis1@me.com>
To: europa-list@matronics.com<mailto:europa-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2014 8:42 AM
Subject: Europa-List: Re: Fuel Caps for the Europa Fleet.
<jim.davis1@me.com<mailto:jim.davis1@me.com>>
hi looks like i will need a new cap made ,depends on the lead time
please let me no when you find out
thanks
jim davis
--------
owner g-fizy
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=428967#428967<http://forums
.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=428967#428967>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List<http://www.matronics.com/N
avigator?Europa-List>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution<http://www.matronics.com/contributi
on>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Caps for the Europa Fleet. |
I would like to but I will be in San Diego California this weekend. I will t
ry to come by after we get back.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Aug 19, 2014, at 6:19 PM, "Bud Yerly" <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>
> To all owners and operators.
>
> I received a call from a client who inadvertently misplaced his gas cap. H
is kit is a about a 2001 XS and Europa-Aircraft (2004) does not have stock o
n these older caps.
> Come to find out, the caps changed in or about 2003. All caps on newer XS
kits have a smaller cap and ring (65mmOD).
>
> What to check.
> If you have a fuel cap supplied with your kit made by SPRL that measures 7
0 mm OD on the gray cap, these caps are no longer in production and the new 6
5 mm caps do not fit properly. Aircraft Spruce and Wicks do not have any ol
d style caps in inventory.
>
> Classic caps and the newer XS kits are available but the cap and flange ha
ve to be bought at an average price of about $60-$70. On the older pre 2004
kits if you have the 70 mm cap and you wish to upgrade to the newer style, y
ou will have to cut the fuel ring out and replace. Not fun especially since
the diameters are different.
>
> Please review the pdf document attached for details on the differences.
>
> I am putting together a special order for my Custom Flight Clients for the
older 70 mm caps through Newton SPRL. The price is reasonable and less the
n current retail. I highly recommend that older XS kit owners purchase a sp
are in the unlikely event your cap may disappear. We are not supplying the k
ey lock. This is a one time shot as it is coming out of my pocket for the R
&D. I cannot expect the current Europa Company to support these pre 2004 ki
t fuel caps as it is not economically viable to do so.
>
> However, determined owners like myself will attempt to make a special orde
r through the manufacturer happen to keep my clients happy and supplied. Yo
u are all welcome to piggy back on my efforts and research.
>
> Email or call in your order to me direct, not through the Matronics site p
lease so as not to clutter up the site.
>
> Regards,
>
> Bud Yerly
> Custom Flight Creations, Inc.
> personal email: budyerly@msn.com,
> Mobile Phone: 813-244-8354
>
> <Europa Aircraft Fuel Cap Replacement.pdf>
Message 7
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| Subject: | 70mm Fuel Cap has production go. |
To all 70mm fuel cap owners.
We do have sufficient caps on order (25 in the first 24 hours) that the
manufacturer has begun tooling and secured a flange for testing and QC.
It appears though this is still a one time production run so don't
expect spares to be available collecting dust on the shelf.
I still expect the caps price to be equal to or less than the current
caps.
Regards,
Bud Yerly
US Europa Dealer
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: anti-corrosion coating of tailwheel spring arm |
Rowland, I suspect it is high tensile steel, but do not
know. My tail spring has lasted for 14 yrs without any
sign of significant corrosion ( & it has flown through
plenty of rain!) with just two pot paint on top of (I
think) acid etch primer. Could get more precise info from
Roger Targett if you like. Regards, David
On Thu, 21 Aug 2014 12:45:30 +0100
Rowland Carson <rowlandcarson@gmail.com> wrote:
><rowlandcarson@gmail.com>
>
> After a recent presentation at the Gloster Strut where
>the aircraft on display had all its steel parts
>electro-phoretic coated, I made enquiries at the firm the
>builder had used about anti-corrosion treatment on my
>tailwheel spring arm. The guy I talked to advised that
>the EP coating is a bit like an epoxy paint, and could
>start to go chalky after a few years. But as Id be
>liable for the minimum charge anyway, he suggested I have
>instead a much more effective treatment which is a type
>of zinc plating and results in a greenish finish that can
>be sprayed over for cosmetic appearance. However, that
>process involves an acid bath and could lead to hydrogen
>embrittlement if the arm is high-tensile steel. He said
>it should be OK if the steel was not high-tensile - above
>about 60 ton or 1040 Newtons.
>
> Does anyone know the specification of the steel used for
>the tailwheel arm?
>
> Or - has anyone a better suggestion for corrosion
>protection?
>
> in friendship
>
> Rowland
>
>...
> http://www.rowlandcarson.org.uk
>Carson
>
>
>
>Un/Subscription,
>Forums!
>Admin.
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Tinnerman washers on cowling |
Just a quick addition here:
One reason for the question of whether the tinnerman sits on or flush to the
surface is to get the thickness of material between the two sides of the
fastener just right. It seems to work best at just the proper thickness.
Any changes later would require re-doing the receptacle, requiring a lot of
time. It might be an easier question to answer if I knew the cowl was built
up with layers of glass only. Any less-dense filler between the inner and
outer layers might compromise strength in a rebated but flush-set fastening
system. With the cowl being all white, there is no way to see through. It
seems to be all glass..I just cannot tell for sure, especially with some
dimpling being seen around the clecos. I'd like to start placing fasteners
today or tomorrow..
The Europa is quite a clean aircraft aerodynamically, with nice sleek lines
and smooth skins, so I was envisioning an all-flat cowl fastening system
(similar in concept to a flush-fitting screw head), but I have been told on
occasion, that I am 'overthinking' something.
Maybe this is one of those times?
_____
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Greg Fuchs
Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2014 3:44 AM
Subject: Europa-List: Tinnerman washers on cowling
After countersinking the outer cowling to accept the center area of the
tinnerman washers, is the outer surface of the washer meant to be proud of
the cowling surface, or are they meant to sit flush? Though it may not cause
too much drag, wouldn't it make sense to countersink the whole washer, or am
I over-thinking it?
If they are meant to be proud, has anyone set them flush and how did that
work out?
Message 10
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| Subject: | Classic Cowls and a 914 |
Hi Frank, I have a classic mono with the 914. It is my understanding th
at the 914 will not fit on the classic engine mount due to conflicts wit
h the turbo/muffler. As such, I ordered the XS engine mount which moves
the engine up and forward; making the classic cowl unusable without mod
ification. I elected to modify my classic cowl which required an additi
onal 4" in length. This can be accomplished by either adding on to it a
t the cowl flange, or cutting off the nose and reshaping it. I elected
to go with the latter, primarily since the transition from fuselage to c
owl was already established. I loped off the front of the cowl and resh
aped it to accommodate a 10" spinner. I also, elected to utilize the XS
oil cooler and radiator. In hind sight probably not the best decision.
These are mounted in a similar position as the XS. Regards,Erich Trom
bley N28ETClassic Mono 914
____________________________________________________________
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Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Tinnerman washers on cowling |
Greg=85I believe that conceptually, the tinnerman washer is designed to
fit into a chamfered hole somewhat larger than the diameter of the
fastener=85this will automatically bring the perimeter surface of the
washer down to the surface of your cowl.
I take it that when you use the word, =93flush=94, this is what you
mean, given that the thickness of the tinnerman is so very thin.
If, on the other hand, you=92re ruminating on whether or not to recess
the entire face of the tinnerman, I=92d venture to opine that you may be
=93overhanging=94.
I have never examined a stock Europa cowl, but I do believe it is solid
FG, not a foam core sandwich.
Fred
On Aug 21, 2014, at 12:02 PM, Greg Fuchs <gregoryf.flyboy@comcast.net>
wrote:
> Just a quick addition here:
> One reason for the question of whether the tinnerman sits on or flush
to the surface is to get the thickness of material between the two sides
of the fastener just right. It seems to work best at just the proper
thickness. Any changes later would require re-doing the receptacle,
requiring a lot of time. It might be an easier question to answer if I
knew the cowl was built up with layers of glass only. Any less-dense
filler between the inner and outer layers might compromise strength in a
rebated but flush-set fastening system. With the cowl being all white,
there is no way to see through. It seems to be all glass..I just cannot
tell for sure, especially with some dimpling being seen around the
clecos. I'd like to start placing fasteners today or tomorrow..
>
> The Europa is quite a clean aircraft aerodynamically, with nice sleek
lines and smooth skins, so I was envisioning an all-flat cowl fastening
system (similar in concept to a flush-fitting screw head), but I have
been told on occasion, that I am 'overthinking' something.
> Maybe this is one of those times?
>
>
>
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Greg Fuchs
> Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2014 3:44 AM
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Europa-List: Tinnerman washers on cowling
>
>
> After countersinking the outer cowling to accept the center area of
the tinnerman washers, is the outer surface of the washer meant to be
proud of the cowling surface, or are they meant to sit flush? Though it
may not cause too much drag, wouldn't it make sense to countersink the
whole washer, or am I over-thinking it?
> If they are meant to be proud, has anyone set them flush and how did
that work out?
>
>
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Tinnerman washers on cowling |
Greg=85I believe that conceptually, the tinnerman washer is designed to
fit into a chamfered hole somewhat larger than the diameter of the
fastener=85this will automatically bring the perimeter surface of the
washer down to the surface of your cowl.
I take it that when you use the word, =93flush=94, this is what you
mean, given that the thickness of the tinnerman is so very thin.
If, on the other hand, you=92re ruminating on whether or not to recess
the entire face of the tinnerman, I=92d venture to opine that you may be
=93overhanging=94.
(Whoops=85sorry=85that was meant to be =93overthinking=94, not
=93overhanging=94.)
I have never examined a stock Europa cowl, but I do believe it is solid
FG, not a foam core sandwich.
Fred
On Aug 21, 2014, at 12:02 PM, Greg Fuchs <gregoryf.flyboy@comcast.net>
wrote:
> Just a quick addition here:
> One reason for the question of whether the tinnerman sits on or flush
to the surface is to get the thickness of material between the two sides
of the fastener just right. It seems to work best at just the proper
thickness. Any changes later would require re-doing the receptacle,
requiring a lot of time. It might be an easier question to answer if I
knew the cowl was built up with layers of glass only. Any less-dense
filler between the inner and outer layers might compromise strength in a
rebated but flush-set fastening system. With the cowl being all white,
there is no way to see through. It seems to be all glass..I just cannot
tell for sure, especially with some dimpling being seen around the
clecos. I'd like to start placing fasteners today or tomorrow..
>
> The Europa is quite a clean aircraft aerodynamically, with nice sleek
lines and smooth skins, so I was envisioning an all-flat cowl fastening
system (similar in concept to a flush-fitting screw head), but I have
been told on occasion, that I am 'overthinking' something.
> Maybe this is one of those times?
>
>
>
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Greg Fuchs
> Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2014 3:44 AM
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Europa-List: Tinnerman washers on cowling
>
>
> After countersinking the outer cowling to accept the center area of
the tinnerman washers, is the outer surface of the washer meant to be
proud of the cowling surface, or are they meant to sit flush? Though it
may not cause too much drag, wouldn't it make sense to countersink the
whole washer, or am I over-thinking it?
> If they are meant to be proud, has anyone set them flush and how did
that work out?
>
>
>
>
>
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