---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 09/09/14: 35 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:49 AM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Frans Veldman) 2. 02:12 AM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Max Cointe (Free)) 3. 02:26 AM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (AUVRAY Michel) 4. 02:44 AM - Re: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas (DAVID JOYCE) 5. 03:13 AM - Re: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas (Ivan Shaw) 6. 05:57 AM - Re: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas (Brian Davies) 7. 07:20 AM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Robert Borger) 8. 07:27 AM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (AUVRAY Michel) 9. 07:45 AM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Robert Borger) 10. 07:58 AM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (AUVRAY Michel) 11. 08:02 AM - 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements (Bud Yerly) 12. 08:07 AM - Re: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements (europa089@aol.com) 13. 08:16 AM - Re: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas (Kevin Challis) 14. 08:27 AM - Re: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements () 15. 08:30 AM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Roland) 16. 08:45 AM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Robert Borger) 17. 08:57 AM - Re: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements (Frans Veldman) 18. 09:12 AM - Re: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Frans Veldman) 19. 09:36 AM - Re: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Peter Zutrauen) 20. 10:33 AM - Re: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements (Bud Yerly) 21. 10:47 AM - Re: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas (Paul McAllister) 22. 11:04 AM - Texel wonderful again (goff) 23. 11:36 AM - Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas (graeme bird) 24. 11:38 AM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Roland) 25. 11:52 AM - Re: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Frans Veldman) 26. 12:00 PM - Re: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements (Jeremy Fisher) 27. 12:09 PM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Roland) 28. 12:29 PM - Re: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Frans Veldman) 29. 12:38 PM - Re: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements (Bud Yerly) 30. 12:43 PM - Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Roland) 31. 01:03 PM - Re: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements (Frans Veldman) 32. 01:20 PM - Re: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? (Frans Veldman) 33. 02:09 PM - Re: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements (craig) 34. 02:37 PM - Re: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements (Brian Phillips) 35. 04:24 PM - Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas (JonSmith) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:49:29 AM PST US From: Frans Veldman Subject: Re: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi Gert, > My new engine and prop. really sounds and feel OK at 4200 rpm / > 30", and that is giving me exactly 120 knots IAS. But again - this > prop. is a completely new world for me ... What power-setting are > others aiming for at cruise with a 914 and adjustable prop? We usuably cruise with 27" and about 4500 rpm if we are not in a hurry, which is about 16 l/h fuel, and good for about 120 IAS. I think for 30" you should go to about 5000 rpm. There is some curve about that in some Rotax manual. Of course it also depends on the balance of your prop (I have a two blade prop, and it feels just a bit more rough in the area of 4600 to 4800 rpm, so I avoid that area.) Frans -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJUDr7mAAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVuu8QAMTm+/UcSJagNI6mpbSrFJ3w aUZW3B6PLInrJV6MdDcYAeTPNmUD8LbTBA83a+7L/RUYzmXQjVq+9qgNedoE9qkD VQluxx+lSlZJ/KSe9dTEQyZBL1M86zywvgpjO/Df0nWBeUH/VIdqamHK3b3pX0A6 yZAykkN+yJdZyr9/iDazgDiCeCKD/zRoGbEOih7Qej6yQ+Tu1CtvVUO6iQL2BPG7 8ovnMSvOqwH5AUFldCfPgjMNXZgmq0GiAQ9QdYJ5vvpgTtjoBu9xiwMDc05qRRIX M/KGaTY/1xOTPcrdcPuppeN4vkBVfoxmx8kzJNXzLJ9CgzquwOOl5trujrMzPOTk rMsndcDm/SDDsut4pnVzB4itk6uVO1MgGrlNcj4YC8xVv2jxwe7nGSiREfwMAOIl GfXX4IiJ3GWGueri3iMu6N8MpAv0BZfvR+QoSlDGigRD/DP7pYRS1XktUZJu19oi n1OqPpBlDmNR7oDCmpYb8FIiqAc8+SnQwUZyzDGS8BAkEGDxqHOlHbAoVk+P6mlO FzxDtUV6KiiJcOUGkBc1jmmDUZ00+BIDncK/67MR3ggiQW2CSB9UIAu7hpdIzfBE geYrhiCAbPftleKBucxduq+xSNYsOKuCJUGL7aQv8G3Zbdu86lSgQ2XxWjJh/ol+ wjVfd8joVGJcRVPulZSI =gL3Q -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:12:59 AM PST US From: "Max Cointe (Free)" Subject: RE: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? The automatic cruse setting of the Airmaster controler gives us 118Kt IAS @ 5000rpm and 25.5" for a 19 l/h consumption. Trimmed on a manuel mode we can't have better than 120Kt IAS @ 4800 rpm and 26" for 18 l/H Max Cointe F-PMLH Europa XS_TriGear Kit #560-2003 912ULS/AirmasterAP332 520 hours F-PLDJ DynAro MCR 4S Kit #27-2002 912ULSFR/MTProp MTV7A 1660 heures -----Message d'origine----- De: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] De la part de Frans Veldman Envoy: mardi 9 septembre 2014 10:49 : europa-list@matronics.com Objet: Re: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? --> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi Gert, > My new engine and prop. really sounds and feel OK at 4200 rpm / 30", > and that is giving me exactly 120 knots IAS. But again - this prop. is > a completely new world for me ... What power-setting are others aiming > for at cruise with a 914 and adjustable prop? We usuably cruise with 27" and about 4500 rpm if we are not in a hurry, which is about 16 l/h fuel, and good for about 120 IAS. I think for 30" you should go to about 5000 rpm. There is some curve about that in some Rotax manual. Of course it also depends on the balance of your prop (I have a two blade prop, and it feels just a bit more rough in the area of 4600 to 4800 rpm, so I avoid that area.) Frans -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJUDr7mAAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVuu8QAMTm+/UcSJagNI6mpbSrFJ3w aUZW3B6PLInrJV6MdDcYAeTPNmUD8LbTBA83a+7L/RUYzmXQjVq+9qgNedoE9qkD VQluxx+lSlZJ/KSe9dTEQyZBL1M86zywvgpjO/Df0nWBeUH/VIdqamHK3b3pX0A6 yZAykkN+yJdZyr9/iDazgDiCeCKD/zRoGbEOih7Qej6yQ+Tu1CtvVUO6iQL2BPG7 8ovnMSvOqwH5AUFldCfPgjMNXZgmq0GiAQ9QdYJ5vvpgTtjoBu9xiwMDc05qRRIX M/KGaTY/1xOTPcrdcPuppeN4vkBVfoxmx8kzJNXzLJ9CgzquwOOl5trujrMzPOTk rMsndcDm/SDDsut4pnVzB4itk6uVO1MgGrlNcj4YC8xVv2jxwe7nGSiREfwMAOIl GfXX4IiJ3GWGueri3iMu6N8MpAv0BZfvR+QoSlDGigRD/DP7pYRS1XktUZJu19oi n1OqPpBlDmNR7oDCmpYb8FIiqAc8+SnQwUZyzDGS8BAkEGDxqHOlHbAoVk+P6mlO FzxDtUV6KiiJcOUGkBc1jmmDUZ00+BIDncK/67MR3ggiQW2CSB9UIAu7hpdIzfBE geYrhiCAbPftleKBucxduq+xSNYsOKuCJUGL7aQv8G3Zbdu86lSgQ2XxWjJh/ol+ wjVfd8joVGJcRVPulZSI =gL3Q -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:26:43 AM PST US From: AUVRAY Michel Subject: Re: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? Salut Max, quelle hauteur tes 25.5"? Par ailleurs j'ai mis mon avion en vente voir annonce RSA. Michel AUVRAY Le 09/09/2014 11:11, Max Cointe (Free) a crit : > > The automatic cruse setting of the Airmaster controler gives us 118Kt IAS @ > 5000rpm and 25.5" for a 19 l/h consumption. Trimmed on a manuel mode we > can't have better than 120Kt IAS @ 4800 rpm and 26" for 18 l/H > > Max Cointe > F-PMLH Europa XS_TriGear > Kit #560-2003 912ULS/AirmasterAP332 520 hours > > F-PLDJ Dyn'Aro MCR 4S > Kit #27-2002 912ULSFR/MTProp MTV7A 1660 heures > -----Message d'origine----- > De : owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] De la part de Frans Veldman > Envoy : mardi 9 septembre 2014 10:49 > : europa-list@matronics.com > Objet : Re: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? > > --> > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Hi Gert, > >> My new engine and prop. really sounds and feel OK at 4200 rpm / 30", >> and that is giving me exactly 120 knots IAS. But again - this prop. is >> a completely new world for me ... What power-setting are others aiming >> for at cruise with a 914 and adjustable prop? > We usuably cruise with 27" and about 4500 rpm if we are not in a hurry, > which is about 16 l/h fuel, and good for about 120 IAS. > I think for 30" you should go to about 5000 rpm. There is some curve about > that in some Rotax manual. Of course it also depends on the balance of your > prop (I have a two blade prop, and it feels just a bit more rough in the > area of 4600 to 4800 rpm, so I avoid that area.) > > Frans > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) > > iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJUDr7mAAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVuu8QAMTm+/UcSJagNI6mpbSrFJ3w > aUZW3B6PLInrJV6MdDcYAeTPNmUD8LbTBA83a+7L/RUYzmXQjVq+9qgNedoE9qkD > VQluxx+lSlZJ/KSe9dTEQyZBL1M86zywvgpjO/Df0nWBeUH/VIdqamHK3b3pX0A6 > yZAykkN+yJdZyr9/iDazgDiCeCKD/zRoGbEOih7Qej6yQ+Tu1CtvVUO6iQL2BPG7 > 8ovnMSvOqwH5AUFldCfPgjMNXZgmq0GiAQ9QdYJ5vvpgTtjoBu9xiwMDc05qRRIX > M/KGaTY/1xOTPcrdcPuppeN4vkBVfoxmx8kzJNXzLJ9CgzquwOOl5trujrMzPOTk > rMsndcDm/SDDsut4pnVzB4itk6uVO1MgGrlNcj4YC8xVv2jxwe7nGSiREfwMAOIl > GfXX4IiJ3GWGueri3iMu6N8MpAv0BZfvR+QoSlDGigRD/DP7pYRS1XktUZJu19oi > n1OqPpBlDmNR7oDCmpYb8FIiqAc8+SnQwUZyzDGS8BAkEGDxqHOlHbAoVk+P6mlO > FzxDtUV6KiiJcOUGkBc1jmmDUZ00+BIDncK/67MR3ggiQW2CSB9UIAu7hpdIzfBE > geYrhiCAbPftleKBucxduq+xSNYsOKuCJUGL7aQv8G3Zbdu86lSgQ2XxWjJh/ol+ > wjVfd8joVGJcRVPulZSI > =gL3Q > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > --- Ce courrier lectronique ne contient aucun virus ou logiciel malveillant parce que la protection avast! Antivirus est active. http://www.avast.com ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 02:44:10 AM PST US From: DAVID JOYCE Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas =C2-This is a really interesting discussion and I have to say that I am i n total agreement about currency and despite having had an IMC rating for 2 0+ years do not and will not deliberately fly into IMC conditions as a matt er of open choice, I only ever did the rating to use as a challenge to impr ove my flying and as a last chance get out of jail free card.=0A=0AI concur with Jonathans comments that if we have a plethora of Permit built and ope rated aircraft flying / departing / returning under IFR we will inevitably be reading about its tragic results, I would be devastated to read of such tragedies in the press.=0A=0AThere are many different standards of build so me are stunning some are dogs, even with the annual permit system they stil l get through ( I have to say that the same happens with CAA and EASA aircr aft as well). Do we really want these flying blind as a matter of routine a bove our homes and families?=0A=0AThe other one=0ASent to you=C2-by David Joyce=0Awww.eastmidsspas.com=C2- =0A=C2-=0APLEASE NOTE WE HAVE MOVED A ND ARE NOW AT=0AThe Zycomm Building 51 Nottingham Road Ripley Derbys DE5 3A S=0A160 Meters from Sainsbury's Island=0A=C2-=0ASame Phone 0800 4102122 a nd Direct Mobile 07973 675755=0A=C2-=0A =0A=0A___________________________ _____=0A From: Fred Klein =0ATo: europa-list@matron ics.com =0ASent: Monday, 8 September 2014, 23:44=0ASubject: Re: Europa-List : Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas=0A =0A=0A--> Europa-List message p osted by: Fred Klein =0A=0AJonathonthanks for your educated and well-founded opinionparticularly your emphas is on the importance of true =9Ccurrency=9D, not just by-the-bo ok currencysimilar reasoning has kept me in the ranks of VFR aviat orsF.=0A=0AOn Sep 8, 2014, at 3:07 PM, jonathanmilbank =0A> =0A> Permit me to annoy you all intensely. After more than four decades of earning my living as a pilot, military and civilian, and having held a full instrument rating for over 32 years, wild horses couldn't drag me and my Europa into IMC or night conditions, even i f my aircraft had all the required bells and whistles.=0A> =0A> Single-engi ned in those conditions doesn't seem wise to me, especially in a glass-fibr e airframe in conditions where you can't see and avoid potential lightning activity.=0A> =0A> Furthermore procedural instrument flying is a skill wher e you need to keep very current. An hour or so each month just isn't going to cut it. Me and my colleagues find that just a week or two of holiday bef ore resuming flight operations, puts most pilots (if they're being honest) somewhat behind the mental drag curve for a day or two after returning to d uty.=0A> =0A> And we have the advantage of an Airbus suite of EFIS, Flight Directors and unbeatable automation, plus two pairs of eyes and ears to mon itor the situation.=0A> =0A> Yes I have also flown IMC in earlier days as s ingle pilot with no stabilisation nor autoflight systems, doing things like QGH and GCA in the military. That would make anyone sweat.=0A> =0A> So hav e fun if you must and I'll hope not to read of any sad CFIT stories.=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> Read this topic online here:=0A> =0A> http://forums.mat ronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430200#430200=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- -Matt Dralle ========= ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 03:13:55 AM PST US From: "Ivan Shaw" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas Fred, I also echo all that you say on the subject, particularly re true currency! Ivan -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred Klein Sent: 08 September 2014 23:44 Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas Jonathon.thanks for your educated and well-founded opinion.particularly your emphasis on the importance of true "currency", not just by-the-book currency.similar reasoning has kept me in the ranks of VFR aviators.F. On Sep 8, 2014, at 3:07 PM, jonathanmilbank wrote: > --> > > Permit me to annoy you all intensely. After more than four decades of earning my living as a pilot, military and civilian, and having held a full instrument rating for over 32 years, wild horses couldn't drag me and my Europa into IMC or night conditions, even if my aircraft had all the required bells and whistles. > > Single-engined in those conditions doesn't seem wise to me, especially in a glass-fibre airframe in conditions where you can't see and avoid potential lightning activity. > > Furthermore procedural instrument flying is a skill where you need to keep very current. An hour or so each month just isn't going to cut it. Me and my colleagues find that just a week or two of holiday before resuming flight operations, puts most pilots (if they're being honest) somewhat behind the mental drag curve for a day or two after returning to duty. > > And we have the advantage of an Airbus suite of EFIS, Flight Directors and unbeatable automation, plus two pairs of eyes and ears to monitor the situation. > > Yes I have also flown IMC in earlier days as single pilot with no stabilisation nor autoflight systems, doing things like QGH and GCA in the military. That would make anyone sweat. > > So have fun if you must and I'll hope not to read of any sad CFIT stories. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430200#430200 > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:57:01 AM PST US From: "Brian Davies" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas =9Cif we have a plethora of Permit built and operated aircraft flying / departing / returning under IFR we will inevitably be reading about its tragic results, I would be devastated to read of such tragedies in the press.=9D David, I think this is a bit sensationalistic and flies in the face of the facts. Pilots in the USA have been able to fly IFR in home built aircraft for many years and the ground is not littered with smoking wreckage. The very understandable comments from the professional pilots in our community are also not supported by the stats. There are a large number of (UK) IMC rated pilots flying PA28s, for example, and I think there has only been two accidents in total since the IMCR was introduced. Compare this with the number of accidents caused by VFR pilots scud running. All of these issues have been fully and professionally examined as part of the work that has led to the present trials that are taking place. That is why it has taken 6 years to get to this stage. Any home built aircraft that is approved for night/IFR will have been through a very thorough testing process that is at least equivalent to that required for a certified aircraft. Regards Brian Davies From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of DAVID JOYCE Sent: 09 September 2014 10:41 Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas This is a really interesting discussion and I have to say that I am in total agreement about currency and despite having had an IMC rating for 20+ years do not and will not deliberately fly into IMC conditions as a matter of open choice, I only ever did the rating to use as a challenge to improve my flying and as a last chance get out of jail free card. I concur with Jonathans comments that if we have a plethora of Permit built and operated aircraft flying / departing / returning under IFR we will inevitably be reading about its tragic results, I would be devastated to read of such tragedies in the press. There are many different standards of build some are stunning some are dogs, even with the annual permit system they still get through ( I have to say that the same happens with CAA and EASA aircraft as well). if we have a plethora of Permit built and operated aircraft flying / departing / returning under IFR we will inevitably be reading about its tragic results, I would be devastated to read of such tragedies in the press. The other one Sent to you by David Joyce www.eastmidsspas.com PLEASE NOTE WE HAVE MOVED AND ARE NOW AT The Zycomm Building 51 Nottingham Road Ripley Derbys DE5 3AS 160 Meters from Sainsbury's Island Same Phone 0800 4102122 and Direct Mobile 07973 675755 From: Fred Klein Sent: Monday, 8 September 2014, 23:44 Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas Jonathonthanks for your educated and well-founded opinionparticularly your emphasis on the importance of true =9Ccurrency=9D, not just by-the-book currencysimilar reasoning has kept me in the ranks of VFR aviatorsF. On Sep 8, 2014, at 3:07 PM, jonathanmilbank wrote: > > Permit me to annoy you all intensely. After more than four decades of earning my living as a pilot, military and civilian, and having held a full instrument rating for over 32 years, wild horses couldn't drag me and my Europa into IMC or night conditions, even if my aircraft had all the required bells and whistles. > > Single-engined in those conditions doesn't seem wise to me, especially in a glass-fibre airframe in conditions where you can't see and avoid potential lightning activity. > > Furthermore procedural instrument flying is a skill where you need to keep very current. An hour or so each month just isn't going to cut it. Me and my colleagues find that just a week or two of holiday before resuming flight operations, puts most pilots (if they're being honest) somewhat behind the mental drag curve for a day or two after returning to duty. > > And we have the advantage of an Airbus suite of EFIS, Flight Directors and unbeatable automation, plus two pairs of eyes and ears to monitor the situation. > > Yes I have also flown IMC in earlier days as single pilot with no stabilisation nor autoflight systems, doing things like QGH and GCA in the military. That would make anyone sweat. > > So have fun if you must and I'll hope not to read of any sad CFIT stories. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430200#430200 > > > > > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigatorsp; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - = --> No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 09/09/14 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:20:11 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? From: Robert Borger Hi Gert & others, On a recent trip to Ruidoso, NM I set =93cruise" on my Airmaster (5000 rpm) & 30=94 MP which resulted in 120 kts IAS with a fuel flow of ~5 gph (~19 lph). This is with a tri-gear & no speed kit installed. If I ever get around to installing the wheel pants & gear leg fairings it will probably be faster at the same fuel flow or I can cruise at the same speed for a lower fuel flow. I have heard that Rotax recommends not cruising at an rpm below 5000. I don=92t know how critical that may be. FWIW, a Grumman Tiger landed behind me followed me to the pumps. The copilot (pilot=92s wife) said they ware cruising at 120 kts & burning 12 gph (54.4 lph). Blue skies & tailwinds, Bob Borger Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (75 hrs). Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208-5331 Cel: 817-992-1117 rlborger@mac.com On Sep 8, 2014, at 11:51 PM, Gert Dalgaard S=F8rensen wrote: Hi Ivan - and others Two years ago I had opportunity to purchase a brand new 914, and a Woodcomp at a very reasonably price. Changed engine last summer after 700 hours og trouble free flying with the old constellation. With the old set-up - 914/Warp Drive - i did 105 knots at 4600 rpm, burning 16.5 ltrs./hr. At that power setting my old engine/prop really sounded like it could run for a thousand year - must be the "sweet spot", Ivan :) My new engine and prop. really sounds and feel OK at 4200 rpm / 30", and that is giving me exactly 120 knots IAS. But again - this prop. is a completely new world for me ... What power-setting are others aiming for at cruise with a 914 and adjustable prop? And what fuel-flow do you get? Regards Gert Den 08/09/2014 kl. 18.22 skrev Ivan Shaw : > Gert, > I would not run 4200rpm and 30=94=85.sounds a bit over square to me. > Best way to get your fuel burn info is by test on =91your=92 particular aircraft. Then arrive at a nice economy cruise speed/fuel burn and a regular cruise speed. > Remember you want to cruise your Europa =91on the step=92 AOA wise and this will vary with aircraft weight and differing aircraft. But at MTOW you want to be going 120kts indicated minimum to be nicely in the groove. > Most aircraft have a =91sweet spot=92 speed wise when the aircraft just =91feels=92 right!! Find the sweet spot for YOUR aircraft and cruise there=85.why would you do any other?!! > > Cheers > Ivan > > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gert Dalgaard S=F8rensen > Sent: 08 September 2014 16:05 > To: Europa-List Digest Server > Subject: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? > > Hi > > Could someone show me where I can find figures for the fuel consumption on my 914 when let us say I go 4.200 rpm / 30" MP ... ??? > All I can find is the graphics in Owners Manual and do. graphs. on other Rotax enclosures, but the MP is not an item as far as I can see. > > Regards Gert > OY-GDS > Mono/914/Woodcomp > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:27:37 AM PST US From: AUVRAY Michel Subject: Re: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? Hello Bob, What altitude do you check Le 09/09/2014 16:22, Robert Borger a crit : 5000rpm and 30" 120 kt ? Many thanks Michel AUVRAY > Hi Gert & others, > > On a recent trip to Ruidoso, NM I set cruise" on my Airmaster (5000 > rpm) & 30 MP which resulted in 120 kts IAS with a fuel flow of ~5 gph > (~19 lph). This is with a tri-gear & no speed kit installed. If I > ever get around to installing the wheel pants & gear leg fairings it > will probably be faster at the same fuel flow or I can cruise at the > same speed for a lower fuel flow. > > I have heard that Rotax recommends not cruising at an rpm below 5000. > I dont know how critical that may be. > > FWIW, a Grumman Tiger landed behind me followed me to the pumps. The > copilot (pilots wife) said they ware cruising at 120 kts & burning 12 > gph (54.4 lph). > > Blue skies & tailwinds, > Bob Borger > Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (75 hrs). > Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP > 3705 Lynchburg Dr. > Corinth, TX 76208-5331 > Cel: 817-992-1117 > rlborger@mac.com > > On Sep 8, 2014, at 11:51 PM, Gert Dalgaard Srensen > > wrote: > > Hi Ivan - and others > > Two years ago I had opportunity to purchase a brand new 914, and a > Woodcomp at a very reasonably price. > Changed engine last summer after 700 hours og trouble free flying with > the old constellation. > With the old set-up - 914/Warp Drive - i did 105 knots at 4600 rpm, > burning 16.5 ltrs./hr. > At that power setting my old engine/prop really sounded like it could > run for a thousand year - must be the "sweet spot", Ivan :) > > My new engine and prop. really sounds and feel OK at 4200 rpm / 30", > and that is giving me exactly 120 knots IAS. > But again - this prop. is a completely new world for me ... > What power-setting are others aiming for at cruise with a 914 and > adjustable prop? > And what fuel-flow do you get? > > Regards > Gert > > > Den 08/09/2014 kl. 18.22 skrev Ivan Shaw >: > >> Gert, >> I would not run 4200rpm and 30.sounds a bit over square to me. >> Best way to get your fuel burn info is by test on your particular >> aircraft. Then arrive at a nice economy cruise speed/fuel burn and a >> regular cruise speed. >> Remember you want to cruise your Europa on the step AOA wise and >> this will vary with aircraft weight and differing aircraft. But at >> MTOW you want to be going 120kts indicated minimum to be nicely in >> the groove. >> Most aircraft have a sweet spot speed wise when the aircraft just >> feels right!! Find the sweet spot for YOUR aircraft and cruise >> there.why would you do any other?!! >> Cheers >> Ivan >> *From:*owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com >> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]*On >> Behalf Of*Gert Dalgaard Srensen >> *Sent:*08 September 2014 16:05 >> *To:*Europa-List Digest Server >> *Subject:*Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? >> Hi >> Could someone show me where I can find figures for the fuel >> consumption on my 914 when let us say I go 4.200 rpm / 30" MP ... ??? >> All I can find is the graphics in Owners Manual and do. graphs. on >> other Rotax enclosures, but the MP is not an item as far as I can see. >> Regards Gert >> OY-GDS >> Mono/914/Woodcomp >> > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > * > > * > > > * --- Ce courrier lectronique ne contient aucun virus ou logiciel malveillant parce que la protection avast! Antivirus est active. http://www.avast.com ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:45:55 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? From: Robert Borger Hello Michel, That was at 8500 ft. Ruidoso airport elevation it 6814 ft and traffic pattern altitude is 7900 ft and you have to clear some high ground to get in. TAS was over 130 kts and ground speed was 145 kts with an unusual wind out of the east. Blue skies & tailwinds, Bob Borger Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (75 hrs). Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208-5331 Cel: 817-992-1117 rlborger@mac.com On Sep 9, 2014, at 9:26 AM, AUVRAY Michel wrote: Hello Bob, What altitude do you check Le 09/09/2014 16:22, Robert Borger a =E9crit : 5000rpm and 30" 120 kt ? Many thanks Michel AUVRAY > Hi Gert & others, > > On a recent trip to Ruidoso, NM I set =93cruise" on my Airmaster (5000 rpm) & 30=94 MP which resulted in 120 kts IAS with a fuel flow of ~5 gph (~19 lph). This is with a tri-gear & no speed kit installed. If I ever get around to installing the wheel pants & gear leg fairings it will probably be faster at the same fuel flow or I can cruise at the same speed for a lower fuel flow. > > I have heard that Rotax recommends not cruising at an rpm below 5000. I don=92t know how critical that may be. > > FWIW, a Grumman Tiger landed behind me followed me to the pumps. The copilot (pilot=92s wife) said they ware cruising at 120 kts & burning 12 gph (54.4 lph). > > Blue skies & tailwinds, > Bob Borger > Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (75 hrs). > Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP > 3705 Lynchburg Dr. > Corinth, TX 76208-5331 > Cel: 817-992-1117 > rlborger@mac.com > > On Sep 8, 2014, at 11:51 PM, Gert Dalgaard S=F8rensen wrote: > > Hi Ivan - and others > > Two years ago I had opportunity to purchase a brand new 914, and a Woodcomp at a very reasonably price. > Changed engine last summer after 700 hours og trouble free flying with the old constellation. > With the old set-up - 914/Warp Drive - i did 105 knots at 4600 rpm, burning 16.5 ltrs./hr. > At that power setting my old engine/prop really sounded like it could run for a thousand year - must be the "sweet spot", Ivan :) > > My new engine and prop. really sounds and feel OK at 4200 rpm / 30", and that is giving me exactly 120 knots IAS. > But again - this prop. is a completely new world for me ... > What power-setting are others aiming for at cruise with a 914 and adjustable prop? > And what fuel-flow do you get? > > Regards > Gert > > > > Den 08/09/2014 kl. 18.22 skrev Ivan Shaw : > >> Gert, >> I would not run 4200rpm and 30=94=85.sounds a bit over square to me. >> Best way to get your fuel burn info is by test on =91your=92 particular aircraft. Then arrive at a nice economy cruise speed/fuel burn and a regular cruise speed. >> Remember you want to cruise your Europa =91on the step=92 AOA wise and this will vary with aircraft weight and differing aircraft. But at MTOW you want to be going 120kts indicated minimum to be nicely in the groove. >> Most aircraft have a =91sweet spot=92 speed wise when the aircraft just =91feels=92 right!! Find the sweet spot for YOUR aircraft and cruise there=85.why would you do any other?!! >> >> Cheers >> Ivan >> >> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gert Dalgaard S=F8rensen >> Sent: 08 September 2014 16:05 >> To: Europa-List Digest Server >> Subject: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? >> >> Hi >> >> Could someone show me where I can find figures for the fuel consumption on my 914 when let us say I go 4.200 rpm / 30" MP ... ??? >> All I can find is the graphics in Owners Manual and do. graphs. on other Rotax enclosures, but the MP is not an item as far as I can see. >> >> Regards Gert >> OY-GDS >> Mono/914/Woodcomp >> >> >> > > > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matroni cs.com/Navigator?Europa-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/co ntribution > > > > > Ce courrier =E9lectronique ne contient aucun virus ou logiciel malveillant parce que la protection Antivirus avast! est active. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:58:51 AM PST US From: AUVRAY Michel Subject: Re: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? Many thanks Bob Michel AUVRAY Le 09/09/2014 16:48, Robert Borger a crit : > Hello Michel, > > That was at 8500 ft. Ruidoso airport elevation it 6814 ft and traffic > pattern altitude is 7900 ft and you have to clear some high ground to > get in. TAS was over 130 kts and ground speed was 145 kts with an > unusual wind out of the east. > > Blue skies & tailwinds, > Bob Borger > Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (75 hrs). > Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP > 3705 Lynchburg Dr. > Corinth, TX 76208-5331 > Cel: 817-992-1117 > rlborger@mac.com > > On Sep 9, 2014, at 9:26 AM, AUVRAY Michel > wrote: > > Hello Bob, > What altitude do you check > Le 09/09/2014 16:22, Robert Borger a crit : 5000rpm and 30" 120 kt ? > Many thanks > Michel AUVRAY >> Hi Gert & others, >> >> On a recent trip to Ruidoso, NM I set cruise" on my Airmaster (5000 >> rpm) & 30 MP which resulted in 120 kts IAS with a fuel flow of ~5 >> gph (~19 lph). This is with a tri-gear & no speed kit installed. If >> I ever get around to installing the wheel pants & gear leg fairings >> it will probably be faster at the same fuel flow or I can cruise at >> the same speed for a lower fuel flow. >> >> I have heard that Rotax recommends not cruising at an rpm below 5000. >> I dont know how critical that may be. >> >> FWIW, a Grumman Tiger landed behind me followed me to the pumps. The >> copilot (pilots wife) said they ware cruising at 120 kts & burning >> 12 gph (54.4 lph). >> >> Blue skies & tailwinds, >> Bob Borger >> Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (75 hrs). >> Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP >> 3705 Lynchburg Dr. >> Corinth, TX 76208-5331 >> Cel: 817-992-1117 >> rlborger@mac.com >> >> On Sep 8, 2014, at 11:51 PM, Gert Dalgaard Srensen >> > wrote: >> >> Hi Ivan - and others >> >> Two years ago I had opportunity to purchase a brand new 914, and a >> Woodcomp at a very reasonably price. >> Changed engine last summer after 700 hours og trouble free flying >> with the old constellation. >> With the old set-up - 914/Warp Drive - i did 105 knots at 4600 >> rpm, burning 16.5 ltrs./hr. >> At that power setting my old engine/prop really sounded like it could >> run for a thousand year - must be the "sweet spot", Ivan :) >> >> My new engine and prop. really sounds and feel OK at 4200 rpm / 30", >> and that is giving me exactly 120 knots IAS. >> But again - this prop. is a completely new world for me ... >> What power-setting are others aiming for at cruise with a 914 and >> adjustable prop? >> And what fuel-flow do you get? >> >> Regards >> Gert >> >> >> >> Den 08/09/2014 kl. 18.22 skrev Ivan Shaw > >: >> >>> Gert, >>> I would not run 4200rpm and 30.sounds a bit over square to me. >>> Best way to get your fuel burn info is by test on your particular >>> aircraft. Then arrive at a nice economy cruise speed/fuel burn and a >>> regular cruise speed. >>> Remember you want to cruise your Europa on the step AOA wise and >>> this will vary with aircraft weight and differing aircraft. But at >>> MTOW you want to be going 120kts indicated minimum to be nicely in >>> the groove. >>> Most aircraft have a sweet spot speed wise when the aircraft just >>> feels right!! Find the sweet spot for YOUR aircraft and cruise >>> there.why would you do any other?!! >>> Cheers >>> Ivan >>> *From:*owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com >>> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com]*On >>> Behalf Of*Gert Dalgaard Srensen >>> *Sent:*08 September 2014 16:05 >>> *To:*Europa-List Digest Server >>> *Subject:*Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? >>> Hi >>> Could someone show me where I can find figures for the fuel >>> consumption on my 914 when let us say I go 4.200 rpm / 30" MP ... ??? >>> All I can find is the graphics in Owners Manual and do. graphs. on >>> other Rotax enclosures, but the MP is not an item as far as I can see. >>> Regards Gert >>> OY-GDS >>> Mono/914/Woodcomp >>> >> >> * >> >> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List >> href="http://forums.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com >> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >> * >> >> * >> >> >> * > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Ce courrier lectronique ne contient aucun virus ou logiciel > malveillant parce que la protection Antivirus avast! > est active. > > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > * > > * > > > * --- Ce courrier lectronique ne contient aucun virus ou logiciel malveillant parce que la protection avast! Antivirus est active. http://www.avast.com ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:02:24 AM PST US From: "Bud Yerly" Subject: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements I'm attaching list of fuel cap requests below. SPRL is in production right now. Last Chance to order. I expect the production to be complete by the end of the week. Then that is it. If I missed you on the list, please email immediately as I will only have a couple of spares. Price looks firm at $35.00 US apiece. US customers will get their cap via USPS priority (if it fits it ships) for $5.95 Tax is 7% on Florida Customers Only. Overseas customers will ship via post and should not exceed $12.00 US. For those vacationing in the US from overseas, I will hold your cap until it is convenient for you to pick them up, or I'll forward to your US vacationing address. We have a Pay Pal Account. You will be invoiced on shipping and can pay via check or Pay Pal. Details on the account will be on the invoice. Thank you for your patronage. I will be able to upgrade my anniversary dinner from McDonalds to Wendy's. Qty Name First Last 1 Homer Baker 1 Jim & Heather Butcher 1 Ira Rampil 1 Jerry Hope 1 George Reed 1 Steve Staal 2 Alan & Kate Burrows 1 Dave Anderson 1 Rick Stockton 1 Todd Johnson 1 Karl Heindl 1 Bob Borger 1 Brett Brown 1 John Lawton 1 Richard Kundle 1 Jerry Rehn 1 Danny Shepherd 1 Richard Schultz 1 Bill McClellan 1 Jim Davis 1 Jeff Roberts 1 Hal Carpenter 1 Dave Park 1 Goff Moore 1 Paul McAllister 1 Brad Shafer 1 Andy Ringrose 1 Troy Maynor 1 Bill Bell 1 Rod Palmer 1 Brian Fogg 1 Hans-Peter Reusser 1 Kevin Klienfelter 1 Tony Higgins 1 John Firth 1 Dan Geldermann 1 Greg Fuchs 1 Lee Vaughan 1 Kyle Phillipson 1 Mark Harvey 1 Lance Sanford Best Regards, Bud Yerly ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:07:06 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements From: europa089@aol.com Bud, Do you think I should get Two (2) of them? Sent from my iPhone > On Sep 9, 2014, at 11:02 AM, "Bud Yerly" wrote: > > I'm attaching list of fuel cap requests below. > SPRL is in production right now. Last Chance to order. I expect the prod uction to be complete by the end of the week. > Then that is it. > > If I missed you on the list, please email immediately as I will only have a couple of spares. > Price looks firm at $35.00 US apiece. US customers will get their cap via USPS priority (if it fits it ships) for $5.95 Tax is 7% on Florida Custome rs Only. > Overseas customers will ship via post and should not exceed $12.00 US. Fo r those vacationing in the US from overseas, I will hold your cap until it i s convenient for you to pick them up, or I'll forward to your US vacationing address. > > We have a Pay Pal Account. You will be invoiced on shipping and can pay v ia check or Pay Pal. Details on the account will be on the invoice. > > Thank you for your patronage. I will be able to upgrade my anniversary di nner from McDonalds to Wendy's. > > Qty Name First Last > 1 Homer Baker > 1 Jim & Heather Butcher > 1 Ira Rampil > 1 Jerry Hope > 1 George Reed > 1 Steve Staal > 2 Alan & Kate Burrows > 1 Dave Anderson > 1 Rick Stockton > 1 Todd Johnson > 1 Karl Heindl > 1 Bob Borger > 1 Brett Brown > 1 John Lawton > 1 Richard Kundle > 1 Jerry Rehn > 1 Danny Shepherd > 1 Richard Schultz > 1 Bill McClellan > 1 Jim Davis > 1 Jeff Roberts > 1 Hal Carpenter > 1 Dave Park > 1 Goff Moore > 1 Paul McAllister > 1 Brad Shafer > 1 Andy Ringrose > 1 Troy Maynor > 1 Bill Bell > 1 Rod Palmer > 1 Brian Fogg > 1 Hans-Peter Reusser > 1 Kevin Klienfelter > 1 Tony Higgins > 1 John Firth > 1 Dan Geldermann > 1 Greg Fuchs > 1 Lee Vaughan > 1 Kyle Phillipson > 1 Mark Harvey > 1 Lance Sanford > > Best Regards, > Bud Yerly > > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 08:16:33 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas From: Kevin Challis Brian I fully agree, professional pilots engage the autopilot for most of there fl ights. They earn there money when something goes wrong. And sometimes they don't like keeping a plane in a stall from 30,000 + feet u ntil hits the water. I have only had my IMC for a year and did the training and test in my Europa . Best bit of training I have done. Let's not try and kill permit aeroplanes being allowed to fly in IMC when th e facts don't support the predicted doom and gloom. Kevin Challis > On 9 Sep 2014, at 14:56, "Brian Davies" wrote: > > =9Cif we have a plethora of Permit built and operated aircraft flyin g / departing / returning under IFR we will inevitably be reading about its t ragic results, I would be devastated to read of such tragedies in the press. =9D > > David, I think this is a bit sensationalistic and flies in the face of the facts. Pilots in the USA have been able to fly IFR in home built aircraft f or many years and the ground is not littered with smoking wreckage. > > The very understandable comments from the professional pilots in our commu nity are also not supported by the stats. There are a large number of (UK) IMC rated pilots flying PA28s, for example, and I think there has only been two accidents in total since the IMCR was introduced. Compare this with th e number of accidents caused by VFR pilots scud running. > > All of these issues have been fully and professionally examined as part of the work that has led to the present trials that are taking place. That is w hy it has taken 6 years to get to this stage. Any home built aircraft that i s approved for night/IFR will have been through a very thorough testing proc ess that is at least equivalent to that required for a certified aircraft. > > Regards > > Brian Davies > > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-ser ver@matronics.com] On Behalf Of DAVID JOYCE > Sent: 09 September 2014 10:41 > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas > > This is a really interesting discussion and I have to say that I am in to tal agreement about currency and despite having had an IMC rating for 20+ ye ars do not and will not deliberately fly into IMC conditions as a matter of o pen choice, I only ever did the rating to use as a challenge to improve my f lying and as a last chance get out of jail free card. > > I concur with Jonathans comments that if we have a plethora of Permit buil t and operated aircraft flying / departing / returning under IFR we will ine vitably be reading about its tragic results, I would be devastated to read o f such tragedies in the press. > > There are many different standards of build some are stunning some are dog s, even with the annual permit system they still get through ( I have to say that the same happens with CAA and EASA aircraft as well). if we have a ple thora of Permit built and operated aircraft flying / departing / returning u nder IFR we will inevitably be reading about its tragic results, I would be d evastated to read of such tragedies in the press. > The other one > > Sent to you by David Joyce > www.eastmidsspas.com > > PLEASE NOTE WE HAVE MOVED AND ARE NOW AT > The Zycomm Building 51 Nottingham Road Ripley Derbys DE5 3AS > 160 Meters from Sainsbury's Island > > Same Phone 0800 4102122 and Direct Mobile 07973 675755 > > > From: Fred Klein > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Sent: Monday, 8 September 2014, 23:44 > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas > > > Jonathonthanks for your educated and well-founded opinion particularly your emphasis on the importance of true =9Ccurrency =9D, not just by-the-book currencysimilar reasoning has kept me in t he ranks of VFR aviatorsF. > > On Sep 8, 2014, at 3:07 PM, jonathanmilbank wrote: > .uk> > > > > Permit me to annoy you all intensely. After more than four decades of ea rning my living as a pilot, military and civilian, and having held a full in strument rating for over 32 years, wild horses couldn't drag me and my Europ a into IMC or night conditions, even if my aircraft had all the required bel ls and whistles. > > > > Single-engined in those conditions doesn't seem wise to me, especially i n a glass-fibre airframe in conditions where you can't see and avoid potenti al lightning activity. > > > > Furthermore procedural instrument flying is a skill where you need to ke ep very current. An hour or so each month just isn't going to cut it. Me and my colleagues find that just a week or two of holiday before resuming fligh t operations, puts most pilots (if they're being honest) somewhat behind the mental drag curve for a day or two after returning to duty. > > > > And we have the advantage of an Airbus suite of EFIS, Flight Directors a nd unbeatable automation, plus two pairs of eyes and ears to monitor the sit uation. > > > > Yes I have also flown IMC in earlier days as single pilot with no stabil isation nor autoflight systems, doing things like QGH and GCA in the militar y. That would make anyone sweat. > > > > So have fun if you must and I'll hope not to read of any sad CFIT storie s. > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430200#430200 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigatorsp; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - > = --> > > > > > > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List > http://forums.matronics.com > http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 2014.0.4765 / 09/09/14 > > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 08:27:31 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements Hi Bud, Seem to be missing for one reason or another? 1 number please. John Price Mulberry Stables Lullingstone Park Eynsford England DA4 0JA From: Bud Yerly Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2014 4:02 PM Subject: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements I'm attaching list of fuel cap requests below. SPRL is in production right now. Last Chance to order. I expect the production to be complete by the end of the week. Then that is it. If I missed you on the list, please email immediately as I will only have a couple of spares. Price looks firm at $35.00 US apiece. US customers will get their cap via USPS priority (if it fits it ships) for $5.95 Tax is 7% on Florida Customers Only. Overseas customers will ship via post and should not exceed $12.00 US. For those vacationing in the US from overseas, I will hold your cap until it is convenient for you to pick them up, or I'll forward to your US vacationing address. We have a Pay Pal Account. You will be invoiced on shipping and can pay via check or Pay Pal. Details on the account will be on the invoice. Thank you for your patronage. I will be able to upgrade my anniversary dinner from McDonalds to Wendy's. Qty Name First Last 1 Homer Baker 1 Jim & Heather Butcher 1 Ira Rampil 1 Jerry Hope 1 George Reed 1 Steve Staal 2 Alan & Kate Burrows 1 Dave Anderson 1 Rick Stockton 1 Todd Johnson 1 Karl Heindl 1 Bob Borger 1 Brett Brown 1 John Lawton 1 Richard Kundle 1 Jerry Rehn 1 Danny Shepherd 1 Richard Schultz 1 Bill McClellan 1 Jim Davis 1 Jeff Roberts 1 Hal Carpenter 1 Dave Park 1 Goff Moore 1 Paul McAllister 1 Brad Shafer 1 Andy Ringrose 1 Troy Maynor 1 Bill Bell 1 Rod Palmer 1 Brian Fogg 1 Hans-Peter Reusser 1 Kevin Klienfelter 1 Tony Higgins 1 John Firth 1 Dan Geldermann 1 Greg Fuchs 1 Lee Vaughan 1 Kyle Phillipson 1 Mark Harvey 1 Lance Sanford Best Regards, Bud Yerly ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 08:30:56 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? From: "Roland" Hi there, I found out, that it makes quite a difference for measuring performance and fuel consumption, if I'm solo on board or at MTOM. Plus it's often not mentioned at which altitude the speed is indicated. At least this (from my point of view) is important to have comparable figures. That said, I unfortunately do not have accurate numbers for my aircraft (Trigear with speed kit, Rotax 914 and Airmaster prop). Roughly I cruise between 115 and 120 KIAS at 2000 ft close to 20 l/h at MTOM. Gert, thanks again for selling me your engine - it runs like a sewing machine :) Regards Roland PH-ZTI XS Trigear 914 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430231#430231 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 08:45:31 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? From: Robert Borger Michel, WRT Roland=92s recent comment on weight -- For my Ruidoso trip I was very light. Just myself, the aircraft cover & a small bag. Probably 200 lbs below MTOW. Blue skies & tailwinds, Bob Borger Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (75 hrs). Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208-5331 Cel: 817-992-1117 rlborger@mac.com On Sep 9, 2014, at 9:58 AM, AUVRAY Michel wrote: Many thanks Bob Michel AUVRAY Le 09/09/2014 16:48, Robert Borger a =E9crit : > Hello Michel, > > That was at 8500 ft. Ruidoso airport elevation it 6814 ft and traffic pattern altitude is 7900 ft and you have to clear some high ground to get in. TAS was over 130 kts and ground speed was 145 kts with an unusual wind out of the east. > > Blue skies & tailwinds, > Bob Borger > Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (75 hrs). > Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP > 3705 Lynchburg Dr. > Corinth, TX 76208-5331 > Cel: 817-992-1117 > rlborger@mac.com > > On Sep 9, 2014, at 9:26 AM, AUVRAY Michel wrote: > > Hello Bob, > What altitude do you check > Le 09/09/2014 16:22, Robert Borger a =E9crit : 5000rpm and 30" 120 kt ? > Many thanks > Michel AUVRAY >> Hi Gert & others, >> >> On a recent trip to Ruidoso, NM I set =93cruise" on my Airmaster (5000 rpm) & 30=94 MP which resulted in 120 kts IAS with a fuel flow of ~5 gph (~19 lph). This is with a tri-gear & no speed kit installed. If I ever get around to installing the wheel pants & gear leg fairings it will probably be faster at the same fuel flow or I can cruise at the same speed for a lower fuel flow. >> >> I have heard that Rotax recommends not cruising at an rpm below 5000. I don=92t know how critical that may be. >> >> FWIW, a Grumman Tiger landed behind me followed me to the pumps. The copilot (pilot=92s wife) said they ware cruising at 120 kts & burning 12 gph (54.4 lph). >> >> Blue skies & tailwinds, >> Bob Borger >> Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (75 hrs). >> Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP >> 3705 Lynchburg Dr. >> Corinth, TX 76208-5331 >> Cel: 817-992-1117 >> rlborger@mac.com >> >> On Sep 8, 2014, at 11:51 PM, Gert Dalgaard S=F8rensen wrote: >> >> Hi Ivan - and others >> >> Two years ago I had opportunity to purchase a brand new 914, and a Woodcomp at a very reasonably price. >> Changed engine last summer after 700 hours og trouble free flying with the old constellation. >> With the old set-up - 914/Warp Drive - i did 105 knots at 4600 rpm, burning 16.5 ltrs./hr. >> At that power setting my old engine/prop really sounded like it could run for a thousand year - must be the "sweet spot", Ivan :) >> >> My new engine and prop. really sounds and feel OK at 4200 rpm / 30", and that is giving me exactly 120 knots IAS. >> But again - this prop. is a completely new world for me ... >> What power-setting are others aiming for at cruise with a 914 and adjustable prop? >> And what fuel-flow do you get? >> >> Regards >> Gert >> >> >> >> Den 08/09/2014 kl. 18.22 skrev Ivan Shaw : >> >>> Gert, >>> I would not run 4200rpm and 30=94=85.sounds a bit over square to me. >>> Best way to get your fuel burn info is by test on =91your=92 particular aircraft. Then arrive at a nice economy cruise speed/fuel burn and a regular cruise speed. >>> Remember you want to cruise your Europa =91on the step=92 AOA wise and this will vary with aircraft weight and differing aircraft. But at MTOW you want to be going 120kts indicated minimum to be nicely in the groove. >>> Most aircraft have a =91sweet spot=92 speed wise when the aircraft just =91feels=92 right!! Find the sweet spot for YOUR aircraft and cruise there=85.why would you do any other?!! >>> >>> Cheers >>> Ivan >>> >>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gert Dalgaard S=F8rensen >>> Sent: 08 September 2014 16:05 >>> To: Europa-List Digest Server >>> Subject: Europa-List: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? >>> >>> Hi >>> >>> Could someone show me where I can find figures for the fuel consumption on my 914 when let us say I go 4.200 rpm / 30" MP ... ??? >>> All I can find is the graphics in Owners Manual and do. graphs. on other Rotax enclosures, but the MP is not an item as far as I can see. >>> >>> Regards Gert >>> OY-GDS >>> Mono/914/Woodcomp >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matroni cs.com/Navigator?Europa-List >> href="http://forums.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com >> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/co ntribution >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > Ce courrier =E9lectronique ne contient aucun virus ou logiciel malveillant parce que la protection Antivirus avast! est active. > > > > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matroni cs.com/Navigator?Europa-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/co ntribution > > > > > Ce courrier =E9lectronique ne contient aucun virus ou logiciel malveillant parce que la protection Antivirus avast! est active. ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 08:57:34 AM PST US From: Frans Veldman Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/09/2014 05:02 PM, Bud Yerly wrote: > I'm attaching list of fuel cap requests below. I missed this discussion initially, and later thought it was only for classics. However, I just ran to my airplane and discovered that my cap is 69 mm (the opening being 70mm) so I suspect that I have the no longer produced cap. Therefor, could you please put me on the list? Best regards, Frans Veldman -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJUDyNPAAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVeQMP/2DD9u/G1wWzSnBca1/RGFBy i+sVeUpWx+MdMI1jAEX6O+lykCLvVimcVasXX4UHQ183DbV7OXnhYdkc1CE+DjTk hInPzPTrtoNZ8VpujiiWCBq+fIaZ2aSrWIMruln9tdOEBQa1jZzp5xxc9aaek7Kg /rvbH7rGjX6M4Qz2a11qQco6qkz6I8ZW9mzr1A+GkhKWQSZLdLEE0Lxvjuo0d9Fu YS2dO19zqMsUluYiIJsBJWjHwXGgBF3ogJ8yK9UgcduPEMIyRpIvhkXepCMvvvFP 9VR499xbNdM41NQIU1HpP7uO6nt5AGuUX63mom2rwpNnKxM9JfzNb7IPF/akv7gH JgVTf3Eep8NkigzNTuscmxLXOJWgTX0egDmbpsU8Yd7m9vRLaCoTB48VMKQuNPqv acZIDCIE2/tWAC35COqXdmZbGqsefc1Hdd+FECXK9wuk6PrwkqURC/Xus1y9Vq+9 a1W/OvKz63Z0dOc25jKIbhnu926+aGm1J0xUbdF5+OT3QdcRhsHBCyFak2r0VzBW la29Jq+cO0iiKK/Af1F6Whk2iHAbb9i1nLSK7tebpHOGRKvublLD0FTccSTIWrTX k2X4UATOtaCTmQybAxULEJaVT2GTrda8QfUAiT8qyucyoPOI4bNVw5n/2b3fsBmq P1wwPFBZWkBRAo4eTadR =BTqb -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 09:12:38 AM PST US From: Frans Veldman Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/09/2014 05:30 PM, Roland wrote: > I found out, that it makes quite a difference for measuring > performance and fuel consumption, if I'm solo on board or at MTOM. I always fly (at least) at MTOW. However what I found out is that the distribution of the weight has quite an impact on performance: the more aft, the less drag, and the better the performance. Hence when Ilona and I are going on vacation with a lot of lugage with us, the airplane is actually faster than when we are flying with just the seats occupied. The reason is simple: with the CoG more aft the tailplane has less "inverted lift" to produce, and this also reduces the load on the main wings. So this reduces two times induced drag. Indeed, while cruising in stable weather we often shift a few heavy things more aft in the bagage compartment, which is immediately rewarded by the need to trim a bit more forward, followed by a higher cruise speed. Another thing you need to be aware off is that it makes a difference whether you climbed up to that speed, or came down to that speed. So we often overshoot our intended altitude a bit, and after reaching a stabilized speed, we push her down to the desired altitude, and a higher speed is kept if you be cautious not to let that speed to be "climbed away" again. I know, we consider it some kind of sport to get the most out of our flying machine (or out of our precious fuel). It is worth a grin if you get a consistent 120 knots for 16 l/h. > Plus it's often not mentioned at which altitude the speed is > indicated. At least this (from my point of view) is important to > have comparable figures. IAS is IAS regardless of altitude as far as I can recall. Of course altitude has influence on ground speed, but that should never be used for performance comparisons. Frans -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJUDybOAAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVVlIP/1civE4VrK9mWLQuWih9pgyN 2UJmNjgPAtbfTr5acflJ+lrO1Hbg2fAdBqwtkJ639z74hSRY5Vdbdlb2Q1Pdb6Gq LqBr/iSoAJyWeJhBOn0BCdFkKZOg0meLzZCwzH/cBCI3jljdkGuctbV+VbU8Ny9s SQVXurcl9VOW1h0B8vz1D6HaoeCvOsu4oepMh6HzqHEzKg/vbwSLWDqCrlyZgYhn A3ypl9oHL6UmGEYLFqv0orW/fEnX608tZzQoCDqRpd/qwYcQizHbi6gCuFFG6mL9 0dt6LYNfr1Yta4k4CHQmXgBwUmc2/hY2brmQxv21aK5ylnPKRdZrSFsrt8fD5ntV mOXpjfiyEQNhl42C78YauQud880BOGXNdbnp/kyh/z2q2VF0xH05IX45LqUyLVGp j77/xQB47BwpCtunWFKZ7sXUoUYtMOiW9D9BIR6wzdQUkASlQDPA1mwfD2wu9lcz kf40OrDH8xwum1MgP6vFKu7RlzjOYmvwVCpqMq2zwFMG75Magf2JD8b7IiY5/khD mUS0KtepAGV8PKqQ3sVa0U5kqEq+yxAyZBnZu/MWhrTo+ZxhUmT2hLLfMd9YuK+u JigDIOd6nrlytzy9LlGWiyQ86FJNMdOSRZHgg2KB8KVIJtJ3sfnHvutzsbz8svMm ZhzkKinN0+L+YWfTHjpk =dtMN -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 09:36:50 AM PST US From: Peter Zutrauen Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? "The reason is simple: with the CoG more aft the tailplane has less "inverted lift" to produce, and this also reduces the load on the main wings. So this reduces two times induced drag." Hi Frans, I might question the accuracy of the above assertion - (IMHO) The load on the wing would be greater with the higher gross weight (with the additional luggage), and thus the main wing's induced drag is greater - can't get around that. The net drag savings from a more aft CG come purely from the lower induced drag by the lower angle of incidence of the forward trimmed tailplane, from which the drag savings must be greater than the penalty of higher induced drag from the main wing. Cheers, Pete A239 On Tue, Sep 9, 2014 at 12:11 PM, Frans Veldman wrote: > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > On 09/09/2014 05:30 PM, Roland wrote: > > > I found out, that it makes quite a difference for measuring > > performance and fuel consumption, if I'm solo on board or at MTOM. > > I always fly (at least) at MTOW. However what I found out is that the > distribution of the weight has quite an impact on performance: the > more aft, the less drag, and the better the performance. > Hence when Ilona and I are going on vacation with a lot of lugage with > us, the airplane is actually faster than when we are flying with just > the seats occupied. > The reason is simple: with the CoG more aft the tailplane has less > "inverted lift" to produce, and this also reduces the load on the main > wings. So this reduces two times induced drag. > Indeed, while cruising in stable weather we often shift a few heavy > things more aft in the bagage compartment, which is immediately > rewarded by the need to trim a bit more forward, followed by a higher > cruise speed. > > Another thing you need to be aware off is that it makes a difference > whether you climbed up to that speed, or came down to that speed. So > we often overshoot our intended altitude a bit, and after reaching a > stabilized speed, we push her down to the desired altitude, and a > higher speed is kept if you be cautious not to let that speed to be > "climbed away" again. > > I know, we consider it some kind of sport to get the most out of our > flying machine (or out of our precious fuel). It is worth a grin if > you get a consistent 120 knots for 16 l/h. > > > Plus it's often not mentioned at which altitude the speed is > > indicated. At least this (from my point of view) is important to > > have comparable figures. > > IAS is IAS regardless of altitude as far as I can recall. Of course > altitude has influence on ground speed, but that should never be used > for performance comparisons. > > Frans > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) > > iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJUDybOAAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVVlIP/1civE4VrK9mWLQuWih9pgyN > 2UJmNjgPAtbfTr5acflJ+lrO1Hbg2fAdBqwtkJ639z74hSRY5Vdbdlb2Q1Pdb6Gq > LqBr/iSoAJyWeJhBOn0BCdFkKZOg0meLzZCwzH/cBCI3jljdkGuctbV+VbU8Ny9s > SQVXurcl9VOW1h0B8vz1D6HaoeCvOsu4oepMh6HzqHEzKg/vbwSLWDqCrlyZgYhn > A3ypl9oHL6UmGEYLFqv0orW/fEnX608tZzQoCDqRpd/qwYcQizHbi6gCuFFG6mL9 > 0dt6LYNfr1Yta4k4CHQmXgBwUmc2/hY2brmQxv21aK5ylnPKRdZrSFsrt8fD5ntV > mOXpjfiyEQNhl42C78YauQud880BOGXNdbnp/kyh/z2q2VF0xH05IX45LqUyLVGp > j77/xQB47BwpCtunWFKZ7sXUoUYtMOiW9D9BIR6wzdQUkASlQDPA1mwfD2wu9lcz > kf40OrDH8xwum1MgP6vFKu7RlzjOYmvwVCpqMq2zwFMG75Magf2JD8b7IiY5/khD > mUS0KtepAGV8PKqQ3sVa0U5kqEq+yxAyZBnZu/MWhrTo+ZxhUmT2hLLfMd9YuK+u > JigDIOd6nrlytzy9LlGWiyQ86FJNMdOSRZHgg2KB8KVIJtJ3sfnHvutzsbz8svMm > ZhzkKinN0+L+YWfTHjpk > =dtMN > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 10:33:05 AM PST US From: "Bud Yerly" Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements John, Sorry, I could not find the post when I checked this morning. You are on the list now. Regards, Bud Yerly ----- Original Message ----- From: nicolaandjohn@talktalk.net To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2014 11:26 AM Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements Hi Bud, Seem to be missing for one reason or another? 1 number please. John Price Mulberry Stables Lullingstone Park Eynsford England DA4 0JA From: Bud Yerly Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2014 4:02 PM To: europa-list Subject: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements I'm attaching list of fuel cap requests below. SPRL is in production right now. Last Chance to order. I expect the production to be complete by the end of the week. Then that is it. If I missed you on the list, please email immediately as I will only have a couple of spares. Price looks firm at $35.00 US apiece. US customers will get their cap via USPS priority (if it fits it ships) for $5.95 Tax is 7% on Florida Customers Only. Overseas customers will ship via post and should not exceed $12.00 US. For those vacationing in the US from overseas, I will hold your cap until it is convenient for you to pick them up, or I'll forward to your US vacationing address. We have a Pay Pal Account. You will be invoiced on shipping and can pay via check or Pay Pal. Details on the account will be on the invoice. Thank you for your patronage. I will be able to upgrade my anniversary dinner from McDonalds to Wendy's. Qty Name First Last 1 Homer Baker 1 Jim & Heather Butcher 1 Ira Rampil 1 Jerry Hope 1 George Reed 1 Steve Staal 2 Alan & Kate Burrows 1 Dave Anderson 1 Rick Stockton 1 Todd Johnson 1 Karl Heindl 1 Bob Borger 1 Brett Brown 1 John Lawton 1 Richard Kundle 1 Jerry Rehn 1 Danny Shepherd 1 Richard Schultz 1 Bill McClellan 1 Jim Davis 1 Jeff Roberts 1 Hal Carpenter 1 Dave Park 1 Goff Moore 1 Paul McAllister 1 Brad Shafer 1 Andy Ringrose 1 Troy Maynor 1 Bill Bell 1 Rod Palmer 1 Brian Fogg 1 Hans-Peter Reusser 1 Kevin Klienfelter 1 Tony Higgins 1 John Firth 1 Dan Geldermann 1 Greg Fuchs 1 Lee Vaughan 1 Kyle Phillipson 1 Mark Harvey 1 Lance Sanford Best Regards, Bud Yerly href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matron href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 10:47:17 AM PST US From: "Paul McAllister" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas Hello everyone. There has been a lot of discussion about flying the Europa IFR on the forum so I'll toss in my 2 cents worth. I have both and ILS and GPS approach set up in my aircraft. My experience is that it isn't a very good IFR platform at all. It's just too light and as such, difficult to set up a stable approach. I have personal minimums of 600' on an ILS and 800' and GPS approach and quite frankly I'll only do that if I am super current, and the reality that this I am almost never super current. I can count on one hand the number of times I have done an instrument approach in my Europa. What I do find the IFR capability useful for is to leave an area of marginal weather and fly to a place that is forecasted to be clear VFR. I echo Johnathan's comments, flying two pilot operations in multiengine type rated aircraft is a whole different world and a much better situation than single pilot IFR. In days gone by I'd fly my Piper Comanche down to minimums, but not anymore, I guess I must be getting old. One other thought that Johnathan hadn't mentioned, I have encountered un forecasted icing and even the slightest amount of ice on the Europa's wings is a horrible thought to contemplate. So hopefully if Johnathan hasn't annoyed you all intensely, I have.... lol Cheers, Paul ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 11:04:58 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Texel wonderful again From: "goff" It never ceases to delight. This one saw the following Europas in attendance: G-CHOX G-IVER G-PTAG G-OMIK G-SMDH G-BZTH PH-ZTI LX-CWT PH-DIY PH-JAI PH-SIE Great thanks to our many Dutch hosts for their wonderful hospitality. Goff Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430240#430240 ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 11:36:01 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas From: "graeme bird" I read this week in Pilot the report of the TB10 fatality last year near Bristol, and thought it was a shame he had no confidence in IMC even though he had a few hundred hours PIC and a plane equipt for it. From his track he looked to be in a real panic. Just a few times a year I get in near IMC ish weather, haze, or haze and sun, some low cloud or cloud going from 2/8 to 6/8, maybe having started over the sea only to find a bank of mist/cloud at 500ft. I quite like to fly in a variety of conditions and deliberately fly all year round. Sticking to CAV OK is a mistake. For me its about the confidence. I just want to feel confident and calm, trained and equipt in inadvertent marginal conditions. I guess I don't really need the plane certifying as I don't intend to take off in IMC but it would be good to have it and do my bi annual validations on it. One more aid to confidence. It is more twitchy than a PA28 and even in a PA28 flying for any period in thick cloud is stressful with the changes in air density turbulence etc so I am not going there on purpose. On one hand you have Mr Airbus auto pilot on the other some chap who flies round the world through hour upon hour of horrendous stuff in a flex wing. -------- Graeme Bird G-UMPY Mono Classic/XS 912S/Woodcomp 3000/3W Newby: 105 hours 26 months on the Mono g(at)gdbmk.co.uk Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430241#430241 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 11:38:19 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? From: "Roland" [/quote] IAS is IAS regardless of altitude as far as I can recall Frans, I think you are wrong here. The higher you fly, the less KIAS you have with the same power setting. Roland Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430242#430242 ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 11:52:56 AM PST US From: Frans Veldman Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/09/2014 08:37 PM, Roland wrote: > I think you are wrong here. The higher you fly, the less KIAS you > have with the same power setting. Never observed that, and why would that be the case? (Just to be sure, with "power setting" you don't mean the position of the throttle on a naturally aspirated engine, right?) Frans -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJUD0xbAAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVYmcQAJrvDGHw+HldtEZM9jlQaWMn iDrTrGP03t9uPHkozEcoYDyx22roY0H+US5Mn8hTRC3nmcF72PQFkDGGVABq3VQj AN3YwsE4UYcWfBwElAkZ2YHFjWv/LCITivYVdoH1M/F7doQXn91I1MTf2YAxlMOn ZtZ7XjcTnfIlu3ptvaO2tlI2zwbbi+9uCjX9SzlnSpNVNLedLeN+0ot1tTYy4ccW 3tNxC7pSB0qJUmT5J8U+lkq/gllNXduMyybNNEy5xxhZbeIXbpfw0vaRT2gn0HCB m2Rz/Z5nIrZ46F7lhIHUBDaQ7jiOvTFLe0DpmkrhXdj9Y5nuT/Vzm0WUP2k26d4u HSNQTym4EmqC8qpIUKtkDqqaLuDPdJxHeC81k5sr7VXjUVCqyDgleSmt+R74MQyP Gje0ClzaS6Uiqxj1C2HwyhcrOQzqBB9c6b6rrM2AMcX/7x48RdfKa6iTJ0I4hC1p Lj5CfXBge1kGVOYfxwVzpfXmj6RSkejj84vFsr2lqmSsvFenbcoenG8b0DrnvLyw C10eqv00Vh7kNGDuNAG8oCX9zwO6EgppBowokmukNbF5dOwIrQsgHUMVbKbXFj/8 dWPrGJCmUGfhekGXEQzt4zaE0iS2y25boij01M2Y/OIhYh3Iht8Gry1tZ2y4d8a9 Ye459ZA7NXSmfthSWcIL =yVdm -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 12:00:47 PM PST US From: Jeremy Fisher Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements Bud, I just checked and found out that my fuel cap is also 70mm. If possible, please add me to your list for a replacement/spare. Thanks. Jerry Fisher On Sep 9, 2014, at 11:02 AM, Bud Yerly wrote: > I'm attaching list of fuel cap requests below. > SPRL is in production right now. Last Chance to order. I expect the production to be complete by the end of the week. > Then that is it. > > If I missed you on the list, please email immediately as I will only have a couple of spares. > Price looks firm at $35.00 US apiece. US customers will get their cap via USPS priority (if it fits it ships) for $5.95 Tax is 7% on Florida Customers Only. > Overseas customers will ship via post and should not exceed $12.00 US. For those vacationing in the US from overseas, I will hold your cap until it is convenient for you to pick them up, or I'll forward to your US vacationing address. > > We have a Pay Pal Account. You will be invoiced on shipping and can pay via check or Pay Pal. Details on the account will be on the invoice. > > Thank you for your patronage. I will be able to upgrade my anniversary dinner from McDonalds to Wendy's. > > Qty Name First Last > 1 Homer Baker > 1 Jim & Heather Butcher > 1 Ira Rampil > 1 Jerry Hope > 1 George Reed > 1 Steve Staal > 2 Alan & Kate Burrows > 1 Dave Anderson > 1 Rick Stockton > 1 Todd Johnson > 1 Karl Heindl > 1 Bob Borger > 1 Brett Brown > 1 John Lawton > 1 Richard Kundle > 1 Jerry Rehn > 1 Danny Shepherd > 1 Richard Schultz > 1 Bill McClellan > 1 Jim Davis > 1 Jeff Roberts > 1 Hal Carpenter > 1 Dave Park > 1 Goff Moore > 1 Paul McAllister > 1 Brad Shafer > 1 Andy Ringrose > 1 Troy Maynor > 1 Bill Bell > 1 Rod Palmer > 1 Brian Fogg > 1 Hans-Peter Reusser > 1 Kevin Klienfelter > 1 Tony Higgins > 1 John Firth > 1 Dan Geldermann > 1 Greg Fuchs > 1 Lee Vaughan > 1 Kyle Phillipson > 1 Mark Harvey > 1 Lance Sanford > > Best Regards, > Bud Yerly > > > > ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 12:09:04 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? From: "Roland" Hi Frans, for example here an extraction of the Cirrus SR 22 POH SR22 nonT ISA, Werte teils interpoliert, IAS errechnet Alt/Power/TAS/IAS/FF /GpH 8000 55% 160 138 13,1 10000 55% 163 136 13,1 12000 55% 166 134 13,1 14000 55% 170 133 13,1 16000 55% 173 131 13,1 17000 55% 175 131 13,2 Doesn't have anything to do with Turbo/Non Turbo. Groet Roland PH-ZTI XS Trigear 914 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430246#430246 ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 12:29:23 PM PST US From: Frans Veldman Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/09/2014 09:08 PM, Roland wrote: > for example here an extraction of the Cirrus SR 22 POH Interesting! These are rather high altitudes, don't know if that has anything to do with it. Also, does the Cirrus have variable pitch props? I'm looking for a reason why this could be. As I said, I never observed something like this with my Europa. The only thing that changes at high (FL100) altitudes (besides the increase in ground speed) is that the cooling is a bit less due to the lower density so I have to open up the cowl flap a bit more. All other flight parameters remain the same. Which makes somehow sense as both the aerodynamic drag and pressure on the pitot diminish at the same rate. Any idea here? Frans -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJUD1T3AAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVWgUP+gOgHp7uLcGdjGnOjHJ8+ahO KJiYQp/PKMwEvoXM6b757fNv3tBC81pk4x3aDb65HBQ5TohBOpyHiAhflzRFTTkj oLFX7eKhOKIXaO5t94Xka0iBgYoc685IxUFii5MqiDrlkgQukCL80YFlh2eX6R3N pTmxwZClcCocrbEgvV0kEQsnlaMPpfHSnMUxc9lf2s0C8M8Yt4XUanID5B2Tqrpd 6Iuc2LQoi9JZakyARFKpt9Kr1LqPH4mtC//0NfShFgVmt1wsoIx6QD432ersiWTM RwSksGiutsJthQAqCoH6/MfKFaefAdtdd15tZWVq50QTN1ebeqw/1S3ttRdctlay UfMCKvytYzoX/2woG6FFjsGj1Z+XBbaBtSD3cmPReZb42uCXqCKCqdG7Iq4p1sQd 3sXy1pcRjWTnrM5REOWrDw6lQ8oC+FzZO6uHhmPhld9FHOQa7egV/HZgDDENz90C 7qQtkxpuXvSBJrV7pKZ4u9exwSG4DtCzDzSKbEWTuHeNxBD5WGOqJwKfCkoijBqK Nh2cYeQPQLaI1Vx7gyYc+GKEf40fWNPGURQSX7VnJjFbrzoQqvFDgsOJTDt3+MxZ Zih8DZ98pO4ugTcho0IGAnhsZEtddJWmnfAL4fd9R7clH/FX7rHfvStMAltC+Axc f8QeE2tGbuCsE3KuYOcE =mNHW -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 12:38:14 PM PST US From: "Bud Yerly" Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements Jeremy, I'll see if I can get another cap added on. I'll email you directly back Wednesday PM. Email me at budyerly@msn.com with your address. Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: Jeremy Fisher To: europa-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2014 3:00 PM Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements Bud, I just checked and found out that my fuel cap is also 70mm. If possible, please add me to your list for a replacement/spare. Thanks. Jerry Fisher On Sep 9, 2014, at 11:02 AM, Bud Yerly wrote: I'm attaching list of fuel cap requests below. SPRL is in production right now. Last Chance to order. I expect the production to be complete by the end of the week. Then that is it. If I missed you on the list, please email immediately as I will only have a couple of spares. Price looks firm at $35.00 US apiece. US customers will get their cap via USPS priority (if it fits it ships) for $5.95 Tax is 7% on Florida Customers Only. Overseas customers will ship via post and should not exceed $12.00 US. For those vacationing in the US from overseas, I will hold your cap until it is convenient for you to pick them up, or I'll forward to your US vacationing address. We have a Pay Pal Account. You will be invoiced on shipping and can pay via check or Pay Pal. Details on the account will be on the invoice. Thank you for your patronage. I will be able to upgrade my anniversary dinner from McDonalds to Wendy's. Qty Name First Last 1 Homer Baker 1 Jim & Heather Butcher 1 Ira Rampil 1 Jerry Hope 1 George Reed 1 Steve Staal 2 Alan & Kate Burrows 1 Dave Anderson 1 Rick Stockton 1 Todd Johnson 1 Karl Heindl 1 Bob Borger 1 Brett Brown 1 John Lawton 1 Richard Kundle 1 Jerry Rehn 1 Danny Shepherd 1 Richard Schultz 1 Bill McClellan 1 Jim Davis 1 Jeff Roberts 1 Hal Carpenter 1 Dave Park 1 Goff Moore 1 Paul McAllister 1 Brad Shafer 1 Andy Ringrose 1 Troy Maynor 1 Bill Bell 1 Rod Palmer 1 Brian Fogg 1 Hans-Peter Reusser 1 Kevin Klienfelter 1 Tony Higgins 1 John Firth 1 Dan Geldermann 1 Greg Fuchs 1 Lee Vaughan 1 Kyle Phillipson 1 Mark Harvey 1 Lance Sanford Best Regards, Bud Yerly href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matron ics.com/Navigator?Europa-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ontribution http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 12:43:04 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? From: "Roland" I don't know, how good your German is, but I don't have anything other at hand - sorry (and cannot explain it myself): https://www.pilotundflugzeug.de/forum/2014,08,04,18,3733399 Let's discuss that on Texel next year ;-) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430255#430255 ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 01:03:00 PM PST US From: Frans Veldman Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/09/2014 09:37 PM, Bud Yerly wrote: > Jeremy, I'll see if I can get another cap added on. I'll email you > directly back Wednesday PM. I think you missed my email? I would also like to be put on the list. Thanks, Frans -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJUD1zOAAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVEbwQAKc7VG355EduPmvKduz/1eyE JSUa/Ld8n10lFx7cHqrPGoHPiji1Sj4gVxr8QFnTrZmLbyTI9OxjQo6pcQRaR5rd B/z0/plADgwn8WQX954FWx5eD6/HEwnJS5rhbxgFoQWK+GUPqykBMy1ArdtQbrt5 bbztmbjKTzKlDwwqOyMv4Y5ksoatumSTZorjJskIGNjWlOvTOV7vsHdNWZya86t+ 4S1ty3Jkcgd1KSlKFlxK4Q8ZmtCkkVcPSs2GLcResqrbUUaRYmRQ9d5fW80BEPNK UvcoCpmRaaimkZtzdpVlplaztkr7vAEHggt2fLrKLXlHlKB6vn4gsdjGqWpuECMx prpNjBBmCUsBsgnCJhcDSx125Sr5ZOx7/nZFGBuRZZtc8E+XVuXTJWLEAECFkGgw XzUPfoWcld+tVSY4UI5lSvnx8ILRLBmBtpHW9oRVfSqQojFbmbyx1jNWJ5H/SSz5 SUEzswFvHIYBvUNc2ad80sQa6oXnjhJIEs4BREFpSchBjo6fhkKhHjDNf4XF3CA4 uDI9ymUFg6MwulwIqRR+mxT6gPvS7ohxrUIrgw6BrtCEAmtRSMLZMtB81lIftecp yhpqhlzVHSPQBNSOM3/asfWY0gXk55Y+IkEbd5fYaIs4eNDtw8smQtIpTtuiP/Gx bkBRqTeUM3bHStbO1jef =45QB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 01:20:54 PM PST US From: Frans Veldman Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: 914 / Woodcomp / fuel consumption ... ?? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 09/09/2014 09:42 PM, Roland wrote: > > I don't know, how good your German is, but I don't have anything > other at hand - sorry (and cannot explain it myself): I have read it (I can read German if I have to ;-) ) but it seems there is no real definite answer, but if I understand correctly it is because of reduced prop efficiency at altitude. The solution to this seems to have a prop with a larger diameter, which is exactly what I have. ;-) And of course I have my questions about the effects in more normal altitudes, like from 0 to FL90, instead of FL80 to FL170. I mean, FL170 (like in the graph) is something I never have been testing with my Europa. ;-) Frans -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJUD2ECAAoJEC+zXxqs0ZzVPxgP/iabJGn6Z9Kd486JBT1joGea ei33MfO5nxqV+bGDi7buTzECxN5qVmHLau+YOG234ejveE8ujMNcYfQmsRSwS92Y v6vbhsF1MNtaBmpBxgvTWsHVlQtezK3jh4nvnJLNaCRzb7Oy+FcqTvI6NOEcbSHm gNNIbjt8i95nqeFNbMEqcuLK918vu/1Rk0Rr1/Os5yS1JOW/ZGy8iZhS2WcyX+L5 QGGhLrWfxd77xcvFf2XcQG65LeBg2Wicm8dGamDSp6bRP9ZcIimNGhBMOUoxccdQ ilot7rUJhnE2Q4vnvXgtDC1tF1n6piWBOwWPXca2SZ8T1oKNo57uHhZ7yQAXyrDr sRPyUJyi9tobdDALCNhiiPtzi900DIvOF1xJOQPTaMDFOPkVuVUgpVCUhaWrQNcp 6/IizU7YJgfUjmZxZP0NCWUgv3hBHK447INJMiFQJF1wPpODwIVEL4C5nLd/+Nth SYAp3HGL9Ef6ptBTLGzOkhgImf2jtW4ScH1/B8Tz9kK0lyevjNYkmMDuT0yAbMtg k22hbh4KtrEKvteaxV1SGTjeoLPlJKSkHLG1FJvLDhDgdvo/ZKQ9uCBWqOiFS97D /Gywv+k7iqNfGSSbDo6Ll6Qbk6gkoRyHO3hqHWMedwuMgQnoAYCz3jfKHmb2vaNG EqcGvmNEzQCb9d8LHwJu =b8YZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 02:09:02 PM PST US From: "craig" Subject: RE: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements Sorry bud, me too if I am not too late Regards craig From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bud Yerly Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2014 3:32 AM Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements John, Sorry, I could not find the post when I checked this morning. You are on the list now. Regards, Bud Yerly ----- Original Message ----- From: nicolaandjohn@talktalk.net Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2014 11:26 AM Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements Hi Bud, Seem to be missing for one reason or another? 1 number please. John Price Mulberry Stables Lullingstone Park Eynsford England DA4 0JA From: Bud Yerly Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2014 4:02 PM Subject: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements I'm attaching list of fuel cap requests below. SPRL is in production right now. Last Chance to order. I expect the production to be complete by the end of the week. Then that is it. If I missed you on the list, please email immediately as I will only have a couple of spares. Price looks firm at $35.00 US apiece. US customers will get their cap via USPS priority (if it fits it ships) for $5.95 Tax is 7% on Florida Customers Only. Overseas customers will ship via post and should not exceed $12.00 US. For those vacationing in the US from overseas, I will hold your cap until it is convenient for you to pick them up, or I'll forward to your US vacationing address. We have a Pay Pal Account. You will be invoiced on shipping and can pay via check or Pay Pal. Details on the account will be on the invoice. Thank you for your patronage. I will be able to upgrade my anniversary dinner from McDonalds to Wendy's. Qty Name First Last 1 Homer Baker 1 Jim & Heather Butcher 1 Ira Rampil 1 Jerry Hope 1 George Reed 1 Steve Staal 2 Alan & Kate Burrows 1 Dave Anderson 1 Rick Stockton 1 Todd Johnson 1 Karl Heindl 1 Bob Borger 1 Brett Brown 1 John Lawton 1 Richard Kundle 1 Jerry Rehn 1 Danny Shepherd 1 Richard Schultz 1 Bill McClellan 1 Jim Davis 1 Jeff Roberts 1 Hal Carpenter 1 Dave Park 1 Goff Moore 1 Paul McAllister 1 Brad Shafer 1 Andy Ringrose 1 Troy Maynor 1 Bill Bell 1 Rod Palmer 1 Brian Fogg 1 Hans-Peter Reusser 1 Kevin Klienfelter 1 Tony Higgins 1 John Firth 1 Dan Geldermann 1 Greg Fuchs 1 Lee Vaughan 1 Kyle Phillipson 1 Mark Harvey 1 Lance Sanford Best Regards, Bud Yerly href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref "http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List">http://www.matronhref "http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 02:37:35 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements From: Brian Phillips Hi Bud, I seem to be missing as well. I would like one also please if I'm not too late. Brian Phillips Sydney, Downunder. From: "Bud Yerly" Subject: Europa-List: 70mm Fuel Cap Replacements Sent by: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com I'm attaching list of fuel cap requests below. SPRL is in production right now. Last Chance to order. I expect the production to be complete by the end of the week. Then that is it. If I missed you on the list, please email immediately as I will only have a couple of spares. Price looks firm at $35.00 US apiece. US customers will get their cap via USPS priority (if it fits it ships) for $5.95 Tax is 7% on Florida Customers Only. Overseas customers will ship via post and should not exceed $12.00 US. For those vacationing in the US from overseas, I will hold your cap until it is convenient for you to pick them up, or I'll forward to your US vacationing address. We have a Pay Pal Account. You will be invoiced on shipping and can pay via check or Pay Pal. Details on the account will be on the invoice. Thank you for your patronage. I will be able to upgrade my anniversary dinner from McDonalds to Wendy's. Qty Name First Last 1 Homer Baker 1 Jim & Heather Butcher 1 Ira Rampil 1 Jerry Hope 1 George Reed 1 Steve Staal 2 Alan & Kate Burrows 1 Dave Anderson 1 Rick Stockton 1 Todd Johnson 1 Karl Heindl 1 Bob Borger 1 Brett Brown 1 John Lawton 1 Richard Kundle 1 Jerry Rehn 1 Danny Shepherd 1 Richard Schultz 1 Bill McClellan 1 Jim Davis 1 Jeff Roberts 1 Hal Carpenter 1 Dave Park 1 Goff Moore 1 Paul McAllister 1 Brad Shafer 1 Andy Ringrose 1 Troy Maynor 1 Bill Bell 1 Rod Palmer 1 Brian Fogg 1 Hans-Peter Reusser 1 Kevin Klienfelter 1 Tony Higgins 1 John Firth 1 Dan Geldermann 1 Greg Fuchs 1 Lee Vaughan 1 Kyle Phillipson 1 Mark Harvey 1 Lance Sanford Best Regards, Bud Yerly This e-mail may contain confidential or privileged information. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender immediately via return e-mail and then delete the original e-mail. If you are the intended recipient, please note the change of sender email address to @ausgrid.com.au. Ausgrid has collected your business contact details for dealing with you in your business capacity. More information about how we handle your personal information, including your right of access is contained at http://www.ausgrid.com.au/ ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 04:24:28 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: LAA/CAA IFR permission on europas From: "JonSmith" I guess you will have "x" hundred pilots and "x" hundred views on this! My feeling is that I welcome the possibility that we may one day be given the privilege to be able to consider extending our options on a given occasion if considered appropriate. The realisation of one's own limitations and those of the aircraft is a vital part of all aspects of aviation, none more so than the proposed Permit IFR operations. Personal ability and limitations along with aircraft ability and limitations are paramount and need to be fully understood and appreciated always. But my view is that the permit IFR issue is essentially no different to "IFR operations" in say a Cessna 150 or a C of A Auster for example which has always been allowed. I personally would be just as happy to go out and conduct the same IFR flight in my Europa that I might go and do in a Cessna 150 that I have been qualified to do for years. Yes we do need to consider and realise just what it is we are hoping to be able to be able to do! I don't think any of us believe that we will suddenly become a true all weather/ go anywhere, anytime you like type operation in our little Europas and go whizzing down the ILS to minimums at Heathrow or Paris Charles de Gaulle on a daily basis with the big boys. But to have the capability (in quiet uncontrolled airspace if you like) to legally climb up through a benign layer of cloud to cruise in the beautiful clear air above and descend down through the layer again into good weather below - and to have the capability if necessary to make a simple ILS approach as a cloud break procedure at say a small quiet regional type airport is not beyond the realms of possibility for many of us. I have "dabbled" in the past on a number of occasions to make trips go easier and must say I have always found my Europa a very good instrument platform. Light, very responsive and stable. It's sensitive of course but I don't find it at all twitchy. But I know my limitations and those of my plane and my intention as always, with careful planning and thought is never to overstep those limits. -------- G-TERN Classic Mono Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430265#430265 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.