---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 01/06/15: 11 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:10 AM - Re: Tie-down points (Bud Yerly) 2. 09:09 AM - Typical mass of paint? (Clive Sutton) 3. 11:03 AM - Fuselage join (William Daniell) 4. 12:28 PM - Re: Typical mass of paint? (graeme bird) 5. 01:16 PM - Re: Typical mass of paint? (jonathanmilbank) 6. 01:37 PM - Re: Typical mass of paint? (Clive Sutton) 7. 01:59 PM - Re: Typical mass of paint? (jonathanmilbank) 8. 02:32 PM - Re: Fuselage join (Fred Klein) 9. 02:56 PM - Re: Fuselage join (davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk) 10. 03:02 PM - Re: Fuselage join (William Daniell) 11. 08:36 PM - Re: Tie-down points (Timward) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:10:46 AM PST US From: "Bud Yerly" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Tie-down points Rick, The classic tie down is a challenge with the wing speed kit. My nose gear frame is open on the bottom. At airshows and cross country, I use the gear frame on the front and my tail eye hook. Many airports have a cable laid for tie down and it is just a short clip and go if you have a cargo tie down strap. If all the airport has is single point tie down anchors in the ground, I put the airplane in backwards, tie the nose gear frame down, then tie their wing ropes together to the tail. Jeff Behrens has a simple setup using the outer flap bracket and a 1/8 or so aluminum strap tied to all three bolts and bent out at about a 30 degree angle. The outboard cover would (if cut right), over the tie down. His setup tied at the frame, tail, and both wings went through the tornado at Sun n Fun without a hitch or scratch. All the trigear Europa's did fine as they were into the wind. Not much help if you sealed up your nose gear. Best Regards, Bud Yerly -------------------------------------------------- From: "Rick Moss" Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2015 9:40 AM Subject: Europa-List: Tie-down points > > Hi all, > > My Europa (Classic tri gear with XS wings and FWF) has no obvious tie down > points. POH indicates that the undercarriage should be used, but with the > speed kit I can see challenges there. What to you all use? > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=436605#436605 > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 09:09:17 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Typical mass of paint? From: "Clive Sutton" Can anyone tell me what painting added to the weight of their mono please? I appreciate it might seem like a 'how long is a piece of string' question . . . The amount and quality of the filling & sanding done so far seems to be reasonable/not excessive and I'm planning to use 2-pack acrylic - applied by someone who knows what they are doing with a/c painting Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=436687#436687 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 11:03:44 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Fuselage join From: William Daniell I have a visible join the upper half lip being slightly proud as a result sliding down over the bottom half. The joint is good and the difference is slight. What is the normal practice for the visible join line between the fuze halves? Does one have to sand down to the epoxy or can one fill on top of sanded the gel coat? thanks Will William Daniell LONGPORT +57 310 295 0744 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 12:28:56 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Typical mass of paint? From: "graeme bird" but what's the point of the question, you have to paint it and you are going to use the minimum; I must have used about 7 -8 ltrs of 2 pack base coat and similar for top coat. Most of the weight of the can evaporates, probably a third of it goes on the floor or through the fans. -------- Graeme Bird G-UMPY Mono Classic/XS 912S/Woodcomp 3000/3W Newby: 135 hours 32 months on the Mono g(at)gdbmk.co.uk Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=436698#436698 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 01:16:45 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Typical mass of paint? From: "jonathanmilbank" Excuse me if I set myself up to be shot down, but I vaguely recall from when my Classic Mono got painted in 1996 that two-pack (the poisonous stuff which needs clever breathing apparatus to be worn while spraying, or else you die) contains no solvents. I was given to understand that apart from any overspray, all of the weight of the contents of the paint tins ends up on the aircraft. Hence the need for a skilled person with the spray gun, which is why I paid an expert. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=436699#436699 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 01:37:56 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Typical mass of paint? From: "Clive Sutton" The point of my question is that ive got a prediction spreadsheet running to estimate the empty weight and need to put something in for the paint. The purpose of the spreadsheet is to help make pre-fit choices about instrumentation, battery placement etc before being stuck with whatever drops out of the final weighing and avoid having to add eg lead to achieve w&b. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=436701#436701 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 01:59:34 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Typical mass of paint? From: "jonathanmilbank" It's impossible, I would suggest, to predict the final W & B with the best spreadsheets that money can buy. If you're going to have a 912 pulling you through the sky and you install much the same kit as most others, then the C of G will almost take care of itself. I can't see any substitute for simply getting on with it and doing the measurements at the end. I left myself with the option at the end of placing the battery either in the engine bay or behind the seats in my Classic, but maybe that option isn't so attractive in the XS. But then again, why not? It's such an easy fix! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=436703#436703 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 02:32:15 PM PST US From: Fred Klein Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuselage join > On Jan 6, 2015, at 11:03 AM, William Daniell wrote: > > I have a visible join the upper half lip being slightly proud as a result sliding down over the bottom half. The joint is good and the difference is slight. > > What is the normal practice for the visible join line between the fuze halves? Does one have to sand down to the epoxy or can one fill on top of sanded the gel coat? WillI had the opposite problemi.e., my lower half was proud, and problem solved by adding spacers at each cleco and thickening the Redux bed. For your case, i=99d of course remove the gel coat along the edge of the upper half and rough up the gel coat on the lower half; I don=99t think it=99s necessary to remove the entire gel coat in order to add the requisite filler. Perhaps others w/ more knowledge than I will make other recommendations. Fred ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 02:56:34 PM PST US From: davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuselage join William, You can of course stick a go fast stripe over the join line, but if your 'amour propre' insists on a perfect finish then fill any low areas and sand it all down to a perfect finish. You should in any case sand all the gel coat surface down to complete matness without the smallest bit of refective surface visible, to give the optimum key to whatever paint system you plan to use. One word of warning on which: The release agent used in the original gel coat mould is a strong allergy inducer. Make very sure you have washed all gel coated surfaces very thoroughly before you start sanding them and wear a good mask. You might be totally immune to normal fibreglass dust but get caught out by the gel coat dust which is a more sinister animal! Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ On 2015-01-06 22:31, Fred Klein wrote: >> On Jan 6, 2015, at 11:03 AM, William Daniell wrote: >> >> I have a visible join the upper half lip being slightly proud as a result sliding down over the bottom half. The joint is good and the difference is slight. >> >> What is the normal practice for the visible join line between the fuze halves? Does one have to sand down to the epoxy or can one fill on top of sanded the gel coat? > > Will...I had the opposite problem...i.e., my lower half was proud, and problem solved by adding spacers at each cleco and thickening the Redux bed. For your case, i'd of course remove the gel coat along the edge of the upper half and rough up the gel coat on the lower half; I don't think it's necessary to remove the entire gel coat in order to add the requisite filler. Perhaps others w/ more knowledge than I will make other recommendations. > > Fred > Links: ------ [1] http://www.aeroelectric.com [2] http://www.buildersbooks.com [3] http://www.homebuilthelp.com [4] http://www.mypilotstore.com [5] http://www.mrrace.com [6] http://www.matronics.com/contribution [7] http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List [8] http://forums.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 03:02:14 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Fuselage join From: William Daniell thanks...go faster stripe is a great idea. As for gel coal thanks for warning ...wash with soap or solvent? On Jan 6, 2015 5:59 PM, wrote: > William, You can of course stick a go fast stripe over the join line, > but if your 'amour propre' insists on a perfect finish then fill any low > areas and sand it all down to a perfect finish. You should in any case sand > all the gel coat surface down to complete matness without the smallest bit > of refective surface visible, to give the optimum key to whatever paint > system you plan to use. One word of warning on which: The release agent > used in the original gel coat mould is a strong allergy inducer. Make very > sure you have washed all gel coated surfaces very thoroughly before you > start sanding them and wear a good mask. You might be totally immune to > normal fibreglass dust but get caught out by the gel coat dust which is a > more sinister animal! > > Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ > > > On 2015-01-06 22:31, Fred Klein wrote: > > > On Jan 6, 2015, at 11:03 AM, William Daniell > wrote: > > I have a visible join the upper half lip being slightly proud as a > result sliding down over the bottom half. The joint is good and the > difference is slight. > > What is the normal practice for the visible join line between the fuze > halves? Does one have to sand down to the epoxy or can one fill on top of > sanded the gel coat? > > Will...I had the opposite problem...i.e., my lower half was proud, and > problem solved by adding spacers at each cleco and thickening the Redux > bed. For your case, i'd of course remove the gel coat along the edge of the > upper half and rough up the gel coat on the lower half; I don't think it's > necessary to remove the entire gel coat in order to add the requisite > filler. Perhaps others w/ more knowledge than I will make other > recommendations. > > Fred > > * > > ectric.com > ">www.buildersbooks.com > builthelp.com > lotstore.com > m > .matronics.com/contribution > ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List > ics.com > > * > > * > > > * > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:36:51 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Tie-down points From: Timward Happy New Year Everyone. I have a Monowheel Classic and tie it down by securing the large main wheel and tail wheel only. The outriggers should prevent the wings from lifting. Therefore no tie down points are required on the wings. Thoughts? Just saw for the first time my aircraft flying from the ground after giving my son a rating to fly it! Wonderful sight and such a proud father. Now there is a cheaper way for him to build up his hours! Weather dependent of course! Cheers, Tim Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street Fendalton, Christchurch, 8052 New Zealand. ward.t@xtra.co.nz Ph 64 3 3515166 Mob 0210640221 > On 7/01/2015, at 4:09 am, Bud Yerly wrote: > > > Rick, > The classic tie down is a challenge with the wing speed kit. My nose gear frame is open on the bottom. > > At airshows and cross country, I use the gear frame on the front and my tail eye hook. Many airports have a cable laid for tie down and it is just a short clip and go if you have a cargo tie down strap. If all the airport has is single point tie down anchors in the ground, I put the airplane in backwards, tie the nose gear frame down, then tie their wing ropes together to the tail. > > Jeff Behrens has a simple setup using the outer flap bracket and a 1/8 or so aluminum strap tied to all three bolts and bent out at about a 30 degree angle. The outboard cover would (if cut right), over the tie down. > > His setup tied at the frame, tail, and both wings went through the tornado at Sun n Fun without a hitch or scratch. All the trigear Europa's did fine as they were into the wind. > > Not much help if you sealed up your nose gear. > > Best Regards, > Bud Yerly > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "Rick Moss" > Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2015 9:40 AM > To: > Subject: Europa-List: Tie-down points > >> >> Hi all, >> >> My Europa (Classic tri gear with XS wings and FWF) has no obvious tie down points. POH indicates that the undercarriage should be used, but with the speed kit I can see challenges there. What to you all use? >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=436605#436605 > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.