---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 03/22/15: 13 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:42 AM - water drain (Max Cointe (Free)) 2. 12:51 AM - Re: water drain (=?utf-8?Q?Gert_Dalgaard_S=C3=B8rensen?=) 3. 03:11 AM - Re: water drain (davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk) 4. 04:22 AM - Re: water drain (Bob Harrison) 5. 04:52 AM - Re: Nose Wheel Bearing (Alan Carter) 6. 06:09 AM - Re: water drain (Robert Borger) 7. 10:10 AM - Re: water drain (david park) 8. 11:51 AM - Re: water drain (Timward) 9. 12:57 PM - Re: water drain (Grahamhall123@gmail.com) 10. 01:33 PM - Re: water drain (jonathanmilbank) 11. 02:13 PM - Re: water drain (Kevin Klinefelter) 12. 03:01 PM - Re: water drain (Ken Carpenter) 13. 06:26 PM - Re: Re: Nose Wheel Bearing (Bud Yerly) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:42:26 AM PST US From: "Max Cointe (Free)" Subject: Europa-List: water drain Hi there All, Who uses water drain? Who as ever seen water in the fuel there (I use Mogas only)? Cheers, Max Cointe F-PMLH Europa XS_TriGear Kit #560-2003 912ULS/AirmasterAP332 540 hours F-PLDJ DynAro MCR 4S Kit #27-2002 912ULSFR/MTProp MTV7A 1660 heures ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:51:28 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: water drain From: =?utf-8?Q?Gert_Dalgaard_S=C3=B8rensen?= Hi Max I fly on mo-gas and use water-drain - never seen a drop of water. I always leave the ac with full tank. AC parked in hangar during the summer, and in my isolated shop from November to April. Regards Gert Gert Dalgaard, Denmark OY-GDS Europa Mono/914/750 hrs. > Den 22/03/2015 kl. 08.41 skrev Max Cointe (Free) : > > > Hi there All, > > Who uses water drain? Who as ever seen water in the fuel there (I use Mogas only)? > > Cheers, > Max Cointe > F-PMLH Europa XS_TriGear > Kit #560-2003 912ULS/AirmasterAP332 540 hours > > F-PLDJ DynAro MCR 4S > Kit #27-2002 912ULSFR/MTProp MTV7A 1660 heures > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:11:44 AM PST US From: davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk Subject: Re: Europa-List: water drain Have never seen any water in 13 years, even though I do not regularly fill tank before putting plane away. Regards, David Joyce, GXSDJ On 2015-03-22 07:41, Max Cointe (Free) wrote: > > Hi there All, > > Who uses water drain? Who as ever seen water in the fuel there (I use Mogas only)? > > Cheers, > Max Cointe > F-PMLH Europa XS_TriGear > Kit #560-2003 912ULS/AirmasterAP332 540 hours > > F-PLDJ Dyn'Aro MCR 4S > Kit #27-2002 912ULSFR/MTProp MTV7A 1660 heures > Links: ------ [1] http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List [2] http://forums.matronics.com [3] http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:22:10 AM PST US From: "Bob Harrison" Subject: RE: Europa-List: water drain Hi all ! I had an incident of substantial ingress of water once while parked overnight at Zell Am See in torrential down pour most of the night. I have adjusted the =9Cpinch=9D on the filler =9Co=9D Ring and mostly tape up the filler cap if left outside ever. The aircraft is always kept in it=99s covered trailer and I try to fly exclusively on Mogas but don=99t leave it full but I have water drains to both sides of the tank ALSO Mini Andair filters on both fuel flow lines.. Of course everyone will remember my misfortune of a restriction at the finger filters once, at which time Neville Eyre suggested =9CI shave the dog=9D ! but the dog has long gone and I have =9Cimproved the tank finger filter arrangements=9D . However I have also in the past discovered some contamination in the thimble filters in the Electric Pumps ( the removal of these for inspection requires extreme care , can only be repaired by complete replacement of the Pumps !) Hope I=99m not tempting providence by writing all this ! Regards Bob Harrison G-PTAG. 914 Rotax. From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk Sent: 22 March 2015 10:11 Subject: Re: Europa-List: water drain Have never seen any water in 13 years, even though I do not regularly fill tank before putting plane away. Regards, David Joyce, GXSDJ On 2015-03-22 07:41, Max Cointe (Free) wrote: Hi there All, Who uses water drain? Who as ever seen water in the fuel there (I use Mogas only)? Cheers, Max Cointe F-PMLH Europa XS_TriGear Kit #560-2003 912ULS/AirmasterAP332 540 hours F-PLDJ Dyn'A=C3=A9ro MCR 4S Kit #27-2002 912ULSFR/MTProp MTV7A 1660 heures ttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List ics.com .matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:52:24 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Nose Wheel Bearing From: "Alan Carter" Thanks Guys, As you may know i am not a builder, but have down loaded a diagram of the nose wheel , I see it has tapered roller bearings, which as far as i can see the outer shell is bonded to the actual 2 parts of the wheel hub, The wheel component is made in two parts and bolted together to make the wheel complete, and if necessary unbolted to split the wheel in order to repair a tyre puncher, If the outer shell of the bearing is bonded to these two wheel hubs you can not split the wheel apart the bonded bearing shell holds it togeter ,, well not quit true you need heat, and i don,t fly with a blow torch in the back of the plane. I am not an engineer either, but why could there not be two smaller width bearing used, each being bonded to its respected half wheel hub, so each contains its own bearing and can be split apart easily . Also bonding why bond, surly there are bearing with( don,t know what you call it ) but say 3 projected lug locators so as to drop into a located hub housing to prevent the outer shell from turning. I like 5 minute bearing changes, Please comment and inform me of the why not,s . Basically I would just like some explanation to satisfy my own mind, I may tend to see thing to simple. I believe a mod has already been worked out for the nose wheel which I am also looking into, and may have done, Alan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439723#439723 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:09:27 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: water drain From: Robert Borger Max, Fly only AvGas. No drains. Have gascolator before pump. No inline filters. Keep the tank full whenever possible. Use a cover if I ever have to park outside when traveling. Have never seen evidence water in the tank. Blue skies & tailwinds, Bob Borger Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (75 hrs). Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208-5331 Cel: 817-992-1117 rlborger@mac.com > On Mar 22, 2015, at 1:41 AM, Max Cointe (Free) wrote: > > > Hi there All, > > Who uses water drain? Who as ever seen water in the fuel there (I use Mogas only)? > > Cheers, > Max Cointe > F-PMLH Europa XS_TriGear > Kit #560-2003 912ULS/AirmasterAP332 540 hours > > F-PLDJ Dyn=99A=C3=A9ro MCR 4S > Kit #27-2002 912ULSFR/MTProp MTV7A 1660 heures ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:10:41 AM PST US From: david park Subject: Re: Europa-List: water drain Use Mogas occasional Avgas, never seen water. Dave G-LDVO Sent from my iPad > On 22 Mar 2015, at 07:41, Max Cointe (Free) wrote: > > > Hi there All, > > Who uses water drain? Who as ever seen water in the fuel there (I use Mogas only)? > > Cheers, > Max Cointe > F-PMLH Europa XS_TriGear > Kit #560-2003 912ULS/AirmasterAP332 540 hours > > F-PLDJ DynAro MCR 4S > Kit #27-2002 912ULSFR/MTProp MTV7A 1660 heures > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:51:16 AM PST US From: Timward Subject: Re: Europa-List: water drain Hi Same, use Mogas occasional Avgas, never seen water. Tim Tim Ward 12 Waiwetu Street Fendalton, Christchurch, 8052 New Zealand. ward.t@xtra.co.nz Ph 64 3 3515166 Mob 0210640221 > On 23/03/2015, at 6:09 am, david park wrote: > > Use Mogas occasional Avgas, never seen water. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:57:10 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: water drain From: "Grahamhall123@gmail.com" Since getting my ppl in the late 80's I have always checked fuel drains as part of pre-flight, even when pushed to get going on business trips. On one occasion one tank of my 182 was clear fluid which did not smell like fuel and did not evaporate. Transpired I had about 2 liters rainwater in one tank. I will always check water drains- it only takes a minute and from my own experience is a minute well spent. 'to fail to look is to look to fail'. On Mar 22, 2015, at 7:41 AM, "Max Cointe (Free)" wrote: > > Hi there All, > > Who uses water drain? Who as ever seen water in the fuel there (I use Mogas only)? > > Cheers, > Max Cointe > F-PMLH Europa XS_TriGear > Kit #560-2003 912ULS/AirmasterAP332 540 hours > > F-PLDJ DynAro MCR 4S > Kit #27-2002 912ULSFR/MTProp MTV7A 1660 heures > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 01:33:42 PM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: water drain From: "jonathanmilbank" I had a small number of occasions when I found a few drops of water in my mogas. My aircraft was parked outside for several years and had Jaxida covers. But the fabric got old and needed to be washed and treated with water-proofing liquid more frequently. Rarely after heavy prolonged rain storms, I would find a few drops in the fuel sample. The cap and 'O' ring were tight enough, but I guessed that the fabric of the covers in contact with the tank breather tube was acting like a wick to convey water into the breather. When I taped plastic over the tube before putting on the cover, there was no water ingress. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439739#439739 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 02:13:51 PM PST US From: Kevin Klinefelter Subject: Re: Europa-List: water drain Me too, almost all Mogas (with up to 10% ethanol) and never seen water. > On Mar 22, 2015, at 11:50 AM, Timward wrote: > > > Hi > Same, use Mogas occasional Avgas, never seen water. > > Tim > > Tim Ward > 12 Waiwetu Street > Fendalton, > Christchurch, 8052 > New Zealand. > > ward.t@xtra.co.nz > > Ph 64 3 3515166 > Mob 0210640221 > > >> On 23/03/2015, at 6:09 am, david park wrote: >> >> Use Mogas occasional Avgas, never seen water. > > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 03:01:31 PM PST US From: Ken Carpenter Subject: Re: Europa-List: water drain Never in twelve years found water in Europa, 100LL or Mogas. Did find water in 182 after it left out in rain with original cap not tight. Went to Monarch caps and no further water but I still check if any plane been outside in rain. Fueling at strange fields will get you water as happened to me twice. Sent from my iPad Ken Carpenter > On Mar 22, 2015, at 3:56 PM, Grahamhall123@gmail.com wrote: > > > Since getting my ppl in the late 80's I have always checked fuel drains as part of pre-flight, even when pushed to get going on business trips. On one occasion one tank of my 182 was clear fluid which did not smell like fuel and did not evaporate. Transpired I had about 2 liters rainwater in one tank. I will always check water drains- it only takes a minute and from my own experience is a minute well spent. 'to fail to look is to look to fail'. > >> On Mar 22, 2015, at 7:41 AM, "Max Cointe (Free)" wrote: >> >> >> Hi there All, >> >> Who uses water drain? Who as ever seen water in the fuel there (I use Mogas only)? >> >> Cheers, >> Max Cointe >> F-PMLH Europa XS_TriGear >> Kit #560-2003 912ULS/AirmasterAP332 540 hours >> >> F-PLDJ DynAro MCR 4S >> Kit #27-2002 912ULSFR/MTProp MTV7A 1660 heures > > > > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 06:26:03 PM PST US From: "Bud Yerly" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Nose Wheel Bearing Alan, Be sure to note Matco MFGs. website or my website on the proper way to torque wheel bearings. The inner race must not move (rubber seal does not rotate). The nose wheel is a Matco unit also. The easy method of fixing the bearing is by axle nut torque with the inner race locked to a flange on the inner race. Tough to do on a nose wheel. The old style NG06 axle (the smooth one with the dumb spacers), is a piece of cake to maintain. To remove the axle from the wheel on a used aircraft: No torches. Put the wheel flat on a large vice or a couple of thick timbers across the wheel rim with the axle in the slot. Whack the end of the axle with a dead blow or wood mallet. The bearing will pop right off with no damage. Flip the wheel over and hit the other side of the axle. Both bearings are free. (I only drive one side off and clean and pack the other on the axle). Take a single edge razor or a razor knife, and take off the Loctite, clean with a bit of acetone. Pack the bearings as usual. Clean the inner race of any grease. Do not use a lot of Loctite 638, a small drop or two is sufficient on the bearing. Slide on the other parts and slip into the yoke. In 15 minutes, go fly. (Realistically, do the mains next.) So it takes 6 minutes to do a nose axle grease job. If you desire, buy the new axle with a nut on the Europa website. Matco basically copied this design. See their website. Europa Loctite's on the nut, and Matco came up with a new nut with a set screw in it. The axle now has a slot. This was incorporated on the RV10. Loctite works. Split wheels on aircraft (not ultralights) are split rims due to structural concerns. Our main wheels only hold 650 pounds of aircraft weight, right. WRONG, these wheels are designed for impact loads exceeding 4000 lbs of force. Hence the 1.25" bearings (stronger), the centrifugally cast wheels with the extra meat on the bearing race areas are needed. Bearings must be rigidly in contact with their races and not rotating on the axle to meet the structural load conditions. No bearing wiggle or slop. In fact, properly seated, the wheel is a bit draggy. Split wheels are a pain, but strong for their weight. I highly recommend my clients put a piece of one inch heavy paper ring on the inside of one of the wheels to prevent pinching the tube when assembling the wheel. If my guys in the shop pinch a tube not using the paper safety ring, they pay for it. Hope this sheds some light on the wheels. Regards, Bud Yerly -----Original Message----- From: Alan Carter Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2015 7:51 AM Subject: Europa-List: Re: Nose Wheel Bearing Thanks Guys, As you may know i am not a builder, but have down loaded a diagram of the nose wheel , I see it has tapered roller bearings, which as far as i can see the outer shell is bonded to the actual 2 parts of the wheel hub, The wheel component is made in two parts and bolted together to make the wheel complete, and if necessary unbolted to split the wheel in order to repair a tyre puncher, If the outer shell of the bearing is bonded to these two wheel hubs you can not split the wheel apart the bonded bearing shell holds it togeter ,, well not quit true you need heat, and i don,t fly with a blow torch in the back of the plane. I am not an engineer either, but why could there not be two smaller width bearing used, each being bonded to its respected half wheel hub, so each contains its own bearing and can be split apart easily . Also bonding why bond, surly there are bearing with( don,t know what you call it ) but say 3 projected lug locators so as to drop into a located hub housing to prevent the outer shell from turning. I like 5 minute bearing changes, Please comment and inform me of the why not,s . Basically I would just like some explanation to satisfy my own mind, I may tend to see thing to simple. I believe a mod has already been worked out for the nose wheel which I am also looking into, and may have done, Alan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439723#439723 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.