---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 04/14/15: 6 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:13 AM - Re: Autopilot servo instalation (nigel_graham@m-tecque.co.uk) 2. 05:07 AM - Re: Autopilot servo instalation (William Daniell) 3. 06:26 AM - Might be of interest (trevannan) 4. 06:58 AM - Re: Autopilot servo instalation (nigel_graham@m-tecque.co.uk) 5. 07:59 AM - Re: Might be of interest (Fred Klein) 6. 06:54 PM - Re: Autopilot servo instalation. Sun 'n Fun preview. (Bud Yerly) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:13:01 AM PST US From: "nigel_graham@m-tecque.co.uk" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Autopilot servo instalation Bud, Will, I have attached a couple of drawings and a picture of the UK mod application for the scheme that Bud described FYI Nigel On 13/04/2015 20:39, Bud Yerly wrote: > Yep. Bob Berube first showed me and it is simple. I use 2 in tube > cut in half with a drove lug or post welded on for MW-4 attached. Put > 3/32 silicone cowl seal in the tube and clamp it on. I prefer this if > there is no access in the aft end. > > Bud > > /Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID/ > On Apr 12, 2015 10:18 PM, William Daniell > wrote: > Bud > Does this mean that you put a clamp on the main torque tube? > Will > > > William Daniell > LONGPORT > +57 310 295 0744 > > On Sun, Apr 12, 2015 at 9:02 PM, Bud Yerly > wrote: > > Alan, > Nice clean job. > I prefer not to run a thin wall one inch tube that far without an > idler in the center. However, the pitch system only needs a > couple of pounds of pressure when out of trim, and when the stab > is trimmed neutral, very little pressure is necessary to move the > stab. We design our systems for the worse case scenario, that is, > full trim up the the max torque of the trim motor and the bending > moment of the thin wall tubing has to be capable of taking the > load plus a rather large safety factor (since it is a control > system) without bending or flexing. If the trim tube should bend, > it can jamb the flight control. > I prefer to put the trim motor where you did, but make a 3/2 ratio > arm to drive the tube via a tube clamp. > However, to keep a short drive tube, I would recommend installing > the new light weight servos behind the mass balance post using a > two inch extension from the torque tube arm (there are two holes > there anyway to mount .016 steel arms to). Use a 1/2 inch with > .049 wall for the drive tube (like the aileron tubes). The length > of the tube should be about 2 feet. > Regards, > Bud Yerly > *From:* Alain Chabert > *Sent:* Saturday, April 11, 2015 1:05 PM > *To:* europa-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Re: Europa-List: Autopilot servo instalation > Hello, > Look at the solution I adopted from 330 hours and is much simpler > than the proposed mod. > Regards > > *Alain CHABERT* > > > __ > Le 11/04/2015 18:44, William Daniell a crit : >> I have seen searching through the list that there are some >> alternatives to the major surgery required for Mod 75 and 76. >> For example I saw some correspondence between Raimo and Bob >> Gowing connecting servo to the tail plane torque tube using a >> bracket. I assume that the service is mounted on a fiberglass >> bracket mounted on the floor .... >> Could I prevail on anyone who has who has an alternative to the >> official mods and which does not require major surgery send me a >> pic please. >> Many thanks >> Will >> William Daniell >> LONGPORT >> +57 310 295 0744 >> * >> >> >> * > > * > > arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List > tp://forums.matronics.com > _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > * > > > * > > >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List > onics.com > ww.matronics.com/contribution > > * > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:07:37 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Autopilot servo instalation From: William Daniell Nigel perfect thanks. Thank makes life a lot easier that than changing the cross ways control tube. Do you see any reason why the bracket would have to be steel...for example could it be composite provided that it was sufficiently strong/well made? Is there a similar option for the aileron servo - ie one that doesn't require the bracket on the torque tube? Perhaps attached to the base of the joystick. Thanks again Will William Daniell LONGPORT +57 310 295 0744 On Tue, Apr 14, 2015 at 2:11 AM, nigel_graham@m-tecque.co.uk < nigel_graham@m-tecque.co.uk> wrote: > Bud, Will, I have attached a couple of drawings and a picture of the UK > mod application for the scheme that Bud described FYI > > Nigel > > > On 13/04/2015 20:39, Bud Yerly wrote: > > Yep. Bob Berube first showed me and it is simple. I use 2 in tube cut > in half with a drove lug or post welded on for MW-4 attached. Put 3/32 > silicone cowl seal in the tube and clamp it on. I prefer this if there i s > no access in the aft end. > > Bud > > *Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID* > On Apr 12, 2015 10:18 PM, William Daniell > wrote: > Bud > Does this mean that you put a clamp on the main torque tube? > Will > > > William Daniell > LONGPORT > +57 310 295 0744 > > On Sun, Apr 12, 2015 at 9:02 PM, Bud Yerly wrote: > > Alan, > Nice clean job. > I prefer not to run a thin wall one inch tube that far without an idler i n > the center. However, the pitch system only needs a couple of pounds of > pressure when out of trim, and when the stab is trimmed neutral, very > little pressure is necessary to move the stab. We design our systems for > the worse case scenario, that is, full trim up the the max torque of the > trim motor and the bending moment of the thin wall tubing has to be capab le > of taking the load plus a rather large safety factor (since it is a contr ol > system) without bending or flexing. If the trim tube should bend, it can > jamb the flight control. > > I prefer to put the trim motor where you did, but make a 3/2 ratio arm to > drive the tube via a tube clamp. > > However, to keep a short drive tube, I would recommend installing the new > light weight servos behind the mass balance post using a two inch extensi on > from the torque tube arm (there are two holes there anyway to mount .016 > steel arms to). Use a 1/2 inch with .049 wall for the drive tube (like t he > aileron tubes). The length of the tube should be about 2 feet. > > Regards, > Bud Yerly > > *From:* Alain Chabert > *Sent:* Saturday, April 11, 2015 1:05 PM > *To:* europa-list@matronics.com > *Subject:* Re: Europa-List: Autopilot servo instalation > > Hello, > Look at the solution I adopted from 330 hours and is much simpler than th e > proposed mod. > Regards > > *Alain CHABERT* > > > Le 11/04/2015 18:44, William Daniell a =C3=A9crit : > > I have seen searching through the list that there are some alternatives > to the major surgery required for Mod 75 and 76. > > For example I saw some correspondence between Raimo and Bob Gowing > connecting servo to the tail plane torque tube using a bracket. I assume > that the service is mounted on a fiberglass bracket mounted on the floor > .... > > Could I prevail on anyone who has who has an alternative to the official > mods and which does not require major surgery send me a pic please. > > Many thanks > > Will > > > William Daniell > LONGPORT > +57 310 295 0744 > > > * > > arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List > tp://forums.matronics.com > _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > * > > > * > > >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List > onics.com > ww.matronics.com/contribution > > * > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:26:54 AM PST US From: trevannan Subject: Europa-List: Might be of interest Hi All I built a mobile T hanger a few years ago, in the hope of renting a field nearer to my home, this has not happened. I am at a lovely strip with good hanger and very friendly owners , but too far away. With their cooperation I have put the T hanger there rather than sell it. The two wing boxes are detachable and movable on a separate trailer, the main body is jacked up and the wheels put on and is towable behind my car. I have an electric winch to pull the plane in after removing the tail feathers. The solar panel keeps the plane and winch batteries topped up. There is another access door by the tail. I thought it might be of interest. Roger G-BWIJ ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:58:10 AM PST US From: "nigel_graham@m-tecque.co.uk" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Autopilot servo instalation I can see no reason why a composite bracket could not work provided it was well made. I would suggest two "question mark" (?) shaped mouldings back to back to ensure that the laminates are continuous (i.e. don't bond a flat piece onto a curved piece). My first choice though, would be tig welded steel. With regards to aileron servo, I did fabricate a 2024 alloy bracket which was bonded and countersunk-screwed into the flat back-face of the P1 control yoke (prior to assembly of the control system) and driven by the sevo sitting under the seat via short pushrod in front of the seat. If you have already constructed the under-seat controls, then your options are limited. Nigel On 14/04/2015 13:06, William Daniell wrote: > Nigel > perfect thanks. > Thank makes life a lot easier that than changing the cross ways > control tube. > Do you see any reason why the bracket would have to be steel...for > example could it be composite provided that it was sufficiently > strong/well made? > > Is there a similar option for the aileron servo - ie one that doesn't > require the bracket on the torque tube? Perhaps attached to the base > of the joystick. > Thanks again > Will > > William Daniell > LONGPORT > +57 310 295 0744 > > On Tue, Apr 14, 2015 at 2:11 AM, nigel_graham@m-tecque.co.uk > > wrote: > > Bud, Will, I have attached a couple of drawings and a picture of > the UK mod application for the scheme that Bud described FYI > > Nigel > > > On 13/04/2015 20:39, Bud Yerly wrote: >> Yep. Bob Berube first showed me and it is simple. I use 2 in >> tube cut in half with a drove lug or post welded on for MW-4 >> attached. Put 3/32 silicone cowl seal in the tube and clamp it >> on. I prefer this if there is no access in the aft end. >> >> Bud >> >> /Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID/ >> On Apr 12, 2015 10:18 PM, William Daniell >> >> wrote: >> Bud >> Does this mean that you put a clamp on the main torque tube? >> Will >> >> >> William Daniell >> LONGPORT >> +57 310 295 0744 >> >> On Sun, Apr 12, 2015 at 9:02 PM, Bud Yerly > > wrote: >> >> Alan, >> Nice clean job. >> I prefer not to run a thin wall one inch tube that far >> without an idler in the center. However, the pitch system >> only needs a couple of pounds of pressure when out of trim, >> and when the stab is trimmed neutral, very little pressure is >> necessary to move the stab. We design our systems for the >> worse case scenario, that is, full trim up the the max torque >> of the trim motor and the bending moment of the thin wall >> tubing has to be capable of taking the load plus a rather >> large safety factor (since it is a control system) without >> bending or flexing. If the trim tube should bend, it can >> jamb the flight control. >> I prefer to put the trim motor where you did, but make a 3/2 >> ratio arm to drive the tube via a tube clamp. >> However, to keep a short drive tube, I would recommend >> installing the new light weight servos behind the mass >> balance post using a two inch extension from the torque tube >> arm (there are two holes there anyway to mount .016 steel >> arms to). Use a 1/2 inch with .049 wall for the drive tube >> (like the aileron tubes). The length of the tube should be >> about 2 feet. >> Regards, >> Bud Yerly >> *From:* Alain Chabert >> *Sent:* Saturday, April 11, 2015 1:05 PM >> *To:* europa-list@matronics.com >> >> *Subject:* Re: Europa-List: Autopilot servo instalation >> Hello, >> Look at the solution I adopted from 330 hours and is much >> simpler than the proposed mod. >> Regards >> >> *Alain CHABERT* >> >> >> __ >> Le 11/04/2015 18:44, William Daniell a crit : >>> I have seen searching through the list that there are some >>> alternatives to the major surgery required for Mod 75 and 76. >>> For example I saw some correspondence between Raimo and Bob >>> Gowing connecting servo to the tail plane torque tube using >>> a bracket. I assume that the service is mounted on a >>> fiberglass bracket mounted on the floor .... >>> Could I prevail on anyone who has who has an alternative to >>> the official mods and which does not require major surgery >>> send me a pic please. >>> Many thanks >>> Will >>> William Daniell >>> LONGPORT >>> +57 310 295 0744 >>> * >>> >>> >>> * >> >> * >> >> arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List >> tp://forums.matronics.com >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> >> * >> >> >> * >> >> >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List >> onics.com >> ww.matronics.com/contribution >> >> * >> * >> >> >> * > > > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:59:26 AM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Might be of interest From: Fred Klein Roger, Hats off to what seems to me to have been a very economical solution to keeping your plane fully assembled and out of the weatherthe solar panel takes the cakeand I see your guard dog provides active security! F. > On Apr 14, 2015, at 6:25 AM, trevannan wrote: > > Hi All > > I built a mobile T hanger a few years ago, in the hope of renting a field nearer to my home, this has not happened. I am at a lovely strip with good hanger and very friendly owners , but too far away. With their cooperation I have put the T hanger there rather than sell it. The two wing boxes are detachable and movable on a separate trailer, the main body is jacked up and the wheels put on and is towable behind my car. I have an electric winch to pull the plane in after removing the tail feathers. The solar panel keeps the plane and winch batteries topped up. There is another access door by the tail. > I thought it might be of interest. > Roger G-BWIJ ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:54:19 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Autopilot servo instalation. Sun 'n Fun preview. From: Bud Yerly TmlnZWwgYW5kIE90aGVycywKTXkgcHJlZmVyZW5jZSBpcyA2MDYxLVQ2IGFsdW1pbnVtIHR1YmUg d2l0aCBhIDEvNCBpbmNoIGx1ZyBUaWcgd2VsZGVkIG9uIGl0LsKgIAoKSSBwcmVmZXIgNjA2MSBi ZWNhdXNlIGl0IGlzIGNvcnJvc2lvbiByZXNpc3RhbnQgc3RpZmYgd2l0aG91dCBiZWluZyBicml0 dGxlLCBhbmQgd2VsZHMgbmljZWx5LiBDdXQgYW5kIHdlbGQsIG5vIHBhaW50aW5nLi4uRG9uZSEK CkkgY2FuJ3QgdGhhbmsgeW91IGVub3VnaCBmb3IgdGhlIHBob3Rvcy7CoCBJIGhhdmVuJ3QgdGhl IHRpbWUgdGhlc2UgZGF5cyB0byBnbyB0byB0aGUgc2hvcCB0byBzZWFyY2ggbXkgYXJjaGl2ZXMu wqAgCgpBaXJzaG93IHByZXAgZm9yIFN1biAnbiBGdW4gaXMgaW4gZnVsbCBzd2luZy7CoCBJIGhh dmUgSm9obiBLZXJzaG5lcidzIEphYmlydSBwb3dlcmVkIEV1cm9wYSByZWFkeSBmb3IgZGlzcGxh eS7CoCBXZSdyZSBkZWxpZ2h0ZWQgd2l0aCB0aGUgYWlyY3JhZnQuwqAgSXQgbG9va3MgZ29vZCBh bmQgZmxpZXMgYmV0dGVyLsKgIE91ciBjb29saW5nIG1vZHMgaGF2ZSBiZWVuIHJld2FyZGluZywg bWFraW5nIGl0IGFuIGluY3JlZGlibHkgcmVsaWFibGUgZmxpZXIuwqAgTXkgMTJBWSB3aWxsIGJl IHNwb3J0aW5nIFdoaXJsIFdpbmQgYmxhZGVzIGluIHRoZSBBaXJtYXN0ZXIgQVAzMzIuwqAgV2Vh dGhlciBwZXJtaXR0aW5nLCB3ZSBzaG91bGQgaGF2ZSBzb21lIHBlcmZvcm1hbmNlIGNvbXBhcmlz b25zIGJ5IHRoZSBzaG93LsKgIFRoZSBibGFkZXMgYXJlIGdyZWF0IGxvb2tpbmcgYW5kIGxpZ2h0 ZXIuwqAgVGhleSBhcmUgYSBkaXJlY3QgcmVwbGFjZW1lbnQgZm9yIHRoZSBXYXJwIERyaXZlIGJs YWRlcy4KCkJlc3QgUmVnYXJkcywKQnVkCgoKClNlbnQgZnJvbSBteSBWZXJpem9uIFdpcmVsZXNz IDRHIExURSBEUk9JRAo ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.