Europa-List Digest Archive

Wed 11/09/16


Total Messages Posted: 14



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     0. 12:47 PM - A List Contribution - It's Your Personal Squelch Button... (Matt Dralle)
     1. 07:06 AM - Airmaster or Woodcomp? (jglazener)
     2. 07:26 AM - Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp? (Ken Carpenter)
     3. 07:50 AM - Re: Airmaster or =?UTF-8?Q?Woodcomp=3F? (davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk)
     4. 07:51 AM - Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp? (Robert Borger)
     5. 08:38 AM - Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp? (Neville Eyre)
     6. 09:01 AM - Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp? (graeme bird)
     7. 10:14 AM - Re: Airmaster or =?UTF-8?Q?Woodcomp=3F? (davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk)
     8. 10:39 AM - Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp? (david park)
     9. 11:36 AM - Re: Airmaster or =?UTF-8?Q?Woodcomp=3F? (davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk)
    10. 11:45 AM - Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp? (spcialeffects)
    11. 12:59 PM - Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp? (Roland)
    12. 01:58 PM - Re: Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp? (houlihan tim)
    13. 02:19 PM - Re: Re: Airmaster or =?UTF-8?Q?Woodcomp=3F? (davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk)
 
 
 


Message 0


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    Time: 12:47:07 PM PST US
    From: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
    Subject: A List Contribution - It's Your Personal Squelch Button...
    There is an automatic "squelch button" of sorts for the Fund Raiser messages. Here's how it works... As soon as a List member makes a Contribution through the Matronics Fund Raiser web site, their email address is automatically added to this year's Contributor List and they instantly cease to receive further Fund Raiser messages for the rest of the month! Its just that simple! :-) I really do appreciate each and every one of your individual Contributions to support the Lists. It is your support that enables me to upgrade the hardware and software that are required to run a List Site such as this one. It also goes to pay for the commercial-grade Internet connection and to pay the huge electric bill to keep the computer gear running and the air conditioner powered on. I run all of the Matronics Email List and Forums sites here locally which allows me to control and monitor every aspect of the system for the utmost in reliably and performance. Your personal Contribution matters because, when combined with other Listers such as yourself, it pays the bills to keep this site up and running. I accept exactly ZERO advertising dollars for the Matronics Lists sites. I can't stand the pop-up ads and all other commercials that are so prevalent on the Internet these days and I particularly don't want to have it on my Email List sites. If you appreciate the ad-free, grass-roots, down-home feel of the Matronics Email Lists, please make a Contribution to keep it that way!! http://www.matronics.com/contribution or, you can send a personal check to the following address: Matronics / Matt Dralle 581 Jeannie Way Livermore, CA 94550 Thank you! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator [Note that there are certain circumstances where you might still see a Contribution related message. For example, if someone replies to one of the messages, when using the List Browse feature, or when accessing List message via the Forum. The system keys on the given email address and since most of these are anonymous public access methods, there is no simple way to filter them.]


    Message 1


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    Time: 07:06:33 AM PST US
    Subject: Airmaster or Woodcomp?
    From: "jglazener" <j.glazener@planet.nl>
    I am rapidly getting to the point where I need to select my propeller to go with a 912ULS engine. Having already decided on an in flight adjustable, the choice seems to come down to the following: Airmaster AP332 with Whirlwind blades and AC200 CS controller. Eur ~6000 Woodcomp SR3000 with CS5 CS controller. Eur 4000 Woodcomp SR3000 with manual controller. Eur 3500 Based on the price I can surmise thet the Airmaster is better, but is it twice as good, and more importantly, is the Woodcomp maybe good enough? Then there is the choice between CS and manual which the Woodcomp offers. Manual is cheaper and as a first timer I want to keep things simple, so that has some appeal. The importer also kindly mentioned that he does not have good experiences with the CS setup, which is either refreshingly homest or an indication of a dud product. So which is it to be? Your opinions and experiences would be highly appreciated! -------- Jeroen http://www.europaowners.org/main.php?g2_itemId=44165 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462236#462236


    Message 2


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    Time: 07:26:02 AM PST US
    From: Ken Carpenter <kbcarpenter@comcast.net>
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp?
    Happy with Airmaster with Warp Drive blades. Have 660 hours. It is computer controlled with manual override and works well requiring no close attention...that is it is not a complication,just set cruise or climb or takeoff. I damaged a prop blade and was able to get replacement promptly. Sent from my iPad Ken Carpenter > On Nov 9, 2016, at 10:04 AM, jglazener <j.glazener@planet.nl> wrote: > > > I am rapidly getting to the point where I need to select my propeller to go with a 912ULS engine. Having already decided on an in flight adjustable, the choice seems to come down to the following: > > Airmaster AP332 with Whirlwind blades and AC200 CS controller. Eur ~6000 > > Woodcomp SR3000 with CS5 CS controller. Eur 4000 > > Woodcomp SR3000 with manual controller. Eur 3500 > > Based on the price I can surmise thet the Airmaster is better, but is it twice as good, and more importantly, is the Woodcomp maybe good enough? > > Then there is the choice between CS and manual which the Woodcomp offers. Manual is cheaper and as a first timer I want to keep things simple, so that has some appeal. The importer also kindly mentioned that he does not have good experiences with the CS setup, which is either refreshingly homest or an indication of a dud product. > > So which is it to be? Your opinions and experiences would be highly appreciated! > > -------- > Jeroen > > http://www.europaowners.org/main.php?g2_itemId=44165 > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462236#462236 > > > > > > > > >


    Message 3


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    Time: 07:50:07 AM PST US
    From: davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or =?UTF-8?Q?Woodcomp=3F?
    Jeroen, I do not know of anyone who has done a direct comparison between the Airmaster and the Woodcomp prop in controlled circumstances, although I first became interested in the Woodcomp when at the Europa Fly out to Prague in 2000, two XS 914s took off at the same time. Tom Justic with a Woodcomp prop dramatically out-climbed the Europa company one with an Airmaster - which caught my attention at the time and was instrumental in persuading me to go through the significant hassle of being the first to import one into the UK LAA fleet. I have since come to believe that both are excellent propellers. The latest SR3000 has a totally redesigned hub mechanism which is beautifully robust, and the High twist 'W' blades are particularly efficient. (with my SR300-3W/914/XS/mono I can exceed Vne TAS on the level at 6000ft upwards). I do not think you would go wrong with either propeller, but I would certainly think that the Airmaster is not worth an extra E2000. What I would say is worth it is to have a constant speed controller. The manual might be very false economy. In a slippery plane like a Europa it is very easy to increase speed and RPM, especially if you are in some conflict situation where you are distracted. Overspeeding the engine is not a good thing. In fact a constant speed unit does above all keep things simple - you simply select take off, climb or cruise settings by press of a button, and the controller does the rest, whereas the manual controller needs more thought and pilot input to get things right. Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ On 2016-11-09 15:04, jglazener wrote: > > I am rapidly getting to the point where I need to select my propeller to go with a 912ULS engine. Having already decided on an in flight adjustable, the choice seems to come down to the following: > > Airmaster AP332 with Whirlwind blades and AC200 CS controller. Eur ~6000 > > Woodcomp SR3000 with CS5 CS controller. Eur 4000 > > Woodcomp SR3000 with manual controller. Eur 3500 > > Based on the price I can surmise thet the Airmaster is better, but is it twice as good, and more importantly, is the Woodcomp maybe good enough? > > Then there is the choice between CS and manual which the Woodcomp offers. Manual is cheaper and as a first timer I want to keep things simple, so that has some appeal. The importer also kindly mentioned that he does not have good experiences with the CS setup, which is either refreshingly homest or an indication of a dud product. > > So which is it to be? Your opinions and experiences would be highly appreciated! > > -------- > Jeroen > > http://www.europaowners.org/main.php?g2_itemId=44165 [1] > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462236#462236 [2] > Links: ------ [1] http://www.europaowners.org/main.php?g2_itemId=44165 [2] http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462236#462236 [3] http://www.aeroelectric.com [4] http://www.buildersbooks.com [5] http://www.homebuilthelp.com [6] http://www.mypilotstore.com [7] http://www.mrrace.com [8] http://www.matronics.com/contribution [9] http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List [10] http://forums.matronics.com [11] http://wiki.matronics.com


    Message 4


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    Time: 07:51:24 AM PST US
    From: Robert Borger <rlborger@mac.com>
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp?
    Jeroen, I am very happy with my Airmaster prop and controller with the Warp Drive blades. Set it for the mode of flight (takeoff, climb or cruise) and it works. I have damaged the blades and the response by Airmaster has been excellent. I can highly recommend them. No experience with Woodcomp so I can=99t comment on them. Blue skies & tailwinds, Bob Borger Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (75 hrs). Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP 3705 Lynchburg Dr. Corinth, TX 76208-5331 Cel: 817-992-1117 rlborger@mac.com <mailto:rlborger@mac.com> On Nov 9, 2016, at 9:04 AM, jglazener <j.glazener@planet.nl> wrote: I am rapidly getting to the point where I need to select my propeller to go with a 912ULS engine. Having already decided on an in flight adjustable, the choice seems to come down to the following: Airmaster AP332 with Whirlwind blades and AC200 CS controller. Eur ~6000 Woodcomp SR3000 with CS5 CS controller. Eur 4000 Woodcomp SR3000 with manual controller. Eur 3500 Based on the price I can surmise thet the Airmaster is better, but is it twice as good, and more importantly, is the Woodcomp maybe good enough? Then there is the choice between CS and manual which the Woodcomp offers. Manual is cheaper and as a first timer I want to keep things simple, so that has some appeal. The importer also kindly mentioned that he does not have good experiences with the CS setup, which is either refreshingly homest or an indication of a dud product. So which is it to be? Your opinions and experiences would be highly appreciated! -------- Jeroen


    Message 5


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    Time: 08:38:53 AM PST US
    From: Neville Eyre <neveyre@aol.com>
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp?
    Having fitted dozens of Airmaster's, and just recently fitted a Woodcomp there is no comparison, Airmaster is more than twice as good [ mechanically] -----Original Message----- From: jglazener <j.glazener@planet.nl> Sent: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 15:35 Subject: Europa-List: Airmaster or Woodcomp? I am rapidly getting to the point where I need to select my propeller to go with a 912ULS engine. Having already decided on an in flight adjustable, the choice seems to come down to the following: Airmaster AP332 with Whirlwind blades and AC200 CS controller. Eur ~6000 Woodcomp SR3000 with CS5 CS controller. Eur 4000 Woodcomp SR3000 with manual controller. Eur 3500 Based on the price I can surmise thet the Airmaster is better, but is it twice as good, and more importantly, is the Woodcomp maybe good enough? Then there is the choice between CS and manual which the Woodcomp offers. Manual is cheaper and as a first timer I want to keep things simple, so that has some appeal. The importer also kindly mentioned that he does not have good experiences with the CS setup, which is either refreshingly homest or an indication of a dud product. So which is it to be? Your opinions and experiences would be highly appreciated! -------- Jeroen http://www.europaowners.org/main.php?g2_itemId=44165 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462236#462236


    Message 6


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    Time: 09:01:09 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp?
    From: "graeme bird" <graeme@gdbmk.co.uk>
    Very pleased with my Woodcomp 3000/w and smart controller. I would just say that if you ding a blade you have to replace the lot. Ok if it's insurance. -------- Graeme Bird G-UMPY - Mono Classic/XS FFW 912S, Woodcomp 3000/3W CS, trutrak Gemini 2 axis ap, pflarm, ads-b out, 8.33khz, mode S, FP 5, Aera500 &amp; SD on Nexus, 250 hours &amp; 4 years on the Mono, 880 total g(at)gdbmk.co.uk Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462242#462242


    Message 7


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    Time: 10:14:06 AM PST US
    From: davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or =?UTF-8?Q?Woodcomp=3F?
    Nev, I guess that is not the new (this summer) design of SR3000, which has done away with cogs and is an impressive bit of kit. Regards, David On 2016-11-09 16:30, Neville Eyre wrote: > Having fitted dozens of Airmaster's, and just recently fitted a Woodcomp there is no comparison, Airmaster is more than twice as good [ mechanically] > > -----Original Message----- > From: jglazener <j.glazener@planet.nl> > To: europa-list <europa-list@matronics.com> > Sent: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 15:35 > Subject: Europa-List: Airmaster or Woodcomp? > > > I am rapidly getting to the point where I need to select my propeller to go with a 912ULS engine. Having already decided on an in flight adjustable, the choice seems to come down to the following: > > Airmaster AP332 with Whirlwind blades and AC200 CS controller. Eur ~6000 > > Woodcomp SR3000 with CS5 CS controller. Eur 4000 > > Woodcomp SR3000 with manual controller. Eur 3500 > > Based on the price I can surmise thet the Airmaster is better, but is it twice as good, and more importantly, is the Woodcomp maybe good enough? > > Then there is the choice between CS and manual which the Woodcomp offers. Manual is cheaper and as a first timer I want to keep things simple, so that has some appeal. The importer also kindly mentioned that he does not have good experiences with the CS setup, which is either refreshingly homest or an indication of a dud product. > > So which is it to be? Your opinions and experiences would be highly appreciated! > > -------- > Jeroen > > http://www.europaowners.org/main.php?g2_itemId=44165 [1] > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462236#462236 [2] Links: ------ [1] http://www.europaowners.org/main.php?g2_itemId=44165 [2] http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462236#462236


    Message 8


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    Time: 10:39:29 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp?
    From: david park <dpark748@icloud.com>
    David Your email corrupt?? Dave Dave Park > On 9 Nov 2016, at 18:13, davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk wrote: > > <html><body><pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier"> > <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier"> > > </b></font></pre>


    Message 9


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    Time: 11:36:07 AM PST US
    From: davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or =?UTF-8?Q?Woodcomp=3F?
    Nev, I guess you are talking about the original SR3000 which had lots of cogs in it, not the new, completely different (as of this summer) design, which looks cogless and very impressive Nev, I guess you are talking about the original SR3000 design, which had lots of cogs in it, not the totally redesigned one(as from this summer) which has no cogs and looks very impressive. Regards, David Joyce PS. Sorry my previous attempt at tjis came out as garbage! On 2016-11-09 16:30, Neville Eyre wrote: > Having fitted dozens of Airmaster's, and just recently fitted a Woodcomp there is no comparison, Airmaster is more than twice as good [ mechanically] > > -----Original Message----- > From: jglazener <j.glazener@planet.nl> > To: europa-list <europa-list@matronics.com> > Sent: Wed, 9 Nov 2016 15:35 > Subject: Europa-List: Airmaster or Woodcomp? > > > I am rapidly getting to the point where I need to select my propeller to go with a 912ULS engine. Having already decided on an in flight adjustable, the choice seems to come down to the following: > > Airmaster AP332 with Whirlwind blades and AC200 CS controller. Eur ~6000 > > Woodcomp SR3000 with CS5 CS controller. Eur 4000 > > Woodcomp SR3000 with manual controller. Eur 3500 > > Based on the price I can surmise thet the Airmaster is better, but is it twice as good, and more importantly, is the Woodcomp maybe good enough? > > Then there is the choice between CS and manual which the Woodcomp offers. Manual is cheaper and as a first timer I want to keep things simple, so that has some appeal. The importer also kindly mentioned that he does not have good experiences with the CS setup, which is either refreshingly homest or an indication of a dud product. > > So which is it to be? Your opinions and experiences would be highly appreciated! > > -------- > Jeroen > > http://www.europaowners.org/main.php?g2_itemId=44165 [1] > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462236#462236 [2] Links: ------ [1] http://www.europaowners.org/main.php?g2_itemId=44165 [2] http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462236#462236


    Message 10


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    Time: 11:45:55 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp?
    From: "spcialeffects" <spcialeffects@aol.com>
    Hi David. This re-design is good news as i'll be ordering my Woodcomp early next year from Kevin Dilks. Have they done anything with the motor as i have heard of these running away to either fully fine or fully course. Frank X- kit 165 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462246#462246


    Message 11


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    Time: 12:59:07 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp?
    From: "Roland" <schmidtroland@web.de>
    I'm happy with the Airmaster CS with Warp Drive blades. This combinations seems to be very rugged. As some might remember I had cooling issues in high temperatures on the ground (XS with Rotax 914) which I got under control in the meantime by simple measures. What I can definitely say is, that Martin from Airmaster is very helpful and answers any questions rapidly. The manuals are online in English and easy to understand. Regards Roland PH-ZTI XS TG 914 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462325#462325


    Message 12


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    Time: 01:58:54 PM PST US
    From: houlihan tim <houlihan@blueyonder.co.uk>
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or Woodcomp?
    I have a Woodcomp SR2000 fitted for about ten years and I am very happy with it, During a visit to the Woodcomp factory near Prague earlier this year I saw the latest SR3000 hub and it looked much simpler and more robust than my hub so constant developments have been carried out . I would have no hesitation in recommending it , Of course I appreciate that the Airmaster is a well made propeller but I have no personal knowledge or experience of this prop and I am sure it works well but it is significantly more expensive Tim H > > On 09 November 2016 at 20:58 Roland <schmidtroland@web.de> wrote: > > > > I'm happy with the Airmaster CS with Warp Drive blades. This combinations > seems to be very rugged. > > As some might remember I had cooling issues in high temperatures on the > ground (XS with Rotax 914) which I got under control in the meantime by simple > measures. > > What I can definitely say is, that Martin from Airmaster is very helpful > and answers any questions rapidly. The manuals are online in English and easy > to understand. > > Regards > Roland > PH-ZTI > XS TG 914 > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462325#462325 > > > > > > > > > >


    Message 13


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    Time: 02:19:00 PM PST US
    From: davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk
    Subject: Re: Airmaster or =?UTF-8?Q?Woodcomp=3F?
    Frank, I think it is a complete redesign, including thepitch change stop system, which is now apparently much simpler to adjust. But if you want more detail youcould probably get it from Kevin Dilks. Regards, David On 2016-11-09 19:45, spcialeffects wrote: > > Hi David. This re-design is good news as i'll be ordering my Woodcomp early next year from Kevin Dilks. Have they done anything with the motor as i have heard of these running away to either fully fine or fully course. > > Frank X- kit 165 > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462246#462246 [1] > Links: ------ [1] http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=462246#462246 [2] http://www.aeroelectric.com [3] http://www.buildersbooks.com [4] http://www.homebuilthelp.com [5] http://www.mypilotstore.com [6] http://www.mrrace.com [7] http://www.matronics.com/contribution [8] http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List [9] http://forums.matronics.com [10] http://wiki.matronics.com




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