Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 07:20 AM - Value of the List... (Matt Dralle)
1. 02:48 AM - Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear (davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk)
2. 03:02 AM - Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear (Roland)
3. 07:42 AM - Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear (AirEupora)
4. 09:17 AM - Re: Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear (Bud Yerly)
5. 01:28 PM - Re: Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear (Tim)
6. 02:35 PM - Re: Looking for ideals on landing lights and placement (craig)
7. 05:35 PM - Re: Throttle cables (Erich Trombley)
8. 07:01 PM - Re: Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear (Bud Yerly)
9. 07:45 PM - Mono wheel versus Tri-gear (Erich Trombley)
10. 11:46 PM - Re: Throttle cables (Richard Wheelwright)
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Subject: | Value of the List... |
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Subject: | Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear |
Hazel, The simple answer to that question for someone with relatively
little flying experience is that you would do well to go for the
trigear. However, there are a lot of mono pilots out there, including
myself who would not give up their mono at any price. It was of course
the only configuration for quite a while when the plane was first on the
market and all sorts of pilots managed to get on top of it, albeit with
quite a percentage of incidents.
Briefly the advantages of the mono are: it is a bit faster and more
economical; it is better at field landings- it was designed to land in
unprepared farmers fields (I have done upwards of a dozen such landings
without damage) whereas a trike is very likely to bust its nose wheel
leg & prop; it is quite a bit cheaper on the UK market- and the
difference might well pay for at least one ground loop & bust prop!
My advice would be to get a ride in both and ask the owner to let you
taxi each when you will get an insight into the challenges of ground
control of the mono, then make a decision. You could put out a plea on
this network for someone in your neck of the woods to fly you. If you
haven't made your decision before the next Europa Club AGM or the Rally
I am sure we/I can arrange something.
Regards, David Joyce, GXSDJ
On 2017-11-23 21:39, Hazel Jackson wrote:
> Hi Guys - I'm rather hoping that you can help us with this please...
>
> My husband and I are looking to hopefully buy a Europa in the not too distant
future and we have received a lot of advice from non-Europa owners that we should
go for a Tri-gear rather than a Mono wheel. I would very much like to know
the pros and cons of both please, and in which circumstances each shines - from
real Europa owners!
>
> Huge thanks
>
> Hazel
>
> [1]
> Virus-free. www.avg.com [1]
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Subject: | Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear |
The Europa is the right decision anyway :-)
When I decided to buy a Europa I made a ride in the Monowheel with Andy Draper.
Andy as a very skilled pilot had no problems in handling it of course, but I
became Aware, that it would be too much of a challenge for me as an average Pilot,
especially in windy conditions. So I went for a XS Trigear with a Rotax 914
and never regretted this decision. I want peace of mind and don't need the
thrill of the Mono. The Trigear is very easy to land and on the ground in general
when one gets used to the steering with the differentiol brake.
Regards
Roland
PH-ZTI
XS TG 914
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=475499#475499
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Subject: | Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear |
One of the things that has not been talked about is the landing surface that you
will be using. The mono does good on glass fields. Where the trouble starts
is on hard surface runways. Concrete, Asphalt and the number of plies the tire
has. When the Europa first arrived on the shores of the U.S. I believe they
were using two ply tires. From what I have learned the fiction between the
runway surface and the tire that causes a twisting of the tire and if a wing
tips as in dropped during the landing, think outrigger, and touches it unloads
the tire and causes the aircraft to weathervane into the wind.
On glass field it will not twist the tire as much as the glass will allow the tire
to move more freely as there is less fiction.
I believe most of the mono wheel pilots have installed tires with more plies and
you have heard a lot less about ground loops.
If you have a number of hours in a tail wheel aircraft and you get good training
from a mono pilot you should be OK, but any tail wheel aircraft can and will
bite you if you don't fly it to parking. One of the best ways to practice is
in a glider. They all have a mono wheel and they are fun to fly.
In many ways I wish I had biuilt a mono wheel, as they are faster. They look so
nice when they fly by. With a 914 they are an outstanding airplane.
If you live it the U.S. 97% of all your landings will be on a hard surface!
Rick Stockton
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=475582#475582
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Subject: | Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear |
Good discussion on tri vs. mono. I couldn=92t agree more with Roland and D
avid Joyce.
Full disclosure: I am the US Europa Dealer and an owner operator/builder.
Whether you choose a mono or trigear, the Europa is still the finest flying
sport aircraft after all these years. It is delightful to fly, yet provid
es excellent cruise performance with toughness to absorb shocks and bumps a
nd shake it off and is very repairable for builders who are unfortunate eno
ugh to have a minor mishap.
It is a love hate relationship between the mono and trigear. The trigear p
enalty of extra drag and weight with excellent ground handling (and no retr
act test or specialized equipment needed for maintenance of the wheel) vs a
retractable mono that is lighter, has the potential for less drag, larger
baggage capacity, looks cool, but has no similarity with a typical conventi
onal gear unless the conventional gear is placed 7 inches apart. The mono
is easy to land for me, even on asphalt, as long as I am sharp, on my game,
proficient and have drug the strange field so I know if there are hidden s
wirly wind conditions near the touchdown point if cross winds are present.
Mono:
I have sat through a few oops landings, but believe it or not, also runway
departures on takeoff. Old habits die hard, this is not a typical tail dra
gger. My bad experiences was not with bad or non current pilots, just a mo
mentary lapse of applying the proper procedures at the right moment. On ta
keoff, keep the stick back hard until 35Kts, small precise rudder inputs, a
nd do not allow the airplane velocity vector to go outside that 7 inch whee
l footprint. On landing, the same is true. The aircraft must have its vel
ocity vector and alignment dead on the runway centerline, wings level, at t
he precise moment of touchdown for a smooth roll on landing. It gets sport
y if alignment is not precise or the stick is relaxed with or without power
below flying speed. It is getting tougher for new pilot/builders to get i
nsurance due to ground loop/prop strike potential. Second hand owners in t
he US with the mono do not fair well. In my opinion, it is their failure t
o get a proper checkout and loose their bad habits. Maintenance wise, the
wheel well is the black hole of Calcutta. It is close to the ground (layin
g on the cold ground), and extra equipment is needed for tire removal, retr
act tests and lifting equipment.
Trigear:
You must have a speed kit or performance is dismal. That means more weight
and time. Baggage bay area is lost, the cowl is more difficult to get off
with a three blade prop around that nose leg, it has hand brakes which wor
k well but for some are different, nose gear shimmy is a problem if set ver
y light, and precise steering more difficult if set tight. Cross wind or s
trange field landings with pesky wind gusts are a piece of cake. Mile long
taxi backs with a strong crosswind will eat brakes and may overheat them.
Differential brake steering means there are two more brake pads to wear ou
t and an extra brake cylinder to maintain. Field blown tire drills are rar
e. Brake failure is more likely. Brake failure, means no ground steering.
If a tire failure does occur, the FBO has a trolley normally, and one onl
y has to put his back under the spar and lightly push up and raise the whee
l for the trolley or tire change. Piece of cake. With a tow bar, it is ea
sy to haul and maneuver for a operator/ mechanic. There is good clearance
for underside maintenance which allows working on a comfortable creeper.
I like both types of gear. But an owner operator must look at all sides of
the issue for his long term ownership. You are doing the right thing by a
sking the questions now. Go fly both and if the test fly plane is rigged a
nd properly balanced, with stall strips you are in for a treat.
I=92ve done some other writings on maintenance and techniques and they are
either on my website, or emails are available in the matronics archives or
Europa Club website with many other excellent tech articles. I=92ve attach
ed my personal notes on flying the mono in .PDF format. The trigear never
needed any landing or flight articles but maintenance techniques are availa
ble.
Best Regards,
Bud Yerly
Europa trigear, 914, Airmaster
Custom Flight Creations, Inc.
US Europa Dealer
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________________________________
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server@matr
onics.com> on behalf of Roland <schmidtroland@web.de>
Sent: Friday, November 24, 2017 6:02:24 AM
Subject: Europa-List: Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear
The Europa is the right decision anyway :-)
When I decided to buy a Europa I made a ride in the Monowheel with Andy Dra
per. Andy as a very skilled pilot had no problems in handling it of course,
but I became Aware, that it would be too much of a challenge for me as an
average Pilot, especially in windy conditions. So I went for a XS Trigear w
ith a Rotax 914 and never regretted this decision. I want peace of mind and
don't need the thrill of the Mono. The Trigear is very easy to land and on
the ground in general when one gets used to the steering with the differen
tiol brake.
Regards
Roland
PH-ZTI
XS TG 914
Read this topic online here:
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Subject: | Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear |
While your comments about the tyre are interesting and historically
accurate I doubt if any Mono is still using the original golf buggy
tyre. What you say about grass field strips is good but once you are up
to speed on grass moving to hard runways is not a problem.
I converted to a mono from PA28's with a instructor familiar with
Europa's it took about seven hours all on hard runways. The trick as
mentioned by Bud and others is to keep it absolutely straight and not
allow it to deviate one bit from the straight path, I believe that also
applies to all tailwheel aircraft from four engined transports to single
seat hotrods.
In my mind Trigears are great but Mono's are tremendous.
Just my views based on 15 years with a mono and now three months with a
trigear.
Tim Houlihan
On 24/11/2017 15:41, AirEupora wrote:
>
> One of the things that has not been talked about is the landing surface that
you will be using. The mono does good on glass fields. WIf you have a number
of hours in a tail wheel aircraft and you get good training from a mono pilot
you should be OK, but any tail wheel aircraft can and will bite you if you don't
fly it to parking. One of the best ways to practice is in a glider. They
all have a mono wheel and they are fun to fly.
>
> In many ways I wish I had biuilt a mono wheel, as they are faster. They look
so nice when they fly by. With a 914 they are an outstanding airplane.
>
> If you live it the U.S. 97% of all your landings will be on a hard surface!
>
> Rick Stockton
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=475582#475582
>
>
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Subject: | Looking for ideals on landing lights and placement |
I came up with one idea, look up 5 CREE LED bike headlight on ebay.
The units I got will run on voltage from 8 - 15 volts, one unit is about the
same as my car headlight, they are about 2 inches across and 2.5 inches
deep.
Well made from aluminium with a glass lense and oring seals. The switch is
on the back of the case so that will have to be moved for obvious reasons
Will post a picture later today
Regards
craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of AirEupora
Sent: Friday, 24 November 2017 2:31 AM
Subject: Europa-List: Looking for ideals on landing lights and placement
I had two HD lights in the cowl of my Jabiru powered Europa, but they turned
out to be useless. I'd like to hear or see what others have done for a
landing light and placement.
I recently installed a 40amp alternator and electrical power is no problem
now that I got rid of the so called 15 amp Jabiru alternator.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=475466#475466
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Subject: | Re: Throttle cables |
Hi Richard,
I am not sure what you mean by =9Cwhat ends did you secure to the
outer cable? I have tried to fix the 6mm ends to a scrap cable and find
it impossible to get them to screw on securely.=9D Which end are
you referring to, the throttle box or the carb end? Are you not able to
retain the Europa supplied cable sheath and just run the Bowden cable t
hrough it?
Erich Trombley
N28ET
Classic Mono 914
____________________________________________________________
1 Simple Trick Removes Eye Bags & Lip Lines in Seconds
Fit Mom Daily
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Subject: | Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear |
Craig and Rick,
The Jab cowl has quite a slope, so I would prefer to cut in a light on the
pilots side of the cowl. A lot of work.
I made an exterior hanging light for 12AY and sold it to John Kershner. Ph
oto Attached in the pdf. It was just a Kuntzleman which was adequate for a
painted runway with lights. Good for taxi. Lights up the runway paint ab
out 3-500 feet out. I have never made another for the Kuntzleman as I just
didn=92t like it as much as others.
Look at your off road guys. I made a swap of the Walmart special H4s on Ga
ry Leinberger=92s to the Ridgid industries SR-Q2 with a bright dim switch.
Either of these lights above will not light up as well as our 100,000 cand
le airliner landing lights but you won=92t feel like Helen Keller coming in
to land either. If you have the room, the Aeroled and Whelen standard Par
light replacements are better than the smaller motorcycle types, but at le
ast twice the cost and amps. I=92ve never installed an HID but they really
reach out there, but in my opinion too much weight and heat. More amps to
o.
I personally like the Rigid SR-Q2 as they are fairly inexpensive, use the h
igh output Cree LEDs and are easy to mount. They don=92t make noise either
. Go to youtube and take a look at Ridgid Industries Hi/LO SRQ2 Drive Beam
Pattern Snake Racing test video.
I set these small LEDs all up out back of the shop, and the Spot Cree LEDs
go out about 800 feet pretty well and the driving is just fine at about 500
feet and wide enough to drive down the road with just one. There are no r
eflectors out behind the shop, so there is no chance these off road lights
would be OK on a grass runway on a pitch black night in my opinion, but fin
e for a painted runway. The Aerosun was not much different than the SRQ2 d
riving light, just a little harder to mount and the lens is not as tough.
I had to do a paper for clients to explain to me and the guys what the heck
a lumen, candle, luminance, lux and candlepower was as comparisons are a s
on of a gun without consistent standards. I=92ve attached that paper I mad
e up from internet articles above also, as I know you do your research. He
ll of a thing=85how bright is bright. Who knows until you see it. I wish
I had unlimited resources to test these lights out on a runway. Look at Av
Webs Youtube videos and get some ideas on your own as well as the off road
and motorcycle guys videos.
Good luck. If you are going to repaint the cowl anyway, cutting in a reces
sed light is reasonable. Making an external pod is not any easier, but if t
he plane is nicely painted, no repair work will be necessary, just the wiri
ng. The choices we make eh?
Best Regards,
Bud Yerly
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________________________________
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server@matr
onics.com> on behalf of AirEupora <AirEupora@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Friday, November 24, 2017 10:41:34 AM
Subject: Europa-List: Re: Mono wheel versus Tri-gear
One of the things that has not been talked about is the landing surface tha
t you will be using. The mono does good on glass fields. Where the troubl
e starts is on hard surface runways. Concrete, Asphalt and the number of p
lies the tire has. When the Europa first arrived on the shores of the U.S.
I believe they were using two ply tires. From what I have learned the fic
tion between the runway surface and the tire that causes a twisting of the
tire and if a wing tips as in dropped during the landing, think outrigger,
and touches it unloads the tire and causes the aircraft to weathervane into
the wind.
On glass field it will not twist the tire as much as the glass will allow t
he tire to move more freely as there is less fiction.
I believe most of the mono wheel pilots have installed tires with more plie
s and you have heard a lot less about ground loops.
If you have a number of hours in a tail wheel aircraft and you get good tra
ining from a mono pilot you should be OK, but any tail wheel aircraft can a
nd will bite you if you don't fly it to parking. One of the best ways to p
ractice is in a glider. They all have a mono wheel and they are fun to fly
.
In many ways I wish I had biuilt a mono wheel, as they are faster. They lo
ok so nice when they fly by. With a 914 they are an outstanding airplane.
If you live it the U.S. 97% of all your landings will be on a hard surface!
Rick Stockton
Read this topic online here:
https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fforums.m
atronics.com%2Fviewtopic.php%3Fp%3D475582%23475582&data=02%7C01%7Cbudyerl
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Subject: | Mono wheel versus Tri-gear |
I have to echo Tim=99s experience. I transitioned into the Europa
Mono with a couple of hundred hours of Cessna 152 and 172 time and zero
tailwheel time. I did my tailwheel transition in the Mono and got sign
ed off after 10 hours. I had two really good instructions, Bob Lindsay,
test pilot extraordinaire, and another fellow that Bob provided transit
ion training to. As Bob was only available for a couple of days he work
ed with my local instructor/friend and got him up to speed after a coupl
e of hours. I ended up with half my time with each. I also did a bit o
f aggressive taxiing with Kim Prout prior to the first flight which real
ly helped as I got to explore the limits of ground handling.
The only tailwheel time I have is in my Mono; 750 hours over almost 15 y
ears of flying. With the exception of a handful of landings on turf, I
operate exclusively off of hard surfaces. Truth be told I am more nervo
us on turf, worried mostly about uneven surfaces. I guess for me, it re
ally comes down to what I have more experience with. As for cross wind
landings I can=99t say that it is really any different in the Mono
than the Cessna=99s I learned in. I crab into the wind vs. the w
ing low technique. I have landed with 15+ mph direct cross wind without
issue. Anything less than 90 degree provides for a slower ground speed
and less roll out which is a plus. I do, however, try to make sure the
plane is tracking straight at touchdown, although, I haven=99t al
ways been successful. The key for me, is quick jabs of the rudder pedal
s to keep it straight...dancing feet. If you apply constant rudder unti
l the plane changes direction it=99s too late, your off to the rac
es.
I love my Mono. The only downside is the availability of hull insurance
at what I consider a reasonable price. I have a 914 in my Mono and fly
in the high teens and usually see a true airspeed of 165-171 kts depend
ing on atmospheric conditions, burning 5.3 gal/hrs. For cross country f
lying that=99s hard to beat. And lastly, she is a head turner. O
h, and did I mention, I love my Mono.
My two cents.
Erich Trombley
N28ET
Classic Mono 914
____________________________________________________________
I Felt Like A Snake That Had Swallowed A Watermelon
Activated You
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/5a18e6f0bf25d66ef4b65st01vuc
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Subject: | Re: Throttle cables |
Erich
Currently experimenting with improvement options. I was looking at how different
builder have shortened the outer sheath. Removing the 6mm cable adjuster
from the carb end of the outlet sheath (now scrap cable) I found it impossible
to put the 6mm ajuster back on to outer sheath without damaging it. I agree
with you about putting the Bowden solid piano wire through the Europa suplyed
outer sheath. This may be the way to go to improve operation of the throttle
linkage.
--------
Richard Wheelwright
G-IRPW
First Flight 24th July 2013
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=475602#475602
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