Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:55 AM - Re: Re: Cooling a Mono Classic (Kingsley Hurst)
2. 03:46 AM - Re: Re: Cooling a Mono Classic (Peter Jeffers)
3. 04:11 AM - One for the books. (William Daniell)
4. 04:50 AM - Re: One for the books. (Pete)
5. 05:47 AM - Re: One for the books. (William Daniell)
6. 06:14 AM - Re: One for the books. (Pete)
7. 06:27 AM - Re: Cooling a Mono Classic (phillik747)
8. 10:38 AM - Re: Cooling a Mono Classic (Fred Klein)
9. 10:38 AM - Re: Re: Transponder Ground Plane (Fred Klein)
Message 1
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Subject: | Re: Cooling a Mono Classic |
Many thanks Phil. I wasn't aware Kim had ongoing cooling problems.
I have had a few photos of Kim's aircraft for many years but they were all taken
prior to the mods you have made me aware of. I also have a Europa news article
where Ivan Shaw and Kim flew to Oshkosh. The article explained oil cooling
issues and how they finally settled on relocation of the oil cooler to under
the spinner. This was the reason I put mine under the spinner.
Thanks again Phil.
Best regards
Kingsley
>
>
> Kingsley,
>
>> From the very first flight of my Uncle's Europa (Kim Prout) he had temp issues.
The fist mod was the oil cooler moved to its own inlet below the spinner.
There have been many mods after.
>
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Subject: | Re: Cooling a Mono Classic |
Hi Kyle,
I am not quite sure of your current configuration. Please confirm engine ie
912UL or ULS. From your photos you seem to be Classic Mono with I think a
912UL.
In 1996 when I first flew my Classic Mono with Rotax 912UL (80 hp)we,
together with a number of other builders, had cooling issues such as you
mention.
The fix we all discovered in those days was to provide additional exit air
from the cowlings. In essence all we did was to fit aprox 1" spacers between
the bottom of the lower cowling and the fuselage. This enabled greater exit
air from cowling and immediately gave 10 degrees centigrade reduction in
both oil and water temps.
This is just an idea that may help you but on the other hand you may already
have tried this.
Pete Jeffers
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of phillik747
Sent: 25 December 2017 02:57
Subject: Europa-List: Re: Cooling a Mono Classic
Kingsley,
>From the very first flight of my Uncle's Europa (Kim Prout) he had temp
issues. The fist mod was the oil cooler moved to its own inlet below the
spinner. There have been many mods after.
In this link, the first 7 photos, you will see the current cowling mod of my
Uncle's plane. On page 4 the last two photos you can see the plane behind
two knuckleheads. I hope these photos will be helpful.
Kyle
--------
Kyle
Europa Tri-gear (under construction)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=476756#476756
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Message 3
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Subject: | One for the books. |
Yesterday I took off with my nephew who 220lbs, I'm 198 with full fuel
making us 16lbs over mtow.
.......and the density altitude at skgy (8500) was just under 10k. We
climbed at 400/min to 10500.
It is a remarkable machine.
Happy holidays to all
Will
HJ460
Tri 912 turbo airmaster
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: One for the books. |
Happy holidays Will!
"912 turbo" aftermarket? (Can we have more info?) or 914 turbo?
Cheers and thx,
Pete :)
> On Dec 25, 2017, at 7:11 AM, William Daniell <wdaniell.longport@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Yesterday I took off with my nephew who 220lbs, I'm 198 with full fuel making
us 16lbs over mtow.
>
> .......and the density altitude at skgy (8500) was just under 10k. We climbed
at 400/min to 10500.
>
> It is a remarkable machine.
>
> Happy holidays to all
>
> Will
> HJ460
> Tri 912 turbo airmaster
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: One for the books. |
Pete,
this is a colombian adaptation for a 80hp 912. The Colombians claim that
they turbo'd the 912 before rotax which might be true given the
topography. Truth is wierder than fiction in Colombia. Or it might not.
My guy makes the exhaust system. It has a small truck turbo (doesnt really
matter which) controlled by a vernier. A garret might be better but it
works fine as it it. My Savannah has a mitsuibishi turbo and my Europa has
an IVECO turbo. He also made the airbox and put in the oil supply and
scavenge for the turbo. You need a 914 fuel regulator.
The turbo is in the same place as the 914 turbo.
You need to fit the pressure normalizing tubes between the airbox and the
carbs and fit bigger main jets so it runs cooler. You need to tighten the
clamps on the carb rubber too. You need nitrile gaskets for the carb
bowls. There's some fun stuff in it too. There is a ball valve on the
oil inlet to the turbo which which stops the oil leaking out through the
turbo when the engine is shut down. This ball valve is always held in
place with the ball point pen spring.
The system uses the mechanical fuel pump from the 912 and an electric pump
which means that if you have an electrical failure the engine doesnt stop.
My engine will run at about 28" without the electric pump.
And that's about it. The net result is a turbo normalized 912 for less
than USD25k. I run mine at 33" unless I have a heavy nephew on board.
Yesterday we took off at 35".
Its pretty simple and the manual wastegate doesn't really complicate
things. You can control power with the wastegate or the throttle. I am
comfortable with this because I have been flying with one for 10 years now
in my Savannah. And in the worst case with no turbo and no electrical
system you still have a 912. You can see photos at
https://sites.google.com/site/europaconstructionwd/
Will
On Dec 25, 2017 07:52, "Pete" <peterz@zutrasoft.com> wrote:
>
> Happy holidays Will!
>
> "912 turbo" aftermarket? (Can we have more info?) or 914 turbo?
>
> Cheers and thx,
> Pete :)
>
> > On Dec 25, 2017, at 7:11 AM, William Daniell <
> wdaniell.longport@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Yesterday I took off with my nephew who 220lbs, I'm 198 with full fuel
> making us 16lbs over mtow.
> >
> > .......and the density altitude at skgy (8500) was just under 10k. We
> climbed at 400/min to 10500.
> >
> > It is a remarkable machine.
> >
> > Happy holidays to all
> >
> > Will
> > HJ460
> > Tri 912 turbo airmaster
>
>
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: One for the books. |
Sounds like a very nice implementation! Great job you guys!
At what level of boost do you start running into issues (preignition/overhea
ting/twisted crank etc)?
I wonder if the very nicely executed rotec sprayer, with its built in intern
al regulator (should work beautifully in a blow-through configuration as lon
g as the supply fuel pressure is greater than the airbox press.).
https://www.rotecaerosport.com/tbi
Very high quality machined piece, with some nice features, better atomizatio
n, much simpler than those horrible bings etc.
Cheers!
Pete
> On Dec 25, 2017, at 8:46 AM, William Daniell <wdaniell.longport@gmail.com>
wrote:
>
> Pete,
>
> this is a colombian adaptation for a 80hp 912. The Colombians claim that t
hey turbo'd the 912 before rotax which might be true given the topography.
Truth is wierder than fiction in Colombia. Or it might not.
>
> My guy makes the exhaust system. It has a small truck turbo (doesnt reall
y matter which) controlled by a vernier. A garret might be better but it wo
rks fine as it it. My Savannah has a mitsuibishi turbo and my Europa has an
IVECO turbo. He also made the airbox and put in the oil supply and scaveng
e for the turbo. You need a 914 fuel regulator.
>
> The turbo is in the same place as the 914 turbo.
>
> You need to fit the pressure normalizing tubes between the airbox and the c
arbs and fit bigger main jets so it runs cooler. You need to tighten the cl
amps on the carb rubber too. You need nitrile gaskets for the carb bowls.
There's some fun stuff in it too. There is a ball valve on the oil inlet t
o the turbo which which stops the oil leaking out through the turbo when the
engine is shut down. This ball valve is always held in place with the ball
point pen spring.
>
> The system uses the mechanical fuel pump from the 912 and an electric pump
which means that if you have an electrical failure the engine doesnt stop.
My engine will run at about 28" without the electric pump.
>
> And that's about it. The net result is a turbo normalized 912 for less th
an USD25k. I run mine at 33" unless I have a heavy nephew on board. Yester
day we took off at 35".
>
> Its pretty simple and the manual wastegate doesn't really complicate thing
s. You can control power with the wastegate or the throttle. I am comforta
ble with this because I have been flying with one for 10 years now in my Sav
annah. And in the worst case with no turbo and no electrical system you sti
ll have a 912. You can see photos at https://sites.google.com/site/europ
aconstructionwd/
>
> Will
>
>> On Dec 25, 2017 07:52, "Pete" <peterz@zutrasoft.com> wrote:
>>
>> Happy holidays Will!
>>
>> "912 turbo" aftermarket? (Can we have more info?) or 914 turbo?
>>
>> Cheers and thx,
>> Pete :)
>>
>> > On Dec 25, 2017, at 7:11 AM, William Daniell <wdaniell.longport@gmail.c
om> wrote:
>> >
>> > Yesterday I took off with my nephew who 220lbs, I'm 198 with full fuel m
aking us 16lbs over mtow.
>> >
>> > .......and the density altitude at skgy (8500) was just under 10k. We
climbed at 400/min to 10500.
>> >
>> > It is a remarkable machine.
>> >
>> > Happy holidays to all
>> >
>> > Will
>> > HJ460
>> > Tri 912 turbo airmaster
>>
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vigator?Europa-List
>> =========================
>> FORUMS -
>> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
>> =========================
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>> b Site -
>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
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n
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>>
>>
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: Cooling a Mono Classic |
Hello Pete,
The engine is a 912UL.
You are correct on the cowling spacers. The lower lip was dropped a bit to allow
air to exit. However, I'm not sure the spacers are still there with the new
mod due to the larger exit area.
I live over 2000 miles away from my Uncle but I can get details if needed.
Thanks,
Kyle
--------
Kyle
Europa Tri-gear (under construction)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=476764#476764
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Cooling a Mono Classic |
> On Dec 24, 2017, at 3:01 PM, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>
> In my opinion, movable cowl flaps are essential in every airplane to
increase speed, improve high power cooling, and keep cruise temps in the
warm range.
Bud,
Might you have some drawings or pixs of the control rod linkage or
cables or servos you=99ve used to open and close cowl flaps?
Merry Christmas,
Fred
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Transponder Ground Plane |
> On Dec 24, 2017, at 9:33 AM, h&jeuropa <butcher43@att.net> wrote:
>
> Why Dynon suggests a larger ground plane I don't understand. Antenna
theory says that the ground plane should be the same 1/4 wavelength as
the radiating element.
In their instructions regarding antennas, does Dynon make any
distinction between metal & FG composite airframes?or
is that irrelevant?...
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