---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 07/20/18: 5 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:19 AM - Re: Varley Li-16 or Li-5 (John Wighton) 2. 04:30 AM - Re: Re: Play in monowheel Tailwheel arm rear mounting hole. (Bud Yerly) 3. 07:07 AM - Re: Play in monowheel Tailwheel arm rear mounting hole. (Dave Disney) 4. 08:00 AM - Re: Re: Varley Li-16 or Li-5 (Alan Burrill) 5. 06:31 PM - On your greasing / oil leak. (Bud Yerly) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:19:36 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Varley Li-16 or Li-5 From: "John Wighton" Well l wasn't exactly inundated with replies to this request. Thanks to Richard for the related PM. Feedback from Varley (DMS Technologies) is that the Li-16 will provide a better solution as the Red Top 25 CA is 310A and CCA drops to 230A. The Li-5 (along with similar low AHr capacity batteries has a CCA of effectively zero. Meaning that ops in very cold conditions will be worse than l currently experience. As the Li-16 has an [effective] CA of 670A this should overcome my kickback issues in colder months. It saves around 3.8kg and will need a lengthened battery box as it measures 203 x 78 x 139 (compared RT 25 at 181 x 77 x 167). Just need to start saving as it's RRP is 678 (yes, there are no decimal points in that number). The LAA mod process and approved list for Lithium based batteries is here: https://www.lightaircraftassociation.co.uk/engineering/Standard%20Mods/SM14337%20Lithium%20batteries.pdf -------- John Wighton Europa XS trigear G-IPOD Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481766#481766 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:30:44 AM PST US From: Bud Yerly Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Play in monowheel Tailwheel arm rear mounting hole. What I think when doing maintenance is: If the spring came loose at the t ailpost, find out why. Otherwise it is just a patch. Which may be OK... For a while. The book tailpost pyramid is subject to flex in ground loops. I build mine from wall to wall. Never had a spring mount failure but after a spring came loose, inspection revealed a wonky hole. Bud Yerly Custom Flight Creations ________________________________ From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com on behalf of JonSmith Sent: Friday, July 20, 2018 2:18:33 AM Subject: Europa-List: Re: Play in monowheel Tailwheel arm rear mounting hol e. > Hi Frank, that was my thought exactly - keep it simple! Cheers, Jon :D -------- G-TERN Classic Mono Read this topic online here: https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fforums.m atronics.com%2Fviewtopic.php%3Fp%3D481765%23481765&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf10c f77294f04e1a67fb08d5ee0915e1%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6 36676645143801781&sdata=LH1nP7JuILCxG8uboBijANj91NlMlKfd3RsR64SmuCQ%3D&re served=0 F%2Fwww.matronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf10cf77 294f04e1a67fb08d5ee0915e1%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6366 76645143801781&sdata=mqId%2BbxTDR7cTvuCu0jGxuSAzQQHVakNgxNOHbpqaxE%3D&res erved=0 F%2Fforums.matronics.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf10cf77294f04e1a67fb08d5ee0915 e1%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636676645143801781&sdata= D1%2Fbd0EvxFgNK%2BHeDI6d3FEqhEob0hy0XfVmRGY7FjQ%3D&reserved=0 F%2Fwiki.matronics.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf10cf77294f04e1a67fb08d5ee0915e1 %7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636676645143801781&sdata=To Og0F8ojEhv%2B2NZFc1%2BkPHMQ02f7hW0vbI%2Boo0BabA%3D&reserved=0 F%2Fwww.matronics.com%2Fcontribution&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf10cf77294f04e1a67 fb08d5ee0915e1%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636676645143801 781&sdata=FdCiZ4qQpLea16dVr2C%2BAL2LZr4gCm1L4BMjQLvGVmQ%3D&reserved=0 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:07:45 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Play in monowheel Tailwheel arm rear mounting hole. From: "Dave Disney" I had the same problem, the tail wheel spring became loose where it passes through the sternpost. I removed it, cleaned off the old redux and re-bonded it as per the manual. It's OK at the moment, but I would like a fix that is permanent as I think it will become loose again in time. I'm not convinced that bonding the tailspring to the sternpost is the strongest fixing method. I thought about developing a mod using two small 4130 steel plates that would bolt through the sternpost sandwiching it, with an appropriate 'guide' welded on to one of the plates to clamp the spring. The tail loads and vibration would then be transmitted to the sternpost over a greater area through the steel plates and sternpost. Any thoughts anyone? Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481769#481769 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:00:31 AM PST US From: Alan Burrill Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Varley Li-16 or Li-5 Sorry didnt get to reply as now in Oshkosh and was travelling. Ive just fitted a Li-16 for weight saving, not flown yet as I then disappeared of on holiday. Fitted the higher capacity one so if I have regulator fail I have about 2 hours of battery life with all things running. Dimensions slightly longer than the Varley so had to remake brackets but that was easy. Starts engine, 912ULS, no problems and I had. Varley 25 previously. Initial engine runs suggest everything ok and charging. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 20 Jul 2018, at 04:19, John Wighton wrote: > > > Well l wasn't exactly inundated with replies to this request. Thanks to Richard for the related PM. > > Feedback from Varley (DMS Technologies) is that the Li-16 will provide a better solution as the Red Top 25 CA is 310A and CCA drops to 230A. The Li-5 (along with similar low AHr capacity batteries has a CCA of effectively zero. Meaning that ops in very cold conditions will be worse than l currently experience. > > As the Li-16 has an [effective] CA of 670A this should overcome my kickback issues in colder months. It saves around 3.8kg and will need a lengthened battery box as it measures 203 x 78 x 139 (compared RT 25 at 181 x 77 x 167). > > Just need to start saving as it's RRP is 678 (yes, there are no decimal points in that number). > > The LAA mod process and approved list for Lithium based batteries is here: > https://www.lightaircraftassociation.co.uk/engineering/Standard%20Mods/SM14337%20Lithium%20batteries.pdf > > -------- > John Wighton > Europa XS trigear G-IPOD > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=481766#481766 > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:31:34 PM PST US From: Bud Yerly Subject: Europa-List: On your greasing / oil leak. Bill and all early or used Airmaster Owners with the 308 or circa 2000 and early AP332s. I=92ll see Martin at Oshkosh this week (if I don=92t get WX CNX again by th e airlines) and discuss the messy greasing procedure. For now, this is what I will bring up with him: Reference SB14 for the Airmaster AP308. Airmaster and we builders were worried about water incursion in our seaplan es. SB 14 covered what to do to fill the void in the blade ferrule and the cam follower hole that allowed water or moisture to enter the blade ferrul e bearings and ferrule support causing expensive repairs. One side effect of the SB14 sealing was now old oily grease (grease does se parate from the thickening agent) could not go up into the blade ferrule ei ther and come running out the blades. Which was nice. The new 332s and 332Ss are sealed pretty well from water incursion, and are also sealed at the outside of the blade ferrule right at the blade exit, w hich is so nice (and clean). These sealing improvements have really improv ed that old grease all over the plane slinging common of the old 308. To s eal the prop using SB 14 please do not use off the shelf sealant to do this SB or to seal around your blades like the new props, as the acid added to the sealant will corrode your aluminum. Use the Dow 737 non acid clear sea lant. Bottom Line: These improved sealing methods used by Airmaster pret ty much eliminated the massive grease slinging and water incursion, unless =85. Reference SL 1 Greasing Procedure. In the greasing instruction paragraph e, with its photo, if followed exactl y with that much grease, the new grease will ooze out of around the O ring on the retention nut, and during operations one will get a spray of grease for quite some time all over your aircraft. The prop will never corrode, and it will be well lubricated, which is good for Airmaster, but may make a mess of your aircraft. My suggestion to successfully lube the prop and still keep the aircraft rel atively clean is to grease the bearings as shown, but use a clean towel to wipe the excess grease off of the ferrule threads, and the O-ring seat area of the hub to a thin film, not the pasting of globs of grease as shown on the threads and O ring area on the ferrule as shown in Service Letter 1. ( The bearing seat area still must be greased well and fully packed as any be aring should be.) In my opinion, and from 15 years of practice, one should not see an opaque layer of grease on the threads, it should just be just a shiny film on the threads of the bore. If the threads of both the blade f errule and the hub are full of thick grease, during assembly, it will ooze inside the gap on the underside of the nut, and after tightening the blade, the grease will be pushed up and out around the O-ring and along the blade assembly retention nut to the ferrule base and will take quite a few hours to fling out. Education comment: Grease is actually oil (synthetic or blend) with a thickening agent (Miner al, soap, plastic) that allows the oil under pressure and or temperature to release the oil and lube the area of contact while the excess thick grease squeezed out around the bearing surface to continue to transfer the oil to the contact surfaces of the bearing or friction plate over time. Some gre ases appear to dry out (become wax like) in the presence of air, others are highly water resistant, others still are designed for specific temperature ranges and pressures. Every application has a grease that is just right ( the Goldilocks grease). Back to the Prop: If a significant oily trace is coming out from the ferrule nut (refer to fi gure 2 Page 9 of the operators/install manual for the 332), the careful obs erver can see how the oil from the excess grease can run out from around th e seals all around certain areas. It is obvious centrifugal force is forci ng the grease up the ferrule wall and the ferrule gaps in and around the re tention nut threading, O ring and eventually out of the prop where the blad e exits the Ferrule nut and all over the aircraft. Study this figure well and see those areas which allow oil to fling out of the blade. In my opini on, the main culprits are the Retention Nut Seal O-ring under the flange wh ere the #10 Allen screws are, the blade ferrule seal to the body. Consider this: One must clean out the old grease well, , but, look also at your old grease that has slid along the outside of the retention nut and clean it up well before adding new... that old oil is now freely running and with new grease added compounds the problem and will add to your mess. Slide the retention nut up and down and see just how greasy/oily that area is and wipe clean =85 It should be clean of fluid, or solid grease, but a film should remain . Note that any runny oily fluid or caked grease may be a sign of previous over-greasing. Once cleaned up, apply new grease to the blade retention, alignment and preload bearings ensuring the bearings are packed, and the va lley around them is also filled as you would any bearing. Again, carefully wipe excess off your outside areas or non bearing areas. Finally, make sure the threads of the blade nut are covered with only a thi n film of grease (virtually transparent and shiny) as is the O ring area pr ior to assembly. Install the blade and start cranking down on the nut by h and and to clean up any ooze, use a lint free towel to wipe as you go. I f old a Scott lint free paper towel (those blue mechanics ones) and while tur ning the blade nut, I wipe all around the underside of the flange on the fe rrule retention nut until the O-ring starts to nearly grab the towel and th en back off, wipe some more until the cloth is clean and finish tightening the nut and wipe some more... The towel will be wet with the oil film but should not have any thick grease remaining. Finally on leaks on a tractor engine, Possible other oil leaks seen on the cowl should be investigated also: On the airframe, keep your spinner to cowl gap distance to an 1/8 to 3/32 i nch as a larger gap will interfere with air pressure in the cowl. Normally the gap pulls air out of the pressurized cowl and over the cowl face. Any engine oil leak will be pulled from the engine and exit around the prop sh aft and out around the spinner backplate. Since the Airmaster standard sli p ring is attached to the spinner backplate, the rings get covered with eng ine oil as well as the cowl. If the prop was severely over greased, with the grease coming out of the bl ade ferrules and collecting on the inside of the spinner, it will travel ou t through the holes in the spinner backplate then on to the cowl and out. If the inside of the spinner is clean, and oil is on your slip rings, look hard at the engine because you may have an oil leak. In this case engine o il is normally brown ish, and so one must lube the prop with a red grease s uch as Mobile 28 to tell the difference. If the grease or oil for that mat ter are the same color, you don=92t know where it is coming from. Look har d. Sorry for the tome, Bud Yerly ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.