Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:58 AM - Performance of 80HP compared to 100HP Rotax (graeme bird)
2. 03:35 AM - Mono Trailer Ramp extenders (clivesutton)
3. 05:32 AM - Fire proof barrier with Jabiru Engine (tonyvaccarella)
4. 06:39 AM - HJ 460 trip report.... (William Daniell)
5. 06:39 AM - =?utf-8?Q?Re:__Fire_proof_barrier_with_Jabiru_Engine? ()
6. 07:46 AM - Re: HJ 460 trip report.... (Robert Borger)
7. 02:02 PM - Re: HJ 460 trip report.... (William Daniell)
8. 03:17 PM - Re: Pierburg fuel pump 7.2097155 (Kingsley Hurst)
9. 03:49 PM - Re: Performance of 80HP compared to 100HP Rotax (Kingsley Hurst)
10. 06:59 PM - Re: Fire proof barrier with Jabiru Engine (tonyvaccarella)
11. 09:39 PM - Re: Pierburg fuel pump 7.2097155 (Fred Klein)
Message 1
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Subject: | Performance of 80HP compared to 100HP Rotax |
I received an unused 80HP 912 with my recent part built kit with a thin three blade
warp drive; my own Europa is a 100HP 912ULS, can anyone comment on what difference
in performance I might expect. I recall on my previous plane, a C42,
the 80HP was less violent and more economical with marginal difference in performance
but that might have been because it was cloth and draggy.
Thanks for all the responses on recent posts and PMs, much appreciated.
I wonder how many are currently building in the UK and whether any near Milton
Keynes.
--------
Graeme Bird
G-UMPY - Mono Classic/XS FFW 912S, Woodcomp SR3000/3W CS, trutrak Gemini 2 axis
AP, PAW, PFLARM core, ads-b out, 8.33khz, mode S, FP-5, Aera500, SD on Nexus,
Smart A3
350 hours & 6 years on the Mono, 930 total
g(at)gdbmk.co.uk
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=486892#486892
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Subject: | Mono Trailer Ramp extenders |
I'm having some 'U' channel made for my Mono trailer - to extend it and make the
loading/unloading operation easier. Essentially the ramp will be made from
two pieces of 500L x 80D x 225W folded from 6mm Alu plate, hinged so that it works
as the factory design when loaded but extends the inclined ramp portion to
be 500mm further from the trailer 'hod' the main wheel sits in.
The min qty is 8 pcs and i will use 2 - so i'm wondering if anyone else would like
to buy the surplus pieces? Cost will be ~60 each. Polyester powder coated
in white as attached drawing.
Any takers/interest?
Clive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=486893#486893
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/aha_b3pd401b_trailer_ramp_177.pdf
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Subject: | Fire proof barrier with Jabiru Engine |
I'm at a point of installing my Jabiru engine and note that the Builders Manual
in section 31 calls for the construction of a fire-proof barrier that is fitted
to the landing gear frame.
I made a cardboard cutout as per the drawings in my manual only to find out that
the drawing appear to be only for the Rotax installation and does not fit my
Jabiru engine frame. So....Im wondering what other Europa builder who have Jabiru
engines have done?
It appears to me that the Jabiru engine would site between the mounts and protrude
further back than the Rotax. Therefore Im at a loss on how to proceed.
Any help for experienced builders would be greatly appreciated.
Regards,
Tony
VH-VOW
--------
Tony Vaccarella
Mascot NSW 2020
Sydney Australia
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=486895#486895
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Subject: | HJ 460 trip report.... |
Sunday 6 Jan Bogota Medellin 1:15 flight time 150nm 120kt
Monday 7 Jan Medellin Bureaucracy
Tuesday 8 Jan Medellin Gelabert Panama 404nm 3:46 128kt av speed landed
with 1/4 tank 4 gals - we started with 6 gals in the aux tank and 15.
Panama Controllers helpful and professional - albeit their radios were not
working well and we had issues to Tocumen Approach - one of the other
pilots in the air mentioned that they had been having issues.
Wednesday 9 Jan we planned to go to Limon Costa Rica we took off from
Gelbert and then had to return due to weather 1.5 hours.
Thursday 10 Jan Gelabert to San Jose Costa Rica. Shortly before David
northern Panama the Dynon started flashing Green Red Blue white and black
in succession so we decided to land in David. Gelabert to David is 206 nm
2:53 97kt. The unplanned stop in David caused a lot of confusion with the
authorities and we had to get gas which they don't have on the field.
Everyone was very helpful, for example Operations got a taxi driver to take
the aux tank to fill up at a local gas station. But having landed at 0900
we took off again at 1330. The Dynon came back up within 15 minutes of
landing so we assumed that the fault was due to heat. iLevil and analog
engine instruments backup worked exactly as planned to provide air and
basic engine data. So we decided to continue with a jury rigged shade
for the Dynon.
David - Liberia Costa Rica. We had originally planned to fly to San Jose
GA Airport MRPV but on on seeing towering cumulus we asked to continue to
Liberia which was authorized. 227nm, 2 hours, I dont have any other data
because my ipad shut down due to heat....it was easily 100 degrees in the
cockpit. Costa Rican Controllers were super helpful, even pointing out the
sights to us as they tracked us on radar. We landed in 18ktG25 without the
slightest problem.
The Dynon repeated its fault so we decided on reaching Liberia and talking
to Dynon to return to Miami for the weekend to pick up a new unit which
should be arriving today. Kudos to Don Jones of Dynon tech support but not
so happy as this is the second unit in 100 hours and the second
transponder. The interesting thing is that the unit continued to function
despite the screen failing. The AP worked and we got wifi attitude (when
the ipad cooled down) and voice alerts. I have powerful cold air tube to
the back of the unit but its hard to cool down the front.
We plan to return to Liberia on Monday install the new Dynon unit and
continue. We plan to go to Salvador Ilopango. Then we are at a fork in
the road which depends on weather.
One fork goes Cozumel Key West. This is 385 nm. We have 24 gals on
board. Today according to Foreflight we have a 2kt headwind and will
consume 19.1 gals (2 gals taxi 7 gph climb 5.5gph cruise). this leaves a
reserve of 4.9 gals which if you had options would be fine however the only
option to KEYW is cuba! Also this doesn't include deviations which are
common in the Caribbean due to build ups. So unless we can guarantee a
good tail wind and clear skies I feel that this is risky.
The other fork goes Tapachula Mexico Brownsville and round the gulf to 04FA
Miami which is over 1000nm and we would have to contend with the weather in
Southern USA which can be variable. However I feel that if the weather is
kind we can push on - 3x2 hour legs in a day is perfectly possible.
Lessons learned -
- Heat is tough on the body and takes a toll on electronics. We need
more sun shade and ventilation.
- The back systems worked BUT we hadn't thought about how to actually
use them....It would have been very useful to have a means by which the
Android iLevil PFD back up could have been placed in front of the pilot.
The way we solved this was for the Co Pilot sing out the speeds on approach
(which incidentally resulted in very stable approaches) but it might have
been different if I had been on my own. I would have had to have the PFD
on my lap or something like that which certainly wouldnt have been optimum
and might have been a serious issue in marginal conditions.
- So far we have spent more time on bureaucracy than actually flying.
A request: I know I have asked this before but can you all help me with
suggestions for routes between KBRO and KTMB. Particularly Id like to know
of friendly airports and contacts in case we have further technical issues.
Yours
Will
William Daniell
LONGPORT
+57 310 295 0744
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: f-8?Q?Re:_Europa-List:_Fire_proof_barrier_with_Jabiru_Engine? |
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Message 6
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Subject: | Re: HJ 460 trip report.... |
Will,
Sounds like you have had a very =9Cinteresting=9D journey so
far. Almost all airports are =9CFriendly=9D to GA aircraft.
Did you not receive the flight plan I sent back on Dec 1? You didn
=99t reply, so perhaps you didn=99t.
Here=99s what I put together trying to avoid as much troublesome
airspace as possible and refuel at the least expensive fuel stops:
KMFE (entry); KBEG (low cost gas); KBEA (waypoint); 00R (waypoint or
fuel); 5R8 (waypoint or fuel); 0R1 (waypoint or fuel); 79J (waypoint or
fuel); 40J (waypoint or fuel); X35 (land/fuel); KCHN or X06 (waypoint or
fuel); F45 (waypoint); 04FA (land)
If you insist on KBRO as a point of entry then KBRO; KPIL; KBEA
This track keeps you inland and close to airports along the way in case
one is needed. It avoids the worst airspace issues but you will still
have to contend with MOAs, they are everywhere. Flight following will
help with them. Distance 1308 NM, enroute time would be 12:45+stops and
would burn about 53 gal of fuel.
Please don=99t hesitate to ask about alternates if the legs are
too long. I based this on the performance of my Europa and is pretty
conservative with fuel.
Heat will be less of a problem as you get further north.
Wishing you the best of luck with your electronics. I=99ve had my
iPad blank out from heat. Always at the worst possible time.
Keep me posted on your progress.
Blue skies & tailwinds,
Bob Borger
Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (130 hrs).
Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP, Hercules
Prop.
3705 Lynchburg Dr.
Corinth, TX 76208-5331
Cel: 817-992-1117
rlborger@mac.com
On Jan 12, 2019, at 8:34 AM, William Daniell
<wdaniell.longport@gmail.com> wrote:
Sunday 6 Jan Bogota Medellin 1:15 flight time 150nm 120kt
Monday 7 Jan Medellin Bureaucracy
Tuesday 8 Jan Medellin Gelabert Panama 404nm 3:46 128kt av speed landed
with 1/4 tank 4 gals - we started with 6 gals in the aux tank and 15.
Panama Controllers helpful and professional - albeit their radios were
not working well and we had issues to Tocumen Approach - one of the
other pilots in the air mentioned that they had been having issues.
Wednesday 9 Jan we planned to go to Limon Costa Rica we took off from
Gelbert and then had to return due to weather 1.5 hours.
Thursday 10 Jan Gelabert to San Jose Costa Rica. Shortly before David
northern Panama the Dynon started flashing Green Red Blue white and
black in succession so we decided to land in David. Gelabert to David is
206 nm 2:53 97kt. The unplanned stop in David caused a lot of confusion
with the authorities and we had to get gas which they don't have on the
field. Everyone was very helpful, for example Operations got a taxi
driver to take the aux tank to fill up at a local gas station. But
having landed at 0900 we took off again at 1330. The Dynon came back up
within 15 minutes of landing so we assumed that the fault was due to
heat. iLevil and analog engine instruments backup worked exactly as
planned to provide air and basic engine data. So we decided to
continue with a jury rigged shade for the Dynon.
David - Liberia Costa Rica. We had originally planned to fly to San
Jose GA Airport MRPV but on on seeing towering cumulus we asked to
continue to Liberia which was authorized. 227nm, 2 hours, I dont have
any other data because my ipad shut down due to heat....it was easily
100 degrees in the cockpit. Costa Rican Controllers were super helpful,
even pointing out the sights to us as they tracked us on radar. We
landed in 18ktG25 without the slightest problem.
The Dynon repeated its fault so we decided on reaching Liberia and
talking to Dynon to return to Miami for the weekend to pick up a new
unit which should be arriving today. Kudos to Don Jones of Dynon tech
support but not so happy as this is the second unit in 100 hours and the
second transponder. The interesting thing is that the unit continued
to function despite the screen failing. The AP worked and we got wifi
attitude (when the ipad cooled down) and voice alerts. I have powerful
cold air tube to the back of the unit but its hard to cool down the
front.
We plan to return to Liberia on Monday install the new Dynon unit and
continue. We plan to go to Salvador Ilopango. Then we are at a fork in
the road which depends on weather.
One fork goes Cozumel Key West. This is 385 nm. We have 24 gals on
board. Today according to Foreflight we have a 2kt headwind and will
consume 19.1 gals (2 gals taxi 7 gph climb 5.5gph cruise). this leaves
a reserve of 4.9 gals which if you had options would be fine however the
only option to KEYW is cuba! Also this doesn't include deviations which
are common in the Caribbean due to build ups. So unless we can
guarantee a good tail wind and clear skies I feel that this is risky.
The other fork goes Tapachula Mexico Brownsville and round the gulf to
04FA Miami which is over 1000nm and we would have to contend with the
weather in Southern USA which can be variable. However I feel that if
the weather is kind we can push on - 3x2 hour legs in a day is perfectly
possible.
Lessons learned -
Heat is tough on the body and takes a toll on electronics. We need more
sun shade and ventilation.
The back systems worked BUT we hadn't thought about how to actually use
them....It would have been very useful to have a means by which the
Android iLevil PFD back up could have been placed in front of the pilot.
The way we solved this was for the Co Pilot sing out the speeds on
approach (which incidentally resulted in very stable approaches) but it
might have been different if I had been on my own. I would have had to
have the PFD on my lap or something like that which certainly wouldnt
have been optimum and might have been a serious issue in marginal
conditions.
So far we have spent more time on bureaucracy than actually flying.
A request: I know I have asked this before but can you all help me with
suggestions for routes between KBRO and KTMB. Particularly Id like to
know of friendly airports and contacts in case we have further technical
issues.
Yours
Will
William Daniell
LONGPORT
+57 310 295 0744
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: HJ 460 trip report.... |
Sorry Bob I did get it but with all the other bureaucracy for the trip I
must have overlooked a response. Sorry.
thanks
William Daniell
LONGPORT
+57 310 295 0744
On Sat, Jan 12, 2019 at 10:48 AM Robert Borger <rlborger@mac.com> wrote:
> Will,
>
> Sounds like you have had a very =9Cinteresting=9D journey so
far. Almost all
> airports are =9CFriendly=9D to GA aircraft. Did you not rece
ive the flight
> plan I sent back on Dec 1? You didn=99t reply, so perhaps you didn
=99t.
>
> Here=99s what I put together trying to avoid as much troublesome ai
rspace as
> possible and refuel at the least expensive fuel stops:
>
> KMFE (entry); KBEG (low cost gas); KBEA (waypoint); 00R (waypoint or
> fuel); 5R8 (waypoint or fuel); 0R1 (waypoint or fuel); 79J (waypoint or
> fuel); 40J (waypoint or fuel); X35 (land/fuel); KCHN or X06 (waypoint or
> fuel); F45 (waypoint); 04FA (land)
>
> If you insist on KBRO as a point of entry then KBRO; KPIL; KBEA
>
> This track keeps you inland and close to airports along the way in case
> one is needed. It avoids the worst airspace issues but you will still ha
ve
> to contend with MOAs, they are everywhere. Flight following will help wi
th
> them. Distance 1308 NM, enroute time would be 12:45+stops and would burn
> about 53 gal of fuel.
>
> Please don=99t hesitate to ask about alternates if the legs are too
long. I
> based this on the performance of my Europa and is pretty conservative wit
h
> fuel.
>
> Heat will be less of a problem as you get further north.
>
> Wishing you the best of luck with your electronics. I=99ve had my
iPad
> blank out from heat. Always at the worst possible time.
>
> Keep me posted on your progress.
>
> Blue skies & tailwinds,
> Bob Borger
> Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop (130 hrs).
> Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP, Hercules
> Prop.
> 3705 Lynchburg Dr.
> Corinth, TX 76208-5331
> Cel: 817-992-1117
> rlborger@mac.com
>
> On Jan 12, 2019, at 8:34 AM, William Daniell <wdaniell.longport@gmail.com
>
> wrote:
>
> Sunday 6 Jan Bogota Medellin 1:15 flight time 150nm 120kt
> Monday 7 Jan Medellin Bureaucracy
> Tuesday 8 Jan Medellin Gelabert Panama 404nm 3:46 128kt av speed landed
> with 1/4 tank 4 gals - we started with 6 gals in the aux tank and 15.
> Panama Controllers helpful and professional - albeit their radios were no
t
> working well and we had issues to Tocumen Approach - one of the other
> pilots in the air mentioned that they had been having issues.
> Wednesday 9 Jan we planned to go to Limon Costa Rica we took off from
> Gelbert and then had to return due to weather 1.5 hours.
> Thursday 10 Jan Gelabert to San Jose Costa Rica. Shortly before David
> northern Panama the Dynon started flashing Green Red Blue white and black
> in succession so we decided to land in David. Gelabert to David is 206 nm
> 2:53 97kt. The unplanned stop in David caused a lot of confusion with th
e
> authorities and we had to get gas which they don't have on the field.
> Everyone was very helpful, for example Operations got a taxi driver to ta
ke
> the aux tank to fill up at a local gas station. But having landed at 090
0
> we took off again at 1330. The Dynon came back up within 15 minutes of
> landing so we assumed that the fault was due to heat. iLevil and analog
> engine instruments backup worked exactly as planned to provide air and
> basic engine data. So we decided to continue with a jury rigged shade
> for the Dynon.
> David - Liberia Costa Rica. We had originally planned to fly to San Jose
> GA Airport MRPV but on on seeing towering cumulus we asked to continue to
> Liberia which was authorized. 227nm, 2 hours, I dont have any other data
> because my ipad shut down due to heat....it was easily 100 degrees in the
> cockpit. Costa Rican Controllers were super helpful, even pointing out t
he
> sights to us as they tracked us on radar. We landed in 18ktG25 without t
he
> slightest problem.
> The Dynon repeated its fault so we decided on reaching Liberia and talkin
g
> to Dynon to return to Miami for the weekend to pick up a new unit which
> should be arriving today. Kudos to Don Jones of Dynon tech support but n
ot
> so happy as this is the second unit in 100 hours and the second
> transponder. The interesting thing is that the unit continued to functi
on
> despite the screen failing. The AP worked and we got wifi attitude (when
> the ipad cooled down) and voice alerts. I have powerful cold air tube to
> the back of the unit but its hard to cool down the front.
>
> We plan to return to Liberia on Monday install the new Dynon unit and
> continue. We plan to go to Salvador Ilopango. Then we are at a fork in
> the road which depends on weather.
>
> One fork goes Cozumel Key West. This is 385 nm. We have 24 gals on
> board. Today according to Foreflight we have a 2kt headwind and will
> consume 19.1 gals (2 gals taxi 7 gph climb 5.5gph cruise). this leaves a
> reserve of 4.9 gals which if you had options would be fine however the on
ly
> option to KEYW is cuba! Also this doesn't include deviations which are
> common in the Caribbean due to build ups. So unless we can guarantee a
> good tail wind and clear skies I feel that this is risky.
>
> The other fork goes Tapachula Mexico Brownsville and round the gulf to
> 04FA Miami which is over 1000nm and we would have to contend with the
> weather in Southern USA which can be variable. However I feel that if th
e
> weather is kind we can push on - 3x2 hour legs in a day is perfectly
> possible.
>
> Lessons learned -
>
> - Heat is tough on the body and takes a toll on electronics. We need
> more sun shade and ventilation.
> - The back systems worked BUT we hadn't thought about how to actually
> use them....It would have been very useful to have a means by which th
e
> Android iLevil PFD back up could have been placed in front of the pilo
t.
> The way we solved this was for the Co Pilot sing out the speeds on app
roach
> (which incidentally resulted in very stable approaches) but it might h
ave
> been different if I had been on my own. I would have had to have the
PFD
> on my lap or something like that which certainly wouldnt have been opt
imum
> and might have been a serious issue in marginal conditions.
> - So far we have spent more time on bureaucracy than actually flying.
>
> A request: I know I have asked this before but can you all help me with
> suggestions for routes between KBRO and KTMB. Particularly Id like to kn
ow
> of friendly airports and contacts in case we have further technical issue
s.
>
> Yours
>
> Will
>
>
> William Daniell
> LONGPORT
> +57 310 295 0744
>
>
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Subject: | Re: Pierburg fuel pump 7.2097155 |
Pete,
I have the same dilemma with respect to the latest fuel pump touching
the radiator on my Classic.
I have therefore been seriously considering making the fuel system 'all
electric' as it is with the 914 except that I will use a second Facet
solid state fuel pump like the one originally supplied by Europa.
Further, my thoughts are to install this new pump in parallel with the
existing Facet pump unless I receive good advice to the contrary.
Cheers
Kingsley in Oz
On 11.01.19 3:29 am, Pete Lawless wrote:
>
> Hi All
>
> A flashing fuel pressure light, probably caused by a failing pressure
> sensor, got me thinking about a spare fuel pump for the 912ul in my
> Classic.
>
> I believe the new Rotax pump with the drain will not fit in the
> Classic as it touches the radiator. I looked on the Ruddies-Berlin
> website but they do not seem to offer the 7.2097155 anymore.
>
> Any ideas where I might find one UK or Europe or is there an
> alternative pump that will fit the Classic layout?
>
> Thanks
>
> Pete
>
>
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Performance of 80HP compared to 100HP Rotax |
Hello Graeme,
I have a Mono Classic with the 912 80HP engine with 3 tapered Warp Drive
blades and an Airmaster CS hub.
Whilst I cannot directly compare the 80 HP 912 to the 100HP 912S, I can
say that I (along with others) am amazed how well it performs. The only
thing that would make me consider replacing it with the 100HP engine is
that part of flight between lift off and 90 kts. I am perfectly happy
with the ground run but after lift off in the high drag configuration
(flaps and gear down), 60 kts is about all I can get. I therefore
progressively start raising the gear/flaps very soon after lift off and
put them fully away at 60 kts. Climb rate at this time is minimal as it
fairly slowly accelerates. At 80 kts it starts to climb quite nicely
but by then I am well past the end of our 700m strip. (Exacerbating
this situation is the fact that we almost always have a cross wind) I
like to climb at 90 kts IAS and at AUW of 621 kg, I am astounded how
well it climbs to altitude averaging around 500 fpm and sometimes more
to 8,000 ft etc.
A mate of mine had a tri gear with the 80 HP engine and a fixed pitch
wooden propeller. It couldn't look at mine performance wise. I'm
therefore of the opinion a CS prop is a necessity with the 80 HP
especially in the hot conditions we have to endure over here.
I suppose this has told you very little Graeme but I wouldn't go to the
expense of purchasing a 912S without first trying the 912 you were
supplied. If need be, swapping them over is a very simple exercise once
you have forked out the $$$!!
Best regards
Kingsley in Oz
On 12.01.19 8:57 pm, graeme bird wrote:-
> I received an unused 80HP 912 with my recent part built kit with a thin three
blade warp drive; my own Europa is a 100HP 912ULS, can anyone comment on what
difference in performance I might expect. I recall on my previous plane, a C42,
the 80HP was less violent and more economical with marginal difference in performance
but that might have been because it was cloth and draggy.
>
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|
Subject: | Re: Fire proof barrier with Jabiru Engine |
Hi Mike,
Thanks for your reply. Im building a conventional landing gear Europa.
All the SBs on the engine have already been carried out.
With regard to your firewall, just confirming you covered all the phenolic firewall
with stainless steel? How did you fasten the sheets - was it riveted?
When you used the fire resistant compound at the edges, did you bend the edges
to provide more area for the compound to adhere?
Thanks again for your advice Mike.
--------
Tony Vaccarella
Mascot NSW 2020
Sydney Australia
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=486914#486914
Message 11
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|
Subject: | Re: Pierburg fuel pump 7.2097155 |
Dual fuel pumps in parallel w/ their respective dual filters avoids a single mode
of failureunless Im missing somethingF.
> On Jan 12, 2019, at 3:09 PM, Kingsley Hurst <kingsnjan@westnet.com.au> wrote:
>
>
> Pete,
>
> I have the same dilemma with respect to the latest fuel pump touching the radiator
on my Classic.
>
> I have therefore been seriously considering making the fuel system 'all electric'
as it is with the 914 except that I will use a second Facet solid state fuel
pump like the one originally supplied by Europa. Further, my thoughts are
to install this new pump in parallel with the existing Facet pump unless I receive
good advice to the contrary.
>
> Cheers
>
> Kingsley in Oz
>
>
> On 11.01.19 3:29 am, Pete Lawless wrote:
>>
>> Hi All
>>
>> A flashing fuel pressure light, probably caused by a failing pressure sensor,
got me thinking about a spare fuel pump for the 912ul in my Classic.
>>
>> I believe the new Rotax pump with the drain will not fit in the Classic as it
touches the radiator. I looked on the Ruddies-Berlin website but they do not
seem to offer the 7.2097155 anymore.
>>
>> Any ideas where I might find one UK or Europe or is there an alternative pump
that will fit the Classic layout?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Pete
>>
>>
>
>
>
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