---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 04/14/20: 11 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:13 AM - Re: 914 Battery Locations (tennant) 2. 01:43 AM - Batteries (Richard Scanlan) 3. 02:09 AM - Re: Wheel pants help (John Wighton) 4. 03:40 AM - Re: Batteries (Brian Davies) 5. 05:15 AM - Warp drive (Michel AUVRAY) 6. 05:21 AM - Re: Batteries (Alan Burrill) 7. 05:35 AM - Re: Batteries (olivier.hequet@neuf.fr) 8. 05:39 AM - Re: Re: Wheel pants help (William Daniell) 9. 06:55 AM - Re: Batteries (Richard Churchill-Coleman) 10. 08:44 AM - Re: Batteries (h&jeuropa) 11. 12:49 PM - Re: Batteries (Gilles Thesee) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:13:18 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: 914 Battery Locations From: "tennant" I had a heavy MT prop and 2 x batteries (8 kg) in parallel on the footwell. I had to put 2 kg of ballast at the tail. Recently changed to one Lipo on the footwell and took out nearly all of the ballast!! Magic! -------- Barry Tennant D-EHBT At EDLM - Germany Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=495806#495806 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:43:36 AM PST US From: Richard Scanlan Subject: Europa-List: Batteries A friend of mine in the motorcycle trade after looking at the Rotax charging system specified a 6.5kg lead acid. Two years later he suggested LiPo and after 7 years Im now on my second one. Its 800 grams and the first failed through age. LTX9-BS and 80 delivered through eBay. I initially had concerns over an early regulator failure but thats still original after 10 years and 700 hours. Fully flooded and VRLA batteries have their place but possibly not in an aircraft. Richard S G CEIW Sent from my iPad ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:09:44 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Wheel pants help From: "John Wighton" My tri-gear using the standard spats and wheels with 2 x vertical 1/8in lite-ply formers set approx 2-3in into each main spat moulding. The nosegear spat has a similar plywood former in the aft moulding. All spats have a 1/4in drain hole on the underside. In winter the mud accumulates in the void around the wheel, I normally remove it using a [small] pressure washer. On odd occasions when it was left and has dried it shrinks and is prone to lock a wheel when man-handling the aircraft on the ground. I once weighed the [wet] mud extracted - approx 10lbs. If l was to redesign the spats l would add a mud-guard internally - set around 2in from the tyre outer radius. This would limit the mud but possibly also increase the risk of it getting heavily bunged up. All of my spats have carbon tows laid around the wheel aperture - this avoids splits in the woven GF propagating. I leave around 1/2in gap around each tyre. -------- John Wighton Europa XS trigear G-IPOD Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=495808#495808 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:40:04 AM PST US From: "Brian Davies" Subject: RE: Europa-List: Batteries LiPo batteries are great for cranking amps but it is worth double checking the capacity, particularly if you are flying an aircraft that relies on only electric pumps ( 914). The LTX9 has a capacity of only 3.6 AH. Regards Brian -----Original Message----- From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Scanlan Sent: 14 April 2020 09:42 Subject: Europa-List: Batteries A friend of mine in the motorcycle trade after looking at the Rotax charging system specified a 6.5kg lead acid. Two years later he suggested LiPo and after 7 years Im now on my second one. Its 800 grams and the first failed through age. LTX9-BS and 80 delivered through eBay. I initially had concerns over an early regulator failure but thats still original after 10 years and 700 hours. Fully flooded and VRLA batteries have their place but possibly not in an aircraft. Richard S G CEIW Sent from my iPad -- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. https://www.avg.com ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:15:20 AM PST US From: Michel AUVRAY Subject: Europa-List: Warp drive Hello all, I search warp drive propeller second hand for tri-gear with blades no tapered. Many thanks ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:21:13 AM PST US From: Alan Burrill Subject: Re: Europa-List: Batteries >>LiPo batteries are great for cranking amps but it is worth double checking the capacity, particularly if you are flying an aircraft that relies on only electric pumps ( 914). The LTX9 has a capacity of only 3.6 AH.<< When I fitted a a LiPro to my 912ULS Tri-gear, I worked through the static load i.e. Radio, GPS, Master Solenoid, Transponder. and then dynamic load i.e. Radio Transmitting, trimmer and flap operation. With a static load of 8 amps I have 2 hours of battery capability and can extend that if I close down transponder, put GPS on internal battery and other measures. In other words I can cross the channel and find an airfield to divert into. If anyone is considering fitting a LiPro I recommend sitting down first and working out the electrical load factors first and then considering how much capacity your would need to divert should you loose an alternator. It's done for IFR capable aircraft as part of the design. Fitting a LiPro is not all about weight saving and cranking capacity IMHO. Regards Alan Burrill G-OBJT > On 14 Apr 2020, at 11:38, Brian Davies wrote: > > > LiPo batteries are great for cranking amps but it is worth double checking the capacity, particularly if you are flying an aircraft that relies on only electric pumps ( 914). The LTX9 has a capacity of only 3.6 AH. > > Regards > > Brian > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Scanlan > Sent: 14 April 2020 09:42 > To: europa-list@matronics.com > Subject: Europa-List: Batteries > > > A friend of mine in the motorcycle trade after looking at the Rotax charging system specified a 6.5kg lead acid. Two years later he suggested LiPo and after 7 years Im now on my second one. Its 800 grams and the first failed through age. LTX9-BS and 80 delivered through eBay. I initially had concerns over an early regulator failure but thats still original after 10 years and 700 hours. > Fully flooded and VRLA batteries have their place but possibly not in an aircraft. > > Richard S > G CEIW > > Sent from my iPad > > > > > -- > This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. > https://www.avg.com > > > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:35:43 AM PST US From: "olivier.hequet@neuf.fr" Subject: Re: Europa-List: Batteries Hello, Just for information I put a lipo battery in my Europa...for better results I change my regulator by a Silent Hektik. Like this: https://www.silent-hektik.de/UL_R_912.htm Olivier > Le 14 avr. 2020 =C3- 14:24, Alan Burrill a =C3=A9cri t : > k> > >>> LiPo batteries are great for cranking amps but it is worth double checki ng the capacity, particularly if you are flying an aircraft that relies on o nly electric pumps ( 914). The LTX9 has a capacity of only 3.6 AH.<< > > When I fitted a a LiPro to my 912ULS Tri-gear, I worked through the static load i.e. Radio, GPS, Master Solenoid, Transponder. and then dynam ic load i.e. Radio Transmitting, trimmer and flap operation . With a static load of 8 amps I have 2 hours of battery capability and can extend that if I close down transponder, put GPS on internal batter y and other measures. In other words I can cross the channel and find an ai rfield to divert into. > > If anyone is considering fitting a LiPro I recommend sitting down first an d working out the electrical load factors first and then considering how muc h capacity your would need to divert should you loose an alternator. It's do ne for IFR capable aircraft as part of the design. > > Fitting a LiPro is not all about weight saving and cranking capacity IMHO. > > Regards > > Alan Burrill > G-OBJT > >> On 14 Apr 2020, at 11:38, Brian Davies wrote: >> uk> >> >> LiPo batteries are great for cranking amps but it is worth double checkin g the capacity, particularly if you are flying an aircraft that relies on on ly electric pumps ( 914). The LTX9 has a capacity of only 3.6 AH. >> >> Regards >> >> Brian >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-se rver@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Scanlan >> Sent: 14 April 2020 09:42 >> To: europa-list@matronics.com >> Subject: Europa-List: Batteries >> >> >> A friend of mine in the motorcycle trade after looking at the Rotax charg ing system specified a 6.5kg lead acid. Two years later he suggested LiPo an d after 7 years I=99m now on my second one. It=99s 800 grams and the first failed through age. LTX9-BS and =82=AC80 delivered through eBa y. I initially had concerns over an early regulator failure but that=99 s still original after 10 years and 700 hours. >> Fully flooded and VRLA batteries have their place but possibly not in an a ircraft. >> >> Richard S >> G CEIW >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> >> >> >> -- >> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. >> https://www.avg.com >> >> >> >> >> > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:39:48 AM PST US From: William Daniell Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Wheel pants help thanks john. Did you make any mods to the mounting system. The bendy steel bracket things seem well ...bendy. That said I had mine mounted for the first 150 hours and they worked fine....it's the grass that Im worried about. Now that you mention it I do have a split on the bottom seam which I have to reinforce... Will William Daniell LONGPORT +1 786 878 0246 On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 5:11 AM John Wighton wrote: > > My tri-gear using the standard spats and wheels with 2 x vertical 1/8in > lite-ply formers set approx 2-3in into each main spat moulding. The > nosegear spat has a similar plywood former in the aft moulding. All spats > have a 1/4in drain hole on the underside. > > In winter the mud accumulates in the void around the wheel, I normally > remove it using a [small] pressure washer. On odd occasions when it was > left and has dried it shrinks and is prone to lock a wheel when > man-handling the aircraft on the ground. > > I once weighed the [wet] mud extracted - approx 10lbs. > > If l was to redesign the spats l would add a mud-guard internally - set > around 2in from the tyre outer radius. This would limit the mud but > possibly also increase the risk of it getting heavily bunged up. > > All of my spats have carbon tows laid around the wheel aperture - this > avoids splits in the woven GF propagating. I leave around 1/2in gap around > each tyre. > > -------- > John Wighton > Europa XS trigear G-IPOD > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=495808#495808 > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:55:35 AM PST US From: Richard Churchill-Coleman Subject: Re: Europa-List: Batteries Unfortunately, Silent Hektik refuses to sell their items to UK residents. Pe rhaps a reaction to Brexit - But they didn=99t give me an explanation! Richard C-C Sent from my iPhone > On 14 Apr 2020, at 13:34, "olivier.hequet@neuf.fr" wrote: > > Hello, > > Just for information > I put a lipo battery in my Europa...for better results I change my regulat or by a Silent Hektik. Like this: https://www.silent-hektik.de/UL_R_912.htm > > Olivier > >> Le 14 avr. 2020 =C3- 14:24, Alan Burrill a =C3=A9cr it : >> uk> >> >>>> LiPo batteries are great for cranking amps but it is worth double check ing the capacity, particularly if you are flying an aircraft that relies on o nly electric pumps ( 914). The LTX9 has a capacity of only 3.6 AH.<< >> >> When I fitted a a LiPro to my 912ULS Tri-gear, I worked through the stati c load i.e. Radio, GPS, Master Solenoid, Transponder. and then dyna mic load i.e. Radio Transmitting, trimmer and flap operation . With a static load of 8 amps I have 2 hours of battery capability and can extend that if I close down transponder, put GPS on internal batter y and other measures. In other words I can cross the channel and find an ai rfield to divert into. >> >> If anyone is considering fitting a LiPro I recommend sitting down first a nd working out the electrical load factors first and then considering how mu ch capacity your would need to divert should you loose an alternator. It's d one for IFR capable aircraft as part of the design. >> >> Fitting a LiPro is not all about weight saving and cranking capacity IMHO .. >> >> Regards >> >> Alan Burrill >> G-OBJT >> >>> On 14 Apr 2020, at 11:38, Brian Davies wrote: >>> .uk> >>> >>> LiPo batteries are great for cranking amps but it is worth double checki ng the capacity, particularly if you are flying an aircraft that relies on o nly electric pumps ( 914). The LTX9 has a capacity of only 3.6 AH. >>> >>> Regards >>> >>> Brian >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-s erver@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Scanlan >>> Sent: 14 April 2020 09:42 >>> To: europa-list@matronics.com >>> Subject: Europa-List: Batteries >>> >>> >>> A friend of mine in the motorcycle trade after looking at the Rotax char ging system specified a 6.5kg lead acid. Two years later he suggested LiPo a nd after 7 years I=99m now on my second one. It=99s 800 grams an d the first failed through age. LTX9-BS and =82=AC80 delivered through eB ay. I initially had concerns over an early regulator failure but that=99 s still original after 10 years and 700 hours. >>> Fully flooded and VRLA batteries have their place but possibly not in an aircraft. >>> >>> Richard S >>> G CEIW >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. >>> https://www.avg.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> = Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, >> ========================= ==================== >> >> >> >> ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:44:24 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: Re: Batteries From: "h&jeuropa" We have been using a EarthX lithium battery (ETX 680C) for several years. I wrote an article for the Europa Flyer (EF82) concerning it. We load test it each inspection and it will maintain rated voltage with a load of 10 amps for over an hour. One feature of lithium batteries is that the voltage does not decay as the battery discharges. It stays pretty constant but then falls off quickly. We replaced the Ducatti regulator with one Jim built. A RV12 owner and electrical engineer who researched many Ducatti failures developed this replacement. It is essentially a clone of the Ducatti but with high quality components and much larger heat sinks. Documentation and PC boards are available and the cost is roughly $70. B and C Aero now has a replacement for the Ducatti called AVC-1. The link to the specifications is https://bandc.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/AVC1_Technical_Manual_RevIR_3-11-20.pdf While not listed on their website yet, I believe the cost is $275. We have always had our battery located on top of the foot well, even when we had a lead acid battery. We really wanted to avoid long, heavy cable runs. There are some loading situations where the CG is too far forward but we just use a couple 1 gallon containers filled with water located in the rear for those flights. Jim & Heather Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=495817#495817 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 12:49:44 PM PST US Subject: Re: Europa-List: Batteries From: Gilles Thesee /Le 14/04/2020 15:53, Richard Churchill-Coleman a crit:// / > /Unfortunately, Silent Hektik refuses to sell their items to UK > residents. Perhaps a reaction to Brexit - But they didnt give me an > explanation!/ > Hi Richard, My building buddy has a Silent Hektik for sale. He might be willing to send it to you (regardless of Brexit or else ;-). Sorry, only picture I have : If interested, do not hesitate to pm me. FWIW -- Best regards, Gilles http://contrails.free.fr http://lapierre.skunkworks.free.fr ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.