Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:42 AM - Blocked Fuel Filters (davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk)
2. 08:09 AM - Re: Blocked Fuel Filters (Michel AUVRAY)
3. 09:57 AM - Re: Blocked Fuel Filters (David stranfaer)
4. 11:25 AM - Re: Blocked Fuel Filters (Mike Christine Duane)
5. 12:11 PM - Re: Blocked Fuel Filters (Jerry Rehn)
6. 01:07 PM - Re: Rotax 912ULS starter motor (Martin Tuck)
7. 02:22 PM - Re: Blocked Fuel Filters (david park)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Blocked Fuel Filters |
I would be very grateful for any information anyone has on incidents
arising from blockage of the glass fuel filters supplied as Europa
standard. Please reply to my personal email.
Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Blocked Fuel Filters |
Hello David
Yes I now this probl=C3=A8me 20 years ago, on 2001 I replace 2 originals fu
el
filters by andair gascolator on my airplane FPFGT and 4 years after
samething on my son aircraft FPSLN it si perfect. We have both 912S
Michel Auvray
Le sam. 6 f=C3=A9vr. 2021 =C3- 13:45, <davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk> a =C3
=A9crit :
> I would be very grateful for any information anyone has on incidents
> arising from blockage of the glass fuel filters supplied as Europa
> standard. Please reply to my personal email.
>
> Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Blocked Fuel Filters |
David I had the main give me problems about eight years ago on way back from
Cardiff , switched to reserve then ASAP we stopped at Wolverhampton to chec
k and it was blocked, cleaned it and proved it, refuelled, but then flew las
t 40 miles on reserve . I have now changed to the solid pipe and Andair gasc
olator mod, much neater and les problematic rgds DJ the other one =F0=9F=98
Sent from my iPhone
> On 6 Feb 2021, at 16:10, Michel AUVRAY <mau05160@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> =EF=BB
> Hello David
> Yes I now this probl=C3=A8me 20 years ago, on 2001 I replace 2 originals f
uel filters by andair gascolator on my airplane FPFGT and 4 years after same
thing on my son aircraft FPSLN it si perfect. We have both 912S
> Michel Auvray
>
>> Le sam. 6 f=C3=A9vr. 2021 =C3- 13:45, <davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk> a =C3
=A9crit :
>> I would be very grateful for any information anyone has on incidents aris
ing from blockage of the glass fuel filters supplied as Europa standard. Ple
ase reply to my personal email.
>>
>> Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Blocked Fuel Filters |
During my annual, I remove and clean these filters. I=99ve never had a
problem with them. Knock on wood!
Mike Duane N377EA
Europa Conventional Gear
Chandler, AZ, USA
Sent from my iPhone
> On Feb 6, 2021, at 9:10 AM, Michel AUVRAY <mau05160@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> =EF=BB
> Hello David
> Yes I now this probl=C3=A8me 20 years ago, on 2001 I replace 2 originals f
uel filters by andair gascolator on my airplane FPFGT and 4 years after same
thing on my son aircraft FPSLN it si perfect. We have both 912S
> Michel Auvray
>
>> Le sam. 6 f=C3=A9vr. 2021 =C3- 13:45, <davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk> a =C3
=A9crit :
>> I would be very grateful for any information anyone has on incidents aris
ing from blockage of the glass fuel filters supplied as Europa standard. Ple
ase reply to my personal email.
>>
>> Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Blocked Fuel Filters |
Some many years ago my filters also failed on taking off as engine went to f
ull boost, backed off boost and engine ran fine, landed, changed filters all
ok. Replaced with a andair, never a problem since. I too regularly checked t
he original filters, probably some stuff still in fuel tank back then.
I check my andair frequently and very little in bowl and filter.
JERRY
Mono XS 914
Sent from my iPhone
> On Feb 6, 2021, at 12:30 PM, Mike Christine Duane <DuaneFamly@aol.com> wro
te:
>
> =EF=BBDuring my annual, I remove and clean these filters. I=99ve n
ever had a problem with them. Knock on wood!
>
> Mike Duane N377EA
> Europa Conventional Gear
> Chandler, AZ, USA
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>>> On Feb 6, 2021, at 9:10 AM, Michel AUVRAY <mau05160@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>> =EF=BB
>> Hello David
>> Yes I now this probl=C3=A8me 20 years ago, on 2001 I replace 2 originals f
uel filters by andair gascolator on my airplane FPFGT and 4 years after same
thing on my son aircraft FPSLN it si perfect. We have both 912S
>> Michel Auvray
>>
>>> Le sam. 6 f=C3=A9vr. 2021 =C3- 13:45, <davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk> a =C3
=A9crit :
>>> I would be very grateful for any information anyone has on incidents ari
sing from blockage of the glass fuel filters supplied as Europa standard. Pl
ease reply to my personal email.
>>>
>>> Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Rotax 912ULS starter motor |
Hi all,
Closer scrutiny of the SkyTec starter shows eligibility for the Rotax
912ULS Serials 4425001 and on.
I have an older 912UL. Do you know if there a similar hi-torque starter
available for it?
Anyone have experience installing the SkyTec starter on the 912UL?
Regards,
Martin Tuck
On 12/3/2020 6:47 AM, Bud Yerly wrote:
>
> Martin,
>
> Remember all the posts, SBs, SLs, Sis on Genuine Rotax Parts kept
> coming on and on?
>
> I normally use Rotax parts on my engine because I can afford it and I
> plan on selling my aircraft when I get old. My plane and I are aging
> similarly by the way. But my plane is easier to touch up and is not
> growing hair out of its ears.
>
> The Sky-tec has the same nose seal as the Rotax. The problem with
> Joe Bag of Doughnuts installer is they fail to note the spacers and
> O rings that go on the spindly threaded rods. Sky-tec threaded rods
> are not as hard a steel as the Rotax and bend usually in shipment.
> Ive had to straighten them and fab a new spacer to suit my liking to
> get the gear length exactly the length of the other starter, which was
> a waste of time. Simply reinstall the existing spacers and the clamp
> and it works just fine.
>
> The Rotax heavy MX manual shows the spacers, O rings and clamp. That
> rear clamp will keep the starter securely fastened preventing the
> somewhat soft threaded rods from worrying you about a sagging starter.
>
> You just have to work around the ring mount, footwell, and any
> hose/electrical routings with cold fingers getting it all back into
> place without pulling apart. The O rings help but I find using safety
> wire to hold the starter nose and tail tight while installing prevents
> the starters from falling apart on install which can damage brushes.
> Once the starter starts to slip in place, and you have not forgotten
> to put the clamp back on, simply cut the .020 safety wire off, and
> push it home.
>
> I normally do starter changes and engine rubber mount changes at the
> same time by pulling the engine on a 5 year. If you make the engine
> easy to disconnect and come off like a pod, it is a 4 hour hose,
> rubber, starter cleanup, and service rather than days of frustration.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Bud Yerly
>
> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
> Windows 10
>
> *From: *Martin Tuck <mailto:MJKTuck@cs.com>
> *Sent: *Wednesday, December 2, 2020 11:09 PM
> *To: *europa-list@matronics.com <mailto:europa-list@matronics.com>
> *Subject: *Re: Europa-List: Rotax 912ULS starter motor
>
> Nine years ago on the Rotax Owners Forum there was some commentary
> surrounding the suitability of the Sky-Tec starter due to the lack of
> oil seal resulting in oil in the starter and possibly compromising the
> oil return system.
>
> This is explained in a Rotax service bulletin.
>
> See Rotax Service LetterSL-912-014 / 914-012 / 2ST-008
> <https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Flegacy.rotax-owner.com%2Fsi_tb_info%2Fserviceletter%2Fsl-912-014-r3.pdf&data=04%7C01%7C%7Ce4413423f0a147ea925a08d897413630%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637425653619573178%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=7JH9LR5coDY%2FiHPA1jXP%2FaAdctWtKMibkk4lAEeCbYY%3D&reserved=0>for
> more information.
>
>
> That was a while ago and put me off the idea of using that starter.
>
> Do you know if the Sky-Tec starter has since been modified to prevent
> this? It doesn't sound like those who have used it have had issues
> like this.
>
> Thanks,
> Martin Tuck
> N152MT
> Wichita, Kansas
>
> On 12/1/2020 7:16 PM, Bud Yerly wrote:
>
> Arwel,
>
> In my Troubleshooting guide I mention the starter issues.
>
> It is my opinion all Rotax engines should upgrade to the high
> torque starter.
>
> Ive tried them both. The Rotax high torque is what I
> installed ($1100USD), mainly because my plane was kept stock as
> much as possible. For the Experimenter I recommend the Sky-Tec
> as it costs half (<$500 USD) as much and is quite torquey.
>
>
>
> Both spin the prop with authority, easily surpasses the ignition
> excitation speed. With plugs in and ignition off, I see 500 RPM
> for a 914/912 and 400-450 for a 912S/iS.
>
> Even with a slightly low battery, starts are crisp. This
> lengthens the life of the sprag clutch. But these clutches do
> wear and somewhere within 1000 hours even on a well maintained
> 912S engine with good starting, it may fail.
>
>
>
> In my Rotax troubleshooting update in March, I went into the soft
> start/starting ignition problems of the Rotax. As many have
> learned, once the starter cant push past the compression peak
> at ignition, the engine will kick back which will quickly wear the
> sprag clutch. What I didnt explain completely was when the
> sprag clutch begins to weaken and slightly slip, this will
> exacerbate the kickback issues. Adding a high torque starter on
> a defective clutch will not be the total answer to the
> kickback. Because the Rotax sprag clutch is a trapped un-round
> roller type one way clutch, if the spring that holds the un-round
> roller in place is loaded excessively, the spring stretches which
> causes the clutch to slip so it no longer is an effective one way
> clutch. The good news is there is no damage to the starter or
> the crank shaft when this happens unless the engine continues to
> have kick backs with the defective clutch, then things break
> and fowl the engine with metal parts. Which means it goes from a
> somewhat expensive repair to a very expensive repair. Youtube has
> videos on the different types of these one way clutches.
>
>
>
> I recommend that if you have an XS firewall forward (with the ring
> mount) the high torque starter will fit. (Note the Rotax high
> torque may come with the tabs still attached which must be
> cut/ground off. Our dealers in the States supply them ready to
> install without the tabs.) I found the Sky-Tek to be well built
> and spun up quickly on some light sport aircraft we have around
> here. I think it is good insurance for preserving the sprag
> clutch. The Sky-Tek is cheaper also.
>
>
>
> For those with the Classic FWF, Im afraid neither of the high
> torque starter options will fit the original Classic mount. It
> is too long by only a few millimeters, but it is too long.
> Service your starter for good operation, keep the battery up, and
> on very cold starts, use engine preheat.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Bud Yerly
>
> www.customflightcreations.com
> <https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.customflightcreations.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7Ce4413423f0a147ea925a08d897413630%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637425653619573178%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=HlvIQjpH42%2BEPZpJGxoIdhCla8JaEK1CDVxNtmV2E3s%3D&reserved=0>
>
> Sent from Mail
> <https://eur05.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgo.microsoft.com%2Ffwlink%2F%3FLinkId%3D550986&data=04%7C01%7C%7Ce4413423f0a147ea925a08d897413630%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637425653619583173%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=uaUpZqhiF2nGrXR5s9Ou%2BjJ927NGj4zzU6x5YVH0m20%3D&reserved=0>
> for Windows 10
>
>
>
> *From: *arwel pritchard <mailto:arwel.pritchard@powercom.ltd.uk>
> *Sent: *Tuesday, December 1, 2020 8:51 AM
> *To: *europa-list@matronics.com <mailto:europa-list@matronics.com>
> *Subject: *Europa-List: Rotax 912ULS starter motor
>
>
>
> Good morning
>
>
>
> Has anybody replaced the starter motor on a 912ULS with a Sky-Tec
> model. Apparently, it cranks the engine faster than the standard
> Rotax model.
>
> I have been quoted 660 for this unit, seems quite expensive,
> but if it preserves the sprag clutch (which I had to replace last
> year at much more cost) its got to be a good thing?
>
> Just wondering if its worth it.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -->
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Blocked Fuel Filters |
Have two Andair gascolators in G-LDVO and never had a problem since they wer
e installed during the build several years ago.
Never seen any water in them. Replace filters regardless every couple of yea
rs with new seals.
Dave Park
Dave Park
> On 6 Feb 2021, at 20:22, Jerry Rehn <rehn@rockisland.com> wrote:
>
> =EF=BBSome many years ago my filters also failed on taking off as engin
e went to full boost, backed off boost and engine ran fine, landed, changed f
ilters all ok. Replaced with a andair, never a problem since. I too regularl
y checked the original filters, probably some stuff still in fuel tank back t
hen.
> I check my andair frequently and very little in bowl and filter.
> JERRY
> Mono XS 914
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>>> On Feb 6, 2021, at 12:30 PM, Mike Christine Duane <DuaneFamly@aol.com> w
rote:
>>>
>> =EF=BBDuring my annual, I remove and clean these filters. I=99ve
never had a problem with them. Knock on wood!
>>
>> Mike Duane N377EA
>> Europa Conventional Gear
>> Chandler, AZ, USA
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>>> On Feb 6, 2021, at 9:10 AM, Michel AUVRAY <mau05160@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>> =EF=BB
>>> Hello David
>>> Yes I now this probl=C3=A8me 20 years ago, on 2001 I replace 2 originals
fuel filters by andair gascolator on my airplane FPFGT and 4 years after sa
mething on my son aircraft FPSLN it si perfect. We have both 912S
>>> Michel Auvray
>>>
>>>> Le sam. 6 f=C3=A9vr. 2021 =C3- 13:45, <davidjoyce@doctors.org.uk> a =C3
=A9crit :
>>>> I would be very grateful for any information anyone has on incidents ar
ising from blockage of the glass fuel filters supplied as Europa standard. P
lease reply to my personal email.
>>>>
>>>> Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ
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