Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:30 PM - Ethanol in fuel. What about Brazil? (JonathanMilbank)
2. 03:49 PM - Re: Ethanol in fuel. What about Brazil? (Steve Ivell)
3. 04:16 PM - Re: Ethanol in fuel. What about Brazil? (Pete Zut)
4. 04:26 PM - Re: Ethanol in fuel. What about Brazil? (Wladimir Kummer)
5. 06:34 PM - Grove Undercarriage for Conventional Tail Wheeled Europa (Kingsley Hurst)
6. 07:10 PM - Re: Grove Undercarriage for Conventional Tail Wheeled Europa (Bud Yerly)
7. 08:02 PM - Re: Europa Panel (David Glauser)
8. 08:35 PM - Re: Grove Undercarriage for Conventional Tail Wheeled Europa (Kingsley Hurst)
9. 11:26 PM - Charging Issues (Craig Sweenie)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Ethanol in fuel. What about Brazil? |
We in the UK are faced with the prospect of ethanol content in fuel being raised
in September from 5% to 10%. About 10 or so years ago (or was it longer?) this
whole subject got debated to death, with the LAA Light Aircraft Association
taking the position that we should always check each fuel batch for ethanol before
pouring it into our fuel tanks. The test using a glass test tube with about
1" of water in the bottom, noting its level, then adding about 4 X as much
fuel before shaking well and allowing to settle to see if the water level had
apparently risen, was not particularly accurate and I never saw the water level
rise.
The LAA's understandable position then was "If you find evidence of ethanol in
fuel, then don't use it!" This position is very unlikely to change, which will
mean that Rotax engines should either use avgas or UL91. For those of us living
in god-forsaken northern latitudes, neither of these fuels are available and
it would be economically prohibitive to either import them to our remote airfields
or to fly to the nearest large airport to refuel, while simultaneously
incurring landing fees and handling charges of 200!
Obviously (at least to me) Europas should cope with 10% ethanol in fuel, because
I believe that at least one, maybe more Europas in Brazil were using fuel with
ethanol having well in ecxess of 20%. Seemingly our "plastic" fuel tanks, automotive
fuel lines and carburettors are unfased by ethanol.
Please correct me if I'm wrong about Brazil and let me know whether ethanol is
to blame for any fuel tank failures in Europas. Thank you.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=501000#501000
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Ethanol in fuel. What about Brazil? |
Hi Jonathan
The Rotax engine is fine with ethanol, as you mention in Brazil. The engine
is designed for mogas and really doesn't like Avgas.
My feeling is that the LAA are living in the past and if it's not Avgas it'
s no good!! Well it's time to smell the coffee and get used to the here and
now. 10% ethanol is coming and I'll be using it.
It might mean changing the rubber more often but that's still much more aff
ordable than having to use Avgas.
Obviously just my humble opinion.
Cheers
Steve
GSTES
XS Trigear 912s..... nearly finished!!
________________________________
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server@matr
onics.com> on behalf of JonathanMilbank <jdmilbank@yahoo.co.uk>
Sent: Thursday, 18 March 2021, 21:35
Subject: Europa-List: Ethanol in fuel. What about Brazil?
>
We in the UK are faced with the prospect of ethanol content in fuel being r
aised in September from 5% to 10%. About 10 or so years ago (or was it long
er?) this whole subject got debated to death, with the LAA Light Aircraft A
ssociation taking the position that we should always check each fuel batch
for ethanol before pouring it into our fuel tanks. The test using a glass t
est tube with about 1" of water in the bottom, noting its level, then addin
g about 4 X as much fuel before shaking well and allowing to settle to see
if the water level had apparently risen, was not particularly accurate and
I never saw the water level rise.
The LAA's understandable position then was "If you find evidence of ethanol
in fuel, then don't use it!" This position is very unlikely to change, whi
ch will mean that Rotax engines should either use avgas or UL91. For those
of us living in god-forsaken northern latitudes, neither of these fuels are
available and it would be economically prohibitive to either import them t
o our remote airfields or to fly to the nearest large airport to refuel, wh
ile simultaneously incurring landing fees and handling charges of =C2=A3200
!
Obviously (at least to me) Europas should cope with 10% ethanol in fuel, be
cause I believe that at least one, maybe more Europas in Brazil were using
fuel with ethanol having well in ecxess of 20%. Seemingly our "plastic" fue
l tanks, automotive fuel lines and carburettors are unfased by ethanol.
Please correct me if I'm wrong about Brazil and let me know whether ethanol
is to blame for any fuel tank failures in Europas. Thank you.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=501000#501000
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Ethanol in fuel. What about Brazil? |
Ethanol (+ humidity) makes a mess of aluminum float bowls and jets
etc...... I've rebuilt many a mower with such damage, and the bings are of
the same materials fwiw.
Here is a good paper listing many an issue from a while ago:
https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1757-899X/370/1/012009/pdf
Cheers,
Pete
On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 6:01 PM Steve Ivell <SteveIvell@pestproof.co.uk>
wrote:
> Hi Jonathan
>
> The Rotax engine is fine with ethanol, as you mention in Brazil. The
> engine is designed for mogas and really doesn't like Avgas.
> My feeling is that the LAA are living in the past and if it's not Avgas
> it's no good!! Well it's time to smell the coffee and get used to the her
e
> and now. 10% ethanol is coming and I'll be using it.
> It might mean changing the rubber more often but that's still much more
> affordable than having to use Avgas.
> Obviously just my humble opinion.
>
> Cheers
> Steve
> GSTES
> XS Trigear 912s..... nearly finished!!
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <
> owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com> on behalf of JonathanMilbank <
> jdmilbank@yahoo.co.uk>
> *Sent:* Thursday, 18 March 2021, 21:35
> *To:* europa-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Europa-List: Ethanol in fuel. What about Brazil?
>
> jdmilbank@yahoo.co.uk>
>
> We in the UK are faced with the prospect of ethanol content in fuel being
> raised in September from 5% to 10%. About 10 or so years ago (or was it
> longer?) this whole subject got debated to death, with the LAA Light
> Aircraft Association taking the position that we should always check each
> fuel batch for ethanol before pouring it into our fuel tanks. The test
> using a glass test tube with about 1" of water in the bottom, noting its
> level, then adding about 4 X as much fuel before shaking well and allowin
g
> to settle to see if the water level had apparently risen, was not
> particularly accurate and I never saw the water level rise.
>
> The LAA's understandable position then was "If you find evidence of
> ethanol in fuel, then don't use it!" This position is very unlikely to
> change, which will mean that Rotax engines should either use avgas or UL9
1.
> For those of us living in god-forsaken northern latitudes, neither of the
se
> fuels are available and it would be economically prohibitive to either
> import them to our remote airfields or to fly to the nearest large airpor
t
> to refuel, while simultaneously incurring landing fees and handling charg
es
> of =C3=82=C2=A3200!
>
> Obviously (at least to me) Europas should cope with 10% ethanol in fuel,
> because I believe that at least one, maybe more Europas in Brazil were
> using fuel with ethanol having well in ecxess of 20%. Seemingly our
> "plastic" fuel tanks, automotive fuel lines and carburettors are unfased
by
> ethanol.
>
> Please correct me if I'm wrong about Brazil and let me know whether
> ethanol is to blame for any fuel tank failures in Europas. Thank you.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=501000#501000
>
>
> ==========
> st Email Forum -
> pa-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
> ==========
> p; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
> ums.matronics.com
> ==========
> p; - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
> matronics.com
> ==========
> p; - List Contribution Web Site -
> p; -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ==========
>
>
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Ethanol in fuel. What about Brazil? |
Hello all,
Our gasol in Brazil has about 25% ethanol for the premium blend, it is
measured as 103 RON which is roughly equivalent to Avgas 100LL. Indeed we
run Rotaxes (some small Lycs and Conts also) using it, the engines
run cleaner and cooler. However, composites fuel tanks must be watched for.
Usually the carbs must be adjusted for a richer mixture to compensate for
the ethanol content. Some use zinc based oil additives.
The EMBRAER in Brazil manufactures the Ipanema Ag plane which is flex fuel
(AvGas or Hydrated Ethanol - 85-90% ethanol, 10% water). Very
successful plane here, about 1400 manufactured and in use. The engine is
the old fashioned Lyc IO540. And yes Lycoming has teamed up with Embraer to
develop ethanol based aviation engines. Endurance is reduced about 30%
since ethanol has a lower energy density than Avgas, but it is
environmentally cleaner.
https://agricultural.embraer.com/br/pt/ipanema-203
Wlad
Em qui., 18 de mar. de 2021 =C3-s 19:52, Steve Ivell <
SteveIvell@pestproof.co.uk> escreveu:
> Hi Jonathan
>
> The Rotax engine is fine with ethanol, as you mention in Brazil. The
> engine is designed for mogas and really doesn't like Avgas.
> My feeling is that the LAA are living in the past and if it's not Avgas
> it's no good!! Well it's time to smell the coffee and get used to the her
e
> and now. 10% ethanol is coming and I'll be using it.
> It might mean changing the rubber more often but that's still much more
> affordable than having to use Avgas.
> Obviously just my humble opinion.
>
> Cheers
> Steve
> GSTES
> XS Trigear 912s..... nearly finished!!
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <
> owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com> on behalf of JonathanMilbank <
> jdmilbank@yahoo.co.uk>
> *Sent:* Thursday, 18 March 2021, 21:35
> *To:* europa-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Europa-List: Ethanol in fuel. What about Brazil?
>
> jdmilbank@yahoo.co.uk>
>
> We in the UK are faced with the prospect of ethanol content in fuel being
> raised in September from 5% to 10%. About 10 or so years ago (or was it
> longer?) this whole subject got debated to death, with the LAA Light
> Aircraft Association taking the position that we should always check each
> fuel batch for ethanol before pouring it into our fuel tanks. The test
> using a glass test tube with about 1" of water in the bottom, noting its
> level, then adding about 4 X as much fuel before shaking well and allowin
g
> to settle to see if the water level had apparently risen, was not
> particularly accurate and I never saw the water level rise.
>
> The LAA's understandable position then was "If you find evidence of
> ethanol in fuel, then don't use it!" This position is very unlikely to
> change, which will mean that Rotax engines should either use avgas or UL9
1.
> For those of us living in god-forsaken northern latitudes, neither of the
se
> fuels are available and it would be economically prohibitive to either
> import them to our remote airfields or to fly to the nearest large airpor
t
> to refuel, while simultaneously incurring landing fees and handling charg
es
> of =C3=82=C2=A3200!
>
> Obviously (at least to me) Europas should cope with 10% ethanol in fuel,
> because I believe that at least one, maybe more Europas in Brazil were
> using fuel with ethanol having well in ecxess of 20%. Seemingly our
> "plastic" fuel tanks, automotive fuel lines and carburettors are unfased
by
> ethanol.
>
> Please correct me if I'm wrong about Brazil and let me know whether
> ethanol is to blame for any fuel tank failures in Europas. Thank you.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=501000#501000
>
>
> ==========
> st Email Forum -
> pa-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
> ==========
> p; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
> ums.matronics.com
> ==========
> p; - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
> matronics.com
> ==========
> p; - List Contribution Web Site -
> p; -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ==========
>
>
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Grove Undercarriage for Conventional Tail Wheeled Europa |
I enquire on behalf of a friend who is contemplating purchasing a second
hand Classic Europa that is fitted with a Grove Aluminium (Aluminum)
undercarriage.
The purpose of this post is to establish who in the Europa fraternity
may have the same type of undercarriage and your thoughts on same please.
Regards
Kingsley in Oz.
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Grove Undercarriage for Conventional Tail Wheeled Europa |
Kingsley,
Mike Duane, Bill McClellan, and Richard Kundle, are flying with the Berube
conventional gear.
Best Regards,
Bud Yerly
Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg>
________________________________
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server@matr
onics.com> on behalf of Kingsley Hurst <kingsnjan@westnet.com.au>
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 9:34:06 PM
Subject: Europa-List: Grove Undercarriage for Conventional Tail Wheeled Eur
opa
>
I enquire on behalf of a friend who is contemplating purchasing a second
hand Classic Europa that is fitted with a Grove Aluminium (Aluminum)
undercarriage.
The purpose of this post is to establish who in the Europa fraternity
may have the same type of undercarriage and your thoughts on same please.
Regards
Kingsley in Oz.
%2Fwww.matronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C817b
82c510754e48883408d8ea77ce4f%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6
37517147571599788%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luM
zIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=tAyKtWj6KBcULKlNZO%2BU
u4MRCy8vjDPZD5AB%2F%2B%2BV7Vo%3D&reserved=0
%2Fforums.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C817b82c510754e48883408d8
ea77ce4f%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637517147571599788%7C
Unknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiL
CJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=161i8GIob82v4Xq7sVO88wm%2BlKdwzIPoaOmuY%2B
fkrKU%3D&reserved=0
%2Fwiki.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C817b82c510754e48883408d8ea
77ce4f%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637517147571599788%7CUn
known%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJ
XVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=wdu73A9NpTS%2FTDlpMxzfzI0sulSm7NJkrQB2550w3W
4%3D&reserved=0
%2Fwww.matronics.com%2Fcontribution&data=04%7C01%7C%7C817b82c510754e4
8883408d8ea77ce4f%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637517147571
599788%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6
Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=ZRSQOY%2FF6n7v6sZKkKxBa%2Fqt503ji
r77kT49%2Fi0uMp8%3D&reserved=0
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Europa Panel |
I missed the original message, but I do have an unused Europa panel for a
monowheel XS. Thing is, I'm in southern California, a long way from the UK.
dg
On Wed, Mar 17, 2021 at 11:31 AM Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>
> A Blank or one of the Europa ones already cut with the instrument holes
> for flight and engine?
>
> Alan
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On 17 Mar 2021, at 16:56, Patrick Tunney <p1tun@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> >
oo.co.uk>
> >
> > Hi i am looking for a mono panel if anyone has one available that they
> no longer need.
> >
> > Many Thanks
> >
> > Pat
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=500989#500989
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Grove Undercarriage for Conventional Tail Wheeled Europa |
Many thanks Bud.
Subsequent to your answering my post, I received an unrelated phone call
and by co-incidence was told that Bob Berube used a Grove
undercarriage. I was completely unaware of this so all is good now thanks.
Cheers
Kingsley
On 19.03.21 12:09 pm, Bud Yerly wrote:
> Kingsley,
> Mike Duane, Bill McClellan, and Richard Kundle, are flying with the
> Berube conventional gear.
>
> Best Regards,
> Bud Yerly
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Hi all,
I completed my 50 hours and a carb balance yesterday. Before the check I warmed
the engine with no issues; it was running a d operating well.
After the check, we rigged up the carb balancer using the aircraft battery to power
it. After start I noticed that the Alternator warning light remained on and
voltage was about 12.5. We disconnected the balancer and used an external battery
to power.
Issue remains. Raising the rpm to over 3000 would generally turn out the light
and the battery appeared to be charging again. Spent a few hours fault finding
but not sure Ive got to the bottom of it. All the wiring into the rectifier regulator
appears sound.
Any ideas what could be the issue?
Thanks in advance.
Craig
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|