Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:22 AM - Re: Airfoil Profiles (Area-51)
2. 01:01 AM - Re: Starter Diode (david park)
3. 01:31 AM - Re: Starter Diode (Alan Burrill)
4. 02:09 AM - Re: Starter Diode (david park)
5. 02:27 AM - XS Tail wheel assembly (flyingphil2)
6. 02:37 AM - Re: Starter Diode (Alan Burrill)
7. 02:42 AM - Re: Starter Diode (Kingsley Hurst)
8. 02:56 AM - Re: Starter Diode (Alan Burrill)
9. 03:30 AM - Re: Starter Diode (david park)
10. 04:03 AM - Re: Starter Diode (Kingsley Hurst)
11. 04:25 AM - Re: Starter Diode (Alan Burrill)
12. 04:55 AM - Re: Starter Diode (david park)
13. 04:07 PM - Re: XS Tail wheel assembly (Area-51)
14. 10:19 PM - Re: XS Tail wheel assembly (Fred Klein)
Message 1
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Subject: | Re: Airfoil Profiles |
What an awesome looking europa!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=502257#502257
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: Starter Diode |
Bud,
Still confused as Europa Manual wiring diagram shows Anode to Earth? Not swi
tch.
Regards
Dave Park
> On 7 Jun 2021, at 01:06, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>
> =EF=BB
> Dave,
> I didn't see anyone commented on your diode.
>
> Pretty much any diode will do. If you get it backwards, the saving grace i
s the start solenoid is looking for 12 volts. Of course, the solenoid must b
e grounded.
> Most mistakes are the ground is left off the solenoid when putting on the d
iode. Another problem is guys don=99t insulate the anode side of the d
iode and it shorts.
>
> The Rotax manual doesn't comment on the diode. But it is an accepted prac
tice to extend the life of the contacts in the starter solenoid. The Europa
Electrical Chapter 25 advises to use an IN5404 but any will do.
>
> IN5404
> silicone diode is shown above. Anode or plus side is on the starter switc
h tab and the cathode or negative goes to the ground bolt holding on the sta
rter solenoid. I use at least a #18 or 16 wire from the solenoid fastening b
olt to the main firewall ground.
>
> Best Regards,
> Bud Yerly
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server@mat
ronics.com> On Behalf Of david park
> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 2:44 PM
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Europa-List: Starter Diode
>
>
> I fitted a starter Diode and engine would not start. Orientation was as de
scribed with band end cathode on starter terminal and other end to earth?
> Have I got wrong diode.
> Any advice appreciated
>
> Dave Park G-LDVO
>
>
> - The Europa-List Email Forum -
> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fw
ww.matronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189a
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Message 3
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Subject: | Re: Starter Diode |
Are you sure the diode is not faulty?
You can check it with an meter set to read resistance. Should be high resist
ance one way and low the other.
Have you tried connecting it the other way round?
Alan
Sent from my iPad
> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:02, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>
> =EF=BBBud,
> Still confused as Europa Manual wiring diagram shows Anode to Earth? Not s
witch.
> Regards
> Dave Park
>
>
>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 01:06, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>>>
>> =EF=BB
>> Dave,
>> I didn't see anyone commented on your diode.
>>
>> Pretty much any diode will do. If you get it backwards, the saving grace
is the start solenoid is looking for 12 volts. Of course, the solenoid mus
t be grounded.
>> Most mistakes are the ground is left off the solenoid when putting on the
diode. Another problem is guys don=99t insulate the anode side of th
e diode and it shorts.
>>
>> The Rotax manual doesn't comment on the diode. But it is an accepted pra
ctice to extend the life of the contacts in the starter solenoid. The Europ
a Electrical Chapter 25 advises to use an IN5404 but any will do.
>>
>> IN5404
>> <image001.png>
>>
>> silicone diode is shown above. Anode or plus side is on the starter swit
ch tab and the cathode or negative goes to the ground bolt holding on the st
arter solenoid. I use at least a #18 or 16 wire from the solenoid fastening
bolt to the main firewall ground.
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Bud Yerly
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server@ma
tronics.com> On Behalf Of david park
>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 2:44 PM
>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Europa-List: Starter Diode
>>
>>
>> I fitted a starter Diode and engine would not start. Orientation was as d
escribed with band end cathode on starter terminal and other end to earth?
>> Have I got wrong diode.
>> Any advice appreciated
>>
>> Dave Park G-LDVO
>>
>>
>> - The Europa-List Email Forum -
>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fw
ww.matronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189a
f0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6375825
64812620700%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJB
TiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=d2yFiqBfE8TCD9qLmlbZwUHkZby9t6
u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0
>> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
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orums.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f
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Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUhMM%3D&a
mp;reserved=0
>> - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
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iki.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c
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7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn
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eserved=0
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>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fw
ww.matronics.com%2Fcontribution&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b61755
08d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692
%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWw
iLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2F4PsRd1psVqvnaU7%2FNqFY9pTbwXM%2FA4XO38
X5pjT4sc%3D&reserved=0
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>>
>>
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: Starter Diode |
Allan have you put ANODE to switch contact?
Dave Park
> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:35, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>
> =EF=BBAre you sure the diode is not faulty?
>
> You can check it with an meter set to read resistance. Should be high resi
stance one way and low the other.
>
> Have you tried connecting it the other way round?
>
> Alan
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:02, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>
>> =EF=BBBud,
>> Still confused as Europa Manual wiring diagram shows Anode to Earth? Not s
witch.
>> Regards
>> Dave Park
>>
>>
>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 01:06, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>> =EF=BB
>>> Dave,
>>> I didn't see anyone commented on your diode.
>>>
>>> Pretty much any diode will do. If you get it backwards, the saving grac
e is the start solenoid is looking for 12 volts. Of course, the solenoid mu
st be grounded.
>>> Most mistakes are the ground is left off the solenoid when putting on th
e diode. Another problem is guys don=99t insulate the anode side of t
he diode and it shorts.
>>>
>>> The Rotax manual doesn't comment on the diode. But it is an accepted pr
actice to extend the life of the contacts in the starter solenoid. The Euro
pa Electrical Chapter 25 advises to use an IN5404 but any will do.
>>>
>>> IN5404
>>> <image001.png>
>>>
>>> silicone diode is shown above. Anode or plus side is on the starter swi
tch tab and the cathode or negative goes to the ground bolt holding on the s
tarter solenoid. I use at least a #18 or 16 wire from the solenoid fastenin
g bolt to the main firewall ground.
>>>
>>> Best Regards,
>>> Bud Yerly
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server@m
atronics.com> On Behalf Of david park
>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 2:44 PM
>>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>>> Subject: Europa-List: Starter Diode
>>>
>>>
>>> I fitted a starter Diode and engine would not start. Orientation was as d
escribed with band end cathode on starter terminal and other end to earth?
>>> Have I got wrong diode.
>>> Any advice appreciated
>>>
>>> Dave Park G-LDVO
>>>
>>>
>>> - The Europa-List Email Forum -
>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
Fwww.matronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a18
9af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C63758
2564812620700%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLC
JBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=d2yFiqBfE8TCD9qLmlbZwUHkZby9
t6u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0
>>> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
Fforums.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f
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own%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVC
I6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUhMM%3D
&reserved=0
>>> - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
Fwiki.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f
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n%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6
Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=o8qJjaCYZwDfnYZL5ZTUYwVjcHuo0CD7LEX42XsDfhY%3D&
;reserved=0
>>> - List Contribution Web Site -
>>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2
Fwww.matronics.com%2Fcontribution&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b617
5508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6375825648126306
92%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1ha
WwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2F4PsRd1psVqvnaU7%2FNqFY9pTbwXM%2FA4XO
38X5pjT4sc%3D&reserved=0
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Message 5
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Subject: | XS Tail wheel assembly |
Hi,
I'm looking for all the parts to make a complete XS tailwheel assembly.
I ideally want new, unused parts - does anyone have any bits lying around that
they'd like to sell?
Thanks,
Phil
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=502262#502262
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Starter Diode |
I=99m asking if you did it by accident, I know what happens=F0=9F=98
Alan
Sent from my iPad
> On 7 Jun 2021, at 10:11, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>
> =EF=BBAllan have you put ANODE to switch contact?
>
> Dave Park
>
>
>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:35, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>>>
>> =EF=BBAre you sure the diode is not faulty?
>>
>> You can check it with an meter set to read resistance. Should be high res
istance one way and low the other.
>>
>> Have you tried connecting it the other way round?
>>
>> Alan
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:02, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>> =EF=BBBud,
>>> Still confused as Europa Manual wiring diagram shows Anode to Earth? Not
switch.
>>> Regards
>>> Dave Park
>>>
>>>
>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 01:06, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>> =EF=BB
>>>> Dave,
>>>> I didn't see anyone commented on your diode.
>>>>
>>>> Pretty much any diode will do. If you get it backwards, the saving gra
ce is the start solenoid is looking for 12 volts. Of course, the solenoid m
ust be grounded.
>>>> Most mistakes are the ground is left off the solenoid when putting on t
he diode. Another problem is guys don=99t insulate the anode side of t
he diode and it shorts.
>>>>
>>>> The Rotax manual doesn't comment on the diode. But it is an accepted p
ractice to extend the life of the contacts in the starter solenoid. The Eur
opa Electrical Chapter 25 advises to use an IN5404 but any will do.
>>>>
>>>> IN5404
>>>> <image001.png>
>>>>
>>>> silicone diode is shown above. Anode or plus side is on the starter sw
itch tab and the cathode or negative goes to the ground bolt holding on the s
tarter solenoid. I use at least a #18 or 16 wire from the solenoid fastenin
g bolt to the main firewall ground.
>>>>
>>>> Best Regards,
>>>> Bud Yerly
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server@
matronics.com> On Behalf Of david park
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 2:44 PM
>>>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>>>> Subject: Europa-List: Starter Diode
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I fitted a starter Diode and engine would not start. Orientation was as
described with band end cathode on starter terminal and other end to earth?
>>>> Have I got wrong diode.
>>>> Any advice appreciated
>>>>
>>>> Dave Park G-LDVO
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> - The Europa-List Email Forum -
>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fwww.matronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a1
89af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6375
82564812620700%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiL
CJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=d2yFiqBfE8TCD9qLmlbZwUHkZby
9t6u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0
>>>> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fforums.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925
f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnk
nown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXV
CI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUhMM%3
D&reserved=0
>>>> - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
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2Fwiki.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6
f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnkno
wn%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI
6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=o8qJjaCYZwDfnYZL5ZTUYwVjcHuo0CD7LEX42XsDfhY%3D&am
p;reserved=0
>>>> - List Contribution Web Site -
>>>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fwww.matronics.com%2Fcontribution&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b61
75508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630
692%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1h
aWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2F4PsRd1psVqvnaU7%2FNqFY9pTbwXM%2FA4X
O38X5pjT4sc%3D&reserved=0
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: Starter Diode |
Hello Dave,
I haven=99t got your previous posts in front of me but I assume you wa
nt to put the diode across the starter solenoid.
If my assumption is correct, you should connect the anode to the starter mot
or side of the starter solenoid and the cathode to the positive (starter swi
tch) side of the solenoid.
If you have had it connected the other way around and tried starting the eng
ine, the diode would have been forward biased trying to carry the full curre
nt of the starter motor and more than likely will be ruined.
Either check the diode with a multi meter ( on ohms scale) to ensure it cond
ucts in one direction but not the other or use a new diode.
When connected correctly, on pressing the starter button (or key switch), th
e diode is reverse biased and has no effect..... all the current passes thro
ugh the solenoid. On releasing the starter button (or key switch), the coll
apsing magnetic field in the starter solenoid tries to induce a high voltage
spike but this is swamped by the diode because the diode short circuits the
current induced by the collapsing magnetic field in the coil.
Hope this hasn=99t made it more confusing for you. I could and probab
ly should have just said ..... connect it like the manual says.
Best regards
Kingsley in Oz.
Sent from my iPhone
> On 7 Jun 2021, at 7:17 pm, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>
> =EF=BBAllan have you put ANODE to switch contact?
>
> Dave Park
>
>
>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:35, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>>>
>> =EF=BBAre you sure the diode is not faulty?
>>
>> You can check it with an meter set to read resistance. Should be high res
istance one way and low the other.
>>
>> Have you tried connecting it the other way round?
>>
>> Alan
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:02, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>> =EF=BBBud,
>>> Still confused as Europa Manual wiring diagram shows Anode to Earth? Not
switch.
>>> Regards
>>> Dave Park
>>>
>>>
>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 01:06, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>> =EF=BB
>>>> Dave,
>>>> I didn't see anyone commented on your diode.
>>>>
>>>> Pretty much any diode will do. If you get it backwards, the saving gra
ce is the start solenoid is looking for 12 volts. Of course, the solenoid m
ust be grounded.
>>>> Most mistakes are the ground is left off the solenoid when putting on t
he diode. Another problem is guys don=99t insulate the anode side of t
he diode and it shorts.
>>>>
>>>> The Rotax manual doesn't comment on the diode. But it is an accepted p
ractice to extend the life of the contacts in the starter solenoid. The Eur
opa Electrical Chapter 25 advises to use an IN5404 but any will do.
>>>>
>>>> IN5404
>>>> <image001.png>
>>>>
>>>> silicone diode is shown above. Anode or plus side is on the starter sw
itch tab and the cathode or negative goes to the ground bolt holding on the s
tarter solenoid. I use at least a #18 or 16 wire from the solenoid fastenin
g bolt to the main firewall ground.
>>>>
>>>> Best Regards,
>>>> Bud Yerly
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server@
matronics.com> On Behalf Of david park
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 2:44 PM
>>>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>>>> Subject: Europa-List: Starter Diode
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I fitted a starter Diode and engine would not start. Orientation was as
described with band end cathode on starter terminal and other end to earth?
>>>> Have I got wrong diode.
>>>> Any advice appreciated
>>>>
>>>> Dave Park G-LDVO
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> - The Europa-List Email Forum -
>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fwww.matronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a1
89af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6375
82564812620700%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiL
CJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=d2yFiqBfE8TCD9qLmlbZwUHkZby
9t6u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0
>>>> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fforums.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925
f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnk
nown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXV
CI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUhMM%3
D&reserved=0
>>>> - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fwiki.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6
f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnkno
wn%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI
6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=o8qJjaCYZwDfnYZL5ZTUYwVjcHuo0CD7LEX42XsDfhY%3D&am
p;reserved=0
>>>> - List Contribution Web Site -
>>>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fwww.matronics.com%2Fcontribution&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b61
75508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630
692%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1h
aWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2F4PsRd1psVqvnaU7%2FNqFY9pTbwXM%2FA4X
O38X5pjT4sc%3D&reserved=0
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
Message 8
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|
Subject: | Re: Starter Diode |
The diode is connected across the starter solenoid coil not the contacts for
the starter motor as per the extract from the build manual above. There is n
o diode across the starter motor shown in the build manual diagram, at least
not my version.
With 12v positive on the starter contacter coil the diode, with the cathode o
r marked end of the diode connected to positive terminal of the starter coil
, is reverse biased and so will not conduct. When the starter button release
the falling emf, magnetic field, produces an opposite voltage in the coil a
nd can spark across the starter switch contacts eventually damaging the cont
acts, the diode shorts out this so the spark does not happen.
If the diode is shorted out, or the wrong way round, then solenoid will not w
ork, assuming the solenoid will operate without diode connected as a test to
ensure it=99s the wiring of the diode that=99s the problem of c
ourse.
Isn=99t explaining electrical problems by email fun
.=F0=9F=A4=A9
Alan
Sent from my iPad
> On 7 Jun 2021, at 10:44, Kingsley Hurst <kingsnjan@westnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> =EF=BBHello Dave,
>
> I haven=99t got your previous posts in front of me but I assume you w
ant to put the diode across the starter solenoid.
>
> If my assumption is correct, you should connect the anode to the starter m
otor side of the starter solenoid and the cathode to the positive (starter s
witch) side of the solenoid.
>
> If you have had it connected the other way around and tried starting the e
ngine, the diode would have been forward biased trying to carry the full cur
rent of the starter motor and more than likely will be ruined.
>
> Either check the diode with a multi meter ( on ohms scale) to ensure it co
nducts in one direction but not the other or use a new diode.
>
> When connected correctly, on pressing the starter button (or key switch), t
he diode is reverse biased and has no effect..... all the current passes thr
ough the solenoid. On releasing the starter button (or key switch), the col
lapsing magnetic field in the starter solenoid tries to induce a high voltag
e spike but this is swamped by the diode because the diode short circuits th
e current induced by the collapsing magnetic field in the coil.
>
> Hope this hasn=99t made it more confusing for you. I could and prob
ably should have just said ..... connect it like the manual says.
>
> Best regards
> Kingsley in Oz.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 7:17 pm, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>
>> =EF=BBAllan have you put ANODE to switch contact?
>>
>> Dave Park
>>
>>
>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:35, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>> =EF=BBAre you sure the diode is not faulty?
>>>
>>> You can check it with an meter set to read resistance. Should be high re
sistance one way and low the other.
>>>
>>> Have you tried connecting it the other way round?
>>>
>>> Alan
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:02, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>> =EF=BBBud,
>>>> Still confused as Europa Manual wiring diagram shows Anode to Earth? No
t switch.
>>>> Regards
>>>> Dave Park
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 01:06, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>> =EF=BB
>>>>> Dave,
>>>>> I didn't see anyone commented on your diode.
>>>>>
>>>>> Pretty much any diode will do. If you get it backwards, the saving gr
ace is the start solenoid is looking for 12 volts. Of course, the solenoid m
ust be grounded.
>>>>> Most mistakes are the ground is left off the solenoid when putting on t
he diode. Another problem is guys don=99t insulate the anode side of t
he diode and it shorts.
>>>>>
>>>>> The Rotax manual doesn't comment on the diode. But it is an accepted p
ractice to extend the life of the contacts in the starter solenoid. The Eur
opa Electrical Chapter 25 advises to use an IN5404 but any will do.
>>>>>
>>>>> IN5404
>>>>> <image001.png>
>>>>>
>>>>> silicone diode is shown above. Anode or plus side is on the starter s
witch tab and the cathode or negative goes to the ground bolt holding on the
starter solenoid. I use at least a #18 or 16 wire from the solenoid fasten
ing bolt to the main firewall ground.
>>>>>
>>>>> Best Regards,
>>>>> Bud Yerly
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server
@matronics.com> On Behalf Of david park
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 2:44 PM
>>>>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>>>>> Subject: Europa-List: Starter Diode
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I fitted a starter Diode and engine would not start. Orientation was a
s described with band end cathode on starter terminal and other end to earth
?
>>>>> Have I got wrong diode.
>>>>> Any advice appreciated
>>>>>
>>>>> Dave Park G-LDVO
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> - The Europa-List Email Forum -
>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fwww.matronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a1
89af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6375
82564812620700%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiL
CJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=d2yFiqBfE8TCD9qLmlbZwUHkZby
9t6u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0
>>>>> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fforums.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925
f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnk
nown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXV
CI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUhMM%3
D&reserved=0
>>>>> - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fwiki.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6
f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnkno
wn%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI
6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=o8qJjaCYZwDfnYZL5ZTUYwVjcHuo0CD7LEX42XsDfhY%3D&am
p;reserved=0
>>>>> - List Contribution Web Site -
>>>>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%
2Fwww.matronics.com%2Fcontribution&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b61
75508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630
692%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1h
aWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2F4PsRd1psVqvnaU7%2FNqFY9pTbwXM%2FA4X
O38X5pjT4sc%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
Message 9
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|
Subject: | Re: Starter Diode |
Thanks everyone, happy now=F0=9F=98=84=F0=9F=98=84=F0=9F=98=84
Dave Park
> On 7 Jun 2021, at 11:00, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>
> =EF=BB
>
> The diode is connected across the starter solenoid coil not the contacts f
or the starter motor as per the extract from the build manual above. There i
s no diode across the starter motor shown in the build manual diagram, at le
ast not my version.
>
> With 12v positive on the starter contacter coil the diode, with the cathod
e or marked end of the diode connected to positive terminal of the starter c
oil, is reverse biased and so will not conduct. When the starter button rele
ase the falling emf, magnetic field, produces an opposite voltage in the coi
l and can spark across the starter switch contacts eventually damaging the c
ontacts, the diode shorts out this so the spark does not happen.
>
> If the diode is shorted out, or the wrong way round, then solenoid will no
t work, assuming the solenoid will operate without diode connected as a test
to ensure it=99s the wiring of the diode that=99s the problem o
f course.
>
> Isn=99t explaining electrical problems by email fun
.=F0=9F=A4=A9
>
> Alan
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 10:44, Kingsley Hurst <kingsnjan@westnet.com.au> wrote
:
>>>
>> =EF=BBHello Dave,
>>
>> I haven=99t got your previous posts in front of me but I assume you
want to put the diode across the starter solenoid.
>>
>> If my assumption is correct, you should connect the anode to the starter m
otor side of the starter solenoid and the cathode to the positive (starter s
witch) side of the solenoid.
>>
>> If you have had it connected the other way around and tried starting the e
ngine, the diode would have been forward biased trying to carry the full cur
rent of the starter motor and more than likely will be ruined.
>>
>> Either check the diode with a multi meter ( on ohms scale) to ensure it c
onducts in one direction but not the other or use a new diode.
>>
>> When connected correctly, on pressing the starter button (or key switch),
the diode is reverse biased and has no effect..... all the current passes t
hrough the solenoid. On releasing the starter button (or key switch), the c
ollapsing magnetic field in the starter solenoid tries to induce a high volt
age spike but this is swamped by the diode because the diode short circuits t
he current induced by the collapsing magnetic field in the coil.
>>
>> Hope this hasn=99t made it more confusing for you. I could and pro
bably should have just said ..... connect it like the manual says.
>>
>> Best regards
>> Kingsley in Oz.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 7:17 pm, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>> =EF=BBAllan have you put ANODE to switch contact?
>>>
>>> Dave Park
>>>
>>>
>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:35, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>> =EF=BBAre you sure the diode is not faulty?
>>>>
>>>> You can check it with an meter set to read resistance. Should be high r
esistance one way and low the other.
>>>>
>>>> Have you tried connecting it the other way round?
>>>>
>>>> Alan
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>
>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:02, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>> =EF=BBBud,
>>>>> Still confused as Europa Manual wiring diagram shows Anode to Earth? N
ot switch.
>>>>> Regards
>>>>> Dave Park
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 01:06, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> =EF=BB
>>>>>> Dave,
>>>>>> I didn't see anyone commented on your diode.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Pretty much any diode will do. If you get it backwards, the saving g
race is the start solenoid is looking for 12 volts. Of course, the solenoid
must be grounded.
>>>>>> Most mistakes are the ground is left off the solenoid when putting on
the diode. Another problem is guys don=99t insulate the anode side o
f the diode and it shorts.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Rotax manual doesn't comment on the diode. But it is an accepted
practice to extend the life of the contacts in the starter solenoid. The E
uropa Electrical Chapter 25 advises to use an IN5404 but any will do.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> IN5404
>>>>>> <image001.png>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> silicone diode is shown above. Anode or plus side is on the starter s
witch tab and the cathode or negative goes to the ground bolt holding on the
starter solenoid. I use at least a #18 or 16 wire from the solenoid fasten
ing bolt to the main firewall ground.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best Regards,
>>>>>> Bud Yerly
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-serve
r@matronics.com> On Behalf Of david park
>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 2:44 PM
>>>>>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>>>>>> Subject: Europa-List: Starter Diode
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I fitted a starter Diode and engine would not start. Orientation was a
s described with band end cathode on starter terminal and other end to earth
?
>>>>>> Have I got wrong diode.
>>>>>> Any advice appreciated
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dave Park G-LDVO
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - The Europa-List Email Forum -
>>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2
F%2Fwww.matronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756
a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C63
7582564812620700%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzI
iLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=d2yFiqBfE8TCD9qLmlbZwUHkZ
by9t6u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
>>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2
F%2Fforums.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d9
25f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CU
nknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJ
XVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUhMM
%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>> - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
>>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2
F%2Fwiki.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925
f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnk
nown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXV
CI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=o8qJjaCYZwDfnYZL5ZTUYwVjcHuo0CD7LEX42XsDfhY%3D&
amp;reserved=0
>>>>>> - List Contribution Web Site -
>>>>>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2
F%2Fwww.matronics.com%2Fcontribution&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b
6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6375825648126
30692%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik
1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2F4PsRd1psVqvnaU7%2FNqFY9pTbwXM%2FA
4XO38X5pjT4sc%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
Message 10
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|
Subject: | Re: Starter Diode |
=EF=BBHello Alan,
I wasn=99t intending to infer the diode should be across the starter m
otor as I clearly said starter solenoid in my opening paragraph.
Without digging a deeper hole for myself, I offer no excuses for the errors i
n my posting other than to say my brain was obviously not engaged properly a
fter 8 hrs of driving today.
Please accept my apology (and you too Dave) for my misdemeanour.
Regards
Kingsley.
Sent from my iPhone
> On 7 Jun 2021, at 8:19 pm, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
> =EF=BB
> <image0.jpeg>
>
> The diode is connected across the starter solenoid coil not the contacts f
or the starter motor as per the extract from the build manual above. There i
s no diode across the starter motor shown in the build manual diagram, at le
ast not my version.
>
> With 12v positive on the starter contacter coil the diode, with the cathod
e or marked end of the diode connected to positive terminal of the starter c
oil, is reverse biased and so will not conduct. When the starter button rele
ase the falling emf, magnetic field, produces an opposite voltage in the coi
l and can spark across the starter switch contacts eventually damaging the c
ontacts, the diode shorts out this so the spark does not happen.
>
> If the diode is shorted out, or the wrong way round, then solenoid will no
t work, assuming the solenoid will operate without diode connected as a test
to ensure it=99s the wiring of the diode that=99s the problem o
f course.
>
> Isn=99t explaining electrical problems by email fun
.=F0=9F=A4=A9
>
> Alan
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 10:44, Kingsley Hurst <kingsnjan@westnet.com.au> wrote:
>> =EF=BBHello Dave,
>>
>> I haven=99t got your previous posts in front of me but I assume you
want to put the diode across the starter solenoid.
>>
>> If my assumption is correct, you should connect the anode to the starter m
otor side of the starter solenoid and the cathode to the positive (starter s
witch) side of the solenoid.
>>
>> If you have had it connected the other way around and tried starting the e
ngine, the diode would have been forward biased trying to carry the full cur
rent of the starter motor and more than likely will be ruined.
>>
>> Either check the diode with a multi meter ( on ohms scale) to ensure it c
onducts in one direction but not the other or use a new diode.
>>
>> When connected correctly, on pressing the starter button (or key switch),
the diode is reverse biased and has no effect..... all the current passes t
hrough the solenoid. On releasing the starter button (or key switch), the c
ollapsing magnetic field in the starter solenoid tries to induce a high volt
age spike but this is swamped by the diode because the diode short circuits t
he current induced by the collapsing magnetic field in the coil.
>>
>> Hope this hasn=99t made it more confusing for you. I could and pro
bably should have just said ..... connect it like the manual says.
>>
>> Best regards
>> Kingsley in Oz.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 7:17 pm, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>> =EF=BBAllan have you put ANODE to switch contact?
>>>
>>> Dave Park
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:35, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> =EF=BBAre you sure the diode is not faulty?
>>>>
>>>> You can check it with an meter set to read resistance. Should be high r
esistance one way and low the other.
>>>>
>>>> Have you tried connecting it the other way round?
>>>>
>>>> Alan
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>
>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:02, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>> =EF=BBBud,
>>>>> Still confused as Europa Manual wiring diagram shows Anode to Earth? N
ot switch.
>>>>> Regards
>>>>> Dave Park
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 01:06, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>>>>>> =EF=BB
>>>>>> Dave,
>>>>>> I didn't see anyone commented on your diode.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Pretty much any diode will do. If you get it backwards, the saving g
race is the start solenoid is looking for 12 volts. Of course, the solenoid
must be grounded.
>>>>>> Most mistakes are the ground is left off the solenoid when putting on
the diode. Another problem is guys don=99t insulate the anode side o
f the diode and it shorts.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Rotax manual doesn't comment on the diode. But it is an accepted
practice to extend the life of the contacts in the starter solenoid. The E
uropa Electrical Chapter 25 advises to use an IN5404 but any will do.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> IN5404
>>>>>> <image001.png>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> silicone diode is shown above. Anode or plus side is on the starter s
witch tab and the cathode or negative goes to the ground bolt holding on the
starter solenoid. I use at least a #18 or 16 wire from the solenoid fasten
ing bolt to the main firewall ground.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best Regards,
>>>>>> Bud Yerly
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-serve
r@matronics.com> On Behalf Of david park
>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 2:44 PM
>>>>>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>>>>>> Subject: Europa-List: Starter Diode
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I fitted a starter Diode and engine would not start. Orientation was a
s described with band end cathode on starter terminal and other end to earth
?
>>>>>> Have I got wrong diode.
>>>>>> Any advice appreciated
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dave Park G-LDVO
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - The Europa-List Email Forum -
>>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2
F%2Fwww.matronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756
a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C63
7582564812620700%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzI
iLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=d2yFiqBfE8TCD9qLmlbZwUHkZ
by9t6u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
>>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2
F%2Fforums.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d9
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nknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJ
XVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUhMM
%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>> - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
>>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2
F%2Fwiki.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925
f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnk
nown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXV
CI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=o8qJjaCYZwDfnYZL5ZTUYwVjcHuo0CD7LEX42XsDfhY%3D&
amp;reserved=0
>>>>>> - List Contribution Web Site -
>>>>>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2
F%2Fwww.matronics.com%2Fcontribution&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b
6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6375825648126
30692%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik
1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2F4PsRd1psVqvnaU7%2FNqFY9pTbwXM%2FA
4XO38X5pjT4sc%3D&reserved=0
Message 11
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|
Subject: | Re: Starter Diode |
Kingsley, no problem here and I was just ensuring with the diagram that
everyone contributing had access to the same info.
I think Dave has indicated he has the answer - he might even share what
was causing the problem. =F0=9F=98
Alan
> On 7 Jun 2021, at 12:02, Kingsley Hurst <kingsnjan@westnet.com.au>
wrote:
>
> =EF=BBHello Alan,
>
> I wasn=99t intending to infer the diode should be across the
starter motor as I clearly said starter solenoid in my opening
paragraph.
>
> Without digging a deeper hole for myself, I offer no excuses for the
errors in my posting other than to say my brain was obviously not
engaged properly after 8 hrs of driving today.
>
> Please accept my apology (and you too Dave) for my misdemeanour.
>
> Regards
> Kingsley.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 8:19 pm, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk
<mailto:alanb@dpy01.co.uk>> wrote:
>>
>> =EF=BB
>> <image0.jpeg>
>>
>> The diode is connected across the starter solenoid coil not the
contacts for the starter motor as per the extract from the build manual
above. There is no diode across the starter motor shown in the build
manual diagram, at least not my version.
>>
>> With 12v positive on the starter contacter coil the diode, with the
cathode or marked end of the diode connected to positive terminal of the
starter coil, is reverse biased and so will not conduct. When the
starter button release the falling emf, magnetic field, produces an
opposite voltage in the coil and can spark across the starter switch
contacts eventually damaging the contacts, the diode shorts out this so
the spark does not happen.
>>
>> If the diode is shorted out, or the wrong way round, then solenoid
will not work, assuming the solenoid will operate without diode
connected as a test to ensure it=99s the wiring of the diode
that=99s the problem of course.
>>
>> Isn=99t explaining electrical problems by email
fun.=F0=9F=A4=A9
>>
>> Alan
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 10:44, Kingsley Hurst <kingsnjan@westnet.com.au>
wrote:
>>>
>>> =EF=BBHello Dave,
>>>
>>> I haven=99t got your previous posts in front of me but I
assume you want to put the diode across the starter solenoid.
>>>
>>> If my assumption is correct, you should connect the anode to the
starter motor side of the starter solenoid and the cathode to the
positive (starter switch) side of the solenoid.
>>>
>>> If you have had it connected the other way around and tried starting
the engine, the diode would have been forward biased trying to carry the
full current of the starter motor and more than likely will be ruined.
>>>
>>> Either check the diode with a multi meter ( on ohms scale) to ensure
it conducts in one direction but not the other or use a new diode.
>>>
>>> When connected correctly, on pressing the starter button (or key
switch), the diode is reverse biased and has no effect..... all the
current passes through the solenoid. On releasing the starter button
(or key switch), the collapsing magnetic field in the starter solenoid
tries to induce a high voltage spike but this is swamped by the diode
because the diode short circuits the current induced by the collapsing
magnetic field in the coil.
>>>
>>> Hope this hasn=99t made it more confusing for you. I could
and probably should have just said ..... connect it like the manual
says.
>>>
>>> Best regards
>>> Kingsley in Oz.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 7:17 pm, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> =EF=BBAllan have you put ANODE to switch contact?
>>>>
>>>> Dave Park
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:35, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> =EF=BBAre you sure the diode is not faulty?
>>>>>
>>>>> You can check it with an meter set to read resistance. Should be
high resistance one way and low the other.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you tried connecting it the other way round?
>>>>>
>>>>> Alan
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:02, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> =EF=BBBud,
>>>>>> Still confused as Europa Manual wiring diagram shows Anode to
Earth? Not switch.
>>>>>> Regards
>>>>>> Dave Park
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 01:06, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> =EF=BB
>>>>>>> Dave,
>>>>>>> I didn't see anyone commented on your diode.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Pretty much any diode will do. If you get it backwards, the
saving grace is the start solenoid is looking for 12 volts. Of course,
the solenoid must be grounded.
>>>>>>> Most mistakes are the ground is left off the solenoid when
putting on the diode. Another problem is guys don=99t insulate
the anode side of the diode and it shorts.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Rotax manual doesn't comment on the diode. But it is an
accepted practice to extend the life of the contacts in the starter
solenoid. The Europa Electrical Chapter 25 advises to use an IN5404
but any will do.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> IN5404
>>>>>>> <image001.png>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> silicone diode is shown above. Anode or plus side is on the
starter switch tab and the cathode or negative goes to the ground bolt
holding on the starter solenoid. I use at least a #18 or 16 wire from
the solenoid fastening bolt to the main firewall ground.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best Regards,
>>>>>>> Bud Yerly
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
<owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com> On Behalf Of david park
>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 2:44 PM
>>>>>>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>>>>>>> Subject: Europa-List: Starter Diode
>>>>>>>
<mailto:dpark748@me.com>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I fitted a starter Diode and engine would not start. Orientation
was as described with band end cathode on starter terminal and other end
to earth?
>>>>>>> Have I got wrong diode.
>>>>>>> Any advice appreciated
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dave Park G-LDVO
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - The Europa-List Email Forum -
>>>>>>> -->
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.matr
onics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42
b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6375825648
12620700%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBT
iI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=d2yFiqBfE8TCD9qLmlbZwUHkZby9t
6u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0
<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mat
ronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d4
2b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564
812620700%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJB
TiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=d2yFiqBfE8TCD9qLmlbZwUHkZby9
t6u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0>
>>>>>>> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
>>>>>>> -->
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fforums.m
atronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7
C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnknown%7
CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6M
n0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUhMM%3D&
amp;reserved=0
<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fforums.
matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%
7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnknown%
7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6
Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUhMM%3D
&reserved=0>
>>>>>>> - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
>>>>>>> -->
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwiki.mat
ronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C8
4df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnknown%7CT
WFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0
%3D%7C1000&sdata=o8qJjaCYZwDfnYZL5ZTUYwVjcHuo0CD7LEX42XsDfhY%3D&
reserved=0
<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwiki.ma
tronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C
84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnknown%7C
TWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn
0%3D%7C1000&sdata=o8qJjaCYZwDfnYZL5ZTUYwVjcHuo0CD7LEX42XsDfhY%3D&
;reserved=0>
>>>>>>> - List Contribution Web Site -
>>>>>>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>>>>>>> -->
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.matr
onics.com%2Fcontribution&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d92
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38X5pjT4sc%3D&reserved=0>
Message 12
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|
Subject: | Re: Starter Diode |
Ptroblem started while rewiring a new panel and engine would not start due t
o a different problem. When looking to replace diode I got confused with dif
fering advice and written instructions, but was sure it should be as diagra
m.
All good now ready for continental adventures again??
Regards
Dave Park
> On 7 Jun 2021, at 12:29, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>
> =EF=BBKingsley, no problem here and I was just ensuring with the diagra
m that everyone contributing had access to the same info.
>
> I think Dave has indicated he has the answer - he might even share what wa
s causing the problem. =F0=9F=98
>
> Alan
>
>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 12:02, Kingsley Hurst <kingsnjan@westnet.com.au> wrote:
>>
>> =EF=BBHello Alan,
>>
>> I wasn=99t intending to infer the diode should be across the starte
r motor as I clearly said starter solenoid in my opening paragraph.
>>
>> Without digging a deeper hole for myself, I offer no excuses for the erro
rs in my posting other than to say my brain was obviously not engaged proper
ly after 8 hrs of driving today.
>>
>> Please accept my apology (and you too Dave) for my misdemeanour.
>>
>> Regards
>> Kingsley.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 8:19 pm, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>> =EF=BB
>>> <image0.jpeg>
>>>
>>> The diode is connected across the starter solenoid coil not the contacts
for the starter motor as per the extract from the build manual above. There
is no diode across the starter motor shown in the build manual diagram, at l
east not my version.
>>>
>>> With 12v positive on the starter contacter coil the diode, with the cath
ode or marked end of the diode connected to positive terminal of the starter
coil, is reverse biased and so will not conduct. When the starter button re
lease the falling emf, magnetic field, produces an opposite voltage in the c
oil and can spark across the starter switch contacts eventually damaging the
contacts, the diode shorts out this so the spark does not happen.
>>>
>>> If the diode is shorted out, or the wrong way round, then solenoid will n
ot work, assuming the solenoid will operate without diode connected as a tes
t to ensure it=99s the wiring of the diode that=99s the problem o
f course.
>>>
>>> Isn=99t explaining electrical problems by email fun
.=F0=9F=A4=A9
>>>
>>> Alan
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 10:44, Kingsley Hurst <kingsnjan@westnet.com.au> wro
te:
>>>>>
>>>> =EF=BBHello Dave,
>>>>
>>>> I haven=99t got your previous posts in front of me but I assume y
ou want to put the diode across the starter solenoid.
>>>>
>>>> If my assumption is correct, you should connect the anode to the starte
r motor side of the starter solenoid and the cathode to the positive (starte
r switch) side of the solenoid.
>>>>
>>>> If you have had it connected the other way around and tried starting th
e engine, the diode would have been forward biased trying to carry the full c
urrent of the starter motor and more than likely will be ruined.
>>>>
>>>> Either check the diode with a multi meter ( on ohms scale) to ensure it
conducts in one direction but not the other or use a new diode.
>>>>
>>>> When connected correctly, on pressing the starter button (or key switch
), the diode is reverse biased and has no effect..... all the current passes
through the solenoid. On releasing the starter button (or key switch), the
collapsing magnetic field in the starter solenoid tries to induce a high vo
ltage spike but this is swamped by the diode because the diode short circuit
s the current induced by the collapsing magnetic field in the coil.
>>>>
>>>> Hope this hasn=99t made it more confusing for you. I could and p
robably should have just said ..... connect it like the manual says.
>>>>
>>>> Best regards
>>>> Kingsley in Oz.
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 7:17 pm, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>> =EF=BBAllan have you put ANODE to switch contact?
>>>>>
>>>>> Dave Park
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:35, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> =EF=BBAre you sure the diode is not faulty?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You can check it with an meter set to read resistance. Should be high
resistance one way and low the other.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have you tried connecting it the other way round?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Alan
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:02, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> =EF=BBBud,
>>>>>>> Still confused as Europa Manual wiring diagram shows Anode to Earth?
Not switch.
>>>>>>> Regards
>>>>>>> Dave Park
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 01:06, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> =EF=BB
>>>>>>>> Dave,
>>>>>>>> I didn't see anyone commented on your diode.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Pretty much any diode will do. If you get it backwards, the saving
grace is the start solenoid is looking for 12 volts. Of course, the soleno
id must be grounded.
>>>>>>>> Most mistakes are the ground is left off the solenoid when putting o
n the diode. Another problem is guys don=99t insulate the anode side o
f the diode and it shorts.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The Rotax manual doesn't comment on the diode. But it is an accept
ed practice to extend the life of the contacts in the starter solenoid. The
Europa Electrical Chapter 25 advises to use an IN5404 but any will do.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> IN5404
>>>>>>>> <image001.png>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> silicone diode is shown above. Anode or plus side is on the starte
r switch tab and the cathode or negative goes to the ground bolt holding on t
he starter solenoid. I use at least a #18 or 16 wire from the solenoid fast
ening bolt to the main firewall ground.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Best Regards,
>>>>>>>> Bud Yerly
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-ser
ver@matronics.com> On Behalf Of david park
>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 2:44 PM
>>>>>>>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>>>>>>>> Subject: Europa-List: Starter Diode
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I fitted a starter Diode and engine would not start. Orientation wa
s as described with band end cathode on starter terminal and other end to ea
rth?
>>>>>>>> Have I got wrong diode.
>>>>>>>> Any advice appreciated
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dave Park G-LDVO
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> - The Europa-List Email Forum -
>>>>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A
%2F%2Fwww.matronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C47
56a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C
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kZby9t6u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>>>> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
>>>>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A
%2F%2Fforums.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508
d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7
CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiL
CJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUh
MM%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>>>> - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
>>>>>>>> --> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A
%2F%2Fwiki.matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d9
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nknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJ
XVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=o8qJjaCYZwDfnYZL5ZTUYwVjcHuo0CD7LEX42XsDfhY%3
D&reserved=0
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Message 13
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Subject: | Re: XS Tail wheel assembly |
Make sure you apply Mod77 when you fit the tailwheel assembly; its made a huge
difference to affective ground control on the aircraft... flew circuits for the
first time yesterday after fitting the mod and found it more precise and responsive
to minor rudder inputs and ability to maintain centerline... finding it
no more challenging than a Motorfalke to handle on the ground.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=502278#502278
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Subject: | Re: XS Tail wheel assembly |
PhilWhile I recognize you as a highly experienced Europa
builder, I pass along two modifications to the stock Europa tailwheel
which have been recommended to me by others.
First, add a stop to prevent the tailwheel from rotating more than
approximately 30 deg in either direction...shown below is a half inch
thick aluminum stopmine came to me as part of the Singleton
tail wheel mod.
Second, I cut off the ears of the stock fitting and made up a bracket
from 1/8=9D 4130 plate configured to a design suggested to me by
William Mills, RIP, which has two beneficial attributes: there are 3
sets of holes which allow for adjusting the sensitivity of rudder pedal
inputs(the outermost set of holes for the novice and allowing
for less sensitivity, and by using the innermost sets of holes the
result is less sensitivity and decreased turning radius) and
the sets of holes are further forward than the holes in the stock
=9Cears=9D so that string lines dropping thru the holes are
perfectly aligned with the vertical tail wheel pivot rod which decreases
the strain on the entire assembly.
PS: Ignore the bronze split-bolts shown in lieu of the second set of
nicopress sleeves.
> On Jun 7, 2021, at 2:27 AM, flyingphil2 <philipjtiller@gmail.com>
wrote:
> I'm looking for all the parts to make a complete XS tailwheel
assembly.
> I ideally want new, unused parts - does anyone have any bits lying
around that they'd like to sell?
>
> Thanks,
> Phil
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=502262#502262
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