---------------------------------------------------------- Europa-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 12/09/22: 3 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:34 AM - What did you do with your europa this week - 12/12/22 (Area-51) 2. 02:06 AM - Re: Europa-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 12/08/22 (Karel Vranken) 3. 08:18 AM - Re: Re: Europa-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 12/08/22 (D McFadyean) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:34:20 AM PST US Subject: Europa-List: What did you do with your europa this week - 12/12/22 From: "Area-51" Did what is supposed to be done with a europa; got in it and flew the thing... flew it three days out of seven and enjoyed every minute of the near perfect conditions this week for a fly up and down the coast and around the caldera. Also was fortunate enough to get a ride in another well built europa that turned up while drinking a cup of tea, and enjoyed that too! What's next??? .... Fly it again!!! Such joy... Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509478#509478 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/f18eea5d_fb0d_4699_b15d_e1c83d67b481_915.jpeg ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:06:59 AM PST US From: Karel Vranken Subject: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 12/08/22 Concerning Door Warping, I performed a solution (2004) after seeing a similar arrangement from Ted Gladstone I suppose. Note also the strap solution after reinforcement of the door sill. Karel Vranken. Op vr 9 dec. 2022 om 08:37 schreef Europa-List Digest Server < europa-list@matronics.com>: > * > > ================================================= > Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive > ================================================= > > Today's complete Europa-List Digest can also be found in either of the > two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted > in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes > and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version > of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor > such as Notepad or with a web browser. > > HTML Version: > > > http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 22-12-08&Archive=Europa > > Text Version: > > > http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 22-12-08&Archive=Europa > > > =============================================== > EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive > =============================================== > > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > Europa-List Digest Archive > --- > Total Messages Posted Thu 12/08/22: 7 > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > > Today's Message Index: > ---------------------- > > 1. 06:26 AM - Re: Re: Anti Door Warping (SHERIDAN Roger) > 2. 06:39 AM - Re: Re: Anti Door Warping (Pete) > 3. 07:35 AM - Re: N460HJ flies again (n7188u) > 4. 07:55 AM - Re: Anti Door Warping (n7188u) > 5. 01:05 PM - Re: Anti Door Warping (Area-51) > 6. 01:25 PM - Re: Re: Anti Door Warping (Alan Burrill) > 7. 01:31 PM - Re: Anti Door Warping (rparigoris) > > > ________________________________ Message 1 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 06:26:13 AM PST US > From: SHERIDAN Roger > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > x-mailer: Apple Mail (2.3731.200.110.1.12) > > VGhhbmtzIGZvciB0aGF0IHN1Z2dlc3Rpb24gQTUxLg0KDQpNeSBwYXNzaXZl > IHBpbiBhdHRlbXB0IGhhZCB0b28gbXVjaCBmcmljdGlvbiBidXQgdGhlIHJv > bGxlciBpZGVhIGlzIGEgZ3JlYXQgb25lIHRoYXQgSSBtaWdodCB0cnkuDQoN > CkFsYW4sIERpcmsgT3llbiB1c2VzIGEgcGFzc2l2ZSBzdXBwb3J0IHN0cnV0 > Og0KDQoNCg0KDQpSb2dlciBTaGVyaWRhbg0KDQpMaW5lIFBpbG90DQoNCis0 > NCAoMCkgMTczNyA4MjIgODg1DQoNCg0Kd3d3LnNwZWNpYWxpc3QtYXZpYXRp > b24uY29tDQoNClNwZWNpYWxpc3QgQXZpYXRpb24gU2VydmljZXMgTGltaXRl > ZCDigJMgUmVnaXN0ZXJlZCBpbiBFbmdsYW5kIGFuZCBXYWxlcyBObzoxODQ4 > NzczDQpSZWdpc3RlcmVkIG9mZmljZTogR2xvdWNlc3RlcnNoaXJlIEFpcnBv > 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Cj4gXy09ICAgLS0+IGh0dHBzOi8vbWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbS9jb250cmlidXRp > b24NCj4gXy09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 > PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT0NCj4gDQo+IA0KPiANCg0K > > ________________________________ Message 2 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 06:39:45 AM PST US > From: Pete > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > > Overcenter cam..no friction. :) > > > On Dec 8, 2022, at 9:38 AM, SHERIDAN Roger > com> wrote: > > > > =EF=BBThanks for that suggestion A51. > > > > My passive pin attempt had too much friction but the roller idea is a > grea > t one that I might try. > > > > Alan, Dirk Oyen uses a passive support strut: > > > > > > > > > > Roger Sheridan > > > > Line Pilot > > > > +44 (0) 1737 822 885 > > > > > > www.specialist-aviation.com > > > > Specialist Aviation Services Limited =93 Registered in England and W > ales No:1848773 > > Registered office: Gloucestershire Airport, Staverton, Cheltenham, > Glouces > tershire GL51 6SS > > > > This message and any attachments are confidential and intended only for > th > e use of the person to whom they are addressed. If you are not the > intended r > ecipient, you must not use, copy or distribute this message or any > attachmen > ts. Any such action may be unlawful. If you have received this message in > er > ror, please notify us immediately by replying to the message and delete it > f > rom your computer. Messages sent to and from us may be monitored. > > Internet communications may be intercepted, corrupted, lost, arrive late > o > r incomplete, or contain viruses. Therefore, we do not accept > responsibility > for any errors or omissions that have arisen as a result of email > transmiss > ion or for viruses. It is your responsibility to conduct your own virus > chec > king. If verification is required, please request a hard-copy version. Any > o > pinions expressed are those of the author and do not necessarily represent > t > hose of the company. > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > > > > > > > > > > Scanned by SystemForce I.T. PRMX Security System > > > > >> On 8 Dec 2022, at 06:59, Area-51 wrote: > >> > >> CAUTION: This email originated from outside your organization. Exercise > c > aution when opening attachments or on clicking links from unknown senders. > >> > om> > >> > >> Hi Ron, thanks for your request regarding door warping... to be > straight u > p its not an issue i have time to sit and examine; my time is constantly > tru > ly limited. > >> > >> The CAD testing calls for a non dynamic testing algorithm which will > not b > e accurate enough to be useful to anybody due to so many variables; and > that > is the b&w of what you are asking. > >> > >> Cardboard is your best friend (and a pencil and some basic map charting > t > ools) ; draw your solution and proof it on paper first using a pencil and > ci > rcles; i think thats how your passive pin system works? (See attached > basic s > ketch)... its going to be a solution of two arcs; the swing of the door > fram > e and shape of the pin and its parking gate. If you can get it to work > with p > aper stencils then it will work in situ. CAD will not provide you any > better > result or magic solution. All CAD will provide you is the ability to > record > and replicate; that's the only magic CAD will ever provide anybody. > Persona > lly from my quick sketch i don't think it is a practical solution but more > o > f a band aid for a greater upstream affect; i could be totally wrong and > oft > en am. > >> > >> The issue is not really safety related, which is my focus. It does hold > s > ome aerodynamic qualities there, and the simple solution "is" strengthen > the > door frame sufficiently at the time of production. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Read this topic online here: > >> > >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509463#509463 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Attachments: > >> > >> > http://forums.matronics.com//files/eec4e83c_aec3_460b_9585_589875a3317f_2 > 05.jpeg > > >> > >> > >> > ========================= > ======== > ========================= > ======== > ========================= > ======== > ========================= > ======== > ========================= > ======== > >> > >> > >> > > > > ________________________________ Message 3 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 07:35:07 AM PST US > Subject: Europa-List: Re: N460HJ flies again > From: "n7188u" > > > Great news Will. Let us know how your new tank performs. > Chris > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509467#509467 > > > ________________________________ Message 4 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 07:55:53 AM PST US > Subject: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > From: "n7188u" > > > Interesting thread. > > My LongEZ has a simple scissor type with over-center locking bar to keep > the canopy > open. In the LEZ case the latch only moves 90 were in ours it needs to go > 180 but it should not be too hard to modify. > > Simple and works well. The canopy doesn't slam down on your head as it > happens > on my EU once in awhile (I actually taxy with the door partially closed > held open > with a small foam block). > > Chris > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509469#509469 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_1694_134.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_1691_193.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_1695_131.jpg > > > ________________________________ Message 5 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 01:05:29 PM PST US > Subject: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > From: "Area-51" > > > The best and simplest solution ever for this type of hatch can be found on > the > rear window of the Hillman Imp produced by Rootes Group Scotland > 1961-1976; had > a few for 25 years and never had a failure. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509474#509474 > > > ________________________________ Message 6 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 01:25:11 PM PST US > From: Alan Burrill > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > > > > On 8 Dec 2022, at 21:04, Area-51 > wrote: > > > > > The best and simplest solution ever for this type of hatch can be > found on the rear window of the Hillman Imp produced by Rootes Group > Scotland 1961-1976; had a few for 25 years and never had a failure. > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509474#509474 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 7 > _____________________________________ > > > Time: 01:31:32 PM PST US > Subject: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > From: "rparigoris" > > > Hi Group > Nev's solution with passive pins and CF reinforcement works great. I made > cardboard > mock up and was able to get geometry spot on. Had packaging tape on fuse > and used JB KWIK Weld to temporarily hold in exact position. Then once > bonded > in perfect position and all is working great we then drilled fuse for > screws. > If alignment is not spot on friction is high and it doesn't work. > It's hard to get your head around the geometry, but once you do, it works > great. > We did install over a decade ago and all is well. The pin and striker are > made > out of SS. > My build partner Wayne was not convinced with my cardboard mock up. He > called it > a muck up! It took him till after completion of pins and striker install > and > actual fooling with to be convinced. > Ron P. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509476#509476 > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:18:39 AM PST US From: D McFadyean Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 12/08/22 Got any dimensioned drawings for the door support? Presuming that you've used standard gas struts. Duncan McF. > On 09 December 2022 at 10:05 Karel Vranken wrote: > > Concerning Door Warping, I performed a solution (2004) after seeing a similar arrangement from Ted Gladstone I suppose. Note also the strap solution after reinforcement of the door sill. > Karel Vranken. > > > Op vr 9 dec. 2022 om 08:37 schreef Europa-List Digest Server : > > > > * > > > > ======================== > > Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive > > ======================== > > > > Today's complete Europa-List Digest can also be found in either of the > > two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted > > in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes > > and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version > > of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor > > such as Notepad or with a web browser. > > > > HTML Version: > > > > http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 22-12-08&Archive=Europa > > > > Text Version: > > > > http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 22-12-08&Archive=Europa > > > > > > ====================== > > EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive > > ====================== > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > Europa-List Digest Archive > > --- > > Total Messages Posted Thu 12/08/22: 7 > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > Today's Message Index: > > ---------------------- > > > > 1. 06:26 AM - Re: Re: Anti Door Warping (SHERIDAN Roger) > > 2. 06:39 AM - Re: Re: Anti Door Warping (Pete) > > 3. 07:35 AM - Re: N460HJ flies again (n7188u) > > 4. 07:55 AM - Re: Anti Door Warping (n7188u) > > 5. 01:05 PM - Re: Anti Door Warping (Area-51) > > 6. 01:25 PM - Re: Re: Anti Door Warping (Alan Burrill) > > 7. 01:31 PM - Re: Anti Door Warping (rparigoris) > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ > > > > > > Time: 06:26:13 AM PST US > > From: SHERIDAN Roger > > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > > x-mailer: Apple Mail (2.3731.200.110.1.12) > > > > VGhhbmtzIGZvciB0aGF0IHN1Z2dlc3Rpb24gQTUxLg0KDQpNeSBwYXNzaXZl > > IHBpbiBhdHRlbXB0IGhhZCB0b28gbXVjaCBmcmljdGlvbiBidXQgdGhlIHJv > > bGxlciBpZGVhIGlzIGEgZ3JlYXQgb25lIHRoYXQgSSBtaWdodCB0cnkuDQoN > > CkFsYW4sIERpcmsgT3llbiB1c2VzIGEgcGFzc2l2ZSBzdXBwb3J0IHN0cnV0 > > Og0KDQoNCg0KDQpSb2dlciBTaGVyaWRhbg0KDQpMaW5lIFBpbG90DQoNCis0 > > NCAoMCkgMTczNyA4MjIgODg1DQoNCg0Kd3d3LnNwZWNpYWxpc3QtYXZpYXRp > > b24uY29tDQoNClNwZWNpYWxpc3QgQXZpYXRpb24gU2VydmljZXMgTGltaXRl > > ZCDigJMgUmVnaXN0ZXJlZCBpbiBFbmdsYW5kIGFuZCBXYWxlcyBObzoxODQ4 > > 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IGZvciB5b3VyIGdlbmVyb3VzIHN1cHBvcnQhDQo+IF8tPSAgICAgICAgICAg > > ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgIC1NYXR0IERyYWxsZSwgTGlzdCBBZG1pbi4N > > Cj4gXy09ICAgLS0+IGh0dHBzOi8vbWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbS9jb250cmlidXRp > > b24NCj4gXy09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 > > PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT0NCj4gDQo+IA0KPiANCg0K > > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ > > > > > > Time: 06:39:45 AM PST US > > From: Pete > > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > > > > Overcenter cam..no friction. :) > > > > > On Dec 8, 2022, at 9:38 AM, SHERIDAN Roger > com> wrote: > > > > > > =EF=BBThanks for that suggestion A51. > > > > > > My passive pin attempt had too much friction but the roller idea is a grea > > t one that I might try. > > > > > > Alan, Dirk Oyen uses a passive support strut: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger Sheridan > > > > > > Line Pilot > > > > > > +44 (0) 1737 822 885 > > > > > > > > >http://www.specialist-aviation.com > > > > > > Specialist Aviation Services Limited =93 Registered in England and W > > ales No:1848773 > > > Registered office: Gloucestershire Airport, Staverton, Cheltenham, Glouces > > tershire GL51 6SS > > > > > > This message and any attachments are confidential and intended only for th > > e use of the person to whom they are addressed. If you are not the intended r > > ecipient, you must not use, copy or distribute this message or any attachmen > > ts. Any such action may be unlawful. If you have received this message in er > > ror, please notify us immediately by replying to the message and delete it f > > rom your computer. Messages sent to and from us may be monitored. > > > Internet communications may be intercepted, corrupted, lost, arrive late o > > r incomplete, or contain viruses. Therefore, we do not accept responsibility > > for any errors or omissions that have arisen as a result of email transmiss > > ion or for viruses. It is your responsibility to conduct your own virus chec > > king. If verification is required, please request a hard-copy version. Any o > > pinions expressed are those of the author and do not necessarily represent t > > hose of the company. > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Scanned by SystemForce I.T. PRMX Security System > > > > > > > >> On 8 Dec 2022, at 06:59, Area-51 wrote: > > >> > > >> CAUTION: This email originated from outside your organization. Exercise c > > aution when opening attachments or on clicking links from unknown senders. > > >> > > om> > > >> > > >> Hi Ron, thanks for your request regarding door warping... to be straight u > > p its not an issue i have time to sit and examine; my time is constantly tru > > ly limited. > > >> > > >> The CAD testing calls for a non dynamic testing algorithm which will not b > > e accurate enough to be useful to anybody due to so many variables; and that > > is the b&w of what you are asking. > > >> > > >> Cardboard is your best friend (and a pencil and some basic map charting t > > ools) ; draw your solution and proof it on paper first using a pencil and ci > > rcles; i think thats how your passive pin system works? (See attached basic s > > ketch)... its going to be a solution of two arcs; the swing of the door fram > > e and shape of the pin and its parking gate. If you can get it to work with p > > aper stencils then it will work in situ. CAD will not provide you any better > > result or magic solution. All CAD will provide you is the ability to record > > and replicate; that's the only magic CAD will ever provide anybody. Persona > > lly from my quick sketch i don't think it is a practical solution but more o > > f a band aid for a greater upstream affect; i could be totally wrong and oft > > en am. > > >> > > >> The issue is not really safety related, which is my focus. It does hold s > > ome aerodynamic qualities there, and the simple solution "is" strengthen the > > door frame sufficiently at the time of production. > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> Read this topic online here: > > >> > > >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509463#509463 > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> Attachments: > > >> > > >> http://forums.matronics.com//files/eec4e83c_aec3_460b_9585_589875a3317f_2 > > 05.jpeg http://forums.matronics.com//files/eec4e83c_aec3_460b_9585_589875a3317f_205.jpeg > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > ======== > > > > ======== > > > > ======== > > > > ======== > > > > ======== > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ > > > > > > Time: 07:35:07 AM PST US > > Subject: Europa-List: Re: N460HJ flies again > > From: "n7188u" > > > > > > Great news Will. Let us know how your new tank performs. > > Chris > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509467#509467 > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ > > > > > > Time: 07:55:53 AM PST US > > Subject: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > > From: "n7188u" > > > > > > Interesting thread. > > > > My LongEZ has a simple scissor type with over-center locking bar to keep the canopy > > open. In the LEZ case the latch only moves 90 were in ours it needs to go > > 180 but it should not be too hard to modify. > > > > Simple and works well. The canopy doesn't slam down on your head as it happens > > on my EU once in awhile (I actually taxy with the door partially closed held open > > with a small foam block). > > > > Chris > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509469#509469 > > > > > > Attachments: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_1694_134.jpg > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_1691_193.jpg > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_1695_131.jpg > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ > > > > > > Time: 01:05:29 PM PST US > > Subject: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > > From: "Area-51" > > > > > > The best and simplest solution ever for this type of hatch can be found on the > > rear window of the Hillman Imp produced by Rootes Group Scotland 1961-1976; had > > a few for 25 years and never had a failure. > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509474#509474 > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ > > > > > > Time: 01:25:11 PM PST US > > From: Alan Burrill > > Subject: Re: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > > > > > > > On 8 Dec 2022, at 21:04, Area-51 > > wrote: > > > > > > > > The best and simplest solution ever for this type of hatch can be > > found on the rear window of the Hillman Imp produced by Rootes Group > > Scotland 1961-1976; had a few for 25 years and never had a failure. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509474#509474 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ > > > > > > Time: 01:31:32 PM PST US > > Subject: Europa-List: Re: Anti Door Warping > > From: "rparigoris" > > > > > > Hi Group > > Nev's solution with passive pins and CF reinforcement works great. I made cardboard > > mock up and was able to get geometry spot on. Had packaging tape on fuse > > and used JB KWIK Weld to temporarily hold in exact position. Then once bonded > > in perfect position and all is working great we then drilled fuse for screws. > > If alignment is not spot on friction is high and it doesn't work. > > It's hard to get your head around the geometry, but once you do, it works great. > > We did install over a decade ago and all is well. The pin and striker are made > > out of SS. > > My build partner Wayne was not convinced with my cardboard mock up. He called it > > a muck up! It took him till after completion of pins and striker install and > > actual fooling with to be convinced. > > Ron P. > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=509476#509476 > > > > > > > > > > ========== > > pa-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List > > ========== > > FORUMS - > > eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com > > ========== > > WIKI - > > errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com > > ========== > > b Site - > > -Matt Dralle, List Admin. > > ="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://matronics.com/contribution > > ========== > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message europa-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Europa-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/europa-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/europa-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.