Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:56 AM - Re: Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? (Pete)
2. 03:50 AM - Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? (Area-51)
3. 04:35 AM - Sun N Fun (h&jeuropa)
4. 04:54 AM - Europa Sun 'n Fun Forum and gatherings. (budyerly@msn.com)
5. 05:10 AM - Re: the Obsidian Files - So Much Noise!!! (Area-51)
6. 08:42 AM - Re: Sun N Fun (Fred Klein)
7. 12:17 PM - Re: Sun N Fun (n7188u)
8. 12:49 PM - Re: Europa Sun 'n Fun Forum and gatherings. (n7188u)
9. 12:58 PM - Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? (n7188u)
10. 01:02 PM - Re: Re: Europa Sun 'n Fun Forum and gatherings. (Bud Yerly)
11. 01:05 PM - Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? (n7188u)
12. 01:23 PM - Re: Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? (Pete)
13. 01:50 PM - Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? (n7188u)
14. 02:01 PM - Re: Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? (Pete Zut)
15. 02:23 PM - Re: the Obsidian Files - So Much Noise!!! (Area-51)
16. 05:26 PM - Re: the Obsidian Files - So Much Noise!!! (n7188u)
17. 06:07 PM - Re: What did you do with your Europa this week 19/03/23 (Area-51)
18. 08:42 PM - Re: Finishing tips (danbish99)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? |
Lower the wheel such that its 45-50% exposed. Its too high in your sim. (And would
love to see an 8.00 tire)
Thx!
Pete
> On Mar 26, 2023, at 10:36 PM, Area-51 <goldsteinindustrial@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Attached is a rudimentary cross section of free stream air through the forward
fuselage voids without lower cowl ducting.
>
>> From experience flying in a mono with wheel fairing fitted; with ANR switched
on at the time there was no detectible change in cabin noise volume compared
to flying in 181. However the degree off air flow through the cockpit was greatly
multiplied due to the wheel well being mostly sealed off during flight; not
fitting the rear portion of the fairing will greatly diminish this ventilation
feature.
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510515#510515
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> Attachments:
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> http://forums.matronics.com//files/9727fbf9_885d_4ac6_bc0d_a372d13ea377_675.jpeg
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| Subject: | Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? |
Already reset it to correct position and sizing ages ago; just haven't updated
to the latest solution; its going be an arduous procedure with all the fine details
now in the mix... i did mention the above sample is rudimentary...
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http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510517#510517
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Just a reminder, the Europa Forum is scheduled for Wednesday at 1:00 PM in room
CFAA-05. Bud Yerly will be leading the forum.
Hope you make it!
Jim
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510518#510518
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| Subject: | Europa Sun 'n Fun Forum and gatherings. |
Sun 'n Fun is here! Join us at the Forum!
Now that Anita and I are no longer doing a booth at Sun 'n Fun, my blood pressure
is down, and my sense of humor is back. Airshows can be a grind. We are volunteers
for the event with my local EAA chapter making sandwiches daily with
about 40 other volunteers and friends from the local community and our flying
community.
Jerry Hope and I and our wives are at the Sun 'n Fun Pavillion making sandwiches,
drinks and shooting the bull from 0900 until 1130 daily. So far, Anita and
I enjoy driving home after lunch and I go to the shop and print some 3D mods
and repair parts I have done to tools/and other items. I have made many little
tidbits improving my aged CAD skills and patience as these printers are notoriously
slow. Frankly, some of what I have done could be whacked out of foam
and glass and modded quicker. That's another story.
If you all would like to come and chat, we have a place to meet out of the sun
and a bit more quiet, so come over to the pavillion about 1130, it is a nice place
to meet and exchange ideas. I will be walking the show in the afternoons
taking a break from the airshow watching crowds seeing the sites and old friends
and if anyone wants to go to the shop in the late afternoon, I'll be available
to open it up and assist folks wanting to sift through the mono stuff left
over. In the shop, I only have one kit left partially built XS Trigear and
Brett Browns trigear and my own trigear. Of course, I'm tearing down my woodworking
tools and rehabbing them so it is a mess. That is where the 3D printed
parts are going.
We've arranged a Forum for Europa Owners on Wednesday March 29th at CFAA-05 FROM
1:00 TO 1:55 (the Nazis will throw us out at 1156). There are problems that
just arrived with WiFi in the building so this will be an informal gathering
for Europa Owners and the topics are open for discussion. Of course, we also
can meet in the Sun 'n Fun Pavillion area daily and gather and talk about individual
issues you may be having on your Europa if you don't want to discuss it
in the forum.
I have a shopping list this year and am not afraid to exercise it, so 12AY is tore
down in the shop getting little goodies installed. I may be adding the internal
Stratus to my ESG transponder. Some other doo dads are being looked at
and more than likely I'll probably just build another Stratux an put it into
the cockpit area. My move of the Stratux ADS-B in to the rear near my transmitter
antenna has caused interference with the ADS-B operation and although shielded
and working, it looks like an amateur did the install.
The weather looks reasonable from Tuesday afternoon through the rest of the week
so join us. Be sure to bring sun screen and a hat. IT IS HOT!
Best Regards,
Bud and Anita Yerly
Custom Flight Creations, Inc.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510519#510519
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| Subject: | Re: the Obsidian Files - So Much Noise!!! |
Today has been spent crunching numbers again by adding the butyl layer to 181's
air box. The untreated air box was also rerun through the same analysis matrix
settings as a control for comparison purposes.
Several criteria were examined on both models; the modal natural frequency, the
harmonic response, and the harmonic acoustic qualities.
Two sets of solutions were applied overall based upon 1 cylinder cycle and 4 cylinder
cycles from 3000rpm to 5800rpm; both provided similar attenuation plot
results. The images attached are from the 4 cylinder cycle solutions.
The attached images relate to distortion of the air box at a nominated frequency
of 8200hz, being 4100rpm. Blue represents zero distortion, red maximum measured
distortion. The two images clearly show how well the butyl layer attenuates
excitation frequencies of the air box; being the image with the most blue.
The attached graphs are related to the amplitude of applied frequencies being projected
from the air box to the surrounding environment, measured at a near field
specific position to the air box being 100mm above the air filter opening,
behind the rear at the firewall, inside under the air filter, and corollate
to (x2) rpm.
The db attenuation qualities of applying the butyl has proven much better than
expected. One point to note is the material density applied. The DCI product presents
a density of 1310kg/m3 against standard 900kg/m3 of other similar products.
It was surprising to make the distinction between the lower amplitude levels on
the graphs to the different power setting rpm selected in real flight situations;
they are identical to where the smooth running points are being perceived
to be.
Again these tests are not for determining induction noise affects, they are for
determining the inherent acoustic qualities of the air box and how it is affected
by environmental frequencies along with its ability to adsorb vibrational
frequencies. Can it or can it not absorb and dissipate a specific kind of kinetic
energy.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510520#510520
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/a36fd941_1515_4c04_b9fc_0d14389760b0_191.jpeg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/61ad6bda_5185_488d_ba0b_3f8573defecb_173.jpeg
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Message 6
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Ill be there
Fred, A194
Sent from my iPhone
> On Mar 27, 2023, at 7:37 AM, h&jeuropa <butcher43@att.net> wrote:
>
>
> Just a reminder, the Europa Forum is scheduled for Wednesday at 1:00 PM in room
CFAA-05. Bud Yerly will be leading the forum.
>
> Hope you make it!
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510518#510518
>
>
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I wanted to go but can go Thursday or Friday. I guess I'll have to pass this year.
Chris
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| Subject: | Re: Europa Sun 'n Fun Forum and gatherings. |
Hi Bud,
I will see if I can go Wednesday but most likely it will have to be Thursday or
Friday since my son wants to come and we are limited by his school obligations.
If I can't I will go by the pavilion to say hello at 11:30.
Chris
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| Subject: | Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? |
Air spilled from the intake duct looks terrible.
I also have the duct open on the lower starboard side of the cowling. I guess that
is there for the 914 but I kept it open because it seems to provide some cool
air to the oil tank area and rear of the engine. I dare to say it may even
augment the flow through the exit a little. My cooling system is working very
well so afraid to change anything at this point.
I am planning to remove the gills on the top cowling and make that area smooth.
I have them closed right now and it seems to me they probably just add turbulence
to the air going over them.
Chris
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| Subject: | Re: Europa Sun 'n Fun Forum and gatherings. |
I'll be looking forward to seeing you. Weather is better later in the week
.
Bud
Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg>
________________________________
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server@matr
onics.com> on behalf of n7188u <chmgarb@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2023 3:48:26 PM
Subject: Europa-List: Re: Europa Sun 'n Fun Forum and gatherings.
Hi Bud,
I will see if I can go Wednesday but most likely it will have to be Thursda
y or Friday since my son wants to come and we are limited by his school obl
igations.
If I can't I will go by the pavilion to say hello at 11:30.
Chris
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| Subject: | Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? |
BTW, I did a little number crunching of my own. I measured all the templates I
used to cut the airbox sound deadening material and calculated the weight for
the Noico material I used.
0.6 kg or 1.3 lbs. It is significant for a single component but for now I'll keep
it.
Regarding the effect of this additional mass on the carburetor mounts, the airbox
is well supported on the back. But that's not to say it has no effect on the
carb rubber mounts so I will just double the inspections on that area.
Chris
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| Subject: | Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? |
Curious, how is it supported in the back? Mine is spaced away from the firewall.
Thx!
PeteZ
> On Mar 27, 2023, at 4:11 PM, n7188u <chmgarb@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> BTW, I did a little number crunching of my own. I measured all the templates
I used to cut the airbox sound deadening material and calculated the weight for
the Noico material I used.
>
> 0.6 kg or 1.3 lbs. It is significant for a single component but for now I'll
keep it.
>
> Regarding the effect of this additional mass on the carburetor mounts, the airbox
is well supported on the back. But that's not to say it has no effect on
the carb rubber mounts so I will just double the inspections on that area.
>
> Chris
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510527#510527
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? |
An aluminum bar is attached to the back of the box and down to the engine mount
(the part that is fixed to the ring mount, not behind the rubber mounts). As
shown in the plans.
Chris
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http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510530#510530
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| Subject: | Re: Considering a few mods. Opinions? |
Aha! Makes sense. .....I have a classic :)
PeteZ
On Mon, Mar 27, 2023, 4:57 p.m. n7188u <chmgarb@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> An aluminum bar is attached to the back of the box and down to the engine
> mount (the part that is fixed to the ring mount, not behind the rubber
> mounts). As shown in the plans.
> Chris
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510530#510530
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: the Obsidian Files - So Much Noise!!! |
[quote="n7188u"]Today I finally had a chance to get a longer flight in. It's hard
to say how much improvement the install of the sound deadening material on
the air box has on the internal noise. But there is certainly improvement!! The
flight today was very pleasant and more enjoyable. But what really struck me
is that, as A51 experienced, I had to lower the intercom volume quite a bit since
it felt too loud. Same thing when I was playing music as I generally do.
So, even though I can still hear relatively high frequency sound, but maybe less,
it seems that overall there is a reduction in noise.
But, I have to admit this is all just based on perception. It is indeed hard to
quantify the change. But I have to say that despite the increase in weight, it
is a keeper.
On a different note: I finished rebuilding my spray booth and getting closer to
starting the painting process. I will hold off taking the airplane apart this
week to see if I fly it to Sun n Fun but by next weekend it will come apart so
no more flying until it is done. I also have a couple of pending jobs I want
to perform on the airframe.
Chris[/quote]
Chris, i noticed you mention calc on the added mass of your air box being 0.6kg.
This aligns with the lower density of products out there. The affects will be
reduced... Adding a second layer will bring the results closer to what the DCI
product has provided, but will of course add another 0.6kg.
Reviewing the graphs demonstrates the db reduction achievable for a given rpm.
The average is 10db but some points it is as much as 25db... the high frequency
vibrational load upon the carbi rubbers is reduced as well as a result.
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http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510532#510532
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| Subject: | Re: the Obsidian Files - So Much Noise!!! |
Thanks for the advice A51. I am right now in the process of disassembling my airplane
to paint. When I finish this phase I will get back to the sound issue.
Will continue following your analysis and experimentation.
Best,
Chris
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| Subject: | Re: What did you do with your Europa this week 19/03/23 |
Went up for another hour and made a point of listening to the volume levels in
the cockpit at various rpm. The analysis graphs showed volume levels falling off
at 5000rpm, so made a conscious effort to listen and indeed they did!! ...
Remarkable!!!
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| Subject: | Re: Finishing tips |
Thanks everyone for all the great resources - awesome to be able to reach out for
help like this. You've surely saved me a ton of time avoiding sand & fill hell!
Best,
Dan
Read this topic online here:
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