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1. 04:35 AM - Re: Oil - Rotax - Synthetic or other (D McFadyean)
2. 06:38 PM - Re: Oil - Rotax - Synthetic or other (Area-51)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Oil - Rotax - Synthetic or other |
Getting an oil with enough ZDDP (anti-scuff) is an issue, with this substan
ce being now very diminished in any oil that could be used in an engine wit
h a catalyst (because the Zinc contaminates the catalyst).
Aeroshell SP4 has loads and the new Rotax synthetic oil * is suggestive tha
t it does too (in its comment: Not recommended in automotive applications w
ith catalytic aftertreatment systems).
Sometimes the MSDS will say how much ZDDP is present, other times not. But
if the gearbox screeches momentarily on shutdown, chances are your oil does
n't have enough.
*ROTAX-XPS-Datasheet-A4-2304-RZ.indd (flyrotax.com) https://www.flyrotax.co
m/assets/images/ROTAX-XPS-Datasheet-A4-2304-RZ-1.pdf
Duncan McF.
> On 07 May 2023 at 01:33 Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>
>
> Will,
>
> Aeroshell Sport Plus 4 (Aeroshell SP4) is good for either Mogas (AKI
91 or R+M/2) of 91 or 92 and is fine also with 100LL IAW Rotax Service lett
ers and experience.
>
>
>
> Any other oil must have the proper gearbox additives used in motorcyc
les as Area 51 noted also. We used to use Mobile MX4T (now known as Racing
4T Motorcycle oil) which is a motorcycle/ATV oil using additives for gearb
oxes bathed in engine oil. Do not use regular Mobile One in a Rotax althou
gh many did until after 2011-2012 914-SB-19?? or so when the guidance chan
ged due to the gearbox additive not found in Mobile 1 which may have caused
some gearbox issues of which the Rotax Gods kept secret and Rotax went har
d over for Aeroshell SP4. Primary reason was Aeroshell doesn=99t cha
nge their oil without notice as auto oil manufacturers do. If you use TCP
and SP4 the lead settles in the tank when the oil cools. As you all know I
change oil every 25-30 hours anyway as I believe in routine 25 hour inspec
tions and since I use and will continue to use 100LL it keeps the oil can c
leaner. You also know I don=99t follow hearsay and do my own researc
h (Have internet, will research!).
>
>
>
> Miscellaneous Ramblings:
>
> If using Super Premium Auto Fuel AKI 91 (whatever the local station c
alls it) we never had a problem with the Mobile MX4T but there were startin
g issues if the gas was old. But even at a higher oil change interval, loo
k at the cost difference:
>
>
>
> I fly less than most of you, so Aeroshell SP4 is cost effective. SP4
is about $11-15 a quart and MX4T is about $12-15 a quart. Depending on wh
ere you buy it. I buy the SP4 a case at a time (12 quarts) for about $135
including shipping, and the 4T is about $86 for 6 quarts plus shipping. Ag
ain, depending on where you buy your oil costs change. Since only a few ai
rports across the US carry MOGAS of 91 AKI, I can=99t avoid leaded AV
Gas use. I stick with the SP4. Do I religiously use the TCP fuel additive
? Well, I try to. If cross country and I need oil and the FBO does not st
ock SP4, I use either the Valvoline semi synthetic motorcycle oil or Mobil
MX4T to add if my oil level gets low for some reason.
>
>
>
> Although some say a full synthetic oil only has to be changed every 1
00 Hrs, I=99m afraid I have not bought into that. Florida is hot, hu
mid, and iron gears are prone to rusting. Synthetics are great oils, but I
personally am not inclined to be a test case due to our high humidity cond
itions and the lack of coating Mobile one seems to have in comparison to st
andard oil on the gears when the plane sets for weeks/months.
>
>
>
> AVGas is averaging now (on cross country) about $7 (Sebring is $5) an
d Premium 92 Octane R+M/2 is about $4/gallon in Tampa. If I fly 25 hours a
year how much do I save at 5-6 gal/hr with a 25 hour oil change. (Note I r
eally only flew the Europa 10 hours last year.) My gas use would be 137 ga
llons and an oil change is about 3 quarts. Avgas/SP4 at 5.5GPH $962+33 for
oil =$995 but normally with my discount $688+45=$732 and 91AKI Mogas u
se would cost in my area (My FF is 5.8 GPH at 31 inches on Shell Supreme fu
el) $582 + 45= $625 and I must now consider I can=99t get reliable
MOGAS on cross country at the nice airports, however I still have to worry
about bad or old gas that has been setting at the airport and in my airplan
e. For me it is not that much of a difference over a years worth of flying
but, if you only fly local and fly 300 hours a year, you can save quite a
bit. Those folks overseas that can get good super supreme fuel at airfield
s and go 50 hours between oil changes can save enough to pay a month
=99s hangar fee and or a month=99s worth of insurance so it=99s
worth it for those overseas to look for alternatives due to their high fue
l costs and oil availability. For me, in the Tampa Florida area, it just i
sn=99t worth the stagnant fuel issues since I fly so little and SP4 w
orks and is relatively cheap to buy for a specialty oil. As far as auto fu
el goes vs 100LL, my particular 914 likes 100LL. It starts really fast. N
o worries about kickback on start with that fuel, no matter how old it is.
With ethanol laced super MoGas only available here in Tampa, I find that b
y using 100LL fuel, my carbs are always clean and have stayed tuned for 4 y
ears, the floats don=99t sink and my float bowls look like new. Othe
rs in the area are not so lucky that fuel with ethanol gas.
>
>
>
> Note, I had Lockwood do a 500 Hr top overhaul of my 914 running 100LL
with TCP and SP4 oil and Rotax Filter. The engine was unbelievably clean
on the inside. The oil tank holds the lead in suspension like it is suppos
ed to. The only thing I find is, in the oil filter there are small chunks
of carbon from the turbo. There is a new Service Bulletin on the 914 turbo
can which changes the design and adds a filter screen. It may set too clo
se to my duct so I doubt I can change it without lowering the duct. I
=99ll see how much it costs. I like the design but, I probably will be
shocked by the price. To tell you the truth I can=99t wait for the n
ew unleaded AVGas either. I bet the AVGas price jumps 30% initially when i
t comes out.
>
>
>
> So, the choice is yours. Research and do your own math for your flyi
ng needs and fuel/oil costs. I wouldn=99t skimp on fluids though. G
ood fresh gas, and good oil are a must. Maintenance becomes more of a time
change requirement with proper fluids. Do the inspections and time change
s and your plane will reward you with only periodic maintenance and leave y
ou more money for upgrades.
>
>
>
> You all know what keeps an airplane flying don=99t you
.MONEY!
>
>
>
> Bud Yerly
>
>
>
>
>
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-serve
r@matronics.com> On Behalf Of William Daniell
> Sent: Friday, May 05, 2023 10:50 AM
> To: europa-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Europa-List: Oil - Rotax - Synthetic or other
>
>
>
> Whats is the consensus on the best oil.
>
> I have used the Aeroshell sport PLUS 4 oil up to now mainly because I
used AVGAS in Colombia. (Mogas was of doubtful quality.)
>
> I have since heard that lost of people use Mobil Synthetic.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
> William Daniell
>
> LONGPORT
>
> +1 786 878 0246
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Oil - Rotax - Synthetic or other |
Think some of the AGIP hi performance oils were pegged as suitable but don't quote
me on that... goo point on the ZDDP... Anybody have any thoughts on adding
colloidal graphite?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=510745#510745
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