Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:54 AM - Re: Europa-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 10/27/24 (James Kelly)
2. 01:54 AM - Re: Europa-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 10/27/24 (James Kelly)
3. 04:17 AM - Re: Re: Europa-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 10/27/24 (Ken Richardson)
4. 05:17 AM - cowl to spinner clearance [was: Re: Re: Europa-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 10/27/24] (Rowland Carson)
5. 05:49 AM - Re: Re: Europa-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 10/27/24 (Bud Yerly)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Europa-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 10/27/24 |
Hello Airmaster owners. I have a new Airmaster prop fitted by an aviation
expert I understand that the clearance between the cowlings and spinner
should be 6mm minimum to 12mm maximum. I have only 3.5mm how can I make
the adjustment ???
On Mon, 28 Oct 2024, 06:33 Europa-List Digest Server, <
europa-list@matronics.com> wrote:
> *
>
> =================================================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> =================================================
>
> Today's complete Europa-List Digest can also be found in either of the
> two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
> in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
> and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
> of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
> such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>
> HTML Version:
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 24-10-27&Archive=Europa
>
> Text Version:
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 24-10-27&Archive=Europa
>
>
> ===============================================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> ===============================================
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Europa-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Sun 10/27/24: 6
> ----------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 03:29 AM - Recommendations VP Prop (Paul Hawkins)
> 2. 03:41 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Alan Burrill)
> 3. 03:49 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (William Daniell)
> 4. 05:52 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Raimo Toivio)
> 5. 09:03 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Bud Yerly)
> 6. 10:07 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Peter Z)
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 1
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 03:29:13 AM PST US
> From: Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
> Subject: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> Hi chaps
>
> I=92m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa, I n
> eed help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 2
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 03:41:35 AM PST US
> From: Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> I=99m very pleased with my Airmaster.
>
> Very Robust
> Very well made.
> Good Performance improvements over my fixed pitch warp drive.
> Maintains RPM set
> 2000 hours between overhauls and with 100hour maintenance intervals.
> Support is good and we have the European agent as Europa Owner.
>
> It=99s the heaviest of the VP props at 26lb
> It=99s expensive.
>
> Wouldn=99t change it.
>
> Alan Burrill
> G-OBJT
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On 27 Oct 2024, at 10:30, Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
> wro
> te:
> >
> > =EF=BB
> > Hi chaps
> >
> > I=99m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Euro
> pa, I need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
> >
>
> ________________________________ Message 3
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 03:49:08 AM PST US
> From: William Daniell <wdaniell.longport@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> I have an airmaster which has worked well and with good service...
> surprisingly quick considering the factory is in nz.
>
> William Daniell
> +1 786 878 0246
>
> On Sun, Oct 27, 2024, 12:30 Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Hi chaps
> >
> > I=99m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Eur
> opa, I
> > need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
> >
> >
>
> ________________________________ Message 4
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 05:52:39 AM PST US
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
> From: Raimo Toivio <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>
>
> I do agree, Alan!
>
> Perfectly happy with it since 2008 and through 800 hours.
>
> First coil change when used well over 600 hours (old ones were still
> usable).
>
> Dirk van Oyen - Europa Pilot [Mono OO-145) and Airmaster Expert from
> Belgium, flew to my place and completed also The Dynamical Balancing
> with his pro equipment.
>
> It was good (value < 0,2 IPS by chance), but now its smooth like my
> iX50M, value next to 0,00 IPS [inches per second].
>
> I have Warp Drive Blades and have been happy with them.
>
> During the coming decade (!) however they must be upgraded to the next
> level, which are...any recommendations?
>
>
> allekirjoitus2 Cheers, Raimo Toivio
>
> signature
>
> Europa XS Monowheel OH-XRT #417 2007
> Antonov AN-2 TDSRM AirCamper HA-MDO 1987
>
> 37800 Akaa
> FINLAND
> p. +358 3 3753 777
> m. +358 40 590 1450
> www.rwm.fi <http://www.rwm.fi/>
> raimo.toivio@rwm.fi
> Alan Burrill kirjoitti 27.10.2024 klo 12.40:
> > Im very pleased with my Airmaster.
> >
> > Very Robust
> > Very well made.
> > Good Performance improvements over my fixed pitch warp drive.
> > Maintains RPM set
> > 2000 hours between overhauls and with 100hour maintenance intervals.
> > Support is good and we have the European agent as Europa Owner.
> >
> > Its the heaviest of the VP props at 26lb
> > Its expensive.
> >
> > Wouldnt change it.
> >
> > Alan Burrill
> > G-OBJT
> > Sent from my iPad
> >
> >> On 27 Oct 2024, at 10:30, Paul Hawkins
> >> <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi chaps
> >>
> >> Im looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa,
> >> I need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
> >>
>
> ________________________________ Message 5
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 09:03:18 AM PST US
> From: Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> Paul,
> In my over 20 years dealing with the Airmaster (and Europa) I think my webs
> ite has all the information you need on choosing a constant speed propeller
> . (Keep in mind this is not a variable pitch only propeller, it is a const
> ant speed propeller.)
>
> The Europa with a 914 and Airmaster AP 330 three blade or AP420 two blade t
> ransforms the aircraft into a good economical 10,000+ ft cruiser. The 64 i
> nch propeller length is considered maximum for the Europa due to ground cle
> arance. I would not go any longer.
>
> On the 912S (100 HP) Rotax, it is excellent for shorter takeoff and gives y
> ou the best for optimum low altitude cruise in the normally aspirated Rotax
> . With a fuel leaning kit (HacMan), fuel efficiency improves at cruise at
> 7500 feet and you can pick up a bit of speed also. Your country regulation
> s must be adhered to concerning modifications to an engine.
>
> Attached is my now very old and hated by the prop blade manufacturers infor
> mation pdf on choosing the right blade for constant speed propeller operati
> ons on the Rotax. Nothing good happens after 67 to 68 inches on a Rotax ev
> en with a constant speed hub, but people keep trying. It is a short read a
> nd goes into why this is true. In all honesty, blade manufacturer performa
> nce is negated as the "performance is in the hub". Changing the pitch with
> speed is the key to performance. I'm including the installation manual fr
> om Airmaster as well for your review.
>
> The Airmaster is more expensive than some of our European competitor prop b
> uilders but when it comes to ease of installation, builder maintenance, rel
> iability and quick turn around on parts, the Airmaster has never left me st
> uck out. It is amazingly reliable. Service the hub once a year, change th
> e brushes around 300-500 hours and look at your blades for damage as on any
> propeller. Yes, you have to maintain an aircraft. No engine, prop, or el
> ectronic do dad works forever as humidity, age and lack of use or attention
> often shows up. The controller is almost bullet proof, but switches can g
> et corroded if kept near the salt water or the plane has sat in a humid env
> ironment for months on end without use. Simply clean your brush ring, clic
> k and wiggle switches that may corrode and if necessary, call a dealer or A
> irmaster direct with your issue and you will find troubleshooting is very s
> imple on any electric constant speed. The hub is strong and reliable, and
> the motor and switches in the hub are better than those 20 years ago. Airm
> aster is constantly improving their product.
>
> Final thoughts:
> The two blade AP420 is lighter at 19 pounds, and the three blade AP330 is s
> moother at 26 pounds. Speed difference is negligible ranging from 0-5 Knot
> s depending on altitude, RPM, and engine. The trigear cowl removal is easi
> er with the two blade on the Europa. If you have a Rotax belt drive altern
> ator, use the mini-slip ring through the prop shaft. Note that there can b
> e some interference from these alternators windings but there is an easy wo
> rk around for those noisy field windings on these Denso type alternators.
> There is no problem with the Rotax / Ducati alternator or interference with
> the propeller.
>
> I like to fly and look myself at equipment before I buy. I talk to owners,
> but still do my own research. I suggest you do the same. You will be har
> d pressed to find a disappointed Airmaster owner. A rule of thumb is if th
> e plane looks nasty and is not well kept, the owner may not be taking best
> care of his airplane, but somehow the Airmaster soldiers on even when negle
> cted.
>
> In the UK, your nearest dealer is Dirk Oyen in Belgium. He will set you up
> with a demo and or there are many UK owners with the Airmaster. He is very
> hands on and well versed in the Airmaster operations and any maintenance.
> Contact for Dirk: Hemelrijk 61, Heusen-Zolder, Limburg 3550, Belgium. E
> mail: dirk.oyen1@telenet.be<mailto:dirk.oyen1@telenet.be> , Phone: +32
> 477
> 25 80 28
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Bud Yerly
> Custom Flight Creations
> US Airmaster Dealer
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> <owner-europa-list-server@matr
> onics.com> on behalf of Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
> Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2024 6:28 AM
> Subject: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> Hi chaps
>
> I=92m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa, I n
> eed help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 6
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 10:07:50 AM PST US
> From: Peter Z <peterz@zutrasoft.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> --- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found ---
>
> A message with no text/plain MIME section was received.
> The entire body of the message was removed. Please
> resend the email using Plain Text formatting.
>
> HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section
> in their client's default configuration. If you're using
> HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings
> and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text".
>
> --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found ---
>
>
Message 2
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| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Europa-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 10/27/24 |
Hello Airmaster owners. I have a new Airmaster prop fitted by an aviation
expert I understand that the clearance between the cowlings and spinner
should be 6mm minimum to 12mm maximum. I have only 3.5mm how can I make
the adjustment ???
On Mon, 28 Oct 2024, 06:33 Europa-List Digest Server, <
europa-list@matronics.com> wrote:
> *
>
> =================================================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> =================================================
>
> Today's complete Europa-List Digest can also be found in either of the
> two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
> in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
> and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
> of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
> such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>
> HTML Version:
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 24-10-27&Archive=Europa
>
> Text Version:
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 24-10-27&Archive=Europa
>
>
> ===============================================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> ===============================================
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Europa-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Sun 10/27/24: 6
> ----------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 03:29 AM - Recommendations VP Prop (Paul Hawkins)
> 2. 03:41 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Alan Burrill)
> 3. 03:49 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (William Daniell)
> 4. 05:52 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Raimo Toivio)
> 5. 09:03 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Bud Yerly)
> 6. 10:07 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Peter Z)
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 1
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 03:29:13 AM PST US
> From: Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
> Subject: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> Hi chaps
>
> I=92m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa, I n
> eed help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 2
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 03:41:35 AM PST US
> From: Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> I=99m very pleased with my Airmaster.
>
> Very Robust
> Very well made.
> Good Performance improvements over my fixed pitch warp drive.
> Maintains RPM set
> 2000 hours between overhauls and with 100hour maintenance intervals.
> Support is good and we have the European agent as Europa Owner.
>
> It=99s the heaviest of the VP props at 26lb
> It=99s expensive.
>
> Wouldn=99t change it.
>
> Alan Burrill
> G-OBJT
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On 27 Oct 2024, at 10:30, Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
> wro
> te:
> >
> > =EF=BB
> > Hi chaps
> >
> > I=99m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Euro
> pa, I need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
> >
>
> ________________________________ Message 3
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 03:49:08 AM PST US
> From: William Daniell <wdaniell.longport@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> I have an airmaster which has worked well and with good service...
> surprisingly quick considering the factory is in nz.
>
> William Daniell
> +1 786 878 0246
>
> On Sun, Oct 27, 2024, 12:30 Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Hi chaps
> >
> > I=99m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Eur
> opa, I
> > need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
> >
> >
>
> ________________________________ Message 4
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 05:52:39 AM PST US
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
> From: Raimo Toivio <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>
>
> I do agree, Alan!
>
> Perfectly happy with it since 2008 and through 800 hours.
>
> First coil change when used well over 600 hours (old ones were still
> usable).
>
> Dirk van Oyen - Europa Pilot [Mono OO-145) and Airmaster Expert from
> Belgium, flew to my place and completed also The Dynamical Balancing
> with his pro equipment.
>
> It was good (value < 0,2 IPS by chance), but now its smooth like my
> iX50M, value next to 0,00 IPS [inches per second].
>
> I have Warp Drive Blades and have been happy with them.
>
> During the coming decade (!) however they must be upgraded to the next
> level, which are...any recommendations?
>
>
> allekirjoitus2 Cheers, Raimo Toivio
>
> signature
>
> Europa XS Monowheel OH-XRT #417 2007
> Antonov AN-2 TDSRM AirCamper HA-MDO 1987
>
> 37800 Akaa
> FINLAND
> p. +358 3 3753 777
> m. +358 40 590 1450
> www.rwm.fi <http://www.rwm.fi/>
> raimo.toivio@rwm.fi
> Alan Burrill kirjoitti 27.10.2024 klo 12.40:
> > Im very pleased with my Airmaster.
> >
> > Very Robust
> > Very well made.
> > Good Performance improvements over my fixed pitch warp drive.
> > Maintains RPM set
> > 2000 hours between overhauls and with 100hour maintenance intervals.
> > Support is good and we have the European agent as Europa Owner.
> >
> > Its the heaviest of the VP props at 26lb
> > Its expensive.
> >
> > Wouldnt change it.
> >
> > Alan Burrill
> > G-OBJT
> > Sent from my iPad
> >
> >> On 27 Oct 2024, at 10:30, Paul Hawkins
> >> <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi chaps
> >>
> >> Im looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa,
> >> I need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
> >>
>
> ________________________________ Message 5
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 09:03:18 AM PST US
> From: Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> Paul,
> In my over 20 years dealing with the Airmaster (and Europa) I think my webs
> ite has all the information you need on choosing a constant speed propeller
> . (Keep in mind this is not a variable pitch only propeller, it is a const
> ant speed propeller.)
>
> The Europa with a 914 and Airmaster AP 330 three blade or AP420 two blade t
> ransforms the aircraft into a good economical 10,000+ ft cruiser. The 64 i
> nch propeller length is considered maximum for the Europa due to ground cle
> arance. I would not go any longer.
>
> On the 912S (100 HP) Rotax, it is excellent for shorter takeoff and gives y
> ou the best for optimum low altitude cruise in the normally aspirated Rotax
> . With a fuel leaning kit (HacMan), fuel efficiency improves at cruise at
> 7500 feet and you can pick up a bit of speed also. Your country regulation
> s must be adhered to concerning modifications to an engine.
>
> Attached is my now very old and hated by the prop blade manufacturers infor
> mation pdf on choosing the right blade for constant speed propeller operati
> ons on the Rotax. Nothing good happens after 67 to 68 inches on a Rotax ev
> en with a constant speed hub, but people keep trying. It is a short read a
> nd goes into why this is true. In all honesty, blade manufacturer performa
> nce is negated as the "performance is in the hub". Changing the pitch with
> speed is the key to performance. I'm including the installation manual fr
> om Airmaster as well for your review.
>
> The Airmaster is more expensive than some of our European competitor prop b
> uilders but when it comes to ease of installation, builder maintenance, rel
> iability and quick turn around on parts, the Airmaster has never left me st
> uck out. It is amazingly reliable. Service the hub once a year, change th
> e brushes around 300-500 hours and look at your blades for damage as on any
> propeller. Yes, you have to maintain an aircraft. No engine, prop, or el
> ectronic do dad works forever as humidity, age and lack of use or attention
> often shows up. The controller is almost bullet proof, but switches can g
> et corroded if kept near the salt water or the plane has sat in a humid env
> ironment for months on end without use. Simply clean your brush ring, clic
> k and wiggle switches that may corrode and if necessary, call a dealer or A
> irmaster direct with your issue and you will find troubleshooting is very s
> imple on any electric constant speed. The hub is strong and reliable, and
> the motor and switches in the hub are better than those 20 years ago. Airm
> aster is constantly improving their product.
>
> Final thoughts:
> The two blade AP420 is lighter at 19 pounds, and the three blade AP330 is s
> moother at 26 pounds. Speed difference is negligible ranging from 0-5 Knot
> s depending on altitude, RPM, and engine. The trigear cowl removal is easi
> er with the two blade on the Europa. If you have a Rotax belt drive altern
> ator, use the mini-slip ring through the prop shaft. Note that there can b
> e some interference from these alternators windings but there is an easy wo
> rk around for those noisy field windings on these Denso type alternators.
> There is no problem with the Rotax / Ducati alternator or interference with
> the propeller.
>
> I like to fly and look myself at equipment before I buy. I talk to owners,
> but still do my own research. I suggest you do the same. You will be har
> d pressed to find a disappointed Airmaster owner. A rule of thumb is if th
> e plane looks nasty and is not well kept, the owner may not be taking best
> care of his airplane, but somehow the Airmaster soldiers on even when negle
> cted.
>
> In the UK, your nearest dealer is Dirk Oyen in Belgium. He will set you up
> with a demo and or there are many UK owners with the Airmaster. He is very
> hands on and well versed in the Airmaster operations and any maintenance.
> Contact for Dirk: Hemelrijk 61, Heusen-Zolder, Limburg 3550, Belgium. E
> mail: dirk.oyen1@telenet.be<mailto:dirk.oyen1@telenet.be> , Phone: +32
> 477
> 25 80 28
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Bud Yerly
> Custom Flight Creations
> US Airmaster Dealer
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> <owner-europa-list-server@matr
> onics.com> on behalf of Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
> Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2024 6:28 AM
> Subject: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> Hi chaps
>
> I=92m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa, I n
> eed help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 6
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 10:07:50 AM PST US
> From: Peter Z <peterz@zutrasoft.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>
> --- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found ---
>
> A message with no text/plain MIME section was received.
> The entire body of the message was removed. Please
> resend the email using Plain Text formatting.
>
> HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section
> in their client's default configuration. If you're using
> HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings
> and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text".
>
> --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found ---
>
>
Message 3
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|
| Subject: | Re: Europa-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 10/27/24 |
Put a packing shim between the prop backplate and engine drive prop plate
On Mon, 28 Oct 2024, 09:07 James Kelly, <europajimkelly@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello Airmaster owners. I have a new Airmaster prop fitted by an aviation
> expert I understand that the clearance between the cowlings and spinner
> should be 6mm minimum to 12mm maximum. I have only 3.5mm how can I make
> the adjustment ???
>
> On Mon, 28 Oct 2024, 06:33 Europa-List Digest Server, <
> europa-list@matronics.com> wrote:
>
>> *
>>
>> ========================
>> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
>> ========================
>>
>> Today's complete Europa-List Digest can also be found in either of the
>> two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
>> in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
>> and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
>> of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
>> such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>>
>> HTML Version:
>>
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 24-10-27&Archive=Europa
>>
>> Text Version:
>>
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 24-10-27&Archive=Europa
>>
>>
>> ======================
>> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
>> ======================
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------
>> Europa-List Digest Archive
>> ---
>> Total Messages Posted Sun 10/27/24: 6
>> ----------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>> Today's Message Index:
>> ----------------------
>>
>> 1. 03:29 AM - Recommendations VP Prop (Paul Hawkins)
>> 2. 03:41 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Alan Burrill)
>> 3. 03:49 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (William Daniell)
>> 4. 05:52 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Raimo Toivio)
>> 5. 09:03 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Bud Yerly)
>> 6. 10:07 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Peter Z)
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 1
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 03:29:13 AM PST US
>> From: Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
>> Subject: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>>
>> Hi chaps
>>
>> I=92m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa, I
>> n
>> eed help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 2
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 03:41:35 AM PST US
>> From: Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk>
>> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>>
>> I=99m very pleased with my Airmaster.
>>
>> Very Robust
>> Very well made.
>> Good Performance improvements over my fixed pitch warp drive.
>> Maintains RPM set
>> 2000 hours between overhauls and with 100hour maintenance intervals.
>> Support is good and we have the European agent as Europa Owner.
>>
>> It=99s the heaviest of the VP props at 26lb
>> It=99s expensive.
>>
>> Wouldn=99t change it.
>>
>> Alan Burrill
>> G-OBJT
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> > On 27 Oct 2024, at 10:30, Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
>> wro
>> te:
>> >
>> > =EF=BB
>> > Hi chaps
>> >
>> > I=99m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Euro
>> pa, I need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>> >
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 3
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 03:49:08 AM PST US
>> From: William Daniell <wdaniell.longport@gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>>
>> I have an airmaster which has worked well and with good service...
>> surprisingly quick considering the factory is in nz.
>>
>> William Daniell
>> +1 786 878 0246
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 27, 2024, 12:30 Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Hi chaps
>> >
>> > I=99m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Eur
>> opa, I
>> > need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>> >
>> >
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 4
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 05:52:39 AM PST US
>> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>> From: Raimo Toivio <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>
>>
>> I do agree, Alan!
>>
>> Perfectly happy with it since 2008 and through 800 hours.
>>
>> First coil change when used well over 600 hours (old ones were still
>> usable).
>>
>> Dirk van Oyen - Europa Pilot [Mono OO-145) and Airmaster Expert from
>> Belgium, flew to my place and completed also The Dynamical Balancing
>> with his pro equipment.
>>
>> It was good (value < 0,2 IPS by chance), but now its smooth like my
>> iX50M, value next to 0,00 IPS [inches per second].
>>
>> I have Warp Drive Blades and have been happy with them.
>>
>> During the coming decade (!) however they must be upgraded to the next
>> level, which are...any recommendations?
>>
>>
>> allekirjoitus2 Cheers, Raimo Toivio
>>
>> signature
>>
>> Europa XS Monowheel OH-XRT #417 2007
>> Antonov AN-2 TDSRM AirCamper HA-MDO 1987
>>
>> 37800 Akaa
>> FINLAND
>> p. +358 3 3753 777
>> m. +358 40 590 1450
>> www.rwm.fi <http://www.rwm.fi/>
>> raimo.toivio@rwm.fi
>> Alan Burrill kirjoitti 27.10.2024 klo 12.40:
>> > Im very pleased with my Airmaster.
>> >
>> > Very Robust
>> > Very well made.
>> > Good Performance improvements over my fixed pitch warp drive.
>> > Maintains RPM set
>> > 2000 hours between overhauls and with 100hour maintenance intervals.
>> > Support is good and we have the European agent as Europa Owner.
>> >
>> > Its the heaviest of the VP props at 26lb
>> > Its expensive.
>> >
>> > Wouldnt change it.
>> >
>> > Alan Burrill
>> > G-OBJT
>> > Sent from my iPad
>> >
>> >> On 27 Oct 2024, at 10:30, Paul Hawkins
>> >> <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Hi chaps
>> >>
>> >> Im looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa,
>> >> I need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>> >>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 5
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 09:03:18 AM PST US
>> From: Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com>
>> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>>
>> Paul,
>> In my over 20 years dealing with the Airmaster (and Europa) I think my
>> webs
>> ite has all the information you need on choosing a constant speed
>> propeller
>> . (Keep in mind this is not a variable pitch only propeller, it is a
>> const
>> ant speed propeller.)
>>
>> The Europa with a 914 and Airmaster AP 330 three blade or AP420 two blade
>> t
>> ransforms the aircraft into a good economical 10,000+ ft cruiser. The 64
>> i
>> nch propeller length is considered maximum for the Europa due to ground
>> cle
>> arance. I would not go any longer.
>>
>> On the 912S (100 HP) Rotax, it is excellent for shorter takeoff and gives
>> y
>> ou the best for optimum low altitude cruise in the normally aspirated
>> Rotax
>> . With a fuel leaning kit (HacMan), fuel efficiency improves at cruise
>> at
>> 7500 feet and you can pick up a bit of speed also. Your country
>> regulation
>> s must be adhered to concerning modifications to an engine.
>>
>> Attached is my now very old and hated by the prop blade manufacturers
>> infor
>> mation pdf on choosing the right blade for constant speed propeller
>> operati
>> ons on the Rotax. Nothing good happens after 67 to 68 inches on a Rotax
>> ev
>> en with a constant speed hub, but people keep trying. It is a short read
>> a
>> nd goes into why this is true. In all honesty, blade manufacturer
>> performa
>> nce is negated as the "performance is in the hub". Changing the pitch
>> with
>> speed is the key to performance. I'm including the installation manual
>> fr
>> om Airmaster as well for your review.
>>
>> The Airmaster is more expensive than some of our European competitor prop
>> b
>> uilders but when it comes to ease of installation, builder maintenance,
>> rel
>> iability and quick turn around on parts, the Airmaster has never left me
>> st
>> uck out. It is amazingly reliable. Service the hub once a year, change
>> th
>> e brushes around 300-500 hours and look at your blades for damage as on
>> any
>> propeller. Yes, you have to maintain an aircraft. No engine, prop, or
>> el
>> ectronic do dad works forever as humidity, age and lack of use or
>> attention
>> often shows up. The controller is almost bullet proof, but switches can
>> g
>> et corroded if kept near the salt water or the plane has sat in a humid
>> env
>> ironment for months on end without use. Simply clean your brush ring,
>> clic
>> k and wiggle switches that may corrode and if necessary, call a dealer or
>> A
>> irmaster direct with your issue and you will find troubleshooting is very
>> s
>> imple on any electric constant speed. The hub is strong and reliable,
>> and
>> the motor and switches in the hub are better than those 20 years ago.
>> Airm
>> aster is constantly improving their product.
>>
>> Final thoughts:
>> The two blade AP420 is lighter at 19 pounds, and the three blade AP330 is
>> s
>> moother at 26 pounds. Speed difference is negligible ranging from 0-5
>> Knot
>> s depending on altitude, RPM, and engine. The trigear cowl removal is
>> easi
>> er with the two blade on the Europa. If you have a Rotax belt drive
>> altern
>> ator, use the mini-slip ring through the prop shaft. Note that there can
>> b
>> e some interference from these alternators windings but there is an easy
>> wo
>> rk around for those noisy field windings on these Denso type
>> alternators.
>> There is no problem with the Rotax / Ducati alternator or interference
>> with
>> the propeller.
>>
>> I like to fly and look myself at equipment before I buy. I talk to
>> owners,
>> but still do my own research. I suggest you do the same. You will be
>> har
>> d pressed to find a disappointed Airmaster owner. A rule of thumb is if
>> th
>> e plane looks nasty and is not well kept, the owner may not be taking
>> best
>> care of his airplane, but somehow the Airmaster soldiers on even when
>> negle
>> cted.
>>
>> In the UK, your nearest dealer is Dirk Oyen in Belgium. He will set you
>> up
>> with a demo and or there are many UK owners with the Airmaster. He is
>> very
>> hands on and well versed in the Airmaster operations and any
>> maintenance.
>> Contact for Dirk: Hemelrijk 61, Heusen-Zolder, Limburg 3550, Belgium.
>> E
>> mail: dirk.oyen1@telenet.be<mailto:dirk.oyen1@telenet.be> , Phone: +32
>> 477
>> 25 80 28
>>
>>
>> Best Regards,
>>
>> Bud Yerly
>> Custom Flight Creations
>> US Airmaster Dealer
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
>> <owner-europa-list-server@matr
>> onics.com> on behalf of Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>
>> Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2024 6:28 AM
>> Subject: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>>
>> Hi chaps
>>
>> I=92m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa, I
>> n
>> eed help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>>
>>
>> ________________________________ Message 6
>> _____________________________________
>>
>>
>> Time: 10:07:50 AM PST US
>> From: Peter Z <peterz@zutrasoft.com>
>> Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
>>
>> --- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found ---
>>
>> A message with no text/plain MIME section was received.
>> The entire body of the message was removed. Please
>> resend the email using Plain Text formatting.
>>
>> HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section
>> in their client's default configuration. If you're using
>> HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings
>> and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text".
>>
>> --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found ---
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ==========
>> pa-List" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">
>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List
>> ==========
>> FORUMS -
>> eferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
>> ==========
>> WIKI -
>> errer noreferrer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
>> ==========
>> b Site -
>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>> ="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">
>> https://matronics.com/contribution
>> ==========
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Europa-List Digest: |
6 Msgs - 10/27/24]
On 28 Oct 2024, at 08:52, James Kelly <europajimkelly@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello Airmaster owners. I have a new Airmaster prop fitted by an
aviation expert I understand that the clearance between the cowlings and
spinner should be 6mm minimum to 12mm maximum. I have only 3.5mm how
can I make the adjustment ???
{big snip of all other posts in the digest}
James - in my conversations with Neville Eyre, he said that the
clearance between spinner and cowl should be the thickness of 2 or 3
mixing sticks (about 3mm to 5mm). I have also heard from Andy Draper
that the ideal clearance is 3mm.
I sounds as though your setup is fine already - I wonder why Airmaster
would suggest a larger clearance than that recommended by the factory
experts.
in friendship
Rowland
| Rowland Carson ... that's Rowland with a 'w' ...
| <rowlandcarson@gmail.com> http://www.rowlandcarson.org.uk
| Skype, Twitter: rowland_carson Facebook: Rowland Carson
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Europa-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 10/27/24 |
James,
Leave it alone. 3.5 mm is frankly perfect. On the Europa with our particu
lar mounts the engine does not move as much as say a Pipistrel or other pla
nes using the larger Lycoming, Rotax 916 engines and their particular Dynaf
ocal mounts.
I personally install all my spinners between 1/8 and inch to =BC of an inch
(3.2mm to 6.4mm). Be sure to center your cowl on the spinner.
If the cowl is even on the top and one side but you see a smaller gap than
3.2 mm then I consider shimming the engine forward. I do not shim the prop
hub. Add a thin or thick AN-5 washer to your mount and move the engine sl
ightly forward to achieve your clearance. The Lord type mount we use on th
e Rotax/Europa FWF kit pulls the engine firmly to the mount with the spacer
s and on our little planes, the engine may sag roughly 2-3 mm over time. I
t is prudent to have the spinner on a new install very slightly above the c
owl so over time as the engine mounts relax, then it MAY drop into top alig
nment. If two sides of the spinner are at the correct spacing then the lar
ger gap on the other side can be filled and smoothed for that perfect finis
h.
Three popsicle sticks in the US (or my 10 inch diameter 3/16 inch plywood r
ing I made) was what I used to get the unpainted cowl alignment fit. That
gap of 3.2 to 4.8mm has worked for 25 years.
Even on a 5 year hose and rubber engine mount change, I use the original co
wl alignment to get my slight adjustments done to get the engine precisely
aligned with the new mounts/washer alignment. (Provided the original cowl
was aligned properly and the engine offset was correct.)
Best Regards,
Bud Yerly
Custom Flight Creations, Inc.
US Airmaster Dealer.
________________________________
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server@matr
onics.com> on behalf of James Kelly <europajimkelly@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, October 28, 2024 4:52 AM
Subject: Europa-List: Re: Europa-List Digest: 6 Msgs - 10/27/24
Hello Airmaster owners. I have a new Airmaster prop fitted by an aviation
expert I understand that the clearance between the cowlings and spinner sho
uld be 6mm minimum to 12mm maximum. I have only 3.5mm how can I make the a
djustment ???
On Mon, 28 Oct 2024, 06:33 Europa-List Digest Server, <europa-list@matronic
s.com<mailto:europa-list@matronics.com>> wrote:
*
========================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
========================
Today's complete Europa-List Digest can also be found in either of the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=htm
l&Chapter 24-10-27&Archive=Europa
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt
&Chapter 24-10-27&Archive=Europa
======================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
======================
----------------------------------------------------------
Europa-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Sun 10/27/24: 6
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:29 AM - Recommendations VP Prop (Paul Hawkins)
2. 03:41 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Alan Burrill)
3. 03:49 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (William Daniell)
4. 05:52 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Raimo Toivio)
5. 09:03 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Bud Yerly)
6. 10:07 AM - Re: Recommendations VP Prop (Peter Z)
________________________________ Message 1 ______________________________
_______
Time: 03:29:13 AM PST US
From: Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com<mailto:pwhawkinsbuilders@
hotmail.com>>
Subject: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
Hi chaps
I=92m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa, I
n
eed help on this one I would appreciate your response.
________________________________ Message 2 ______________________________
_______
Time: 03:41:35 AM PST US
From: Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk<mailto:alanb@dpy01.co.uk>>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
I=99m very pleased with my Airmaster.
Very Robust
Very well made.
Good Performance improvements over my fixed pitch warp drive.
Maintains RPM set
2000 hours between overhauls and with 100hour maintenance intervals.
Support is good and we have the European agent as Europa Owner.
It=99s the heaviest of the VP props at 26lb
It=99s expensive.
Wouldn=99t change it.
Alan Burrill
G-OBJT
Sent from my iPad
> On 27 Oct 2024, at 10:30, Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com<mai
lto:pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>> wro
te:
>
> =EF=BB
> Hi chaps
>
> I=99m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Euro
pa, I need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>
________________________________ Message 3 ______________________________
_______
Time: 03:49:08 AM PST US
From: William Daniell <wdaniell.longport@gmail.com<mailto:wdaniell.longport
@gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
I have an airmaster which has worked well and with good service...
surprisingly quick considering the factory is in nz.
William Daniell
+1 786 878 0246
On Sun, Oct 27, 2024, 12:30 Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com<mai
lto:pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>>
wrote:
> Hi chaps
>
> I=99m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Eur
opa, I
> need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>
>
________________________________ Message 4 ______________________________
_______
Time: 05:52:39 AM PST US
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
From: Raimo Toivio <raimo.toivio@rwm.fi<mailto:raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>>
I do agree, Alan!
Perfectly happy with it since 2008 and through 800 hours.
First coil change when used well over 600 hours (old ones were still
usable).
Dirk van Oyen - Europa Pilot [Mono OO-145) and Airmaster Expert from
Belgium, flew to my place and completed also The Dynamical Balancing
with his pro equipment.
It was good (value < 0,2 IPS by chance), but now its smooth like my
iX50M, value next to 0,00 IPS [inches per second].
I have Warp Drive Blades and have been happy with them.
During the coming decade (!) however they must be upgraded to the next
level, which are...any recommendations?
allekirjoitus2 Cheers, Raimo Toivio
signature
Europa XS Monowheel OH-XRT #417 2007
Antonov AN-2 TDSRM AirCamper HA-MDO 1987
37800 Akaa
FINLAND
p. +358 3 3753 777
m. +358 40 590 1450
www.rwm.fi<http://www.rwm.fi/> <http://www.rwm.fi/>
raimo.toivio@rwm.fi<mailto:raimo.toivio@rwm.fi>
Alan Burrill kirjoitti 27.10.2024 klo 12.40:
> Im very pleased with my Airmaster.
>
> Very Robust
> Very well made.
> Good Performance improvements over my fixed pitch warp drive.
> Maintains RPM set
> 2000 hours between overhauls and with 100hour maintenance intervals.
> Support is good and we have the European agent as Europa Owner.
>
> Its the heaviest of the VP props at 26lb
> Its expensive.
>
> Wouldnt change it.
>
> Alan Burrill
> G-OBJT
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On 27 Oct 2024, at 10:30, Paul Hawkins
>> <pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com<mailto:pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>> wr
ote:
>>
>>
>> Hi chaps
>>
>> Im looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa,
>> I need help on this one I would appreciate your response.
>>
________________________________ Message 5 ______________________________
_______
Time: 09:03:18 AM PST US
From: Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com<mailto:budyerly@msn.com>>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
Paul,
In my over 20 years dealing with the Airmaster (and Europa) I think my webs
ite has all the information you need on choosing a constant speed propeller
. (Keep in mind this is not a variable pitch only propeller, it is a const
ant speed propeller.)
The Europa with a 914 and Airmaster AP 330 three blade or AP420 two blade t
ransforms the aircraft into a good economical 10,000+ ft cruiser. The 64 i
nch propeller length is considered maximum for the Europa due to ground cle
arance. I would not go any longer.
On the 912S (100 HP) Rotax, it is excellent for shorter takeoff and gives y
ou the best for optimum low altitude cruise in the normally aspirated Rotax
. With a fuel leaning kit (HacMan), fuel efficiency improves at cruise at
7500 feet and you can pick up a bit of speed also. Your country regulation
s must be adhered to concerning modifications to an engine.
Attached is my now very old and hated by the prop blade manufacturers infor
mation pdf on choosing the right blade for constant speed propeller operati
ons on the Rotax. Nothing good happens after 67 to 68 inches on a Rotax ev
en with a constant speed hub, but people keep trying. It is a short read a
nd goes into why this is true. In all honesty, blade manufacturer performa
nce is negated as the "performance is in the hub". Changing the pitch with
speed is the key to performance. I'm including the installation manual fr
om Airmaster as well for your review.
The Airmaster is more expensive than some of our European competitor prop b
uilders but when it comes to ease of installation, builder maintenance, rel
iability and quick turn around on parts, the Airmaster has never left me st
uck out. It is amazingly reliable. Service the hub once a year, change th
e brushes around 300-500 hours and look at your blades for damage as on any
propeller. Yes, you have to maintain an aircraft. No engine, prop, or el
ectronic do dad works forever as humidity, age and lack of use or attention
often shows up. The controller is almost bullet proof, but switches can g
et corroded if kept near the salt water or the plane has sat in a humid env
ironment for months on end without use. Simply clean your brush ring, clic
k and wiggle switches that may corrode and if necessary, call a dealer or A
irmaster direct with your issue and you will find troubleshooting is very s
imple on any electric constant speed. The hub is strong and reliable, and
the motor and switches in the hub are better than those 20 years ago. Airm
aster is constantly improving their product.
Final thoughts:
The two blade AP420 is lighter at 19 pounds, and the three blade AP330 is s
moother at 26 pounds. Speed difference is negligible ranging from 0-5 Knot
s depending on altitude, RPM, and engine. The trigear cowl removal is easi
er with the two blade on the Europa. If you have a Rotax belt drive altern
ator, use the mini-slip ring through the prop shaft. Note that there can b
e some interference from these alternators windings but there is an easy wo
rk around for those noisy field windings on these Denso type alternators.
There is no problem with the Rotax / Ducati alternator or interference with
the propeller.
I like to fly and look myself at equipment before I buy. I talk to owners,
but still do my own research. I suggest you do the same. You will be har
d pressed to find a disappointed Airmaster owner. A rule of thumb is if th
e plane looks nasty and is not well kept, the owner may not be taking best
care of his airplane, but somehow the Airmaster soldiers on even when negle
cted.
In the UK, your nearest dealer is Dirk Oyen in Belgium. He will set you up
with a demo and or there are many UK owners with the Airmaster. He is very
hands on and well versed in the Airmaster operations and any maintenance.
Contact for Dirk: Hemelrijk 61, Heusen-Zolder, Limburg 3550, Belgium. E
mail: dirk.oyen1@telenet.be<mailto:dirk.oyen1@telenet.be><mailto:dirk.oyen1
@telenet.be<mailto:dirk.oyen1@telenet.be>> , Phone: +32 477
25 80 28
Best Regards,
Bud Yerly
Custom Flight Creations
US Airmaster Dealer
________________________________
From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-europa-list-serve
r@matronics.com> <owner-europa-list-server@matr
onics.com<http://onics.com/>> on behalf of Paul Hawkins <pwhawkinsbuilders@
hotmail.com<mailto:pwhawkinsbuilders@hotmail.com>>
Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2024 6:28 AM
Subject: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
Hi chaps
I=92m looking for recommendations for a VP prop for my trike XS Europa, I
n
eed help on this one I would appreciate your response.
________________________________ Message 6 ______________________________
_______
Time: 10:07:50 AM PST US
From: Peter Z <peterz@zutrasoft.com<mailto:peterz@zutrasoft.com>>
Subject: Re: Europa-List: Recommendations VP Prop
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HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings
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