---------------------------------------------------------- FEWMustang-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 04/04/04: 8 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 11:37 AM - Re: sanding (LRE2@aol.com) 2. 11:56 AM - Re: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding (Harold Anderson) 3. 12:53 PM - Re: Re: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding (HMS23TURBO@aol.com) 4. 01:01 PM - Re: Re: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding (LRE2@aol.com) 5. 01:26 PM - Re: Re: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding (melvinke@direcway.com) 6. 03:16 PM - Re: FEW Mustang-List: Re: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding (Harold Anderson) 7. 04:27 PM - Re: Re: FEW Mustang-List: Re: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding (PolymerDesign@aol.com) 8. 05:22 PM - Re: Re: FEW Mustang-List: Re: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding (LRE2@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 11:37:25 AM PST US From: LRE2@aol.com Subject: FEWMustang-List: Re: sanding --> FEWMustang-List message posted by: LRE2@aol.com Gary, Most of the pro painters I have talked to say that paint will nicely fill surfaces sanded to #320, so there is little point in going any finer. Wet sanding adds little, and need not be done until the final sanding. However, I usually keep a wet rag handy, just to wipe down the surface that I'm working on to remove the dust and help me see better. You can get long rolls of adhesive backed sandpaper at your local autobody and paint store. I find that I try to use a piece of sandpaper far to long. When it begins to stop cutting, throw it away and get a fresh piece! As to imbedding nuts in various surfaces, ie faring attachment, I have developed a technique which is cheap and very durable. I think I'll write up a little" How to" article. Jim's technique just didn't work for me. The Book binders nuts are aluminum and strip out easily. They also tend to spin in the holes. Ed is machining some steel "Bobbins" which look to me as though they should work. However, you're going to need a lot of them and they will be spendy to make. I used steel "T-Nuts" from the hardware store, you know the ones with the three barbs on them for pennies a piece and bonded them in using a spot facer to remove the outer skin. LRE ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 11:56:11 AM PST US From: "Harold Anderson" Subject: FEWMustang-List: RE: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding --> FEWMustang-List message posted by: "Harold Anderson" Guys, Hi this is Andy Anderson, I've got my fuselage about 90% complete, I bought Ed's bobbins to use in the fairing installation but I've thought about simply using 1/8" aluminum pull rivets to install the fairings, for the number of times you have to remove the fairing it seems to make more sense, if you do have to remove them simply drill them out and replace them. The direction of airflow over the fuselage presses the fairings on to the fuselage, so there is little or no stress in the attachments, if there was Jims book bindings would fail long before pull rivets would. Any thoughts on this? Andy -----Original Message----- From: owner-fewmustang-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-fewmustang-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of LRE2@aol.com Subject: FEWMustang-List: Re: sanding --> FEWMustang-List message posted by: LRE2@aol.com Gary, Most of the pro painters I have talked to say that paint will nicely fill surfaces sanded to #320, so there is little point in going any finer. Wet sanding adds little, and need not be done until the final sanding. However, I usually keep a wet rag handy, just to wipe down the surface that I'm working on to remove the dust and help me see better. You can get long rolls of adhesive backed sandpaper at your local autobody and paint store. I find that I try to use a piece of sandpaper far to long. When it begins to stop cutting, throw it away and get a fresh piece! As to imbedding nuts in various surfaces, ie faring attachment, I have developed a technique which is cheap and very durable. I think I'll write up a little" How to" article. Jim's technique just didn't work for me. The Book binders nuts are aluminum and strip out easily. They also tend to spin in the holes. Ed is machining some steel "Bobbins" which look to me as though they should work. However, you're going to need a lot of them and they will be spendy to make. I used steel "T-Nuts" from the hardware store, you know the ones with the three barbs on them for pennies a piece and bonded them in using a spot facer to remove the outer skin. LRE == == == == ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:53:55 PM PST US From: HMS23TURBO@aol.com Subject: Re: FEWMustang-List: RE: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding --> FEWMustang-List message posted by: HMS23TURBO@aol.com Andy, Don't use rivets. You are going to take the fairings off many times over the life of the plane and the rivet holes will get bigger and bigger every time you drill them out. You're gonna end up with either huge rivets to fill the holes eventually or repairing the used up skin. Put the bobbins in. Period. They are stainless just like the 6-32 screws that will screw into them. Take the time now and you'll never have an issue. The fairings will have forces trying to peel them off in flight and aluminum pop rivets won't be anywhere near strong enough. Ed ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 01:01:09 PM PST US From: LRE2@aol.com Subject: Re: FEWMustang-List: RE: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding --> FEWMustang-List message posted by: LRE2@aol.com Andy, I have had my farings on and off a dozen times so far. At very least they will need to be removed every annual to check the horizontal stab and wing mount bolts. LRE ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 01:26:35 PM PST US From: melvinke@direcway.com Subject: Re: FEWMustang-List: RE: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding --> FEWMustang-List message posted by: melvinke@direcway.com My experience with aluminum pull rivets for composite fairings has not been good. Some will inevitably spin when drilled, particulary as they heat up during the process, and leave a hole you can cover again with a Tinnerman washer and new rivet, but not very satisfying. Ken Melvin, N51KX ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 03:16:10 PM PST US From: "Harold Anderson" Subject: FEWMustang-List: RE: FEW Mustang-List: RE: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding --> FEWMustang-List message posted by: "Harold Anderson" Thanks for the reply everyone, I'll go with the bobbins. Ed what did you use as a syringe to put in the adhesive? Andy -----Original Message----- From: owner-fewmustang-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-fewmustang-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of HMS23TURBO@aol.com Subject: Re: FEWMustang-List: RE: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding --> FEWMustang-List message posted by: HMS23TURBO@aol.com Andy, Don't use rivets. You are going to take the fairings off many times over the life of the plane and the rivet holes will get bigger and bigger every time you drill them out. You're gonna end up with either huge rivets to fill the holes eventually or repairing the used up skin. Put the bobbins in. Period. They are stainless just like the 6-32 screws that will screw into them. Take the time now and you'll never have an issue. The fairings will have forces trying to peel them off in flight and aluminum pop rivets won't be anywhere near strong enough. Ed == == == == ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 04:27:55 PM PST US From: PolymerDesign@aol.com Subject: Re: FEWMustang-List: RE: FEW Mustang-List: RE: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding --> FEWMustang-List message posted by: PolymerDesign@aol.com Wicks handles a nice cheap plastic syringe that you can cut the tip to any angle and size. Ken ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:22:44 PM PST US From: LRE2@aol.com Subject: Re: FEWMustang-List: RE: FEW Mustang-List: RE: FEW Mustang-List: Re: sanding --> FEWMustang-List message posted by: LRE2@aol.com I use disposable icing bags, from Aircraft Spruce P/N 01-1471 $18.20 for 100 bags. At 18 cents a bag, WAY cheaper than syringes. And you will use lots of them. They are also very useful during wing closing. You can make the aperture what ever you need for the current application. LRE