Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:10 AM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Lynn Matteson)
2. 06:32 AM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Lynn Matteson)
3. 07:03 AM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Andy Silvester)
4. 07:58 AM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Fred Hulen)
5. 09:58 AM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Lynn Matteson)
6. 10:29 AM - Re: Valve rocker shaft / bearing wear (Andy Silvester)
7. 12:44 PM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Jabiru USA)
8. 02:06 PM - Re: Re: Valve rocker shaft / bearing wear (Lynn Matteson)
9. 02:11 PM - Re: cam shaft bearings (Peter Harris)
10. 02:16 PM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Peter Harris)
11. 02:44 PM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Jabiru USA)
12. 02:45 PM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Lynn Matteson)
13. 03:58 PM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Lynn Matteson)
14. 04:02 PM - Re: cam shaft bearings (Lynn Matteson)
15. 08:13 PM - Re: cam shaft bearings (JohnDRead@aol.com)
16. 10:05 PM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Peter Harris)
17. 10:23 PM - Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Peter Harris)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
What kind/make prop? Mine's a Sensenich, and was smooth running from
the git-go. My engine started out smooth as silk, but over the hours
got mild vibration due to the valve lash loosening. After each new
setting, back to smooth again.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
On May 9, 2007, at 12:10 AM, Peter Harris wrote:
> <peterjfharris@bigpond.com>
>
> I got a vast improvement in smooth running when I had my wooden prop
> dynamically balanced even though I had spent hours to achieve a
> perfect
> static balance. When the dynamic weights were added it was like a new
> engine.
> Peter J3300 25hrs
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
I don't know who this question if for , because you didn't include at
least a snippet of the post you're referring to, but I'll take a
chance it was about the valve lash/rocker arm bushing thread.
No, I didn't email the factory, because I've always heard that the
factory doesn't answer their emails. Besides, I've always had good
luck just phoning the dealers here in the USA. That is until another,
previous problem, came up and I never got an answer to my 2 emails
(including pictures) to each of the 3 US dealers....solved that one
on my own.
I guess it wouldn't hurt to email the factory, and see what they have
to say. I'm not trying to bad mouth the dealers, I just want to get
some answers, or alert somebody to a possible problem.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
do not archive
On May 9, 2007, at 12:35 AM, JohnDRead@aol.com wrote:
> Did you try emailing the factory rather than the dealer about this
> problem?
>
> John Read
> do not archive
>
>
> See what's free at AOL.com.
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?JabiruEngine-List _-
> ===========================================================
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
do not archive
Message 3
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| Subject: | [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
Hello Lynn,
I'm (also) unaware of any particular wear issue with rocker shafts or rocker
bushings but admittedly where I'd done 'early' top-overhauls due to head
overheating or other issues I have noticed wear on the rocker shafts and
have replaced the affected ones along with the respective rocker bushings.
With the head off it's an easy and therefore inexpensive job. From memory,
I've done this with heads at 350 hours onwards, but I hasten to add not on
all heads. Some at much higher times have been OK.
In looking for a cause of higher-than-normal wear, we should consider the
following:
1. Oil feed integrity; meaning that a blockage in any part of the oil feed
line to the valve gear will compromise lubrication. If you get the usual
'teaspoon' of oil come out of the valve chamber when you take the cover off,
your lubrication is probably OK. The oil-way from the feed into the chamber
is a small slot right above each valve spring and you can check these by
sticking a piece of (e.g.) locking wire in there and checking for an
obstruction.
2. The rocker shafts are lubricated by splash from the valve chamber and
there should be (depending on serial number) an oil hole in the rocker which
you can check for obstructions. I don't have my dealer tech. info book with
me right now (you find me in UK for a week or two) so I'm going from memory
and there have been changes in rocker design, offset, gearing, etc over the
years.
Hope this helps - let me know if not.
Andy
Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc.
39248 South Ave, Zephyrhills, FL 33542
Tel: (813) 779 2324 Fax: (813) 779 2246
www.suncoastjabiru.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
Matteson
Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 2:35 PM
Subject: Re: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
I don't know who this question if for , because you didn't include at
least a snippet of the post you're referring to, but I'll take a
chance it was about the valve lash/rocker arm bushing thread.
No, I didn't email the factory, because I've always heard that the
factory doesn't answer their emails. Besides, I've always had good
luck just phoning the dealers here in the USA. That is until another,
previous problem, came up and I never got an answer to my 2 emails
(including pictures) to each of the 3 US dealers....solved that one
on my own.
I guess it wouldn't hurt to email the factory, and see what they have
to say. I'm not trying to bad mouth the dealers, I just want to get
some answers, or alert somebody to a possible problem.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
do not archive
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
> I got a vast improvement in smooth running when I had my wooden prop
> dynamically balanced even though I had spent hours to achieve a perfect
> static balance. When the dynamic weights were added it was like a new
> engine.
> Peter J3300 25hrs
++ Hey Peter, please tell me more about the particular process you went
through to dynamically balance your prop. I went to a specialty place to
have mine done but after about an hour of applying sensors and getting all
of their equipment ready to actually do it, the guy asked that I run the
engine at 2500 rpm for 5 minutes! My cooling is just fine in normal
operations but there's no way could I sit there on the ground and run it at
2500 rpms for 5 minutes without getting too hot. Please tell me some of the
particulars when you had yours done.
Thanks
Fred
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
Hi Andy-
Hope things are going well in the UK (I spoke with Dave A. at your
place yesterday).
1. I've always had the teaspoon of oil...maybe a little
less...when removing covers, but this time I got some brass
particles. That prompted the shaft removal, and subsequent bushing
wear discovery. Jim at Pacific Jab suggested drilling the hole in the
delivery tube fitting *one* decimal-size drill larger, which I did,
going from the (found).059" to .063". I've ordered brass bushings of
the oil-retention type as replacement bushings for the teflon coated
that are presently in my engine (Serial #2062). I blew through the
rubber tee fitting while I had the delivery tube removed, and all
lines to above the valves are clear.
2. My rockers had no oil hole in them until I decided that there
was a need for one, so I drilled a hole in each one, which will allow
splash oil to feed the bushing. This hole is vertical to the position
of the rocker, and will allow the oil to enter the rocker at the
point where there is no load between the shaft and the rocker arm.
Thanks for the reply Andy, and I'll keep the group posted. By the
way, did you get the pictures of my distributor shaft problem? I sent
them to you, Pete, and Jim.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
On May 9, 2007, at 10:02 AM, Andy Silvester wrote:
> <andy@suncoastjabiru.com>
>
> Hello Lynn,
>
> I'm (also) unaware of any particular wear issue with rocker shafts
> or rocker
> bushings but admittedly where I'd done 'early' top-overhauls due to
> head
> overheating or other issues I have noticed wear on the rocker
> shafts and
> have replaced the affected ones along with the respective rocker
> bushings.
> With the head off it's an easy and therefore inexpensive job. From
> memory,
> I've done this with heads at 350 hours onwards, but I hasten to add
> not on
> all heads. Some at much higher times have been OK.
>
> In looking for a cause of higher-than-normal wear, we should
> consider the
> following:
>
> 1. Oil feed integrity; meaning that a blockage in any part of the
> oil feed
> line to the valve gear will compromise lubrication. If you get the
> usual
> 'teaspoon' of oil come out of the valve chamber when you take the
> cover off,
> your lubrication is probably OK. The oil-way from the feed into the
> chamber
> is a small slot right above each valve spring and you can check
> these by
> sticking a piece of (e.g.) locking wire in there and checking for an
> obstruction.
> 2. The rocker shafts are lubricated by splash from the valve
> chamber and
> there should be (depending on serial number) an oil hole in the
> rocker which
> you can check for obstructions. I don't have my dealer tech. info
> book with
> me right now (you find me in UK for a week or two) so I'm going
> from memory
> and there have been changes in rocker design, offset, gearing, etc
> over the
> years.
>
> Hope this helps - let me know if not.
>
> Andy
>
> Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc.
> 39248 South Ave, Zephyrhills, FL 33542
> Tel: (813) 779 2324 Fax: (813) 779 2246
> www.suncoastjabiru.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Lynn
> Matteson
> Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 2:35 PM
> To: jabiruengine-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo
> Share
> Available!
>
> <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
> I don't know who this question if for , because you didn't include at
> least a snippet of the post you're referring to, but I'll take a
> chance it was about the valve lash/rocker arm bushing thread.
> No, I didn't email the factory, because I've always heard that the
> factory doesn't answer their emails. Besides, I've always had good
> luck just phoning the dealers here in the USA. That is until another,
> previous problem, came up and I never got an answer to my 2 emails
> (including pictures) to each of the 3 US dealers....solved that one
> on my own.
> I guess it wouldn't hurt to email the factory, and see what they have
> to say. I'm not trying to bad mouth the dealers, I just want to get
> some answers, or alert somebody to a possible problem.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Grass Lake, Michigan
> Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
> flying w/275+ hrs
> do not archive
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | RE: Valve rocker shaft / bearing wear |
Lynn,
You seem to have done all that is necessary in investigating and remedying
the problem.
I note your email about distributor shaft scoring where the oil seals ride,
but there were no pictures. I don't have a 'quick fix' for that issue
either; it's certainly not a usual occurrence - either oil leaking past the
seal or scoring of the shaft by the seal, and certainly not at the hours you
have. Those seals are usually pretty good but my guess is the one that was
leaking must have been damaged - maybe from new, and the one that scored the
other shaft had picked-up an abrasive particle in the seal. Unlikely? Yes,
but possible. I've seen many bearing / shaft instances where the (relatively
soft) bearing is in good condition, yet the (much harder) shaft has been
worn down. This is due to abrasive particles bedding into the soft bearing
(or in your case seal) material, and cutting away at the harder shaft.
Again, it seems you were unlucky in having these issues but no doubt you
have rectified them.
Andy
Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc.
39248 South Ave, Zephyrhills, FL 33542
Tel: (813) 779 2324 Fax: (813) 779 2246
www.suncoastjabiru.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
Matteson
Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 6:01 PM
Subject: Re: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
Hi Andy-
Hope things are going well in the UK (I spoke with Dave A. at your
place yesterday).
1. I've always had the teaspoon of oil...maybe a little
less...when removing covers, but this time I got some brass
particles. That prompted the shaft removal, and subsequent bushing
wear discovery. Jim at Pacific Jab suggested drilling the hole in the
delivery tube fitting *one* decimal-size drill larger, which I did,
going from the (found).059" to .063". I've ordered brass bushings of
the oil-retention type as replacement bushings for the teflon coated
that are presently in my engine (Serial #2062). I blew through the
rubber tee fitting while I had the delivery tube removed, and all
lines to above the valves are clear.
2. My rockers had no oil hole in them until I decided that there
was a need for one, so I drilled a hole in each one, which will allow
splash oil to feed the bushing. This hole is vertical to the position
of the rocker, and will allow the oil to enter the rocker at the
point where there is no load between the shaft and the rocker arm.
Thanks for the reply Andy, and I'll keep the group posted. By the
way, did you get the pictures of my distributor shaft problem? I sent
them to you, Pete, and Jim.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
On May 9, 2007, at 10:02 AM, Andy Silvester wrote:
> <andy@suncoastjabiru.com>
>
> Hello Lynn,
>
> I'm (also) unaware of any particular wear issue with rocker shafts
> or rocker
> bushings but admittedly where I'd done 'early' top-overhauls due to
> head
> overheating or other issues I have noticed wear on the rocker
> shafts and
> have replaced the affected ones along with the respective rocker
> bushings.
> With the head off it's an easy and therefore inexpensive job. From
> memory,
> I've done this with heads at 350 hours onwards, but I hasten to add
> not on
> all heads. Some at much higher times have been OK.
>
> In looking for a cause of higher-than-normal wear, we should
> consider the
> following:
>
> 1. Oil feed integrity; meaning that a blockage in any part of the
> oil feed
> line to the valve gear will compromise lubrication. If you get the
> usual
> 'teaspoon' of oil come out of the valve chamber when you take the
> cover off,
> your lubrication is probably OK. The oil-way from the feed into the
> chamber
> is a small slot right above each valve spring and you can check
> these by
> sticking a piece of (e.g.) locking wire in there and checking for an
> obstruction.
> 2. The rocker shafts are lubricated by splash from the valve
> chamber and
> there should be (depending on serial number) an oil hole in the
> rocker which
> you can check for obstructions. I don't have my dealer tech. info
> book with
> me right now (you find me in UK for a week or two) so I'm going
> from memory
> and there have been changes in rocker design, offset, gearing, etc
> over the
> years.
>
> Hope this helps - let me know if not.
>
> Andy
>
> Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc.
> 39248 South Ave, Zephyrhills, FL 33542
> Tel: (813) 779 2324 Fax: (813) 779 2246
> www.suncoastjabiru.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Lynn
> Matteson
> Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 2:35 PM
> To: jabiruengine-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo
> Share
> Available!
>
> <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
> I don't know who this question if for , because you didn't include at
> least a snippet of the post you're referring to, but I'll take a
> chance it was about the valve lash/rocker arm bushing thread.
> No, I didn't email the factory, because I've always heard that the
> factory doesn't answer their emails. Besides, I've always had good
> luck just phoning the dealers here in the USA. That is until another,
> previous problem, came up and I never got an answer to my 2 emails
> (including pictures) to each of the 3 US dealers....solved that one
> on my own.
> I guess it wouldn't hurt to email the factory, and see what they have
> to say. I'm not trying to bad mouth the dealers, I just want to get
> some answers, or alert somebody to a possible problem.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Grass Lake, Michigan
> Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
> flying w/275+ hrs
> do not archive
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
Lynn,
I've been looking through past emails and do not see one from you with
photos of the rocker shaft or bushing.
Pete Krotje
Jabiru USA Sport Aircraft, LLC
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
Matteson
Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 12:01 PM
Subject: Re: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
Hi Andy-
Hope things are going well in the UK (I spoke with Dave A. at your
place yesterday).
1. I've always had the teaspoon of oil...maybe a little
less...when removing covers, but this time I got some brass
particles. That prompted the shaft removal, and subsequent bushing
wear discovery. Jim at Pacific Jab suggested drilling the hole in the
delivery tube fitting *one* decimal-size drill larger, which I did,
going from the (found).059" to .063". I've ordered brass bushings of
the oil-retention type as replacement bushings for the teflon coated
that are presently in my engine (Serial #2062). I blew through the
rubber tee fitting while I had the delivery tube removed, and all
lines to above the valves are clear.
2. My rockers had no oil hole in them until I decided that there
was a need for one, so I drilled a hole in each one, which will allow
splash oil to feed the bushing. This hole is vertical to the position
of the rocker, and will allow the oil to enter the rocker at the
point where there is no load between the shaft and the rocker arm.
Thanks for the reply Andy, and I'll keep the group posted. By the
way, did you get the pictures of my distributor shaft problem? I sent
them to you, Pete, and Jim.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
On May 9, 2007, at 10:02 AM, Andy Silvester wrote:
> <andy@suncoastjabiru.com>
>
> Hello Lynn,
>
> I'm (also) unaware of any particular wear issue with rocker shafts
> or rocker
> bushings but admittedly where I'd done 'early' top-overhauls due to
> head
> overheating or other issues I have noticed wear on the rocker
> shafts and
> have replaced the affected ones along with the respective rocker
> bushings.
> With the head off it's an easy and therefore inexpensive job. From
> memory,
> I've done this with heads at 350 hours onwards, but I hasten to add
> not on
> all heads. Some at much higher times have been OK.
>
> In looking for a cause of higher-than-normal wear, we should
> consider the
> following:
>
> 1. Oil feed integrity; meaning that a blockage in any part of the
> oil feed
> line to the valve gear will compromise lubrication. If you get the
> usual
> 'teaspoon' of oil come out of the valve chamber when you take the
> cover off,
> your lubrication is probably OK. The oil-way from the feed into the
> chamber
> is a small slot right above each valve spring and you can check
> these by
> sticking a piece of (e.g.) locking wire in there and checking for an
> obstruction.
> 2. The rocker shafts are lubricated by splash from the valve
> chamber and
> there should be (depending on serial number) an oil hole in the
> rocker which
> you can check for obstructions. I don't have my dealer tech. info
> book with
> me right now (you find me in UK for a week or two) so I'm going
> from memory
> and there have been changes in rocker design, offset, gearing, etc
> over the
> years.
>
> Hope this helps - let me know if not.
>
> Andy
>
> Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc.
> 39248 South Ave, Zephyrhills, FL 33542
> Tel: (813) 779 2324 Fax: (813) 779 2246
> www.suncoastjabiru.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Lynn
> Matteson
> Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 2:35 PM
> To: jabiruengine-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo
> Share
> Available!
>
> <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
> I don't know who this question if for , because you didn't include at
> least a snippet of the post you're referring to, but I'll take a
> chance it was about the valve lash/rocker arm bushing thread.
> No, I didn't email the factory, because I've always heard that the
> factory doesn't answer their emails. Besides, I've always had good
> luck just phoning the dealers here in the USA. That is until another,
> previous problem, came up and I never got an answer to my 2 emails
> (including pictures) to each of the 3 US dealers....solved that one
> on my own.
> I guess it wouldn't hurt to email the factory, and see what they have
> to say. I'm not trying to bad mouth the dealers, I just want to get
> some answers, or alert somebody to a possible problem.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Grass Lake, Michigan
> Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
> flying w/275+ hrs
> do not archive
>
Message 8
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|
| Subject: | Re: RE: Valve rocker shaft / bearing wear |
Andy-
Yes, that problem has been cured. New seals, new caps and rotors, and
a little product call "Speedi Sleeve". I also drilled a hole in the
lower area of each cap so I could feel there and see if the fix was
still working.
In the email to you, Pete, and Jim, I ended with "I have pictures
available" (or something like that), and Jim responded that he would
like to see them. I sent to him, and CC'd you and Pete. They were
sent via Kodak EasyShare. If you'd like to see them, holler. I sent
them about 3/24/2007 or thereabouts.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
On May 9, 2007, at 1:27 PM, Andy Silvester wrote:
> <andy@suncoastjabiru.com>
>
> Lynn,
>
> You seem to have done all that is necessary in investigating and
> remedying
> the problem.
>
> I note your email about distributor shaft scoring where the oil
> seals ride,
> but there were no pictures. I don't have a 'quick fix' for that issue
> either; it's certainly not a usual occurrence - either oil leaking
> past the
> seal or scoring of the shaft by the seal, and certainly not at the
> hours you
> have. Those seals are usually pretty good but my guess is the one
> that was
> leaking must have been damaged - maybe from new, and the one that
> scored the
> other shaft had picked-up an abrasive particle in the seal.
> Unlikely? Yes,
> but possible. I've seen many bearing / shaft instances where the
> (relatively
> soft) bearing is in good condition, yet the (much harder) shaft has
> been
> worn down. This is due to abrasive particles bedding into the soft
> bearing
> (or in your case seal) material, and cutting away at the harder shaft.
> Again, it seems you were unlucky in having these issues but no
> doubt you
> have rectified them.
>
> Andy
>
> Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc.
> 39248 South Ave, Zephyrhills, FL 33542
> Tel: (813) 779 2324 Fax: (813) 779 2246
> www.suncoastjabiru.com
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | cam shaft bearings |
Lynn,
I have noticed that my J3300 oil temp is probably too low ie say 50 to 80
deg C . Is that a factor in your bearing failure do you think?
You mentioned a reference to the bearing material. Is there a quality issue
with this product?
When you have a better bearing I would appreciate the product details. Like
you I am out of warranty and want to prepare for independence in the future.
I am based a couple of hours from the factory. Like almost every other
Aviation product supplier I found resistance to any admission of a product
design problem. The best contact I have there is Doug Smith.
Can you tell us about the other problem.?
Regards
Peter H
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
Matteson
Sent: Wednesday, 9 May 2007 11:35 PM
Subject: Re: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
I don't know who this question if for , because you didn't include at
least a snippet of the post you're referring to, but I'll take a
chance it was about the valve lash/rocker arm bushing thread.
No, I didn't email the factory, because I've always heard that the
factory doesn't answer their emails. Besides, I've always had good
luck just phoning the dealers here in the USA. That is until another,
previous problem, came up and I never got an answer to my 2 emails
(including pictures) to each of the 3 US dealers....solved that one
on my own.
I guess it wouldn't hurt to email the factory, and see what they have
to say. I'm not trying to bad mouth the dealers, I just want to get
some answers, or alert somebody to a possible problem.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
do not archive
On May 9, 2007, at 12:35 AM, JohnDRead@aol.com wrote:
> Did you try emailing the factory rather than the dealer about this
> problem?
>
> John Read
> do not archive
>
>
> See what's free at AOL.com.
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?JabiruEngine-List _-
> ===========================================================
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
do not archive
Message 10
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| Subject: | [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
Lynn
My prop is from Ed Sterba and I have been trimming it, also there were
issues with the spinner backing plate. But my experience proved that static
balance was not enough. It was not until dynamic balance that I discovered
how smooth is smooth.
By valve lash do you mean that the tappet clearances were regularly becoming
uneven?
Peter H
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
Matteson
Sent: Wednesday, 9 May 2007 11:13 PM
Subject: Re: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
What kind/make prop? Mine's a Sensenich, and was smooth running from
the git-go. My engine started out smooth as silk, but over the hours
got mild vibration due to the valve lash loosening. After each new
setting, back to smooth again.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
On May 9, 2007, at 12:10 AM, Peter Harris wrote:
> <peterjfharris@bigpond.com>
>
> I got a vast improvement in smooth running when I had my wooden prop
> dynamically balanced even though I had spent hours to achieve a
> perfect
> static balance. When the dynamic weights were added it was like a new
> engine.
> Peter J3300 25hrs
Message 11
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| Subject: | [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
Peter,
Where did you attach the weights to the prop or spinner to balance it? How
much weight did it take? We are about to go into the dynamic balancing
business and are not sure just yet as to where to attach the weights.
Pete Krotje
Jabiru USA Sport Aircraft, LLC
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter
Harris
Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 4:15 PM
Subject: RE: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
<peterjfharris@bigpond.com>
Lynn
My prop is from Ed Sterba and I have been trimming it, also there were
issues with the spinner backing plate. But my experience proved that static
balance was not enough. It was not until dynamic balance that I discovered
how smooth is smooth.
By valve lash do you mean that the tappet clearances were regularly becoming
uneven?
Peter H
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
Matteson
Sent: Wednesday, 9 May 2007 11:13 PM
Subject: Re: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
What kind/make prop? Mine's a Sensenich, and was smooth running from
the git-go. My engine started out smooth as silk, but over the hours
got mild vibration due to the valve lash loosening. After each new
setting, back to smooth again.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
On May 9, 2007, at 12:10 AM, Peter Harris wrote:
> <peterjfharris@bigpond.com>
>
> I got a vast improvement in smooth running when I had my wooden prop
> dynamically balanced even though I had spent hours to achieve a
> perfect
> static balance. When the dynamic weights were added it was like a new
> engine.
> Peter J3300 25hrs
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
I haven't sent them out yet, Pete, but I will. They will be via Kodak
EasyShare. I'll even send them to you, Andy and Jim separately, just
in case Kodak doesn't understand CC'ing.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
On May 9, 2007, at 3:44 PM, Jabiru USA wrote:
> <info@usjabiru.com>
>
> Lynn,
>
> I've been looking through past emails and do not see one from you with
> photos of the rocker shaft or bushing.
>
> Pete Krotje
> Jabiru USA Sport Aircraft, LLC
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
Yes, valve lash is what it is sometimes referred to over here. It
used to be called tappet clearance (in the days of flathead engines)
when in fact you were setting the clearances *at* the tappet (cam
follower), but with overhead valve engines, the term valve clearance
or valve lash is used...here at least. When dealing with a small
number of cylinders, any cylinder which has its valves mis-adjusted
will operate at less power than the others, causing the vibration or
imbalance. This is partly due to less *effective* camshaft lift
(looser clearance setting), or maybe keeping the valve open when it
should be closed (tighter to 'zero' clearance setting).
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
do not archive
On May 9, 2007, at 5:14 PM, Peter Harris wrote:
> <peterjfharris@bigpond.com>
>
> Lynn
> My prop is from Ed Sterba and I have been trimming it, also there were
> issues with the spinner backing plate. But my experience proved
> that static
> balance was not enough. It was not until dynamic balance that I
> discovered
> how smooth is smooth.
> By valve lash do you mean that the tappet clearances were regularly
> becoming
> uneven?
> Peter H
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: cam shaft bearings |
Hi Peter-
By the way, the subject line somehow got changed to "cam shaft
bearings" but it really isn't, it's rocker arm bearings/bushings.
My oil temp has always been from (in cruise) 170 F or so, to about
235 F...it got this hot when I forgot and left the oil cooler door
(which I use for quick warm-up in winter months) closed. My EIS
quickly alerted me to this condition, and I opened the door and it
cooled in a minute or so.
I don't know of any quality issue with the product, but I couldn't
find any specs that I understood...go to: Glacier Garlock Bearings,
or look up DU bearings on google. I've lost track of where I found
the temp spec, but it was about 468 F as I recall for these teflon-
coated bronze/steel bushings. I just could not find any load or
pressure spec that I was familiar with. Now I gotta say that I'm not
sure which bearings are used in this engine, but they have been
identified by a knowledgeable source locally as DU bearings. In
reading the service manual (CD) that came with my engine, it says on
p. 46 that "engines from 189 onwards use either 12mm or 15mm wide
GLASIER type bush." The spelling of the word Glacier/GLASIER may be
just a typo, or a completely different bushing altogether, but can
you imagine two bearing companies using this name and not suing one
another?
As my personal disclaimer, I have to say that I'm not sure what
bushings/bearings are used by Jabiru, but the bottom line for me is
they failed. My engine is serial #2062.
The other problem was a scoring of the distributor shaft on the left
bank, and oil leakage on the distributor shaft on the right bank...go
figure. The one that was scored was not leaking a drop, while the
other one was perfectly smooth, but leaked badly. I used a product
called "Speedi Sleeve", which is a thin steel sleeve which is slid
over the grooved shaft, and it effectively increases the diameter of
the shaft at that point .022". This is a ring of steel .011" thick.
This is enough to put just a slight bit more pressure on the seal
lips, and cover over the worn area. They work great!
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
do not archive
On May 9, 2007, at 5:09 PM, Peter Harris wrote:
> <peterjfharris@bigpond.com>
>
> Lynn,
> I have noticed that my J3300 oil temp is probably too low ie say 50
> to 80
> deg C . Is that a factor in your bearing failure do you think?
> You mentioned a reference to the bearing material. Is there a
> quality issue
> with this product?
> When you have a better bearing I would appreciate the product
> details. Like
> you I am out of warranty and want to prepare for independence in
> the future.
> I am based a couple of hours from the factory. Like almost every other
> Aviation product supplier I found resistance to any admission of a
> product
> design problem. The best contact I have there is Doug Smith.
> Can you tell us about the other problem.?
> Regards
> Peter H
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: cam shaft bearings |
Hello Listers:
The Glacier DU online catalog has all of the application and spec info.
In a past life I used a lot of these bearings with out any problems. They are
similar to an Oilite sintered bronze bearing except the "spaces" on the DU
are infiltrated with teflon which should provide good boundary layer
lubrication if there is brief oil starvation. One problem with oscillating bearings
is
to get adequate lubrication into the bearing, direct pressure feed is to be
preferred over splash lubrication. The latest Jabiru engines have hydraulic
lifters so I suppose there is a real need to examine the engine oil for
particles as there theoretically there will be zero tappet clearance.
Regards, John Read
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 16
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| Subject: | [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
Pete the maintenance shop here did the job and they have a lot of experience
with the equipment, using electronic equipment which they said cost $6000. A
vibration sensor is attached to the engine near centre front just behind the
prop. A laser is fitted where it will see the reflection from tape on the
prop. The two inputs establish weight and position. The control unit is
attached to the sensor and laser by long leads. The backing disc for the
spinner was indexed and I ran the engine up to 2700 rpm and the first read
out called up weights and a location. At this stage washers were selected
and weighed using a very sensitive electronic scale part of the kit which
measures to .01 G . The washers were fitted for convenience to the nearest
spinner attach screw and we ran again twice more with small adjustments to
the weights, then we calculated by proportion how much weight to fix at a
convenient hidden point at a smaller radius inside the backing plate. From
memory it took about 1.5G which we did with a short bolt and some washers
weighed using the e scale.
What impressed me was how much smoother it bran right from the first
addition. I think it is a good starting point for the flywheel bolts job.I
think your customers will be happy with the result. It took about 45min.
Peter
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jabiru
USA
Sent: Thursday, 10 May 2007 7:44 AM
Subject: RE: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
Peter,
Where did you attach the weights to the prop or spinner to balance it? How
much weight did it take? We are about to go into the dynamic balancing
business and are not sure just yet as to where to attach the weights.
Pete Krotje
Jabiru USA Sport Aircraft, LLC
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter
Harris
Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 4:15 PM
Subject: RE: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
<peterjfharris@bigpond.com>
Lynn
My prop is from Ed Sterba and I have been trimming it, also there were
issues with the spinner backing plate. But my experience proved that static
balance was not enough. It was not until dynamic balance that I discovered
how smooth is smooth.
By valve lash do you mean that the tappet clearances were regularly becoming
uneven?
Peter H
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
Matteson
Sent: Wednesday, 9 May 2007 11:13 PM
Subject: Re: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
What kind/make prop? Mine's a Sensenich, and was smooth running from
the git-go. My engine started out smooth as silk, but over the hours
got mild vibration due to the valve lash loosening. After each new
setting, back to smooth again.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/275+ hrs
On May 9, 2007, at 12:10 AM, Peter Harris wrote:
> <peterjfharris@bigpond.com>
>
> I got a vast improvement in smooth running when I had my wooden prop
> dynamically balanced even though I had spent hours to achieve a
> perfect
> static balance. When the dynamic weights were added it was like a new
> engine.
> Peter J3300 25hrs
Message 17
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| Subject: | [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
Hi Fred,
I covered most of the details in my post to Pete . From the point of view of
overheating it was not really an issue. I had the cowls off and each run up
was for only a minute or so, then there was down time for interpreting the
results, selecting and weighing the weights etc. and I switched off for
this. There was a total of 3 power runs and the whole job took about 45
mins. I would guess that 50% of the time was down time devoted to selecting
and weighing and adding the weights.
Let me know if you have any other questions.
Peter
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Fred
Hulen
Sent: Thursday, 10 May 2007 12:59 AM
Subject: Re: JabiruEngine-List: [ Bob Haas ] : New Email List Photo Share
Available!
> I got a vast improvement in smooth running when I had my wooden prop
> dynamically balanced even though I had spent hours to achieve a perfect
> static balance. When the dynamic weights were added it was like a new
> engine.
> Peter J3300 25hrs
++ Hey Peter, please tell me more about the particular process you went
through to dynamically balance your prop. I went to a specialty place to
have mine done but after about an hour of applying sensors and getting all
of their equipment ready to actually do it, the guy asked that I run the
engine at 2500 rpm for 5 minutes! My cooling is just fine in normal
operations but there's no way could I sit there on the ground and run it at
2500 rpms for 5 minutes without getting too hot. Please tell me some of the
particulars when you had yours done.
Thanks
Fred
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