Today's Message Index:
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1. 04:12 AM - RE : Deposits in Oil Filter (=?iso-8859-1?Q?J=E9rme_Delamare?=)
2. 04:46 AM - Re: Deposits in Oil Filter (Andy Silvester)
3. 06:36 AM - Re: insufficient rocker chamber greasing ????? (Lynn Matteson)
4. 03:28 PM - Re: Deposits in Oil Filter (Peter Harris)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Deposits in Oil Filter |
Peter you=92re right!
This morning, I tested again with a magnet the deposits obtained after
filtering. Nothing!
But=85 When I tested the fuel used to wash the oil filter with the same
magnet, I found magnetic particles! (sorry, I didn=92t had my camera
this
morning)
The particles are so small that they pass thru the paper during
filtering!
Of course, it=92s normal to find this magnetic dust. But is it normal to
find
those orange particles (size, quantity)?
http://jeromedelamare.free.fr/deposit/DSCN3651.JPG
Did you, or someone else, observed those orange particles too?
Is there a link with those particles and a lubrication problem as
observed
by Martin?
J=E9rme
-----Message d'origine-----
De : owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] De la part de
Peter
Harris
Envoy=E9 : jeudi 23 ao=FBt 2007 00:02
=C0 : jabiruengine-list@matronics.com
Objet : RE: JabiruEngine-List: Deposits in Oil Filter
Jerome as I understand it there will normally be some magnetic particles
due
to the bedding in of the rings. I found a significant amount in mine at
15hrs. There should be no non magnetic bearing material which is
normally
white.
Peter H
_____
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
J=E9rme
Delamare
Sent: Wednesday, 22 August 2007 5:38 PM
Subject: JabiruEngine-List: Deposits in Oil Filter
Jabachat of May 2007 advise to cut the filter and wash it in fuel in
order
to look for deposit:
http://www.jabiru.net.au/Jabachat/Jaba%20Chat%20May%20%202007.pdf
I did it after the first 25 hours. My friend Marc cut the filter
carefully
(no dust). After filtering the fuel:
* http://jeromedelamare.free.fr/deposit/DSCN3651.JPG
* Test with a magnet : no magnetic parts
* Visual inspection: very small orange metal dust (valve guide?)
Is it =93normal=94 ?
I would like to send the oil for analysis but I have no reference to
compare. What and in which quantity should I find in a =93normal=94
analysis?
J=E9rme
P.S.
Jabiru 2200 N=B02092, hydraulic lifter, SB13 before first run, oil
cooler,
break in with Aeroshell 100, +0,3l of oil during 25 hours of break in,
maximum temps never exceed)
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?JabiruEngine-List
http://forums.matronics.com
Message 2
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| Subject: | Deposits in Oil Filter |
Jerome,
It=92s normal to find very small amounts of both ferrous (magnetic) and
non-ferrous material during the break-in phase. The crankshaft and
rod-end
bearings are probably contributing to the orange dust, as they bed-in.
Any
ferrous dust is coming from cylinder bores and / or piston rings as the
honed surfaces are bedded-in. It=92s good that you have taken the time
to
check at this stage, but more important to check later in the engine=92s
life
(say at 300 ' 400 hours). Bearing material being deposited in the
filter at
that stage indicates wider problems.
Andy
Suncoast Sportplanes, Inc.
39248 South Ave, Zephyrhills, FL 33542
Tel: (813) 779 2324 Fax: (813) 779 2246
www.suncoastjabiru.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
J=E9rme
Delamare
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2007 4:38 AM
Subject: JabiruEngine-List: Deposits in Oil Filter
Jabachat of May 2007 advise to cut the filter and wash it in fuel in
order
to look for deposit:
http://www.jabiru.net.au/Jabachat/Jaba%20Chat%20May%20%202007.pdf
I did it after the first 25 hours. My friend Marc cut the filter
carefully
(no dust). After filtering the fuel:
* http://jeromedelamare.free.fr/deposit/DSCN3651.JPG
* Test with a magnet : no magnetic parts
* Visual inspection: very small orange metal dust (valve guide?)
Is it =93normal=94 ?
I would like to send the oil for analysis but I have no reference to
compare. What and in which quantity should I find in a =93normal=94
analysis?
J=E9rme
P.S.
Jabiru 2200 N=B02092, hydraulic lifter, SB13 before first run, oil
cooler,
break in with Aeroshell 100, +0,3l of oil during 25 hours of break in,
maximum temps never exceed)
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: insufficient rocker chamber greasing ????? |
Martin-
Go back and look at the archives of this list (around May 8 of this
year) and you'll see my write-up of the problem I had with my rocker
arm bushings. I always had oil when I had to pull my covers for valve
clearance adjustment, which seemed to be too often. One day I noticed
flakes of a brass-color inside the covers. During some research of
the problem, it was suggested that I drill out the restriction in the
tube you mentioned (at the oil gallery) to the next size number
drill, which I did, but I don't recall what the size was right now,
but the next size drill was only 3 or 4 thousands of an inch larger.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/369+ hrs
On Aug 19, 2007, at 12:36 PM, avidflyer01 wrote:
> <vegayacht@club.fr>
>
> hi guys, I would like to share some very worrying facts about my
> engine (2200 w/hyd lifters) and maybe get some answers from those
> who have already been there.
> I have just completed reassembling my engine after replacement of
> all valve guides (both of N2 were completely worn out at 100hrs,
> others were replaced as precaution). Today I started it and run for
> 5 min at 1200-1500rpm, then stopped and made a close inspection.
> When I removed tapper covers, I discovered there was some oil, as
> it should be the case, in rear rocker chambers (Ns 3 and 4) but
> the forward ones were AS DRY AS PRIOR TO ASSEMBLY.
> The airplane was sitting almost level, with tail slightly lower,
> maybe 5. Oil level was slightly above minimum, as per SB 013-1.
> The oil pressure was (as always both in flight and at idle) at 35psi.
> After checking that the T junctions on oil feed line were not
> blocked and some more thinking, I tilted the airplane more on the
> nose (3 nose down), cleaned rocker chambers and run it again for 1
> min at 1200rpm.
> This time forward rocker chambers were correctly flooded with oil
> while the aft ones were virtually dry, except a few drops.
> I sincerely hope that at a higher power setting the amount of oil
> carried thru the feed tube from under the cylinders is sufficient
> to spread it correctly in the T-junction to grease both rocker
> chambers (I have so far always seen oil in rocker chambers,
> although there was always more of it in the rear ones my plane is
> a taildragger).
> But the worrying truth seems to be that when warming the engine or
> taxiing at low rews (and even more so in a taildragger, although
> already 5 tilt seems to make a difference), there are good chances
> that fwd cylinder rockers and valve guides run dry!!!! My guess is
> that the quantity of oil delivered is insufficient and it only runs
> down the slope, towards the cylinder that is lower.
> This could be by the way one of the possible explanations why my
> valve guides were ruined after 100hrs and that my rocker bushings
> also show some premature wear.
> Has anybody any comment on these facts? Pete, Andy, do you guys
> consider it normal that the whole rocker chamber is not bathing in
> oil????? Any similar problems found/cured????
>
> Once at that subject, the SB 013-1 explained to us that vent holes
> and correct routing of the sump breather were supposed to enhance
> the return of oil from rocker chambers back to the sump, as if too
> much oil was delivered to the heads. Seemingly, I have the opposite
> problem (or at least I do have it on lower revs) isnt there a
> restriction between the main oil galley and the two tubes feeding
> oil to rocker chambers, that could be increased????
>
> I dont like the idea of running idle with no oil in my rockers/
> valves.
> Any input, guys????
> Martin
> Avid flyer w/Jab 2200
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Deposits in Oil Filter |
Jerome,
The picture looks like white particles on an orange thumb !
I did not find orange coloured particles. If this is the first filter
scan
there may be traces of sealant or something else. It would be best to
ask
the dealer who would have wider experience. Are you sure it is not rust?
Peter H
_____
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
J=E9rme
Delamare
Sent: Thursday, 23 August 2007 9:11 PM
Subject: RE : JabiruEngine-List: Deposits in Oil Filter
Peter you=92re right!
This morning, I tested again with a magnet the deposits obtained after
filtering. Nothing!
But=85 When I tested the fuel used to wash the oil filter with the same
magnet, I found magnetic particles! (sorry, I didn=92t had my camera
this
morning)
The particles are so small that they pass thru the paper during
filtering!
Of course, it=92s normal to find this magnetic dust. But is it normal to
find
those orange particles (size, quantity)?
http://jeromedelamare.free.fr/deposit/DSCN3651.JPG
Did you, or someone else, observed those orange particles too?
Is there a link with those particles and a lubrication problem as
observed
by Martin?
J=E9rme
-----Message d'origine-----
De : owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] De la part de
Peter
Harris
Envoy=E9 : jeudi 23 ao=FBt 2007 00:02
=C0 : jabiruengine-list@matronics.com
Objet : RE: JabiruEngine-List: Deposits in Oil Filter
Jerome as I understand it there will normally be some magnetic particles
due
to the bedding in of the rings. I found a significant amount in mine at
15hrs. There should be no non magnetic bearing material which is
normally
white.
Peter H
_____
From: owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-jabiruengine-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
J=E9rme
Delamare
Sent: Wednesday, 22 August 2007 5:38 PM
Subject: JabiruEngine-List: Deposits in Oil Filter
Jabachat of May 2007 advise to cut the filter and wash it in fuel in
order
to look for deposit:
http://www.jabiru.net.au/Jabachat/Jaba%20Chat%20May%20%202007.pdf
I did it after the first 25 hours. My friend Marc cut the filter
carefully
(no dust). After filtering the fuel:
* http://jeromedelamare.free.fr/deposit/DSCN3651.JPG
* Test with a magnet : no magnetic parts
* Visual inspection: very small orange metal dust (valve guide?)
Is it =93normal=94 ?
I would like to send the oil for analysis but I have no reference to
compare. What and in which quantity should I find in a =93normal=94
analysis?
J=E9rme
P.S.
Jabiru 2200 N=B02092, hydraulic lifter, SB13 before first run, oil
cooler,
break in with Aeroshell 100, +0,3l of oil during 25 hours of break in,
maximum temps never exceed)
<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?JabiruEngine-List>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?JabiruEngine-List
<http://forums.matronics.com> http://forums.matronics.com
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