Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:11 AM - Re: Re: Advice on intermittent voltage spiking in Jab 3300 (Rob Turk)
2. 02:35 AM - Re: Re: Advice on intermittent voltage spiking in Jab 3300 (FLYaDIVE)
3. 03:03 AM - Re: Re: Advice on intermittent voltage spiking in Jab 3300 (Rob Turk)
4. 03:33 PM - Jabiru (BobbyPaulk@comcast.net)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Advice on intermittent voltage spiking in |
Jab 3300
Jabiru owner here.. Please don't make assumptions, this engine does not
have traditional magneto and alternator systems.
The flywheel on the Jabiru engine has two sets of electrical components.
1. Fixed sets of magnets on the outer edge of the flywheel, three sets
on a 3300 engine. These fly by two fixed ignition coils, providing
independent ignition systems. Lawnmower technology. Mechanical
distributors send these to the right spark plugs. This setup equates to
what the magnetos would be on a Lycoming. Has nothing to do with bus
power or charging circuits.
2. A ring with rear-earth magnets, which rotates around a 12-pole fixed
stator. This is a permanent magnet alternator (PMA) which is like a
simple motorcycle dynamo. The output varies from 6V AC when idle, to 40V
AC when running full power. The output is rectified and regulated by a
simple Kubota regulator. This regulator takes two input lines from the
PMA, and delivers two output lines (GND and +12V) to the battery. A
yellow reference wire is tied to the battery +12V pole as well so the
regulator 'knows' the bus voltage.
For the regulator to do its job, you need the following:
1. The regulator must not be broken (duh..)
2. The regulator must receive some cooling air
3. The regulator body must be grounded
4. The regulator output (red, +12V) and reference (yellow) wire must be
firmly connected at the battery +12V pole
5. The regulator ground wire must be firmly connected to the central
ground point on the firewall.
With this, you'll have a well working system. You can expand by using an
OV protection system, but Jabiru does not recommend this.
A drawing for the electrical system is available in the freely
downloadable manuals at www.jabiru.net.au
If you are uncomfortable with this setup then a more traditional
belt-driven alternator setup is available from Rotec.
Rob
On 7/6/2017 11:52 PM, Paul Mulwitz wrote:
>
> I think the magnets and pickup you mentioned are not the alternator
> but rather the ignition system. The wires from the pickups shouldn't
> go to the voltage regulator (I think) but should connect eventually to
> the distributors and spark plugs. I can't remember where the
> electronics live in the ignition system but I don't think it is the
> voltage regulator which is part of a different system entirely.
>
> I think the alternator on the Jabiru 3300 is inside the bright
> aluminum frame work on the back of the engine.
>
> Paul
>
>
> On 7/6/2017 2:24 PM, FLYaDIVE wrote:
>> Thanks for the quick reply. Although I'll have to talk to some others
>> who actually can translate much of what you've said, the Jabiru 3300
>> doesn't have a regular alternator, but something with magnets wound
>> into the rear flywheel of the engine with two white wires that are
>> connected to the voltage regulator.
>> I don't think there are any brushes.
>
>
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Advice on intermittent voltage spiking in |
Jab 3300
Bob:
I went to the Jabiru web site and reviewed the 3300 engine manual. Here is
a link to that manual:
http://www.jabiru.net.au/Manuals/Engine/JEM3302-7_Inst.pdf
See pages: 14 & 15.
The system is simple enough. But! If:
1 - Ground becomes Open, you will lose regulation.
2 - The Yellow (regulation) wire becomes Open you will lose regulation.
3 - I'm not sure what would happen if you connected the B+ wire (pale blue
wire) to the #3 pin of the regulator (this is for a second alternator).
NOW!!! If there is a DUAL regulator in one box (the gray finned box) and
one side of the regular blew... You maybe able to utilize the pin of the #2
alternator for your needs.
So:
Do a resistance check of the B+ wire all the way from the regulator to the
Battery.
Do a resistance check of the voltage control wire (yellow wire) all the way
from the regulator to the Battery.
The manual mentions the use of a BUSS. If the plane has a Buss, than you
include that in your point to point check. Such as: A to B to C to D...
>From your explanation the alternator is putting out - Just too much
Output. So it is the regulation that is failing.
Print out the two pages of the manual and see if they help your
understanding of the circuit and what the physical items LQQK like.
Operation seems quite simple.
OH! There is always the SWAP method of testing... Can you get a spare
Regulator?
Just make sure you GROUND the Body of the Regulator.
This is done for 3 reasons:
1 - Physical transfer of heat - Heat Sink.
2 - Electrical Ground - To put everything at the same electrical ground
potential.
3 - There MAY be part of the circuit (Ground) connected to the regulator
case... Well, that sure sounds like #2 above ;-)
You will notice that Pins: 2 and 6 are to the Battery + and -
respectively. Pin 5 is the sense wire. They use the term Buss... Oh,
they spelled Buss incorrectly... Single 'S' is what you ride ;-) If on
your plane you do not use/utilize a Buss, it can go directly to the B+ side
of the battery. Just make sure it is a good, no Perfect Connection.
One last thing: Notice in the manual they show Fast-On connectors? They
are good when they work. But, many are crimped incorrectly. The crimp
tool that makes a U and dimples the connector also causes problems.
Re-Crimp them (easier than R&R) with a proper tool.
One MORE last thing: Open up the regulator Connector (LQQKs like a MOLEX
connector), inspect for corrosion. Clean with Contact Cleaner and a wire
brush - BOTH halves. I use DIELECTRIC GREASE on those type connectors
because they are notorious for corrosion. Also inspect the back end of the
connector... Corrosion and POOR Crimping of the wires.
Electronics is the game... Shocking ain't it!
Barry
On Thu, Jul 6, 2017 at 5:06 PM, Skyking13 <robertkperry@gmail.com> wrote:
> robertkperry@gmail.com>
>
> Barry,
> Thanks for the quick reply. Although I'll have to talk to some others who
> actually can translate much of what you've said, the Jabiru 3300 doesn't
> have a regular alternator, but something with magnets wound into the rear
> flywheel of the engine with two white wires that are connected to the
> voltage regulator.
> I don't think there are any brushes.
>
> --------
> Blue Skies & Tailwinds,
> Captain Bob
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=470739#470739
>
>
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Advice on intermittent voltage spiking in |
Jab 3300
Barry,
Have you *EVER* worked on a Jabiru electrical system?? Your advice below
contains so many errors, it's not funny anymore.
- There is NO SUCH THING as a dual regulator. Don't even suggest that!
The labels 'Alternator #1 and #2' refer to the two AC wires coming from
the PMA. Not to a dual regulator or alternator of any kind. Poor choise
of names.
- The pale blue wires (pin 1 and 3) are the AC inputs of the regulator.
They receive the AC output of the PMA, and NOTHING ELSE!
- The B+ / Battery wire (pin 6) is RED!
- The regulator sense wire (pin 5) is YELLOW!
- The Ground wire (pin 2) is BLACK!
See the schematics and details on page 25 and 26 of that same manual.
Please, please, please do NOT make assumptions, these are NOT toys.
Lives depend on it!
Rob
On 7/7/2017 11:34 AM, FLYaDIVE wrote:
> Bob:
>
> I went to the Jabiru web site and reviewed the 3300 engine manual.
> Here is a link to that manual:
> http://www.jabiru.net.au/Manuals/Engine/JEM3302-7_Inst.pdf
>
> See pages: 14 & 15.
>
> The system is simple enough. But! If:
> 1 - Ground becomes Open, you will lose regulation.
> 2 - The Yellow (regulation) wire becomes Open you will lose regulation.
> 3 - I'm not sure what would happen if you connected the B+ wire (pale
> blue wire) to the #3 pin of the regulator (this is for a second
> alternator).
> NOW!!! If there is a DUAL regulator in one box (the gray finned box)
> and one side of the regular blew... You maybe able to utilize the pin
> of the #2 alternator for your needs.
>
> So:
> Do a resistance check of the B+ wire all the way from the regulator to
> the Battery.
> Do a resistance check of the voltage control wire (yellow wire) all
> the way from the regulator to the Battery.
> The manual mentions the use of a BUSS. If the plane has a Buss, than
> you include that in your point to point check. Such as: A to B to C
> to D...
>
> From your explanation the alternator is putting out - Just too much
> Output. So it is the regulation that is failing.
>
> Print out the two pages of the manual and see if they help your
> understanding of the circuit and what the physical items LQQK like.
> Operation seems quite simple.
> OH! There is always the SWAP method of testing... Can you get a spare
> Regulator?
> Just make sure you GROUND the Body of the Regulator.
> This is done for 3 reasons:
> 1 - Physical transfer of heat - Heat Sink.
> 2 - Electrical Ground - To put everything at the same electrical
> ground potential.
> 3 - There MAY be part of the circuit (Ground) connected to the
> regulator case... Well, that sure sounds like #2 above ;-)
> You will notice that Pins: 2 and 6 are to the Battery + and -
> respectively. Pin 5 is the sense wire. They use the term Buss...
> Oh, they spelled Buss incorrectly... Single 'S' is what you ride ;-)
> If on your plane you do not use/utilize a Buss, it can go directly to
> the B+ side of the battery. Just make sure it is a good, no Perfect
> Connection.
>
> One last thing: Notice in the manual they show Fast-On connectors?
> They are good when they work. But, many are crimped incorrectly.
> The crimp tool that makes a U and dimples the connector also causes
> problems. Re-Crimp them (easier than R&R) with a proper tool.
> One MORE last thing: Open up the regulator Connector (LQQKs like a
> MOLEX connector), inspect for corrosion. Clean with Contact Cleaner
> and a wire brush - BOTH halves. I use DIELECTRIC GREASE on those type
> connectors because they are notorious for corrosion. Also inspect the
> back end of the connector... Corrosion and POOR Crimping of the wires.
>
> Electronics is the game... Shocking ain't it!
>
> Barry
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 6, 2017 at 5:06 PM, Skyking13 <robertkperry@gmail.com
> <mailto:robertkperry@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> <robertkperry@gmail.com <mailto:robertkperry@gmail.com>>
>
> Barry,
> Thanks for the quick reply. Although I'll have to talk to some
> others who actually can translate much of what you've said, the
> Jabiru 3300 doesn't have a regular alternator, but something with
> magnets wound into the rear flywheel of the engine with two white
> wires that are connected to the voltage regulator.
> I don't think there are any brushes.
>
> --------
> Blue Skies & Tailwinds,
> Captain Bob
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=470739#470739
> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=470739#470739>
>
>
> ===================================
> -
> ruEngine-List" rel="noreferrer"
> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?JabiruEngine-List
> ===================================
> FORUMS -
> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
> ===================================
> WIKI -
> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
> ===================================
> b Site -
> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> ===================================
>
>
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Guys
The standard Jabiru comes with a dynamo ( Magnets and coils on the flywheel ).
It does not charge much unless the engine is turning about cruise RPMs.
The same flywheel has more magnets and coils on the outer rim for ignition.
The external regulator is from a Kubota ( I think ) Tractor.
I replaced all the Dynamo stuff with an alternator kit from AU.
Bobby
Jabiru 3300 278 hrs.
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|