---------------------------------------------------------- KIS-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 10/22/09: 6 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:04 AM - Fw: Tri-R KIS TR-1 Nose Leg () 2. 09:09 AM - Re: Fw: Tri-R KIS TR-1 Nose Leg (Robert Reed) 3. 12:28 PM - Welcome To The Matronics KIS-List! [PLEASE READ] (Matt Dralle) 4. 12:47 PM - Matronics KIS-List FAQ & Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle) 5. 09:12 PM - Website Update (Robert Reed) 6. 10:34 PM - Website and Forum (Mike Pienaar) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:04:36 AM PST US From: Subject: KIS-List: Fw: Tri-R KIS TR-1 Nose Leg ----- Original Message ----- From: Cc: ; "'TRICKEL, RICH'" ; Sent: Thursday, October 22, 2009 2:52 AM Subject: Re: Tri-R KIS TR-1 Nose Leg > {#} Replies are directed back to kisbuilders@angus.mystery.com > {#} To reply to the author, write to > > 10/22/2009 > > Hello Lyle, Thanks for your quick response to my email. You wrote: > > 1) "I built a nose gear weldment for you in 2001." > > That is correct. I had a coil spring version of the KIS TR-1 nose gear > strut weldment with the angled streamline tubing that I had obtained from > Tri-R Technologies. I had had the streamline tubing reenforced locally, > but some failures of that streamline tubing by other builders, even with > reenforcement, destroyed my confidence in that configuration. > > So I built a shipping box for the strut weldment (I still have the box) > and sent it off to you in Valencia CA in November 2001. You made up two > strut weldments with round angled tubing and had them heat treated by > Quality Heat Treating Inc on 11/14/2001. Your customer PO Number was > 111301. I have a copy of the heat treating certificate number 270014. I > don't know who the other strut was for. You shipped my strut back to me on > 11/20/2001. > > Also I don't know if the short vertical stub at the bottom of the round > angled tubing was made new by you in November 2001 and welded onto the > round angled tubing or if the short vertical stub at the bottom of the > abandoned streamlined angled tubing was cut off and then used to complete > the weldment. It is in this vertical stub area that the deficiencies > exist. > > 2) "Are you wanting another , or is this for a different aircraft?" and > "Please clarify." > > I am wanting another -- or a modified / upgraded rebuild of the one that I > have. The strut weldment that you made up for me was installed on my > airplane pror to first flight (which was in November 2003) and now the > plane has over 250 hours on it. The strut weldment has performed well, but > as I described in my email, I don't have complete confidence in it so have > considered having it replaced or modified / upgraded. > > I guess my big issue in removing my present strut and shipping it off to > you for either modification / upgrading or to serve as a pattern for a > completely new strut weldment is the fact that my airplane would be > grounded for an indeterminate period of time. I really don't have a need > for the airplane to go any place, but for some reason I tend to get > anxious if I don't have a flyable airplane available. In over 50 years of > flying I have always suffered from this addiction. I am sure that we could > overcome this issue with some communication and coordination. > > 3) "P.S. The springs should be obtainable through Mc Master Carr." > > I won't be needing a coil spring, the one that I have is fine. But JJ > would need one if he decides to go ahead with the purchase of a new strut > from you. Do you know the McMaster Carr part number for this specific coil > spring? > > I'd appreciate being kept in the loop on this subject and when the > opportunity arises I'll probably jump in and ship my strut weldment off to > you for either replacement or modification / upgrade as appropriate. Did > any of my requirements seem out of line or undoable? > > OC > > PS: I would strongly encourage any KIS TR-1 builders that have any nose > gear strut concerns at all to look real hard at upgrading to this version > of the strut. If any one would like a picture of this version of the strut > just email me direct or post to the group and I will email you direct a > picture. > > ================================================ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lyle Hendricks" > To: ; "'JOHN JACKSON'" > Cc: "'TRICKEL, RICH'" > Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:38 PM > Subject: RE: Tri-R KIS TR-1 Nose Leg > > > O.C., > I built a nose gear weldment for you in 2001. Are you wanting another , or > is this for a different aircraft? You sent us your existing weldment so we > could insure a matched fit would be manufactured, as several very similar > variations of that nose gear weldment now exist. Please clarify. The price > quoted to JJ was for a one off. If more builders are interested in the new > style of nose gear, the price would be adjusted accordingly. > > Lyle Hendricks > Hendricks Mfg., Inc. > 208-476-7740 > > P.S. The springs should be obtainable through Mc Master Carr. > > > ===================================================== > -----Original Message----- > From: bakerocb@cox.net [mailto:bakerocb@cox.net] > Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 3:23 PM > To: JOHN JACKSON > Cc: TRICKEL, RICH; HENDRICKS, LYLE > Subject: Re: Tri-R KIS TR-1 Nose Leg > > 10/21/2009 > > Hello JJ, Thank you for your email copied below on this subject -- it was > greatly appreciated. > > I think that the strut assembly shown in the attached picture is by far > the best nose gear strut for the KIS TR-1, but I do have some comments. > > Lyle wrote: > > 1) "We can manufacture a new nose gear assembly for you as shown in your > picture less the spring/ strut." > > I am not exactly sure what Lyle is referring to when he uses the term > "spring / strut". The coil spring itself came from a less expensive / > small Japanese made automobile. Rich Trickel should be able to identify > that part and one should be able to retrieve one from an automobile > salvage yard (formerly known as a junk yard). If Lyle can make everything, > but the coil spring, and the spring can be obtained separately then it > should be possible to assemble an entire unit. > > 2) "new nose gear weldment $844.37" > > This is the part that I am interested in obtaining. It is the large > weldment painted white in the upper portion of the attached picture. It is > made of some high quality steel and requires heat treatment. > > Previously Lyle was reluctant to make one of these for me unless I sent > him my present one. Maybe because I wanted some modifications and > corrections made and he wanted my existing strut in hand in order to see > exactly what I was talking about. Let me describe those modification and > corrections: > > a) The short vertical stub welded on at the bottom of my strut angled > portion was not perfectly vertical or in alignment with the vertical > cylinder at the top of the weldment. It wasn't off by much, but it could > be detected by the naked eye. The result was that my aluminum shoe > swiveling axis was not perfectly vertical and the nose wheel axle was not > perfectly horizontal and the nose wheel and tire leaned a bit in one > direction. > > b) The threaded portion at the bottom end of the short vertical unpainted > stub welded on at the bottom of my strut weldment was not long enough. > Even with minimum washers ( I use a combination of flat steel and nylon > washers in the stack) one had to use the very thin version of the castle > nut (AN > 320) in order to get the nut on far enough to put a cotter key through the > slots in the nut. > > c) And also the cotter key hole through the vertical stub was so close to > the end of the stub that there was no confidence in the surrounding > material's structural integrity. > > d) And to make matters worse the cotter key hole through the vertical stub > was not exactly through the middle of the stub and it was necessary to > file two of the opposite slots in the castle nut very wide in order to put > the cotter key through both the castle nut and the hole in the vertical > stub. Unfortunately this meant that one's ability to adjust the > compression on the stack was available only in 180 degree increments of > nut rotation -- not a good situation. > > e) The solution to the problems cited in a through d above can be solved > by: > ensuring the alignment of the vertical stub is correct; making a longer > threaded portion of the vertical stub so that a standard thickness castle > nut (AN 310) may be used; drilling the cotter key hole further from the > bottom end of the vertical stub; and ensuring that the cotter key hole is > drilled exactly through the middle of the vertical stub. > > f) Another modification that I would want Lyle to make if he made me a new > strut weldment is related to the ring that is welded on at the top of the > unpainted portion of the vertical stub. This ring performs two functions: > A) It provides the bearing surface which stops any further upward movement > of the aluminum shoe (or downward movement of the vertical stub if you > prefer); and B) It has two horns projecting out that, in conjunction with > a pin installed in the upper surface of the aluminum shoe, permits the > aluminum shoe to swivel only so far when making a turn. > > Since this welded on ring performs the important function of a bearing > surface between the bottom face of the ring and the upper face of the > aluminum shoe it should be large enough in outer diameter so that one can > use washers as desired (I prefer nylon) to provide the appropriate > friction interface between those two surfaces. At present that ring is not > large enough in outer diameter and appears to exist primarily to provide > the two turn stoppage horns. I would have that ring made larger in outer > diameter and cut out a sector from the circumference that would permit > swiveling of the aluminum shoe and provide stoppage by means of the pin > installed in the top of the aluminum shoe. > > Maybe we can persuade Lyle to go into production and there may be a few > other builders out there that could use a new strut. Please let me know if > you have any questions or comments on this subject. Thanks. > > OC > > PS: I'll send out a version of this email without the attachment to the > kisbuilders group to see what comes up. > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 09:09:26 AM PST US From: Robert Reed Subject: Re: KIS-List: Fw: Tri-R KIS TR-1 Nose Leg OC,=0A=0AI will try to get this photo loaded to the Website if you don't mi nd.- I think it would be helpful.=0A=0ABob=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________ ________________=0AFrom: "bakerocb@cox.net" =0ATo: "KIS-L IST, MATRONICS" =0ASent: Thursday, October 22, 2009 6:48:22 AM=0ASubject: KIS-List: Fw: Tri-R KIS TR-1 Nose Leg=0A=0A----- Ori ginal Message ----- From: =0ATo: "Lyle Hendricks" =0ACc: ; "'TRICKEL, RICH'" < richard_trickel@yahoo.com>; =0ASent: Thursday , October 22, 2009 2:52 AM=0ASubject: Re: Tri-R KIS TR-1 Nose Leg=0A=0A=0A> {#}- Replies are directed back to kisbuilders@angus.mystery.com=0A> {#} - To reply to the author, write to =0A> =0A> 10/22/2009 =0A> =0A> Hello Lyle, Thanks for your quick response to my email. You wrote :=0A> =0A> 1) "I built a nose gear weldment for you in 2001."=0A> =0A> That is correct. I had a coil spring version of the KIS TR-1 nose gear strut we ldment with the angled streamline tubing that I had obtained from Tri-R Tec hnologies. I had had the streamline tubing reenforced locally, but some fai lures of that streamline tubing by other builders, even with reenforcement, destroyed my confidence in that configuration.=0A> =0A> So I built a shipp ing box for the strut weldment (I still have the box) and sent it off to yo u in Valencia CA in November 2001. You made up two strut weldments with rou nd angled tubing and had them heat treated by Quality Heat Treating Inc on 11/14/2001. Your customer PO Number was 111301. I have a copy of the heat t reating certificate number 270014. I don't know who the other strut was for . You shipped my strut back to me on 11/20/2001.=0A> =0A> Also I don't know if the short vertical stub at the bottom of the round angled tubing was ma de new by you in November 2001 and welded onto the round angled tubing or i f the short vertical stub at the bottom of the abandoned streamlined angled tubing was cut off and then used to complete the weldment. It is in this v ertical stub area that the deficiencies exist.=0A> =0A> 2) "Are you wanting another , or is this for a different aircraft?" and "Please clarify."=0A> =0A> I am wanting another -- or a modified / upgraded rebuild of the one th at I have. The strut weldment that you made up for me was installed on my a irplane pror to first flight (which was in November 2003) and now the plane has over 250 hours on it. The strut weldment has performed well, but as I described in my email, I don't have complete confidence in it so have consi dered having it replaced or modified / upgraded.=0A> =0A> I guess my big is sue in removing my present strut and shipping it off to you for either modi fication / upgrading or to serve as a pattern for a completely new strut we ldment is the fact that my airplane would be grounded for an indeterminate period of time. I really don't have a need for the airplane to go any place , but for some reason I tend to get anxious if I don't have a flyable airpl ane available. In over 50 years of flying I have always suffered from this addiction. I am sure that we could overcome this issue with some communicat ion and coordination.=0A> =0A> 3) "P.S. The springs should be obtainable th rough Mc Master Carr."=0A> =0A> I won't be needing a coil spring, the one t hat I have is fine. But JJ would need one if he decides to go ahead with th e purchase of a new strut from you. Do you know the McMaster Carr part numb er for this specific coil spring?=0A> =0A> I'd appreciate being kept in the loop on this subject and when the opportunity arises I'll probably jump in and ship my strut weldment off to you for either replacement or modificati on / upgrade as appropriate. Did any of my requirements seem out of line or undoable?=0A> =0A> OC=0A> =0A> PS: I would strongly encourage any KIS TR-1 builders that have any nose gear strut concerns at all to look real hard a t upgrading to this version of the strut. If any one would like a picture o f this version of the strut just email me direct or post to the group and I will email you direct a picture.=0A> =0A> ========== ===============0A> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lyle Hendricks" =0A> To: ; "'JOHN JACKSON'" =0A> Cc: "'TRICKEL, RICH'" =0A> Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:38 PM =0A> Subject: RE: Tri-R KIS TR-1 Nose Leg=0A> =0A> =0A> O.C.,=0A> I built a nose gear weldment for you in 2001. Are you wanting another , or is this f or a different aircraft? You sent us your existing weldment so we could ins ure a matched fit would be manufactured, as several very similar variations of that nose gear weldment now exist. Please clarify. The price quoted to JJ was for a one off. If more builders are interested in the new style of n ose gear, the price would be adjusted accordingly.=0A> =0A> Lyle Hendricks =0A> Hendricks Mfg., Inc.=0A> 208-476-7740=0A> =0A> P.S. The springs should be obtainable through Mc Master Carr.=0A> =0A> =0A> ======= =======================0A> ---- -Original Message-----=0A> From: bakerocb@cox.net [mailto:bakerocb@cox.net] =0A> Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 3:23 PM=0A> To: JOHN JACKSON=0A> Cc: TRICKEL, RICH; HENDRICKS, LYLE=0A> Subject: Re: Tri-R KIS TR-1 Nose Leg=0A > =0A> 10/21/2009=0A> =0A> Hello JJ, Thank you for your email copied below on this subject -- it was greatly appreciated.=0A> =0A> I think that the st rut assembly shown in the attached picture is by far the best nose gear str ut for the KIS TR-1, but I do have some comments.=0A> =0A> Lyle wrote:=0A> =0A> 1) "We can manufacture a new nose gear assembly for you as shown in yo ur picture less the spring/ strut."=0A> =0A> I am not exactly sure what Lyl e is referring to when he uses the term "spring / strut". The coil spring i tself came from a less expensive / small Japanese made automobile. Rich Tri ckel should be able to identify that part and one should be able to retriev e one from an automobile salvage yard (formerly known as a junk yard). If L yle can make everything, but the coil spring, and the spring can be obtaine d separately then it should be possible to assemble an entire unit.=0A> =0A > 2) "new nose gear weldment $844.37"=0A> =0A> This is the part that I am i nterested in obtaining. It is the large weldment painted white in the upper portion of the attached picture. It is made of some high quality steel and requires heat treatment.=0A> =0A> Previously Lyle was reluctant to make on e of these for me unless I sent him my present one. Maybe because I wanted some modifications and corrections made and he wanted my existing strut in hand in order to see exactly what I was talking about. Let me describe thos e modification and corrections:=0A> =0A> a) The short vertical stub welded on at the bottom of my strut angled portion was not perfectly vertical or i n alignment with the vertical cylinder at the top of the weldment. It wasn' t off by much, but it could be detected by the naked eye. The result was th at my aluminum shoe swiveling axis was not perfectly vertical and the nose wheel axle was not perfectly horizontal and the nose wheel and tire leaned a bit in one direction.=0A> =0A> b) The threaded portion at the bottom end of the short vertical unpainted stub welded on at the bottom of my strut we ldment was not long enough. Even with minimum washers ( I use a combination of flat steel and nylon washers in the stack) one had to use the very thin version of the castle nut (AN=0A> 320) in order to get the nut on far enou gh to put a cotter key through the slots in the nut.=0A> =0A> c) And also t he cotter key hole through the vertical stub was so close to the end of the stub that there was no confidence in the surrounding material's structural integrity.=0A> =0A> d) And to make matters worse the cotter key hole throu gh the vertical stub was not exactly through the middle of the stub and it was necessary to file two of the opposite slots in the castle nut very wide in order to put the cotter key through both the castle nut and the hole in the vertical stub. Unfortunately this meant that one's ability to adjust t he compression on the stack was available only in 180 degree increments of nut rotation -- not a good situation.=0A> =0A> e) The solution to the probl ems cited in a through d above can be solved by:=0A> ensuring the alignment of the vertical stub is correct; making a longer threaded portion of the v ertical stub so that a standard thickness castle nut (AN 310) may be used; drilling the cotter key hole further from the bottom end of the vertical st ub; and ensuring that the cotter key hole is drilled exactly through the mi ddle of the vertical stub.=0A> =0A> f) Another modification that I would wa nt Lyle to make if he made me a new strut weldment is related to the ring t hat is welded on at the top of the unpainted portion of the vertical stub. This ring performs two functions: A) It provides the bearing surface which stops any further upward movement of the aluminum shoe (or downward movemen t of the vertical stub if you prefer); and B) It has two horns projecting o ut that, in conjunction with a pin installed in the upper surface of the al uminum shoe, permits the aluminum shoe to swivel only so far when making a turn.=0A> =0A> Since this welded on ring performs the important function of a bearing surface between the bottom face of the ring and the upper face o f the aluminum shoe it should be large enough in outer diameter so that one can use washers as desired (I prefer nylon) to provide the appropriate fri ction interface between those two surfaces. At present that ring is not lar ge enough in outer diameter and appears to exist primarily to provide the t wo turn stoppage horns. I would have that ring made larger in outer diamete r and cut out a sector from the circumference that would permit swiveling - of the aluminum shoe and provide stoppage by means of the pin installed in the top of the aluminum shoe.=0A> =0A> Maybe we can persuade Lyle to go into production and there may be a few other builders out there that could use a new strut. Please let me know if you have any questions or comments on this subject. Thanks.=0A> =0A> OC=0A> =0A> PS: I'll send out a version o f this email without the attachment to the kisbuilders group to see what co mes up.=0A> =0A ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:28:45 PM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: KIS-List: Welcome To The Matronics KIS-List! [PLEASE READ] Greetings KIS Enthusiasts! At the request of Bill Schertz I have migrated the KIS majordomo list over to the Matronics servers. This includes all of the currently subscribed members. 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This digest will contain the same information that is currently appended to the archive file. It has all of the headers except for the "From:" and "Subject:" lines removed, and includes a message separator consisting of a line of underscores. Each day at 23:55 PST US, the day's messages as described above will be combined and sent as a single message to everyone on the digest email list. To subscribe to the digest list, use the same subscription web form described above, and just select the Digest version of the List. http://www.matronics.com/subscribe Note that you *can* be subscribed to both the realtime and digest versions of the List at the same time. This is perfectly acceptable. Now some caveats: * Messages sent to "kis-list-digest" will be forwarded to the standard email list. In other words, you cannot post messages only to the digest List. * If you are subscribed to both the regular List and the digest List, you will receive the realtime postings as well as the digest at the end of the day. * If you reply to the digest email, your message will be forwarded to the normal list associated with the digest. Important Note: Please change the subject line to reflect the topic of your response! Also, please *do not include all or most of the digest in your reply*. **************************** *** List Digest Browser *** **************************** An archive of all the List Digests can be found online in either plain text or HTML format. These archives contain the exact Digest that was posted to the Digest email list on the given day. The Digest Archives can be found at the following location: http://www.matronics.com/digest ***************************************** *** The "DO NOT ARCHIVE" Message Flag *** ***************************************** At times, your message may concern something that is revelent only to a very small number of persons or to a limited area, and you may not wish to archive it. In such a case, simply put the following phrase anywhere in the message: do not archive Your message will not be appended to the archive, but will be sent to List email distribution as normal. ********************************************** ***** READ THIS - Automatic Unsubscribes ***** ********************************************** Note that if your email address begins to cause problems such as bounced email, mailbox is filled, or any other errors, your address will be promptly removed from the List. If you discover that you are no longer receiving messages from the KIS-List, go to the following Web page, and look for your email address and a possible reason for your removal. The Matronics Email List uses utility called the "Email Weasel" that automatically looks though the day's bounced email for addresses that caused problems due to common things like "user is unknown", "mailbox full", etc. If the Email Weasel removes your email address from the Lists you will find record of it at the following URL: http://www.matronics.com/unsubscribe d If the problem listed on the web site above has been resolved, please feel free to resubscribe to the Lists of your choice. ******************************* *** List Member Information *** ******************************* If you have not done so already, please email me your phone numbers and paper mail address in the following format: smith@somehost.com Joe Smith 123 Airport Lane Tower, CA 91234-1234 098-765-1234 w 123-456-7890 h Please forward this information to the following email address: requests@matronics.com I have a file of such things, that I typically use to contact you when there are problems with your email address. The information will NOT be used for any other commercial purpose. **************************************** *** Realtime Web Email List Browsing *** **************************************** Recent messages posted to the KIS-List are also made available on the Web for realtime browsing. Seven days worth of back postings are available with this feature. The messages can be sorted by Subject, Author, Date, or Message Thread. The Realtime List Browser indexes are updated twice per hour at xx:15 and xx:45. You can also reply to a message or start a new message directly from the List Browser Interface (coming soon). You do not have to be subscribed to the given list to use the List Browser Interface in view-mode. http://www.matronics.com/brow selist/kis-list ******************************************* *** Web Forums Bulletin Board Interface *** ******************************************* A phpBB BBS web Forums front end is available for all KIS-List content. content. The Forums contain all of the same content available via the email distribution and found on the various archive viewing formats such as the List Browse, etc. Any posts on the web Forums will be cross posted to the respective email List, and posts to the Email List will be cross posted to the web Forums. You may view all List content on the Forums without any special login. If you wish to post a message via the Web Forum interface, however, you will need to Register. This is a simple process that takes only a few minutes. A link to the Registration page can be found at the top of the main web Forums page. Note that registering on the Forum web site also enables you to send email posts to the Lists as well. You will also need to Subscribe to the respective Email List as described above to receive the Email Distribution of the List, however. The Matroincs Email List Web BBS Forums can be found at the following URL: http://forums.matronics.com ********************************* *** Matronics Email List Wiki *** ********************************* In an attempt to make it easy to store and find structured and often accessed information, Matronics has installed a Wiki at: http://wiki.matronics.com The Wiki allows individuals to create web pages to contain useful information for other users of the mailing lists and web site. Unlike an ordinary web page where the content needs to be submitted to Matronics for inclusion, the Wiki permits the users to construct their own pages and have them visible immediately. While constructing pages for the Wiki is not difficult, some may not be comfortable building pages. In that case, simply prepare the text and any images and email it to: wiki-support@matronics.com One of the volunteers on that list will take your submission and construct a Wiki page for you. Often someone produces a particularly useful posting in email one one of the Lists that would be of general interest. In that case Matronics may take that post and convert it into a Wiki page. ********************* *** List Archives *** ********************* A file containing of all of the previous postings to the KIS-List is available on line. The archive file information is available via the Web and FTP in a number of forms. Each are briefly described below: * KIS-List.FAQ - Latest version of the KIS-List Frequently Asked Question page (this document). * KIS-Archive.digest.complete - Complete file with most of the email header info removed and page breaks inserted between messages. * KIS-Archive.digest.vol-?? - Same as the file above, but broken up into small sections that can more easily handled. * KIS-Archive.digest.complete.zip - Same as the KIS-Archive.digest.complete file above, but in PKZIP format. Use "binary" data transfer methods. * KIS-Archive.digest.complete.Z - Same as the KIS-Archive.digest.complete file above, but in UNIX compress format. Use "binary" data transfer methods. Download Via FTP ---------------- The archive file is available via anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com in the "/pub/Archives" directory. It is updated daily and can be found in a number of formats as described above. (All filenames are case sensitive.) ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives Download Via Web ---------------- The archives are also available via a web listing. These can be found toward the bottom of the following web page: http://www.matronics.com/archives ****************************************** *** Complete List Web Archive Browsing *** ****************************************** All messages posted to the KIS-List are also available using the Email List Archive Browsing feature. With this utility, all messages in the List are indexed, and individual sub-archives can be browsed. http://www.matronic s.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?KIS ***************************************** **** High-Speed Archive Search Engine *** ***************************************** You can use the custom, high-performance Matronics Email List Search Engine to quickly locate and browse any messages that have been posted to the List. The Engine allows the user to easily search any of the currently available List archives. http://www.matronics.com/search **************************** *** File and Photo Share *** **************************** With the Matronics Email List File and Photo Share you can share pictures and other data with members of the List without having to forward a copy of it to everyone. To share your Files and Photos, simply email them to: pictures@matronics.com !! ==> Please including the following information with each submission: 1) Email Lists that they are related to. 2) Your Full Name. 3) Your Email Address. 4) One line Subject description. 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic. 6-x) One-line Description of each photo or file Prior to public availability of the files and photos, each will be scanned for viruses. Please also note that the process of making the files and photos available on the web site is a pseudo-manual process, and I try to process them every few days. Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will be sent to the Email Lists enumerated in 1) above indicating that the new Share is available and what the direct URL to it is. For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main Index Page: http://www.matronics.com/photoshare ************************** *** List Archive CDROM *** ************************** A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains all of the archives since the beginning of each of the Lists. The archives for all of the Lists are included on the CD along with a freeware search engine written by a list member. The CD is burned the day you order it and will contain archive received up to the last minute. They make great gifts! http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDRO M ********************************** *** List Support Contributions *** ********************************** The Matronics Lists are run *completely* through the support of it members. You won't find any PopUpAds, flashing Banner ads, or any other form of annoying commercialism on either the Email Messages or the List web pages associated with the Matronics Email Lists. Every year during November I run a low-key, low-pressure "Fund Raiser" where, throughout the month, I ask List members to make a Contribution in any amount with which they are comfortable. I will often offer free gifts with certain contribution levels during the Fund Raiser to increase the participation. The gifts are usually donated by companies that are themselves List members. Your Contributions go directly to supporting the operation of the Lists including the high-speed, business-class Internet connection, server system hardware and software upgrades, and to partially offset the many many hours I spend running, maintaining, upgrading, and developing the variety of services found here. Generally Contributions range from $20 to $100 and are completely voluntary and non-compulsory. I ask only that if person enjoys the Lists and obtains value from them, that they make a Contribution of equal magnitude. Contributions are accepted throughout the year, and if you've just subscribed, feel free to make a Contribution when you've settled in. The website for making SSL Secure Contributions is listed below. There are a variety of payment methods including Visa and MasterCard, PayPal, and sending a personal check. If you enjoy and value the List, won't you make a Contribution today to support its continued operation? http://www.matronics.com/contributi ons Thank you! Matt Dralle Email List Administrator *************************************************************************** *** KIS-List Usage Guidelines *************************************************************************** *** The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the KIS-List. You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein. Failure to use the KIS-List in the manner described below may result in the removal of the subscribers from the List. KIS-List Policy Statement The purpose of the KIS-List is to provide a forum of discussion for things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established: - Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc. - THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it. - Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and responses. - Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address, aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary space in the archive. - DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the web page or FAQ first. - If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it easy to find threads in the archive. - When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive can not be overstated! - When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the "reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your response to the original poster. You might have to actively address your response with the original poster's email address. - DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large. - When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly contribute something valuable. - Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing. - Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by List members promoting their respective products or items for sale should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to everyone, including those who provide products to the entire community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists. ------- ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 12:47:55 PM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: KIS-List: Matronics KIS-List FAQ & Usage Guidelines (Not sure what happend to the format on my original post, but here's the FAQ and Usage Guidelines in an easier to read format. -Matt) [ Note: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such as Courier. Proportional fonts will cause display formatting errors. ] This FAQ can also be viewed in HTML online at the following address: http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/KIS-List.htm ************************************************************ ******* LIST POLICIES AND FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS ******* ************************************************************ PLEASE READ. This document contains KIS-List policies and information for new and old subscribers. Understanding the KIS-List policies will minimize problems for the Administrator, and will help keep the KIS-List running smoothly for all of us. ****************************************** *** Quick Start Guide to List Features *** ****************************************** There are many features available on the Matronics Email Lists and each one is described in detailed below. However, using the List Navigator you can quickly access the complete set of features available for this List. The List Navigator can be found at the following URL: http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?KIS-List **************************************** *** How to Subscribe and Unsubscribe *** **************************************** Simply go to the Web Page shown below and enter your email address and select the List(s) that you wish to subscribe or unsubscribed from. You may also use the handy "Find" function to determine the exact syntax of your email address as it is subscribed to the List. Please see the complete instructions at the top of the Web Page for more information. The Subscribe/Unsubscribe web page is: http://www.matronics.com/subscribe Note that you will receive TWO conformation emails regarding your subsciption process. The first verifies that your subscription/unsubsciption request was received, and the second confirms that the process has been completed. You should receive the first email within a few minutes of your request. The second conformation will arrive in less than 24 hours. You cannot post until you receive the second conformation email message. ***************************** *** How to Post a Message *** ***************************** Send an email message to: kis-list@matronics.com Your message will be redistributed to everyone currently subscribed to the List. ***************************************************** *** SPAM Fighter - You Must be Subscribed to Post *** ***************************************************** When a new post is received by the system, the From: line of the message is checked and compared against the current subscription list. If the email address is found, the message is passed on to the List Processor. If the email address isn't found in the current list of subscribers, it is dumped. This serves to very effectively thwart 99% of the SPAM that gets posted to the Lists. Remember, however, that the syntax of your email address is very important with regard to the configuration of your email application such as Outlook or Eudora. For example, the following two email addresses may be functionally equivalent, but only one would pass the Matronics Email SPAM test depending on which was syntax was subscribed to the given List: smith@machine.domain.com smith@domain.com Either email address syntax is alright, just be sure that you configure your email application to match *exactly* the address you've subscibed to the List. ************************************** *** Enclosure Support on the Lists *** ************************************** Limited posting of enclosures such as pictures, documents, and spreadsheets is supported on the Lists. There are a number of restrictions, and these are detailed below. Please abide by the rules put forth regarding the content of enclosures. These are some of the features and limits of enclosures on the Matronics Lists: 1) Enclosures will only be posted to the Real Time version of the Lists. 2) Enclosures will NOT be included in the Daily Digest version of the Lists. 3) Enclosures WILL BE forwarded on to the BBS Forum Web site. 4) Enclosures will NOT be appended to the Archives. 5) Enclosures will NOT be available in the List Browse feature. 6) Only the following file types and extensions will be allowed: bmp doc dwg dxf gif jpg pdf png txt xls All other enclosures types will be rejected and email returned to sender. The enclosure types listed above are relatively safe from a virus standpoint and don't pose a particularly large security risk. 7) !! All incoming enclosures will be scanned for viruses prior to posting to the List. This is done in real time and will not slow down the process of posting the message !! Here are some rules for posting enclosures. Failure to abide by these rules could result in the removal of a subscriber's email address from the Lists. 1) Pay attention to what you are posting!! Make sure that the files you are enclosing aren't HUGE (greater that 1MB). Remember that there are still people checking they're email via dial up modem. If you post 30MB worth of pictures, you are placing an unnecessary burden on these folks and the rest of us, for that matter. 2) SCALE YOUR PICTURES DOWN!!! I don't want to see huge 3000 x 2000 pictures getting posted that are 3 or 4MB each. This is just unacceptable. Use a program such as Photoshop to scale the picture down to something on the order of 800 x 600 and try to keep the file size to less-than 200KB, preferably much less. Microsoft has a really awesome utility available for free that allows you to Right-Click on a picture in Explorer and automatically scale it down and resave it. This is a great utility - get it, use it! http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/downloads/powertoys/xppowertoys.mspx Look for the link "Image Resizer" 3) !! This would seem to go without saying, but I'll say it anyway. Do not post anything that would be considered offensive by your grandmother. And you know what I'm saying; I don't want to see anything even questionable. !! 4) REMEMBER THIS: If you post a 1MB enclosure to a List with 1000 members subscribed, your 1MB enclosure must be resent 1000 times amounting to 1MB X 1000 = 1 Gigabyte of network traffic!! BE CAREFUL and BE COURTEOUS! Also see the section below on the Matronics Photo and File Share where you can have your files and photos posted on the Matronics web server for long time viewing and availability. ******************* *** Digest Mode *** ******************* Each day, starting at 12 midnight PST US, a new 'digest' will be started. This digest will contain the same information that is currently appended to the archive file. It has all of the headers except for the "From:" and "Subject:" lines removed, and includes a message separator consisting of a line of underscores. Each day at 23:55 PST US, the day's messages as described above will be combined and sent as a single message to everyone on the digest email list. To subscribe to the digest list, use the same subscription web form described above, and just select the Digest version of the List. http://www.matronics.com/subscribe Note that you *can* be subscribed to both the realtime and digest versions of the List at the same time. This is perfectly acceptable. Now some caveats: * Messages sent to "kis-list-digest" will be forwarded to the standard email list. In other words, you cannot post messages only to the digest List. * If you are subscribed to both the regular List and the digest List, you will receive the realtime postings as well as the digest at the end of the day. * If you reply to the digest email, your message will be forwarded to the normal list associated with the digest. Important Note: Please change the subject line to reflect the topic of your response! Also, please *do not include all or most of the digest in your reply*. **************************** *** List Digest Browser *** **************************** An archive of all the List Digests can be found online in either plain text or HTML format. These archives contain the exact Digest that was posted to the Digest email list on the given day. The Digest Archives can be found at the following location: http://www.matronics.com/digest ***************************************** *** The "DO NOT ARCHIVE" Message Flag *** ***************************************** At times, your message may concern something that is revelent only to a very small number of persons or to a limited area, and you may not wish to archive it. In such a case, simply put the following phrase anywhere in the message: do not archive Your message will not be appended to the archive, but will be sent to List email distribution as normal. ********************************************** ***** READ THIS - Automatic Unsubscribes ***** ********************************************** Note that if your email address begins to cause problems such as bounced email, mailbox is filled, or any other errors, your address will be promptly removed from the List. If you discover that you are no longer receiving messages from the KIS-List, go to the following Web page, and look for your email address and a possible reason for your removal. The Matronics Email List uses utility called the "Email Weasel" that automatically looks though the day's bounced email for addresses that caused problems due to common things like "user is unknown", "mailbox full", etc. If the Email Weasel removes your email address from the Lists you will find record of it at the following URL: http://www.matronics.com/unsubscribed If the problem listed on the web site above has been resolved, please feel free to resubscribe to the Lists of your choice. ******************************* *** List Member Information *** ******************************* If you have not done so already, please email me your phone numbers and paper mail address in the following format: smith@somehost.com Joe Smith 123 Airport Lane Tower, CA 91234-1234 098-765-1234 w 123-456-7890 h Please forward this information to the following email address: requests@matronics.com I have a file of such things, that I typically use to contact you when there are problems with your email address. The information will NOT be used for any other commercial purpose. **************************************** *** Realtime Web Email List Browsing *** **************************************** Recent messages posted to the KIS-List are also made available on the Web for realtime browsing. Seven days worth of back postings are available with this feature. The messages can be sorted by Subject, Author, Date, or Message Thread. The Realtime List Browser indexes are updated twice per hour at xx:15 and xx:45. You can also reply to a message or start a new message directly from the List Browser Interface (coming soon). You do not have to be subscribed to the given list to use the List Browser Interface in view-mode. http://www.matronics.com/browselist/kis-list ******************************************* *** Web Forums Bulletin Board Interface *** ******************************************* A phpBB BBS web Forums front end is available for all KIS-List content. content. The Forums contain all of the same content available via the email distribution and found on the various archive viewing formats such as the List Browse, etc. Any posts on the web Forums will be cross posted to the respective email List, and posts to the Email List will be cross posted to the web Forums. You may view all List content on the Forums without any special login. If you wish to post a message via the Web Forum interface, however, you will need to Register. This is a simple process that takes only a few minutes. A link to the Registration page can be found at the top of the main web Forums page. Note that registering on the Forum web site also enables you to send email posts to the Lists as well. You will also need to Subscribe to the respective Email List as described above to receive the Email Distribution of the List, however. The Matroincs Email List Web BBS Forums can be found at the following URL: http://forums.matronics.com ********************************* *** Matronics Email List Wiki *** ********************************* In an attempt to make it easy to store and find structured and often accessed information, Matronics has installed a Wiki at: http://wiki.matronics.com The Wiki allows individuals to create web pages to contain useful information for other users of the mailing lists and web site. Unlike an ordinary web page where the content needs to be submitted to Matronics for inclusion, the Wiki permits the users to construct their own pages and have them visible immediately. While constructing pages for the Wiki is not difficult, some may not be comfortable building pages. In that case, simply prepare the text and any images and email it to: wiki-support@matronics.com One of the volunteers on that list will take your submission and construct a Wiki page for you. Often someone produces a particularly useful posting in email one one of the Lists that would be of general interest. In that case Matronics may take that post and convert it into a Wiki page. ********************* *** List Archives *** ********************* A file containing of all of the previous postings to the KIS-List is available on line. The archive file information is available via the Web and FTP in a number of forms. Each are briefly described below: * KIS-List.FAQ - Latest version of the KIS-List Frequently Asked Question page (this document). * KIS-Archive.digest.complete - Complete file with most of the email header info removed and page breaks inserted between messages. * KIS-Archive.digest.vol-?? - Same as the file above, but broken up into small sections that can more easily handled. * KIS-Archive.digest.complete.zip - Same as the KIS-Archive.digest.complete file above, but in PKZIP format. Use "binary" data transfer methods. * KIS-Archive.digest.complete.Z - Same as the KIS-Archive.digest.complete file above, but in UNIX compress format. Use "binary" data transfer methods. Download Via FTP ---------------- The archive file is available via anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com in the "/pub/Archives" directory. It is updated daily and can be found in a number of formats as described above. (All filenames are case sensitive.) ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives Download Via Web ---------------- The archives are also available via a web listing. These can be found toward the bottom of the following web page: http://www.matronics.com/archives ****************************************** *** Complete List Web Archive Browsing *** ****************************************** All messages posted to the KIS-List are also available using the Email List Archive Browsing feature. With this utility, all messages in the List are indexed, and individual sub-archives can be browsed. http://www.matronics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?KIS ***************************************** **** High-Speed Archive Search Engine *** ***************************************** You can use the custom, high-performance Matronics Email List Search Engine to quickly locate and browse any messages that have been posted to the List. The Engine allows the user to easily search any of the currently available List archives. http://www.matronics.com/search **************************** *** File and Photo Share *** **************************** With the Matronics Email List File and Photo Share you can share pictures and other data with members of the List without having to forward a copy of it to everyone. To share your Files and Photos, simply email them to: pictures@matronics.com !! ==> Please including the following information with each submission: 1) Email Lists that they are related to. 2) Your Full Name. 3) Your Email Address. 4) One line Subject description. 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic. 6-x) One-line Description of each photo or file Prior to public availability of the files and photos, each will be scanned for viruses. Please also note that the process of making the files and photos available on the web site is a pseudo-manual process, and I try to process them every few days. Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will be sent to the Email Lists enumerated in 1) above indicating that the new Share is available and what the direct URL to it is. For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main Index Page: http://www.matronics.com/photoshare ************************** *** List Archive CDROM *** ************************** A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains all of the archives since the beginning of each of the Lists. The archives for all of the Lists are included on the CD along with a freeware search engine written by a list member. The CD is burned the day you order it and will contain archive received up to the last minute. They make great gifts! http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDROM ********************************** *** List Support Contributions *** ********************************** The Matronics Lists are run *completely* through the support of it members. You won't find any PopUpAds, flashing Banner ads, or any other form of annoying commercialism on either the Email Messages or the List web pages associated with the Matronics Email Lists. Every year during November I run a low-key, low-pressure "Fund Raiser" where, throughout the month, I ask List members to make a Contribution in any amount with which they are comfortable. I will often offer free gifts with certain contribution levels during the Fund Raiser to increase the participation. The gifts are usually donated by companies that are themselves List members. Your Contributions go directly to supporting the operation of the Lists including the high-speed, business-class Internet connection, server system hardware and software upgrades, and to partially offset the many many hours I spend running, maintaining, upgrading, and developing the variety of services found here. Generally Contributions range from $20 to $100 and are completely voluntary and non-compulsory. I ask only that if person enjoys the Lists and obtains value from them, that they make a Contribution of equal magnitude. Contributions are accepted throughout the year, and if you've just subscribed, feel free to make a Contribution when you've settled in. The website for making SSL Secure Contributions is listed below. There are a variety of payment methods including Visa and MasterCard, PayPal, and sending a personal check. If you enjoy and value the List, won't you make a Contribution today to support its continued operation? http://www.matronics.com/contributions Thank you! Matt Dralle Email List Administrator ****************************************************************************** KIS-List Usage Guidelines ****************************************************************************** The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the KIS-List. You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein. Failure to use the KIS-List in the manner described below may result in the removal of the subscribers from the List. KIS-List Policy Statement The purpose of the KIS-List is to provide a forum of discussion for things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established: - Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc. - THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it. - Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and responses. - Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address, aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary space in the archive. - DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the web page or FAQ first. - If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it easy to find threads in the archive. - When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive can not be overstated! - When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the "reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your response to the original poster. You might have to actively address your response with the original poster's email address. - DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large. - When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly contribute something valuable. - Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing. - Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by List members promoting their respective products or items for sale should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to everyone, including those who provide products to the entire community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists. ------- Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:12:30 PM PST US From: Robert Reed Subject: KIS-List: Website Update All,=0A-=0AJust uploaded several updates to my website.- =0A-=0AI add ed a photo of OC Baker's TR-1 Nose Gear Componets that have been discussed in a recent thread.=0A-=0AI also added an update on MY PROGRESS to show t hat I haven't been sleeping all summer.- I must admit that I never antici pated taking as much time to build the Pressure Cowling as it is taking but I think it is coming along well and should be finished in a couple of week s.=0A-=0Awww.kisbuild.onfinal18.com=0A-=0AHave a great day,=0A-=0ABob Reed ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:34:00 PM PST US From: "Mike Pienaar" Subject: KIS-List: Website and Forum Bob and Bill, I would like to thank both of you again for looking after the website and the forum, don't know where I would have been without your help Regards Mike ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kis-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/KIS-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kis-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kis-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.