Today's Message Index:
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1. 03:36 PM - KIS Engine Stoppage ()
2. 04:04 PM - Re: Winglets & Performance (Kent Pyle)
3. 06:02 PM - Re: KIS Engine Stoppage (F. Tim Yoder)
Message 1
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| Subject: | KIS Engine Stoppage |
11/25/2009
Hello JF, Good to hear from you. You wrote:
1) "Do you still enjoy flying your kis??"
Yes I do, very much. I go flying at least once a week, weather permitting,
and I have over 265 hours on it now. Also I seem to enjoy working on it as
much as flying it. My last major project was modifying and installing RV
type wheel pants and wheel strut fairings on all three landing gear. I'll
attach a picture.
2) "It looks like if the engine fuel pump gets defused and the engine stop."
That sounds like a very serious problem -- I assume that you have not flown
yet and discovered this problem while running the engine on the ground.
3) "Do you have a check valve along your fuel line?"
The only check valve that I have in my fuel system is a flapper type check
valve in the fuel return line that goes from the engine driven mechanical
fuel pump back to the Andair fuel selector valve. See part number 250004 on
this web page:
http://www.stealth316.com/misc/earl's_fittings&hoses.pdf
My fuel supply lines are -6 (3/8 inch) and my fuel return lines are -4 (1/4
inch)
4) "Have you ever encountered such a problem or similar?"
Not with my plane, but fuel starvation is a rather common problem in
homebuilt airplanes. One of the highly recommended ground checks before
first flight is to position the airplane in a nose high attitude as if
climbing after takeoff, tie it down in that attitude, and then go to full
power to ensure that the engine will keep running.
I'd like very much to help you solve this problem. I am sure that more
information will be needed before we can solve it, but let me talk in some
generalities for now.
There are two different portions of the fuel system: One is the airframe
portion (every thing in the fuel system prior to the engine driven
mechanical fuel pump) that you built, and the other is the engine portion
(every thing in the fuel system starting with the engine driven mechanical
fuel pump) which TCM has provided.
I think that the trouble shooting should start with the airframe portion. A
rather simplistic check is to put some fuel in the wing tanks, open a fuel
line in the fuel system at a low point prior to the engine driven pump and
see how much fuel can gravity flow out in a 15 minute period. Since a
nominal maximum fuel flow for this engine is 12 gallons per hour then one
quarter of that, or three gallons should flow out in 15 minutes. If you
don't get that much then I'd start looking for fuel restrictions in the
supply line or fuel tank vent blockage or restrictions.
Trouble shooting the engine portion of the system is more difficult. If you
have made some modifications to the engine fuel system between the engine
driven mechanical fuel pump and the spider such as installing a pressure
transducer or fuel flow transducer you should examine them with great care
or bypass them to ensure that they are not contributors to the engine
stoppage. If they are not the problem then the next step would be to conduct
the tests described by SID97-3E. See here:
http://www.genuinecontinental.aero/documents/SID97-3E.pdf
You may discover that you have a poorly adjusted fuel injection system or a
faulty engine driven mechanical fuel pump.
This is the best that I can offer given the limited information that I have
at hand. If you will send me more information I will be glad to dig into
this further.
OC
==========================================
----- Original Message -----
From: <jfherzog@bluewin.ch>
Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 3:10 PM
Subject: KIS
> Hello Owen
>
> Do you still enjoy flying your kis??
>
> Myself,I am still on the way to complet the job.But I 've just discovered
> a new problem and I was wondering if you
> also got it
> It looks like if the engine fuel pump gets defused and the engine
> stop.
> Do you have a check valve along your fuel line?
> Have you ever encountered such a problem or similar?
>
> Best wishes
>
> JF
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Winglets & Performance |
Good report Galin. I guess I shouldn't feel bad not having received
mine even they are paid for. Kent
----- Original Message -----
From: Galin Hernandez
To: kis-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2009 8:11 PM
Subject: KIS-List: Winglets & Performance
All;
After many flights (2 with new winglets, 2 with old wingtips) at
different power settings, I can honestly say there is no significant
change in aircraft performance. My numbers show, at best, a maximum 3kt
increase in speed with the new winglets based on GPS measured TAS at
1000ft MSL. At 2,400RPM I was getting between 138-139KTAS with the
winglets and 136-137KTAS with the old wing tips everything else being
equal. Climb performance was not changed at all, that I could measure. I
am still getting around 1200fpm climb at MGW, full power from SL to
3,000ft at 100KIAS with either wingtip.
I feel It is not conclusive enough for me to warrant buying the new
winglets to replace the old ones. But, since I already have the new
winglets, I will keep them on. I did get a tiny increase and to me they
do look good. I can tell you I enjoyed doing the test flights and
"crunching the numbers" afterwards. It made all the "theory" come alive
even if nothing much was found after it was all over. The best part was
it gave me something to do while flying instead of just burning holes in
the air going nowhere fast. :o)
Galin
N819PR
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: KIS Engine Stoppage |
Pretty TR-1 'OC'
Tim
----- Original Message -----
From: <bakerocb@cox.net>
Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 4:35 PM
Subject: KIS-List: KIS Engine Stoppage
> 11/25/2009
>
> Hello JF, Good to hear from you. You wrote:
>
> 1) "Do you still enjoy flying your kis??"
>
> Yes I do, very much. I go flying at least once a week, weather permitting,
> and I have over 265 hours on it now. Also I seem to enjoy working on it as
> much as flying it. My last major project was modifying and installing RV
> type wheel pants and wheel strut fairings on all three landing gear. I'll
> attach a picture.
>
> 2) "It looks like if the engine fuel pump gets defused and the engine
> stop."
>
> That sounds like a very serious problem -- I assume that you have not
> flown
> yet and discovered this problem while running the engine on the ground.
>
> 3) "Do you have a check valve along your fuel line?"
>
> The only check valve that I have in my fuel system is a flapper type check
> valve in the fuel return line that goes from the engine driven mechanical
> fuel pump back to the Andair fuel selector valve. See part number 250004
> on
> this web page:
>
> http://www.stealth316.com/misc/earl's_fittings&hoses.pdf
>
> My fuel supply lines are -6 (3/8 inch) and my fuel return lines are -4
> (1/4
> inch)
>
> 4) "Have you ever encountered such a problem or similar?"
>
> Not with my plane, but fuel starvation is a rather common problem in
> homebuilt airplanes. One of the highly recommended ground checks before
> first flight is to position the airplane in a nose high attitude as if
> climbing after takeoff, tie it down in that attitude, and then go to full
> power to ensure that the engine will keep running.
>
> I'd like very much to help you solve this problem. I am sure that more
> information will be needed before we can solve it, but let me talk in some
> generalities for now.
>
> There are two different portions of the fuel system: One is the airframe
> portion (every thing in the fuel system prior to the engine driven
> mechanical fuel pump) that you built, and the other is the engine portion
> (every thing in the fuel system starting with the engine driven mechanical
> fuel pump) which TCM has provided.
>
> I think that the trouble shooting should start with the airframe portion.
> A
> rather simplistic check is to put some fuel in the wing tanks, open a fuel
> line in the fuel system at a low point prior to the engine driven pump and
> see how much fuel can gravity flow out in a 15 minute period. Since a
> nominal maximum fuel flow for this engine is 12 gallons per hour then one
> quarter of that, or three gallons should flow out in 15 minutes. If you
> don't get that much then I'd start looking for fuel restrictions in the
> supply line or fuel tank vent blockage or restrictions.
>
> Trouble shooting the engine portion of the system is more difficult. If
> you
> have made some modifications to the engine fuel system between the engine
> driven mechanical fuel pump and the spider such as installing a pressure
> transducer or fuel flow transducer you should examine them with great care
> or bypass them to ensure that they are not contributors to the engine
> stoppage. If they are not the problem then the next step would be to
> conduct
> the tests described by SID97-3E. See here:
>
> http://www.genuinecontinental.aero/documents/SID97-3E.pdf
>
> You may discover that you have a poorly adjusted fuel injection system or
> a
> faulty engine driven mechanical fuel pump.
>
> This is the best that I can offer given the limited information that I
> have
> at hand. If you will send me more information I will be glad to dig into
> this further.
>
> OC
>
> ==========================================
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <jfherzog@bluewin.ch>
> To: <bakerocb@cox.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 3:10 PM
> Subject: KIS
>
>
>> Hello Owen
>>
>> Do you still enjoy flying your kis??
>>
>> Myself,I am still on the way to complet the job.But I 've just discovered
>> a new problem and I was wondering if you
>> also got it
>> It looks like if the engine fuel pump gets defused and the engine
>> stop.
>> Do you have a check valve along your fuel line?
>> Have you ever encountered such a problem or similar?
>>
>> Best wishes
>>
>> JF
>
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