---------------------------------------------------------- KIS-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 07/08/10: 4 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:21 AM - KIS TR-1 Aerodynamics () 2. 07:48 AM - Re: KIS TR-1 Aerodynamics (Mark Kettering) 3. 08:47 AM - oshkosh (Randy Ott) 4. 01:45 PM - Re: KIS TR-1 Aerodynamics (F. Tim Yoder) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:21:37 AM PST US From: Subject: KIS-List: KIS TR-1 Aerodynamics 7/8/2010 Hello Tim, You wrote: 1) "I would be interested to see your numbers." I am working on a spread sheet to compare some numbers. I'll post it when finished. 2) "Oh, Mark and 'OC' what was the thickness of your main gear shims? Are they fiberglass or aluminum or???" I used a liquid shim of epoxy and glass fibers -- no specific thickness -- just whatever thickness resulted from the gear cross piece squished down into the shim while tilted forward as much as considered feasible. Actual final location of the main gear will be shown on the spread sheet. 'OC' Baker Says: "The best investment we can make is the time and effort to gather and understand knowledge." ============================================================ KIS-List message posted by: "F. Tim Yoder" Mark, 'OC' and all, My gear dimensions are as follows; Main gear axle center line to firewall is 42 1/8" " " " " " " nose gear axle center line 53" I would be interested to see your numbers. In retrospect, I do have to watch and may have to increase stick pressure in order to keep the nose gear off the runway. But I do have plenty of elevator authority to do that. Julian's plane was a tail dragger (conventional) I think. He was trying to give it STOL qualities, an oxymoron I think. I forget what he built to replace the KIS, I think it is a high wing with better STOL qualities. Mark, I am in annual now, but I will try and report on your take off procedure. That is if I don't stall, crash, and burn! Also, maybe it would be helpful to confirm final approach and touch down speeds from the GPS, if available, to confirm the accuracy of our different pitot systems at slow speeds. I you are flying alone, it might be safest to do this at altitude in a practice area. 'OC', maybe Mark and Rich are just better pilots than you and I because I use your technique for more consistent landings. Oh, Mark and 'OC' what was the thickness of your main gear shims? Are they fiberglass or aluminum or??? Tim ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:48:18 AM PST US From: Mark Kettering Subject: Re: KIS-List: KIS TR-1 Aerodynamics Hi Tim, I did about the same thing as OC when making the shim. I taped a thin rubber sheet to the gear so the flox would not stick and there would be room for the rubber. Then put a excess amount of flox piled on the gear cross area. The flox was about 1/2 inch thick at the back edge and thin at the front edge and slightly convex. I was careful to make sure there were not any voids near the areas where the gear bolts attach the gear. Then I placed the gear into the tunnel and bolted it on place with well greased bolts making sure the main gear tires contacted the ground at the correct location. So, I really do not know how thick the shim is. I just know that the shim was made so that the main gear contact point is at the correct location. And at the moment I can not find my notes on the location. For this shim when I say flox I think I used not only cotton but also short chopped fiberglass in the mix. I did not use all chopped fiberglass but I am sure that also works well. Mark >I used a liquid shim of epoxy and glass fibers -- no specific thickness -- >just whatever thickness resulted from the gear cross piece squished down >into the shim while tilted forward as much as considered feasible. Actual >final location of the main gear will be shown on the spread sheet. ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:47:21 AM PST US Subject: KIS-List: oshkosh From: Randy Ott Just curious, Are we going to have a special parking place at oshkosk this year for KIS? Randy 96BT ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 01:45:10 PM PST US From: "F. Tim Yoder" Subject: Re: KIS-List: KIS TR-1 Aerodynamics Thanks Mark, Tim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Kettering" Sent: Thursday, July 08, 2010 7:47 AM Subject: Re: KIS-List: KIS TR-1 Aerodynamics > > Hi Tim, > > I did about the same thing as OC when making the shim. I taped a thin > rubber sheet to the gear so the flox would not stick and there would be > room for the rubber. Then put a excess amount of flox piled on the gear > cross area. The flox was about 1/2 inch thick at the back edge and thin > at the front edge and slightly convex. I was careful to make sure there > were not any voids near the areas where the gear bolts attach the gear. > Then I placed the gear into the tunnel and bolted it on place with well > greased bolts making sure the main gear tires contacted the ground at the > correct location. > > So, I really do not know how thick the shim is. I just know that the shim > was made so that the main gear contact point is at the correct location. > And at the moment I can not find my notes on the location. > > For this shim when I say flox I think I used not only cotton but also > short chopped fiberglass in the mix. I did not use all chopped fiberglass > but I am sure that also works well. > > Mark > > >>I used a liquid shim of epoxy and glass fibers -- no specific thickness -- >>just whatever thickness resulted from the gear cross piece squished down >>into the shim while tilted forward as much as considered feasible. Actual >>final location of the main gear will be shown on the spread sheet. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kis-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/KIS-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kis-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kis-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.