Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:25 AM - Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator (Keith.Miller@esa.int)
2. 02:10 AM - Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator (helixaviation@googlemail.com)
3. 02:22 AM - Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM alternator (Keith.Miller@esa.int)
4. 03:45 AM - Re: oops (BlueSkyFlier)
5. 04:26 AM - Zero timing a O-240-E engine (BlueSkyFlier)
6. 04:40 AM - Re: TRI - 1 (BlueSkyFlier)
7. 05:42 AM - Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine (Keith.Miller@esa.int)
8. 05:49 AM - PORT SIDE FAIRING ()
9. 06:05 AM - Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine ()
10. 07:44 AM - Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine (F. Tim Yoder)
11. 07:50 AM - Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator (F. Tim Yoder)
12. 08:54 AM - Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine (BlueSkyFlier)
13. 09:47 AM - Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator (helixaviation@googlemail.com)
14. 09:58 AM - Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator (F. Tim Yoder)
15. 12:33 PM - Re: KIS TR-1 Propeller (BlueSkyFlier)
16. 12:33 PM - Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING (kent pyle)
17. 12:41 PM - Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING (BlueSkyFlier)
18. 01:01 PM - Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine (Galin Hernandez)
19. 01:27 PM - Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine (ALFRED ROSA)
20. 01:41 PM - Easier browsing of the KIS list (BlueSkyFlier)
21. 02:36 PM - Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING ()
22. 03:06 PM - Re: Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING (F. Tim Yoder)
23. 03:53 PM - Re: Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING (Robert Reed)
24. 04:12 PM - Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine (Galin Hernandez)
25. 05:43 PM - Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine (BlueSkyFlier)
26. 08:25 PM - Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine ()
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator |
Tim
that is not what I want to hear , my IO240B is just coming up to 400hrs ,
but thanks for sharing it with us anyway , at least the shock will be less
when it eventually happens to mine
Keith
From: "F. Tim Yoder" <ftyoder@yoderbuilt.com>
To: <kis-list@matronics.com>
Date: 04/03/2011 04:09
Subject: KIS-List: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator
Sent by: owner-kis-list-server@matronics.com
FYI,
I was fly a couple weeks ago and lost The Alt.
I determined that the Alt. was not producing power and removed it. I am sure
Cont. could have made that job harder if they tried.
I found the Alt. was ok but the Alt. Drive Coupling Assembly (P/N 635796) was
broken, the Lord rubber mount came loose from the ss shroud. Better if the
Alt was bad.
The bad news is that Cont. wants $2077.00 for this part, no, the engine is
not included!
The not so bad news is that Drake rebuilds them and they can be had for
$600.00 to $900.00, with a good core.
I only had a little over 400 hrs. on the engine. I had to remove a Slick Mag
to get the Alt. out, so I had the mag 500 hr service done. New points and
replaced a bad gear. So for only a $1000.00 + I now have lots of amps &
volts.
Hope you have the "good" ones!
Tim
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator |
Keith. My alternator drive coupling failed after about 50 hours. I put it down
to kickback on startup and had the mags retarded a little. The original coupling
was elastomeric and had failed in sheer. I managed to locate an alternative
style that was mechanical but has rubber inserts for shock absorbtion. I got
it second hand and from memory only cost about 100. John
--
Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
Keith.Miller@esa.int wrote:
ore. I
only had a little over 400 hrs. on the engine. I had to remove a Slick Mag to get
the Alt. out, so I had the mag 500 hr service done. New points and replaced
a bad gear. So for only a $1000.00 + I now have lots of amps & volts. Hope you
have the "good" ones! Tim_____________________________________________
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM alternator |
Hopefully mine will last a bit longer , but good to know that there are some
options
From: "helixaviation@googlemail.com" <helixaviation@btinternet.com>
To: kis-list@matronics.com
Date: 04/03/2011 11:11
Subject: Re: KIS-List: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator
Sent by: owner-kis-list-server@matronics.com
Keith. My alternator drive coupling failed after about 50 hours. I put it
down to kickback on startup and had the mags retarded a little. The original
coupling was elastomeric and had failed in sheer. I managed to locate an
alternative style that was mechanical but has rubber inserts for shock
absorbtion. I got it second hand and from memory only cost about 100. John
--
Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
Keith.Miller@esa.int wrote:
want to hear , my IO240B is just coming up to 400hrs , but thanks for
sharing it with us anyway , at least the shock will be less when it
eventually happens to mine Keith From: "F. Tim Yoder"
<ftyoder@yoderbuilt.com> To: <kis-list@matronics.com> Date: 04/03/2011
04:09 Subject: KIS-List: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator Sent by:
owner-kis-list-server@matronics.com FYI, I was fly a couple weeks ago and
lost The Alt. I determined that the Alt. was not producing power and
removed it. I am sure Cont. could have made that job harder if they tried.
I found the Alt. was ok but the Alt. Drive Coupling Assembly (P/N 635796)
was broken, the Lord rubber mount came loose from the ss shroud. Better if
the Alt was bad. The bad news is that Cont. wants $2077.00 for this part,
no, the engine is not included! The not so bad news is that Drake rebuilds
them and they can be had for $600.00 to $900.00, with a good core. I only
had a little over 400 hrs. on the engine. I had to remove a Slick Mag to
get the Alt. out, so I had the mag 500 hr service done. New points and
replaced a bad gear. So for only a $1000.00 + I now have lots of amps &
volts. Hope you have the "good" ones!
Message 4
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Hi Rich,
Chuckle ... yes, going in a circle is a good way to get nowhere fast :O)
Judged by the eye, linear speed in the arc was 8-10 miles/hr when left wingtip
connected the side of Cessna's tail section. The wing did flex backward a bit
and the hinge of the flap actuator was bent approx half an inch out of line. The
wing will have to come off anyway because flap actuator mechanism needs work
and damage to bottom part of port side fairing is such that it needs to be
replaced/rebuilt.
If you know where one can still get that fairing part plse let me know?
Good news is that there are no cracks whatsoever in fuselage or spar box attachment
(which was built much stronger than specified) Firewall and engine mount
is fine too. The plane had a huge aluminium spinner which absorbed most of the
impact and shock.
Besides fixable damage to left wing tip front corner, other airframe damage is
constrained to wing fairings and rudder actuator hinge mechanism. Photos will
follow once insurance matters are resolved.
The list of glass fibre repair items include:
1) cowling top and bottom left front side
2) left wing fairing (extensive)
3) right wing fairing (negligible)
3) starboard side of tail fin (scratches and one small perforation)
4) left wing tip front corner
5) fibre panel to front of left flap actuator hinge has a hole in it.
6) topside of left wing has scratches and a shallow dent just to inside fuel cap
but is not pulverised or cracked (from sliding underneath the tail section of
Cessna)
7) port hatch to be re-attached and scratches on top side of cabin to be mended
8) windscreen to be replaced
Rudder modifications, zero timed engine and complete repaint to round it all off.
Regards,
Alfred
--------
_________________________________________
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332729#332729
Message 5
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| Subject: | Zero timing a O-240-E engine |
Hi Scott,
You wrote: "The new windshield should be easy. The company that has the molds
is Aircraft Windshield Company, 562-430-8108 in the Los Angeles area. What kind
of engine do you have?"
Thank you for the windshield info. I shall contact them forthwith.
My engine is a Rolls Royce Continental O-240-E as originally fitted to Cessna FRM-150
Aerobats out of the Reims factory in France.
More info at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_O-240
Does anyone have knowledge of a reliable shop where I can have the engine zero-timed
for a fair price?
Regards,
Alfred
--------
_________________________________________
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332731#332731
Message 6
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While we are in memory lane ...
Attached a picture of Rich and his wife with the first KIS plane. And a good plane
it is too. Thanks Rich!
I was to still too young at the time to be building one but I sure do enjoy the
way it flies. And so will a whole second generation of owners.
- Alfred
--------
_________________________________________
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332732#332732
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/original_kis_plane__rich_trickle_353.jpg
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine |
Alfred
when you get a price for the windshield , please share the info . also Some
time back we had some discussions on the thickness and the material, maybe
look in the archives
Keith
From: "BlueSkyFlier" <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
To: kis-list@matronics.com
Date: 04/03/2011 13:28
Subject: KIS-List: Zero timing a O-240-E engine
Sent by: owner-kis-list-server@matronics.com
Hi Scott,
You wrote: "The new windshield should be easy. The company that has the
molds is Aircraft Windshield Company, 562-430-8108 in the Los Angeles area.
What kind of engine do you have?"
Thank you for the windshield info. I shall contact them forthwith.
My engine is a Rolls Royce Continental O-240-E as originally fitted to Cessna
FRM-150 Aerobats out of the Reims factory in France.
More info at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_O-240
Does anyone have knowledge of a reliable shop where I can have the engine
zero-timed for a fair price?
Regards,
Alfred
--------
_________________________________________
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332731#332731
Message 8
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| Subject: | PORT SIDE FAIRING |
3/4/2011
Hello Alfred, You wrote: ".....damage to bottom part of port side fairing is
such that it needs to be replaced/rebuilt."
and
"If you know where one can still get that fairing part plse let me know?"
It is a bit difficult to give specific advice on the part involved without
seeing a picture of the damage, but please let me comment in anticipation.
A) The original kit provided bottom of the wing fairings did not work at all
for me. My solution was to position the fuselage upside down and install the
wing.
B) Then I bridged the entire area to be faired with multiple strips of tape
that epoxy would not stick to.
C) Then I put a few layers of epoxy soaked fiberglass on the tape and let it
cure.
D) Then I removed the fairly stiff leather like piece of fiberglass fairing,
removed the tape covering the gap, trimmed the fairing edges, and used that
layup as my lower wing fairing.
'OC' Baker Says: "The best investment we can make is the time and effort to
gather and understand knowledge."
PS: Keep in mind that Julian Bond did extensive wing fairing mods to his KIS
TR-1. I have attached just one of the pictures that are available.
===========================================================
Hi Rich,
Chuckle ... yes, going in a circle is a good way to get nowhere fast :O)
Judged by the eye, linear speed in the arc was 8-10 miles/hr when left
wingtip connected the side of Cessna's tail section. The wing did flex
backward a bit and the hinge of the flap actuator was bent approx half an
inch out of line. The wing will have to come off anyway because flap
actuator mechanism needs work and damage to bottom part of port side fairing
is such that it needs to be replaced/rebuilt.
If you know where one can still get that fairing part plse let me know?
Good news is that there are no cracks whatsoever in fuselage or spar box
attachment (which was built much stronger than specified) Firewall and
engine mount is fine too. The plane had a huge aluminium spinner which
absorbed most of the impact and shock.
Besides fixable damage to left wing tip front corner, other airframe damage
is constrained to wing fairings and rudder actuator hinge mechanism. Photos
will follow once insurance matters are resolved.
The list of glass fibre repair items include:
1) cowling top and bottom left front side
2) left wing fairing (extensive)
3) right wing fairing (negligible)
3) starboard side of tail fin (scratches and one small perforation)
4) left wing tip front corner
5) fibre panel to front of left flap actuator hinge has a hole in it.
6) topside of left wing has scratches and a shallow dent just to inside fuel
cap but is not pulverised or cracked (from sliding underneath the tail
section of Cessna)
7) port hatch to be re-attached and scratches on top side of cabin to be
mended
8) windscreen to be replaced
Rudder modifications, zero timed engine and complete repaint to round it all
off.
Regards,
Alfred
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine |
3/4/2011
Hello Alfred, You wrote: "Does anyone have knowledge of a reliable shop
where I can have the engine zero-timed for a fair price?"
I don't know how the regulations read in your part of the world, but in the
USA the only entity that is authorized to return an engine to zero time
through a remanufacturing or rebuilding process is the original manufacturer
of the engine.
Both Lycoming and TCM have service bulletins published on the subject of
prop strikes or engine sudden stoppages. I will dig them out and post them
if you are interested.
'OC' Baker Says: "The best investment we can make is the time and effort to
gather and understand knowledge."
============================================================
From: "BlueSkyFlier" <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 7:24 AM
Subject: KIS-List: Zero timing a O-240-E engine
> <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
>
> Hi Scott,
>
> You wrote: "The new windshield should be easy. The company that has the
> molds is Aircraft Windshield Company, 562-430-8108 in the Los Angeles
> area. What kind of engine do you have?"
>
> Thank you for the windshield info. I shall contact them forthwith.
>
> My engine is a Rolls Royce Continental O-240-E as originally fitted to
> Cessna FRM-150 Aerobats out of the Reims factory in France.
>
> More info at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_O-240
>
> Does anyone have knowledge of a reliable shop where I can have the engine
> zero-timed for a fair price?
>
> Regards,
> Alfred
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine |
I think the original was 1/8", I had Rich get me one 3/16". If memory
serves, that was in 1993.
----- Original Message -----
From: <Keith.Miller@esa.int>
Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 6:32 AM
Subject: Re: KIS-List: Zero timing a O-240-E engine
>
> Alfred
>
> when you get a price for the windshield , please share the info . also
> Some
> time back we had some discussions on the thickness and the material, maybe
> look in the archives
>
> Keith
>
>
> From: "BlueSkyFlier" <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
>
> To: kis-list@matronics.com
>
> Date: 04/03/2011 13:28
>
> Subject: KIS-List: Zero timing a O-240-E engine
>
> Sent by: owner-kis-list-server@matronics.com
>
>
> <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
>
> Hi Scott,
>
> You wrote: "The new windshield should be easy. The company that has the
> molds is Aircraft Windshield Company, 562-430-8108 in the Los Angeles
> area.
> What kind of engine do you have?"
>
> Thank you for the windshield info. I shall contact them forthwith.
>
> My engine is a Rolls Royce Continental O-240-E as originally fitted to
> Cessna
> FRM-150 Aerobats out of the Reims factory in France.
>
> More info at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_O-240
>
> Does anyone have knowledge of a reliable shop where I can have the engine
> zero-timed for a fair price?
>
> Regards,
> Alfred
>
> --------
> _________________________________________
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332731#332731
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator |
John, Do you have part no's for the replacement parts?
Thanks, Tim
----- Original Message -----
From: helixaviation@googlemail.com
To: kis-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 3:08 AM
Subject: Re: KIS-List: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator
Keith. My alternator drive coupling failed after about 50 hours. I put
it down to kickback on startup and had the mags retarded a little. The
original coupling was elastomeric and had failed in sheer. I managed to
locate an alternative style that was mechanical but has rubber inserts
for shock absorbtion. I got it second hand and from memory only cost
about =C2=A3100. John
--
Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
Keith.Miller@esa.int wrote:
what I want to hear , my IO240B is just coming up to 400hrs , but thanks
for sharing it with us anyway , at least the shock will be less when it
eventually happens to mine Keith From: "F. Tim Yoder"
<ftyoder@yoderbuilt.com> To: <kis-list@matronics.com> Date: 04/03/2011
04:09 Subject: KIS-List: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator Sent by:
owner-kis-list-server@matronics.com FYI, I was fly a couple weeks ago
and lost The Alt. I determined that the Alt. was not producing power and
removed it. I am sure Cont. could have made that job harder if they
tried. I found the Alt. was ok but the Alt. Drive Coupling Assembly (P/N
635796) was broken, the Lord rubber mount came loose from the ss shroud.
Better if the Alt was bad. The bad news is that Cont. wants $2077.00 for
this part, no, the engine is not included! The not so bad news is that
Drake rebuilds them and they can be had for $600.00 to $900.00, with a
good core. I only had a little over 400 hrs. on the engine. I had to
remove a Slick Mag to get the Alt. out, so I had the mag 500 hr service
done. New points and replaced a bad gear. So for only a $1000.00 + I now
have lots of amps & volts. Hope you have the "good" ones!
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine |
OC,
The manufacturer info about prop strikes you mentioned earlier will be most welcome.
I expect that there will be duly licensed shops which can also zero-time
an engine. There has been talk of Norvik, but I have not had time to look that
up yet.
Regards,
Alfred
--------
_________________________________________
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332751#332751
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator |
Tim.
I thought it lasted 50 hours, after checking the engine logbook it actually lasted
225 hours! Shows how quickly the pain dulls after the passage of time.
I removed part no. 635796 and replaced it with p/ns 531325, 530407, 632050, 653982
and 653983.
John
--
Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
"F. Tim Yoder" <ftyoder@yoderbuilt.com> wrote:
John, Do you have part no's for the replacement parts?
Thanks, Tim
----- Original Message -----
From: helixaviation@googlemail.com
Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 3:08 AM
Subject: Re: KIS-List: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator
Keith. My alternator drive coupling failed after about 50 hours. I put it down
to kickback on startup and had the mags retarded a little. The original coupling
was elastomeric and had failed in sheer. I managed to locate an alternative
style that was mechanical but has rubber inserts for shock absorbtion. I got
it second hand and from memory only cost about 100. John
--
Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
Keith.Miller@esa.int wrote:
ore. I
only had a little over 400 hrs. on the engine. I had to remove a Slick Mag to get the Alt. out, so I had the mag 500 hr service done. New points and replaced a bad gear. So for only a $1000.00 + I now have lots of amps & volts. Hope you have the "good" ones! href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?KIS-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?KIS-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator |
Thank you John, I will keep that info on file, as I am sure others will.
Tim
----- Original Message -----
From: helixaviation@googlemail.com
To: kis-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 10:45 AM
Subject: Re: KIS-List: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator
Tim.
I thought it lasted 50 hours, after checking the engine logbook it
actually lasted 225 hours! Shows how quickly the pain dulls after the
passage of time.
I removed part no. 635796 and replaced it with p/ns 531325, 530407,
632050, 653982 and 653983.
John
--
Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
"F. Tim Yoder" <ftyoder@yoderbuilt.com> wrote:
John, Do you have part no's for the replacement parts?
Thanks, Tim
----- Original Message -----
From: helixaviation@googlemail.com
To: kis-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 3:08 AM
Subject: Re: KIS-List: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator
Keith. My alternator drive coupling failed after about 50 hours. I
put it down to kickback on startup and had the mags retarded a little.
The original coupling was elastomeric and had failed in sheer. I managed
to locate an alternative style that was mechanical but has rubber
inserts for shock absorbtion. I got it second hand and from memory only
cost about =C2=A3100. John
--
Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my
brevity.
Keith.Miller@esa.int wrote:
not what I want to hear , my IO240B is just coming up to 400hrs , but
thanks for sharing it with us anyway , at least the shock will be less
when it eventually happens to mine Keith From: "F. Tim Yoder"
<ftyoder@yoderbuilt.com> To: <kis-list@matronics.com> Date: 04/03/2011
04:09 Subject: KIS-List: IO-240B With the 15V 60A TCM altinator Sent by:
owner-kis-list-server@matronics.com FYI, I was fly a couple weeks ago
and lost The Alt. I determined that the Alt. was not producing power and
removed it. I am sure Cont. could have made that job harder if they
tried. I found the Alt. was ok but the Alt. Drive Coupling Assembly (P/N
635796) was broken, the Lord rubber mount came loose from the ss shroud.
Better if the Alt was bad. The bad news is that Cont. wants $2077.00 for
this part, no, the engine is not included! The not so bad news is that
Drake rebuilds them and they can be had for $600.00 to $900.00, with a
good core. I only had a little over 400 hrs. on the engine. I had to
remove a Slick Mag to get the Alt. out, so I had the mag 500 hr service
done. New points and replaced a bad gear. So for only a $1000.00 + I now
have lots of amps & volts. Hope you have the "good" ones!
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?KIS-List">http://www.matronics
.com/Navigator?KIS-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: KIS TR-1 Propeller |
Thank you for the pointer Tim.
I looked it up and there appears to be close links between Catto and Lipps.
So, for replacing my now demised Chris Lodge prop I shall consider Catto, Prince
P-tip and Idrovario as candidates.
Catto and Prince props are reasonably priced - don't have info on Idrovario pricing
range yet.
Regards,
Alfred
--------
_________________________________________
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332780#332780
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| Subject: | Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING |
Alfred, first of all. I am sorry to hear bout your mishap and your resolve
to fix everything back is a good thing.
My kit did not come with the farings, so I made my own by using the top of
the wing as the pattern. I layed tape on the surface so the glue would not
stick. Then 4 layers of fiberglass cloth. I epoxyed glued that and let it
in place for a couple of days. When I peeled the fibeglass from the upper
surface, and trial fitted it in place it fit suprisingly well considering
the curvatures wee not the same. After using #8 counterset screws every 4
inches on both sides, it conforms to the contures very well.
Rich was able to get me a replacement faring. Kent
----- Original Message -----
From: <bakerocb@cox.net>
<bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 7:47 AM
Subject: KIS-List: PORT SIDE FAIRING
> 3/4/2011
>
> Hello Alfred, You wrote: ".....damage to bottom part of port side fairing
> is
> such that it needs to be replaced/rebuilt."
>
> and
>
> "If you know where one can still get that fairing part plse let me know?"
>
> It is a bit difficult to give specific advice on the part involved without
> seeing a picture of the damage, but please let me comment in anticipation.
>
> A) The original kit provided bottom of the wing fairings did not work at
> all
> for me. My solution was to position the fuselage upside down and install
> the
> wing.
>
> B) Then I bridged the entire area to be faired with multiple strips of
> tape
> that epoxy would not stick to.
>
> C) Then I put a few layers of epoxy soaked fiberglass on the tape and let
> it
> cure.
>
> D) Then I removed the fairly stiff leather like piece of fiberglass
> fairing,
> removed the tape covering the gap, trimmed the fairing edges, and used
> that
> layup as my lower wing fairing.
>
> 'OC' Baker Says: "The best investment we can make is the time and effort
> to
> gather and understand knowledge."
>
> PS: Keep in mind that Julian Bond did extensive wing fairing mods to his
> KIS
> TR-1. I have attached just one of the pictures that are available.
>
> ===========================================================
>
> <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
>
> Hi Rich,
>
> Chuckle ... yes, going in a circle is a good way to get nowhere fast :O)
>
> Judged by the eye, linear speed in the arc was 8-10 miles/hr when left
> wingtip connected the side of Cessna's tail section. The wing did flex
> backward a bit and the hinge of the flap actuator was bent approx half an
> inch out of line. The wing will have to come off anyway because flap
> actuator mechanism needs work and damage to bottom part of port side
> fairing
> is such that it needs to be replaced/rebuilt.
>
> If you know where one can still get that fairing part plse let me know?
>
> Good news is that there are no cracks whatsoever in fuselage or spar box
> attachment (which was built much stronger than specified) Firewall and
> engine mount is fine too. The plane had a huge aluminium spinner which
> absorbed most of the impact and shock.
>
> Besides fixable damage to left wing tip front corner, other airframe
> damage
> is constrained to wing fairings and rudder actuator hinge mechanism.
> Photos
> will follow once insurance matters are resolved.
>
> The list of glass fibre repair items include:
>
> 1) cowling top and bottom left front side
> 2) left wing fairing (extensive)
> 3) right wing fairing (negligible)
> 3) starboard side of tail fin (scratches and one small perforation)
> 4) left wing tip front corner
> 5) fibre panel to front of left flap actuator hinge has a hole in it.
> 6) topside of left wing has scratches and a shallow dent just to inside
> fuel
> cap but is not pulverised or cracked (from sliding underneath the tail
> section of Cessna)
> 7) port hatch to be re-attached and scratches on top side of cabin to be
> mended
> 8) windscreen to be replaced
>
> Rudder modifications, zero timed engine and complete repaint to round it
> all
> off.
>
> Regards,
> Alfred
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
13:34:00
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING |
Thanks OC.
That confirms the thoughts I had. The difficult part is getting the plane upside
down with gear and all :D. Empty weight without engine is ~ 720 lb. but nothing
is impossible.
I could use inflatable mattress to put pressure on layups from below.
- Alfred
--------
_________________________________________
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332784#332784
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine |
I can highly recommend an engine shop (Zephyr Engines) here in the USA. They
did the prop strike rebuild on my engine (Lycoming O-360) 250hrs ago and
they did an awesome job.
Galin
On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 6:24 AM, BlueSkyFlier <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>wrote:
> >
>
> Hi Scott,
>
> You wrote: "The new windshield should be easy. The company that has the
> molds is Aircraft Windshield Company, 562-430-8108 in the Los Angeles area.
> What kind of engine do you have?"
>
> Thank you for the windshield info. I shall contact them forthwith.
>
> My engine is a Rolls Royce Continental O-240-E as originally fitted to
> Cessna FRM-150 Aerobats out of the Reims factory in France.
>
> More info at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_O-240
>
> Does anyone have knowledge of a reliable shop where I can have the engine
> zero-timed for a fair price?
>
> Regards,
> Alfred
>
> --------
> _________________________________________
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332731#332731
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine |
*Galin,*
*
*
*You need to wait another 1,750 hours before you declare an awesome job.*
*
*
*Al*
On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 3:58 PM, Galin Hernandez <galinhdz@gmail.com> wrote:
> I can highly recommend an engine shop (Zephyr Engines) here in the USA.
> They did the prop strike rebuild on my engine (Lycoming O-360) 250hrs ago
> and they did an awesome job.
>
> Galin
>
> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 6:24 AM, BlueSkyFlier <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>wrote:
>
>> bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
>>
>> Hi Scott,
>>
>> You wrote: "The new windshield should be easy. The company that has the
>> molds is Aircraft Windshield Company, 562-430-8108 in the Los Angeles area.
>> What kind of engine do you have?"
>>
>> Thank you for the windshield info. I shall contact them forthwith.
>>
>> My engine is a Rolls Royce Continental O-240-E as originally fitted to
>> Cessna FRM-150 Aerobats out of the Reims factory in France.
>>
>> More info at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_O-240
>>
>> Does anyone have knowledge of a reliable shop where I can have the engine
>> zero-timed for a fair price?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Alfred
>>
>> --------
>> _________________________________________
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.=========
>> rowse, Chat, FAQ,
>> ="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?KIS-List" target="_blank">http://w==
>> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332731#332731>http://forums.m
>> le, List Admin.
>> ====
>>
>>
>>
>> <http://forums.matronics.com/>
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Easier browsing of the KIS list |
Being a newbie to this forum, I only just discovered the easy/convenient way to
work through messages in this list.
For those who havent tried it yet, take a look at the list via:
http://www.matronics.com/listbrowse/kis-list/subject.html --- ordered by subject
http://www.matronics.com/listbrowse/kis-list/date.html --- ordered by date
http://www.matronics.com/listbrowse/kis-list/author.html --- ordered by author
Regards,
Alfred
--------
_________________________________________
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332793#332793
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING |
3/4/2011
Hello Alfred, You wrote:
1) "The difficult part is getting the plane upside down with gear and
all...."
That is very true, but I bet that if you had the engine, nose gear, and
wing off (may be a very likely configuration in the process of your repair)
the plane could be tipped over going nose down tail up. It is not that hard
to rig sling straps for the fuselage to rest in while upside down.
Also consider that one can make epoxy - fiberglass layups onto an overhead
surface. It is more difficult than having gravity to help you, but it can be
done.
2) "I could use inflatable mattress to put pressure on layups from below."
An excellent idea -- thin plywood between the matress and the fiberglass
layup with a release surface and peel ply on the plywood could create a very
nice fairing surface ready for filling, priming, and painting.
OC
====================================================
From: "BlueSkyFlier" <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 3:40 PM
Subject: KIS-List: Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING
> <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
>
> Thanks OC.
>
> That confirms the thoughts I had. The difficult part is getting the plane
> upside down with gear and all :D. Empty weight without engine is ~ 720 lb.
> but nothing is impossible.
>
> I could use inflatable mattress to put pressure on layups from below.
>
> - Alfred
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING |
I went a different direction with the bottom fairings. I made them out of
thin Aluminum sheet and screwed them on. They make large inspection doors
and were easy fit.
If you are interested I could take some photos and post them.
Tim
----- Original Message -----
From: <bakerocb@cox.net>
Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 3:31 PM
Subject: KIS-List: Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING
>
> Hello Alfred, You wrote:
>
> 1) "The difficult part is getting the plane upside down with gear and
> all...."
>
> That is very true, but I bet that if you had the engine, nose gear, and
> wing off (may be a very likely configuration in the process of your
> repair) the plane could be tipped over going nose down tail up. It is not
> that hard to rig sling straps for the fuselage to rest in while upside
> down.
>
> Also consider that one can make epoxy - fiberglass layups onto an overhead
> surface. It is more difficult than having gravity to help you, but it can
> be done.
>
> 2) "I could use inflatable mattress to put pressure on layups from below."
>
> An excellent idea -- thin plywood between the matress and the fiberglass
> layup with a release surface and peel ply on the plywood could create a
> very nice fairing surface ready for filling, priming, and painting.
>
> OC
>
> ====================================================
> From: "BlueSkyFlier" <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
> To: <kis-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 3:40 PM
> Subject: KIS-List: Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING
>
>
>> <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
>>
>> Thanks OC.
>>
>> That confirms the thoughts I had. The difficult part is getting the plane
>> upside down with gear and all :D. Empty weight without engine is ~ 720
>> lb. but nothing is impossible.
>>
>> I could use inflatable mattress to put pressure on layups from below.
>>
>> - Alfred
>
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING |
Much easier to use some plastic, tape, and vacuum.=0A=0ABob=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_
_______________________________=0AFrom: BlueSkyFlier <bleuskyfly@teledynami
x.com>=0ATo: kis-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Fri, March 4, 2011 2:40:31 PM
=0ASubject: KIS-List: Re: PORT SIDE FAIRING=0A=0A--> KIS-List message poste
d by: "BlueSkyFlier" <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>=0A=0AThanks OC.=0A=0AThat
confirms the thoughts I had. The difficult part is getting the plane upsid
e =0Adown with gear and all :D. Empty weight without engine is ~ 720 lb. bu
t nothing =0Ais impossible.=0A=0AI could use inflatable mattress to put pre
ssure on layups from below.=0A=0A- Alfred=0A=0A--------=0A_________________
________________________=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Aht
tp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332784#332784=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
============
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine |
Well, with Zephyr Engines being rated #1 in the last 3 AOPA polls there are
others out there that feel the same as I do. Besides, I can declare and
recommend whatever I want even if you don't agree. ;o)
Galin
On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 3:25 PM, ALFRED ROSA <fredorosa@gmail.com> wrote:
> *Galin,*
> *
> *
> *You need to wait another 1,750 hours before you declare an awesome job.*
> *
> *
> *Al*
>
> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 3:58 PM, Galin Hernandez <galinhdz@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> I can highly recommend an engine shop (Zephyr Engines) here in the USA.
>> They did the prop strike rebuild on my engine (Lycoming O-360) 250hrs ago
>> and they did an awesome job.
>>
>> Galin
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 6:24 AM, BlueSkyFlier <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>wrote:
>>
>>> bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
>>>
>>> Hi Scott,
>>>
>>> You wrote: "The new windshield should be easy. The company that has the
>>> molds is Aircraft Windshield Company, 562-430-8108 in the Los Angeles area.
>>> What kind of engine do you have?"
>>>
>>> Thank you for the windshield info. I shall contact them forthwith.
>>>
>>> My engine is a Rolls Royce Continental O-240-E as originally fitted to
>>> Cessna FRM-150 Aerobats out of the Reims factory in France.
>>>
>>> More info at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_O-240
>>>
>>> Does anyone have knowledge of a reliable shop where I can have the engine
>>> zero-timed for a fair price?
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Alfred
>>>
>>> --------
>>> _________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.=========
>>> rowse, Chat, FAQ,
>>> ="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?KIS-List"
>>> target="_blank">http://w==
>>> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332731#332731>http://forums.m
>>> le, List Admin.
>>> ====
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <http://forums.matronics.com/>
>>
>>
>> *
>>
>> et="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?KIS-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> *
>>
>>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine |
After doing my homework I decided to get the work done this side of the pond. After
weeding out the bad apples the potential repair shops are:
http://www.arrowaviationservices.co.uk/page7.php
http://www.nicholsonmclaren.com/
http://norvic.com/en/Lycoming_Continental_Franklin_shockload
CFS at Coventry - http://www.cfsaeroproducts.co.uk/engines.html
Airspeed at Derby - http://www.derbyaeroclub.com/Airspeed.html
Dukeries Aviation, Netherthorpe - Dave Bonsall Netherthorpe, Worksop, Nottinghamshire
S80 3JQ, Tel: 01909481802
Multiflight - http://www.multiflight.com/engineering/capabilities-and-approvals.php
CSE - http://www.avbuyer.com/PDFs/CSE%20Page%202.pdf
As the first three are the closest, one of them will most likely be chosen unless
significant price advantage comes from one of the remaining lot - transport
costs can easily erode the advantage.
Regards,
Alfred.
--------
_________________________________________
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=332825#332825
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine |
3/4/2011
Hello Alfred, You wrote:
1) "The manufacturer info about prop strikes you mentioned earlier will be
most welcome."
Please see below links and the attached TCM SB96-11B:
http://www.tcmlink.com/fiddefault.aspx?cgroup=MATTITUCK&cpagename=SS
http://www.lycoming.textron.com/support/publications/service-bulletins/pdfs/SB533A.pdf
2) "I expect that there will be duly licensed shops which can also zero-time
an engine."
In the USA this is not true. Here is an extract from US Part 14 CFR (Code of
Federal Regulations):
"91.421 Rebuilt engine maintenance records.
(a) The owner or operator may use a new maintenance record, without previous
operating history, for an aircraft engine rebuilt by the manufacturer or by
an agency approved by the manufacturer.
(b) Each manufacturer or agency that grants zero time to an engine rebuilt
by it shall enter in the new record-
(1) A signed statement of the date the engine was rebuilt;
(2) Each change made as required by airworthiness directives; and
(3) Each change made in compliance with manufacturer's service bulletins, if
the entry is specifically requested in that bulletin.
(c) For the purposes of this section, a rebuilt engine is a used engine that
has been completely disassembled, inspected, repaired as necessary,
reassembled, tested, and approved in the same manner and to the same
tolerances and limits as a new engine with either new or used parts.
However, all parts used in it must conform to the production drawing
tolerances and limits for new parts or be of approved oversized or
undersized dimensions for a new engine."
What 91.421 is saying:
A} Only a rebuilt (or new) engine gets a new (zero time) maintenance record
(engine log book).
B} An overhauled engine does not get a new (zero time) maintenance record
(engine log book).
C} Only the manufacturer or an agency approved by the manufacturer can
create a rebuilt engine.
Even Teledyne Mattituck Services Inc which is owned by TCM does not use the
term rebuilt in any of their literature, but instead uses the term
overhauled. I am unaware of any agency in the US that either Lycoming or TCM
has approved, other than themselves, to rebuild (zero time) their engines.
What do the regulations in your country permit?
Here is some additional information on this subject:
http://www.mattituck.com/articles/ohterms.htm
http://www.lycoming.textron.com/engines/service/zero-time-rebuilt-engines.html
3) "There has been talk of Norvik, but I have not had time to look that up
yet."
I see only the term overhauled used on their web site:
http://norvic.com/en/Aircraft_engine_overhaul_exchange_shockload_repair
'OC' Baker Says: "The best investment we can make is the time and effort to
gather and understand knowledge."
========================================================
From: "BlueSkyFlier" <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
Sent: Friday, March 04, 2011 11:52 AM
Subject: KIS-List: Re: Zero timing a O-240-E engine
> <bleuskyfly@teledynamix.com>
>
> OC,
>
> The manufacturer info about prop strikes you mentioned earlier will be
> most welcome. I expect that there will be duly licensed shops which can
> also zero-time an engine. There has been talk of Norvik, but I have not
> had time to look that up yet.
>
> Regards,
> Alfred
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