Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:07 AM - KIS TR-1 Gear Gap ()
2. 07:43 AM - Re: KIS TR-1 Gear Gap (ALFRED ROSA)
3. 01:13 PM - Re: KIS TR-1 Propeller ()
4. 03:42 PM - KIS TR-1 Wing Removal and Installation ()
5. 04:23 PM - Re: KIS TR-1 Wing Removal and Installation (Scott Stearns)
Message 1
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Subject: | KIS TR-1 Gear Gap |
3/9/2011
Hello Al, You wrote:
1) " Has anyone not done this?"
That would be me.
2) "Wonder how big a difference it would make in parasitic drag."
I suspect very little because the air in that area is already very turbulent
because of:
A) Disturbance caused by engine exhaust coming out of the exhaust pipes.
B) Disturbance caused by the exhaust pipes themselves sticking out into the
air flow.
C) Disturbance caused by engine cooling air exiting out of the bottom rear
of the engine cowling.
I may cover over the gap some day, but it would be more cosmetically
motivated than performance motivated.
'OC' Baker Says: "The best investment we can make is the time and effort to
gather and understand knowledge."
=====================================================
From: "ALFRED ROSA" <fredorosa@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2011 10:41 AM
Subject: KIS-List: Gear gap
> I'm considering not bothering to cover the landing gear indent in the
> bottom
> of the fuselage.
>
> Has anyone not done this? Wonder how big a difference it would make in
> parasitic drag.
>
> Al
>
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: KIS TR-1 Gear Gap |
OK, thanks. That's one less job to do.
Al
On Wed, Mar 9, 2011 at 8:05 AM, <bakerocb@cox.net> wrote:
>
> 3/9/2011
>
> Hello Al, You wrote:
>
> 1) " Has anyone not done this?"
>
> That would be me.
>
> 2) "Wonder how big a difference it would make in parasitic drag."
>
> I suspect very little because the air in that area is already very
> turbulent because of:
>
> A) Disturbance caused by engine exhaust coming out of the exhaust pipes.
>
> B) Disturbance caused by the exhaust pipes themselves sticking out into the
> air flow.
>
> C) Disturbance caused by engine cooling air exiting out of the bottom rear
> of the engine cowling.
>
> I may cover over the gap some day, but it would be more cosmetically
> motivated than performance motivated.
>
> 'OC' Baker Says: "The best investment we can make is the time and effort to
> gather and understand knowledge."
>
> =====================================================
> From: "ALFRED ROSA" <fredorosa@gmail.com>
> To: "kisbuilders" <kis-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2011 10:41 AM
> Subject: KIS-List: Gear gap
>
>
> I'm considering not bothering to cover the landing gear indent in the
>> bottom
>> of the fuselage.
>>
>> Has anyone not done this? Wonder how big a difference it would make in
>> parasitic drag.
>>
>> Al
>>
>>
>
>
Message 3
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Subject: | Re: KIS TR-1 Propeller |
3/9/2011
Hello Alfred, Message received. I'll try.
There are some rather valid reasons for resubjecting or, as some may
consider it, refining message subjects to show more accurate message
content:
1) The initial message may be mostly on one subject, then someone will
respond to that initial message including an off shoot subject and the next
thing we know messages that deal only with, say flap positioning, are flying
back and forth still under the intial subject of propeller performance.
This would make it very difficult to research the subject of flap
positioning if one were doing a message subject only search as opposed to
doing a message content search.
Bil Schertz, the founder and great guru of the original KIS list before it
was shifted over to Matronics, was frequently reminding us to keep message
subject focused on message content. Back then we did not have available the
sophisticated message content search capability that currently exists within
the Matronics system.
2) The initial message may just identify the airplane as a KIS with no
specificity regarding whether the 2 seat or 4 seat, or tail dragger versus
tricycle gear version was being discussed. This created confusion on many
occasions and the sooner the clarification was made the better.
3) Sometimes the initial poster will use non standard / unfamiliar / wrong
(from a widely accepted usage view point) terminology in the posting subject
line such as "dust cover" instead of "glare shield" or "zero time engine"
instead of "zero time SMOH (Since Major Over Haul)" and it is not entirely
helpful to continue to use that initial misleading subject for the life of
the thread (or eternity as the case may be).
On balance my preference seems to lean toward accurate communication and
future search relevance being of more long range value than near term ease
in just following a current thread subject path no matter how misleading the
subject has become.
OC
===============================================================
From: "Alfred Prosser" <aprosser@teledynamix.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2011 11:26 AM
Subject: RE: KIS TR-1 Propeller
> Hi OC,
>
> If you don't mind, please don't start new threads on the forum when
> responding to messages in already existing threads? It just
> breaks the flow of things and adds clutter where there need not be any. No
> harm done in just asking.
>
> Examples of this recently include:
> KIS TR-1 Gear Gap
> KIS TR-1 Propeller - attachment
> PORT SIDE FAIRING
> KIS Landings
>
> Regards,
> Alfred
>
Message 4
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Subject: | KIS TR-1 Wing Removal and Installation |
3/9/2011
Hello Scott, Thanks for the pictures.
Your picture of the wing being held up by a jack setting on a structure made
of particle board, 2 X 4's, and drywall screws reminded me of a thought that
went through my mind a few times while building my KIS TR-1 and the various
temporary jigs that I constructed with plywood (much of it from the original
KIS delivery crate), 2 X 4's, and drywalls screws:
"If you give me enough plywood, 2 X 4's, and drywall screws I bet I could
build an Empire State Building." It might not be very usable, but it would
be up there.
OC
PS: For those quick to scoff I refer them to the photos of bamboo
scaffolding used in Hong Kong. See here:
http://www.designboom.com/weblog/cat/8/view/6888/hong-kong-bamboo-scaffolding.html
I marveled at this technique when I visited there back in the early 1960's.
They were using a type of grass or rattan to fasten the joints -- don't know
if they still do that.
=================================================
From: "Scott Stearns" <sstearns2@yahoo.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2011 1:03 AM
Subject: Re: KIS-List: KIS TR-1 Wing Removal and Installation
Here's a picture of the rig I built to install and remove my wing. I removed
and installed the wing by myself dozens of times. The final iteration had
the 2x4s vertical instead of angled (originally I made to remove the wing
with the tail down). I also had temper foam where the wing rested in the
cradle. It's on wheels which makes the wing easy to move around.
Scott
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: KIS TR-1 Wing Removal and Installation |
Hi OC,
-
I've seen the bamboo scaffolding in China when I was there with Mark 10 yea
rs ago.- 30 story buildings with bamboo scaffolding tied together with so
me kind of a twine.- Not a nail or screw in it.-
-
The box with the jack had a base of 4x4s and was quite solid.-
-
Scott
--- On Wed, 3/9/11, bakerocb@cox.net <bakerocb@cox.net> wrote:
From: bakerocb@cox.net <bakerocb@cox.net>
Subject: KIS-List: KIS TR-1 Wing Removal and Installation
3/9/2011
Hello Scott, Thanks for the pictures.
Your picture of the wing being held up by a jack setting on a structure mad
e of particle board, 2 X 4's, and drywall screws reminded me of a thought t
hat went through my mind a few times while building my KIS TR-1 and the var
ious temporary jigs that I constructed with plywood (much of it from the or
iginal KIS delivery crate), 2 X 4's, and drywalls screws:
"If you give me enough plywood, 2 X 4's, and drywall screws I bet I could b
uild an Empire State Building." It might not be very usable, but it would b
e up there.
OC
PS: For those quick to scoff I refer them to the photos of bamboo scaffoldi
ng used in Hong Kong. See here:
http://www.designboom.com/weblog/cat/8/view/6888/hong-kong-bamboo-scaffoldi
ng.html
I marveled at this technique when I visited there back in the early 1960's.
They were using a type of grass or rattan to fasten the joints -- don't kn
ow if they still do that.
========================
From: "Scott Stearns" <sstearns2@yahoo.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2011 1:03 AM
Subject: Re: KIS-List: KIS TR-1 Wing Removal and Installation
Here's a picture of the rig I built to install and remove my wing. I remove
d and installed the wing by myself dozens of times. The final iteration had
the 2x4s vertical instead of angled (originally I made to remove the wing
with the tail down). I also had temper foam where the wing rested in the cr
adle. It's on wheels which makes the wing easy to move around.
Scott
le, List Admin.
=0A=0A=0A
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