---------------------------------------------------------- KIS-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 08/10/12: 4 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:51 PM - Sanding, sanding, some more sanding and so on. (Robert Reed) 2. 03:59 PM - Re: Sanding, sanding, some more sanding and so on. (Galin Hernandez) 3. 04:23 PM - Re: Sanding, sanding, some more sanding and so on. (Scott Stearns) 4. 06:29 PM - Re: Sanding, sanding, some more sanding and so on. (Robert Reed) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:51:05 PM PST US From: Robert Reed Subject: KIS-List: Sanding, sanding, some more sanding and so on. The summer after I turned 11 years old my step father informed me that I wa s old =0Aenough to start working at the Garage and Body Shop that he and hi s brothers =0Aowned.- My joyful unpaid job from then on every weekend and through the summers =0Auntil I turned 14, got my drivers licence and a pay ing job was to do the wet =0Asanding of the cars in the shop for body repai r and painting.- (Yes, 14 was when =0Awe could get drivers licences back in those old days.)- Sanding back then used =0Awet sandpaper, a bucket an d a sanding block similar to what we have today.- We =0Adid have somethin g called a JitterBug air powered sander for the very rough =0Asanding but m ost sanding used just your hand, water, and paper.- The sanding =0Ablock wasn't really that useful on anything other than flat surfaces.=0A-=0AWha t used to really irritate me was after a long session of sanding a fender, =0Adoor, or hood I would proudly proclaim that it was done.- My stepfathe r would =0Acome out to the sanding and washing bay and walk over to the car , rub his hands =0Aover the surface and quickly tell me that I had a lot ye t to do and get back to =0Ait.- He would then point out every area that I had missed or not done =0Acorrectly.- I couldn't for the life of me unde rstand how he knew it wasn't done =0Ajust by rubbing his hands over it.- Now before I go further, I must state that =0Ahis hands were about the roug hest, cracked, banged up, and greese imbedded you =0Awould ever see.- You didn't want to shake hands with him because it reminded you =0Aof holding a big pine cone.- Yet, he could feel any flaws in that surface =0Ainstant ly.- It used to infuriate me to no end and I would say a few choice words =0Aand go back to sanding only to repeat the process two or three times be fore =0Afinally getting a grunt followed by him picking up some sandpaper a nd working on =0Aa couple of areas before proclaiming it ready.=0A-=0AFas t forward to now and finally after all of these years I totally understand. - =0AThe HANDS are an incredibily sensitive tool for determining when a s urface is =0Afully sanded and for picking out the slightest flaw in a surfa ce as large as a =0Awing.- Flaws that you can't see, a microscopic speck of dust, or a low spot can =0Abe instantly detected by just rubbing a clean dry hand over the surface.- =0A=0A-=0AI have just finished preparing t he second wing for painting.- I put on the first =0Atwo coats of primer a nd have sanded them down preparing for two more coats that =0Awill get anot her sanding before the color coats.- What I found in the process =0Awas w hat my step-father had been doing all those years back.- He would clean t he =0Asurface and wait for it to dry.- He would then clean his hands and dry them =0Abefore sliding it across the surface.- I have used the same t echnique before =0Apainting to clear any dust from the surface and to know when I had all of it =0Acleared.- During the sanding process, I will sand until I think it is about =0Athere, clean the surface to remove all sandin g dust, then use the dry hand rub =0Ato detect any flaws.- A quick mark w ith a pencil over any flaws is followed by =0Aanother sanding session and r epeat the same thing again.- A couple of iterations =0Aand you will find the surface is ready for the next painting process.- =0A=0A-=0AI also u se the same process just before putting on the paint.- I wash the heck =0Aout of my hands to remove any oil and dry them.- I then wet a rag with rubbing =0Aalcahol and use it to clean my hand.- Using my hand I rub it over the surface to =0Apickup any dust and wipe it on the damp rag.- I re peat this process until I can =0Ano longer feel any dust anywhere on the su rface.- This will always take at least =0Atwo passes.- If I feel anythi ng on a pass, I wipe my hand after making the pass =0Aand do it again.- I know they recommend tack cloth but have found tack cloths =0Acan leave res idue and you really don't know if it get everything.- I hate to =0Aadmit but my step-father actually know what he was doing, at least when it came =0Ato sanding.=0A-=0ANOW if he had just taught me how to spray paint!- Anyway, the primer is going on =0Agreat and the color coat is a futur chall enge.=0A-=0AMaking slow progress,=0A-=0ABob Reed ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:59:29 PM PST US From: Galin Hernandez Subject: Re: KIS-List: Sanding, sanding, some more sanding and so on. NICE! Remember, slow progress is how the turtle beat the hare. :o) On Fri, Aug 10, 2012 at 5:50 PM, Robert Reed wrote: > The summer after I turned 11 years old my step father informed me that I > was old enough to start working at the Garage and Body Shop that he and his > brothers owned. My joyful unpaid job from then on every weekend and > through the summers until I turned 14, got my drivers licence and a paying > job was to do the wet sanding of the cars in the shop for body repair and > painting. (Yes, 14 was when we could get drivers licences back in those > old days.) Sanding back then used wet sandpaper, a bucket and a sanding > block similar to what we have today. We did have something called a > JitterBug air powered sander for the very rough sanding but most sanding > used just your hand, water, and paper. The sanding block wasn't really > that useful on anything other than flat surfaces. > > > What used to really irritate me was after a long session of sanding a > fender, door, or hood I would proudly proclaim that it was done. My > stepfather would come out to the sanding and washing bay and walk over to > the car, rub his hands over the surface and quickly tell me that I had a > lot yet to do and get back to it. He would then point out every area that > I had missed or not done correctly. I couldn't for the life of me > understand how he knew it wasn't done just by rubbing his hands over it. > Now before I go further, I must state that his hands were about the > roughest, cracked, banged up, and greese imbedded you would ever see. You > didn't want to shake hands with him because it reminded you of holding a > big pine cone. Yet, he could feel any flaws in that surface instantly. It > used to infuriate me to no end and I would say a few choice words and go > back to sanding only to repeat the process two or three times before > finally getting a grunt followed by him picking up some sandpaper and > working on a couple of areas before proclaiming it ready. > > > Fast forward to now and finally after all of these years I totally > understand. The HANDS are an incredibily sensitive tool for determining > when a surface is fully sanded and for picking out the slightest flaw in a > surface as large as a wing. Flaws that you can't see, a microscopic speck > of dust, or a low spot can be instantly detected by just rubbing a clean > dry hand over the surface. > > > I have just finished preparing the second wing for painting. I put on the > first two coats of primer and have sanded them down preparing for two more > coats that will get another sanding before the color coats. What I found > in the process was what my step-father had been doing all those years > back. He would clean the surface and wait for it to dry. He would then > clean his hands and dry them before sliding it across the surface. I have > used the same technique before painting to clear any dust from the surface > and to know when I had all of it cleared. During the sanding process, I > will sand until I think it is about there, clean the surface to remove all > sanding dust, then use the dry hand rub to detect any flaws. A quick mark > with a pencil over any flaws is followed by another sanding session and > repeat the same thing again. A couple of iterations and you will find the > surface is ready for the next painting process. > > > I also use the same process just before putting on the paint. I wash the > heck out of my hands to remove any oil and dry them. I then wet a rag with > rubbing alcahol and use it to clean my hand. Using my hand I rub it over > the surface to pickup any dust and wipe it on the damp rag. I repeat this > process until I can no longer feel any dust anywhere on the surface. This > will always take at least two passes. If I feel anything on a pass, I wipe > my hand after making the pass and do it again. I know they recommend tack > cloth but have found tack cloths can leave residue and you really don't > know if it get everything. I hate to admit but my step-father actually > know what he was doing, at least when it came to sanding. > > > NOW if he had just taught me how to spray paint! Anyway, the primer is > going on great and the color coat is a futur challenge. > > > Making slow progress, > > > Bob Reed > > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:23:03 PM PST US Subject: Re: KIS-List: Sanding, sanding, some more sanding and so on. From: Scott Stearns Misting on a guide coat of cheap spray paint before you start sanding is pre tty effective too. The cheap stuff comes right off with acetone. Scott On Aug 10, 2012, at 3:50 PM, Robert Reed wrote: > The summer after I turned 11 years old my step father informed me that I w as old enough to start working at the Garage and Body Shop that he and his b rothers owned. My joyful unpaid job from then on every weekend and through t he summers until I turned 14, got my drivers licence and a paying job was to do the wet sanding of the cars in the shop for body repair and painting. ( Yes, 14 was when we could get drivers licences back in those old days.) San ding back then used wet sandpaper, a bucket and a sanding block similar to w hat we have today. We did have something called a JitterBug air powered san der for the very rough sanding but most sanding used just your hand, water, a nd paper. The sanding block wasn't really that useful on anything other tha n flat surfaces. > > > > What used to really irritate me was after a long session of sanding a fend er, door, or hood I would proudly proclaim that it was done. My stepfather w ould come out to the sanding and washing bay and walk over to the car, rub h is hands over the surface and quickly tell me that I had a lot yet to do and get back to it. He would then point out every area that I had missed or no t done correctly. I couldn't for the life of me understand how he knew it w asn't done just by rubbing his hands over it. Now before I go further, I mu st state that his hands were about the roughest, cracked, banged up, and gre ese imbedded you would ever see. You didn't want to shake hands with him be cause it reminded you of holding a big pine cone. Yet, he could feel any fl aws in that surface instantly. It used to infuriate me to no end and I woul d say a few choice words and go back to sanding only to repeat the process t wo or three times before finally getting a grunt followed by him picking up s ome sandpaper and working on a couple of areas before proclaiming it ready. > > > > Fast forward to now and finally after all of these years I totally underst and. The HANDS are an incredibily sensitive tool for determining when a sur face is fully sanded and for picking out the slightest flaw in a surface as l arge as a wing. Flaws that you can't see, a microscopic speck of dust, or a low spot can be instantly detected by just rubbing a clean dry hand over th e surface. > > > > I have just finished preparing the second wing for painting. I put on the first two coats of primer and have sanded them down preparing for two more c oats that will get another sanding before the color coats. What I found in t he process was what my step-father had been doing all those years back. He w ould clean the surface and wait for it to dry. He would then clean his hand s and dry them before sliding it across the surface. I have used the same t echnique before painting to clear any dust from the surface and to know when I had all of it cleared. During the sanding process, I will sand until I t hink it is about there, clean the surface to remove all sanding dust, then u se the dry hand rub to detect any flaws. A quick mark with a pencil over an y flaws is followed by another sanding session and repeat the same thing aga in. A couple of iterations and you will find the surface is ready for the n ext painting process. > > > > I also use the same process just before putting on the paint. I wash the h eck out of my hands to remove any oil and dry them. I then wet a rag with r ubbing alcahol and use it to clean my hand. Using my hand I rub it over the surface to pickup any dust and wipe it on the damp rag. I repeat this proc ess until I can no longer feel any dust anywhere on the surface. This will a lways take at least two passes. If I feel anything on a pass, I wipe my han d after making the pass and do it again. I know they recommend tack cloth b ut have found tack cloths can leave residue and you really don't know if it g et everything. I hate to admit but my step-father actually know what he was doing, at least when it came to sanding. > > > > NOW if he had just taught me how to spray paint! Anyway, the primer is go ing on great and the color coat is a futur challenge. > > > > Making slow progress, > > > > Bob Reed > > > > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:29:25 PM PST US From: Robert Reed Subject: Re: KIS-List: Sanding, sanding, some more sanding and so on. I used that process early on to find the low spots and it does work great f or =0Athat.=0A=0ABob=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: Scott Stearns =0ATo: "kis-list@matronics.com" =0ASent: Fri, August 10, 2012 6:23:08 PM=0ASubject: Re: KI S-List: Sanding, sanding, some more sanding and so on.=0A=0A=0AMisting on a guide coat of cheap spray paint before you start sanding is pretty =0Aeffe ctive too. -The cheap stuff comes right off with acetone.=0A=0AScott=0A =0A=0A=0A=0AOn Aug 10, 2012, at 3:50 PM, Robert Reed w rote:=0A=0A=0AThe summer after I turned 11 years old my step father informe d me that I was old =0Aenough to start working at the Garage and Body Shop that he and his brothers =0Aowned.- My joyful unpaid job from then on eve ry weekend and through the summers =0Auntil I turned 14, got my drivers lic ence and a paying job was to do the wet =0Asanding of the cars in the shop for body repair and painting.- (Yes, 14 was when =0Awe could get drivers licences back in those old days.)- Sanding back then used =0Awet sandpape r, a bucket and a sanding block similar to what we have today.- We =0Adid have something called a JitterBug air powered sander for the very rough =0Asanding but most sanding used just your hand, water, and paper.- The s anding =0Ablock wasn't really that useful on anything other than flat surfa ces.=0A>-=0A>What used to really irritate me was after a long session of sanding a fender, =0A>door, or hood I would proudly proclaim that it was do ne.- My stepfather would =0A>come out to the sanding and washing bay and walk over to the car, rub his hands =0A>over the surface and quickly tell m e that I had a lot yet to do and get back to =0A>it.- He would then point out every area that I had missed or not done =0A>correctly.- I couldn't for the life of me understand how he knew it wasn't done =0A>just by rubbin g his hands over it.- Now before I go further, I must state that =0A>his hands were about the roughest, cracked, banged up, and greese imbedded you =0A>would ever see.- You didn't want to shake hands with him because it r eminded you =0A>of holding a big pine cone.- Yet, he could feel any flaws in that surface =0A>instantly.- It used to infuriate me to no end and I would say a few choice words =0A>and go back to sanding only to repeat the process two or three times before =0A>finally getting a grunt followed by h im picking up some sandpaper and working on =0A>a couple of areas before pr oclaiming it ready.=0A>-=0A>Fast forward to now and finally after all of these years I totally understand.- =0A>The HANDS are an incredibily sensi tive tool for determining when a surface is =0A>fully sanded and for pickin g out the slightest flaw in a surface as large as a =0A>wing.- Flaws that you can't see, a microscopic speck of dust, or a low spot can =0A>be insta ntly detected by just rubbing a clean dry hand over the surface.- =0A>=0A >-=0A>I have just finished preparing the second wing for painting.- I p ut on the first =0A>two coats of primer and have sanded them down preparing for two more coats that =0A>will get another sanding before the color coat s.- What I found in the process =0A>was what my step-father had been doin g all those years back.- He would clean the =0A>surface and wait for it t o dry.- He would then clean his hands and dry them =0A>before sliding it across the surface.- I have used the same technique before =0A>painting t o clear any dust from the surface and to know when I had all of it =0A>clea red.- During the sanding process, I will sand until I think it is about =0A>there, clean the surface to remove all sanding dust, then use the dry h and rub =0A>to detect any flaws.- A quick mark with a pencil over any fla ws is followed by =0A>another sanding session and repeat the same thing aga in.- A couple of iterations =0A>and you will find the surface is ready fo r the next painting process.- =0A>=0A>-=0A>I also use the same process just before putting on the paint.- I wash the heck =0A>out of my hands to remove any oil and dry them.- I then wet a rag with rubbing =0A>alcahol and use it to clean my hand.- Using my hand I rub it over the surface to =0A>pickup any dust and wipe it on the damp rag.- I repeat this process u ntil I can =0A>no longer feel any dust anywhere on the surface.- This wil l always take at least =0A>two passes.- If I feel anything on a pass, I w ipe my hand after making the pass =0A>and do it again.- I know they recom mend tack cloth but have found tack cloths =0A>can leave residue and you re ally don't know if it get everything.- I hate to =0A>admit but my step-fa ther actually know what he was doing, at least when it came =0A>to sanding. =0A>-=0A>NOW if he had just taught me how to spray paint!- Anyway, the primer is going on =0A>great and the color coat is a futur challenge.=0A> -=0A>Making slow progress,=0A>-=0A>Bob Reed=0A>-=0A> =0A>href="htt p://www.matronics.com/Navigator?KIS-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigato r?KIS-List=0A> 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