---------------------------------------------------------- KIS-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 04/04/17: 7 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:28 AM - Re: Wheel pants? (Owen Baker) 2. 11:40 AM - KIS TR-1 Nose Wheel Pant (Owen Baker) 3. 12:25 PM - KIS TR-1 Main Landing Gear Wheel Pant (Owen Baker) 4. 02:46 PM - Re: Washer at the top (Galin Hernandez) 5. 04:54 PM - Re: KIS TR-1 Main Landing Gear Wheel Pant (pastormac@comcast.net) 6. 08:19 PM - Re: Washer at the top (Owen Baker) 7. 08:37 PM - More KIS TR-1 Wheel Pant Photos (Owen Baker) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:28:38 AM PST US From: "Owen Baker " Subject: Re: KIS-List: Wheel pants? 4/4/2017 Hello Rob, I am sorry. I have not yet conducted any such tests. OC ============================ From: Rob Sent: Monday, April 03, 2017 12:22 PM Subject: Re: KIS-List: Wheel pants? OC, I was wondering, with the wheel pants etc, did you see any improvement in speed at cruise and max throttle? If so what was the difference from speed without wheel pants etc. Rob On 04/02/2017 08:13 PM, Owen Baker wrote: > > 4/2/2017 > > Hello Steve, You wrote: "I'm going to pursue getting them on!" > > OK, here is what I did for the nose gear leg fairing: > > 1) I contacted Glasair, (360-435-8533) got assigned a customer number, and > ordered the two fiberglass pieces that are part of the Glastar / Sportsman > kit nose gear leg fairing. See here: > > http://glasairaviation.com/ > > and here: > > http://glasairaviation.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/GlaStarSportsman_Tech_Info_Kit_Contents_GA_-_Revised_Small.pdf > > 2) I acquired the pages from the Glastar builders manual and put together > the fairing. If you purchase those two pieces in 1 above I will mail you a > copy of those pages. > > 3) After a couple years of head scratching I put together my Glastar strut > fairing and my RV nose wheel pant. Pictures to follow. > > Please let me know if you have any questions. > > OC > > =========================================== > > From: pastormac@comcast.net > Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2017 3:26 PM > To: kis-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: KIS-List: Wheel pants? > > > Thank you! I'm going to pursue getting them on! > > To our success, Stephen McIntosh > > =================================================== > >> On Apr 2, 2017, at 2:12 PM, Owen Baker wrote: >> >> 4/2/2017 >> >> Hello Steve, You are continuing to get input regarding your comment about >> desiring to put wheel pants on your airplane. Please let me add my 01.5 >> cents (remainder of 02.0 cents to follow -- maybe). Let me also add again >> that this is not a trivial, bolt them on and go, project. >> >> 1) Here is the Van's Aircraft web site where you can purchase the below >> listed items (you don't have to be building or own an RV aircraft in >> order to purchase these items): >> >> https://www.vansaircraft.com/cgi-bin/store.cgi?ident=1491153716-334-519&browse=airframe&product=wheel-pants >> >> 2) This pair of items will fair the KIS TR-1 main landing gear strut >> legs. Do not attempt to use the hinge pin method of closing the trailing >> edge -- it won't work. I use the same white tape that the glider people >> use when they take their sailplane out of the trailer and assemble it to >> fly: >> >> Fiberglass fairings for the RV-8 flat bar main gear legs (per pair). >> Part Number = GEAR LEG FAIRING FLAT >> Price = $175.00 >> >> 3) Here is almost everything you need for your main landing gear wheel >> pants. Creating the lower end of the landing gear strut fairing into the >> wheel pants is your job: >> >> Wheel pants for RV-8 flat bar gear >> Part Number = WHL FAIRING KIT,PRFLT >> Price = $375.00 >> >> 4) Here is what you need for the nose wheel pant: >> >> Wheel pant for 6A/7A/8A/9A Nose Gear >> Part Number = WHL FAIRING KIT,NOSE >> Price = $140.00 >> >> If you have not been thoroughly intimidated by now and want to continue >> on to create a fairing for the nose landing gear strut and an interface >> between that fairing and the nose wheel pant (see the attached >> 100_0311.jpg picture) just let me know and I'll lay it on you. I still >> intend to take some pictures of the pants off the airplane the next time >> I get out to the hangar and send them to you. >> >> OC >> > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 11:40:04 AM PST US From: "Owen Baker " Subject: KIS-List: KIS TR-1 Nose Wheel Pant 4/4/2017 Hello Steve, Here are some of the pictures that I have been promising you: 0132: This is a photo of both the nose gear leg fairing (on the left) and the wheel pant (on the right). The leg fairing was made from a Glastar / Sportsman nose gear leg fairing. It was assembled from two pieces (a left and a right). The top was cut off and the bottom modified to fit the opening in the nose wheel pant. The nose wheel pant came from Van's. 0133: Just another view of the same two items in 0132 described above. 0134: This view shows how the trailing edge of the leg fairing is held together with hinge material and a hinge pin. Any questions? OC PS: I will send you a separate email with pics of the main landing gear wheel pants. =========================================== From: pastormac@comcast.net Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2017 3:26 PM Subject: Re: KIS-List: Wheel pants? Thank you! I'm going to pursue getting them on! To our success, Stephen McIntosh ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:25:29 PM PST US From: "Owen Baker " Subject: KIS-List: KIS TR-1 Main Landing Gear Wheel Pant 4/4/2017 Hello Again Steve, Here are the remainder of the KIS TR-1 landing gear pant photos that I have promised you: 0136: This is a pic of the right main landing gear pant which was supplied (along with attaching hardware) by Van's. All projecting interface fairing with the landing gear strut fairing was created by me by molding fiberglass over clay. The main landing gear strut fairing (not pictured) also came from Van's. 0138: This pic shows the two halves of the pant (forward and aft). Yeah, I know that the hole for access to the tire air filler valve is a little ragged.## It is hard to hit that location precisely. I could grind it into a perfect circle and come up with a manufactured cover for the hole, but I have been using the same 2 inch wide white 3M glider assembly tape to cover that hole that I use to close the trailing edges of the Van's provided main landing gear strut fairings and it works great.** Any questions? OC ##PS: If you install wheel pants you will have to come up with some sort of removable valve extension in order to test, and if needed, refill your tires with air. Pulling the wheel pants off every time that you want to check / refill tire air status is not a good plan. **PS: See here: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AQ29P62/ref=biss_dp_t_buying_options or less expensive here: http://www.cumulus-soaring.com/bowlus.htm ================================= From: pastormac@comcast.net Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2017 3:26 PM Subject: Re: KIS-List: Wheel pants? Thank you! I'm going to pursue getting them on! To our success, Stephen McIntosh ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 02:46:05 PM PST US From: Galin Hernandez Subject: Re: KIS-List: Washer at the top Doesn't that affect the friction adjustment so it won't maintain the 27lbs break-out? Virus-free. www.avg.com <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 11:17 PM, Owen Baker wrote: > > 4/3/2017 > > Hello Steve, I think that it is very desirable to have a thin flat nylon > washer next to the aluminum shoe both on the top and the bottom. > > OC > > =============================== > > From: pastormac@comcast.net > Sent: Monday, April 03, 2017 4:15 PM > To: kis-list@matronics.com > Subject: KIS-List: Washer at the top > > Hi Guys, > I finally received my Belleville washers! Do I need a washer at the top. > I included two pics. I noticed my noise gear is wearing where the washers > go on. > Thanks! > > > To our success, Stephen McIntosh > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:54:15 PM PST US Subject: Re: KIS-List: KIS TR-1 Main Landing Gear Wheel Pant From: pastormac@comcast.net Thank you!! Looks great!! To our success, Stephen McIntosh > On Apr 4, 2017, at 3:24 PM, Owen Baker wrote: > > 4/4/2017 > > Hello Again Steve, Here are the remainder of the KIS TR-1 landing gear pant photos that I have promised you: > > 0136: This is a pic of the right main landing gear pant which was supplied (along with attaching hardware) by Van's. All projecting interface fairing with the landing gear strut fairing was created by me by molding fiberglass over clay. The main landing gear strut fairing (not pictured) also came from Van's. > > 0138: This pic shows the two halves of the pant (forward and aft). Yeah, I know that the hole for access to the tire air filler valve is a little ragged.## It is hard to hit that location precisely. I could grind it into a perfect circle and come up with a manufactured cover for the hole, but I have been using the same 2 inch wide white 3M glider assembly tape to cover that hole that I use to close the trailing edges of the Van's provided main landing gear strut fairings and it works great.** > > Any questions? > > OC > > ##PS: If you install wheel pants you will have to come up with some sort of removable valve extension in order to test, and if needed, refill your tires with air. Pulling the wheel pants off every time that you want to check / refill tire air status is not a good plan. > > **PS: See here: > > https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AQ29P62/ref=biss_dp_t_buying_options > > or less expensive here: > > http://www.cumulus-soaring.com/bowlus.htm > > ================================= > > From: pastormac@comcast.net > Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2017 3:26 PM > To: kis-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: KIS-List: Wheel pants? > > > Thank you! I'm going to pursue getting them on! > > To our success, Stephen McIntosh > <000_0136.JPG> > <000_0138.JPG> ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:19:01 PM PST US From: "Owen Baker " Subject: Re: KIS-List: Washer at the top 4/4/2017 Hello Galin and Steve, Galin questioned the use of a nylon washer adjacent to the top and bottom of the aluminum nose wheel shoe in the stack up for a KIS TR-1 nose landing gear. Please see the attached picture 2016-4-18A 009. It shows the stack up consisting of just nylon washers and a flat steel washer (next to the nut) that I used for over 500 flight hours on my Lyle #1 nose landing gear strut with no shimmy problems. Whether you are using nylon washers or Belleville washers the friction created is still dependent upon how tightly the nut is torqued. One may have to torque the nut to a higher value in order to obtain the 27 pound pull at the axle for the nylon washers instead of the Belleville washers, but the resulting anti shimmy friction is initially still the same. I believe that there are some advantages to using nylon washers instead of Belleville washers: 1) The nylon washers will not wear as rapidly as the steel-on-steel or steel-on-aluminum Belleville washers therefore one does not have to recheck / adjust the friction setting as often. 2) Nylon washers adjacent to the aluminum shoe will not wear the shoe as rapidly as steel Belleville washers adjacent to the aluminum. Any questions? OC PS: The full thickness AN310-12 castle nut appears in the attached picture only because I was trying to show its depth compared to the thinner AN320-12 nut intended for shear use only. I was unable to use the AN310-12 nut on my Lyle #1 gear because of the shortness of the 3/4 inch diameter vertical stub. I had Lyle make the 3/4 inch diameter vertical stub portion of my #2 and #3 gear weldment longer so that I could use the full depth AN310-12 nut. I would have preferred even more length for that stub, but Lyle declined. ============= From: Galin Hernandez Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 5:39 PM Subject: Re: KIS-List: Washer at the top Doesn't that affect the friction adjustment so it won't maintain the 27lbs break-out? Virus-free. www.avg.com ======= On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 11:17 PM, Owen Baker wrote: 4/3/2017 Hello Steve, I think that it is very desirable to have a thin flat nylon washer next to the aluminum shoe both on the top and the bottom. OC ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:37:27 PM PST US From: "Owen Baker " Subject: KIS-List: More KIS TR-1 Wheel Pant Photos 4/4/2017 Hello Steve, While looking for that stack up picture that I sent to you and Galin I came across some more wheel pant pictures: 100_0301 This picture shows the interface between the nose wheel pant and the nose landing gear strut fairing when the nose wheel is turned significantly to the left. 100_0302 This picture shows the interface between the nose wheel pant and the nose landing gear strut fairing as it would be in cruise flight with the nose wheel aligned straight. 100_0307 This picture shows the interface between the installed right main gear wheel pant and the right main gear strut fairing. Any questions? 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