---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 11/28/03: 19 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:11 AM - Re: Flying with the doors open.. (Matt Keyes) 2. 01:07 AM - Re: Flying with the doors open.. (Dave & Wendy Grosvenor) 3. 03:15 AM - Re: flapron foam (KITFOXZ@aol.com) 4. 03:41 AM - Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 11/24/03 (confirm please) () 5. 05:25 AM - Re: Flying with the doors open.. (Bob Unternaehrer) 6. 08:29 AM - Re: Boomerangs and aerodyamics (fluff) (tom) 7. 10:20 AM - Inverted Pitts gear (jimshumaker) 8. 11:48 AM - (confirm please) (Bruce Harrington) 9. 12:35 PM - 1993 era model 1200 912 header tank capacity (doug kulick) 10. 02:01 PM - Re: Flying with the doors open.. (Steve M) 11. 05:28 PM - static port (DC91840@aol.com) 12. 05:59 PM - Re: static port (Wwillyard@aol.com) 13. 06:08 PM - Re: static port (Lowell Fitt) 14. 06:10 PM - Re: static port (Wwillyard@aol.com) 15. 07:59 PM - Re: static port (Clint Bazzill) 16. 08:34 PM - 25% COST SAVINGS - MIL-T-4345B Electronic Lacing Cord (Garey Wittich) 17. 09:48 PM - Re: static port (about do not archive) (Paul A. Franz, P.E.) 18. 10:30 PM - Re: static port (about do not archive) (Don Pearsall) 19. 10:42 PM - Re: static port (RiteAngle3@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:11:45 AM PST US From: Matt Keyes Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flying with the doors open.. --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Matt Keyes If my instructor did that, it would certainly affect my attitude! What type of gear do inverted landings require? Does that come in the advanced lessons, or is it self taught? DO NOT ARCHIVE Matt --------------------------------- Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 01:07:49 AM PST US From: "Dave & Wendy Grosvenor" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flying with the doors open.. --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave & Wendy Grosvenor" It is possible. There was a guy with a Pitts Special once who fitted another set of gear to the top of the plane. With the plane standing inverted on the apron, he would strap himself to a harness and winch himself into it. Close the canopy, taxi out, takeoff, all whilst inverted. After his display he would land again inverted. I suspect you need some strong concentration though. Imagine the typical airshow takeoff, fly a few feet above the runway until the speed has really built up then PULL!!! Dave do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matt Keyes" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flying with the doors open.. --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Matt Keyes If my instructor did that, it would certainly affect my attitude! What type of gear do inverted landings require? Does that come in the advanced lessons, or is it self taught? DO NOT ARCHIVE Matt --------------------------------- Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:15:43 AM PST US From: KITFOXZ@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: flapron foam --> Kitfox-List message posted by: KITFOXZ@aol.com In a message dated 11/26/2003 10:13:16 AM Eastern Standard Time, RonCarr@qwest.net writes: Great question, Charlie, I'm curious about this too. I'm surprised SS hasn't addressed this long ago. Ron Carroll KF3 in Oregon do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: broschart To: fox2 Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 2:58 AM Subject: Kitfox-List: flapron foam --> Kitfox-List message posted by: broschart while on the subject of foam replacement i'm wondering if the spray foam would work to spray into the flapron hinge opening to seal it and keep the rain out, there is always water in the flapron after a storm even though i have holes drilled at each hinge Have a good day - Charlie Hello Guys, I have found on some of my automotive repairs that the hardware store variety of spray can foam actually harbors water like a sponge! John P. Marzluf Columbus, Ohio Outback, (out back in the garage) ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:41:42 AM PST US From: Subject: Kitfox-List: RE: Kitfox-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 11/24/03 (confirm please) --> Kitfox-List message posted by: jeburke@direcway.com here, I am controlling the email that is sent to my inbox. By asking for you to confirm that you really sent email to me I can ensure that I receive no spam and that your email address really exists. This is a one time confirmation, please click the link below and your email will be delivered straight away, now and in the future. Click to confirm: http://vetomail.com/ok/e5c7a7e0-46b8-4dad-87dd-855b526ec9ee You are receiving this message in response to your email to jeburke@direcway.com, a VetoMail customer. VetoMail asks that senders verify their address before email is delivered. When you have clicked the link above a webpage will be displayed, if the page displays correctly your address has been verified. You will only need to do this once per VetoMail protected email address. Thankyou. ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:25:17 AM PST US From: "Bob Unternaehrer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flying with the doors open.. --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Unternaehrer" NO!!! PUSH,,,, If your inverted... Bob U. Do Not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave & Wendy Grosvenor" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flying with the doors open.. > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave & Wendy Grosvenor" > > It is possible. There was a guy with a Pitts Special once who fitted > another set of gear to the top of the plane. With the plane standing > inverted on the apron, he would strap himself to a harness and winch himself > into it. Close the canopy, taxi out, takeoff, all whilst inverted. After > his display he would land again inverted. I suspect you need some strong > concentration though. Imagine the typical airshow takeoff, fly a few feet > above the runway until the speed has really built up then PULL!!! > > Dave > > do not archive > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Matt Keyes" > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flying with the doors open.. > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Matt Keyes > > If my instructor did that, it would certainly affect my attitude! What type > of gear do inverted landings require? Does that come in the advanced > lessons, or is it self taught? > > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > Matt > > > --------------------------------- > Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now > > > --- > [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] > > --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:29:08 AM PST US From: tom Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Boomerangs and aerodyamics (fluff) --> Kitfox-List message posted by: tom I've been making boomerangs for a couple years and they are a blast. And more complicated than they would seem you are right. The three bladed ones are easier to start with and in my opinion are most fun. There are people that can juggle two or three boomerangs at a time in a very tight circle. They have a maximum timre aloft contest as well which was some astounding amount of time I cant remember at the moment. It's all out there on the web :) I made some blanks on my cnc router if anybody want's one for cost of the wood and shipping. You would have to shape it with sandpaper but that's the educational part. :) Not so hard. Very fun. Lowell Fitt wrote:--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" Do not archive For Christmas, my grandson wanted a Boomerang that really worked . I began searching the internet and found a boomerang that is supposed to work and with it I got a Floppy disk with some interesting info on boomerangs. I was surprised that the cross section of a boomerang arm is the classic airfoil shape we are familiar with in our wings and props. I was further surprised to read about how dihedral affects a boomerang's performance as well as angle of incidence of the arms and how adding spoilers or varying the CG can affect performance. Pretty heady stuff, especially when the whole thing started in the upside-down subcontinent by a group believed, at least by some, to be quite primitive. Lowell All this from --------------------------------- Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:20:56 AM PST US From: "jimshumaker" Subject: Kitfox-List: Inverted Pitts gear --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jimshumaker" It is interesting the methods used just to get forward visibility when landing in a Pitts. It would have been easier to put a nosegear on the plane... Jim Shumaker ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave & Wendy Grosvenor" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flying with the doors open.. > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave & Wendy Grosvenor" > > It is possible. There was a guy with a Pitts Special once who fitted > another set of gear to the top of the plane. With the plane standing > inverted on the apron, he would strap himself to a harness and winch himself > into it. Close the canopy, taxi out, takeoff, all whilst inverted. After > his display he would land again inverted. I suspect you need some strong > concentration though. Imagine the typical airshow takeoff, fly a few feet > above the runway until the speed has really built up then PULL!!! > > Dave > > do not archive > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Matt Keyes" > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flying with the doors open.. > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Matt Keyes > > If my instructor did that, it would certainly affect my attitude! What type > of gear do inverted landings require? Does that come in the advanced > lessons, or is it self taught? > > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > Matt > > > --------------------------------- > Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:48:02 AM PST US From: "Bruce Harrington" Subject: Kitfox-List: (confirm please) --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bruce Harrington" Do not archive jeburke, I assume the below is all automatic, otherwise you are going to get a lot of emails. There are several hundred Kitfox List participants. bh > jeburke@direcway.com here, > > I am controlling the email that is sent to my inbox. By asking for you > to confirm that you really sent email to me I can ensure that I receive > no spam and that your email address really exists. > > This is a one time confirmation, please click the link below and your > email will be delivered straight away, now and in the future. > > Click to confirm: > http://vetomail.com/ok/e5c7a7e0-46b8-4dad-87dd-855b526ec9ee > > > > You are receiving this message in response to your email to > jeburke@direcway.com, a VetoMail customer. > > VetoMail asks that senders verify their address before email is > delivered. When you have clicked the link above a webpage will be > displayed, if the page displays correctly your address has been > verified. You will only need to do this once per VetoMail protected > email address. > > Thankyou. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:35:43 PM PST US From: "doug kulick" Subject: Kitfox-List: 1993 era model 1200 912 header tank capacity --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "doug kulick" HI All: Does anyone know the fuel capacity of the 1993 model 1200 912 kitfox poly plastic header tank.. Thanks .. Doug Kulick ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 02:01:57 PM PST US From: "Steve M" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flying with the doors open.. --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve M" >It is possible. There was a guy with a Pitts Special once who fitted >another set of gear to the top of the plane. With the plane standing >inverted on the apron, he would strap himself to a harness and winch >himself >into it. Close the canopy, taxi out, takeoff, all whilst inverted. After >his display he would land again inverted. I suspect you need some strong >concentration though. Imagine the typical airshow takeoff, fly a few feet >above the runway until the speed has really built up then PULL!!! A long long time ago in a galaxy far far away, I was an enthusiastic model airplane flier. There was a large field where many of us flew our radio-controlled model planes. I never got much beyond a high-wing three-channel trainer, but there were some people there with a lot of experience, and one who was truly gifted. Troy Payne had flown P-47s in WWII, and designed and built his own radios. He was retired, gray-haired, and had the latest stunt plane with which he regularly buzzed the field. You could always tell who was flying when his plane was in the air. While other fliers would rack their planes into turns and brutally yank the stick back, Payne would bank smoothly and start around the turn as though hsi mother were in the plane - it was so smooth you would swear there was a real pilot on board trying not to jostle the passsengers, or some such. But then, he could also horse on the controls when needed, as his snap rolls and spins frequently showed. But once he did a series of low inverted passes over the runway. Smooth as ever, he would come down within feet of the ground, zoom past the assembled fliers with his canopy almost brushing the weeds, and lift gracefully into the sky again. Except for the last one, where he rolled inverted and zoomed low past the crowd at around 50-60 MPH (scale speed approaching 300 MPH), and then attempted a zoom climb by yanking the stick back HARD... Damn. That was a nice plane. Steve Maher Kitfox Model 2, Geo Metro engine San Diego, CA Say goodbye to busy signals and slow downloads with a high-speed Internet connection! Prices start at less than $1 a day average. https://broadband.msn.com (Prices may vary by service area.) ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 05:28:40 PM PST US From: DC91840@aol.com Subject: Kitfox-List: static port --> Kitfox-List message posted by: DC91840@aol.com Hi all you Fox Drivers: I want to put a static port on my Classic IV. Where should I put it and what diameter should the hole be? All help will be appreciated. Been flying and my VSI doesn't seem to register correctly. Am now ported under the panel inside the cockpit. Thank you Don Cravener dc91840@aol.com ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 05:59:54 PM PST US From: Wwillyard@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: static port --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Wwillyard@aol.com I bought mine from SkyStar as a kit. The instructions indicate the location on the fuselage. Bill Willyard Classic IV DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 06:08:54 PM PST US From: "Lowell Fitt" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: static port --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" Don, I installed mine according to SS's recommendations and to make it a little easier to measure, this is what I have. Drop a line from the leading edge of the horizontal stabilizer to the lower longeron left side - or both sides - From the point where the line intercepts the longeron measure forward 31 inches along the longeron and then perpendicular to the longeron measure up 4-3/4 inches. The hole is a number 53. Lowell ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: Kitfox-List: static port > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: DC91840@aol.com > > Hi all you Fox Drivers: > I want to put a static port on my Classic IV. > Where should I put it and what diameter > should the hole be? All help will be appreciated. > Been flying and my VSI doesn't seem to register > correctly. Am now ported under the panel inside > the cockpit. Thank you > Don Cravener > dc91840@aol.com > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 06:10:27 PM PST US From: Wwillyard@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: static port --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Wwillyard@aol.com In a message dated 11/28/2003 8:39:25 PM Eastern Standard Time, DC91840@aol.com writes: Hi all you Fox Drivers: I want to put a static port on my Classic IV. Where should I put it and what diameter should the hole be? All help will be appreciated. Been flying and my VSI doesn't seem to register correctly. Am now ported under the panel inside the cockpit. Thank you Don Cravener dc91840@aol.com Lets try this again. I bought mine from SkyStar as a kit. The instructions indicate the location on the fuselage Bill Willyard Classic IV DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 07:59:48 PM PST US From: "Clint Bazzill" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: static port --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clint Bazzill" I put 2 ports on my model IV. I like to slip and I want the airspeed to read the same with a left and right slip, it will indicate the same with 2 but not with 1. Clint From the hottest toys to tips on keeping fit this winter, youll find a range of helpful holiday info here. ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 08:34:00 PM PST US From: Garey Wittich Subject: Kitfox-List: 25% COST SAVINGS - MIL-T-4345B Electronic Lacing Cord glasair-list@matronics.com, kolb-list@matronics.com, zenith-list@matronics.com, europa-list@matronics.com, ez-list@matronics.com --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Garey Wittich I have some "Brand New" (in original packaging) MIL-T-43435B Lacing Cord, Type 2 (polyester / Hi Temp), Finish C (synthetic Rubber or Elastomer), Size 3 (50 Lb min strength, 0.085" wide X 0.014" thick). This Cord is used extensively by Avionic Shops to tie individual electrical wires into bundles for their avionic equipment. * Least expensive way to make Wire Bundles. * Will not cut into wires like Dental Floss used by some Builders, as it is "flat". * Higher Temp Rating (-73 Deg C to 177 Deg C) than Type 1 (-55 Deg C to 121 Deg C) that is sold by Aircraft Spruce and Chief Aircraft for $21 per Spool + Shipping Cost * Each Spool contains 500 yards of BLUE Cord. (Share with other Builders) * Excellent "KNOT" retention. * See: www.versatileindustrial.com/gudebrod.html for additional information. * Selling for $16 per Spool (Blue color) - includes shipping in the US. SUPPLIES LIMITED If interested, E-mail me off-line at- gareywittich2000@yahoo.com __________________________________ Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 09:48:41 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: static port (about do not archive) From: "Paul A. Franz, P.E." --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul A. Franz, P.E." On Fri, 2003-11-28 at 18:10, Wwillyard@aol.com wrote: > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Wwillyard@aol.com > Bill Willyard > Classic IV > > DO NOT ARCHIVE Seems like a pretty worthy post to me. So why not archive it? In days of yore, there was guidance on this list about putting "fluff" in the subject when the e-mail had nothing to do with KF building, or operating. The purpose for this might be to assist people when they are looking through messages to avoid "fluff" if they are looking for something in particular. Maybe, just maybe, this new list's feature of declining an archive has a similar purpose. Well, I thought your post was fine and not fluff at all and in fact was well worth keeping. Maybe Darrel or Don have some guidance here, as this seems to be something regularly done - Iwonder if people are just being very careful or what? I like having most everything archived. I think it is good. -- PAF Consulting Engineers | 427 - 140th Ave NE (425)641-8202 voice | Bellevue, WA 98005 (425)641-1773 fax | GnuPG Public Key - ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 10:30:00 PM PST US From: "Don Pearsall" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: static port (about do not archive) --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" I agree with you, Paul. I have seen some "Do not archive"'s in posts that SHOULD be archived. It is up to the sender if they want their posts archived or not, but I think everything should be, unless it is completely off topic and/or personal and should not have been sent to the list in the first place. Anything that is of interest to the whole group regardless of the importance should be archived. Don Pearsall ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 10:42:48 PM PST US From: RiteAngle3@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: static port --> Kitfox-List message posted by: RiteAngle3@aol.com Don, I believe I have the drawings from SkyStar if you want will be glad to try and find them in my hard drive somewhere! Elbie Outstanding Customer Service is our Motto If you like it let others know If not let me know! Elbie Mendenhall President EM Aviation www.RiteAngle.com