Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:39 AM - Re: Re: NSI/CAP prop rpm (dmorisse)
2. 04:28 AM - Re: Re: Michel, Jabi 2200 (Mike Chaney)
3. 06:30 AM - Heating problem (Gary Algate)
4. 06:40 AM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation (Lowell Fitt)
5. 07:04 AM - Re: Heating problem (Randy Daughenbaugh)
6. 07:25 AM - Re: Older 582 mount for model 3 (Dcecil3@aol.com)
7. 07:27 AM - Re: Older Mount for Model 3 (Dcecil3@aol.com)
8. 07:36 AM - Re: Heating problem (michel)
9. 07:38 AM - Re: Heating problem (jareds)
10. 07:56 AM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation (Grant Fluent)
11. 08:15 AM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation (Gary Algate)
12. 08:20 AM - Re: Heating problem (Gary Algate)
13. 08:23 AM - Re: Heating problem responses (Gary Algate)
14. 09:01 AM - R2800 (Jack Rabon)
15. 09:05 AM - Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 33 Msgs - 02/06/04 (Kirby Cramer)
16. 09:12 AM - Re: Whats going on at Skystar-Update (Dcecil3@aol.com)
17. 09:18 AM - Re: 912-S Oil Cooler Failures (John E. King)
18. 09:36 AM - Re: Heating problem (Ted Palamarek)
19. 09:50 AM - Re: Low Fuel Warning (Torgeir Mortensen)
20. 10:14 AM - Re: Heating problem (Torgeir Mortensen)
21. 10:20 AM - Re: Heating problem (Gary Algate)
22. 10:27 AM - Re: Heating problem (Torgeir Mortensen)
23. 10:50 AM - Re: Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 33 Msgs - 02/06/04 (dmorisse)
24. 11:16 AM - Re: Heating problem (jareds)
25. 11:19 AM - Re: Re: NSI/CAP prop rpm (Torgeir Mortensen)
26. 01:42 PM - Apolgies to the list + Mig Welding correction (jeff.hays@aselia.com)
27. 02:01 PM - Re: Apolgies to the list + Mig Welding correction (flier)
28. 05:42 PM - Re: 912-S Oil Cooler Failures (John Banes)
29. 05:51 PM - Re: Cruise Speeds (Paul Seehafer)
30. 06:13 PM - Re: Apolgies to the list + Mig Welding correction (Fred Shiple)
31. 06:35 PM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation (Lowell Fitt)
32. 06:35 PM - Re: Heating problem (Lowell Fitt)
33. 06:57 PM - 2 stroke oil (Tc9008@aol.com)
34. 07:06 PM - Re: Apolgies to the list + Mig Welding correction (Arthur Nation)
35. 07:25 PM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation (Bob Unternaehrer)
36. 08:03 PM - Knight Upholstery for Kitfox (Sam Knight)
37. 08:34 PM - Re: 2 stroke oil (Bob Robertson)
38. 08:48 PM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation (Grant Fluent)
39. 08:48 PM - Re: 2si Engine 460-F35 & the Lite (Bob Robertson)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: RE: NSI/CAP prop rpm |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dmorisse" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Does the turbo use the Ellison Kurt? I've never touched mine as it
was set from the factory and after 270 hours it still meters perfectly. The
only problem I've ever had with my engine was about 60 hours ago when the
EGTs would be erratic, it would miss under takeoff load, and left ignition
would have a large drop. After a bunch of trouble shooting and
unnecessarily replacing the ignition pickup assembly, it turned out to be
the spark plugs. Popped in a new set and problem solved. I had been sand
blasting them about every 50 hours and that apparently caused some damage to
the insulators. From now on I'll just replace them every 100 hours.
Cheap and easy.
Darrel
> I think the real problem might be with carboration.
> It has been all over the place since I got it. Lean
> and rich, stumbling - everything. EGT's changing from
> one flight to the next. Sometimes full rich is peak
> and sometimes it is rich. I pulled the carb screen
> and it looks clean.
>
> I made the idle circuit richer and that cleared it up
> a lot. Lance says that the problem is really the
> plugs from running the engine unloaded - carbon. So I
> am going to have to replace the plugs and see if that
> helps. I have had them out twice and they look fine.
>
> But since it runs well enough, I will have to attend
> to some other things first. It was just so nice when
> it ran smoothly... Five years from now I probably
> won't be so picky. I just want it right the first
> time.
> Kurt S.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Michel, Jabi 2200 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Mike Chaney <mdps_mc@SWOCA.NET>
I installed a Jabiru 2200 in my Model IV. Thake a look at the Jabiru USA
website for pictures.
Mike Chaney
Michel,
In the article, Dave says he has the "Skyfox" cowl.
Here are some web sites for you so that you can get
dimensions and other info. They do include the
firewall forward kits too.
>http://www.usjabiru.com/<
>http://www.usjabiru.com/jabiru_2200a.htm<
So as soon as your rich uncle dies and leaves you a
fortune, you'll be ready.
Kurt S.
--- Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no> wrote:
> Kurt, thank you for writing the essence of the
> article. Dave's performances are
> above my expectations, if any. I don't know enough
> about Kitfoxes and their
> engines to be able to compare them. As for my Vne,
> it is written 100 MPH in the
> User's Manual, which is, I guess, the same for all
> the model 3. Can I exceed
> that if I have a different engine? Is the Vne
> dictated by the structural
> strength of the aircraft or by the power of the
> engine? I think it is the
> former, isn't it? Can I expect more speed from my
> old Avid STOL undercambered
> long wings? I guess Dave has the KF 4-1200 with
> different wings.
>
> Thank you again, both. I know one day I'll have a
> new engine and I can thank
> this list for having made the right choice.
>
> Cheers,
> Michel
__________________________________
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
Message 3
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Here's one for the detectives on the list. Last week I reported a failed
thermostat on my 582 Blue Head engine.
I purchased a new thermostat but had an interesting occurrence. Background:
Temperature was -20 degC and it was a little too cold for the small
electric fan heater I use to get things warmed up under the cowl. I had
recently purchased a small coleman heater that runs off camp oil for just
this event so I placed the heater under the plane and ducted the hot air
through some aluminum vent ducting up under the cowl.
After about 10 minutes I could easily turn the prop by hand so I removed the
heater and started the engine.
As I was warming it up I noticed the water temp rocket past 190 deg after
only 3 or 4 minutes so I shut it down. I tried re-starting but the same
thing occurred and I also noticed that my radiator and heater core remained
cold. This pointed to the thermostat failing so I arranged to borrow a
friends and everything worked fine.
I purchased a new thermostat and tried it last Friday (-10 degrees and no
pre-heat necessary) and it worked fine.
On Sunday the temp was down around -17 degC so I once again used the coleman
heater to pre-heat the engine and once again after startup the water temp
rocketed up to almost 200 deg.
Out with the thermostat and about 1 hour boiling it in a jug to try and work
exactly how it works.
Finally in desperation I reconsidered events and determined the problem only
occurred when I used the higher temperature Coleman pr-heat.
By this time the engine had cooled completely so I refitted the thermostat
and carried out a cold start.
All temps perfect?????
The new Bluehead engine has a complicated thermostat that has a small gate
that opens one end but at the same time the centre spindle extends and
pushes a large disc up against a seat inside the head to divert flow (I'm
not sure where or why).
Can anyone give me some ideas as to why the preheat is effecting the
operation of the thermostat.......
Gary Algate
Lite2 582 Bluehead - Confused????????????????
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Grant,
First, my lower cowl - the flat part is flush with the bottom of the
fuselage/firewall. The large lip is what I use for air exit only. If that
1/2" is all you need, I would say move it up as far as you can. Looking at
mine, I would say the top of the panel cover is parallel with the top of the
cowl, but higher, as the top is at the level of the cowl lip. The screws
being just below the lip.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Grant Fluent" <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
Installation
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
>
> Thanks to everyone for their continuing responses to
> my problem with the dash cover.
> Lowell, you mentioned that oil tank would prevent
> the top cowling from being too low. That's one thing
> that I didn't do. I didn't install it when I fitted
> the cowlings - I followed the manual :( I will check
> that next to see if it fits or interferes.
> If I was to move the lower cowling up, I have only
> about 1/2" to go until it hits the bottom piece of the
> firewall - is it supposed to? I located it vertically
> by the dimensions in the manual.
> The dash cover will fit nicely with the windshield
> it I slide it down and forward until the bottom edge
> is flush with the bottom edge of the windshield. The
> screws would be where they're supposed to be except
> that the dash cover is no longer level with the
> fuselage. The front is about 1/2" lower. Has everyone
> else made theirs level or just positioned it where it
> fits well?
> Thanks,
> Grant Fluent
> Newcastle, NE
> Classic IV 912S
>
>
> --- kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> > <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> >
> > It does sound like your cowl is too low, but just an
> > idea here. Would it be easier to modify the dash
> > cover than the cowl? Which one would be best in the
> > long run to change? Do the cowl if it wrong, but if
> > there is no other problem, just modify the cover,
> > IMHO.
> >
> > Kurt S.
> >
> > --- Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Thanks Lowell, Kurt and Eric.
> > >
> > > From reading your responses, I think I've got
> > > something drastically wrong here. The bottom lip
> > on
> > > the dash cover is 1" above the bottom lip on the
> > > windscreen. Eric, you may be right, I may have the
> > > cowlings mounted too low. At most I could only
> > gain
> > > 1/2" though if I were to epoxy the holes shut and
> > > start over moving the lower cowling up. The
> > > windscreen seems very close to the x-brace tubing
> > in
> > > the front. By that I mean you can just get your
> > > fingers between the tubes and the windscreen. It
> > had
> > > to be positioned like that because the top cowling
> > > was
> > > such a tight fit against it. Any ideas or
> > > suggestions?
> > >
> > > Grant Fluent
> > > Newcastle, NE
> > > Classic IV 912S
>
>
Message 5
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh" <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
Gary,
Is it reasonable to speculate that there was a coolant line (maybe to or
from the radiator that was blocked with ice crystals? And it has nothing to
do with the thermostat?
The only times that I have boiled over an engine has been when I had a
coolant line frozen.
Randy - Wrestling with fire sleeve.
.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Algate
Subject: Kitfox-List: Heating problem
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Here's one for the detectives on the list. Last week I reported a failed
thermostat on my 582 Blue Head engine.
I purchased a new thermostat but had an interesting occurrence. Background:
Temperature was -20 degC and it was a little too cold for the small
electric fan heater I use to get things warmed up under the cowl. I had
recently purchased a small coleman heater that runs off camp oil for just
this event so I placed the heater under the plane and ducted the hot air
through some aluminum vent ducting up under the cowl.
After about 10 minutes I could easily turn the prop by hand so I removed the
heater and started the engine.
As I was warming it up I noticed the water temp rocket past 190 deg after
only 3 or 4 minutes so I shut it down. I tried re-starting but the same
thing occurred and I also noticed that my radiator and heater core remained
cold. This pointed to the thermostat failing so I arranged to borrow a
friends and everything worked fine.
I purchased a new thermostat and tried it last Friday (-10 degrees and no
pre-heat necessary) and it worked fine.
On Sunday the temp was down around -17 degC so I once again used the coleman
heater to pre-heat the engine and once again after startup the water temp
rocketed up to almost 200 deg.
Out with the thermostat and about 1 hour boiling it in a jug to try and work
exactly how it works.
Finally in desperation I reconsidered events and determined the problem only
occurred when I used the higher temperature Coleman pr-heat.
By this time the engine had cooled completely so I refitted the thermostat
and carried out a cold start.
All temps perfect?????
The new Bluehead engine has a complicated thermostat that has a small gate
that opens one end but at the same time the centre spindle extends and
pushes a large disc up against a seat inside the head to divert flow (I'm
not sure where or why).
Can anyone give me some ideas as to why the preheat is effecting the
operation of the thermostat.......
Gary Algate
Lite2 582 Bluehead - Confused????????????????
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Older 582 mount for model 3 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Dcecil3@aol.com
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Older Mount for Model 3 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Dcecil3@aol.com
I have a 582 mount Listed on Ebay if anyones interested.
Thanks David Cecil
Message 8
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: michel <michel@online.no>
>===== Original Message From "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
>Can anyone give me some ideas as to why the preheat is effecting the
>operation of the thermostat.......
Gary, what I am about to write is certainly rubbish but ...
Many years ago, I poured some concentrated anti-frost fluid in the snow, then
put my finger in it. To my surprise, my fingertip turned white and was left
with a burn mark. To turn a solid into liquid steals a lot of energy. The
seemingly liquid result was way much colder than the ambiant temperature,
hence the slight burn on my fingertip.
Could it be that heating your engine, thus warming the coolant fluid, cools it
to a freezing solid point say, in the radiator? It sounds like science-fiction
but your overheating problem seems so weird that ... maybe something as weird
is happening ... I don't know.
Good luck,
Michel
do not archive
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Heating problem |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: jareds <jareds@verizon.net>
Randy,
I had the same thing happen and traced it to an air bubble in cooling
system!
Jared
Randy Daughenbaugh wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh" <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
>
>Gary,
>Is it reasonable to speculate that there was a coolant line (maybe to or
>from the radiator that was blocked with ice crystals? And it has nothing to
>do with the thermostat?
>
>The only times that I have boiled over an engine has been when I had a
>coolant line frozen.
>
>Randy - Wrestling with fire sleeve.
>
>.
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Algate
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Kitfox-List: Heating problem
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
>
>Here's one for the detectives on the list. Last week I reported a failed
>thermostat on my 582 Blue Head engine.
>
>I purchased a new thermostat but had an interesting occurrence. Background:
>
>Temperature was -20 degC and it was a little too cold for the small
>electric fan heater I use to get things warmed up under the cowl. I had
>recently purchased a small coleman heater that runs off camp oil for just
>this event so I placed the heater under the plane and ducted the hot air
>through some aluminum vent ducting up under the cowl.
>
>After about 10 minutes I could easily turn the prop by hand so I removed the
>heater and started the engine.
>
>As I was warming it up I noticed the water temp rocket past 190 deg after
>only 3 or 4 minutes so I shut it down. I tried re-starting but the same
>thing occurred and I also noticed that my radiator and heater core remained
>cold. This pointed to the thermostat failing so I arranged to borrow a
>friends and everything worked fine.
>
>I purchased a new thermostat and tried it last Friday (-10 degrees and no
>pre-heat necessary) and it worked fine.
>
>On Sunday the temp was down around -17 degC so I once again used the coleman
>heater to pre-heat the engine and once again after startup the water temp
>rocketed up to almost 200 deg.
>
>Out with the thermostat and about 1 hour boiling it in a jug to try and work
>exactly how it works.
>
>Finally in desperation I reconsidered events and determined the problem only
>occurred when I used the higher temperature Coleman pr-heat.
>
>By this time the engine had cooled completely so I refitted the thermostat
>and carried out a cold start.
>
>All temps perfect?????
>
>The new Bluehead engine has a complicated thermostat that has a small gate
>that opens one end but at the same time the centre spindle extends and
>pushes a large disc up against a seat inside the head to divert flow (I'm
>not sure where or why).
>
>Can anyone give me some ideas as to why the preheat is effecting the
>operation of the thermostat.......
>
>Gary Algate
>Lite2 582 Bluehead - Confused????????????????
>
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Lowell,
If I move the lower cowling up 1/2" and drill 10 new
holes, how do you recommend plugging the old ones?
I've worked with epoxy and body filler but have never
messed with fiberglass.
Thanks,
Grant Fluent
Newcastle, NE
Classic IV 912S
--- Lowell Fitt <lcfitt@inreach.com> wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
> <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
> Grant,
> First, my lower cowl - the flat part is flush with
> the bottom of the
> fuselage/firewall. The large lip is what I use for
> air exit only. If that
> 1/2" is all you need, I would say move it up as far
> as you can. Looking at
> mine, I would say the top of the panel cover is
> parallel with the top of the
> cowl, but higher, as the top is at the level of the
> cowl lip. The screws
> being just below the lip.
>
> Lowell
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Grant Fluent" <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument
> Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
> Installation
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent
> <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
> >
> > Thanks to everyone for their continuing responses
> to
> > my problem with the dash cover.
> > Lowell, you mentioned that oil tank would
> prevent
> > the top cowling from being too low. That's one
> thing
> > that I didn't do. I didn't install it when I
> fitted
> > the cowlings - I followed the manual :( I will
> check
> > that next to see if it fits or interferes.
> > If I was to move the lower cowling up, I have
> only
> > about 1/2" to go until it hits the bottom piece of
> the
> > firewall - is it supposed to? I located it
> vertically
> > by the dimensions in the manual.
> > The dash cover will fit nicely with the
> windshield
> > it I slide it down and forward until the bottom
> edge
> > is flush with the bottom edge of the windshield.
> The
> > screws would be where they're supposed to be
> except
> > that the dash cover is no longer level with the
> > fuselage. The front is about 1/2" lower. Has
> everyone
> > else made theirs level or just positioned it where
> it
> > fits well?
> > Thanks,
> > Grant Fluent
> > Newcastle, NE
> > Classic IV 912S
> >
> >
> > --- kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
> > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> > > <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> > >
> > > It does sound like your cowl is too low, but
> just an
> > > idea here. Would it be easier to modify the
> dash
> > > cover than the cowl? Which one would be best in
> the
> > > long run to change? Do the cowl if it wrong,
> but if
> > > there is no other problem, just modify the
> cover,
> > > IMHO.
> > >
> > > Kurt S.
> > >
> > > --- Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Thanks Lowell, Kurt and Eric.
> > > >
> > > > From reading your responses, I think I've
> got
> > > > something drastically wrong here. The bottom
> lip
> > > on
> > > > the dash cover is 1" above the bottom lip on
> the
> > > > windscreen. Eric, you may be right, I may have
> the
> > > > cowlings mounted too low. At most I could only
> > > gain
> > > > 1/2" though if I were to epoxy the holes shut
> and
> > > > start over moving the lower cowling up. The
> > > > windscreen seems very close to the x-brace
> tubing
> > > in
> > > > the front. By that I mean you can just get
> your
> > > > fingers between the tubes and the windscreen.
> It
> > > had
> > > > to be positioned like that because the top
> cowling
> > > > was
> > > > such a tight fit against it. Any ideas or
> > > > suggestions?
> > > >
> > > > Grant Fluent
> > > > Newcastle, NE
> > > > Classic IV 912S
> >
> >
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Grant.
I have played around with fibreglass quite a bit and found it easy to plug
holes by first placing a piece of masking over the rear of the hole and
then filling the hole with a mixture of resin and microballoons. The mixture
can be also held in place by carefully placing some masking tape over the
finish side
Gary Algate
Lite2/582
Message 12
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Good point Randy,
Maybe the thermostat and Coleman Heater were lost leaders. But I have
started and flown in temperatures quite a bit colder than this without a
problem. I think this evening I will try the heater again even though it's
only about -5 degC and see if I can repeat the problem.
Thanks for your input Randy.
Gary Algate
Lite2/582
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Gary,
Is it reasonable to speculate that there was a coolant line (maybe to or
from the radiator that was blocked with ice crystals? And it has nothing to
do with the thermostat?
The only times that I have boiled over an engine has been when I had a
coolant line frozen.
Randy
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
\
Message 13
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Heating problem responses |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Thanks also for your suggestions Jared and Michel.
I'll be experimenting tonight - Just hope I can come up with something
definitive as I hate leaving these problems completely unanswered.
Gary Algate
Lite2/582
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I had the same thing happen and traced it to an air bubble in cooling
system!
Jared
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Could it be that heating your engine, thus warming the coolant fluid, cools
it
to a freezing solid point say, in the radiator? It sounds like
science-fiction
but your overheating problem seems so weird that ... maybe something as
weird
is happening ... I don't know.
Good luck,
Michel
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
Message 14
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jack Rabon <rabonj@bellsouth.net>
How about this 2800?
http://www.rotecradialengines.com/
Is Brian a list member?
http://www.rotecradialengines.com/customers/brian.htm
http://www.rotecradialengines.com/0brian/SteveAirToAir.htm
Jack
-----Original Message-----
Time: 06:04:40 PM PST US
From: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
. . .
While it's always fun to gloat over things, what I really enjoyed was that
article you sent me on the new radial engined ROUND-COWLED, LOW DRAG Reno
air racer being developed. Maybe I should consider putting an R-2800 in my
Model IV Fox? I'll bet all that streamlining and fairings wouldn't mean
much by comparison....hmmmm.....a power loading of somewhere around .4 lbs
per hp!!!! A true Speedster no doubt...
Paul Seehafer
Central Wisconsin
Message 15
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
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| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
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|
| Subject: | RE: Kitfox-List Digest: 33 Msgs - 02/06/04 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirby Cramer" <kitfox@mcn.org>
I get this every day.
PLEASE REMOVE
Kirby Cramer
Broker Associate, Realtor
Award Commercial Properties
San Diego, CA.
(760) 505-3173 cell (760) 454-4567 fax
kirby@awardcommercial.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kitfox-List
Digest Server
Subject: Kitfox-List Digest: 33 Msgs - 02/06/04
*
==================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
==================================================
Today's complete Kitfox-List Digest can be also be found in either
of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest
formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features
Hyperlinked
Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII
version of the Kitfox-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic
text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list/Digest.Kitfox-List.2004-02-0
6.html
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list/Digest.Kitfox-List.2004-02-0
6.txt
================================================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
================================================
Kitfox-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Fri 02/06/04: 33
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:03 AM - Re: EIS engine info system (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
2. 05:26 AM - Re: Varnishing Ribs (Ronald K. Stevens)
3. 06:08 AM - Re: Altimeter needed (Randy Daughenbaugh)
4. 06:38 AM - Re: Varnishing Ribs (flier)
5. 07:05 AM - Re: Altimeter needed (Gary Algate)
6. 07:26 AM - Re: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement (Lowell Fitt)
7. 07:30 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (jeff.hays@aselia.com)
8. 07:35 AM - Re: Altimeter needed - Get RMI Microencoder
(jeff.hays@aselia.com)
9. 07:41 AM - Re: Removing PTT button from Model 2 stick? (Rex)
10. 07:42 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (Lowell Fitt)
11. 08:15 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (Fox5flyer)
12. 08:25 AM - Re: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
(jeff.hays@aselia.com)
13. 08:52 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (JMCBEAN)
14. 09:03 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (jeff.hays@aselia.com)
15. 09:24 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (Lines, John)
16. 09:38 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (kurt schrader)
17. 10:28 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (martin dovey)
18. 12:24 PM - Re: Removing PTT button from Model 2 stick? (Scott
McClintock)
19. 01:17 PM - Re: Altimeter needed (dsherburn)
20. 02:04 PM - Re: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement (Lowell Fitt)
21. 02:10 PM - Re: Re: Michel, Jabi 2200,was Rotax 582 Engine
problems (Matt Keyes)
22. 02:11 PM - Re: Cruise Speeds (Lowell Fitt)
23. 02:49 PM - Classic IV (Victor Marsh)
24. 03:08 PM - Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
Installation (Grant Fluent)
25. 05:26 PM - "Captive" PAX - WAS: Stick movement (Michael Gibbs)
26. 05:47 PM - Re: Captive PAX/ Stick movement (kurt schrader)
27. 06:11 PM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
Installation (Lowell Fitt)
28. 06:21 PM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
Installation (kurt schrader)
29. 06:26 PM - Re: NSI/CAP prop cruising (kurt schrader)
30. 07:22 PM - Re: Re: NSI/CAP prop cruising (Rick)
31. 07:38 PM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
Installation (Ceashman@aol.com)
32. 08:03 PM - Re: Sky Star (Dcecil3@aol.com)
33. 08:15 PM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
Installation (Grant Fluent)
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 04:03:25 AM PST US
From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: EIS engine info system
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 2/5/04 6:10:57 PM Pacific Standard Time,
rjdaugh@rapidnet.com writes:
> Hope it's a good as everyone says.
>
> Randy - Series 5/7 - 912S - this spring!!! (?)
> .
>
>
Randy,
You'll love it. Will probably be the best thing on the panel.
Don Smythe
DO NOT ARCHIVE
________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
Time: 05:26:12 AM PST US
From: "Ronald K. Stevens" <rkstevens@verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Varnishing Ribs
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ronald K. Stevens"
<rkstevens@verizon.net>
Jimmie Blackwell wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie Blackwell"
<jablackwell@ev1.net>
>
>Wanted to get your opinions on varnishing wing ribs and other wooden
parts in
the wing. I have quick build wings.
>
>How many coats of varnish? and is it necessary to sand between coats?
>
>Thanks
>Jimmie
>
>
>
>
Use 2-3 coats of epoxy varnish - not the 'regular' kind as the MEK used
in the covering process will melt & remove 'normal' varnishes. It's not
really necessary to sand in between coats. Though, it's sometimes
necessary to lightly sand any high spots/bumps on the tops of the ribs
where it would come into contact with the fabric covering.
Without the varnish, your ribs will most certainly warp due to changes
in humidity.
Ron
________________________________ Message 3
_____________________________________
Time: 06:08:06 AM PST US
From: "Randy Daughenbaugh" <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh"
<rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
Hey Jay,
Have you looked at the Garmin GPSmap 196. It's panel view screen has
Altimeter, VSI and other cute things. I kind of like steam gages for
basic
info too, but I don't plan to put other VSI in.
Maybe you have been in on discussions on this already, but...
Randy
.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Fabian
Subject: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jay Fabian"
<experimental208nd@comcast.net>
Hi List,
I am starting to do my annual , and it just so happens that my
altimeters
barometer does not work right now. The vent line is not clogged.
I wanted to know if anyone has an instrument that might include ALT,
RATE
OF CLIMB, BARO, and maybe some more all in one, and what the cost would
be?
Thanks
Jay Fabian
4-1200 912ul
________________________________ Message 4
_____________________________________
Time: 06:38:04 AM PST US
From: "flier" <FLIER@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Varnishing Ribs
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "flier" <FLIER@sbcglobal.net>
Definately use epoxy varnish as Jimmie noted.
Before covering it's a good idea to scuff the tops of
the capstrips with some sandpaper to provide tooth
adhesion for the PolyTak or whatever adhesive process
you're using.
Regards,
Ted
--- Original Message ---
From: "Ronald K. Stevens" <rkstevens@verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Varnishing Ribs
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ronald K.
Stevens" <rkstevens@verizon.net>
>
>Jimmie Blackwell wrote:
>
>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie
Blackwell" <jablackwell@ev1.net>
>>
>>Wanted to get your opinions on varnishing wing ribs
and other wooden parts in the wing. I have quick
build wings.
>>
>>How many coats of varnish? and is it necessary to
sand between coats?
>>
>>Thanks
>>Jimmie
>>
>>
>>
>>
>Use 2-3 coats of epoxy varnish - not the 'regular'
kind as the MEK used
>in the covering process will melt & remove 'normal'
varnishes. It's not
>really necessary to sand in between coats. Though,
it's sometimes
>necessary to lightly sand any high spots/bumps on
the tops of the ribs
>where it would come into contact with the fabric
covering.
>
>Without the varnish, your ribs will most certainly
warp due to changes
>in humidity.
>
>Ron
>
>
>_-
======================================================
==================
Contributions
any other
Forums.
>_-
======================================================
==================
>_-
======================================================
==================
http://www.matronics.com/subscription
http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
http://www.matronics.com/browse/kitfox-list
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>_-
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==================
>
>
________________________________ Message 5
_____________________________________
Time: 07:05:41 AM PST US
From: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
I have the 196 and love it - the panel screen not only gives VSI etc it
also
has a turn and Bank which is a welcome addition. The screen is big and
it is
very user friendly
Gary Algate
Lite2/582
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Hey Jay,
Have you looked at the Garmin GPSmap 196. It's panel view screen has
Altimeter, VSI and other cute things. I kind of like steam gages for
basic
info too, but I don't plan to put other VSI in.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
________________________________ Message 6
_____________________________________
Time: 07:26:29 AM PST US
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Hey, Jeff, If you are putting the stresses on your stick that can be
put on
your rudder/brake pedals, You need to check the friction in your
slystem.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
<jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
>
> I always worry that the Mig welded control column might be
> welded by the same welder as the rudder pedals, so I want
> the second stick in case the first breaks off ... :)
>
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: michel michel@online.no
> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:43:20 +0100
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: "Captive" PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: michel <michel@online.no>
>
> >--- Dave & Wendy Grosvenor <dwg@iafrica.com> wrote:
> >I take it out when I'm flying alone or if I have a pax who
> >doesn't want to do any flying.
>
> While I understand you, Dave, I feel that, if I should become ill
while
> flying
> (I am 56) my passenger should get a fair chance to crash ... not
> vertically.
> As a matter of fact, I always explain the rudiment of the stick and
the
two
> red lines (Vso and Vne) to all my passengers, prior to take-off. They
> usually
> enjoy it, feeling less "captive."
> But I am a beginner and I'd like to hear old-timers' opinion on that
one.
>
> Cheers,
> Michel
>
>
________________________________ Message 7
_____________________________________
Time: 07:30:39 AM PST US
From: "jeff.hays@aselia.com" <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
<jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Ok - That does it. Out with the IO-240 and in with a new IO-540
add a little nitrous, and we'll see how fast my Kitfox can go!
All this talk about speed. Feel like I tuned into the Lancair
list by mistake ...
How about a little talk about getting in and out of muddy fields,
or various tundra tire options, etc. Stuff the plane was meant to
do.
Original Message:
-----------------
From: JMCBEAN JDMCBEAN@cableone.net
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "JMCBEAN" <JDMCBEAN@cableone.net>
Paul,
At the Sun-n-Fun Dash 100 the Series 6 (standard wing) was
recorded
by the
officials at 119 kts (136.8 mph) Remember that most everyone has their
props pitched for climb or a compromise.... Very few will pitch or for
that
matter prop for just the speed.
Blue Skies!!
John & Debra McBean
"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Paul
Seehafer
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
Hi Sid:
But the Avid Speedwing has a sem-symmetrical airfoil that the Kitfox
doesn't
have the luxury of, plus was only 24 feet long verses the Kitfox wing of
29'+. So while I agree the Speedwing Avid was a little hotrod, we're
not
really comparing apples to apples.
My purpose in asking the question about whether or not the Kitfox IV
Speedster could really do 130-140 mph was to find out if anyone is
actually
doing it with their airplane. Apparently there are some owners that are
doing numbers that are close, but I haven't heard of anyone actually
attaining the numbers claimed by the writers and the factory (yet).
Paul Seehafer
----- Original Message -----
From: "hausding, sid" <sidh@charter.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "hausding, sid" <sidh@charter.net>
>
>
> Paul, they get 120mph out of the Avid Speedwing with the 582 Rotax,
sounds
> like the Kitfox should get 130 behind the 912......if real clean and
faired
> out.
> Sid
> --------------
>
> Does anyone know if the Model IV 912ul Speedster really could cruise
at
130
> mph like they claimed it would?
>
> Previous questions about how to get more speed from our Kitfoxes made
me
> think about this. I have articles where independent aviation writers
> claimed 125-140 mph speeds from the Speedster, verified by loran /
gps.
And
> then there are other articles whereas the writers claimed to have
verified
> 110+ out of the long winged 912ul Model IV. Is this all hipe, or is
it
> really possible? Comments or opinions?
>
>
> Paul Seehafer
> Wisconsin
>
>
________________________________ Message 8
_____________________________________
Time: 07:35:32 AM PST US
From: "jeff.hays@aselia.com" <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed - Get RMI Microencoder
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
<jeff.hays@aselia.com>
http://www.rkymtn.com/rm00002.htm
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Randy Daughenbaugh rjdaugh@rapidnet.com
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh"
<rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
Hey Jay,
Have you looked at the Garmin GPSmap 196. It's panel view screen has
Altimeter, VSI and other cute things. I kind of like steam gages for
basic
info too, but I don't plan to put other VSI in.
Maybe you have been in on discussions on this already, but...
Randy
.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Fabian
Subject: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jay Fabian"
<experimental208nd@comcast.net>
Hi List,
I am starting to do my annual , and it just so happens that my
altimeters
barometer does not work right now. The vent line is not clogged.
I wanted to know if anyone has an instrument that might include ALT,
RATE
OF CLIMB, BARO, and maybe some more all in one, and what the cost would
be?
Thanks
Jay Fabian
4-1200 912ul
________________________________ Message 9
_____________________________________
Time: 07:41:33 AM PST US
From: "Rex" <rex@awarenest.com>
Subject: re: Kitfox-List: Removing PTT button from Model 2 stick?
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex" <rex@awarenest.com>
Hi Steve,
It would depend of course on what adhesive was used to glue the grip. I
have had
some sucess removing motorcycle grips by working a thin screwdriver
blade between
the grip and handlebar. This is a mechanical means to break the bond.
Perhaps
a special tool could be made that would have a thin flexible blade with
a handle. I have something similar which I think is a kitchen tool for
spreading
icing or such. It is too wide for this idea, but one could be made
narrow
and could work. If the glue is like motorcycle grip glue it can be
nearly impossible
to remove a grip without destroying it. Perhaps sharpening the end of
the
tool to cut the glue as you stab between the stick and grip. A little
oil in
there should help too. (WD-40?) too keep to tool and grip sticking
together
from friction.
Good luck, I hope this gives you an idea that will help.
Rex
Colorado Springs
________________________________ Message 10
____________________________________
Time: 07:42:17 AM PST US
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Paul, I opted for the Speedster elevator when I purchased my kit. I
used
trim a lot while flying my C-170 and couldn't rationalize the flaperon
trim
in my mind. The whole empennage fairing think came about because I got
the
elevator with the tab cut out but didn't get the Full Speedster tail
option - I was then leg\ft to figure it out on my own.
The difference is speeds was determined by taking off with the trim tab
in
neutral and trimming for level cruise with flaperons, then neutralizing
the
flaperons and trimming with the trim tab.
As I recall, the Speedster came with a fully faired and closed gap
rudder,
electric elevator trim. The wings shortened by one rib bay, lift strut
fairings, faired jury strut and horizontal stabilizer struts, radiator
shroud, smaller tires with wheel pants and a bit larger spinner.
There was one on our Idaho trip last year, but since we generally fly
at
the speed of the slowest airplane, I can't speak as to its performance.
Early on when he flew with us until he got used to our protocol, we
always
saw him disappear into the horizon in front of us and we would meet up
at
the destination airport.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
>
> Hi Lowell:
>
> Thanks for the great info. But I'm curious, 5mph for flaperon trim?
How
> did you do that?
>
> Paul
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
<lcfitt@inreach.com>
> >
> > Not Really, Most of the fairings were added during construction.
As I
> > recall the hubcaps give about 2 mph and the trim tab - eliminating
> flaperon
> > trim - adds about 5
> >
> > Lowell
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "jareds" <jareds@verizon.net>
> > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> >
> >
> > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: jareds <jareds@verizon.net>
> > >
> > > Lowell,
> > >
> > > Thats really impressive. There is hope for my model IV yet!
> > > Wing strut,spinner, and some covering on the landing gear is all
i've
> > > put on so far with a 582.
> > > I'm only at 90-95. I'll try some of these.
> > > Did you test and evaulate which had the biggest effect?
> > >
> > > Lowell Fitt wrote:
> > >
> > > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
<lcfitt@inreach.com>
> > > >
> > > >Paul, I have a lot of drag reducing mods on my Model IV and it
will
> > easily
> > > >cruise at 115 mph.
> > > >
> > > >The mods include Wing Strut fairings, jury strut and horizontal
> > stabilizer
> > > >strut fairings, internal wingtip nav lights, hubcaps, fully
faired
> rudder
> > > >vertical stabilizer / rudder and horizontal stabilizer / elevator
gaps
> > and,
> > > >according to recent posts, benefit from a 9-1/2" spinner. I do
pay a
> > drag
> > > >penalty in the large 21X12X8 tires.
> > > >
> > > >Some of the mods can be seen on Sportflight:
> > >
> >
>
>http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=view&epoch=104134
8095
> > > >http://www.sportflight.com/uploads/tip6.jpg
> > >
> >
>
>http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=view&epoch=107548
8689
> > > >
> > > >The last photo also shows the pod covering the video camera mount
on
> the
> > > >left wing strut.
> > > >
> > > >Lowell
> > > >
> > > >----- Original Message -----
> > > >From: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
> > > >To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > > >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer"
<av8rps@tznet.com>
> > > >>
> > > >>Hi Rick:
> > > >>
> > > >>I'm not trying to make a case against the slow speed of the
design.
> But
> > I
> > > >>do think anything we can do to make our airplanes faster makes
them
> not
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >only
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>more useful for cross country travel, but also more efficient.
My
> > initial
> > > >>question about the Speedsters true cruise speed was really to
find
out
> > if
> > > >>the design fine tuned with only 80 hp could really be that fast?
> > > >>
> > > >>My Lake amphibian isn't a fast airplane either, but it sure is
> > versatile.
> > > >>And you wouldn't believe how envious some of my float plane
buddies
> are
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >that
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>fly around at under 100 mph when I can breeze by them 30+ mph
faster
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >burning
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>less fuel. And as we all know, the longer the trip, the more
benefit
> we
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >see
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>from any increase in speed.
> > > >>
> > > >>Given my druthers, Kitfoxes would go 200 knots. But we know
that
will
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >never
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>happen. However, if we can get 120+ mph out of our planes it
will
> make
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >all
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>the difference between it being used as a local puddle jumper,
or an
> > > >>effective and efficient cross country cruiser.
> > > >>
> > > >>Paul
> > > >>
> > > >>----- Original Message -----
> > > >>From: <RGray67968@aol.com>
> > > >>To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > > >>Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: RGray67968@aol.com
> > > >>>
> > > >>>Hi Gang,
> > > >>>Just curious.....why are all you folks worrying about 'how
fast'
your
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>Kitfox
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>will go? If you want to go 'fast' then why are you flying
Kitfoxes?
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>Kitfoxes
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>are great little airplanes to tool around the sky and enjoy the
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >afternoon.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>>Nothing more fun than buzzing around checking out the sites and
even
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>enjoying an
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>occasional X-country in your Kitfox. If you want to go
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>'fast'....sorry....but
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>you guys are flying the wrong airplane. Enjoy your Kitfox for
what
it
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >is.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>Just
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>my opinion and worth what you paid for it.....smile.
> > > >>>Rick Gray in Ohio at the Buffalo Farm - RV6 w 280+ hours -
former
> > Kitfox
> > > >>>owner (and loved every 115 mph flight in my little Kitfox)
> > > >>>Oh yea......and you guys need to do a LOT better job with the
do
not
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>archive
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>- ever search a topic looking for something??? No fun weeding
through
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >all
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>the
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>'junk' to get what you want.
> > > >>>do not archive this either :
> > > >>>)
> > > >>>
> > > >>>Paul, they get 120mph out of the Avid Speedwing with the 582
Rotax,
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >sounds
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>>like the Kitfox should get 130 behind the 912......if real
clean
and
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>faired
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>out.
> > > >>>Sid
> > > >>>
> > > >>>Does anyone know if the Model IV 912ul Speedster really could
cruise
> at
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>130
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>mph like they claimed it would?
> > > >>>
> > > >>>Previous questions about how to get more speed from our
Kitfoxes
made
> > me
> > > >>>think about this. I have articles where independent aviation
writers
> > > >>>claimed 125-140 mph speeds from the Speedster, verified by
loran /
> gps.
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>And
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>>then there are other articles whereas the writers claimed to
have
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >verified
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>>110+ out of the long winged 912ul Model IV. Is this all hipe,
or
is
> it
> > > >>>really possible? Comments or opinions?
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>Paul Seehafer
> > > >>>Wisconsin
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________ Message 11
____________________________________
Time: 08:15:23 AM PST US
From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
<morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
I love this thread on cruise speeds. I've done a lot of work on mine,
including "faired gas caps" that gives my S5 a fairly respectable 2up
110mph indicated at less than 4gph with 100hp NSI/CAP at about 22 inches
mp. I can push it a lot faster, but the fuel use goes up just as fast
so
I've found that 3900rpm and 22 inches gives me best economy with good
cruise. I live on a farm with a short farm strip (with obstacles) that
requires a careful and accurate approach to get in on the first try and
the
interesting thing is that this heavy S5 will get in and out just about
as
short as my previous lightweight model II did with a 582. By adding
fairing material to various places and paying attention to aerodynamic
details I have a fairly decent cross country cruiser while still keeping
my
"bush plane" traits. When I have time I've got some ideas to clean it
up
even more. The way I figure it, the cleaner it is the more efficient it
is
which results in more speed and better fuel economy. This in no way
inhibits my ability to pull it back to 85 and cruise around watching
ladies
in their hot tubs.
Ok, that being said, has anybody found a way to clean up the fuselage
strut
attach points with a fairing that is removable? This is a fairly draggy
area and could be worth a knot or two.
For what it's worth.
Darrel
> At the Sun-n-Fun Dash 100 the Series 6 (standard wing) was
recorded by the
> officials at 119 kts (136.8 mph) Remember that most everyone has
their
> props pitched for climb or a compromise.... Very few will pitch or for
that
> matter prop for just the speed.
________________________________ Message 12
____________________________________
Time: 08:25:27 AM PST US
From: "jeff.hays@aselia.com" <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
<jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Hey Lowell -
This I was making a more tongue in cheek comment, about Mig
welding for building aircraft, than as a serious comment about
the control column.
However - Since the subject is here. That control column is
not that well designed, and does indeed flex quite a bit. My system
is very friction free, but when you put some heavy airloads on
it - For example slow flight with flaperons deployed, etc. There
is a noticeable amount of flex in the system.
The way the column makes a U-Channel on the pilots side, where the
aileron axis pivot bolt goes through, the steel is simply too
thin. It forms a sort of rectangle with one end u-shaped (bottom),
and with no means of diagonal support naturally flexes. It's a poor
design, which could have been done much simpler, and stronger.
One day if I get ambitious I might rip it out, and stiffen it. But
for now, my wife's list of things I need to do - After 3 years of
airplane construction induced home neglect, has the priority.
Cheers,
Jeff
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Lowell Fitt lcfitt@inreach.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Hey, Jeff, If you are putting the stresses on your stick that can be
put on
your rudder/brake pedals, You need to check the friction in your
slystem.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
<jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
>
> I always worry that the Mig welded control column might be
> welded by the same welder as the rudder pedals, so I want
> the second stick in case the first breaks off ... :)
>
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: michel michel@online.no
> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:43:20 +0100
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: "Captive" PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: michel <michel@online.no>
>
> >--- Dave & Wendy Grosvenor <dwg@iafrica.com> wrote:
> >I take it out when I'm flying alone or if I have a pax who
> >doesn't want to do any flying.
>
> While I understand you, Dave, I feel that, if I should become ill
while
> flying
> (I am 56) my passenger should get a fair chance to crash ... not
> vertically.
> As a matter of fact, I always explain the rudiment of the stick and
the
two
> red lines (Vso and Vne) to all my passengers, prior to take-off. They
> usually
> enjoy it, feeling less "captive."
> But I am a beginner and I'd like to hear old-timers' opinion on that
one.
>
> Cheers,
> Michel
>
>
________________________________ Message 13
____________________________________
Time: 08:52:14 AM PST US
From: "JMCBEAN" <JDMCBEAN@cableone.net>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "JMCBEAN" <JDMCBEAN@cableone.net>
Jeff,
I've said it before... I'll race any Lancair with my fox......
I get to
pick where the race ends. :) Oh, and part of the rules... One has to be
able to fly the aircraft away from wherever the finish line is.
Nitrous and a 540... Lets just go turbine.. or jet... we already have
variable geometry wings...... push the throttles past the stops, sweep
the
wings and lets rock..... Maybe when we push the throttles forward the
wings
will sweep back for us ???
Blue Skies!!
John & Debra McBean
"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
jeff.hays@aselia.com
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
<jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Ok - That does it. Out with the IO-240 and in with a new IO-540
add a little nitrous, and we'll see how fast my Kitfox can go!
All this talk about speed. Feel like I tuned into the Lancair
list by mistake ...
How about a little talk about getting in and out of muddy fields,
or various tundra tire options, etc. Stuff the plane was meant to
do.
Original Message:
-----------------
From: JMCBEAN JDMCBEAN@cableone.net
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "JMCBEAN" <JDMCBEAN@cableone.net>
Paul,
At the Sun-n-Fun Dash 100 the Series 6 (standard wing) was
recorded
by the
officials at 119 kts (136.8 mph) Remember that most everyone has their
props pitched for climb or a compromise.... Very few will pitch or for
that
matter prop for just the speed.
Blue Skies!!
John & Debra McBean
"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Paul
Seehafer
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
Hi Sid:
But the Avid Speedwing has a sem-symmetrical airfoil that the Kitfox
doesn't
have the luxury of, plus was only 24 feet long verses the Kitfox wing of
29'+. So while I agree the Speedwing Avid was a little hotrod, we're
not
really comparing apples to apples.
My purpose in asking the question about whether or not the Kitfox IV
Speedster could really do 130-140 mph was to find out if anyone is
actually
doing it with their airplane. Apparently there are some owners that are
doing numbers that are close, but I haven't heard of anyone actually
attaining the numbers claimed by the writers and the factory (yet).
Paul Seehafer
----- Original Message -----
From: "hausding, sid" <sidh@charter.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "hausding, sid" <sidh@charter.net>
>
>
> Paul, they get 120mph out of the Avid Speedwing with the 582 Rotax,
sounds
> like the Kitfox should get 130 behind the 912......if real clean and
faired
> out.
> Sid
> --------------
>
> Does anyone know if the Model IV 912ul Speedster really could cruise
at
130
> mph like they claimed it would?
>
> Previous questions about how to get more speed from our Kitfoxes made
me
> think about this. I have articles where independent aviation writers
> claimed 125-140 mph speeds from the Speedster, verified by loran /
gps.
And
> then there are other articles whereas the writers claimed to have
verified
> 110+ out of the long winged 912ul Model IV. Is this all hipe, or is
it
> really possible? Comments or opinions?
>
>
> Paul Seehafer
> Wisconsin
>
>
________________________________ Message 14
____________________________________
Time: 09:03:40 AM PST US
From: "jeff.hays@aselia.com" <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
<jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Time spent "in" the hot tub with the ladies, is better than
time wasted fairing gas caps ... :)
Jeff
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Fox5flyer morid@northland.lib.mi.us
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
<morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
I love this thread on cruise speeds. I've done a lot of work on mine,
including "faired gas caps" that gives my S5 a fairly respectable 2up
110mph indicated at less than 4gph with 100hp NSI/CAP at about 22 inches
mp. I can push it a lot faster, but the fuel use goes up just as fast
so
I've found that 3900rpm and 22 inches gives me best economy with good
cruise. I live on a farm with a short farm strip (with obstacles) that
requires a careful and accurate approach to get in on the first try and
the
interesting thing is that this heavy S5 will get in and out just about
as
short as my previous lightweight model II did with a 582. By adding
fairing material to various places and paying attention to aerodynamic
details I have a fairly decent cross country cruiser while still keeping
my
"bush plane" traits. When I have time I've got some ideas to clean it
up
even more. The way I figure it, the cleaner it is the more efficient it
is
which results in more speed and better fuel economy. This in no way
inhibits my ability to pull it back to 85 and cruise around watching
ladies
in their hot tubs.
Ok, that being said, has anybody found a way to clean up the fuselage
strut
attach points with a fairing that is removable? This is a fairly draggy
area and could be worth a knot or two.
For what it's worth.
Darrel
> At the Sun-n-Fun Dash 100 the Series 6 (standard wing) was
recorded by the
> officials at 119 kts (136.8 mph) Remember that most everyone has
their
> props pitched for climb or a compromise.... Very few will pitch or for
that
> matter prop for just the speed.
________________________________ Message 15
____________________________________
Time: 09:24:26 AM PST US
From: "Lines, John" <JLines@phelpsdodge.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lines, John"
<JLines@phelpsdodge.com>
That could be very debatable...and it would / could be a more
interesting
thread than some other's of late
-----Original Message-----
From: jeff.hays@aselia.com [mailto:jeff.hays@aselia.com]
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
<jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Time spent "in" the hot tub with the ladies, is better than
time wasted fairing gas caps ... :)
Jeff
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Fox5flyer morid@northland.lib.mi.us
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
<morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
I love this thread on cruise speeds. I've done a lot of work on mine,
including "faired gas caps" that gives my S5 a fairly respectable 2up
110mph indicated at less than 4gph with 100hp NSI/CAP at about 22 inches
mp. I can push it a lot faster, but the fuel use goes up just as fast
so
I've found that 3900rpm and 22 inches gives me best economy with good
cruise. I live on a farm with a short farm strip (with obstacles) that
requires a careful and accurate approach to get in on the first try and
the
interesting thing is that this heavy S5 will get in and out just about
as
short as my previous lightweight model II did with a 582. By adding
fairing material to various places and paying attention to aerodynamic
details I have a fairly decent cross country cruiser while still keeping
my
"bush plane" traits. When I have time I've got some ideas to clean it
up
even more. The way I figure it, the cleaner it is the more efficient it
is
which results in more speed and better fuel economy. This in no way
inhibits my ability to pull it back to 85 and cruise around watching
ladies
in their hot tubs.
Ok, that being said, has anybody found a way to clean up the fuselage
strut
attach points with a fairing that is removable? This is a fairly draggy
area and could be worth a knot or two.
For what it's worth.
Darrel
> At the Sun-n-Fun Dash 100 the Series 6 (standard wing) was
recorded by the
> officials at 119 kts (136.8 mph) Remember that most everyone has
their
> props pitched for climb or a compromise.... Very few will pitch or for
that
> matter prop for just the speed.
This message (including attachments) is for the designated recipient
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contain privileged, proprietary, or otherwise confidential information.
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________________________________ Message 16
____________________________________
Time: 09:38:49 AM PST US
From: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
<smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Darrel,
I had to copy your e-mail on improved efficiency for
my archives. You are showing what can be done with
real good results. Thanks.
A long time ago I used to fly CH-53 helicopters.
Cruise speed was 150 kts and max speed 170 kts. But
we could beat an F-4 to 10,000' from a standing
start...using less fuel...carrying a bigger load...
:-) Now that is real apples and oranges. Hehe
Kurt S.
__________________________________
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
________________________________ Message 17
____________________________________
Time: 10:28:50 AM PST US
From: "martin dovey" <kitfox.england@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "martin dovey"
<kitfox.england@ntlworld.com>
Yes but when you are "in" the hot tub with the ladies you still
have to take basic aerodynamics in to acount,
Lift, Weight, Drag & Thrust!
Martin Dovey
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> Time spent "in" the hot tub with the ladies, is better than
> time wasted fairing gas caps ... :)
>
________________________________ Message 18
____________________________________
Time: 12:24:20 PM PST US
From: Scott McClintock <scott_mcclintock@dot.state.ak.us>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Removing PTT button from Model 2 stick?
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock
<scott_mcclintock@dot.state.ak.us>
Steve,
I owned several motorcycle/ATV businesses over the years.
You need to use a thin, long tube attached to a air blower and use
compressed air.
Work the end of the tube around the grip as you push it in.This is the
ONLY way
to remove those grips. If you do it right, the grip will be usable.
Remove the old glue with alcohol or paint thinner.
When you re-install, don't use any glue. A little old spit (or soap)
will get it
back on then use a wrap
of safety wire to secure.
Scott in Nome
Rex wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex" <rex@awarenest.com>
>
> Hi Steve,
> It would depend of course on what adhesive was used to glue the grip.
I have
had some sucess removing motorcycle grips by working a thin screwdriver
blade
between the grip and handlebar. This is a mechanical means to break the
bond.
Perhaps a special tool could be made that would have a thin flexible
blade with
a handle. I have something similar which I think is a kitchen tool for
spreading
icing or such. It is too wide for this idea, but one could be made
narrow
and could work. If the glue is like motorcycle grip glue it can be
nearly impossible
to remove a grip without destroying it. Perhaps sharpening the end of
the tool to cut the glue as you stab between the stick and grip. A
little oil
in there should help too. (WD-40?) too keep to tool and grip sticking
together
from friction.
> Good luck, I hope this gives you an idea that will help.
>
> Rex
> Colorado Springs
>
________________________________ Message 19
____________________________________
Time: 01:17:48 PM PST US
From: "dsherburn" <dsherburn@charter.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dsherburn" <dsherburn@charter.net>
Gary,
Is the screen "update" rate fast enough for the
turn and bank/HSI etc to work well?
ds
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate"
<algate@attglobal.net>
>
> I have the 196 and love it - the panel screen not only gives VSI etc
it
also
> has a turn and Bank which is a welcome addition. The screen is big and
it
is
> very user friendly
>
> Gary Algate
> Lite2/582
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> Hey Jay,
> Have you looked at the Garmin GPSmap 196. It's panel view screen has
> Altimeter, VSI and other cute things. I kind of like steam gages for
basic
> info too, but I don't plan to put other VSI in.
> <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
>
>
________________________________ Message 20
____________________________________
Time: 02:04:28 PM PST US
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Jeff, - can't remember the V design, but the IV is pretty stiff there.
Working the pilot's stick against the passenger's gives me no movement,
flex or slop. I did put in bronze bushings at the stick pivot to
eliminate
the effects of the tapered reamers there, though.
Lowell
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
<jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
>
> Hey Lowell -
>
> This I was making a more tongue in cheek comment, about Mig
> welding for building aircraft, than as a serious comment about
> the control column.
>
> However - Since the subject is here. That control column is
> not that well designed, and does indeed flex quite a bit. My system
> is very friction free, but when you put some heavy airloads on
> it - For example slow flight with flaperons deployed, etc. There
> is a noticeable amount of flex in the system.
>
> The way the column makes a U-Channel on the pilots side, where the
> aileron axis pivot bolt goes through, the steel is simply too
> thin. It forms a sort of rectangle with one end u-shaped (bottom),
> and with no means of diagonal support naturally flexes. It's a poor
> design, which could have been done much simpler, and stronger.
>
> One day if I get ambitious I might rip it out, and stiffen it. But
> for now, my wife's list of things I need to do - After 3 years of
> airplane construction induced home neglect, has the priority.
>
> Cheers,
> Jeff
>
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: Lowell Fitt lcfitt@inreach.com
> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:23:10 -0800
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
> Hey, Jeff, If you are putting the stresses on your stick that can be
put
on
> your rudder/brake pedals, You need to check the friction in your
slystem.
>
> Lowell
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> >
> >
> > I always worry that the Mig welded control column might be
> > welded by the same welder as the rudder pedals, so I want
> > the second stick in case the first breaks off ... :)
> >
> >
> > Original Message:
> > -----------------
> > From: michel michel@online.no
> > Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:43:20 +0100
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Kitfox-List: "Captive" PAX - WAS: Stick movement
> >
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: michel <michel@online.no>
> >
> > >--- Dave & Wendy Grosvenor <dwg@iafrica.com> wrote:
> > >I take it out when I'm flying alone or if I have a pax who
> > >doesn't want to do any flying.
> >
> > While I understand you, Dave, I feel that, if I should become ill
while
> > flying
> > (I am 56) my passenger should get a fair chance to crash ... not
> > vertically.
> > As a matter of fact, I always explain the rudiment of the stick and
the
> two
> > red lines (Vso and Vne) to all my passengers, prior to take-off.
They
> > usually
> > enjoy it, feeling less "captive."
> > But I am a beginner and I'd like to hear old-timers' opinion on that
one.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Michel
> >
> >
>
>
________________________________ Message 21
____________________________________
Time: 02:10:36 PM PST US
From: Matt Keyes <keyesmp@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Michel, Jabi 2200,was Rotax 582 Engine
problems
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Matt Keyes <keyesmp@yahoo.com>
Michel,
I believe Kitplanes Magazine did a series of articles on a Kitfox/Jabiru
2200 installation.
You can find them on the web if not at the news stand. May be of
interest to you in deciding on engines.
Matt
---------------------------------
________________________________ Message 22
____________________________________
Time: 02:11:39 PM PST US
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
<morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>
> I love this thread on cruise speeds. I've done a lot of work on mine,
> including "faired gas caps" that gives my S5 a fairly respectable 2up
> 110mph indicated at less than 4gph...
Darrel, This is a good point. In our first Idaho trip as a group I
used
7.7 gallons in the three hour flight from Cameron Park to Winnemucca,
NV. I
still hear about that one. And in all subsequent trips, when the others
top
off the tanks, I will need about 70% of what the others use.
I expect in another 6 months or so, I will be able to afford the
aforementioned "Hot Tub" with the fuel savings alone.
Lowell
.
________________________________ Message 23
____________________________________
Time: 02:49:59 PM PST US
From: "Victor Marsh" <vmarsh@ib4e.biz>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Classic IV
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Victor Marsh" <vmarsh@ib4e.biz>
Is there anyone in the Stockton CA, area with a classic IV that I can
catch a ride with. I am nearing completion of my project. I have
time in an Avid Flyer, but my insurance carrier wants me to have time
in make and model etc...
Thanks.
Please contact me at vmarsh@ib4e.biz
do not archive.
________________________________ Message 24
____________________________________
Time: 03:08:32 PM PST US
From: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
Installation
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Hello List,
I am installing the fiberglass dash cover on my
Classic IV and have a question. The manual says to
drill 10 holes to fasten the cover to the windshield.
If I position the cover level with the fuselage, the
holes through the windshield to fasten it will have to
be above the edge of the top cowling. Are they
supposed to be?
Grant Fluent
Newcastle, NE
Classic IV 912S
________________________________ Message 25
____________________________________
Time: 05:26:44 PM PST US
From: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: "Captive" PAX - WAS: Stick movement
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
>(I am 56) my passenger should get a fair chance to crash ... not
vertically.
>I always worry that the Mig welded control column might be
>welded by the same welder as the rudder pedals, so I want
>the second stick in case the first breaks off ... :)
You guys have your probabilities all mixed up. You are a lot more
likely to have the passenger's knees interfering with your operation
of the controls than to become incapacitated or have the stick break
off in your hand.
Mike G.
________________________________ Message 26
____________________________________
Time: 05:47:49 PM PST US
From: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX/ Stick movement
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
<smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
I wish we had a center stick option with dual
throttles. That would eliminate some weight,
interference and slop. Push to talk would have to be
somewhere else though. Kind'a crowded to install in
the middle too I know.
Anyone hear of someone doing this on a KF or Avid?
Kurt S.
__________________________________
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
________________________________ Message 27
____________________________________
Time: 06:11:29 PM PST US
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash
Cover) Installation
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Grant, Mine are just below the raised lip, so out of sight. I don't
think
you would want them above the cowl. I have never seen one that way.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Grant Fluent" <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
Installation
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
>
> Hello List,
>
> I am installing the fiberglass dash cover on my
> Classic IV and have a question. The manual says to
> drill 10 holes to fasten the cover to the windshield.
> If I position the cover level with the fuselage, the
> holes through the windshield to fasten it will have to
> be above the edge of the top cowling. Are they
> supposed to be?
>
> Grant Fluent
> Newcastle, NE
> Classic IV 912S
>
>
________________________________ Message 28
____________________________________
Time: 06:21:20 PM PST US
From: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash
Cover) Installation
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
<smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Like Lowell says, below the cowl lip. I was able to
align mine to be about straight back from the cowl so
that, if the cowl lip and windscreen weren't there, it
would form a straight line cowl top to panel cover
top. That made the cover's bottom sides just barely
forward of the panel corners. The way you dress the
cover lip out can help if you need an extention. You
need something there to blunt that edge anyway.
Kurt S. S-5
--- Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent
> <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
>
> Hello List,
>
> I am installing the fiberglass dash cover on my
> Classic IV and have a question. The manual says to
> drill 10 holes to fasten the cover to the
> windshield.
> If I position the cover level with the fuselage, the
> holes through the windshield to fasten it will have
> to
> be above the edge of the top cowling. Are they
> supposed to be?
>
> Grant Fluent
> Newcastle, NE
> Classic IV 912S
__________________________________
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
________________________________ Message 29
____________________________________
Time: 06:26:11 PM PST US
From: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: RE: NSI/CAP prop cruising
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
<smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Rick and others with the NSI turbo and CAP props,
How do you set your cruise? Pitch to full course,
throttle back, then lean? Some intermediate pitch
setting? Leave the throttle max, as Lance says?
What cruise FF do you get and at what speed?
Kurt S. S-5/NSI Turbo
__________________________________
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
________________________________ Message 30
____________________________________
Time: 07:22:07 PM PST US
From: "Rick" <turboflyer@comcast.net>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: RE: NSI/CAP prop cruising
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rick" <turboflyer@comcast.net>
It seems like its been years but as I recall I set climb on the ground
at
run up by appx. pitch, full power full rich , pitch for 5200 RPMs, as
she
climbs and gains speed, back off the throttle in steps to maintain 5200
if
needed depending on the day and altitude, and then at cruise altitude
pull
back the throttle to give me about 4600 then pitch full to about 3600.
Of
course if I am going to climb for any real altitude like 10K plus I will
go
to a 4800 RPM setting and lean back as needed to altitude. Once there
back
to full throttle and full pitch. Guess there are so many ways to do it
and
again slow flight is a different matter as well. I like to keep the
engine
RPMs at or above 3600 which seem a fair trade for torque and HP at
cruise
and put along about 110mph indicated on 5.5GPH. Hope to do better with
the
new engine.
BTW I spoke with Darrell at warp. said they shoot for tip speed of
850FPS.
So if I like the 5200 engine speed and do a 2:1 reduction that will
yield a
816FPS. May go 1.9 for 860 tip speed. I can always fudge up a bit on
RPMs
if needed. He says we are running the warp props to slow for best
performance. So the math looks like this:
5200/2:1=2600X72=187200/229.183=816FPS
Rick
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of kurt
schrader
Subject: Kitfox-List: RE: NSI/CAP prop cruising
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
<smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Rick and others with the NSI turbo and CAP props,
How do you set your cruise? Pitch to full course,
throttle back, then lean? Some intermediate pitch
setting? Leave the throttle max, as Lance says?
What cruise FF do you get and at what speed?
Kurt S. S-5/NSI Turbo
__________________________________
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
________________________________ Message 31
____________________________________
Time: 07:38:21 PM PST US
From: Ceashman@aol.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash
Cover) Installation
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ceashman@aol.com
Hello Grant.
I put together a Classic IV.
That windshield, top instrument cowling and the top engine cowling is a
real
pain.
Be careful, if you have cut, drilled and installed the full engine
cowling in
relationship to the engine you have installed. That is a done thing
(very
difficult to make adjustments to the cowling after this).
If this is the case, I would say that, first install the windshield,
having
cut the windshield to SkyStar specs. and cleco in place on roof (butt
ribs).
And then down the side posts
Now place the instrument glare panel, rear end resting on the positioned
aluminum instrument panel. And slide the fiberglass glare panel foreword
until
the
bottom of the flange is in line with the bottom edge of the windshield.
This
should make for a pleasant profile of the glare panel
If the back edge of the top engine cowling (where it flutes up) is below
the
holes (finally Phillips screws) then I think the cowlings are set too
low on
the fuselage!!.
The other thing could be that the windshield could be flexed back a
little
more. (If you haven't already drilled the holes in the sides). This
should bring
the screw holes down a little.
My 10 windshield screws are slightly lower than the flute of the top
engine
cowl (just about). I would have preferred to have a little more space
there!
But it is very tricky and I spent hours on this area.
If you go to the recent builder completion's at the SkyStar site,
(Ashman.
Blue and red) you will see my window. I have placed a white rubber "P"
weather
strip to the windshield. I had a little rain come in one day.
I hope this helps. Eric Ashman. Atlanta
e-mail; ceashman@aol.com
________________________________ Message 32
____________________________________
Time: 08:03:03 PM PST US
From: Dcecil3@aol.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Sky Star
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Dcecil3@aol.com
I can only speculate as to whats going on at Sky Star but I'm kinda
nervous .
I can't contact them any other way than by phone and then its hard to
get an
answer on anything .the last time I ordered parts was in October and
they just
about brought them here ! I thought "What Service!" now I can't get them
to
do anything? This , and a dedicated Employee leaveing? well one can only
guess
employees off , it attracts them course this is only my opinion but it
don't
take much to read between the lines
Best David Cecil
KF950
Do not archive
________________________________ Message 33
____________________________________
Time: 08:15:02 PM PST US
From: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash
Cover) Installation
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Thanks Lowell, Kurt and Eric.
From reading your responses, I think I've got
something drastically wrong here. The bottom lip on
the dash cover is 1" above the bottom lip on the
windscreen. Eric, you may be right, I may have the
cowlings mounted too low. At most I could only gain
1/2" though if I were to epoxy the holes shut and
start over moving the lower cowling up. The
windscreen seems very close to the x-brace tubing in
the front. By that I mean you can just get your
fingers between the tubes and the windscreen. It had
to be positioned like that because the top cowling was
such a tight fit against it. Any ideas or suggestions?
Grant Fluent
Newcastle, NE
Classic IV 912S
==
==
==
==
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Whats going on at Skystar-Update |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Dcecil3@aol.com
Talked to Dave today and feel better about the company.Orders take more time
now They've had to bring alot of work in house to help keep cost down. This is
winter, sales are not great this time of year, and with the economy being
what it is, everyone's had to "Streamline".I know they have some long-term
delivery issues but I hope everyone will give them the benefit of the doubt and
be
happy that they're not in the same boat as Avid
David Cecil
KF3#950
Message 17
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|
| Subject: | Re: 912-S Oil Cooler Failures |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John E. King " <kingjohn@erols.com>
Lowell & John,
Way back when my Model IV had the SkyStar designed oil cooler bracket
for my Rotax 912UL. It did not last long because the oil cooler was
hard mounted to the bracket supporting the it. The Earl's catalog has a
oil cooler mount that sandwiches the cooler between foam rubber pads. I
designed my own oil cooler mount fashioned after the Earl's design.
There has never been a problem with the oil cooler ever since, even on
my 912S in my Series 6. The bracket cracked on me once, but that was
because I did not use heavy enough aluminum material.
--
John King
Warrenton, VA
Lowell Fitt wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
>John, Earl's Performance Products, the original supplier of the oil cooler
>specifically recommended a cushioned mount for the oil cooler. They were
>primarily manufactured for the high performance auto industry and maybe SS
>felt that this recommendation was due to road stresses. I made my own way
>back then using the shock mounts SS supplies for the ignition module. With
>the added vibration from the US, this would be a must do for my comfort.
>
>
>
Message 18
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ted Palamarek" <temco@telusplanet.net>
Gary
Have you checked the freezing point of you anti freeze??
Sounds to me like you are freezing/gelling the rad at those
cold temps and that is why you temps spike so high once you
start the engine --- no circulation. Just a thought
Ted
Edmonton, Ab
<<<<SNIP>>>>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Heating problem
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate"
<algate@attglobal.net>
Here's one for the detectives on the list. Last week I
reported a failed
thermostat on my 582 Blue Head engine.
I purchased a new thermostat but had an interesting
occurrence. Background:
Temperature was -20 degC and it was a little too cold for
the small
electric fan heater I use to get things warmed up under the
cowl. I had
recently purchased a small coleman heater that runs off camp
oil for just
this event so I placed the heater under the plane and ducted
the hot air
through some aluminum vent ducting up under the cowl.
After about 10 minutes I could easily turn the prop by hand
so I removed the
heater and started the engine.
As I was warming it up I noticed the water temp rocket past
190 deg after
only 3 or 4 minutes so I shut it down. I tried re-starting
but the same
thing occurred and I also noticed that my radiator and
heater core remained
cold. This pointed to the thermostat failing so I arranged
to borrow a
friends and everything worked fine.
I purchased a new thermostat and tried it last Friday (-10
degrees and no
pre-heat necessary) and it worked fine.
On Sunday the temp was down around -17 degC so I once again
used the coleman
heater to pre-heat the engine and once again after startup
the water temp
rocketed up to almost 200 deg.
Out with the thermostat and about 1 hour boiling it in a jug
to try and work
exactly how it works.
Finally in desperation I reconsidered events and determined
the problem only
occurred when I used the higher temperature Coleman pr-heat.
By this time the engine had cooled completely so I refitted
the thermostat
and carried out a cold start.
All temps perfect?????
The new Bluehead engine has a complicated thermostat that
has a small gate
that opens one end but at the same time the centre spindle
extends and
pushes a large disc up against a seat inside the head to
divert flow (I'm
not sure where or why).
Can anyone give me some ideas as to why the preheat is
effecting the
operation of the thermostat.......
Gary Algate
Lite2 582 Bluehead - Confused????????????????
==============
Contributions
other
==============
==============
http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
http://www.matronics.com/browse/kitfox-list
http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list
==============
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | Re: Low Fuel Warning |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
Hi Paul,
The "oil warning" part, is for the two stroke oil reservoir, this part
can be skipped if not needed, makes the system even simpler.
Torgeir.
Paul wrote:
>
> Was the system for a 2 stroke or 4 stroke? Reason for the question is the oil
tank for the 4 stroke contains hot oil and ruins most sensors.
> Thanks, Paul
> =========
>
> At 9:24 PM +0100 2/8/04, Torgeir Mortensen wrote:
> >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
> >
> >Hi Norm,
> >
> >My pleasure!
> >
> >Sometime ago I asked Graham Laucht about using stuff from the "UKAVID
> >newsletter" in the Kitfox list, Graham said; no problem, as long as the
> >origin publisher is credited!
> >
> >Well-, this is from the UKAVID Winter 94 -, the electrical drawing of
> >the low fuel and low oil warning system. I've sent this drawing to the
> >sporflight "picture site".
> >
> >This is the drawing showing all the parts, included in this warning
> >system.
> >
> >There is a test switch, to test both systems for functionality, if this
> >test work the system is OK.
> >
> >The system has very few components and are very reliable.. However, can
> >remember that someone mentioned a problem with the sensor installed in
> >the "feeder" tank. The problem was that the additives in "autogas" seems
> >to "melt" the plastic lens in the sensor device. If you are using the
> >"100LL", there should be no problem... I'm sure someone with experience
> >here can jump in.
> >
> >(This sensors P/N (part number) is: 317-803 from RS Component).
> >
> >OK. here is the direct link to the schematic:
> >
> >http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=view&epoch=1076271459
> >
> >
> >Enjoy.
> >
> >
> >Torgeir.
> >
> >
> >Norm Beauchamp wrote:
> >>
> >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Norm Beauchamp <nebchmp@wcc.net>
> >>
> >> Thanks for the replies,
> >> Torgeir,
> >> I eventually ended up with my Allied Electronics Catalog. At the hanger I
left
> >> a piece of paper with what I believe to be the manufacturer of the unit. No
> >> address, phone numbers, zip codes, zilch. I'll bring it home and do a search.
> >>
> >> Lowell,
> >> >From the experiences others have had and related, I had already painted the
tank
> >> black. I may be confusing the issue here. The push to test switch and light
> >> work.
> >> But with no fuel in the tank, the warning light will not work as it should.
I
> >> figured maybe it wasn't getting enough light, so I removed it from the tank
> >> figuring the light would surely come on. No light! Hell!! So I shined a
> >> flashlight on it. No light.
> >> The fuel vent lines were the only clear lines into the tank, and they have
long
> >> sense yellowed.
> >>
> >> Steve,
> >> If I read you correctly, I should see a small red light on the sensor just
out
> >> side the tank if empty, and the unit is operating properly. No light.
> >>
> >> It sounded like a good option. I guess I'll just have to rely on my two eyes
> >> and the site gauges. Norm
> >>
> >
> >
>
> --
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Heating problem |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
Hi Gary,
I'll think Jared is right, a cold engine with a small air bubble will
work OK., -if started cold. This because a small air bubble will be
drawn easily around in the cooling system, when engine is started (of
course, this depend where the air bubble is located). However, when you
preheat the engine, the air bubble will expand and be trapped inside the
head of the engine. Air in the head work as a "very" good isolator. Such
a situation will rice the temp very fast as you described. This is a
typical situation if air is trapped in the engine head.
Torgeir.
Gary Algate wrote:
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
>
> Here's one for the detectives on the list. Last week I reported a failed
> thermostat on my 582 Blue Head engine.
>
> I purchased a new thermostat but had an interesting occurrence. Background:
>
> Temperature was -20 degC and it was a little too cold for the small
> electric fan heater I use to get things warmed up under the cowl. I had
> recently purchased a small coleman heater that runs off camp oil for just
> this event so I placed the heater under the plane and ducted the hot air
> through some aluminum vent ducting up under the cowl.
>
> After about 10 minutes I could easily turn the prop by hand so I removed the
> heater and started the engine.
>
> As I was warming it up I noticed the water temp rocket past 190 deg after
> only 3 or 4 minutes so I shut it down. I tried re-starting but the same
> thing occurred and I also noticed that my radiator and heater core remained
> cold. This pointed to the thermostat failing so I arranged to borrow a
> friends and everything worked fine.
>
> I purchased a new thermostat and tried it last Friday (-10 degrees and no
> pre-heat necessary) and it worked fine.
>
> On Sunday the temp was down around -17 degC so I once again used the coleman
> heater to pre-heat the engine and once again after startup the water temp
> rocketed up to almost 200 deg.
>
> Out with the thermostat and about 1 hour boiling it in a jug to try and work
> exactly how it works.
>
> Finally in desperation I reconsidered events and determined the problem only
> occurred when I used the higher temperature Coleman pr-heat.
>
> By this time the engine had cooled completely so I refitted the thermostat
> and carried out a cold start.
>
> All temps perfect?????
>
> The new Bluehead engine has a complicated thermostat that has a small gate
> that opens one end but at the same time the centre spindle extends and
> pushes a large disc up against a seat inside the head to divert flow (I'm
> not sure where or why).
>
> Can anyone give me some ideas as to why the preheat is effecting the
> operation of the thermostat.......
>
> Gary Algate
> Lite2 582 Bluehead - Confused????????????????
>
Message 21
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Gary Algate
President
SDS Digger Tools Canada Inc
Ph. +1 (705) 670-8459
Fax +1 (705) 670-9591
Cell +1 (705) 688-2236
Hello Ted
The more I think about it the more your response, and the others that concur
with you, makes sense. Maybe I was just fixated on the thermostat and not
looking at all of the evidence.
I am going to take a sample from my coolant system and store it outside so
that I can see what it looks like as the temperature drops.
When you think about the pre-heat would condition the engine block and
gearbox but would have little or no effect on the exposed rad or heater
core. Once the engine was started and I had finished examining the
thermostat etc the heat may well have soaked into the coolant fluid and
dissolved any gelled or frozen areas.
Best regards
Gary
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Have you checked the freezing point of you anti freeze??
Sounds to me like you are freezing/gelling the rad at those cold temps and
that is why you temps spike so high once you start the engine --- no
circulation. Just a thought
Ted
Edmonton, Ab
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
<<<<SNIP>>>>
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Heating problem |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
Hi Michel,
The antifreeze can be veryyyy cold, remember this stuff won't get stiff
that easy, can be mixed and act as a fluid down to around -50 deg. C.
Sometimes this stuff "freeze" in the rad., -and become a kind of very
cold ice soup .. :) ..
It's true, that this stuff can block the radiator, and the symptom. is
similar to Gary's problem. Fast rising temp, and radiator water pressure
too - soon the expansion tank will overflow and we know the rest.
Torgeir.
michel wrote:
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: michel <michel@online.no>
>
> >===== Original Message From "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
> >Can anyone give me some ideas as to why the preheat is effecting the
> >operation of the thermostat.......
>
> Gary, what I am about to write is certainly rubbish but ...
> Many years ago, I poured some concentrated anti-frost fluid in the snow, then
> put my finger in it. To my surprise, my fingertip turned white and was left
> with a burn mark. To turn a solid into liquid steals a lot of energy. The
> seemingly liquid result was way much colder than the ambiant temperature,
> hence the slight burn on my fingertip.
> Could it be that heating your engine, thus warming the coolant fluid, cools it
> to a freezing solid point say, in the radiator? It sounds like science-fiction
> but your overheating problem seems so weird that ... maybe something as weird
> is happening ... I don't know.
>
> Good luck,
> Michel
>
> do not archive
>
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Re: RE: Kitfox-List Digest: 33 Msgs - 02/06/04 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dmorisse" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Kirby, if you just scroll down to the bottom of the message the instructions
are there to take care of it yourself.
Darrel
List Administrator
>
> I get this every day.
>
> PLEASE REMOVE
>
> Kirby Cramer
> Broker Associate, Realtor
> Award Commercial Properties
> San Diego, CA.
> (760) 505-3173 cell (760) 454-4567 fax
> kirby@awardcommercial.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kitfox-List
> Digest Server
> To: Kitfox-List Digest List
> Subject: Kitfox-List Digest: 33 Msgs - 02/06/04
>
> *
>
> ==================================================
> Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
> ==================================================
>
> Today's complete Kitfox-List Digest can be also be found in either
> of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest
> formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features
> Hyperlinked
> Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII
> version of the Kitfox-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic
> text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser.
>
> HTML Version:
>
>
> 6.html
>
> Text Version:
>
>
> 6.txt
>
>
> ================================================
> EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
> ================================================
>
>
> Kitfox-List Digest Archive
> ---
> Total Messages Posted Fri 02/06/04: 33
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 04:03 AM - Re: EIS engine info system (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
> 2. 05:26 AM - Re: Varnishing Ribs (Ronald K. Stevens)
> 3. 06:08 AM - Re: Altimeter needed (Randy Daughenbaugh)
> 4. 06:38 AM - Re: Varnishing Ribs (flier)
> 5. 07:05 AM - Re: Altimeter needed (Gary Algate)
> 6. 07:26 AM - Re: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement (Lowell Fitt)
> 7. 07:30 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (jeff.hays@aselia.com)
> 8. 07:35 AM - Re: Altimeter needed - Get RMI Microencoder
> (jeff.hays@aselia.com)
> 9. 07:41 AM - Re: Removing PTT button from Model 2 stick? (Rex)
> 10. 07:42 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (Lowell Fitt)
> 11. 08:15 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (Fox5flyer)
> 12. 08:25 AM - Re: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
> (jeff.hays@aselia.com)
> 13. 08:52 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (JMCBEAN)
> 14. 09:03 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (jeff.hays@aselia.com)
> 15. 09:24 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (Lines, John)
> 16. 09:38 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (kurt schrader)
> 17. 10:28 AM - Re: Cruise Speeds (martin dovey)
> 18. 12:24 PM - Re: Removing PTT button from Model 2 stick? (Scott
> McClintock)
> 19. 01:17 PM - Re: Altimeter needed (dsherburn)
> 20. 02:04 PM - Re: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement (Lowell Fitt)
> 21. 02:10 PM - Re: Re: Michel, Jabi 2200,was Rotax 582 Engine
> problems (Matt Keyes)
> 22. 02:11 PM - Re: Cruise Speeds (Lowell Fitt)
> 23. 02:49 PM - Classic IV (Victor Marsh)
> 24. 03:08 PM - Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
> Installation (Grant Fluent)
> 25. 05:26 PM - "Captive" PAX - WAS: Stick movement (Michael Gibbs)
> 26. 05:47 PM - Re: Captive PAX/ Stick movement (kurt schrader)
> 27. 06:11 PM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
> Installation (Lowell Fitt)
> 28. 06:21 PM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
> Installation (kurt schrader)
> 29. 06:26 PM - Re: NSI/CAP prop cruising (kurt schrader)
> 30. 07:22 PM - Re: Re: NSI/CAP prop cruising (Rick)
> 31. 07:38 PM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
> Installation (Ceashman@aol.com)
> 32. 08:03 PM - Re: Sky Star (Dcecil3@aol.com)
> 33. 08:15 PM - Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
> Installation (Grant Fluent)
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 1
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 04:03:25 AM PST US
> From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: EIS engine info system
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 2/5/04 6:10:57 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> rjdaugh@rapidnet.com writes:
>
>
> > Hope it's a good as everyone says.
> >
> > Randy - Series 5/7 - 912S - this spring!!! (?)
> > .
> >
> >
>
> Randy,
> You'll love it. Will probably be the best thing on the panel.
>
> Don Smythe
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 2
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 05:26:12 AM PST US
> From: "Ronald K. Stevens" <rkstevens@verizon.net>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Varnishing Ribs
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ronald K. Stevens"
> <rkstevens@verizon.net>
>
> Jimmie Blackwell wrote:
>
> >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie Blackwell"
> <jablackwell@ev1.net>
> >
> >Wanted to get your opinions on varnishing wing ribs and other wooden
> parts in
> the wing. I have quick build wings.
> >
> >How many coats of varnish? and is it necessary to sand between coats?
> >
> >Thanks
> >Jimmie
> >
> >
> >
> >
> Use 2-3 coats of epoxy varnish - not the 'regular' kind as the MEK used
> in the covering process will melt & remove 'normal' varnishes. It's not
>
> really necessary to sand in between coats. Though, it's sometimes
> necessary to lightly sand any high spots/bumps on the tops of the ribs
> where it would come into contact with the fabric covering.
>
> Without the varnish, your ribs will most certainly warp due to changes
> in humidity.
>
> Ron
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 3
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 06:08:06 AM PST US
> From: "Randy Daughenbaugh" <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh"
> <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
>
> Hey Jay,
> Have you looked at the Garmin GPSmap 196. It's panel view screen has
> Altimeter, VSI and other cute things. I kind of like steam gages for
> basic
> info too, but I don't plan to put other VSI in.
>
> Maybe you have been in on discussions on this already, but...
>
> Randy
>
> .
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Fabian
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jay Fabian"
> <experimental208nd@comcast.net>
>
> Hi List,
>
> I am starting to do my annual , and it just so happens that my
> altimeters
> barometer does not work right now. The vent line is not clogged.
> I wanted to know if anyone has an instrument that might include ALT,
> RATE
> OF CLIMB, BARO, and maybe some more all in one, and what the cost would
> be?
>
> Thanks
> Jay Fabian
> 4-1200 912ul
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 4
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 06:38:04 AM PST US
> From: "flier" <FLIER@sbcglobal.net>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Varnishing Ribs
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "flier" <FLIER@sbcglobal.net>
>
> Definately use epoxy varnish as Jimmie noted.
>
> Before covering it's a good idea to scuff the tops of
> the capstrips with some sandpaper to provide tooth
> adhesion for the PolyTak or whatever adhesive process
> you're using.
>
> Regards,
>
> Ted
>
> --- Original Message ---
> From: "Ronald K. Stevens" <rkstevens@verizon.net>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Varnishing Ribs
>
> >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ronald K.
> Stevens" <rkstevens@verizon.net>
> >
> >Jimmie Blackwell wrote:
> >
> >>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie
> Blackwell" <jablackwell@ev1.net>
> >>
> >>Wanted to get your opinions on varnishing wing ribs
> and other wooden parts in the wing. I have quick
> build wings.
> >>
> >>How many coats of varnish? and is it necessary to
> sand between coats?
> >>
> >>Thanks
> >>Jimmie
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >Use 2-3 coats of epoxy varnish - not the 'regular'
> kind as the MEK used
> >in the covering process will melt & remove 'normal'
> varnishes. It's not
> >really necessary to sand in between coats. Though,
> it's sometimes
> >necessary to lightly sand any high spots/bumps on
> the tops of the ribs
> >where it would come into contact with the fabric
> covering.
> >
> >Without the varnish, your ribs will most certainly
> warp due to changes
> >in humidity.
> >
> >Ron
> >
> >
> >_-
> ======================================================
> ==================
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
> >_-
> ======================================================
> ==================
> >_-
> ======================================================
> ==================
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> list
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> >_-
> ======================================================
> ==================
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 5
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:05:41 AM PST US
> From: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
>
> I have the 196 and love it - the panel screen not only gives VSI etc it
> also
> has a turn and Bank which is a welcome addition. The screen is big and
> it is
> very user friendly
>
> Gary Algate
> Lite2/582
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> Hey Jay,
> Have you looked at the Garmin GPSmap 196. It's panel view screen has
> Altimeter, VSI and other cute things. I kind of like steam gages for
> basic
> info too, but I don't plan to put other VSI in.
> <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 6
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:26:29 AM PST US
> From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
> Hey, Jeff, If you are putting the stresses on your stick that can be
> put on
> your rudder/brake pedals, You need to check the friction in your
> slystem.
>
> Lowell
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> >
> >
> > I always worry that the Mig welded control column might be
> > welded by the same welder as the rudder pedals, so I want
> > the second stick in case the first breaks off ... :)
> >
> >
> > Original Message:
> > -----------------
> > From: michel michel@online.no
> > Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:43:20 +0100
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Kitfox-List: "Captive" PAX - WAS: Stick movement
> >
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: michel <michel@online.no>
> >
> > >--- Dave & Wendy Grosvenor <dwg@iafrica.com> wrote:
> > >I take it out when I'm flying alone or if I have a pax who
> > >doesn't want to do any flying.
> >
> > While I understand you, Dave, I feel that, if I should become ill
> while
> > flying
> > (I am 56) my passenger should get a fair chance to crash ... not
> > vertically.
> > As a matter of fact, I always explain the rudiment of the stick and
> the
> two
> > red lines (Vso and Vne) to all my passengers, prior to take-off. They
> > usually
> > enjoy it, feeling less "captive."
> > But I am a beginner and I'd like to hear old-timers' opinion on that
> one.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Michel
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 7
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:30:39 AM PST US
> From: "jeff.hays@aselia.com" <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
>
> Ok - That does it. Out with the IO-240 and in with a new IO-540
> add a little nitrous, and we'll see how fast my Kitfox can go!
> All this talk about speed. Feel like I tuned into the Lancair
> list by mistake ...
>
> How about a little talk about getting in and out of muddy fields,
> or various tundra tire options, etc. Stuff the plane was meant to
> do.
>
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: JMCBEAN JDMCBEAN@cableone.net
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "JMCBEAN" <JDMCBEAN@cableone.net>
>
> Paul,
> At the Sun-n-Fun Dash 100 the Series 6 (standard wing) was
> recorded
> by the
> officials at 119 kts (136.8 mph) Remember that most everyone has their
> props pitched for climb or a compromise.... Very few will pitch or for
> that
> matter prop for just the speed.
>
> Blue Skies!!
> John & Debra McBean
> "The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Paul
> Seehafer
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
>
> Hi Sid:
>
> But the Avid Speedwing has a sem-symmetrical airfoil that the Kitfox
> doesn't
> have the luxury of, plus was only 24 feet long verses the Kitfox wing of
> 29'+. So while I agree the Speedwing Avid was a little hotrod, we're
> not
> really comparing apples to apples.
>
> My purpose in asking the question about whether or not the Kitfox IV
> Speedster could really do 130-140 mph was to find out if anyone is
> actually
> doing it with their airplane. Apparently there are some owners that are
> doing numbers that are close, but I haven't heard of anyone actually
> attaining the numbers claimed by the writers and the factory (yet).
>
> Paul Seehafer
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "hausding, sid" <sidh@charter.net>
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "hausding, sid" <sidh@charter.net>
> >
> >
> > Paul, they get 120mph out of the Avid Speedwing with the 582 Rotax,
> sounds
> > like the Kitfox should get 130 behind the 912......if real clean and
> faired
> > out.
> > Sid
> > --------------
> >
> > Does anyone know if the Model IV 912ul Speedster really could cruise
> at
> 130
> > mph like they claimed it would?
> >
> > Previous questions about how to get more speed from our Kitfoxes made
> me
> > think about this. I have articles where independent aviation writers
> > claimed 125-140 mph speeds from the Speedster, verified by loran /
> gps.
> And
> > then there are other articles whereas the writers claimed to have
> verified
> > 110+ out of the long winged 912ul Model IV. Is this all hipe, or is
> it
> > really possible? Comments or opinions?
> >
> >
> > Paul Seehafer
> > Wisconsin
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 8
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:35:32 AM PST US
> From: "jeff.hays@aselia.com" <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed - Get RMI Microencoder
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
> http://www.rkymtn.com/rm00002.htm
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: Randy Daughenbaugh rjdaugh@rapidnet.com
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh"
> <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
>
> Hey Jay,
> Have you looked at the Garmin GPSmap 196. It's panel view screen has
> Altimeter, VSI and other cute things. I kind of like steam gages for
> basic
> info too, but I don't plan to put other VSI in.
>
> Maybe you have been in on discussions on this already, but...
>
> Randy
>
> .
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jay Fabian
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jay Fabian"
> <experimental208nd@comcast.net>
>
> Hi List,
>
> I am starting to do my annual , and it just so happens that my
> altimeters
> barometer does not work right now. The vent line is not clogged.
> I wanted to know if anyone has an instrument that might include ALT,
> RATE
> OF CLIMB, BARO, and maybe some more all in one, and what the cost would
> be?
>
> Thanks
> Jay Fabian
> 4-1200 912ul
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 9
> _____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:41:33 AM PST US
> From: "Rex" <rex@awarenest.com>
> Subject: re: Kitfox-List: Removing PTT button from Model 2 stick?
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex" <rex@awarenest.com>
>
> Hi Steve,
> It would depend of course on what adhesive was used to glue the grip. I
> have had
> some sucess removing motorcycle grips by working a thin screwdriver
> blade between
> the grip and handlebar. This is a mechanical means to break the bond.
> Perhaps
> a special tool could be made that would have a thin flexible blade with
> a handle. I have something similar which I think is a kitchen tool for
> spreading
> icing or such. It is too wide for this idea, but one could be made
> narrow
> and could work. If the glue is like motorcycle grip glue it can be
> nearly impossible
> to remove a grip without destroying it. Perhaps sharpening the end of
> the
> tool to cut the glue as you stab between the stick and grip. A little
> oil in
> there should help too. (WD-40?) too keep to tool and grip sticking
> together
> from friction.
> Good luck, I hope this gives you an idea that will help.
>
> Rex
> Colorado Springs
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 10
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:42:17 AM PST US
> From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
> Paul, I opted for the Speedster elevator when I purchased my kit. I
> used
> trim a lot while flying my C-170 and couldn't rationalize the flaperon
> trim
> in my mind. The whole empennage fairing think came about because I got
> the
> elevator with the tab cut out but didn't get the Full Speedster tail
> option - I was then leg\ft to figure it out on my own.
>
> The difference is speeds was determined by taking off with the trim tab
> in
> neutral and trimming for level cruise with flaperons, then neutralizing
> the
> flaperons and trimming with the trim tab.
>
> As I recall, the Speedster came with a fully faired and closed gap
> rudder,
> electric elevator trim. The wings shortened by one rib bay, lift strut
> fairings, faired jury strut and horizontal stabilizer struts, radiator
> shroud, smaller tires with wheel pants and a bit larger spinner.
>
> There was one on our Idaho trip last year, but since we generally fly
> at
> the speed of the slowest airplane, I can't speak as to its performance.
> Early on when he flew with us until he got used to our protocol, we
> always
> saw him disappear into the horizon in front of us and we would meet up
> at
> the destination airport.
>
> Lowell
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
> >
> > Hi Lowell:
> >
> > Thanks for the great info. But I'm curious, 5mph for flaperon trim?
> How
> > did you do that?
> >
> > Paul
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> >
> >
> > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
> <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> > >
> > > Not Really, Most of the fairings were added during construction.
> As I
> > > recall the hubcaps give about 2 mph and the trim tab - eliminating
> > flaperon
> > > trim - adds about 5
> > >
> > > Lowell
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "jareds" <jareds@verizon.net>
> > > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> > >
> > >
> > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: jareds <jareds@verizon.net>
> > > >
> > > > Lowell,
> > > >
> > > > Thats really impressive. There is hope for my model IV yet!
> > > > Wing strut,spinner, and some covering on the landing gear is all
> i've
> > > > put on so far with a 582.
> > > > I'm only at 90-95. I'll try some of these.
> > > > Did you test and evaulate which had the biggest effect?
> > > >
> > > > Lowell Fitt wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
> <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> > > > >
> > > > >Paul, I have a lot of drag reducing mods on my Model IV and it
> will
> > > easily
> > > > >cruise at 115 mph.
> > > > >
> > > > >The mods include Wing Strut fairings, jury strut and horizontal
> > > stabilizer
> > > > >strut fairings, internal wingtip nav lights, hubcaps, fully
> faired
> > rudder
> > > > >vertical stabilizer / rudder and horizontal stabilizer / elevator
> gaps
> > > and,
> > > > >according to recent posts, benefit from a 9-1/2" spinner. I do
> pay a
> > > drag
> > > > >penalty in the large 21X12X8 tires.
> > > > >
> > > > >Some of the mods can be seen on Sportflight:
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=view&epoch=104134
> 8095
> > > > >http://www.sportflight.com/uploads/tip6.jpg
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=view&epoch=107548
> 8689
> > > > >
> > > > >The last photo also shows the pod covering the video camera mount
> on
> > the
> > > > >left wing strut.
> > > > >
> > > > >Lowell
> > > > >
> > > > >----- Original Message -----
> > > > >From: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
> > > > >To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > > > >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer"
> <av8rps@tznet.com>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Hi Rick:
> > > > >>
> > > > >>I'm not trying to make a case against the slow speed of the
> design.
> > But
> > > I
> > > > >>do think anything we can do to make our airplanes faster makes
> them
> > not
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >only
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>more useful for cross country travel, but also more efficient.
> My
> > > initial
> > > > >>question about the Speedsters true cruise speed was really to
> find
> out
> > > if
> > > > >>the design fine tuned with only 80 hp could really be that fast?
> > > > >>
> > > > >>My Lake amphibian isn't a fast airplane either, but it sure is
> > > versatile.
> > > > >>And you wouldn't believe how envious some of my float plane
> buddies
> > are
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >that
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>fly around at under 100 mph when I can breeze by them 30+ mph
> faster
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >burning
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>less fuel. And as we all know, the longer the trip, the more
> benefit
> > we
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >see
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>from any increase in speed.
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Given my druthers, Kitfoxes would go 200 knots. But we know
> that
> will
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >never
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>happen. However, if we can get 120+ mph out of our planes it
> will
> > make
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >all
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>the difference between it being used as a local puddle jumper,
> or an
> > > > >>effective and efficient cross country cruiser.
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Paul
> > > > >>
> > > > >>----- Original Message -----
> > > > >>From: <RGray67968@aol.com>
> > > > >>To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > > > >>Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: RGray67968@aol.com
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>Hi Gang,
> > > > >>>Just curious.....why are all you folks worrying about 'how
> fast'
> your
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>Kitfox
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>will go? If you want to go 'fast' then why are you flying
> Kitfoxes?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>Kitfoxes
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>are great little airplanes to tool around the sky and enjoy the
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >afternoon.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>>Nothing more fun than buzzing around checking out the sites and
> even
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>enjoying an
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>occasional X-country in your Kitfox. If you want to go
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>'fast'....sorry....but
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>you guys are flying the wrong airplane. Enjoy your Kitfox for
> what
> it
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >is.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>Just
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>my opinion and worth what you paid for it.....smile.
> > > > >>>Rick Gray in Ohio at the Buffalo Farm - RV6 w 280+ hours -
> former
> > > Kitfox
> > > > >>>owner (and loved every 115 mph flight in my little Kitfox)
> > > > >>>Oh yea......and you guys need to do a LOT better job with the
> do
> not
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>archive
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>- ever search a topic looking for something??? No fun weeding
> through
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >all
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>the
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>'junk' to get what you want.
> > > > >>>do not archive this either :
> > > > >>>)
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>Paul, they get 120mph out of the Avid Speedwing with the 582
> Rotax,
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >sounds
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>>like the Kitfox should get 130 behind the 912......if real
> clean
> and
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>faired
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>out.
> > > > >>>Sid
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>Does anyone know if the Model IV 912ul Speedster really could
> cruise
> > at
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>130
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>mph like they claimed it would?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>Previous questions about how to get more speed from our
> Kitfoxes
> made
> > > me
> > > > >>>think about this. I have articles where independent aviation
> writers
> > > > >>>claimed 125-140 mph speeds from the Speedster, verified by
> loran /
> > gps.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>And
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>then there are other articles whereas the writers claimed to
> have
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >verified
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>>110+ out of the long winged 912ul Model IV. Is this all hipe,
> or
> is
> > it
> > > > >>>really possible? Comments or opinions?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>Paul Seehafer
> > > > >>>Wisconsin
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 11
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 08:15:23 AM PST US
> From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
> <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>
> I love this thread on cruise speeds. I've done a lot of work on mine,
> including "faired gas caps" that gives my S5 a fairly respectable 2up
> 110mph indicated at less than 4gph with 100hp NSI/CAP at about 22 inches
> mp. I can push it a lot faster, but the fuel use goes up just as fast
> so
> I've found that 3900rpm and 22 inches gives me best economy with good
> cruise. I live on a farm with a short farm strip (with obstacles) that
> requires a careful and accurate approach to get in on the first try and
> the
> interesting thing is that this heavy S5 will get in and out just about
> as
> short as my previous lightweight model II did with a 582. By adding
> fairing material to various places and paying attention to aerodynamic
> details I have a fairly decent cross country cruiser while still keeping
> my
> "bush plane" traits. When I have time I've got some ideas to clean it
> up
> even more. The way I figure it, the cleaner it is the more efficient it
> is
> which results in more speed and better fuel economy. This in no way
> inhibits my ability to pull it back to 85 and cruise around watching
> ladies
> in their hot tubs.
> Ok, that being said, has anybody found a way to clean up the fuselage
> strut
> attach points with a fairing that is removable? This is a fairly draggy
> area and could be worth a knot or two.
> For what it's worth.
> Darrel
>
> > At the Sun-n-Fun Dash 100 the Series 6 (standard wing) was
> recorded by the
> > officials at 119 kts (136.8 mph) Remember that most everyone has
> their
> > props pitched for climb or a compromise.... Very few will pitch or for
> that
> > matter prop for just the speed.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 12
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 08:25:27 AM PST US
> From: "jeff.hays@aselia.com" <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
>
> Hey Lowell -
>
> This I was making a more tongue in cheek comment, about Mig
> welding for building aircraft, than as a serious comment about
> the control column.
>
> However - Since the subject is here. That control column is
> not that well designed, and does indeed flex quite a bit. My system
> is very friction free, but when you put some heavy airloads on
> it - For example slow flight with flaperons deployed, etc. There
> is a noticeable amount of flex in the system.
>
> The way the column makes a U-Channel on the pilots side, where the
> aileron axis pivot bolt goes through, the steel is simply too
> thin. It forms a sort of rectangle with one end u-shaped (bottom),
> and with no means of diagonal support naturally flexes. It's a poor
> design, which could have been done much simpler, and stronger.
>
> One day if I get ambitious I might rip it out, and stiffen it. But
> for now, my wife's list of things I need to do - After 3 years of
> airplane construction induced home neglect, has the priority.
>
> Cheers,
> Jeff
>
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: Lowell Fitt lcfitt@inreach.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
> Hey, Jeff, If you are putting the stresses on your stick that can be
> put on
> your rudder/brake pedals, You need to check the friction in your
> slystem.
>
> Lowell
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> >
> >
> > I always worry that the Mig welded control column might be
> > welded by the same welder as the rudder pedals, so I want
> > the second stick in case the first breaks off ... :)
> >
> >
> > Original Message:
> > -----------------
> > From: michel michel@online.no
> > Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:43:20 +0100
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Kitfox-List: "Captive" PAX - WAS: Stick movement
> >
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: michel <michel@online.no>
> >
> > >--- Dave & Wendy Grosvenor <dwg@iafrica.com> wrote:
> > >I take it out when I'm flying alone or if I have a pax who
> > >doesn't want to do any flying.
> >
> > While I understand you, Dave, I feel that, if I should become ill
> while
> > flying
> > (I am 56) my passenger should get a fair chance to crash ... not
> > vertically.
> > As a matter of fact, I always explain the rudiment of the stick and
> the
> two
> > red lines (Vso and Vne) to all my passengers, prior to take-off. They
> > usually
> > enjoy it, feeling less "captive."
> > But I am a beginner and I'd like to hear old-timers' opinion on that
> one.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Michel
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 13
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 08:52:14 AM PST US
> From: "JMCBEAN" <JDMCBEAN@cableone.net>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "JMCBEAN" <JDMCBEAN@cableone.net>
>
> Jeff,
> I've said it before... I'll race any Lancair with my fox......
> I get to
> pick where the race ends. :) Oh, and part of the rules... One has to be
> able to fly the aircraft away from wherever the finish line is.
>
> Nitrous and a 540... Lets just go turbine.. or jet... we already have
> variable geometry wings...... push the throttles past the stops, sweep
> the
> wings and lets rock..... Maybe when we push the throttles forward the
> wings
> will sweep back for us ???
>
> Blue Skies!!
> John & Debra McBean
> "The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
> jeff.hays@aselia.com
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
>
> Ok - That does it. Out with the IO-240 and in with a new IO-540
> add a little nitrous, and we'll see how fast my Kitfox can go!
> All this talk about speed. Feel like I tuned into the Lancair
> list by mistake ...
>
> How about a little talk about getting in and out of muddy fields,
> or various tundra tire options, etc. Stuff the plane was meant to
> do.
>
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: JMCBEAN JDMCBEAN@cableone.net
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "JMCBEAN" <JDMCBEAN@cableone.net>
>
> Paul,
> At the Sun-n-Fun Dash 100 the Series 6 (standard wing) was
> recorded
> by the
> officials at 119 kts (136.8 mph) Remember that most everyone has their
> props pitched for climb or a compromise.... Very few will pitch or for
> that
> matter prop for just the speed.
>
> Blue Skies!!
> John & Debra McBean
> "The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Paul
> Seehafer
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
>
> Hi Sid:
>
> But the Avid Speedwing has a sem-symmetrical airfoil that the Kitfox
> doesn't
> have the luxury of, plus was only 24 feet long verses the Kitfox wing of
> 29'+. So while I agree the Speedwing Avid was a little hotrod, we're
> not
> really comparing apples to apples.
>
> My purpose in asking the question about whether or not the Kitfox IV
> Speedster could really do 130-140 mph was to find out if anyone is
> actually
> doing it with their airplane. Apparently there are some owners that are
> doing numbers that are close, but I haven't heard of anyone actually
> attaining the numbers claimed by the writers and the factory (yet).
>
> Paul Seehafer
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "hausding, sid" <sidh@charter.net>
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "hausding, sid" <sidh@charter.net>
> >
> >
> > Paul, they get 120mph out of the Avid Speedwing with the 582 Rotax,
> sounds
> > like the Kitfox should get 130 behind the 912......if real clean and
> faired
> > out.
> > Sid
> > --------------
> >
> > Does anyone know if the Model IV 912ul Speedster really could cruise
> at
> 130
> > mph like they claimed it would?
> >
> > Previous questions about how to get more speed from our Kitfoxes made
> me
> > think about this. I have articles where independent aviation writers
> > claimed 125-140 mph speeds from the Speedster, verified by loran /
> gps.
> And
> > then there are other articles whereas the writers claimed to have
> verified
> > 110+ out of the long winged 912ul Model IV. Is this all hipe, or is
> it
> > really possible? Comments or opinions?
> >
> >
> > Paul Seehafer
> > Wisconsin
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 14
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 09:03:40 AM PST US
> From: "jeff.hays@aselia.com" <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
>
> Time spent "in" the hot tub with the ladies, is better than
> time wasted fairing gas caps ... :)
>
> Jeff
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: Fox5flyer morid@northland.lib.mi.us
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
> <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>
> I love this thread on cruise speeds. I've done a lot of work on mine,
> including "faired gas caps" that gives my S5 a fairly respectable 2up
> 110mph indicated at less than 4gph with 100hp NSI/CAP at about 22 inches
> mp. I can push it a lot faster, but the fuel use goes up just as fast
> so
> I've found that 3900rpm and 22 inches gives me best economy with good
> cruise. I live on a farm with a short farm strip (with obstacles) that
> requires a careful and accurate approach to get in on the first try and
> the
> interesting thing is that this heavy S5 will get in and out just about
> as
> short as my previous lightweight model II did with a 582. By adding
> fairing material to various places and paying attention to aerodynamic
> details I have a fairly decent cross country cruiser while still keeping
> my
> "bush plane" traits. When I have time I've got some ideas to clean it
> up
> even more. The way I figure it, the cleaner it is the more efficient it
> is
> which results in more speed and better fuel economy. This in no way
> inhibits my ability to pull it back to 85 and cruise around watching
> ladies
> in their hot tubs.
> Ok, that being said, has anybody found a way to clean up the fuselage
> strut
> attach points with a fairing that is removable? This is a fairly draggy
> area and could be worth a knot or two.
> For what it's worth.
> Darrel
>
> > At the Sun-n-Fun Dash 100 the Series 6 (standard wing) was
> recorded by the
> > officials at 119 kts (136.8 mph) Remember that most everyone has
> their
> > props pitched for climb or a compromise.... Very few will pitch or for
> that
> > matter prop for just the speed.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 15
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 09:24:26 AM PST US
> From: "Lines, John" <JLines@phelpsdodge.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lines, John"
> <JLines@phelpsdodge.com>
>
> That could be very debatable...and it would / could be a more
> interesting
> thread than some other's of late
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jeff.hays@aselia.com [mailto:jeff.hays@aselia.com]
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
>
> Time spent "in" the hot tub with the ladies, is better than
> time wasted fairing gas caps ... :)
>
> Jeff
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: Fox5flyer morid@northland.lib.mi.us
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
> <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>
> I love this thread on cruise speeds. I've done a lot of work on mine,
> including "faired gas caps" that gives my S5 a fairly respectable 2up
> 110mph indicated at less than 4gph with 100hp NSI/CAP at about 22 inches
> mp. I can push it a lot faster, but the fuel use goes up just as fast
> so
> I've found that 3900rpm and 22 inches gives me best economy with good
> cruise. I live on a farm with a short farm strip (with obstacles) that
> requires a careful and accurate approach to get in on the first try and
> the
> interesting thing is that this heavy S5 will get in and out just about
> as
> short as my previous lightweight model II did with a 582. By adding
> fairing material to various places and paying attention to aerodynamic
> details I have a fairly decent cross country cruiser while still keeping
> my
> "bush plane" traits. When I have time I've got some ideas to clean it
> up
> even more. The way I figure it, the cleaner it is the more efficient it
> is
> which results in more speed and better fuel economy. This in no way
> inhibits my ability to pull it back to 85 and cruise around watching
> ladies
> in their hot tubs.
> Ok, that being said, has anybody found a way to clean up the fuselage
> strut
> attach points with a fairing that is removable? This is a fairly draggy
> area and could be worth a knot or two.
> For what it's worth.
> Darrel
>
> > At the Sun-n-Fun Dash 100 the Series 6 (standard wing) was
> recorded by the
> > officials at 119 kts (136.8 mph) Remember that most everyone has
> their
> > props pitched for climb or a compromise.... Very few will pitch or for
> that
> > matter prop for just the speed.
>
>
> This message (including attachments) is for the designated recipient
> only and may
> contain privileged, proprietary, or otherwise confidential information.
> If
> you are not the intended recipient or have received this message in
> error, please
> notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use of
> this
> e-mail is prohibited.
>
> Este mensaje (incluyendo los archivos adjuntos) est dirigido slo al
> receptor sealado
> y puede contener informacin de carcter privilegiada, privada o
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> Si usted no es el receptor sealado o bien ha recibido este mensaje por
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> por favor notifique inmediatamente al remitente y elimine el mensaje
> original.
> Cualquier otro uso de este mensaje de correo electrnico est prohibido.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 16
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 09:38:49 AM PST US
> From: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>
> Darrel,
>
> I had to copy your e-mail on improved efficiency for
> my archives. You are showing what can be done with
> real good results. Thanks.
>
> A long time ago I used to fly CH-53 helicopters.
> Cruise speed was 150 kts and max speed 170 kts. But
> we could beat an F-4 to 10,000' from a standing
> start...using less fuel...carrying a bigger load...
> :-) Now that is real apples and oranges. Hehe
>
> Kurt S.
>
> __________________________________
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 17
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 10:28:50 AM PST US
> From: "martin dovey" <kitfox.england@ntlworld.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "martin dovey"
> <kitfox.england@ntlworld.com>
>
> Yes but when you are "in" the hot tub with the ladies you still
> have to take basic aerodynamics in to acount,
>
> Lift, Weight, Drag & Thrust!
>
> Martin Dovey
>
> do not archive
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
> > Time spent "in" the hot tub with the ladies, is better than
> > time wasted fairing gas caps ... :)
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 18
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 12:24:20 PM PST US
> From: Scott McClintock <scott_mcclintock@dot.state.ak.us>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Removing PTT button from Model 2 stick?
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock
> <scott_mcclintock@dot.state.ak.us>
>
> Steve,
> I owned several motorcycle/ATV businesses over the years.
> You need to use a thin, long tube attached to a air blower and use
> compressed air.
> Work the end of the tube around the grip as you push it in.This is the
> ONLY way
> to remove those grips. If you do it right, the grip will be usable.
> Remove the old glue with alcohol or paint thinner.
> When you re-install, don't use any glue. A little old spit (or soap)
> will get it
> back on then use a wrap
> of safety wire to secure.
> Scott in Nome
>
>
> Rex wrote:
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex" <rex@awarenest.com>
> >
> > Hi Steve,
> > It would depend of course on what adhesive was used to glue the grip.
> I have
> had some sucess removing motorcycle grips by working a thin screwdriver
> blade
> between the grip and handlebar. This is a mechanical means to break the
> bond.
> Perhaps a special tool could be made that would have a thin flexible
> blade with
> a handle. I have something similar which I think is a kitchen tool for
> spreading
> icing or such. It is too wide for this idea, but one could be made
> narrow
> and could work. If the glue is like motorcycle grip glue it can be
> nearly impossible
> to remove a grip without destroying it. Perhaps sharpening the end of
> the tool to cut the glue as you stab between the stick and grip. A
> little oil
> in there should help too. (WD-40?) too keep to tool and grip sticking
> together
> from friction.
> > Good luck, I hope this gives you an idea that will help.
> >
> > Rex
> > Colorado Springs
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 19
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 01:17:48 PM PST US
> From: "dsherburn" <dsherburn@charter.net>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dsherburn" <dsherburn@charter.net>
>
> Gary,
> Is the screen "update" rate fast enough for the
> turn and bank/HSI etc to work well?
> ds
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Altimeter needed
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate"
> <algate@attglobal.net>
> >
> > I have the 196 and love it - the panel screen not only gives VSI etc
> it
> also
> > has a turn and Bank which is a welcome addition. The screen is big and
> it
> is
> > very user friendly
> >
> > Gary Algate
> > Lite2/582
> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > Hey Jay,
> > Have you looked at the Garmin GPSmap 196. It's panel view screen has
> > Altimeter, VSI and other cute things. I kind of like steam gages for
> basic
> > info too, but I don't plan to put other VSI in.
> > <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 20
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 02:04:28 PM PST US
> From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
> Jeff, - can't remember the V design, but the IV is pretty stiff there.
> Working the pilot's stick against the passenger's gives me no movement,
> flex or slop. I did put in bronze bushings at the stick pivot to
> eliminate
> the effects of the tapered reamers there, though.
>
> Lowell
>
> do not archive
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> >
> >
> > Hey Lowell -
> >
> > This I was making a more tongue in cheek comment, about Mig
> > welding for building aircraft, than as a serious comment about
> > the control column.
> >
> > However - Since the subject is here. That control column is
> > not that well designed, and does indeed flex quite a bit. My system
> > is very friction free, but when you put some heavy airloads on
> > it - For example slow flight with flaperons deployed, etc. There
> > is a noticeable amount of flex in the system.
> >
> > The way the column makes a U-Channel on the pilots side, where the
> > aileron axis pivot bolt goes through, the steel is simply too
> > thin. It forms a sort of rectangle with one end u-shaped (bottom),
> > and with no means of diagonal support naturally flexes. It's a poor
> > design, which could have been done much simpler, and stronger.
> >
> > One day if I get ambitious I might rip it out, and stiffen it. But
> > for now, my wife's list of things I need to do - After 3 years of
> > airplane construction induced home neglect, has the priority.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Jeff
> >
> >
> > Original Message:
> > -----------------
> > From: Lowell Fitt lcfitt@inreach.com
> > Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 07:23:10 -0800
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
> >
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> >
> > Hey, Jeff, If you are putting the stresses on your stick that can be
> put
> on
> > your rudder/brake pedals, You need to check the friction in your
> slystem.
> >
> > Lowell
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX - WAS: Stick movement
> >
> >
> > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> > <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
> > >
> > >
> > > I always worry that the Mig welded control column might be
> > > welded by the same welder as the rudder pedals, so I want
> > > the second stick in case the first breaks off ... :)
> > >
> > >
> > > Original Message:
> > > -----------------
> > > From: michel michel@online.no
> > > Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 21:43:20 +0100
> > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > > Subject: Kitfox-List: "Captive" PAX - WAS: Stick movement
> > >
> > >
> > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: michel <michel@online.no>
> > >
> > > >--- Dave & Wendy Grosvenor <dwg@iafrica.com> wrote:
> > > >I take it out when I'm flying alone or if I have a pax who
> > > >doesn't want to do any flying.
> > >
> > > While I understand you, Dave, I feel that, if I should become ill
> while
> > > flying
> > > (I am 56) my passenger should get a fair chance to crash ... not
> > > vertically.
> > > As a matter of fact, I always explain the rudiment of the stick and
> the
> > two
> > > red lines (Vso and Vne) to all my passengers, prior to take-off.
> They
> > > usually
> > > enjoy it, feeling less "captive."
> > > But I am a beginner and I'd like to hear old-timers' opinion on that
> one.
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > > Michel
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 21
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 02:10:36 PM PST US
> From: Matt Keyes <keyesmp@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Michel, Jabi 2200,was Rotax 582 Engine
> problems
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Matt Keyes <keyesmp@yahoo.com>
>
> Michel,
>
> I believe Kitplanes Magazine did a series of articles on a Kitfox/Jabiru
> 2200 installation.
> You can find them on the web if not at the news stand. May be of
> interest to you in deciding on engines.
>
> Matt
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 22
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 02:11:39 PM PST US
> From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
> <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
> >
> > I love this thread on cruise speeds. I've done a lot of work on mine,
> > including "faired gas caps" that gives my S5 a fairly respectable 2up
> > 110mph indicated at less than 4gph...
>
> Darrel, This is a good point. In our first Idaho trip as a group I
> used
> 7.7 gallons in the three hour flight from Cameron Park to Winnemucca,
> NV. I
> still hear about that one. And in all subsequent trips, when the others
> top
> off the tanks, I will need about 70% of what the others use.
>
> I expect in another 6 months or so, I will be able to afford the
> aforementioned "Hot Tub" with the fuel savings alone.
>
> Lowell
> .
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 23
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 02:49:59 PM PST US
> From: "Victor Marsh" <vmarsh@ib4e.biz>
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Classic IV
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Victor Marsh" <vmarsh@ib4e.biz>
>
> Is there anyone in the Stockton CA, area with a classic IV that I can
> catch a ride with. I am nearing completion of my project. I have
> time in an Avid Flyer, but my insurance carrier wants me to have time
> in make and model etc...
>
> Thanks.
>
> Please contact me at vmarsh@ib4e.biz
>
> do not archive.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 24
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 03:08:32 PM PST US
> From: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
> Installation
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
>
> Hello List,
>
> I am installing the fiberglass dash cover on my
> Classic IV and have a question. The manual says to
> drill 10 holes to fasten the cover to the windshield.
> If I position the cover level with the fuselage, the
> holes through the windshield to fasten it will have to
> be above the edge of the top cowling. Are they
> supposed to be?
>
> Grant Fluent
> Newcastle, NE
> Classic IV 912S
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 25
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 05:26:44 PM PST US
> From: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
> Subject: Kitfox-List: "Captive" PAX - WAS: Stick movement
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
>
>
> >(I am 56) my passenger should get a fair chance to crash ... not
> vertically.
>
> >I always worry that the Mig welded control column might be
> >welded by the same welder as the rudder pedals, so I want
> >the second stick in case the first breaks off ... :)
>
> You guys have your probabilities all mixed up. You are a lot more
> likely to have the passenger's knees interfering with your operation
> of the controls than to become incapacitated or have the stick break
> off in your hand.
>
> Mike G.
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 26
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 05:47:49 PM PST US
> From: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Captive PAX/ Stick movement
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>
> I wish we had a center stick option with dual
> throttles. That would eliminate some weight,
> interference and slop. Push to talk would have to be
> somewhere else though. Kind'a crowded to install in
> the middle too I know.
>
> Anyone hear of someone doing this on a KF or Avid?
>
> Kurt S.
>
> __________________________________
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 27
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 06:11:29 PM PST US
> From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash
> Cover) Installation
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
> Grant, Mine are just below the raised lip, so out of sight. I don't
> think
> you would want them above the cowl. I have never seen one that way.
>
> Lowell
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Grant Fluent" <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
> Installation
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
> >
> > Hello List,
> >
> > I am installing the fiberglass dash cover on my
> > Classic IV and have a question. The manual says to
> > drill 10 holes to fasten the cover to the windshield.
> > If I position the cover level with the fuselage, the
> > holes through the windshield to fasten it will have to
> > be above the edge of the top cowling. Are they
> > supposed to be?
> >
> > Grant Fluent
> > Newcastle, NE
> > Classic IV 912S
> >
> >
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 28
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 06:21:20 PM PST US
> From: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash
> Cover) Installation
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>
> Like Lowell says, below the cowl lip. I was able to
> align mine to be about straight back from the cowl so
> that, if the cowl lip and windscreen weren't there, it
> would form a straight line cowl top to panel cover
> top. That made the cover's bottom sides just barely
> forward of the panel corners. The way you dress the
> cover lip out can help if you need an extention. You
> need something there to blunt that edge anyway.
>
> Kurt S. S-5
>
> --- Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent
> > <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
> >
> > Hello List,
> >
> > I am installing the fiberglass dash cover on my
> > Classic IV and have a question. The manual says to
> > drill 10 holes to fasten the cover to the
> > windshield.
> > If I position the cover level with the fuselage, the
> > holes through the windshield to fasten it will have
> > to
> > be above the edge of the top cowling. Are they
> > supposed to be?
> >
> > Grant Fluent
> > Newcastle, NE
> > Classic IV 912S
>
> __________________________________
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 29
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 06:26:11 PM PST US
> From: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Kitfox-List: RE: NSI/CAP prop cruising
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>
> Rick and others with the NSI turbo and CAP props,
>
> How do you set your cruise? Pitch to full course,
> throttle back, then lean? Some intermediate pitch
> setting? Leave the throttle max, as Lance says?
>
> What cruise FF do you get and at what speed?
>
> Kurt S. S-5/NSI Turbo
>
> __________________________________
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 30
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:22:07 PM PST US
> From: "Rick" <turboflyer@comcast.net>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: RE: NSI/CAP prop cruising
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rick" <turboflyer@comcast.net>
>
> It seems like its been years but as I recall I set climb on the ground
> at
> run up by appx. pitch, full power full rich , pitch for 5200 RPMs, as
> she
> climbs and gains speed, back off the throttle in steps to maintain 5200
> if
> needed depending on the day and altitude, and then at cruise altitude
> pull
> back the throttle to give me about 4600 then pitch full to about 3600.
> Of
> course if I am going to climb for any real altitude like 10K plus I will
> go
> to a 4800 RPM setting and lean back as needed to altitude. Once there
> back
> to full throttle and full pitch. Guess there are so many ways to do it
> and
> again slow flight is a different matter as well. I like to keep the
> engine
> RPMs at or above 3600 which seem a fair trade for torque and HP at
> cruise
> and put along about 110mph indicated on 5.5GPH. Hope to do better with
> the
> new engine.
> BTW I spoke with Darrell at warp. said they shoot for tip speed of
> 850FPS.
> So if I like the 5200 engine speed and do a 2:1 reduction that will
> yield a
> 816FPS. May go 1.9 for 860 tip speed. I can always fudge up a bit on
> RPMs
> if needed. He says we are running the warp props to slow for best
> performance. So the math looks like this:
> 5200/2:1=2600X72=187200/229.183=816FPS
>
> Rick
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of kurt
> schrader
> Subject: Kitfox-List: RE: NSI/CAP prop cruising
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>
> Rick and others with the NSI turbo and CAP props,
>
> How do you set your cruise? Pitch to full course,
> throttle back, then lean? Some intermediate pitch
> setting? Leave the throttle max, as Lance says?
>
> What cruise FF do you get and at what speed?
>
> Kurt S. S-5/NSI Turbo
>
> __________________________________
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 31
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 07:38:21 PM PST US
> From: Ceashman@aol.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash
> Cover) Installation
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ceashman@aol.com
>
> Hello Grant.
>
> I put together a Classic IV.
> That windshield, top instrument cowling and the top engine cowling is a
> real
> pain.
> Be careful, if you have cut, drilled and installed the full engine
> cowling in
> relationship to the engine you have installed. That is a done thing
> (very
> difficult to make adjustments to the cowling after this).
> If this is the case, I would say that, first install the windshield,
> having
> cut the windshield to SkyStar specs. and cleco in place on roof (butt
> ribs).
> And then down the side posts
> Now place the instrument glare panel, rear end resting on the positioned
>
> aluminum instrument panel. And slide the fiberglass glare panel foreword
> until
> the
> bottom of the flange is in line with the bottom edge of the windshield.
> This
> should make for a pleasant profile of the glare panel
> If the back edge of the top engine cowling (where it flutes up) is below
> the
> holes (finally Phillips screws) then I think the cowlings are set too
> low on
> the fuselage!!.
>
> The other thing could be that the windshield could be flexed back a
> little
> more. (If you haven't already drilled the holes in the sides). This
> should bring
>
> the screw holes down a little.
>
> My 10 windshield screws are slightly lower than the flute of the top
> engine
> cowl (just about). I would have preferred to have a little more space
> there!
> But it is very tricky and I spent hours on this area.
>
> If you go to the recent builder completion's at the SkyStar site,
> (Ashman.
> Blue and red) you will see my window. I have placed a white rubber "P"
> weather
>
> strip to the windshield. I had a little rain come in one day.
> I hope this helps. Eric Ashman. Atlanta
>
> e-mail; ceashman@aol.com
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 32
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 08:03:03 PM PST US
> From: Dcecil3@aol.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Sky Star
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Dcecil3@aol.com
>
> I can only speculate as to whats going on at Sky Star but I'm kinda
> nervous .
> I can't contact them any other way than by phone and then its hard to
> get an
> answer on anything .the last time I ordered parts was in October and
> they just
>
> about brought them here ! I thought "What Service!" now I can't get them
> to
> do anything? This , and a dedicated Employee leaveing? well one can only
> guess
>
> employees off , it attracts them course this is only my opinion but it
> don't
> take much to read between the lines
> Best David Cecil
> KF950
> Do not archive
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 33
> ____________________________________
>
>
> Time: 08:15:02 PM PST US
> From: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash
> Cover) Installation
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
>
> Thanks Lowell, Kurt and Eric.
>
> From reading your responses, I think I've got
> something drastically wrong here. The bottom lip on
> the dash cover is 1" above the bottom lip on the
> windscreen. Eric, you may be right, I may have the
> cowlings mounted too low. At most I could only gain
> 1/2" though if I were to epoxy the holes shut and
> start over moving the lower cowling up. The
> windscreen seems very close to the x-brace tubing in
> the front. By that I mean you can just get your
> fingers between the tubes and the windscreen. It had
> to be positioned like that because the top cowling was
> such a tight fit against it. Any ideas or suggestions?
>
> Grant Fluent
> Newcastle, NE
> Classic IV 912S
>
>
> ==
> ==
> ==
> ==
>
>
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | Re: Heating problem |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: jareds <jareds@verizon.net>
Making sure the 50/50 coolant water is correct, goes without saying but
if that isn't ratio'd the gelling will have the same effect! Mine just
ended up being a pesky air bubble.I feel your pain. Don Smithe helped
me work through it when i was experiencing the problems.
Good luck!
Jared
Gary Algate wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
>
>
>Gary Algate
>President
>SDS Digger Tools Canada Inc
>Ph. +1 (705) 670-8459
>Fax +1 (705) 670-9591
>Cell +1 (705) 688-2236
>
>
>Hello Ted
>
>The more I think about it the more your response, and the others that concur
>with you, makes sense. Maybe I was just fixated on the thermostat and not
>looking at all of the evidence.
>
>I am going to take a sample from my coolant system and store it outside so
>that I can see what it looks like as the temperature drops.
>
>When you think about the pre-heat would condition the engine block and
>gearbox but would have little or no effect on the exposed rad or heater
>core. Once the engine was started and I had finished examining the
>thermostat etc the heat may well have soaked into the coolant fluid and
>dissolved any gelled or frozen areas.
>
>
>Best regards
>
>Gary
>
>
>Have you checked the freezing point of you anti freeze??
>Sounds to me like you are freezing/gelling the rad at those cold temps and
>that is why you temps spike so high once you start the engine --- no
>circulation. Just a thought
>
>Ted
>Edmonton, Ab
><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
>
><<<<SNIP>>>>
>
>
>
>
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | Re: RE: NSI/CAP prop rpm |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
Aha, you have one of these modern thing...
A "freewheeling" propeller.
Wish I had such a "device", but -, the expenses ... :) ..
I'll think the others are right, about the spark plug.
Cheers
Torgeir.
kurt schrader wrote:
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>
> You might be right about the phase relationships
> Torgier. Unfortunately there is a clutch involved, so
> the relationship is always changing every time it goes
> to low rpm or on restart.
>
> My engine was smooth as silk when I got it, but after
> just a few hours of running it unloaded, (no prop)
> during construction, it got rougher running. The prop
> is not perfect either. A bit out of track. Neither
> situation is bad at all, but it could be smoother.
>
> Kurt S.
>
> --- Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no> wrote:
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen
> > <torgemor@online.no>
> >
> > Hi Kurt,
> >
> > The harmonic oscillation "may" be related to the
> > "phase" between the
> > crank and the prop. mounting. Try changing this by
> > installing the prop.
> > into "next" possible mounting position. Sometimes
> > rare resonant problem
> > occur in crank/propeller phase relation. Just a
> > thought.. And, I have
> > no experience with your setup..
> >
> > Torgeir.
> >
> > kurt schrader wrote:
> > >
> > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> > <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> > >
> > > Ok, I finally found the list of ratios. This
> > manual
> > > is at least 4 years old though. There are 16
> > > different ratios available from NSI ranging from
> > 1.622
> > > to 3.409:1. Ron, your 2.129 is listed and also
> > 2.031
> > > and 1.939 for being close to 2:1. With all Rick's
> > > power, he could even go for the 1.939 and do well
> > too.
> > >
> > > My engine shakes a bit when I load it up with too
> > much
> > > prop. Much more testing to do, but cruise is not
> > good
> > > in the lower 3000 range unless you have the power
> > back
> > > too. Around 3900 is about best for my engine for
> > > smoothness. I would like to run the engine a bit
> > > slower and the prop faster too, if it could be
> > smooth.
> > > Mine does go into and out of harmonics in some
> > > places.
> > >
> > > Interesting subject.
> > >
> > > Kurt S.
>
> __________________________________
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
Message 26
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| Subject: | Apolgies to the list + Mig Welding correction |
PRIORITY_NO_NAME
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com" <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
All -
First off - Apologies to anybody that finds any of my posts to
this list in any way offensive. It is not my intent to do so, I
simply have my opinion's, right or wrong, and I'm not shy about
telling what I think. This is in response to a couple emails I
got from list members, who don't appreciate my comments.
In any case - I'm not going to NOT say what I think in the future,
but I would just suggest that in the future, for those list member's
who don't like me so much, just simply filter your mail. After all
this is an open forum for sharing opinions on all sides.
In any case - About Mig Welding - I got an email from Skystar to correct
me about Mig welding. The letter specifically states that the rudder
pedal assemblies, and control column assemblies are Tig welded. That
they do use Mig welding, but not for these parts. So to Skystar I
apologize for my comment about Mig welding.
Jeff Hays
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Apolgies to the list + Mig Welding correction |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "flier" <FLIER@sbcglobal.net>
Jeff,
After I saw this I went back to see the origin. You
can have your opinion just like everyone else of
course.
Personally, after seeing a lot of projects, as well
as the number of unbuilt RVs setting around, I
consider the Kitfox to be a great kit. I personally
didn't have to rework much of anything except what I
didn't like that I did.
Not sure why you question the sticks??? You'd likely
break those aluminum tubes before you messed up the
pivot assy. Long before that happens, the lift
struts will have broken and you'll have worse worries.
Anyway, I'll bet the bulk of us consider the Kitfox
to be pretty darned good kits given the build time
required and the desired use...
Regards,
Ted
--- Original Message ---
From: "jeff.hays@aselia.com" <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Apolgies to the list + Mig
Welding correction
>--> Kitfox-List message posted
by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com" <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
>
>All -
>
>First off - Apologies to anybody that finds any of
my posts to
>this list in any way offensive. It is not my intent
to do so, I
>simply have my opinion's, right or wrong, and I'm
not shy about
>telling what I think. This is in response to a
couple emails I
>got from list members, who don't appreciate my
comments.
>
>In any case - I'm not going to NOT say what I think
in the future,
>but I would just suggest that in the future, for
those list member's
>who don't like me so much, just simply filter your
mail. After all
>this is an open forum for sharing opinions on all
sides.
>
>In any case - About Mig Welding - I got an email
from Skystar to correct
>me about Mig welding. The letter specifically states
that the rudder
>pedal assemblies, and control column assemblies are
Tig welded. That
>they do use Mig welding, but not for these parts. So
to Skystar I
>apologize for my comment about Mig welding.
>
>Jeff Hays
>
>
>_-
======================================================
==================
Contributions
any other
Forums.
>_-
======================================================
==================
>_-
======================================================
==================
http://www.matronics.com/subscription
http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
http://www.matronics.com/browse/kitfox-list
http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list
http://www.matronics.com/archives
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
list
http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>_-
======================================================
==================
>
>
Message 28
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| Subject: | 912-S Oil Cooler Failures |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Banes" <johnbanes@adelphia.net>
Thanks Clint, Floran, Len, Dan, Lowell and John!
I greatly appreciate you sharing your experiences and advise.
Following your recommendations I'll mount the cooler with some sort of
shock/vibration absorbing mounts. My thought is to use short rubber inserts
in the top and bottom of the square tubing once the tubing is shortened.
These inserts will extend beyond the square tubing and yet still fit between
the coolers mounting tabs. I'll use rubber gromets to center the bolts in
the mounting tabs. This will allow for some lateral and verticle movement.
My biggest concern is the longevity of the rubber inserts due to the effects
of the heat given off by the oil cooler. The inserts are the rubber plugs
that are installed in the discharge line of 3 to 5 ton replacement A/C
compressors. I only have four of them and do not have a ready source for
more if they fail due to heat or vibration.
Sandwiching the whole unit in foam makes more sense but I cannot picture how
I might adapt that to the mount provided with the cooler. Earl's web site
does not have any pictures of their mounting system.
John I know that you and I have the same engine and cowling and that you
have a few to several hundred hours on your installation. I really only
want to do this once. I would appreciate any suggestions. A picture would
be very helpful.
Thanks again,
John Banes
S6 912S Smooth Cowling
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Cruise Speeds |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
Thanks for the good info Lowell (and any others that commented on this
thread). I think I now have a pretty good idea of what to do for final
fairings / drag reduction on my IV.
Paul Seehafer
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
> Paul, I opted for the Speedster elevator when I purchased my kit. I
used
> trim a lot while flying my C-170 and couldn't rationalize the flaperon
trim
> in my mind. The whole empennage fairing think came about because I got
the
> elevator with the tab cut out but didn't get the Full Speedster tail
> option - I was then leg\ft to figure it out on my own.
>
> The difference is speeds was determined by taking off with the trim tab in
> neutral and trimming for level cruise with flaperons, then neutralizing
the
> flaperons and trimming with the trim tab.
>
> As I recall, the Speedster came with a fully faired and closed gap rudder,
> electric elevator trim. The wings shortened by one rib bay, lift strut
> fairings, faired jury strut and horizontal stabilizer struts, radiator
> shroud, smaller tires with wheel pants and a bit larger spinner.
>
> There was one on our Idaho trip last year, but since we generally fly at
> the speed of the slowest airplane, I can't speak as to its performance.
> Early on when he flew with us until he got used to our protocol, we always
> saw him disappear into the horizon in front of us and we would meet up at
> the destination airport.
>
> Lowell
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
> >
> > Hi Lowell:
> >
> > Thanks for the great info. But I'm curious, 5mph for flaperon trim?
How
> > did you do that?
> >
> > Paul
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> >
> >
> > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> > >
> > > Not Really, Most of the fairings were added during construction. As
I
> > > recall the hubcaps give about 2 mph and the trim tab - eliminating
> > flaperon
> > > trim - adds about 5
> > >
> > > Lowell
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "jareds" <jareds@verizon.net>
> > > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> > >
> > >
> > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: jareds <jareds@verizon.net>
> > > >
> > > > Lowell,
> > > >
> > > > Thats really impressive. There is hope for my model IV yet!
> > > > Wing strut,spinner, and some covering on the landing gear is all
i've
> > > > put on so far with a 582.
> > > > I'm only at 90-95. I'll try some of these.
> > > > Did you test and evaulate which had the biggest effect?
> > > >
> > > > Lowell Fitt wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
<lcfitt@inreach.com>
> > > > >
> > > > >Paul, I have a lot of drag reducing mods on my Model IV and it will
> > > easily
> > > > >cruise at 115 mph.
> > > > >
> > > > >The mods include Wing Strut fairings, jury strut and horizontal
> > > stabilizer
> > > > >strut fairings, internal wingtip nav lights, hubcaps, fully faired
> > rudder
> > > > >vertical stabilizer / rudder and horizontal stabilizer / elevator
> gaps
> > > and,
> > > > >according to recent posts, benefit from a 9-1/2" spinner. I do pay
a
> > > drag
> > > > >penalty in the large 21X12X8 tires.
> > > > >
> > > > >Some of the mods can be seen on Sportflight:
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
>http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=view&epoch=1041348095
> > > > >http://www.sportflight.com/uploads/tip6.jpg
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
>http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=view&epoch=1075488689
> > > > >
> > > > >The last photo also shows the pod covering the video camera mount
on
> > the
> > > > >left wing strut.
> > > > >
> > > > >Lowell
> > > > >
> > > > >----- Original Message -----
> > > > >From: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
> > > > >To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > > > >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer"
> <av8rps@tznet.com>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Hi Rick:
> > > > >>
> > > > >>I'm not trying to make a case against the slow speed of the
design.
> > But
> > > I
> > > > >>do think anything we can do to make our airplanes faster makes
them
> > not
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >only
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>more useful for cross country travel, but also more efficient. My
> > > initial
> > > > >>question about the Speedsters true cruise speed was really to find
> out
> > > if
> > > > >>the design fine tuned with only 80 hp could really be that fast?
> > > > >>
> > > > >>My Lake amphibian isn't a fast airplane either, but it sure is
> > > versatile.
> > > > >>And you wouldn't believe how envious some of my float plane
buddies
> > are
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >that
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>fly around at under 100 mph when I can breeze by them 30+ mph
faster
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >burning
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>less fuel. And as we all know, the longer the trip, the more
> benefit
> > we
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >see
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>from any increase in speed.
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Given my druthers, Kitfoxes would go 200 knots. But we know that
> will
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >never
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>happen. However, if we can get 120+ mph out of our planes it will
> > make
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >all
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>the difference between it being used as a local puddle jumper, or
an
> > > > >>effective and efficient cross country cruiser.
> > > > >>
> > > > >>Paul
> > > > >>
> > > > >>----- Original Message -----
> > > > >>From: <RGray67968@aol.com>
> > > > >>To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > > > >>Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Cruise Speeds
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: RGray67968@aol.com
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>Hi Gang,
> > > > >>>Just curious.....why are all you folks worrying about 'how fast'
> your
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>Kitfox
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>will go? If you want to go 'fast' then why are you flying
Kitfoxes?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>Kitfoxes
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>are great little airplanes to tool around the sky and enjoy the
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >afternoon.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>>Nothing more fun than buzzing around checking out the sites and
> even
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>enjoying an
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>occasional X-country in your Kitfox. If you want to go
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>'fast'....sorry....but
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>you guys are flying the wrong airplane. Enjoy your Kitfox for
what
> it
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >is.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>Just
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>my opinion and worth what you paid for it.....smile.
> > > > >>>Rick Gray in Ohio at the Buffalo Farm - RV6 w 280+ hours - former
> > > Kitfox
> > > > >>>owner (and loved every 115 mph flight in my little Kitfox)
> > > > >>>Oh yea......and you guys need to do a LOT better job with the do
> not
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>archive
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>- ever search a topic looking for something??? No fun weeding
> through
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >all
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>the
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>'junk' to get what you want.
> > > > >>>do not archive this either :
> > > > >>>)
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>Paul, they get 120mph out of the Avid Speedwing with the 582
Rotax,
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >sounds
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>>like the Kitfox should get 130 behind the 912......if real clean
> and
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>faired
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>out.
> > > > >>>Sid
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>Does anyone know if the Model IV 912ul Speedster really could
> cruise
> > at
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>130
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>mph like they claimed it would?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>Previous questions about how to get more speed from our Kitfoxes
> made
> > > me
> > > > >>>think about this. I have articles where independent aviation
> writers
> > > > >>>claimed 125-140 mph speeds from the Speedster, verified by loran
/
> > gps.
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>And
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>>then there are other articles whereas the writers claimed to have
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >verified
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >>>110+ out of the long winged 912ul Model IV. Is this all hipe, or
> is
> > it
> > > > >>>really possible? Comments or opinions?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>Paul Seehafer
> > > > >>>Wisconsin
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Apolgies to the list + Mig Welding correction |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Fred Shiple <fredshiple@sbcglobal.net>
Jeff,
I've found your comments to be honest and quite useful. Your web sight was particularly
helpful to this first time builder. You're a valuable member of this
list. IMHO
Fred
do not archieve
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Grant, are you talking about the cleco holes? If so this is how I have
done it. Use a sandpaper flap wheel to create a chamfered depression on the
reverse side of the cowl at the hole. The depression should be an inch or
more in diameter, nearly through the cowl with the cleco hole in the center.
Put a piece of masking tape on the outside over the hole and then lay up
several layers of glass and resin to get the original thickness. Use the
flapper wheel to level it all out and then use the filler to finish the
outside.
It takes a little time, but will result in a strong repair. I have used it
when the new hole will partially be in the old one.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Grant Fluent" <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
Installation
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
>
> Lowell,
> If I move the lower cowling up 1/2" and drill 10 new
> holes, how do you recommend plugging the old ones?
> I've worked with epoxy and body filler but have never
> messed with fiberglass.
> Thanks,
> Grant Fluent
> Newcastle, NE
> Classic IV 912S
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Heating problem |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> Randy - Wrestling with fire sleeve.
Randy, If the firesleeve is too tight to fit over the tubing, get a friend
to help and have him hold the fire sleeve over a source of compresed air
while you work the other end over the tubing. Make sure the tubing is
closed at the opposite end. The compressed air will expand the fire sleeve
for an easy fit.
Lowell
> .
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Algate
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Heating problem
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
>
> Here's one for the detectives on the list. Last week I reported a failed
> thermostat on my 582 Blue Head engine.
>
> I purchased a new thermostat but had an interesting occurrence.
Background:
>
> Temperature was -20 degC and it was a little too cold for the small
> electric fan heater I use to get things warmed up under the cowl. I had
> recently purchased a small coleman heater that runs off camp oil for just
> this event so I placed the heater under the plane and ducted the hot air
> through some aluminum vent ducting up under the cowl.
>
> After about 10 minutes I could easily turn the prop by hand so I removed
the
> heater and started the engine.
>
> As I was warming it up I noticed the water temp rocket past 190 deg after
> only 3 or 4 minutes so I shut it down. I tried re-starting but the same
> thing occurred and I also noticed that my radiator and heater core
remained
> cold. This pointed to the thermostat failing so I arranged to borrow a
> friends and everything worked fine.
>
> I purchased a new thermostat and tried it last Friday (-10 degrees and no
> pre-heat necessary) and it worked fine.
>
> On Sunday the temp was down around -17 degC so I once again used the
coleman
> heater to pre-heat the engine and once again after startup the water temp
> rocketed up to almost 200 deg.
>
> Out with the thermostat and about 1 hour boiling it in a jug to try and
work
> exactly how it works.
>
> Finally in desperation I reconsidered events and determined the problem
only
> occurred when I used the higher temperature Coleman pr-heat.
>
> By this time the engine had cooled completely so I refitted the thermostat
> and carried out a cold start.
>
> All temps perfect?????
>
> The new Bluehead engine has a complicated thermostat that has a small gate
> that opens one end but at the same time the centre spindle extends and
> pushes a large disc up against a seat inside the head to divert flow (I'm
> not sure where or why).
>
> Can anyone give me some ideas as to why the preheat is effecting the
> operation of the thermostat.......
>
> Gary Algate
> Lite2 582 Bluehead - Confused????????????????
>
>
Message 33
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Tc9008@aol.com
What is the best 2 stroke oil to use on a 1997 kitfos model IV 582 rotax? I
can't find the pennzoil for air cooled engines.
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Apolgies to the list + Mig Welding correction |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Arthur Nation <anation@w-link.net>
On Monday 09 February 2004 13:42, jeff.hays@aselia.com wrote:
do not archive
Jeff,
Your comments are justified as I believe we all have the right to openly
express our thoughts.
In that vein, I believe that I have every right to also complain about my 18+
month old order which is still short nearly $17,000.
Arthur
Tacoma, WA
partial S7 kit
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jeff.hays@aselia.com"
> <jeff.hays@aselia.com>
>
>
> All -
>
> First off - Apologies to anybody that finds any of my posts to
> this list in any way offensive. It is not my intent to do so, I
> simply have my opinion's, right or wrong, and I'm not shy about
> telling what I think. This is in response to a couple emails I
> got from list members, who don't appreciate my comments.
>
> In any case - I'm not going to NOT say what I think in the future,
> but I would just suggest that in the future, for those list member's
> who don't like me so much, just simply filter your mail. After all
> this is an open forum for sharing opinions on all sides.
>
> In any case - About Mig Welding - I got an email from Skystar to correct
> me about Mig welding. The letter specifically states that the rudder
> pedal assemblies, and control column assemblies are Tig welded. That
> they do use Mig welding, but not for these parts. So to Skystar I
> apologize for my comment about Mig welding.
>
> Jeff Hays
>
>
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Unternaehrer" <shilocom@c-magic.com>
Grant,, You might try some fiberglass re-inforced Polyester that is
available at the auto parts stores (ours is called "short haired fiberglass,
long haired also available ...really). I've done this by placing a small
patch of fiberglass cloth (1" sq or so, folded a couple of times) behind the
hole, attaching it with the short haired fiberglass and filling the old hole
with the short haired fiberglass. rough everything up prior to patching.
Bob U.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Grant Fluent" <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
Installation
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
>
> Lowell,
> If I move the lower cowling up 1/2" and drill 10 new
> holes, how do you recommend plugging the old ones?
> I've worked with epoxy and body filler but have never
> messed with fiberglass.
> Thanks,
> Grant Fluent
> Newcastle, NE
> Classic IV 912S
>
>
> --- Lowell Fitt <lcfitt@inreach.com> wrote:
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
> > <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> >
> > Grant,
> > First, my lower cowl - the flat part is flush with
> > the bottom of the
> > fuselage/firewall. The large lip is what I use for
> > air exit only. If that
> > 1/2" is all you need, I would say move it up as far
> > as you can. Looking at
> > mine, I would say the top of the panel cover is
> > parallel with the top of the
> > cowl, but higher, as the top is at the level of the
> > cowl lip. The screws
> > being just below the lip.
> >
> > Lowell
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Grant Fluent" <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
> > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Instrument
> > Panel Cover (Dash Cover)
> > Installation
> >
> >
> > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent
> > <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
> > >
> > > Thanks to everyone for their continuing responses
> > to
> > > my problem with the dash cover.
> > > Lowell, you mentioned that oil tank would
> > prevent
> > > the top cowling from being too low. That's one
> > thing
> > > that I didn't do. I didn't install it when I
> > fitted
> > > the cowlings - I followed the manual :( I will
> > check
> > > that next to see if it fits or interferes.
> > > If I was to move the lower cowling up, I have
> > only
> > > about 1/2" to go until it hits the bottom piece of
> > the
> > > firewall - is it supposed to? I located it
> > vertically
> > > by the dimensions in the manual.
> > > The dash cover will fit nicely with the
> > windshield
> > > it I slide it down and forward until the bottom
> > edge
> > > is flush with the bottom edge of the windshield.
> > The
> > > screws would be where they're supposed to be
> > except
> > > that the dash cover is no longer level with the
> > > fuselage. The front is about 1/2" lower. Has
> > everyone
> > > else made theirs level or just positioned it where
> > it
> > > fits well?
> > > Thanks,
> > > Grant Fluent
> > > Newcastle, NE
> > > Classic IV 912S
> > >
> > >
> > > --- kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
> > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> > > > <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> > > >
> > > > It does sound like your cowl is too low, but
> > just an
> > > > idea here. Would it be easier to modify the
> > dash
> > > > cover than the cowl? Which one would be best in
> > the
> > > > long run to change? Do the cowl if it wrong,
> > but if
> > > > there is no other problem, just modify the
> > cover,
> > > > IMHO.
> > > >
> > > > Kurt S.
> > > >
> > > > --- Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks Lowell, Kurt and Eric.
> > > > >
> > > > > From reading your responses, I think I've
> > got
> > > > > something drastically wrong here. The bottom
> > lip
> > > > on
> > > > > the dash cover is 1" above the bottom lip on
> > the
> > > > > windscreen. Eric, you may be right, I may have
> > the
> > > > > cowlings mounted too low. At most I could only
> > > > gain
> > > > > 1/2" though if I were to epoxy the holes shut
> > and
> > > > > start over moving the lower cowling up. The
> > > > > windscreen seems very close to the x-brace
> > tubing
> > > > in
> > > > > the front. By that I mean you can just get
> > your
> > > > > fingers between the tubes and the windscreen.
> > It
> > > > had
> > > > > to be positioned like that because the top
> > cowling
> > > > > was
> > > > > such a tight fit against it. Any ideas or
> > > > > suggestions?
> > > > >
> > > > > Grant Fluent
> > > > > Newcastle, NE
> > > > > Classic IV 912S
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > Contributions
> > any other
> > Forums.
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/chat
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
> > http://www.matronics.com/archives
> > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ---
>
>
---
Message 36
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| Subject: | Knight Upholstery for Kitfox |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Sam Knight <knightair@lv.rmci.net>
Kitfox Builders:
I have been in the upholstery business for 30 years and have been making
upholstery products for kitplanes for 18 years. I have interior kits
available for the Model I, Model II, Model III, Model IV, Lite (Squared),
Series 5, Series 6, Vixen, and the Ultralight plus Sky Raider Ultralight. I
also have cabin covers and other items. A list of other kitplane interior
products available upon request.
For more information, call Knight Aircraft Interiors, Inc., at (702)
207-6681 or e mail me at knightair@lv.rmci.net. If you e-mail for
information, please mention either "Knight" or "Upholstery" in your
reference line so I can give your request my immediate attention. Photos
available upon request.
Sincerely,
KNIGHT AIRCRAFT INTERIORS, INC.
"Fly by Knight" Upholstery Products
Sam Knight
Message 37
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|
| Subject: | Re: 2 stroke oil |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Robertson" <aerocon1@telusplanet.net>
Quaker State makes a good two stroke oil as do Shell (Shell Advance).. If
you live in snowmobile country take a trip to your SkiDoo dealer and pick up
some Rotax two stroke oil. If you live in more moderate climes, head off
to your SeaDoo dealer and pick up some Bombardier SeaDoo Oil.
I guess what I am saying is that there are lots of really good oils on the
market. Ask other pilots in your area what they are sucessfully using. It
has been quite a while since we have seen an engine failure directly related
to the two stroke oil (the companies are making much better products now
than ten years ago.).
I'm not a big fan of synthetic oils in our Rotax U/L engines. I believe the
synthetic oils burn a bit cleaner than straight mineral oils, but I don't
see any economic benefit when the engine is maintained according to the
manufacturers schedule. Synthetic oils are quite a bit more $ than straight
mineral oils.
Regardless of mineral or synthetics one thing you don't want to do is mix
them. You can get some really interesting chemical reactions when mixing
some synthetic and mineral oils. We had one oil tank that had something
that looked like tapioca pudding after the owner mixed tweo major branded
oils (one mineral one synthetic. opps!).
Hope this helps
Bob Robertson
Light Engine Services Ltd.
Rotax Service Center
----- Original Message -----
From: <Tc9008@aol.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: 2 stroke oil
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Tc9008@aol.com
>
> What is the best 2 stroke oil to use on a 1997 kitfos model IV 582 rotax?
I
> can't find the pennzoil for air cooled engines.
>
>
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: Classic IV - Instrument Panel Cover (Dash Cover) Installation |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Thanks Gary, Lowell, and Bob for your tips on filling
the holes in the cowling. It looks like that's what
I'll have to do.
I temporarily installed the oil tank and sure
enough, the cap hits on the top cowling enough that I
can't get the quarter turn fasteners latched. The cap
is the low profile one that Skystar supplied.
I tried again removing the quarter turn fasteners in
the lower cowling and positioned it about 1/4" higher
and 1/4" forward holding it in place with spring
clamps. Now I have about 1/32"-1/16" clearance from
the oil cap to the top cowling. Does this sound
correct or do I need more clearance? The oil tank is
as low as I can get it - the hex sticking out of the
bottom is touching the engine case.
Grant Fluent
Newcastle, NE
Classic IV 912S
--- Bob Unternaehrer <shilocom@c-magic.com> wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob
> Unternaehrer" <shilocom@c-magic.com>
>
> Grant,, You might try some fiberglass re-inforced
> Polyester that is
> available at the auto parts stores (ours is called
> "short haired fiberglass,
> long haired also available ...really). I've done
> this by placing a small
> patch of fiberglass cloth (1" sq or so, folded a
> couple of times) behind the
> hole, attaching it with the short haired fiberglass
> and filling the old hole
> with the short haired fiberglass. rough everything
> up prior to patching.
> Bob U.
Message 39
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|
| Subject: | Re: 2si Engine 460-F35 & the Lite |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Robertson" <aerocon1@telusplanet.net>
Hi David,
I'm not going to stick my nose up in the air because you purchased a 2SI
engine. We needed a small economical engine to replace the Rotax 277.
Unfortunatley, the people who manufactured this engine have made the
decision to discontinue manufacturing and supporting any aircraft engines.
I understand they got hit with a major law suit and discontinued any and all
participation in ultralight aircraft engines. I got this information from
EAA's Web update a month or so ago... Hopefully, someone will pick up the
pieces as this decision will leave a lot of people in a rough spot if they
can;t get parts for their engines.
If you are looking for carburetor parts go to www.bingcarburetors.com
They will be able to help you as they stock parts for ALL Bing carbs.
They might even be able to help you with your airfilter search.
regards
Bob Robertson
Light Engine Services Ltd
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Wright" <deedubs@charter.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: 2si Engine 460-F35 & the Lite
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "David Wright" <deedubs@charter.net>
>
> While i'm at it ..... Does any one out there have experience with the
2si
> engine?
>
> How has it been?
> Where's a good source for consumables for this engine?
> I"ve noticed that it has a needle size for the Bing 84 carb of "6O1".
> I cannot find this size listed in
> either the Aircraft Spruce or California Power Systems catalogs.
> I also cannot find a source for the "Unifilter" air filter that is
1.75"
> in diameter and 6" long.
> The C.P.S. catalog carries Unifilter's but only in a 4" long version.
> Aircraft is new and un-flown as of now but It's nice to know where to
go
> when you need such things.
>
> I've had people give me the "eww" face when I've told them I bought this
> engine. Is it really that bad?
> Why would skystar select it if it was? Are there no other engine
options
> light enough?
> Seems like Rotax lost customers when they dropped the 277 as I keep
hearing
> and seeing aircraft that say they are designed for using that engine.
> Yeah, I'd like to try the 503, but Firewall-Forward Plus Engine rings up
to
> almost $6700 via Skystar ...
> ... AND ... it makes my Lite not legal as an Ultralight
weight-wise.
> Perhaps I shouldn't worry about that when I can afford it? The
> extra power w/be appreciated.
>
> tx
>
>
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