Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:39 AM - Re: Ribs (Lowell Fitt)
2. 07:14 AM - Re: Master solenoid - A confession! (kerrjohna@comcast.net)
3. 07:42 AM - Re: Master solenoid - A confession! (Clifford Begnaud)
4. 07:44 AM - Re: Ribs (Bill Pleso)
5. 08:08 AM - Re: Ribs (Paul Seehafer)
6. 08:30 AM - Re: N60FS still flies/strip (Fox5flyer)
7. 08:46 AM - Insurance -HELP (Joel Mapes)
8. 09:53 AM - Re: Ribs (Lowell Fitt)
9. 10:11 AM - Re: Ribs (Lowell Fitt)
10. 12:43 PM - Master solenoid - A confession! (Ted Palamarek)
11. 01:26 PM - Re: Ribs (u2drvr@dslextreme.com)
12. 01:42 PM - Power diode WAS Master solenoid (Michel Verheughe)
13. 03:30 PM - Re: Ribs (kerrjohna@comcast.net)
14. 04:18 PM - Re: Ribs (kurt schrader)
15. 06:59 PM - Re: Insurance -HELP (Fred Shiple)
Message 1
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Bill, I think the original Model IV-1200 had three hinges - mine does -
1993 vintage. I think the "Classic IV" has 4. Haven't heard of any issues
regarding rudder hinges, so don't have a guess as to the change.
Is it fore and aft that they don't line up or is it the vertical spacing
along the hinge line?
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Ribs
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
>
> Builders,
> The book shows 3 hinge points for the rudder, but my fuselage has 4
(they don't line up very well). Anyone know why the change was made? Would
it be possible for somebody to send me (snail mail) a paper or cardboard
pattern for the wooden ribs on the vertical stabilizer and rudder for the
Model IV? Thanks.
> Bill
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Master solenoid - A confession! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kerrjohna@comcast.net
could this explain why the batteries in my gps went flat while connected to the
accessory plug?
on another thread, the last two recombinant gas (RG) batteries used with my 912
went south after about 6 months. is that because of the "hot" charge that comes
from the 912 regulator?
'lectonics leave me baffled.
John
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh" <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
>
> A while back I asked the list if I should have voltage on the other side of
> the master solenoid if the solenoid was "off". I got a new solenoid from
> Aircraft Spruce. It did the same thing!
>
> Well, I think Ted was closest with his comment that the voltage must be
> coming from some where else. After a lot of frustration, I started
> unhooking things. I finally tracked it down to batteries in the GPS! -
> which was plugged into a cigarette lighter type accessory plug.
>
> I now have a really swell spare master solenoid.
>
> Randy - N10NH Still building and testing - rather be flying! (Never
> thought I would say that!)
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Master solenoid - A confession! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
John,
There's a lengthy and detailed discussion of this very topic going on right
now on the Aeroelectric list (matronics). I suggest looking at the archives
there. Search batteries and "battery types" during the last two weeks.
Cliff
>
> could this explain why the batteries in my gps went flat while connected
to the accessory plug?
>
> on another thread, the last two recombinant gas (RG) batteries used with
my 912 went south after about 6 months. is that because of the "hot" charge
that comes from the 912 regulator?
>
> 'lectonics leave me baffled.
>
> John
>
Message 4
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
> Is it fore and aft that they don't line up or is it the vertical spacing
> along the hinge line?
>
Lowell,
They (the two center bearings) are off vertically. One's a little high
and one's a little low. I don't like the idea of bending the tabs, so I may
cut the tabs off and have them rewelded on. When I bought the plane (10 yrs
old & never built) it still had "most" of the parts. I have the wooden ribs
for the horizontal tail surfaces, but not the vertical / rudder.
Bill
do not archive
Message 5
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
Bill:
Your airplane has the newer, 10" taller rudder and vertical stabilizer.
Therefore you have 4 hinges vs 3 like the earlier models had. The taller
rudder needs the extra hinge to support the length. (At least that's what
I'd guess the engineers would say)
I heard the ribs do nothing in the vertical stab/rudder except add weight.
I did however hear also that the horiz stab and elevator need the ribs for
better performance. So before you start adding ribs you might want to check
with others on how the two verticals (rib vs no-rib) compare performance
wise. I'll bet John McBean may have an opinion on that as he's flown most
all of them I'm sure. Just a suggestion....
Paul S
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Ribs
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
>
> Builders,
> The book shows 3 hinge points for the rudder, but my fuselage has 4
(they don't line up very well). Anyone know why the change was made? Would
it be possible for somebody to send me (snail mail) a paper or cardboard
pattern for the wooden ribs on the vertical stabilizer and rudder for the
Model IV? Thanks.
> Bill
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: N60FS still flies/strip |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Well, since you're proficient on grass, as soon as you get your 40 flown off
stop by here on your way north if you need to take a break. Not really out
of your way.
Darrel
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fred Shiple" <fredshiple@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: N60FS still flies/strip
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Fred Shiple <fredshiple@sbcglobal.net>
>
> Darrel,
> The strip belongs to a friend. Used it for the fly-off. It's 10 miles
north of Toledo on his farm.
> Fred
>
> do not archive
>
> Where is that strip located?
> Darrel
>
>
Message 7
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Joel Mapes" <Joel.Mapes@roxio.com>
I've been following the list for about a month, lots of great info. I'm building
a Series V w/ 921A and GTA CS prop on Aerocomp amphibs. My plan is to fly in
on wheels initially and move it to the floats after 40 hours or so. I'm intrigued
by the request for Kitfox specific floatplane training. Where is that available?
Joel Mapes
Software Engineer
OEM / OCA Team
roxio
The Digital Media Company*
10030 Silverdale Way NW, Ste 101
Silverdale, WA 98383 USA
360 613 9988 direct
360 613 4266 fax
joel.mapes@roxio.com
www.roxio.com
NASDAQ:"ROXI"
Featuring the Best-Selling CD-Recording Software in the World
Message 8
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Thanks Bill, there has been some talk in the past about misalignment of the
hinges. This clears it up.
Since my kit was delivered in March 1993 and yours is ten years old, my
guess is that the change took place shortly after mine was shipped.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Ribs
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
>
>
> > Is it fore and aft that they don't line up or is it the vertical spacing
> > along the hinge line?
> >
> Lowell,
> They (the two center bearings) are off vertically. One's a little
high
> and one's a little low. I don't like the idea of bending the tabs, so I
may
> cut the tabs off and have them rewelded on. When I bought the plane (10
yrs
> old & never built) it still had "most" of the parts. I have the wooden
ribs
> for the horizontal tail surfaces, but not the vertical / rudder.
> Bill
>
> do not archive
>
>
Message 9
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Paul, not quite true. My Model IV-1200 has the taller vertical stab and
rudder. But has three hinges. I am curious as I send this - my rudder
hinges incorporate 1/4" rod ends. Am I correct in that the 4 hinge set-up
uses 3/16 rod ends?
I do have ribs and a closed gap on mine, but have no experience the other
way so have no knowledge of the difference in performance.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Ribs
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
>
> Bill:
>
> Your airplane has the newer, 10" taller rudder and vertical stabilizer.
> Therefore you have 4 hinges vs 3 like the earlier models had. The taller
> rudder needs the extra hinge to support the length. (At least that's what
> I'd guess the engineers would say)
>
> I heard the ribs do nothing in the vertical stab/rudder except add weight.
> I did however hear also that the horiz stab and elevator need the ribs for
> better performance. So before you start adding ribs you might want to
check
> with others on how the two verticals (rib vs no-rib) compare performance
> wise. I'll bet John McBean may have an opinion on that as he's flown most
> all of them I'm sure. Just a suggestion....
>
>
> Paul S
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Ribs
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
> >
> > Builders,
> > The book shows 3 hinge points for the rudder, but my fuselage has 4
> (they don't line up very well). Anyone know why the change was made?
Would
> it be possible for somebody to send me (snail mail) a paper or cardboard
> pattern for the wooden ribs on the vertical stabilizer and rudder for the
> Model IV? Thanks.
> > Bill
> >
> >
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Master solenoid - A confession! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ted Palamarek" <temco@telusplanet.net>
John
Re the GPS batteries going flat --- in all likely hood that
is exactly what happened. To avoid this in the future you
could just pull the accessory plug or put a steering diode
in the 12V side of the line from the plug. This would allow
current to flow to your GPS but block any current from your
GPS going out to other things in you aircraft when your
battery is not supplying power. The normal drop across a
diode is 0.5v, so that would not make any difference to how
your GPS would operate. Better still put the diode on the
supply side, that way any device plugged into the accessory
plug will not discharge into the system if left plugged in.
Not sure about the charging and the other two batteries not
lasting long.
Ted
Edmonton
<<<<SNIP>>>>
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kerrjohna@comcast.net
could this explain why the batteries in my gps went flat
while connected to the accessory plug?
on another thread, the last two recombinant gas (RG)
batteries used with my 912 went south after about 6 months.
is that because of the "hot" charge that comes from the 912
regulator?
'lectonics leave me baffled.
John
Message 11
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: u2drvr@dslextreme.com
Bill,
Airfoiling (adding ribs to) the rudder increases dynamic stability in the
yaw axis. In other words, it has a natural centering tendency... if you
yaw the airplane and then take out the rudder, it wants to go back to
flying straight. This is very noticeable in the horizontal stab, but I'm
not sure how much effect it has in the vertical stab. Bottom line, I think
the improvement in flying qualities is worth the minimal weight.
Cheers,
BP
Paul Seehafer
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
>
> Bill:
>
> Your airplane has the newer, 10" taller rudder and vertical stabilizer.
> Therefore you have 4 hinges vs 3 like the earlier models had. The taller
> rudder needs the extra hinge to support the length. (At least that's what
> I'd guess the engineers would say)
>
> I heard the ribs do nothing in the vertical stab/rudder except add weight.
> I did however hear also that the horiz stab and elevator need the ribs for
> better performance. So before you start adding ribs you might want to
> check
> with others on how the two verticals (rib vs no-rib) compare performance
> wise. I'll bet John McBean may have an opinion on that as he's flown most
> all of them I'm sure. Just a suggestion....
>
>
> Paul S
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Ribs
>
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
>>
>> Builders,
>> The book shows 3 hinge points for the rudder, but my fuselage has 4
> (they don't line up very well). Anyone know why the change was made?
> Would
> it be possible for somebody to send me (snail mail) a paper or cardboard
> pattern for the wooden ribs on the vertical stabilizer and rudder for the
> Model IV? Thanks.
>> Bill
>>
>>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Power diode WAS Master solenoid |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
Ted Palamarek wrote:
> Re the GPS batteries going flat --- in all likely hood that
> is exactly what happened.
This is strange. One would think that any device that can work on internal
battery and external power (either AC or DC) has already a diode that prevents
the internal battery to discharge. Then again, I have seen my share of weird
things in life.
PS: I never leave my GPS in the plane when hangared. I have enough with people
stealing my fuel, I don't want to attract too much their attention.
Cheers,
Michel
do not archive.
Message 13
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kerrjohna@comcast.net
handling diffrences are difficult to determine because so few of us have flown
the different configurations.
I have also heard that the flat fin foxes tend to "search" a bit in yaw.
John 900 hr classic iv
over 2000 landings, lot of slips, and no weeds.
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: u2drvr@dslextreme.com
>
> Bill,
>
> Airfoiling (adding ribs to) the rudder increases dynamic stability in the
> yaw axis. In other words, it has a natural centering tendency... if you
> yaw the airplane and then take out the rudder, it wants to go back to
> flying straight. This is very noticeable in the horizontal stab, but I'm
> not sure how much effect it has in the vertical stab. Bottom line, I think
> the improvement in flying qualities is worth the minimal weight.
>
> Cheers,
>
> BP
>
>
> Paul Seehafer
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
> >
> > Bill:
> >
> > Your airplane has the newer, 10" taller rudder and vertical stabilizer.
> > Therefore you have 4 hinges vs 3 like the earlier models had. The taller
> > rudder needs the extra hinge to support the length. (At least that's what
> > I'd guess the engineers would say)
> >
> > I heard the ribs do nothing in the vertical stab/rudder except add weight.
> > I did however hear also that the horiz stab and elevator need the ribs for
> > better performance. So before you start adding ribs you might want to
> > check
> > with others on how the two verticals (rib vs no-rib) compare performance
> > wise. I'll bet John McBean may have an opinion on that as he's flown most
> > all of them I'm sure. Just a suggestion....
> >
> >
> > Paul S
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
> > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: Kitfox-List: Ribs
> >
> >
> >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bill Pleso" <bill77@cox.net>
> >>
> >> Builders,
> >> The book shows 3 hinge points for the rudder, but my fuselage has 4
> > (they don't line up very well). Anyone know why the change was made?
> > Would
> > it be possible for somebody to send me (snail mail) a paper or cardboard
> > pattern for the wooden ribs on the vertical stabilizer and rudder for the
> > Model IV? Thanks.
> >> Bill
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 14
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Bill,
Are your bearings large enough to shave a little off
of the ends of each to make it fit rather than move
the tabs?
Just a thought,
Kurt S.
--- Bill Pleso <bill77@cox.net> wrote:
>
>
> > Is it fore and aft that they don't line up or is
> it the vertical spacing
> > along the hinge line?
> >
> Lowell,
> They (the two center bearings) are off
> vertically. One's a little high
> and one's a little low. I don't like the idea of
> bending the tabs, so I may
> cut the tabs off and have them rewelded on. When I
> bought the plane (10 yrs
> old & never built) it still had "most" of the parts.
> I have the wooden ribs
> for the horizontal tail surfaces, but not the
> vertical / rudder.
> Bill
>
> do not archive
__________________________________
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Insurance -HELP |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Fred Shiple <fredshiple@sbcglobal.net>
Joel,
I'm fortunate to have a local builder/CFI whose Kitfox is on floats. Falcon allowed
me to name him on my policy and indicated he would satisfy them. John McBean
would be a good source for training for anyone without such a local resource.
Fred
:
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Joel Mapes"
I've been following the list for about a month, lots of great info. I'm building
a Series V w/ 921A and GTA CS prop on Aerocomp amphibs. My plan is to fly in
on wheels initially and move it to the floats after 40 hours or so. I'm intrigued
by the request for Kitfox specific floatplane training. Where is that available?
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