---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 08/12/04: 33 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:12 AM - IVO (gjglh@itlnet.net) 2. 12:36 AM - Re: Flaperon Balance (kurt schrader) 3. 12:45 AM - Re: [Off-topic] A very amateurish video (kurt schrader) 4. 03:21 AM - SV: [Off-topic] A very amateurish video (Michel Verheughe) 5. 03:38 AM - Re: Flaperon Balance (AlbertaIV@aol.com) 6. 04:11 AM - Re: Bulging header tank (Wwillyard@aol.com) 7. 04:24 AM - SV: Flaperon Balance (Michel Verheughe) 8. 04:50 AM - Re: IVO (gary) 9. 06:36 AM - Re: IVO (Marc Arseneault) 10. 07:01 AM - Re: Prop choice for lycoming (W Duke) 11. 08:03 AM - Re: Spark Plugs (Lowell Fitt) 12. 08:08 AM - Re: [Off-topic] A very amateurish video (Lowell Fitt) 13. 10:04 AM - Fuel Valves (Fox5flyer) 14. 10:38 AM - Re: Fuel Valves (Grant Fluent) 15. 10:54 AM - New Flapperon Installation Assistance (Scott McClintock) 16. 11:32 AM - Re: Spark Plugs (Kirk Martenson) 17. 12:09 PM - Re: Spark Plugs (Scott McClintock) 18. 12:21 PM - Re: Fuel Valves (Wwillyard@aol.com) 19. 12:38 PM - Re: Fuel Valves (Fox5flyer) 20. 02:01 PM - EAA Chapter 612 FLy - in () 21. 02:05 PM - Re: Spark Plugs (Kirk Martenson) 22. 02:19 PM - Re: Spark Plugs (Steve Cooper) 23. 03:03 PM - Re: Kirk's Carb Stick (Scott McClintock) 24. 04:54 PM - Manometer (AlbertaIV@aol.com) 25. 05:01 PM - Re: Bulging header tank (Jerry Liles) 26. 05:03 PM - Re: Spark Plugs (Lowell Fitt) 27. 05:31 PM - Re: Manometer (Scott McClintock) 28. 06:43 PM - Just out of curiosity, you guys with bulging headers (Rex & Jan Shaw) 29. 06:48 PM - My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip (Rex & Jan Shaw) 30. 06:49 PM - Re: Manometer (Kirk Martenson) 31. 06:54 PM - Re: Spark Plugs (Kirk Martenson) 32. 08:20 PM - Re: Spark Plugs (Lowell Fitt) 33. 11:21 PM - Re: Manometer (aerocon1@telusplanet.net) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:12:35 AM PST US From: gjglh@itlnet.net Subject: Kitfox-List: IVO --> Kitfox-List message posted by: gjglh@itlnet.net I currently have a GSC three blade prop on a 912UL 80HP. Does anyone have an approximate price on an IVO in flight adjustable prop. Gary 912LS Speedster Model IV ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:36:04 AM PST US From: kurt schrader Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flaperon Balance --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader I think they actually have it backwards. Painting flight controls can be hazardous, but not likely a problem painting the counter-weights. Since weight is such an issue, aircraft are usually equiped with just enough weight to balance the control surface with one coat of paint. If you paint the surface more, you can unbalance it and allow flutter to occur. That is because you have too much weight aft of the hinge line, which is destabilizing. Seldom is too much weight forward a problem, other than just being heavy. The little bit of paint on the weights is negligable compared to the weight of all that paint on the flapperons, and most people paint them. Heavy flapperons and light weights are much worse than heavy weights and light flapperons. I think SS gave us enough counter weight for us to have everything painted. Kurt S. S-5, with painted weights and unpainted flapperons. --- Rex & Jan Shaw wrote: > I have a Kitfox MKIV Classic Speedster/582. It has > the counterbalanced > flaperons. The guys up the club the other day were > looking at my plane and > remarked that the weight balance was so critical > that a coat of paint on > them would put them out of balance with drastic > results. I bought the plane > already made and am not familiar with this aspect. > Can anyone comment if it > is this critical ? How are these things setup ? Are > they actually balanced > about the hinge line ? Rex. > rexjan@bigpond.com __________________________________ http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:45:15 AM PST US From: kurt schrader Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: [Off-topic] A very amateurish video --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader Nice movie Michel. And I learned something from it too. English is what you get when you play Norwegian backwards.... :-) Somehow you got the sound to work. My camera is overwhelmed with the cockpit sound and it cuts in and out. I need a muffler on the camera? Kurt S. S-5/NSI turbo --- Michel Verheughe wrote: > Hello guys, > > Here is a very amateurish video I made on Monday, > when I got the visit of that > German Vixen. No, I don't have a nice video pod like > Lowell and this is my > first try to get anything on the internet but ... > here it is: > > http://home.online.no/~michel/tmp/hokksund.mov > > Cheers, > Michel > > do not archive __________________________________ http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:21:40 AM PST US From: Michel Verheughe Subject: SV: Kitfox-List: [Off-topic] A very amateurish video --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe Thanks Herb and Kurt. > From: kurt schrader [smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com] > And I learned something from it too. English is what > you get when you play Norwegian backwards.... :-) Ah, then you know what a xoftiK is! :-) > I need a muffler on the camera? I wouldn't know, Kurt, I am even newer to movie making than to flying. But I guess a muffler is worth trying. Get a big huge hairy one like what you can see on TV crews. Paint two eyes, call him Otto and put him on your right-hand seat. If someone then asks what it is, you can always answer that it is you auto-pilot! Cheers, Michel do not archive ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 03:38:03 AM PST US From: AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flaperon Balance --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > The guys up the club the other day were looking at my plane and > remarked that the weight balance was so critical that a coat of paint on > them would put them out of balance with drastic results. I bought the plane > In one word, tell the guys "nonsense". There are hundreds of flapperon weights painted with various kinds and coats of paint. Not only that, some flapperons only have one weight on each. I don't think any have had bad results much less drastic. Keep painting, Don Smythe DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 04:11:20 AM PST US From: Wwillyard@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bulging header tank --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Wwillyard@aol.com I used mini ball valves for both wing tanks and the main fuel valve, 150 hours with no problems. Grainger number 6GD45, list price $3.46. Bill W. Classic IV ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 04:24:14 AM PST US From: Michel Verheughe Subject: SV: Kitfox-List: Flaperon Balance --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe > From: AlbertaIV@aol.com > In one word, tell the guys "nonsense". Rex, Don and others gave you advice in one direction: Ignore that pilot's comment. I don't know much about aviation but, like you, I bought a plane built by someone else and I came to these conclusions: 1) Don't repair something that works. Do you experience flaperon flutter? No? Good! 2) Pay some respect to the original builder. Before yours, it was his life hanging from that flying machine. Chances are that he valued his life as much as you do yours. 3) "Les conseilleurs ne sont pas les payeurs." A French proverb that can translate to "Advice are free of charge." It doesn't cost anyone to give advice, even if the adviser wouldn't even dream of enforcing it himself. 3) Idiots never learn. Most people learn from their mistakes. But the real smart guy learns from others' mistakes! I guess the bottom line is: Always listen to the experienced people but, at the end of the day, make up your own mind and stand by it. Cheers, Michel - cheap psycho-analyst. Cheaper than that ... I owe you money! do not archive ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 04:50:53 AM PST US From: "gary" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: IVO --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "gary" prices are on their website, search for IVO prop. about $2K for the medium, less for the UL version (not sure of HP rating). gary ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: Kitfox-List: IVO > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: gjglh@itlnet.net > > I currently have a GSC three blade prop on a 912UL 80HP. Does anyone > have an approximate price on an IVO in flight adjustable prop. > Gary > 912LS > Speedster Model IV > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:36:20 AM PST US From: "Marc Arseneault" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: IVO --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Marc Arseneault" Hi Gary, I am a dealer for Ivoprop and I recommend thethree blade in flight adjustable Patriot model that sells for $950.00 US. If you are interested, you can contact me off the list and I will give you more info. Best Regards, Marc Arseneault Ontario Canada ============================================ Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:01:52 AM PST US From: W Duke Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Prop choice for lycoming --> Kitfox-List message posted by: W Duke Brad, With my IO240 I think I suffer TO and climb somewhat in the summer. I have the Sensenich W74-2-58 which was recomended as a compromise prop at the time. Jeff Hayes (off the list presently) has ordered a "74"x 54 pitch prop." from sensenich hoping for better TO and climb. He will not have his prop for several weeks, though. Maxwell Flybradair@cs.com wrote: --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Flybradair@cs.com Any advice or suggestions from the lycoming drivers on their prop and spinner choice? I did contact Sensenich and they recommend W74EK-2-54, any advice? Cliff are you still using the Aymer-Demuth and are you happy with the prop and pitch? Anyone else feel free to jump in----I need to order one! Brad Martin Wichita 5--lyc o235-l2c wiring --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:03:08 AM PST US From: "Lowell Fitt" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" Kirk, I just changed out the wires and got a little relief from a roughness that occurred between 42 and 4400 rpm The wires are 7 mm diameter and are available from any of the Rotax distributors or elsewhere if you search. They have a stranded copper conductor. They unscrew from the ends of the caps and the coils. Use a dielectric grease when reassembling to prevent corrosion. The rubber outer sheath can be removed if you want to. It is held to the wire by a dab of adhesive that dried and hardened in use. Try pulling on the rubber sheath to find the adhesive blob and then knead (twist) that area until the stuff lets go. I didn't use any adhesive when putting the sheath on the new wires. You will have to disassemble the modules / coils assembly to gain access to the lower coils. It took about 2 hours or so for the job. You don't want to replace the coils. they come at $250 a pop. One of the guys in our group flight to Oshkosh developed serious ignition roughness during the last leg into OSH. It was at first traced to a coil - got a new coil from Lockwood (you can indeed find anything at Airventure) One of the Lockwood techies tested the old coil - bad. The new coil didn't help - apparently not bad after all - makes you wonder. From the techie, the coil is the most common point of failure in the system. We went back to work and determined that an ignition module had failed in an unusual mode. One side only failed affecting only two of the cylinders that module serviced, hence the original coil diagnosis. After a $600 module was installed the problem was solved. There was also a wire break in the bundle from the stator. It is thought that this intermittent wire is what fried half the module. The wires in the system are, as Gary V. once a member of the list, called "crap" wires, and are very vulnerable to breaking somewhere in the insulation due to engine vibration. Advice: Either move the modules to the firewall or oil tank supports or bundle them so as to reduce their vulnerable to vibration. Lowell ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kirk Martenson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > Jim Burke: > > Do you have a Rotax 912 in your Kitfox? I have had a very slight rough > running engine (Rotax 912UL). I changed the spark plugs, and rebuilt the > carburetors. Still rough, but only slightly, no rpm drop. I would like > change out the plug wires as well, but I don't know if you can just change > the wires. Do you have to buy the whole coil? > > > Kirk Martenson > Classic IV > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Burke" > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke > > > > Curious you should bring spark plugs up Don, I had a similar problem a > > couple of weeks ago. I changed out the new plugs and the miss went away > for > > a couple of flights (about three hours). Then it came back. So I replaced > > the plugs wires and have put eight hours on the plane with no Miss. I > guess > > it could have been a bag of mixed tricks but it runs great now. > > > > > > James E. Burke > > (N94JE) > > -------Original Message------- > > > > From: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > Date: 08/09/04 14:34:07 > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > > > I experienced a slight miss in my 582 engine. This started less than > 5 > > hours after putting in new BR8ES plugs. I replace the plugs again today > and > > the miss went away. Old plugs looked brand new and color was excellent. > > Has anyone ever had a new plug go bad in a short time? This is my > first > > > > > > Don Smythe > > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:08:00 AM PST US From: "Lowell Fitt" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: [Off-topic] A very amateurish video --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" Kurt, the easy way to get voice into your videos is to get a small lapel mike and put it into your headset earpiece and plug the other end into your camera. You will still get a little engine noise, but you can discern the voices. Lowell ----- Original Message ----- From: "kurt schrader" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: [Off-topic] A very amateurish video > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader > > Nice movie Michel. > > And I learned something from it too. English is what > you get when you play Norwegian backwards.... :-) > > Somehow you got the sound to work. My camera is > overwhelmed with the cockpit sound and it cuts in and > out. I need a muffler on the camera? > > Kurt S. S-5/NSI turbo > > --- Michel Verheughe wrote: > > > Hello guys, > > > > Here is a very amateurish video I made on Monday, > > when I got the visit of that > > German Vixen. No, I don't have a nice video pod like > > Lowell and this is my > > first try to get anything on the internet but ... > > here it is: > > > > http://home.online.no/~michel/tmp/hokksund.mov > > > > Cheers, > > Michel > > > > do not archive > > > __________________________________ > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:04:13 AM PST US From: "Fox5flyer" Subject: Kitfox-List: Fuel Valves --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" How were you able to mount your ball valve to the center console? That's the most important one in my opinion. Darrel > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Wwillyard@aol.com > I used mini ball valves for both wing tanks and the main fuel valve, 150 hours with no problems. Grainger number 6GD45, list price $3.46. > Bill W. > Classic IV ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 10:38:04 AM PST US From: Grant Fluent Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fuel Valves --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent Darrel, I have a small ball valve mounted in my center console. Take a look at my photo page - pictures 112 and 113: http://photos.yahoo.com/gjfpilot I have more pictures of it that are not on my photo page if you're interested. Grant Fluent Newcastle, NE Classic IV 912S --- Fox5flyer wrote: > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" > > > How were you able to mount your ball valve to the > center console? That's > the most important one in my opinion. > Darrel > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: > Wwillyard@aol.com > > I used mini ball valves for both wing tanks and > the main fuel valve, 150 > hours with no problems. Grainger number 6GD45, list > price $3.46. > > Bill W. > > Classic IV > > > > Contributions > any other > Forums. > > http://www.matronics.com/chat > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm > http://www.matronics.com/archives > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 10:54:08 AM PST US From: Scott McClintock Subject: Kitfox-List: New Flapperon Installation Assistance --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock I'm seeking any pointers from you guys before I install the new S6 flapperons (thanks Fred) on my S5 ("Arctic Fox") They look to be the same. I will remove my existing counterweights and reinstall on the new ones matching the positions of the originals. Any tips as to getting the angles correct or ??? would be appreciated. I installed the repaired Grove spring gear and Maule tail wheel yesterday. Now she is off the "crutches" and looks as good as ever. I did drill out the two plates that sandwich the rear of the aluminum bar to accommodate larger diameter bolts. I can't believe how tiny those "stock" ones were. All new stainless steel hardware so I'm feeling a lot better now. This also gave me the opportunity to look closer at how the original builder covered that section of the plane. I'm going to do a little fabric cutting and modify the section some. I don't care for the way the cross bolts stick out and the fabric covering only made it look bad. It always would catch the eye and created some un-necessary drag. Always the perfectionist, I have a better idea I will need to remove the rudder as I did sustain some damage to the lowest rib which cracked and got pushed up into the rudder about an inch. Good thing I checked as to look at it you couldn't tell. I may still yet get some summer flying in this year. At least my aluminum skis are ready to go. Now, if we can just get a decent snow season all will be well. Scott in Nome DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 11:32:40 AM PST US From: "Kirk Martenson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" Lowell: Thanks for the info. I ordered a set (roll) of wire(s) from Lockwood. They also told me to pneumatically synchronize the carburetors. Kirk Martenson Classic IV ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lowell Fitt" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" > > Kirk, I just changed out the wires and got a little relief from a roughness > that occurred between 42 and 4400 rpm > > The wires are 7 mm diameter and are available from any of the Rotax > distributors or elsewhere if you search. They have a stranded copper > conductor. They unscrew from the ends of the caps and the coils. Use a > dielectric grease when reassembling to prevent corrosion. The rubber outer > sheath can be removed if you want to. It is held to the wire by a dab of > adhesive that dried and hardened in use. Try pulling on the rubber sheath > to find the adhesive blob and then knead (twist) that area until the stuff > lets go. I didn't use any adhesive when putting the sheath on the new > wires. > > You will have to disassemble the modules / coils assembly to gain access to > the lower coils. It took about 2 hours or so for the job. > You don't want to replace the coils. they come at $250 a pop. > > One of the guys in our group flight to Oshkosh developed serious ignition > roughness during the last leg into OSH. It was at first traced to a coil - > got a new coil from Lockwood (you can indeed find anything at Airventure) > One of the Lockwood techies tested the old coil - bad. The new coil didn't > help - apparently not bad after all - makes you wonder. From the techie, > the coil is the most common point of failure in the system. We went back to > work and determined that an ignition module had failed in an unusual mode. > One side only failed affecting only two of the cylinders that module > serviced, hence the original coil diagnosis. After a $600 module was > installed the problem was solved. There was also a wire break in the bundle > from the stator. It is thought that this intermittent wire is what fried > half the module. The wires in the system are, as Gary V. once a member of > the list, called "crap" wires, and are very vulnerable to breaking somewhere > in the insulation due to engine vibration. > > Advice: Either move the modules to the firewall or oil tank supports or > bundle them so as to reduce their vulnerable to vibration. > > Lowell > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kirk Martenson" > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > > > Jim Burke: > > > > Do you have a Rotax 912 in your Kitfox? I have had a very slight rough > > running engine (Rotax 912UL). I changed the spark plugs, and rebuilt the > > carburetors. Still rough, but only slightly, no rpm drop. I would like > > change out the plug wires as well, but I don't know if you can just change > > the wires. Do you have to buy the whole coil? > > > > > > Kirk Martenson > > Classic IV > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Jim Burke" > > To: > > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke > > > > > > Curious you should bring spark plugs up Don, I had a similar problem a > > > couple of weeks ago. I changed out the new plugs and the miss went away > > for > > > a couple of flights (about three hours). Then it came back. So I > replaced > > > the plugs wires and have put eight hours on the plane with no Miss. I > > guess > > > it could have been a bag of mixed tricks but it runs great now. > > > > > > > > > James E. Burke > > > (N94JE) > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > > > From: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > > Date: 08/09/04 14:34:07 > > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > > Subject: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > > > > > I experienced a slight miss in my 582 engine. This started less > than > > 5 > > > hours after putting in new BR8ES plugs. I replace the plugs again today > > and > > > the miss went away. Old plugs looked brand new and color was excellent. > > > Has anyone ever had a new plug go bad in a short time? This is my > > first > > > > > > > > > Don Smythe > > > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 12:09:56 PM PST US From: Scott McClintock Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock Kirk, I would opt for the mercury type manometers which motorcycle shops use for multi cylinder engines. My set cost about $40 and can be ordered through any MC shop. They are much easier to use and once you install the orifices into your intake manifolds, it only takes a few minutes to adjust. The "eyeball" method is not good and you will enjoy much smoother engine operation and some better performance. Scott in Nome Kirk Martenson wrote: > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > Lowell: > > Thanks for the info. I ordered a set (roll) of wire(s) from Lockwood. They > also told me to pneumatically synchronize the carburetors. > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 12:21:53 PM PST US From: Wwillyard@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fuel Valves --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Wwillyard@aol.com How were you able to mount your ball valve to the center console? That's the most important one in my opinion. Darrel The mini ball valves from Grainger are mad from hexagon shaped stock (flat on the front and back sides) and mounting can be accomplished by fabrication of a small plate to be placed behind the valve body. A couple of small screws from the front side through the back plate and your done. This is essentially the same way as the SkyStar instructions outlined for the factory valve that came with my kit. Bill W. ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 12:38:29 PM PST US From: "Fox5flyer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fuel Valves --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" Thanks Grant. Yes, I'd like to see more. Do you have any closeups of your method of anchoring it? Just send direct to me via atch if you don't mind. Darrel > Darrel, > I have a small ball valve mounted in my center > console. Take a look at my photo page - pictures 112 > and 113: http://photos.yahoo.com/gjfpilot > I have more pictures of it that are not on my photo > page if you're interested. > Grant Fluent > Newcastle, NE > Classic IV 912S > > --- Fox5flyer wrote: > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" > > > > > > How were you able to mount your ball valve to the > > center console? That's > > the most important one in my opinion. > > Darrel > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: > > Wwillyard@aol.com > > > I used mini ball valves for both wing tanks and > > the main fuel valve, 150 > > hours with no problems. Grainger number 6GD45, list > > price $3.46. > > > Bill W. > > > Classic IV > > > > > > > > Contributions > > any other > > Forums. > > > > http://www.matronics.com/chat > > > > http://www.matronics.com/subscription > > http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm > > http://www.matronics.com/archives > > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > > http://www.matronics.com/emaillists > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 02:01:12 PM PST US From: "Jim Steinbrink" , "Andy Stanton" , "Randy Roy" , "Jim Pickett" , "Marvin Orr" , "kitfox list" , "Ray Kurian Jr." , "Jason Kessler" , "Donna Hull" , "Kenny Horvatic" , "Carl Hineborg" , "Art Gentry" , "Chris Gagnon" , "Ron Eason" , "Will Crawford" , "Tim Craft" , "George Craft" , "Dave Courtney" , "Les Chambers" , "Allen Brown" , "George Bradley" Subject: Kitfox-List: EAA Chapter 612 FLy - in --> Kitfox-List message posted by: EAA Chapter 612 FLy - in EAA chapter 612 will hold a fly-in and Pancake breakfast at Roosterville airport (0N0) near Liberty Mo. on August 21. The breakfast will start at 7:30 with Young Eagles flights starting at 8:00 and lasting till Noon. There will also be a prize awarded at 11:00 for the best aircraft flown in. Sorry I forgot the date on the first E-mail ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 02:05:50 PM PST US From: "Kirk Martenson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" Scott: What is the brand of manometer you are using? And Lowell: What brand of dielectric grease did you use on your wires? Thanks guys. Kirk Martenson Classic IV ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott McClintock" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock > > Kirk, > I would opt for the mercury type manometers which motorcycle shops use for multi > cylinder engines. > My set cost about $40 and can be ordered through any MC shop. > They are much easier to use and once you install the orifices into your intake > manifolds, it only takes a few minutes to adjust. > The "eyeball" method is not good and you will enjoy much smoother engine > operation and some better performance. > > Scott in Nome > > Kirk Martenson wrote: > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > > > Lowell: > > > > Thanks for the info. I ordered a set (roll) of wire(s) from Lockwood. They > > also told me to pneumatically synchronize the carburetors. > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 02:19:18 PM PST US From: "Steve Cooper" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" ..."I'm not sure of the brand...but thank got for Viagra! hehehehe Steve :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kirk Martenson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > Scott: > > What is the brand of manometer you are using? > > And Lowell: > > What brand of dielectric grease did you use on your wires? > > Thanks guys. > > Kirk Martenson > Classic IV > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott McClintock" > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock > > > > > Kirk, > > I would opt for the mercury type manometers which motorcycle shops use for > multi > > cylinder engines. > > My set cost about $40 and can be ordered through any MC shop. > > They are much easier to use and once you install the orifices into your > intake > > manifolds, it only takes a few minutes to adjust. > > The "eyeball" method is not good and you will enjoy much smoother engine > > operation and some better performance. > > > > Scott in Nome > > > > Kirk Martenson wrote: > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > > > > > Lowell: > > > > > > Thanks for the info. I ordered a set (roll) of wire(s) from Lockwood. > They > > > also told me to pneumatically synchronize the carburetors. > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 03:03:52 PM PST US From: Scott McClintock Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kirk's Carb Stick --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock Kirk, I've had mine for so long the name has rubbed off. Probably made in taiwan? It is yellow plastic, about 24" long, 4" wide with four clear vertical tubes which the mercury rises up into. The face is graduated. They are commonly referred to in "motorcycle speak" as a "Carb Stick". It will come with 4 short adapters and 4 long metal adapters (6mm threaded) which screw into the intake manifolds and which you push the buna hoses over the ends. If you don't have the little threaded holes already in your intake manifolds, it's an simple chore to drill and thread your own. After you "sync" the carbs, you only need to screw in some small screws with a brass or copper washer to seal them back up till the next time. It will come with a small bottle of mercury. Be aware that once you put the mercury in, the "stick" needs to remain vertical. If You drop it or lay it on it's side, the mercury will run out and you'll have to put more in. Not to worry as the stick has little ears with holes for bailing wire to hang them. One other thing, don't run your engine up too high as it will suck the mercury all the way through the "stick" and into your engine. I've done this before with no ill effects except that I had to hunt down more mercury. I have found that the "carb stick" works much better than vacuum type manometers and are much easier to read than trying to follow the twitching needles of the later. I think I got it through the SUDCO carb catalog (mikuni/keihin carb importers). A good MC parts dealer will know exactly what this is. Have him look in the Motion Pro catalog I used to "sync" my buddy's SU carbs on his Austin this way instead of using the bent paperclip method. Much better performance. If you want to make one on the cheap, here is a link telling you how to do that for under $10 bucks. (I'd just go with the mercury stick myself) www.obairlann.net/~reaper/bmw-bike/manometer.html Have fun, I know this will make a noticeable improvement in smoothness. Scott in Nome Kirk Martenson wrote: > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > Scott: > > What is the brand of manometer you are using? > > And Lowell: > > What brand of dielectric grease did you use on your wires? > > Thanks guys. > > Kirk Martenson > Classic IV > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott McClintock" > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock > > > > > Kirk, > > I would opt for the mercury type manometers which motorcycle shops use for > multi > > cylinder engines. > > My set cost about $40 and can be ordered through any MC shop. > > They are much easier to use and once you install the orifices into your > intake > > manifolds, it only takes a few minutes to adjust. > > The "eyeball" method is not good and you will enjoy much smoother engine > > operation and some better performance. > > > > Scott in Nome > > > > Kirk Martenson wrote: > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > > > > > Lowell: > > > > > > Thanks for the info. I ordered a set (roll) of wire(s) from Lockwood. > They > > > also told me to pneumatically synchronize the carburetors. > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 04:54:10 PM PST US From: AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Kitfox-List: Manometer --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > It is yellow plastic, about 24" long, 4" wide with four clear vertical > tubes > which the mercury rises up into. > The face is graduated. They are commonly referred to in "motorcycle speak" > as a > "Carb Stick". > I looked on the web about manometers and found a site that talked about using oil rather than mercury. The article went on to give a couple points. Oil will provide a more accurate reading than mercury. Also, if the oil accidentally gets ingested into the carbs, it won't hurt the engine. I've never used a manometer and don't have a clue. Does any of this make sense? The one I saw on the web can be built for about 2 bucks. Don Smythe DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 05:01:59 PM PST US From: Jerry Liles Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bulging header tank --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles Unfortunately I know from experience that a good ole Southern Redneck Dirt Dauber will use any suitable size hole, even one venting gasoline fumes. It's one tough and not very smart wasp. Jerry Liles Fox5flyer wrote: >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" > >Good question, but in my case the answer is no. I don't close off my pitots >because they're always venting anyway and no bug that I know of will crawl >up into that smelly hole. I think I'll recheck my header venting system >when I swap units to make sure that all is well in that regard. It's >installed per SS instructions. >Darrel > > > >> Just out of curiosity, you guys with bulging headers...Do you put >> >> >rubber > > >>tubing or anything over your tank vents while the plane is sitting??? >> This is now I checked my header for leaks during the building phase. >>With full gas in the header and the vents sealed off, the tank will bulge >> >> >due to > > >>the gas trying to vent off. >> >>Don Smythe >>DO NOT ARCHIVE >> >> > > > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 05:03:09 PM PST US From: "Lowell Fitt" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" Kirk, A confession here - I didn't use dielectric grease. Learned of this at the Rotax forum at OSH. that is a project for later - still converting my hangar for a wedding open house. Lowell ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kirk Martenson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > Scott: > > What is the brand of manometer you are using? > > And Lowell: > > What brand of dielectric grease did you use on your wires? > > Thanks guys. > > Kirk Martenson > Classic IV > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott McClintock" > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock > > > > > Kirk, > > I would opt for the mercury type manometers which motorcycle shops use for > multi > > cylinder engines. > > My set cost about $40 and can be ordered through any MC shop. > > They are much easier to use and once you install the orifices into your > intake > > manifolds, it only takes a few minutes to adjust. > > The "eyeball" method is not good and you will enjoy much smoother engine > > operation and some better performance. > > > > Scott in Nome > > > > Kirk Martenson wrote: > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > > > > > Lowell: > > > > > > Thanks for the info. I ordered a set (roll) of wire(s) from Lockwood. > They > > > also told me to pneumatically synchronize the carburetors. > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 05:31:12 PM PST US From: Scott McClintock Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Manometer --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock See the link in my last message. It says it all pretty well, I'm tired of typing. I've used several different types and the mercury stick seems the easiest. The mercury doesn't jump around as much because it's heavy. You could use cat piss but I'd advise against that too. :- ) P.S. Mercury won't hurt your engine either but it's hell on the brain cells, just don't rev up the engine too high. Is someone missing the point of synchronization here? All you are doing is matching the carbs so that they are pulling EQUAL vacuum and working together. I'm tired and going home now. Scott in Nome DO NOT ARCHIVE AlbertaIV@aol.com wrote: > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > > It is yellow plastic, about 24" long, 4" wide with four clear vertical > > tubes > > which the mercury rises up into. > > The face is graduated. They are commonly referred to in "motorcycle speak" > > as a > > "Carb Stick". > > > > I looked on the web about manometers and found a site that talked about > using oil rather than mercury. The article went on to give a couple points. > Oil will provide a more accurate reading than mercury. Also, if the oil > accidentally gets ingested into the carbs, it won't hurt the engine. > I've never used a manometer and don't have a clue. Does any of this make > sense? The one I saw on the web can be built for about 2 bucks. > > Don Smythe > DO NOT ARCHIVE > ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 06:43:27 PM PST US From: "Rex & Jan Shaw" Subject: Kitfox-List: Just out of curiosity, you guys with bulging headers --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" Don, I put those little rubber sleeves that go on the end of throttle cables over my tank vents. They have ribbon hanging out the end and are hopefully sealed enough against intrusion but can still breath. I do however have an aluminium header tank that was made to suit. Rex. rexjan@bigpond.com ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 06:48:11 PM PST US From: "Rex & Jan Shaw" Subject: Kitfox-List: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" Mike, this is a common problem. One needs to replace the little "O" rings occasionally but be sure to use Viton or some fuel resistant ones, Rex. rexjan@bigpond.com ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 06:49:43 PM PST US From: "Kirk Martenson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Manometer --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" Thanks for the advice on the manometer. I looked it up on the internet and found that a guy was using a yard stick, and 20 feet of vinyl tubing. He used automatic transmission fluid (ATF) because it is red. I think I will use water with red food coloring. He said he had about $4.00 into the whole thing. Cheap enough! Kirk Martenson Classic IV ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: Kitfox-List: Manometer > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > > > It is yellow plastic, about 24" long, 4" wide with four clear vertical > > tubes > > which the mercury rises up into. > > The face is graduated. They are commonly referred to in "motorcycle speak" > > as a > > "Carb Stick". > > > > > I looked on the web about manometers and found a site that talked about > using oil rather than mercury. The article went on to give a couple points. > Oil will provide a more accurate reading than mercury. Also, if the oil > accidentally gets ingested into the carbs, it won't hurt the engine. > I've never used a manometer and don't have a clue. Does any of this make > sense? The one I saw on the web can be built for about 2 bucks. > > Don Smythe > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 06:54:51 PM PST US From: "Kirk Martenson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" Lowell: That's OK. I looked it up on the internet. I think the local Fleet Farm store here in north St. Paul MN carries it. It is made by Permatex. What did they say at the forum, just grease the end that goes into the coil, or the boot end, or both ends of the wire? Thanks, Kirk Martenson Classic IV ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lowell Fitt" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" > > Kirk, A confession here - I didn't use dielectric grease. Learned of this > at the Rotax forum at OSH. that is a project for later - still converting > my hangar for a wedding open house. > > Lowell > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kirk Martenson" > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > > > Scott: > > > > What is the brand of manometer you are using? > > > > And Lowell: > > > > What brand of dielectric grease did you use on your wires? > > > > Thanks guys. > > > > Kirk Martenson > > Classic IV > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Scott McClintock" > > To: > > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock > > > > > > > > Kirk, > > > I would opt for the mercury type manometers which motorcycle shops use > for > > multi > > > cylinder engines. > > > My set cost about $40 and can be ordered through any MC shop. > > > They are much easier to use and once you install the orifices into your > > intake > > > manifolds, it only takes a few minutes to adjust. > > > The "eyeball" method is not good and you will enjoy much smoother engine > > > operation and some better performance. > > > > > > Scott in Nome > > > > > > Kirk Martenson wrote: > > > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > > > > > > > Lowell: > > > > > > > > Thanks for the info. I ordered a set (roll) of wire(s) from Lockwood. > > They > > > > also told me to pneumatically synchronize the carburetors. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 08:20:52 PM PST US From: "Lowell Fitt" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" Both ends Lowell ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kirk Martenson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > Lowell: > > That's OK. I looked it up on the internet. I think the local Fleet Farm > store here in north St. Paul MN carries it. It is made by Permatex. > > What did they say at the forum, just grease the end that goes into the coil, > or the boot end, or both ends of the wire? > > Thanks, > > Kirk Martenson > Classic IV > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lowell Fitt" > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" > > > > Kirk, A confession here - I didn't use dielectric grease. Learned of > this > > at the Rotax forum at OSH. that is a project for later - still converting > > my hangar for a wedding open house. > > > > Lowell > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Kirk Martenson" > > To: > > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > > > > > Scott: > > > > > > What is the brand of manometer you are using? > > > > > > And Lowell: > > > > > > What brand of dielectric grease did you use on your wires? > > > > > > Thanks guys. > > > > > > Kirk Martenson > > > Classic IV > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Scott McClintock" > > > To: > > > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > > > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock > > > > > > > > > > > Kirk, > > > > I would opt for the mercury type manometers which motorcycle shops use > > for > > > multi > > > > cylinder engines. > > > > My set cost about $40 and can be ordered through any MC shop. > > > > They are much easier to use and once you install the orifices into > your > > > intake > > > > manifolds, it only takes a few minutes to adjust. > > > > The "eyeball" method is not good and you will enjoy much smoother > engine > > > > operation and some better performance. > > > > > > > > Scott in Nome > > > > > > > > Kirk Martenson wrote: > > > > > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > > > > > > > > > > Lowell: > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for the info. I ordered a set (roll) of wire(s) from > Lockwood. > > > They > > > > > also told me to pneumatically synchronize the carburetors. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 11:21:47 PM PST US From: aerocon1@telusplanet.net Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Manometer --> Kitfox-List message posted by: aerocon1@telusplanet.net Hi Don, et al Speaking of carb sychronization, we are in the final stages of testing a small hand held electronic manometerthat will allow easy sync of the carbs. This thing is so small we affectionately refer to it as the "nano-mano".. The trade name is going to be Micro-Sync. It is designed to read and average the pulses at the primer port. The read out is a simple four digit number. All the user has to do is adjust the carburetor slide so that both carbs give similar readings. Permiminary testing shows that it should take around 5 minutes to synchronize the carbs. It's not a two dollar manometer, but you can carry it around in you shirt pocket without worrying about spilling oil or mercury. I doubt it will be an item every two stroke owner will need to have, but most repair shops and many avid engine buffs could be interested. I don't have the final cost on this yet, but we are working at keeping it as low as possible. Hope this e-mail finds y'all healthy and enjoying the summer flying weather. regards Bob Robertson Light Engine Services Ltd. Rotax Service Center Quoting AlbertaIV@aol.com: > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > > > It is yellow plastic, about 24" long, 4" wide with four clear vertical > > tubes > > which the mercury rises up into. > > The face is graduated. They are commonly referred to in "motorcycle speak" > > > as a > > "Carb Stick". > > > > > I looked on the web about manometers and found a site that talked about > using oil rather than mercury. The article went on to give a couple points. > > Oil will provide a more accurate reading than mercury. Also, if the oil > accidentally gets ingested into the carbs, it won't hurt the engine. > I've never used a manometer and don't have a clue. Does any of this make > > sense? The one I saw on the web can be built for about 2 bucks. > > Don Smythe > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > > > > > >