---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 08/13/04: 21 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:00 AM - Muffler for camera (Solar) 2. 07:38 AM - Re: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip (Harold Flynn) 3. 08:09 AM - Re: Bulging header tank (Fox5flyer) 4. 08:57 AM - Nano-mano (Scott McClintock) 5. 09:12 AM - Re: Nano-mano (Bob Robertson) 6. 09:56 AM - Spark Plugs () 7. 10:37 AM - Kitfox IV & 582 (Maurice Fraser) 8. 12:20 PM - Re: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip (AlbertaIV@aol.com) 9. 12:25 PM - Re: Kitfox IV & 582 (AlbertaIV@aol.com) 10. 01:43 PM - Anchorage, Alaska? Anyone? (Steve Cooper) 11. 02:07 PM - gap sealing stuff......... (hausding, sid) 12. 02:46 PM - KitFox IV & 582 Bathing Beauty (Scott McClintock) 13. 05:38 PM - Re: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip (Fox5flyer) 14. 05:58 PM - Re: Spark Plugs (Rick) 15. 06:28 PM - Re: Spark Plugs (Floran Higgins) 16. 06:36 PM - Re: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip (Clem Nichols) 17. 07:32 PM - Re: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues (Paul) 18. 07:59 PM - Gap Stuff (Lmar) 19. 11:20 PM - Misc Construction Question (Jim Carriere) 20. 11:43 PM - Re: Misc Construction Question (kitfoxpilot) 21. 11:57 PM - Re: Misc Construction Question (Steve Cooper) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:00:34 AM PST US From: "Solar" Subject: Kitfox-List: Muffler for camera --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Solar" Try using an external microphone that is of higher quality and range than the internal one. If you can find a microphone that has an gain control (either reostat or switchable) get that. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:38:06 AM PST US From: Harold Flynn Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Harold Flynn Rex & Jan Shaw wrote: --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" Mike, this is a common problem. One needs to replace the little "O" rings occasionally but be sure to use Viton or some fuel resistant ones, Rex. rexjan@bigpond.com Why not take them out and replace them with a plug? Any water in the fuel system will end up in the bottom of your header tank. I always check for water there. IT`s the lowest point in the fuel system and thats where the water should end up. --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:09:37 AM PST US From: "Fox5flyer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bulging header tank --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" Did you weld up your own? I have an AC buzz box and a wire welder with argon. Using the correct rods/wire can I weld the aluminum with either of these units? I'm pretty handy with this sort of thing, or does this require a pro to ensure it's done correctly? Darrel > ACS has aluminum specificly for fuel tanks listed with > the al sheets. It is .040 or .050 5052H-32 al. I > used the .050. If you make the same size header tank > as origional, it will weigh less in al, even with the > .050 thickness. :-) > > It is hard to weld that thinwall, and my welder had > enough trouble with the .050. The .040 might be a lot > more problems for a welder. > > I weighed both tanks, but I forgot the difference. > They were very close, even though my new tank was much > bigger. > > Kurt S. S-5/NSI tirbo > > --- Fox5flyer wrote: > .......... > > As for the header tank, Kurt Schrader, who built an > > aluminum unit, sent me > > his original (arrived yesterday Kurt, thanks!) and > > as soon as I have the > > time I plan to install it. Then the plan is to use > > my old one as a template > > and see if I can find someone to weld me up one > > using aluminum. Anybody have any recommendations > > as to what thickness and type of alum I should use, > > considering strength, weight, and weldability? > > Darrel ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:57:09 AM PST US From: Scott McClintock Subject: Kitfox-List: Nano-mano --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock Bob, Your "nano-mano" sounds real interesting. When you get to the production phase, please post a note on this list. I have use for such a thing as I'm still actively racing (1000cc Yamaha RX-1 snowmachine) and help other local racers with their tuning chores. I hope you will incorporate the ability to read 4 cylinders simultaneously. You will sell a bunch if you do. I'll hang onto my carb stick for a while until this is available. Scott in Nome DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:12:39 AM PST US From: "Bob Robertson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Nano-mano --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Robertson" Scott, The initial unit is based on twin cylinders.... Adding two more will require a bit of a change to the software and two more pulse leads. I'll talk to our electronics wizard and see what he can do. So far I've not been able to stump him (he builds explosion proof/deep sea electronic monitors for the deep sea oil business). He speaks a completely different language than the rest of us electronically challenged people. He is a pilot as well so he does understand our needs. He just finished up an electronic altimeter (pocket sized) that can be set to an accuracy of a couple of feet. For aircraft use this is dampened so the numers are not jumping all over the place. Take a look at www.microtim.com The Micro-Sync (2 cyl) will be the same size as the altimeter. regards Bob R I will keep you posted... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott McClintock" Subject: Kitfox-List: Nano-mano > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock > > Bob, > Your "nano-mano" sounds real interesting. When you get to the production > phase, please post a note on this list. > I have use for such a thing as I'm still actively racing (1000cc Yamaha > RX-1 snowmachine) and help other local racers with their tuning chores. > I hope you will incorporate the ability to read 4 cylinders > simultaneously. You will sell a bunch if you do. I'll hang onto my carb > stick for a while until this is available. > Scott in Nome > > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:56:43 AM PST US From: Subject: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Absolutely! But don't get too quick to blame the manufactures on this one. Some do go bad, or quit after being checked at the factory (?). But it could also be crud getting into the gap and shorting out the spark. Then in taking the plug out it might drop away, or off, leaving you to guess as to what it was.........I always keep plugs handy for all my powered toys in the size and hotness needed for best performance and change at the first sign of 'trouble', then clean and check the old ones as backups. Sid out of town a lot lately and just trying to catch up on the mail.......... ---------------- ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:37:12 AM PST US From: Maurice Fraser Subject: Kitfox-List: Kitfox IV & 582 --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Maurice Fraser Hi All I am new to this list and am looking at buying a Kitfox IV. I have a couple of questions. The rotax 582 has an overhauled time of 300 hours does anyone use this engine longer than that? Also if a Kitfox is submerged in water and was rebuilt what kind of damage should I look for and would the wood in the wing ribs be OK? Any info you can give me would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Maurice ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:20:01 PM PST US From: AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com In a message dated 8/13/04 7:39:03 AM Pacific Daylight Time, hflynn46531@yahoo.com writes: > > Why not take them out and replace them with a plug? Any water in the fuel > system will end up in the bottom of your header tank. I always check for water > there. IT`s the lowest point in the fuel system and thats where the water > should end up. > > I said that and they all avoided me. Don Smythe DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:25:51 PM PST US From: AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox IV & 582 --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com I am new to this list and am looking at buying a Kitfox IV. I have a couple of questions. The rotax 582 has an overhauled time of 300 hours does anyone use this engine longer than that? Also if a Kitfox is submerged in water and was rebuilt what kind of damage should I look for and would the wood in the wing ribs be OK? Any info you can give me would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Maurice Maurice, Yes, builders with the 582 expect to get more than 300 hours. I had my engine rebuilt at 300 hours and it was still in fine running shape. I had the engine rebuilt for a different reason than it needed it. If the plane was submerged is salt water I would be very leary. That stuff can come out and cause you a problem way down stream. I don't think an airplane can be cleaned enough to rid all the salt. If it was fresh water, I'd feel a little easier but not that much. I would be concerned over the wood parts in the wing. I guess it would depend on how long it was under water and how long it took to dry out. I would have to get a "real" "real" good purchase price on a plane that was under water. IMHO Don Smythe DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 01:43:38 PM PST US From: "Steve Cooper" Subject: Kitfox-List: Anchorage, Alaska? Anyone? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" Due to a job change, I may be relocating to Anchorage, Alaska in the near future. Is there anybody on the list that lives and flys in Alaska? Feel free to post me offlist at: spdrflyr@earthlink.net I sure would like to ask you some questions! Thanks, Steve Cooper ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 02:07:05 PM PST US From: "hausding, sid" Subject: Kitfox-List: gap sealing stuff......... --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "hausding, sid" To the Kitfox, Avid, and Sirius forums............. Hi Sid, How are you doing? I'm just getting back into flying again down here. Its been way too long. I need to re-tape the gaps since I had to disassemble my plane when I brought it down to Australia with me. I don't have any ski saver tape left. Since I'm going to be in California next week - was wondering if you have any of the plastic tape left that you used, that you could send me? Or, do you remember what it was called? Or who currently has it? Thanks in advance. Cheers Allan ----------------------- the tape is being circulated right now from an enclosed list of members who requested the roll. It should be somewhere out there and as soon as someone responds, or the last list member (if it hasn't run out) can send it on to you........... stay tuned and I will help you get it, maybe in CA, or sent on to Aussie Land. Sid glad to hear you are back in the 'saddle' again and flying! :-) ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 02:46:52 PM PST US From: Scott McClintock Subject: Kitfox-List: KitFox IV & 582 Bathing Beauty --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott McClintock I am new to this list and am looking at buying a Kitfox IV. I have a couple of questions. The rotax 582 has an overhauled time of 300 hours does anyone use this engine longer than that? Also if a Kitfox is submerged in water and was rebuilt what kind of damage should I look for and would the wood in the wing ribs be OK? Any info you can give me would be greatly appreciated. Maurice, Ditto on what Don mentioned and I have another thing that you should consider. Regardless of how long or severe of a soaking that the plane took, I doubt that one can ever remove all the moisture out of the INSIDE of the airframe tubing. I highly doubt that one could "cook" all the water out. I would ask the seller on how or if he dispersed that water out of there. Chrome-moly rusts readily and when it's on the inside, you'd never see it. (until it rusted through) Scott in Nome DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 05:38:44 PM PST US From: "Fox5flyer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" C'mon Don. That's not accurate. I'll bet lots of them took the advice. They just didn't tell you. :-) Darrel ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > In a message dated 8/13/04 7:39:03 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > hflynn46531@yahoo.com writes: > > > > > > Why not take them out and replace them with a plug? Any water in the fuel > > system will end up in the bottom of your header tank. I always check for water > > there. IT`s the lowest point in the fuel system and thats where the water > > should end up. > > > > > > I said that and they all avoided me. > Don Smythe > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 05:58:28 PM PST US From: "Rick" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rick" Just a quick note on the platinum and iridium plugs. Be careful not to touch the plated tip. Very durable to heat very sensitive to abrasion. If they need to be gaped only bend the ground and measure carefully. Should be close out of the box. Just in case sense someone mentioned those plugs. BTW the NGK number for the turbo ea-81 is BR7EIX. Rick N6 -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of sidh@charter.net Subject: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Absolutely! But don't get too quick to blame the manufactures on this one. Some do go bad, or quit after being checked at the factory (?). But it could also be crud getting into the gap and shorting out the spark. Then in taking the plug out it might drop away, or off, leaving you to guess as to what it was.........I always keep plugs handy for all my powered toys in the size and hotness needed for best performance and change at the first sign of 'trouble', then clean and check the old ones as backups. Sid out of town a lot lately and just trying to catch up on the mail.......... ---------------- ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:28:19 PM PST US From: "Floran Higgins" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Floran Higgins" I had a 912 UL that had an interment miss. Finally discovered that I had a bad ground on one of the coils. Floran. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kirk Martenson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" > > Jim Burke: > > Do you have a Rotax 912 in your Kitfox? I have had a very slight rough > running engine (Rotax 912UL). I changed the spark plugs, and rebuilt the > carburetors. Still rough, but only slightly, no rpm drop. I would like > change out the plug wires as well, but I don't know if you can just change > the wires. Do you have to buy the whole coil? > > > Kirk Martenson > Classic IV > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Burke" > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke > > > > Curious you should bring spark plugs up Don, I had a similar problem a > > couple of weeks ago. I changed out the new plugs and the miss went away > for > > a couple of flights (about three hours). Then it came back. So I replaced > > the plugs wires and have put eight hours on the plane with no Miss. I > guess > > it could have been a bag of mixed tricks but it runs great now. > > > > > > James E. Burke > > (N94JE) > > -------Original Message------- > > > > From: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > Date: 08/09/04 14:34:07 > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Kitfox-List: Spark Plugs > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > > > I experienced a slight miss in my 582 engine. This started less than > 5 > > hours after putting in new BR8ES plugs. I replace the plugs again today > and > > the miss went away. Old plugs looked brand new and color was excellent. > > Has anyone ever had a new plug go bad in a short time? This is my > first > > > > > > Don Smythe > > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 06:36:06 PM PST US From: "Clem Nichols" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clem Nichols" I thought we'd determined that the spring-loaded drain in question was the one in the header tank, not the ones in the wing tanks. That's certainly the one I have the most trouble with continuing to dribble, and as previously pointed out, that's probably the most important one when it comes to checking for water in the fuel system. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fox5flyer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" > > C'mon Don. That's not accurate. I'll bet lots of them took the advice. > They just didn't tell you. :-) > Darrel > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues > to drip > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > > > In a message dated 8/13/04 7:39:03 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > > hflynn46531@yahoo.com writes: > > > > > > > > > > Why not take them out and replace them with a plug? Any water in the > fuel > > > system will end up in the bottom of your header tank. I always check for > water > > > there. IT`s the lowest point in the fuel system and thats where the > water > > > should end up. > > > > > > > > > > I said that and they all avoided me. > > Don Smythe > > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 07:32:55 PM PST US From: Paul to drip Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues to drip --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Paul to drip Clarification? The quick drains in the wings are the same as the one in the header. Don advice is sound but if one does not have the large sump header tank then the wing drains probably should be retained and repaired. The beauty of the latest header is that is hold lots of crud to be removed before each flight. These quick drains suffer from contamination when they are closed before all the bad stuff is purged, thus the particles get stuck on the rubber surface. The early ones had an o-ring material which was not good when using auto fuel and they leaked. If one has the new header then plug up the wing drains per Don's suggestion, then two spares are available the header tank. Paul ============ At 8:35 PM -0500 8/13/04, Clem Nichols wrote: >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clem Nichols" > >I thought we'd determined that the spring-loaded drain in question was the >one in the header tank, not the ones in the wing tanks. That's certainly >the one I have the most trouble with continuing to dribble, and as >previously pointed out, that's probably the most important one when it comes >to checking for water in the fuel system. >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Fox5flyer" >To: >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues >to drip > > >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" >> >> C'mon Don. That's not accurate. I'll bet lots of them took the advice. >> They just didn't tell you. :-) >> Darrel >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: >> To: >> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: My fuel tank spring loaded drain valve continues >> to drip >> >> >> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com >> > >> > In a message dated 8/13/04 7:39:03 AM Pacific Daylight Time, >> > hflynn46531@yahoo.com writes: >> > >> > >> > > >> > > Why not take them out and replace them with a plug? Any water in the >> fuel >> > > system will end up in the bottom of your header tank. I always check >for >> water >> > > there. IT`s the lowest point in the fuel system and thats where the >> water >> > > should end up. >> > > >> > > >> > >> > I said that and they all avoided me. >> > Don Smythe > > > DO NOT ARCHIVE -- ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 07:59:04 PM PST US From: Lmar Subject: Kitfox-List: Gap Stuff --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lmar I have taken a proven method from the Tiger Moth and used normal fabric "tape", the 2" roll that is used over ribs, etc. I simply glued it over the elevator gap and only used "poly brush" and painted it. Worked on the old Moth for 25+ years. Larry --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 11:20:52 PM PST US From: Jim Carriere Subject: Kitfox-List: Misc Construction Question --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Carriere Hello list, I've been subscribed to this for about a month, after reading through the archives. I have a Series 7 kit scattered through my garage and the rest of my house. My question is a little better suited to Skystar tech support, but I didn't call them until too late in the day today. When preparing the steel tube frame of the tail feathers to attach the wooden ribs, how much do you sand the surface of the steel tubes? The builder's manual doesn't say exactly how much. Where each rib attaches, do you sand down to bare metal, or do you only roughen the surface of the powder coating? Serious, albeit very basic question, and thanks in advance. Jim __________________________________ http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 11:43:30 PM PST US From: "kitfoxpilot" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Misc Construction Question --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxpilot" Hi Jim, You only need to sand enough to brake the gloss. Just a good dull finish. And of course clean with solvent prior to adhesive bonding. You don't want to sand through the powder coating. Scott Miller Kitfox Series 7 Seattle ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Carriere" Subject: Kitfox-List: Misc Construction Question > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Carriere > > Hello list, > I've been subscribed to this for about a month, after reading > through the archives. I have a Series 7 kit scattered through my > garage and the rest of my house. > > My question is a little better suited to Skystar tech support, but I > didn't call them until too late in the day today. > > When preparing the steel tube frame of the tail feathers to attach > the wooden ribs, how much do you sand the surface of the steel > tubes? The builder's manual doesn't say exactly how much. Where > each rib attaches, do you sand down to bare metal, or do you only > roughen the surface of the powder coating? > > Serious, albeit very basic question, and thanks in advance. > Jim > > > __________________________________ > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > > ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 11:57:26 PM PST US From: "Steve Cooper" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Misc Construction Question --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" Just enough to give it some tooth, then, make absolutely certain that you clean the area. Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Carriere" Subject: Kitfox-List: Misc Construction Question > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Carriere > > Hello list, > I've been subscribed to this for about a month, after reading > through the archives. I have a Series 7 kit scattered through my > garage and the rest of my house. > > My question is a little better suited to Skystar tech support, but I > didn't call them until too late in the day today. > > When preparing the steel tube frame of the tail feathers to attach > the wooden ribs, how much do you sand the surface of the steel > tubes? The builder's manual doesn't say exactly how much. Where > each rib attaches, do you sand down to bare metal, or do you only > roughen the surface of the powder coating? > > Serious, albeit very basic question, and thanks in advance. > Jim > > > __________________________________ > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > >