Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:13 AM - Re: Electric Prop Failure (Lynn Matteson)
2. 05:44 AM - Re: Electric Prop Failure (Bob Unternaehrer)
3. 06:27 AM - Need spinner for GSC prop on 582 (Gill Levesque)
4. 07:05 AM - Re: Electric Prop Failure (Lynn Matteson)
5. 08:19 AM - Re: PTT switch (Joel Mapes)
6. 08:48 AM - Re: Need spinner for GSC prop on 582 (Bruce Harrington)
7. 09:06 AM - Re: PTT switch (kurt schrader)
8. 10:25 AM - Re: Need spinner for GSC prop on 582 (Gary Algate)
9. 11:29 AM - Re: Re:Kitfox list:engine problem (Floran Higgins)
10. 12:35 PM - Re: Electric Prop Failure (Ronald K. Stevens)
11. 12:38 PM - Three blade prop & 3:1 gearbox (Harris, Robert)
12. 12:55 PM - Re: Kitfox for sale (W Duke)
13. 01:16 PM - Re: Three blade prop & 3:1 gearbox (Gary Algate)
14. 01:24 PM - Photo's re prop (Gary Algate)
15. 01:26 PM - Re: Need spinner for GSC prop on 582 (Bob Robertson)
16. 01:26 PM - Re: Kitfox for sale (VFT@aol.com)
17. 02:02 PM - Re: Photo's re prop (Torgeir Mortensen)
18. 02:09 PM - Re: Photo's re prop (Gary Algate)
19. 02:11 PM - Re: Electric Prop Failure (Torgeir Mortensen)
20. 02:18 PM - Link to Prop Failure (Harris, Robert)
21. 02:28 PM - Re: Link to Prop Failure (Gary Algate)
22. 03:25 PM - Re: New E-Mail Address (John King)
23. 03:37 PM - Re: Off topic - Hacked off (John King)
24. 03:38 PM - Re: Off topic - Hacked off (Steve Cooper)
25. 04:04 PM - Buyin' a plane.... (Lynn Matteson)
26. 04:26 PM - Re: Three blade prop & 3:1 gearbox (Harris, Robert)
27. 04:56 PM - Re: Off topic - Hacked off (Rod Ewing)
28. 04:58 PM - Hinge Play Question? Please help. (Harris, Robert)
29. 05:07 PM - Re: Buyin' a plane.... (Don Pearsall)
30. 05:20 PM - Re: Buyin' a plane.... (Harris, Robert)
31. 05:24 PM - Re: Kitfox for sale (Clifford Begnaud)
32. 05:37 PM - Ground handling. (Rex & Jan Shaw)
33. 05:54 PM - 2nd radio (jareds)
34. 06:18 PM - I think it won't effect your rudder cables at all (Rex & Jan Shaw)
35. 06:45 PM - Re: PTT switch (DC91840@aol.com)
36. 06:55 PM - 912 plug wires (Fred Shiple)
37. 07:40 PM - Re: Electric Prop Failure (RICHARD HUTSON)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Electric Prop Failure |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Please excuse my ignorance, but what is NDT? Is it anything like
magnafluxing or magnaglowing? (that may date me, but I've already
admitted to being long in the tooth:) )
Lynn
do not archive
On Monday, August 23, 2004, at 12:50 AM, kurt schrader wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>
> I must say, I like my prop just as it is. No excess
> movement. I was worried about it from the start,
> always ground running it where a thrown blade would
> clear hazardous areas. Now I'll inspect it more, but
> I still don't know if I could detect any failure point
> without NDT.
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Electric Prop Failure |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Unternaehrer" <shilohcom@c-magic.com>
NDT.... Non Destructive Testing.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lynn Matteson" <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Electric Prop Failure
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
> Please excuse my ignorance, but what is NDT? Is it anything like
> magnafluxing or magnaglowing? (that may date me, but I've already
> admitted to being long in the tooth:) )
> Lynn
> do not archive
>
> On Monday, August 23, 2004, at 12:50 AM, kurt schrader wrote:
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> > <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> >
> > I must say, I like my prop just as it is. No excess
> > movement. I was worried about it from the start,
> > always ground running it where a thrown blade would
> > clear hazardous areas. Now I'll inspect it more, but
> > I still don't know if I could detect any failure point
> > without NDT.
> >
>
> > _-
> > =======================================================================
> > _-
> > =======================================================================
> > _-
> > =======================================================================
> > _-
> > =======================================================================
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> ---
>
>
---
Message 3
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| Subject: | Need spinner for GSC prop on 582 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Gill Levesque <canpilot03@yahoo.ca>
HI All,
Just returned from a weekend fly in to find my spinner cracked and ready to fall
off! So I removed it and am in need of a replacement !! Any one have a old
one or new one kickin around?? I guess I would need a backing plate too!!! Thanks!!
Gil Levesque
Model 4 1050 ,582
GSC 68" prop
Missing spinner
Still alive and flyin!!!!
Gil
---------------------------------
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Electric Prop Failure |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Thanks, Bob. I guess that term would include both of the "magna..."
tests that I'm familiar with from long ago.
Lynn
do not archive
On Monday, August 23, 2004, at 08:56 AM, Bob Unternaehrer wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Unternaehrer"
> <shilohcom@c-magic.com>
>
> NDT.... Non Destructive Testing.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lynn Matteson" <lynnmatt@jps.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Electric Prop Failure
>
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>>
>> Please excuse my ignorance, but what is NDT? Is it anything like
>> magnafluxing or magnaglowing? (that may date me, but I've already
>> admitted to being long in the tooth:) )
>> Lynn
>> do not archive
>>
>> On Monday, August 23, 2004, at 12:50 AM, kurt schrader wrote:
>>
>>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
>>> <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>>>
>>> I must say, I like my prop just as it is. No excess
>>> movement. I was worried about it from the start,
>>> always ground running it where a thrown blade would
>>> clear hazardous areas. Now I'll inspect it more, but
>>> I still don't know if I could detect any failure point
>>> without NDT.
>>>
>>
>>> _-
>>> =====================================================================
>>> ==
>>> _-
>>> =====================================================================
>>> ==
>>> _-
>>> =====================================================================
>>> ==
>>> _-
>>> =====================================================================
>>> ==
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ---
>>
>>
>
> ---
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
Message 5
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Joel Mapes" <Joel.Mapes@roxio.com>
Sorry about that. Outlook Web Access and this list server do not get
along well.
My question regards the installation of stick mounted PTT switches in my
Kitfox 5 project. I plan to use shielded microphone wire and drill the
tube just above the top of the pivot attach point, protecting the wiring
with a rubber grommet. The planned routing of the wire is under the
floorboards, up the cabin sidewall and attaching to the panel mounted
microphone jacks. Does this sound reasonable?
Joel Mapes
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Need spinner for GSC prop on 582 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bruce Harrington" <aerowood@mcsi.net>
Hi Gil,
Years ago I lost my spinner half way between home and the factory fly-in.
While in the air. Landed at the next airport and no damage of significance,
so proceeded to the fly-in. Flew it for 2 or 3 years spinnerless with no
difference in operation, other than the old 582 ran a bit smoother at cruise!
bh
> HI All,
>
> Just returned from a weekend fly in to find my spinner cracked and ready to
fall off! So I removed it and am in need of a replacement !! Any one have a old
one or new one kickin around?? I guess I would need a backing plate too!!!
Thanks!!
>
> Gil Levesque
> Model 4 1050 ,582
> GSC 68" prop
> Missing spinner
>
>
> Still alive and flyin!!!!
>
> Gil
Message 7
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Joel,
That is about how I did mine. One thing you have to
consider is putting a loop in the wire next to the
stick to allow for stick movement. The loop has to be
fastened down in a way that keeps it from chaffing,
but allows all movement.
Kurt S. S-5/NSI turbo
--- Joel Mapes <Joel.Mapes@roxio.com> wrote:
> My question regards the installation of stick
> mounted PTT switches in my Kitfox 5 project.
> I plan to use shielded microphone wire and drill the
> tube just above the top of the pivot attach point,
> protecting the wiring with a rubber grommet.
> The planned routing of the wire is under the
> floorboards, up the cabin sidewall and attaching to
> the panel mounted microphone jacks.
> Does this sound reasonable?
>
>
> Joel Mapes
__________________________________
Message 8
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| Subject: | Need spinner for GSC prop on 582 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
I also lost a spinner off my IFA IVOprop. Just managed to catch the tip of
one prop blade but there was no appreciable damage. It gets your attention
though!
I have been lying without one ever since and haven't noticed any appreciable
difference. Looks ugly tough so I am considering a new 10" spinner from
Ivoprop that is evidently matched to the prop I have (USD$295 for the 10"
diameter model completely finished and ready to mount.)
I've also finished mounting my radiator scoop so I am looking forward to
seeing what effect that has on both cooling efficiency and performance
Gary Algate
Lite2/582
Years ago I lost my spinner half way between home and the factory fly-in.
While in the air. Landed at the next airport and no damage of significance,
so proceeded to the fly-in. Flew it for 2 or 3 years spinnerless with no
difference in operation, other than the old 582 ran a bit smoother at
cruise!
bh
> HI All,
>
> Just returned from a weekend fly in to find my spinner cracked and ready
to
fall off! So I removed it and am in need of a replacement !!
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re:Kitfox list:engine problem |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Floran Higgins" <CliffH@outdrs.net>
Thomas
I suggest that you talk to one of the engine tech reps at Lockwood.
I had a 912UL that had the same symptoms as you describe.
They solved the problem for me.
Floran H.
----- Original Message -----
From: <kirkhull@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re:Kitfox list:engine problem
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: <kirkhull@sbcglobal.net>
>
> Check for water. As cool and wet as this summer has been ( at least in
MO.)
> there is a good chance you got some water in the tank.
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Thomas Lee <thomasleekf@comcast.net>
> >
> > Yesterday when I took off with full throttle, at about 350 ft the
> > engine loss power for 1 to 2 second and then resumed power to climb
> > another 10 seconds.
> > I found power loss again for 1-2 second and then it continued to climb
> > with full power at 5000 rpm. I landed immediately and taxied around
> > the airport for 15 minutes . The engine ran very smooth on the
> > ground. The spark plugs have been used for about 50 hrs.
> >
> > I had 400 hrs on the engine, been using 100 LL for months with TPC.
> > Could it be air in the fuel circuit, damage of the plug wires, fuel
> > impurities ?
> > Grateful for your advice.
> >
> > thomas. Vixen 912UL.
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Electric Prop Failure |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ronald K. Stevens" <rkstevens@verizon.net>
NDT = Non Destructive Testing. Eddy current testing, borescoping, etc.
Lynn Matteson wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
>Please excuse my ignorance, but what is NDT? Is it anything like
>magnafluxing or magnaglowing? (that may date me, but I've already
>admitted to being long in the tooth:) )
>Lynn
>do not archive
>
>On Monday, August 23, 2004, at 12:50 AM, kurt schrader wrote:
>
>
>
>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
>><smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>>
>>I must say, I like my prop just as it is. No excess
>>movement. I was worried about it from the start,
>>always ground running it where a thrown blade would
>>clear hazardous areas. Now I'll inspect it more, but
>>I still don't know if I could detect any failure point
>>without NDT.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>>_-
>>=======================================================================
>>_-
>>=======================================================================
>>_-
>>=======================================================================
>>_-
>>=======================================================================
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Three blade prop & 3:1 gearbox |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Hi Gary,
I am interested in switching to the "Medium" Ivoprop two blade prop like you
have.
What pitch, length and chord do you have and do you still recommend this?
How much does this setup cost?
Can I use my old ultralight IVOPROP hub and buy only the medium blades?
I have a three bladed 72" ultralight IVOPROP with a 3:1 gearbox on my 582.
After seeing pictures of the Kitfox that lost a blade I'm concerned about
losing an engine.
Robert
San Diego
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<em><span
style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>Hi Gary,</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>I am interested in switching to the Medium <span
classSpellE>Ivoprop two blade prop like you have.</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>What pitch, length and chord do you have and do
you still recommend this? How much does this setup cost?</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>Can I use my old ultralight IVOPROP hub and buy
only the medium blades?</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>I have a three bladed 72" <span
classSpellE>ultralight IVOPROP with a 3:1 gearbox on my 582. After seeing pictures
of the <span
classSpellE>Kitfox that lost a blade I'm concerned about losing an engine.</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>Robert</em>
<st1:City><st1:place><em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>San Diego</em></st1:place></st1:City><em><font
face"Courier New"></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'> </em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>
<span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>
<span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox for sale |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: W Duke <n981ms@yahoo.com>
That is awesome deal on a great airplane.
VFT@aol.com wrote:--> Kitfox-List message posted by: VFT@aol.com
Ok guys,
I just got word that the engine for my F1 project will ship the end of Sept. I REALLY need to sell N24ZM. $35,000 or best offer. Pics and info at www.aero-kids.com.
--
Danny Melnik
F1 #25
Melbourne (FL) Rocket Factory
Maxwell Duke
S6/IO240/Phase II Flight Testing
---------------------------------
Message 13
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| Subject: | Three blade prop & 3:1 gearbox |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Hi Robert.
I have the 70" x 2 blade in flight adjustable prop so my pitch is variable.
I changed from the three bladed In flight adjustable prop because I kept
wearing out the lead screw that changes the prop pitch at about 100 hr
intervals. Evidently this is caused by harmonic resonance generated by the
three bladed prop and the 3:1 gear ratio in the C Box. I never had any issue
with vibration that would cause it to throw a blade and I never saw the
vibration tapes break.
I subsequently changed to the Medium blades as it allowed me to continue
using the in-flight adjustable system and I haven't had a lead screw problem
since.
The medium blades won't fit on the Ultra light hub as they are far thicker
and heavier:
In flight adjustable system:
3 blade Ultralight 9.5lb US$950
2 blade Medium 15.7lb US$1,640
Ground adjustable system :
3 Blade Ultralight 8 lb US$490
2 Blade Medium 11.2lb UD$660
With the light 582 engine the additional weight up front didn't necessitate
any balance changes and I couldn't even detect any change in handling.
IVO were great with me as they gave me a full credit on my Ultralight set
prop against the purchase of the medium (I had over 200 hrs on the
ultralight prop).
With the two bladed prop I lost a little climb and picked up some top end
cruise. It is also far quieter than the 3 bladed prop. If you are
considering a change take a close look at the in flight adjustable option.
You'll never go back to fixed pitch.
Nb you can also change the gears in your C box to change the ratio and this
will also address the harmonic resonance problem. This may be far less
costly than changing your prop.
Hope this helps
Gary
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Harris, Robert
Subject: Kitfox-List: Three blade prop & 3:1 gearbox
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
<Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Hi Gary,
I am interested in switching to the "Medium" Ivoprop two blade prop like you
have.
What pitch, length and chord do you have and do you still recommend this?
How much does this setup cost?
Can I use my old ultralight IVOPROP hub and buy only the medium blades?
I have a three bladed 72" ultralight IVOPROP with a 3:1 gearbox on my 582.
After seeing pictures of the Kitfox that lost a blade I'm concerned about
losing an engine.
Robert
San Diego
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<body langEN-US linkblue vlinkpurple style'tab-interval:.5in'>
<em><span
style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>Hi
Gary,</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>I am interested in switching to the Medium
<span
classSpellE>Ivoprop two blade prop like you have.</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>What pitch, length and chord do you have and
do you still recommend this? How much does this setup cost?</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>Can I use my old ultralight IVOPROP hub and
buy only the medium blades?</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>I have a three bladed 72" <span
classSpellE>ultralight IVOPROP with a 3:1 gearbox on my 582. After seeing
pictures of the <span
classSpellE>Kitfox that lost a blade I'm concerned about losing an
engine.</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>Robert</em>
<st1:City><st1:place><em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>San
Diego</em></st1:place></st1:City><em><font
face"Courier New"></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'> </em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>
<span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>
<span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>
Message 14
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Sorry for asking but I came in on the end of this discussion - where do I
find the photos of the prop failure that has been the subject of recent
discussions.
[Gary Algate]
Lite2 582
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Need spinner for GSC prop on 582 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Robertson" <aerocon@telusplanet.net>
Gil,
I have 9" F/G spinners in stock (all cut out and ready for paint) for the 3
blade GSC... Also have a 10" for a two blade....
Give me a call 1-866-418-4164 (tlats toll free) if interested.
Bob R
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gill Levesque" <canpilot03@yahoo.ca>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Need spinner for GSC prop on 582
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Gill Levesque <canpilot03@yahoo.ca>
>
> HI All,
>
> Just returned from a weekend fly in to find my spinner cracked and ready
to fall off! So I removed it and am in need of a replacement !! Any one
have a old one or new one kickin around?? I guess I would need a backing
plate too!!! Thanks!!
>
> Gil Levesque
> Model 4 1050 ,582
> GSC 68" prop
> Missing spinner
>
>
> Still alive and flyin!!!!
>
> Gil
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox for sale |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: VFT@aol.com
I agree :)
In a message dated 8/23/2004 3:55:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time, W Duke <n981ms@yahoo.com>
writes:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: W Duke <n981ms@yahoo.com>
>
>That is awesome deal on a great airplane.
>
>VFT@aol.com wrote:--> Kitfox-List message posted by: VFT@aol.com
>
>Ok guys,
>I just got word that the engine for my F1 project will ship the end of Sept. I REALLY need to sell N24ZM. $35,000 or best offer. Pics and info at www.aero-kids.com.
>
>--
>Danny Melnik
>F1 #25
>Melbourne (FL) Rocket Factory
>
>
>Maxwell Duke
>S6/IO240/Phase II Flight Testing
>
>---------------------------------
>
>
--
Danny Melnik
F1 #25
Melbourne (FL) Rocket Factory
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Photo's re prop |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
Hi Gary,
Here is the link.
http://www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox
Torgeir.
On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 16:25:55 -0400, Gary Algate <algate@attglobal.net>
wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
>
>
> Sorry for asking but I came in on the end of this discussion - where do I
> find the photos of the prop failure that has been the subject of recent
> discussions.
> [Gary Algate]
> Lite2 582
>
>
--
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Message 18
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Thanks Torgeir,
Jeez that would certainly get your attention - I don't know what would be
worse in the air or on the ground, just imagine if that happened on the
ground at an airport with on lookers around.
[Gary Algate]
Hi Gary,
Here is the link.
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Electric Prop Failure |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
Hi Gary (Walsh),
Thank you for the insight report of your incident.
I've got a problem in downloading your lab. report, looks like there is no
pdf file present.
Would it be possible for you to send this one to me as an attachment?
Very much like to see the high res. pictures of the rupture.
Thanks
Cheers
Torgeir.
On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 13:20:23 -0400 01:20:35 PM, kitfoxjunky
<kitfoxjunky@decisionlabs.com> wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxjunky"
> <kitfoxjunky@decisionlabs.com>
>
>
> I am not sure on the orientation of the fracture either Kurt. Lance may
> be
> able to comment, since he now has the prop. Those punch marks are a real
> mystery. I do not think they were the cause of someone hammering on the
> bearing, rather I think they were added to lock the bearing in place. An
> engineer who looked at them said that is not an uncommon practise if you
> are working on a car or a tractor, but it would never be acceptable for
> airplane parts. NSI says the bearing is a press fit, and they would not
> dimple it if it was loose. The previous owner said for sure he did not
> do
> it. Sure would be good to have a time machine to find out how they got
> there. Regardless, this is not the blade that failed.
>
> I found the outside appearance of the cuff interesting. As you can see
> from
> the photograph, the color is not consistent. There are spots where it is
> darker. I had a look at a new NSI hub at Oshkosh that they had cut up to
> show the internal workings, and it did not look like this at all. Maybe
> that is just the way the finish aged.
>
> I find it interesting that you say you have no play in your blades fore
> and
> aft. Wish I had put the blade on new, and could confirm they were tight
> from the start. Mine always had a bit of play in them, and it concerned
> me
> enough that I had asked NSI about it. I was thinking of sending it back
> to
> NSI for a rebuild winter, as the greese and the play were causing me some
> concern. Sure wish I had.
>
> Why the prop let go at that particular time I will never understand. 15
> minutes earlier I was pulling full power on takeoff. You would think if
> already had a crack and was ready to let go, it would have done it then
> instead of in cruise.
>
>
> Gary Walsh
> C-GOOT
> www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox
>
>
> kurt schrader
> <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.co To:
> kitfox-list@matronics.com
> m> cc:
> Sent by: Subject: RE:
> Kitfox-List: Electric Prop Failure
> owner-kitfox-list-server@ma
> tronics.com
>
>
> 08/20/2004 02:04 AM
> Please respond to
> kitfox-list
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>
> Excellent info Gary. Top notch. Glad you are here to
> give us the cold, hard facts.
>
> One thing I am having trouble picking out from the
> photos is the relation of the failure origion to the
> blade orientation. I suspect it is about in line with
> the prop rotation plane on the leading edge side at
> normal pitch. Is that correct? Just a theory.
> Leading edge alignment is from engine power and
> startup? Trailing edge is from shutdown? That would
> assume no significant flaw that overrides the engine
> stresses and that the engine stresses are greater than
> flight stresses. Just me guessing though.
>
> Again I like the strength of those Warp blades. Would
> make a good sword. Bronze age. Iron age. Carbon
> age?
>
> The hub appears to have lost 50% of its strength
> before it let go in shear. It might have been
> impossible to detect on preflight, so your NDT might
> have been the only way to know.
>
> For some reason the metal grain size surprises me.
>
> I checked my blades for movement tonight and found
> them to have none at all by feel other than the GB
> output shaft clicking. Ran into them 3 more times
> working on my scoop. :-( Like hitting a flat fishing
> pole. Better than metal.
>
> Those punch marks bother me too. Never saw anything
> done that way. Someone seems to have forced the
> bearing on with the nearest tool at hand.... Not
> wood. Not socket. Not a pipe, but a punch?
>
> Not pointing fingers allows us to pass on needed info
> here, but there is more than one problem with this
> prop that we need to watch for.
>
> Having just rebuilt my prop, I did not see any of the
> questionable items you found. Getting old and losing
> your eyesight has its advantages, I suppose.
>
> Waiting for NSI's report.... Sorry about Lance's
> medical problems. Might cause a delay.
>
> Kurt S. S-5/NSI turbo
>
> --- kitfoxjunky <kitfoxjunky@decisionlabs.com> wrote:
>
>> John
>>
>> I thought I noticed a vibration too that was not
>> there before..but you know how that kind of thing
>> goes.
>> ...............
>> Something this experience has taught me is that NDT
>> testing is very cheap.
>> ...............
>> From what I am hearing, the NSI product has a pretty
>> good track record. It could be the combination of
>> the 912S (high compression and vibration during
>> start and shut down) and that prop that is the
>> problem. Then again, since I was not the original
>> owner I do not know everything the prop has been
>> through. You never know if everything that should
>> be in the log book is actually there.
>> .............
>> Have a look at the lab report from the lab that
>> documented the prop right after I removed it from
>> the plane. I put it up on my web site. There was
>> something else that turned up that raises some
>> questions. One of the bearing races on the end of
>> the prop was dimpled. A punch was used to make
>> indentations to hold the bearing in place.
>>
>> Gary Walsh
>> C-GOOT
>> www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox
>
>
> _______________________________
>
>
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Message 20
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| Subject: | Link to Prop Failure |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Hey Gary,
Here is the link to photo's of Gary Walsh's prop failure. He almost lost
his engine.
www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox.
I'm glad he shared this because now I'm aware that my engine can fall off if
I loose a blade. I'm not concerned if I lost a blade but if I lost my engine
I think my CG would be so far off I would crash.
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxjunky
Subject: Kitfox-List: Electric Prop Failure
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxjunky"
<kitfoxjunky@decisionlabs.com>
On June 26 I departed Brantford Ontario in my Kitfox IV Anphib for Baker
Valley airport, a remote airport that was having an informal flyin. On
board I had camping gear and my 12 year old daughter. We had a good time
and returned the following day, fighting a 20 knot head wind most of the
way home. After fueling up in Brampton, near Toronto, we turned South
towards Brantford. Making the turn meant we would finally get a tailwind
component from the strong and steady wind. During this 40 minute leg of a
3.5 hr journey, and only a few minutes from our destination airport, we
experienced an incredible noise and vibration. It felt like the engine had
exploded. At the same instant I wittnessed a prop blade depart and lodge
itself in the port float. I pulled the throttle immediately and hit the
master and mags. I was just barley at the parimeter of the Brantford zone
at 1500' AGL, and after calming my daughter down I turned into the wind
looking for an ultralight strip I knew of. I did not even consider trying
for the airport, as I knew from experience that the Kitfox on floats was a
poor glider. Guaging the drift from the strong wind, I decided I could
not make the ultralight strip. I considered the river, but was afraid that
the plane would sink due to the damaged float. Instead I turned downwind
and continued to search for a suitable field. During this time the wind
had pushed me even closer to the airport, and I decided to try for a
runway. We were lucky, and came across the numbers with lots of speed,
making a dead stick cross wind landing. I landed with the gear down, and
the aircraft tracked fine despite the fact that the port nose wheel did not
lock in place. There was only one other aircraft on the field, as it was a
Sunday evening. I will always remember the look on the face of the pilot
and passenger of that Cessna as we glided past him onto the taxiway with a
prop blade sicking up vertically from the left float.
I pulled the aircraft from the taxiway to my hanger, noting that the engine
was sagging considerably, and that it easily moved up and down with each
bump in the taxiway. A couple of fellow pilots met me at my hanger, drawn
by the unusual propeller configuration. They wanted to remove the cowls
and check out the damage. I wanted to secure the plan and get my daughter
away, fearing we would remove the cowls and find the engine hanging by a
thread.
I returned to the field later to survey the damage. The two top tube
clusters on the engine mount had broken away completely, leaving only the
bottom two holding the engine to the airframe. In total, seven tubes had
been severed. There were rubber particals everywhere as parts of the
isolators had desintegrated. Both carbs had vibrated free of the engine,
being held by the fuel lines, throttle and carb cables. In retrospec, the
engine may have shut down itself down due to fuel starvation, rather than
due to my fast reflexes. I did not have safety cables attaching the engine
to the airframe. It was obvious we had come very close to losing the engine
completely in flight. I had beefed up the mount the previous year in
response to a service bulletin from Skystar. Thanks Skystar for posting
service bulletins on the web.
The exhaust canister was damaged. The junctions where the header pipes
enter the exhaust were cracked, and the exhaust pipe itself was ripped from
the canister. The oil tank, which sits on top of the engine, was dented and
cracked from pounding on the engine block. The port float was damaged
(Aerocet 1100 anphibs), with the blade puncturing the float, hitting the
pully assembly and cutting the cable. Surprisingly, the blade itself was
in very good condition. I knew Warp drive made a tough blade, but I never
would have believed it could take that level of abuse without breaking into
pieces.
Of course the NSI hub was damaged. One blade had departed cleanly from the
hub, with half of the cuff remaining in the hub and the remainder on the
end of the blade. The prop had less than 250 hours on it, having been
purchased and installed by the previous owner in the spring of 1998. I
had reported to NSI that there was in increase in greese being thrown from
the hub. The previous owner had put lots of greese in the hub when he
assembled it. NSI told me to remove the greese, and not to idle the engine
below 2100 rpm. I had split the hub and inspected it recently as part of
the annual, and did not observe any cracks. Then again, I was not looking
as closely as I would be now.
The Rotax 912S was removed and inspected by an engineer familiar with this
kind of engine. The gearbox was removed and NDT tested, and the crank was
dialed. Fortuanatley, it was determined that the engine was not damaged. A
slipper clutch was installed at the same time. The engine is also
relatively new, being installed shortly before the NSI prop was added.
I reported the incident to the Transportation Safety Board. Since there
was no damage to people or property, other than the plane, Transport Canada
did not investigate further. I took several photos with a digital camera,
and reported the problem to NSI both via email and telephone. The prop
assembly was then removed and sent to Cambridge Material Testing Labs. I
wanted to ensure its condition was examined and documented before I shipped
it to NSI, in case anything was lost or damaged in shipping. I then
shipped the prop back to NSI. They got it July 27.
NSI is still investigating, and have told me they will be contacting
customers running the 912S and Cap 140 combination once they have completed
their investigation. If you are running a CAP in flight adjustable prop,
especially with the Rotax 912S, I would suggest you check it for cracks.
Look at the groove that runs around the ourside of the cuff. It appears to
act as a stress riser, and seems to be where the crack originated. Check
the photos on my web site. The address is below. If you do not have safety
cables holding your engine to the airframe, I would recommend that you add
them. If you have the 912S, you should consider adding the slipper
clutch.
Considering all the possible scenarios, we were very lucky. I hope to be
flying on wheels before the end of the season, and hopefully back on floats
next year in time for Oshkosh.
Gary Walsh
C-GOOT
www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox
Message 21
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| Subject: | Link to Prop Failure |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Thanks Robert
You are right about losing an engine - I use to fly model airplanes 1/3rd
scale and I threw a blade on a 30" prop that was being driven by a 9
cylinder Seidel radial engine.
Some one once told me that you should always put a safety strap to the
engine just in case and in this instance it saved me about $10,000 in engine
and model. I saw the blade go and immediately shut down the engine. I
remember seeing the front of the plane blur (Sopwith Pup 12ft wingspan) and
then the engine was hanging out the front on the tether.
I landed it safely but when I checked inside entire servo's were hanging by
threads and everything was loose. If not for the tether she would have come
down far differently and been a re-kit candidate.
I think I might just go and put a cable tether on my 582>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Gary A
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I'm glad he shared this because now I'm aware that my engine can fall off if
I loose a blade. I'm not concerned if I lost a blade but if I lost my engine
I think my CG would be so far off I would crash.
Robert
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
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| Subject: | Re: New E-Mail Address |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: John King <kingjohne@adelphia.net>
John,
The "e" is my middle initial. Turns out that just "kingjohn" was
already taken on Adelphia. Do not archive.
--
John King
Warrenton, VA
jdmcbean wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
>
>Soooo... Do we start calling you John ny (e)
>
>Blue Skies
>John & Debra McBean
>"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of John King
>To: Kitfox List
>Subject: Kitfox-List: New E-Mail Address
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: John King <kingjohne@adelphia.net>
>
>To the List,
>
>For those who contact me directly I just dropped my dial-up connection
>in favor of a high speed Internet connection. My new e-mail address is
>now <kingjohne@adelphia.net>. Note the "e" after the "kingjohn".
>
>The old address (kingjohn@erols.com) will be soon dropped.
>Do Not Archive.
>
>--
>John King
>Warrenton, VA
>
>
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Off topic - Hacked off |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: John King <kingjohne@adelphia.net>
Kurt,
I use Norton 2002 Intranet Security by Symantec on my computer. Sometimes in the
evenings I get several warnings that someone has attempted to access my computer
and the attempt was blocked. It provides an IPO address for each hit.
My e-mail going out and coming in is always checked for viruses. So far Norton
has done its job for me. I was sure glad to hear you were not using Norton,
otherwise I would start worrying.
--
John King
Warrenton, VA
kurt schrader wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>
>Hi John,
>
>Just so everyone knows, I don't think I am carrying
>anything that passes along, or I would drop out
>immediately. The hack seems specifically to attack or
>use my computer. That is why nothing gets detected.
>
>But I know you asked a different question John. I am
>using Zone Alarm as a firewall. I will contact them
>when I have the time to see if they can help.
>Microsoft also. Whenever I have the time....
>
>Yahoo has done a very good job of cleaning my e-mail.
>They keep it updated. In addition I have Trend
>Micro's Housecall, which is updated as much as
>anything I know. It updates every time I use it.
>
>Then I use Spybot to clean out the spyware and I dump
>cookies almost daily myself.
>
>My computer has a firmware virus protector of its own
>too.
>
>I see 4-6 e-mail virus' daily and hundreds of other
>attacks coming in. Zone Alarm records and blocks
>them. I counted 2066 in the last 24 hrs, and I have
>not been on line but a small portion of that time.
>
>This was a different hit. Relatively long modem
>activity. That is why I had time to cut it off. And
>the changes were immediate. My DVD instantly blocked,
>etc. CPU speed to a crawl or stopped. Lockups.
>
>If I take the time - and it will take a lot - I can
>probably clean it up. But that could take me a week
>of nothing but computer work. It has been 12 years
>since I studyied computers. I know there are faster,
>more up to date people around.
>
>And the hacker knows who I am so he can come right
>back. I have a hardware firewall that I can get
>activated for a few hundred $ after the computer is
>cleaned up. I might as well get a new computer then
>and save what I can from this one. That is probably
>as good as it gets. And as expensive. $$$$
>
>My current goal is to complete my KF scoop, my wing
>strut fairings and vortex generators. Then final
>testing. Don't have time to fool with this my slow,
>pokey self...
>
>I did a ground run with the scoop on today. :-)
>
>Kurt S.
>
>--- John King <kingjohne@adelphia.net> wrote:
>
>
>
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Off topic - Hacked off |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
I havn't seen Manchurian Candidate yet...maybe I'll pass if it's as un
engaging as you say. I worked today 7-3. 12-8 tomorrow. I guess i'm going to
start working mids in a week or so...if I still have the job.
I'm waiting to hear about two interviews I had...prolly won't get either
one...I'm more than a little depressed by the whole affair...
Love ya kiddo...
Steve
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | Buyin' a plane.... |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
To the group in general-
I'm off to buy a IV, and I'm floatin' on air.....
Lynn
Message 26
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|
| Subject: | Three blade prop & 3:1 gearbox |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Gary, that's great information. Thanks for your help.
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
I have the 70" x 2 blade in flight adjustable prop so my pitch is variable.
I changed from the three bladed In flight adjustable prop because I kept
wearing out the lead screw that changes the prop pitch at about 100 hr
intervals. Evidently this is caused by harmonic resonance generated by the
three bladed prop and the 3:1 gear ratio in the C Box. I never had any issue
with vibration that would cause it to throw a blade and I never saw the
vibration tapes break.
I subsequently changed to the Medium blades as it allowed me to continue
using the in-flight adjustable system and I haven't had a lead screw problem
since.
The medium blades won't fit on the Ultra light hub as they are far thicker
and heavier:
In flight adjustable system:
3 blade Ultralight 9.5lb US$950
2 blade Medium 15.7lb US$1,640
Ground adjustable system :
3 Blade Ultralight 8 lb US$490
2 Blade Medium 11.2lb UD$660
With the light 582 engine the additional weight up front didn't necessitate
any balance changes and I couldn't even detect any change in handling.
IVO were great with me as they gave me a full credit on my Ultralight set
prop against the purchase of the medium (I had over 200 hrs on the
ultralight prop).
With the two bladed prop I lost a little climb and picked up some top end
cruise. It is also far quieter than the 3 bladed prop. If you are
considering a change take a close look at the in flight adjustable option.
You'll never go back to fixed pitch.
Nb you can also change the gears in your C box to change the ratio and this
will also address the harmonic resonance problem. This may be far less
costly than changing your prop.
Hope this helps
Gary
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Harris, Robert
Subject: Kitfox-List: Three blade prop & 3:1 gearbox
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
<Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Hi Gary,
I am interested in switching to the "Medium" Ivoprop two blade prop like you
have.
What pitch, length and chord do you have and do you still recommend this?
How much does this setup cost?
Can I use my old ultralight IVOPROP hub and buy only the medium blades?
I have a three bladed 72" ultralight IVOPROP with a 3:1 gearbox on my 582.
After seeing pictures of the Kitfox that lost a blade I'm concerned about
losing an engine.
Robert
San Diego
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<body langEN-US linkblue vlinkpurple style'tab-interval:.5in'>
<em><span
style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>Hi
Gary,</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>I am interested in switching to the Medium
<span
classSpellE>Ivoprop two blade prop like you have.</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>What pitch, length and chord do you have and
do you still recommend this? How much does this setup cost?</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>Can I use my old ultralight IVOPROP hub and
buy only the medium blades?</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>I have a three bladed 72" <span
classSpellE>ultralight IVOPROP with a 3:1 gearbox on my 582. After seeing
pictures of the <span
classSpellE>Kitfox that lost a blade I'm concerned about losing an
engine.</em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>Robert</em>
<st1:City><st1:place><em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New";font-weight:bold'>San
Diego</em></st1:place></st1:City><em><font
face"Courier New"></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'> </em>
<em><font
size2 colorblack face"Courier New"><span style'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New";font-weight:bold'></em>
<span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>
<span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>
<span style'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Off topic - Hacked off |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rod Ewing" <rode@alaska.com>
Gee, thanks Steve I think your swell too, I just know Scott in Nome will be
elated....
Rod ...Meadow Lakes, Alaska
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Off topic - Hacked off
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
>
> I havn't seen Manchurian Candidate yet...maybe I'll pass if it's as un
> engaging as you say. I worked today 7-3. 12-8 tomorrow. I guess i'm going
to
> start working mids in a week or so...if I still have the job.
>
> I'm waiting to hear about two interviews I had...prolly won't get either
> one...I'm more than a little depressed by the whole affair...
>
> Love ya kiddo...
>
> Steve
>
>
Message 28
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|
| Subject: | Hinge Play Question? Please help. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
The holes in one of my elevator hinges are a little worn. (I can move the
elevator up and down at the hinge 1/32" of an inch.) The rest of the hinges
are okay.
How worn can an elevator hinge be before being replaced?
Is there a way to remove the play?
Do I need to worry about flutter?
Robert
KF Model II 430 hours
San Diego
Message 29
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| Subject: | Buyin' a plane.... |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" <donpearsall@comcast.net>
Lynn,
What are you buying? Pre-built, kit, what??
Don Pearsall
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson
Subject: Kitfox-List: Buyin' a plane....
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
To the group in general-
I'm off to buy a IV, and I'm floatin' on air.....
Lynn
Message 30
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| Subject: | Buyin' a plane.... |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
That's a great feeling. Congratulations. What did you buy?
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson
Subject: Kitfox-List: Buyin' a plane....
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
To the group in general-
I'm off to buy a IV, and I'm floatin' on air.....
Lynn
Message 31
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|
| Subject: | Re: Kitfox for sale |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
No kidding folks, this is the deal of a lifetime. I've been closely
watching the used kitfox market for the last 5-6 years and in that time have
purchased 3, that's right 3, model 5 kitfoxes. So I hope you understand that
what I say here has some research behind it.
I have probably seen every model 5/6 that has been advertised for sale in
that time and have never seen one that even comes close to being the bargain
that this one is!!!!!!!
This is a no nonsense, "award winning", totally awesome show plane! If you
have never seen it, you just don't know what you are missing. If you ever
had the slightest inkling to upgrade to a model 5 or just want one that is
really nice, you simply can't do better than this one.
I give you these words totally unsolicited. I have only met the Melnik's
twice at Oshkosh and don't know them other than from those meetings.
So don't walk; you better run and buy this plane! It simply can't last at
this price.
Best Regards,
Cliff
Erie, CO
Kitfox 5 Lycoming 0-235-1/2
p.s.-heck, this plane was a good deal at the $48,000 they were asking on
their web site. I'll bet they have $55k+ invested in it.
> That is awesome deal on a great airplane.
>
>
> Ok guys,
> I just got word that the engine for my F1 project will ship the end of
Sept. I REALLY need to sell N24ZM. $35,000 or best offer. Pics and info at
www.aero-kids.com.
>
> --
> Danny Melnik
> F1 #25
> Melbourne (FL) Rocket Factory
>
>
> Maxwell Duke
> S6/IO240/Phase II Flight Testing
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Ground handling. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
I've noticed that "Airdale" has a bungee type main gear that has a 10.5"
wider
stance than the standard Kitfox main gear. They claim that it improves
handling
on the ground. Has anyone out there tried it?
I haven't exactly tried it but the track on the spring aluminium Groves
undercarriage that I have is also wider than the standard Kitfox bungee u/c
and I believe my plane is less prone to ground loops because of this point.
It's obvious that if you have a wider track it is easier to keep the C of G
behind the main wheels. It's when you don't that she comes around.
Rex
rexjan@bigpond.com
Message 33
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|
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: jareds <jareds@verizon.net>
FLying in DC's restricted airspace requires monitoring and switching
between several frequencies. I'm wanting to incorporate a handheld
along with my tiny Microair dash intercom system? Anyone tackled that
and could a person just plug right in to the existing jacks?
Jared
Rex & Jan Shaw wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
>
>I've noticed that "Airdale" has a bungee type main gear that has a 10.5"
>wider
>stance than the standard Kitfox main gear. They claim that it improves
>handling
>on the ground. Has anyone out there tried it?
>
>I haven't exactly tried it but the track on the spring aluminium Groves
>undercarriage that I have is also wider than the standard Kitfox bungee u/c
>and I believe my plane is less prone to ground loops because of this point.
>It's obvious that if you have a wider track it is easier to keep the C of G
>behind the main wheels. It's when you don't that she comes around.
>
>Rex
>rexjan@bigpond.com
>
>
>
>
Message 34
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| Subject: | I think it won't effect your rudder cables at all |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
Those light springs in the cabin just keep the cables from flopping in the
case of no foot pressure on the pedals. So foot pressure and those light
springs both contribute to cable tension. The cables between the pedals and
rudder horns under tension become a solid link. The rudder horns are
connected via chains and the springs we are discussing to the tail wheel
steering horns. Now any pressure turning or attempting to turn the tail
wheel is applied back through the chains and discussed springs to the rudder
cables that will pull against foot pressure. Now excess force that is
applied back is absorbed by those discussed springs. If the springs are the
original tension springs then they just stretch out more and more as more
excess force is applied. However if one swaps those tension springs for
compression springs they squeeze up rather than stretch out BUT can only
squeeze until we get coil bind at which point something has to give, That
could be the wheel resisting the force trying to turn it, your foot forced
back on the appropriate pedal or the locking device in the tail wheel
letting go and allowing the tail wheel to swivel. The other thing though is
there is more tension on the appropriate rudder cable while this is
happening because that compression spring has closed right up to the point
of coil bind and become a solid in effect. The original tension spring would
just keep stretching and even although as it does the pressure is ever
increasing it is not like a solid the compression spring becomes. Also as
the compression spring reaches coil bind there is a jarring moment that is
taken in the whole line including the appropriate cable.
The jarring moment and increased pressure applied through the cable is my
concern. I am not saying it is a problem. In fact I was asking if any one
had thought about it and/or decided it was a worry or problem.
Should a rudder cable fail during a ground roll it would probably cause a
ground loop at the least. However if a cable failed in flight due to
previous strain on the ground it would not be nice either and some clever
flying at least would be needed to get out of it and a change of underwear
if not a coffin would be called for. I suppose one could compromise with a
hospital !
Rex.
PS
I do agree that the compression springs would most likely give better
control. It's a matter of relative tensions.
rexjan@bigpond.com
Message 35
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: DC91840@aol.com
Joel: thats how I done mine(Classic IV)
works great.
Message 36
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Fred Shiple <fredshiple@sbcglobal.net>
A friend with a newly completed Zenair 701/912 had two spark plug caps burned by
the heat shield on the exhaust header- much less room under that cowl than we
see. He's re-routed the exhaust, but needs to replace the caps. Does anyone
know if the spark plug wire can be separated at the cap or will he need to replace
the cap and wire back to the ignition module as a single unit? The Rotax
catalogue does not list a separate spark plug cap.
Fred
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: Electric Prop Failure |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "RICHARD HUTSON" <rhutson@midsouth.rr.com>
non destructive testing = NDT
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lynn Matteson" <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Electric Prop Failure
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
> Please excuse my ignorance, but what is NDT? Is it anything like
> magnafluxing or magnaglowing? (that may date me, but I've already
> admitted to being long in the tooth:) )
> Lynn
> do not archive
>
> On Monday, August 23, 2004, at 12:50 AM, kurt schrader wrote:
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> > <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> >
> > I must say, I like my prop just as it is. No excess
> > movement. I was worried about it from the start,
> > always ground running it where a thrown blade would
> > clear hazardous areas. Now I'll inspect it more, but
> > I still don't know if I could detect any failure point
> > without NDT.
> >
>
> > _-
> > =======================================================================
> > _-
> > =======================================================================
> > _-
> > =======================================================================
> > _-
> > =======================================================================
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
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