Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:58 AM - Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. (Michel Verheughe)
2. 02:39 AM - Re: SV: Jabiru (Michel Verheughe)
3. 05:56 AM - Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. (Larry Huntley)
4. 06:17 AM - Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
5. 07:27 AM - Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. (Larry Huntley)
6. 07:41 AM - Re: SV: Jabiru (Lowell Fitt)
7. 07:57 AM - Re: Fuel Mizer vrs NavMan (vicwj@earthlink.net)
8. 08:32 AM - Re: Fuel Mizer vrs NavMan (Clifford Begnaud)
9. 08:36 AM - Engine Monitors? (Clifford Begnaud)
10. 08:42 AM - Re: Plane talk (Michel Verheughe)
11. 09:17 AM - Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. (jimshumaker)
12. 09:40 AM - Re: Engine Monitors? (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
13. 10:39 AM - Re: Engine Monitors? (Ben Baltrusaitis)
14. 10:54 AM - Re: SV: Jabiru (Kerry Skyring)
15. 11:17 AM - ZERO oil temp? (Raystuff7@aol.com)
16. 11:31 AM - Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. (Kerry Skyring)
17. 11:58 AM - Re: SV: Jabiru (Michel Verheughe)
18. 01:43 PM - Re: SV: Jabiru (Steve Cooper)
19. 01:52 PM - Re: ZERO oil temp? (Bill Hammond)
20. 02:27 PM - Re: SV: Jabiru (Michel Verheughe)
21. 04:50 PM - Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. (dwight purdy)
22. 05:32 PM - Fly-in - DFS (jdmcbean)
23. 06:35 PM - Trailering a Kitfox (Jimmie Blackwell)
24. 07:18 PM - Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. (roger augenstein)
25. 07:35 PM - Re: SV: Jabiru (Roger L)
26. 08:08 PM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
27. 08:24 PM - Four Stoke Engines (Dee Young)
28. 08:54 PM - Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. ()
29. 10:36 PM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Don Pearsall)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
Shane Fewings wrote:
> I have a question regarding the method used to apply the Gap Seal tape.
This is what I did last spring, Shane:
For both the elevator and rudder, I used a two inches 3M transparent tape that
I "glued," sticky side up, to a long piece of plastic by spraying water. Then,
in the middle, I laid a 3/4" transparent tape, sticky side down. The "water
glue" is to prevent the 2" to lift with static when applying the 3/4" tape.
Then I applied more water spray to the top of everything. I cut that long
stripe in lengths equal to the distances between the hinges of the rudder and
the elevator.
Last, I apply them on both sides but each time pressing the elevator or rudder
to its maximum course in the opposite direction, and pressing the water
droplets out of the tape. Note that the areas over the hinges are not gap
sealed. I want to be able to access and remove them for inspection.
It works fine for me, it is still holding and looks fine. I did notice more
elevator authority after gap sealing. Now I can land with the tailwheel first,
if I want.
Cheers,
Michel
Message 2
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
Lowell Fitt wrote:
> My strong advice to those looking for engines - check the manufacturer's
> website for documentation especially service bulletins.
I entirely agree with you Lowell and Paul.
Some years ago I was producing the newsletter for my company that was making
maritime engine room and bridge instruments, maritime simulators, radar vessel
traffic surveillance and radar APP, TWR and GND systems.
All divisions wanted their own newsletter with their modified logo and style,
that was supposed to come out whenever they had a need to communicate to our
potential customers.
I said: No. All divisions were to merge their mailing lists, their articles,
the logo and style will be the same for all, and the newsletter will come out
once a month, regularly!
Because our customers needed to feel that they could trust us, even if they
didn't read the stuff. They were receiving something from us at regular
interval. And hopefully, the day they decide to shop for something, they would
remember us as a serious company.
I entirely agree, the Rotax way of informing their customers is perfect. We
feel safe and it is the soundest marketing strategy for them too.
... but is the Rotax 912 a better engine than the Jabiru 2200?
Cheers,
Michel
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Larry Huntley" <asq1@adelphia.net>
I used Ski Saver tape. Put elevator in down position,applied tape on
top,.cut it to adhere about 3/8" on each side. Worked well until cracking
about 3 yrs later. No problem in below freezing weather. Peeled off W/ heat
gun and replaced. Increased elevator authority significantly.
Larry Huntley,Kitfox 4-1200,EA81,Dundee,NY,USA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Pearsall" <donpearsall@comcast.net>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Applying Gap Seal tape.
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall"
<donpearsall@comcast.net>
>
> Hi Don,
> I have seen the "S" method you have mentioned. It is typically done with
> fabric. I instructed for a while in a Maule that had this, and I did not
> like the looks of it. There was always dirt, mud and water down in the
gap.
>
> Glider flyers have a Teflon tape they use for gap sealing. I think the way
> to apply it would be to move the elevator down to it's downward limit and
> then apply it tight. That way when the elevator is level, there will be
the
> least amount of bulge in the tape from flexing.
>
> BUT, others may have a better way and please feel free to chime in.
>
>
> Don Pearsall
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> AlbertaIV@aol.com
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Applying Gap Seal tape.
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
>
> Shane,
> You only need to apply to the upper side. That way it looks best and does
> not trap water in the folds.
>
> Don Pearsall
>
>
> Don P.
> You say top side only. I've heard of the "S" method where two tapes
are
>
> overlapped by 1/2 where one sticks to the upper side (stabilizer) and the
> other sticks to the lower side (elevator) as you pass it through the hinge
> opening. This method always seemed to me that it would as you say, trap
> all kinds
> of stuff.
> If you run a straight piece of tape on the top only, do you apply it
> with
> the elevator up/down or straight? Or, am I missing the one tape on top
> method?
> I'm in the process of doing all the speed mods and have put off doing
> the
> gap sealing tape because I always felt there must be a better way and
didn't
>
> like the trap you mention.
>
> Don Smythe
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
> I used Ski Saver tape. Put elevator in down position,applied tape on
> top,.cut it to adhere about 3/8" on each side. Worked well until cracking
> about 3 yrs later. No problem in below freezing weather. Peeled off W/ heat
> gun and replaced. Increased elevator authority significantly.
> Larry Huntley,Kitfox 4-1200,EA81,Dundee,NY,USA
>
>
Larry,
This sounds more attractive than the "S" method. Which way does the
bulge go when the elevator is raised to the neutral position? Also, did you put
the tape all the way across (covering the hinge area)? It seems that
inspection could be done looking through the tape or from the bottom. If you ever
have
to remove the elevator, you would have to remove the tape anyway no mater how
you did it. Right? Also, why couldn't you put the tapes on the bottom also?
Seems that would add even better airflow with the bottom also sealed.
Don Smythe
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Larry Huntley" <asq1@adelphia.net>
> >
>
> Larry,
> This sounds more attractive than the "S" method. Which way does the
> bulge go when the elevator is raised to the neutral position? Also, did
you put
> the tape all the way across (covering the hinge area)?
Hi Don,
The bulge tucks down as the elevator is raised. I did cut slits at each
hinge edge,but don't know if it is neccessary. If I didn't,it would keep
water out of the hinges.
It seems that
> inspection could be done looking through the tape or from the bottom.
The tape is clear,so you can see the hinges thru the top.I am on grass,so
eventually the lower(sticky) side that was exposed began picking up a bit of
debris.
If you ever have
> to remove the elevator, you would have to remove the tape anyway no mater
how
> you did it. Right?
Yes,it comes off easily w/ a heat gun.Just to be careful not to start
shrinking the finishing tapes.
Also, why couldn't you put the tapes on the bottom also?
> Seems that would add even better airflow with the bottom also sealed.
I believe the main purpose of the tape is to keep air from bleeding thru
the gap.One tape does this,but perhaps something would also be gained by
smoothing up the bottom. Dunno. Larry Huntley,Kitfox
4-1200,EA81,Dundee,NY,USA
>
> Don Smythe
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
Message 6
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Michael, Which is better? I don't feel knowledgeable enough to go there.
A buddy herein Cameron Park has a Jabiru in his Sonex. It appears to be a
fine engine. My only concern is that individuals have and will make
decisions based on what they hear. Bad info from a manufacturer is not good
news to an owner or prospective owner, but no news is not necessarily good
news. I feel I have a pretty good handle on what I have because of Rotax
almost overdoing it on the service letters and the number of units flying,
particularly with the 8 or so guys I regularly fly with and issues that have
come up in our collective 5000 hours.
I have no issue with other's choices. I do get concerned when mention is
made of the apparent unreliability of Rotax engines as indicated by the
frequent service bulletins/letters, when compared with other engine
manufacturer's silence.
One thing I think I can say with utmost certainty - the perfect engine has
not been manufactured yet. We will all buy some baggage that we really
don't want to deal with. We will have to make choices based on the info we
have available, I just think more is better.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michel Verheughe" <michel@online.no>
Subject: Re: SV: Kitfox-List: Jabiru
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
>
> Lowell Fitt wrote:
> > My strong advice to those looking for engines - check the manufacturer's
> > website for documentation especially service bulletins.
>
> I entirely agree with you Lowell and Paul.
> Some years ago I was producing the newsletter for my company that was
making
> maritime engine room and bridge instruments, maritime simulators, radar
vessel
> traffic surveillance and radar APP, TWR and GND systems.
> All divisions wanted their own newsletter with their modified logo and
style,
> that was supposed to come out whenever they had a need to communicate to
our
> potential customers.
>
> I said: No. All divisions were to merge their mailing lists, their
articles,
> the logo and style will be the same for all, and the newsletter will come
out
> once a month, regularly!
>
> Because our customers needed to feel that they could trust us, even if
they
> didn't read the stuff. They were receiving something from us at regular
> interval. And hopefully, the day they decide to shop for something, they
would
> remember us as a serious company.
>
> I entirely agree, the Rotax way of informing their customers is perfect.
We
> feel safe and it is the soundest marketing strategy for them too.
>
> ... but is the Rotax 912 a better engine than the Jabiru 2200?
>
> Cheers,
> Michel
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Fuel Mizer vrs NavMan |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "vicwj@earthlink.net" <vicwj@earthlink.net>
List, I used the Navman on 88 VJ which is now owned by Cliff B.
I could see no difference in the two products as I had one of each to
compare. The only difference is the price in my opinion. You may want to
ask Cliff B.how he likes it.
Vic
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Andy fultz@trip.net
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Fuel Mizer vrs NavMan
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andy" <fultz@trip.net>
Jim,
This post begs the questions of, what is the difference, what are the
"modifications", and what is the "danger" in using the NAVMAN? Inquiring
minds want to know.
Andy F.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Aircraft
Spruce
coot@yahoogroups.com; da2a@yahoogroups.com; Aircar@yahoogroups.com;
canard-aviators@yahoogroups.com; Corby_Starlet@yahoogroups.com;
navion_aircraft_mail@yahoogroups.com;
piper-cub-builders@yahoogroups.com;
quicksilverultralightowners@yahoogroups.com; RV10@yahoogroups.com;
subaruaircraft@yahoogroups.com; europa-list@matronics.com;
kitfox-list@matronics.com; kolb-list@matronics.com
Subject: Kitfox-List: Fuel Mizer vrs NavMan
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Aircraft Spruce <fun_plane@yahoo.com>
Builders,
Thanks for bringing the matter of Fuel Mizer vs.
NavMan fuel computers to our attention. We have
carried Fuel Mizer for a couple of years and had never
heard of NavMan. We asked the manufacturer of NavMan
about the difference in the units, and as you can see
from the following commentary there is definitely a
difference, only the Fuel Mizer is recommended for
Aviation use. Fuel Mizer has been thoroughly tested
in aviation applications and is certified for
CAO-95-45 aircraft in the Australia.
Best Regards,
Jim Irwin
President, Aircraft Spruce
----- Original Message -----
From: SlipStream Industries, Inc.
Subject: Questions Regarding Fuel Mizer
Dear Jim:
I am forwarding an email I received from Ole Jensen,
President of Boss Products, the manufacturer of the
Fuel Mizer under license from Navman. SlipStream is
Boss Product's North American distributor. In his
response to the questions posed yesterday, he
references certain modifications and approvals
received for use of this product in aviation. The
exact language found on the cover of the Installation
and Instruction manual is as follows:
This instrument has been modified to comply with
Australian Engineering order HEO-469 and certified for
CAO 95-25 type aircraft in Australia.
Please let me know if you have any questions, or
desire any further information.
Kindest regards,
Mike Puhl
SlipStream International
----- Original Message -----
From: Ole Jensen
Subject: Re: Mizer.
Dear Mike:
The question raised regarding the Navman fuel
flow meter and the Mizer is a common one that has been
around for many years and a lot of people have lost
money and endangered themselves by purchasing the
Navman for use in aviation. Nearly all the Navman
units purchased for this application have failed and
Navman refuses to replace them under warranty. Several
years ago we negotiated with Navman and paid a
licensing fee that enabled us to make the appropriate
modifications for use in aviation. In addition, the
Mizer has been registered with CASA (the equivalent to
your FAA) and certified by a qualified aeronautical
engineer. Boss Products paid to have the appropriate
modifications made for use in civil aviation, and
these modifications have been improved upon several
times since. As a result, the Mizer enjoys an
excellent reliability record and has been certified
according to CAO order no.HEO-469 as printed on the
cover of the installation manual.
Any one doubting the validity of our agreement
with Navman is free to contact the Vice President of
Navman in New Zealand, Mr. Mark Michell, and he will
verify these facts. Boss Products is the only company
in the world licensed to modify and distribute this
particular product. Unfortunately, some unscrupulous
marine dealers still offer the Navman for use in
unapproved applications despite the knowledge that the
manufacturer strictly prohibits this practice. Greed
and ignorance are usually the motivator. I can also
tell you that the price differences between the Navman
and Fuel Mizer are reasonably close, especially
considering the potential danger for misuse in a
non-approved aviation application. Further, I spoke
with Navman earlier today and was told that no one in
the U.S. is offering this unit for anywhere close to
US $99.00, and that the suggested retail price is US
$299.00, though they offer special MAP pricing from
time to time.
Hope this helps to clear up this issue. Please let me
know if I can be of further assistance in any way.
Regards,
Ole Jensen
President
_______________________________
Express yourself with Y! Messenger! Free. Download now.
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel Mizer vrs NavMan |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
I'll go ahead and comment on this, I like the display unit, but I don't like
the flow sensor. It is made of plastic and has 3/8" plastic hose fittings
instead of 5/16". I'm not comfortable with the plastic hose fittings and
don't know what the failure mode of this unit is. I plan to replace it soon
when we build a new instrument panel this winter. Will most likely get a
Flowscan sender to go with a new Engine Monitor. We are seriously
considering the AIM-1 or 2 from I-K Technologies.
Best Regards,
Cliff
Kitfox 5, Lyc 0-235
360 hours
Erie, CO
>
> List, I used the Navman on 88 VJ which is now owned by Cliff B.
>
> I could see no difference in the two products as I had one of each to
> compare. The only difference is the price in my opinion. You may want to
> ask Cliff B.how he likes it.
>
>
> Vic
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Engine Monitors? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
We're planning a new instrument panel right now and are seriously
considering ditching all the analog gauges and going with an integrated
Engine Monitor. I've looked into the EIS, Rocky Mountain Instruments, IK
2000, ACS 2002, Vision Micro and the New Grand Rapids color monitor.
All are very nice, but so far it seems the I-K technologies products offer
the most bang for the buck. Does anyone have any other suggestions?
Thanks,
Cliff
Kiftox 5, Lyc 0-235
Message 10
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
kurt schrader wrote:
> I married my plane.
Yes, I understand now and I feel ashamed that I ever considered asking you
hand, Sir. You are truly in love and I can but respect that. :-)
kurt schrader wrote in another email:
> You mentioned larger inlets and outlets.
My mistake: I meant: larger outlet only. The size of the inlet is of course,
dictated by the size of the ducts.
> Does your local Jabaru dealer have any input on how their
> own plane engine cooling has been working?
They have a rather large fleet of Jabiru aircraft at Stavanger, the place in
south Norway where the dealer is located. Last fly-in we had in the mountains,
five of them came to visit us. They also have a couple of Kitfoxes installed
with the 2200 and I took, this summer a lot of pictures of the installation on
a model IV.
Of course, they are all happy campers with their Jabiru and never mention
cooling problems. Those who try get first a horse's head in their bed, then a
pair of cement shoes at the bottom of the North Sea.
Just kidding, of course. I know of a Kitfox that had cooling problems. But it
was with the older type of Jabiru. Apparently the very latest type that has
arrived in Norway develops 85 HP and not 80 like before. Don't know if it's of
very much help, though.
Cheers,
Michel
do not archive
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jimshumaker" <jimshumaker@sbcglobal.net>
Don
The double sided method adds weight and a place for dirt to get stuck. The
S method is the least wearing on the tape as a properly installed tape is
always under the same tension no matter what the position of the elevator.
But the S method does have more gaps for the hinges and dirt and grit will
get under the tape and create problems. At our low speeds and with regular
changes of tape, either method is practical. In fact I will probably go
with the on top only method on my next tape change.
Jim Shumaker
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Huntley" <asq1@adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Applying Gap Seal tape.
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Larry Huntley" <asq1@adelphia.net>
>
>
> > >
> >
> > Larry,
> > This sounds more attractive than the "S" method. Which way does the
> > bulge go when the elevator is raised to the neutral position? Also, did
> you put
> > the tape all the way across (covering the hinge area)?
>
> Hi Don,
> The bulge tucks down as the elevator is raised. I did cut slits at each
> hinge edge,but don't know if it is neccessary. If I didn't,it would keep
> water out of the hinges.
>
> It seems that
> > inspection could be done looking through the tape or from the bottom.
>
> The tape is clear,so you can see the hinges thru the top.I am on
grass,so
> eventually the lower(sticky) side that was exposed began picking up a bit
of
> debris.
>
> If you ever have
> > to remove the elevator, you would have to remove the tape anyway no
mater
> how
> > you did it. Right?
>
> Yes,it comes off easily w/ a heat gun.Just to be careful not to start
> shrinking the finishing tapes.
>
>
> Also, why couldn't you put the tapes on the bottom also?
> > Seems that would add even better airflow with the bottom also sealed.
>
> I believe the main purpose of the tape is to keep air from bleeding thru
> the gap.One tape does this,but perhaps something would also be gained by
> smoothing up the bottom. Dunno. Larry Huntley,Kitfox
> 4-1200,EA81,Dundee,NY,USA
> >
> > Don Smythe
> > DO NOT ARCHIVE
> >
> >
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Monitors? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 9/19/04 8:37:02 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
shoeless@barefootpilot.com writes:
> We're planning a new instrument panel right now and are seriously
> considering ditching all the analog gauges and going with an integrated
> Engine Monitor. I've looked into the EIS, Rocky Mountain Instruments, IK
> 2000, ACS 2002, Vision Micro and the New Grand Rapids color monitor.
> All are very nice, but so far it seems the I-K technologies products offer
> the most bang for the buck. Does anyone have any other suggestions?
> Thanks,
> Cliff
> Kiftox 5, Lyc 0-235
>
Cliff,
The only thing I can say is that my EIS has worked flawless for 3 years.
Take that back, one time it acted a bit strange. I cycled the power and it
worked fine. Also, I not absolutely sure but I think the EIS folks will stand
behind any failures for life. Might need to check with them on that statement
but I believe I heard them say that once.
Don Smythe
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Monitors? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ben Baltrusaitis" <ben@gmpexpress.net>
Yes, Cliff, try Tracy Crook:
http://www.rotaryaviation.com/
Right now he is having trouble with his web site as a result of Ivan. After it
is working again, the engine monitor information will be available.
Ben
----- Original Message -----
From: Clifford Begnaud
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, September 19, 2004 11:36 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Engine Monitors?
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
We're planning a new instrument panel right now and are seriously
considering ditching all the analog gauges and going with an integrated
Engine Monitor. I've looked into the EIS, Rocky Mountain Instruments, IK
2000, ACS 2002, Vision Micro and the New Grand Rapids color monitor.
All are very nice, but so far it seems the I-K technologies products offer
the most bang for the buck. Does anyone have any other suggestions?
Thanks,
Cliff
Kiftox 5, Lyc 0-235
Message 14
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kerry Skyring" <kerryskyring@hotmail.com>
Michel wrote...
Oh, I really like the look of my model 3, Kerry. And I could install a 912
>without changing the cowling. So, why do I choose a Jabiru? >_-
Michel yes this really is a matter of taste. You like them with big bumps
and I like them smooth!
And I think you've made the right choice with the Jabiru. I have only once
flown behind a Jab
but it was super smooth and very confidence building. The other advantage
you will find is that
it is much simpler to install and connect everything up. We seem to have
been connecting the
912S in the Mk5 for the last six months. And we live in the country that
builds them.
This is really a major factor in build time. Anyway, spinner and a few more
fittings arrived from
Aircraft spruce this week. Instruments are mostly in and wiring is nearly
done. End in sight?
I think so and then we shall organise that European Kitfox fly-in.
Kerry
PS Should have been building today but the weather was too good so we did a
flight with the Motorfalke along the Danube, over the 11th Century monastery
at Melk and on to a beautiful grass strip about an hours flight away. An
apfelsaftgespritzt - and then back home. Flying is an amazing thing.
========================================================================
>
>
Message 15
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Raystuff7@aol.com
Thanks, Guys for the help.
Some of you responded to my problem of the oil temp intermittently dropping
to zero during my Oshkosh trip. Ted had the best suggestion.
He suggested swapping the thermocouple leads from oil temp and coolant temp
(both guages range 0- 300F). Well, I did that and flew it today , and sure
enough, the problem moved over to the other guage, indicating a bad oil temp
sending unit. I had already checked the wiring and ground which seemed ok.
I looked in Lockwood's catalogue and they have two sending units: one $25,
and the other $100 described as original equipment. I'm going to try to figure
which one I have, and order the other one because mine started giving problems
at 40 hours.
I got mine with my Kitfox 6 kit, so I wouldn't be surprised if it is the
cheaper one.
Keep 'em flying
Ray Ward
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kerry Skyring" <kerryskyring@hotmail.com>
This is of no help at all to those who have already covered their planes but
20 years ago when I
restored my Auster I took a strip of ceconite - 4 inch tape I think - and
glued it on the top surface
of the tail plane and then down and under to the lower surface of the
elevator and then doped it with the usual randolph products. This is the S
method. I made cut outs for the hinges so they can be inspected and oiled.
After 20 years it's still working OK and no serious problems with gathering
of rain or rubbish. But we will probably use Ski tape on the Kitfox and I
think either the S or top method will work fine.
Kerry.
>
>
Message 17
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
Lowell Fitt wrote:
> I have no issue with other's choices. I do get concerned when mention is
> made of the apparent unreliability of Rotax engines as indicated by the
> frequent service bulletins/letters, when compared with other engine
> manufacturer's silence.
I agree Lowell and I am not influenced in my decision by reading frequent Rotax
bulletins, rather the opposite. I also believe that, from a marketing point of
view, Jabiru should do the same. But I think they are much smaller and don't
have the resources to do it, maybe.
Rotax, on the other hand, sells a lot of engines. Over here, if you say Rotax,
people will think first snow-scooters. Considering that Jabiru also sells
primarily aircraft, their engine division is probably not as numerous and
resourceful as Rotax. Just a thought.
Still, not a good excuse.
Cheers,
Michel
Message 18
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
I am a happy Jabiru owner (so far) and I have been iside all the way to the
crankshaft bearings. The engine is extremely well designed with large
gallerys and bearing bosses. Jabiru has continually updated the engine...it
is now rated with a 2000 hour TBO and the HP has been increased to 85. I
know this to be true because I bought a fixed pitch prop from a guy with an
early serial no. He could only spin it up to 3300. I see 3760 with the same
prop mounted on my later ser. no. engine. As far as ADs go...you can go to
the Jabiru USA web page and find out all the info required to keep your
engine running in top condition. As far as ADs go specifically...I don't
think I've seen any yet...
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michel Verheughe" <michel@online.no>
Subject: Re: SV: Kitfox-List: Jabiru
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
>
> Lowell Fitt wrote:
> > I have no issue with other's choices. I do get concerned when mention
is
> > made of the apparent unreliability of Rotax engines as indicated by the
> > frequent service bulletins/letters, when compared with other engine
> > manufacturer's silence.
>
> I agree Lowell and I am not influenced in my decision by reading frequent
Rotax
> bulletins, rather the opposite. I also believe that, from a marketing
point of
> view, Jabiru should do the same. But I think they are much smaller and
don't
> have the resources to do it, maybe.
> Rotax, on the other hand, sells a lot of engines. Over here, if you say
Rotax,
> people will think first snow-scooters. Considering that Jabiru also sells
> primarily aircraft, their engine division is probably not as numerous and
> resourceful as Rotax. Just a thought.
> Still, not a good excuse.
>
> Cheers,
> Michel
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: ZERO oil temp? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Bill Hammond <kitfox@itsys3.com>
I also purchased my oil temp guage/sender with the Series 6 kit.
The guage is the Westach Quad guage and the sender is a Westach
unit - replacing the Rotax sender that came with the engine. My
oil temp also died and read zero after ten hours. I too
determined that it was the sender. A quick email to Westach and
they sent me a new sender free of charge. Even though I had only
10 hours on the engine, it had been about 2 1/2 years since I
took delivery on the kit.
If you have the Westach guage, you might consider this before
buying something new.
Bill Hammond
Parker, CO
Raystuff7@aol.com wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Raystuff7@aol.com
>
> Thanks, Guys for the help.
>
> Some of you responded to my problem of the oil temp intermittently dropping
> to zero during my Oshkosh trip. Ted had the best suggestion.
>
> He suggested swapping the thermocouple leads from oil temp and coolant temp
> (both guages range 0- 300F). Well, I did that and flew it today , and sure
> enough, the problem moved over to the other guage, indicating a bad oil temp
> sending unit. I had already checked the wiring and ground which seemed ok.
>
> I looked in Lockwood's catalogue and they have two sending units: one $25,
> and the other $100 described as original equipment. I'm going to try to figure
> which one I have, and order the other one because mine started giving problems
> at 40 hours.
> I got mine with my Kitfox 6 kit, so I wouldn't be surprised if it is the
> cheaper one.
>
> Keep 'em flying
> Ray Ward
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 20
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
Kerry Skyring wrote:
> Michel yes this really is a matter of taste. You like them with big bumps
> and I like them smooth!
Er, ... yes Kerry! (I hope we are talking about the same thing! :-)
Seriously, when I went about to look for a plane, nearly two years ago, I had
no better knowledge than looking for what looked sexy to a layman. And a
taildragger with bungee gear and round cowling looks like most people would
could a classic plane, like the Piper Cub.
Yet I didn't wanted to fall for the look, I was after a safe, well-proven plane
that I could enjoy in my mid-fifties, as a new pilot. What really made me buy
my plane was the good craftmanship that was done by the original builder. And
everybody who has seen my plane can't believe the lady is already 13 years old.
I did a good purchase.
But beauty can also arise from functionality. As my eye gets more trained to
the comlex world of aviation, I feel that an air-cooled engine in a
make-believe rotary cowl is ... cheap. The layman won't care but the timid
pilot that is growing in me says that it may be just as well with a smooth cowling.
One thing, tough, I think the smooth cowling looks more correct on a tricycle
plane. Maybe because it has been seen on so many Cessna. The same goes for the
Groove aluminium gear.
Looking at the model 7 on Skystar home pages, I think it looks right. But then,
it is a tricycle.
Regarding a European Kitfox fly-in, how about Chambley in Lorraine? Is it a
good place? Have you been there before?
Cheers,
Michel
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: dwight purdy <dpurdy@comteck.com>
The reason for the two pieces of tape over lapped is so there is not sticky
exposed to attract dirt.
Dwight
At 07:48 PM 9/18/2004 -0400, you wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
>
>Shane,
>You only need to apply to the upper side. That way it looks best and does
>not trap water in the folds.
>
>Don Pearsall
>
>
>Don P.
> You say top side only. I've heard of the "S" method where two tapes are
>overlapped by 1/2 where one sticks to the upper side (stabilizer) and the
>other sticks to the lower side (elevator) as you pass it through the hinge
>opening. This method always seemed to me that it would as you say, trap
>all kinds
>of stuff.
> If you run a straight piece of tape on the top only, do you apply it
> with
>the elevator up/down or straight? Or, am I missing the one tape on top
>method?
> I'm in the process of doing all the speed mods and have put off doing
> the
>gap sealing tape because I always felt there must be a better way and didn't
>like the trap you mention.
>
>Don Smythe
>DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
>---
>Version: 6.0.760 / Virus Database: 509 - Release Date: 9/10/2004
---
Message 22
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
Its that time again The Desert Fox Squadrons annual fly-in
www.desertfoxsquadron.org <http://www.desertfoxsquadron.org/>
It would be great to have this the biggest one yet.. I think the most
aircraft weve had is 25.. Not bad for a middle of the desert fly-in. So
lets see if we can beat that !!!
There are some fun things planned and as always we do have FUN !!! So get
your aircraft out and stretch your wings.. I know that there are Kitfoxs
coming in from Washington, Oregon, Idaho, California and Colorado. Bring
your spouse and your sleeping bag there are plenty of places for everyone.
25 Days Plan on being there !!!
Blue Skies
John & Debra McBean
The Sky is not the Limit Its a Playground
Message 23
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| Subject: | Trailering a Kitfox |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie Blackwell" <jablackwell@ev1.net>
I will probably need to trailer a plane about 1300 miles in the near future and
I am thinking of having an open trailer fabricated for the trip. Just wonder
if anyone on the list has trailered a Kitfox that far and any suggestions you
would have on trailer construction. Would be great if someone in the Texas
area has a trailer they would rent or sell me for such a trip.
Thanks
Jimmie
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "roger augenstein" <raugenstein@fuse.net>
Larry,
Where do I find ski saver tape? I have asked for it at 3 different ski
shops and no one seems to know what it is. Maybe a company name or web
address. Thanks for anyones help.
Roger KY S5 Sub EJ22
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Huntley" <asq1@adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Applying Gap Seal tape.
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Larry Huntley" <asq1@adelphia.net>
>
> I used Ski Saver tape. Put elevator in down position,applied tape on
> top,.cut it to adhere about 3/8" on each side. Worked well until cracking
> about 3 yrs later. No problem in below freezing weather. Peeled off W/
heat
> gun and replaced. Increased elevator authority significantly.
> Larry Huntley,Kitfox 4-1200,EA81,Dundee,NY,USA
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Don Pearsall" <donpearsall@comcast.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Applying Gap Seal tape.
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall"
> <donpearsall@comcast.net>
> >
> > Hi Don,
> > I have seen the "S" method you have mentioned. It is typically done with
> > fabric. I instructed for a while in a Maule that had this, and I did not
> > like the looks of it. There was always dirt, mud and water down in the
> gap.
> >
> > Glider flyers have a Teflon tape they use for gap sealing. I think the
way
> > to apply it would be to move the elevator down to it's downward limit
and
> > then apply it tight. That way when the elevator is level, there will be
> the
> > least amount of bulge in the tape from flexing.
> >
> > BUT, others may have a better way and please feel free to chime in.
> >
> >
> > Don Pearsall
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> > AlbertaIV@aol.com
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Applying Gap Seal tape.
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> >
> >
> > Shane,
> > You only need to apply to the upper side. That way it looks best and
does
> > not trap water in the folds.
> >
> > Don Pearsall
> >
> >
> > Don P.
> > You say top side only. I've heard of the "S" method where two tapes
> are
> >
> > overlapped by 1/2 where one sticks to the upper side (stabilizer) and
the
> > other sticks to the lower side (elevator) as you pass it through the
hinge
> > opening. This method always seemed to me that it would as you say,
trap
> > all kinds
> > of stuff.
> > If you run a straight piece of tape on the top only, do you apply it
> > with
> > the elevator up/down or straight? Or, am I missing the one tape on top
> > method?
> > I'm in the process of doing all the speed mods and have put off
doing
> > the
> > gap sealing tape because I always felt there must be a better way and
> didn't
> >
> > like the trap you mention.
> >
> > Don Smythe
> > DO NOT ARCHIVE
> >
> >
>
>
Message 25
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Roger L <yiotta@yahoo.com>
This is by far the hardest decision, which engine...
So much misinformation, and so many pilots that fly
"other then kit/homebuild" airplanes that are constantly
badmouthing everything except Lycoming and Continentals...
Safety is VERY important to me, how can a guy possibly
decide? You could spend years researching, and by then there
will be more to research, it is a neverending process and it
is frustrating....
Roger L
Lowell Fitt <lcfitt@inreach.com> wrote:
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
Thanks Paul, To try to be fair, I checked the Rotax website for
documentation - for the first time actually, I had previously gotten all my
info from the Rotax Owners Association - and was pleased to find a
searchable list of all Service Bulletins and letters.
I also from time to time (just did my search again in the interest of
fairness) search other manufacturers and conversion shops for their
bulletins and so far, I have been totally disappointed in the search.
Whether the bulletins/letters exist, I can't say, I can say however, they
are not found on line in the companies websites. One has pages dedicated to
bulletins, but they are blank and there have been grapevine issues with
these engines.
My strong advice to those looking for engines - check the manufacturer's
website for documentation especially service bulletins. If they haven't
been in business long enough to have learned of their engines weaknesses
beware. If they have been in business long enough to have learned something
about their engines (Paul mentioned the grapevine) and still there are no
published service bulletins/letters, buy at your own risk and prepare to
learn on your own or through the grapevine.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul"
Subject: Re: SV: Kitfox-List: Jabiru
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Paul
>
> Hi Lowell,
> Your point is well taken. Apparently some pilots just dont want any
input. We have all heard of the disasters of most other engines and the
only way people find out is by the grapevine. Rotax has an automatic
notification program via email, but they send notices by type instead of by
specific serial number. However, one can search like you did by serial
number. The last time I did that it missed the generic messages like proper
oil to use.
> I just read the notices and keep the ones that apply.
>
> Conclusion: Rotax provided great owner support.
>
> Regards, Paul
> =============
> At 9:19 PM -0700 9/17/04, Lowell Fitt wrote:
> >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
> >
> >Jose,
> >
> >I have a 912 UL and just went to the Rotax Owners Association and did a
> >search on my engine by serial number for appropriate Service Bulletins
and
> >Service letters. My advice to the doubters, try it some time. If you
need
> >a serial number drop me a post or just check for engine type.
> >
> >Such topics covered:
> >
> >-Recommended engine oils.
> >-New dipstick - - (both these items have to do with the EPA mandated
> >changes in the formulations that have resulted in oil foaming due to the
> >mandatory removal of anti-foaming additives.) Yes Rotax does research
and
> >test engine oils.
> >-Proper alignment of piston rings when overhauling an engine
> >-Carburetor flange, proper fixation and inspection.
> >-New starter available
> >-inspection procedures for detection of crank case cracks.
> >-Stator replacement - For which Rotax supplied free parts, free loan of
> >tools or free everything if the engine is returned to a Rotax Service
> >Letter.
> >-Increase in TBO
> >
> >Question - which other engine manufacturer is more thorough in informing
> >it's users of issues that arise. My understanding is that the mandatory
> >stator replacement was because of less than half a dozen incidents that
were
> >due to poor maintenance practices with the engines in certified trainers.
> >
> >Question - Can it be possible that the silent ones somehow have finally
> >built the perfect engine?
> >
> >I really have trouble believing that no news is good news when it comes
to
> >aircraft engines.
> >
> >Respectfully,
> >
> >Lowell
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Jose M. Toro"
> >To:
> >Subject: Re: SV: Kitfox-List: Jabiru
> >
> >
> >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jose M. Toro"
> >>
> >> Michel:
> >>
> >> I don't have a 912 and, as far as I understand, there is no 912 in
Puerto
> >Rico currently. However, I continuously receive Mandatory Service
> >Bulletins from Rotax about problems with the 912. Based on what I've
heard,
> >912 can't be a better alternative than a Jabiru.
> >> A four stroke, air cooled, direct drive, light and smooth engine seems
to
> >be a better alternative.
> >>
> >> Michel Verheughe wrote:
> >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe
> >>
> >> Hello Kerry,
> >>
> >> Kerry Skyring wrote:
> >> > Something doesn't quite ring true with the round "bump" cowl and a
flat
> >four
> >> > like the 912 or Jabiru.
> >>
> >> Oh, I really like the look of my model 3, Kerry. And I could install a
912
> >> without changing the cowling. So, why do I choose a Jabiru? Probably
> >because it
> >> is a simpler engine. In my mind, less is more. I wish to have a plane I
> >can
> >> just fly without thinking much about the engine. I don't need high
speed
> >nor
> >> extreme STOL performance, only something that I, or my son, can fly
> >without worrying.
> >> Maybe my choice is wrong. Maybe a 912 would be better. I have bought
yet
> >the
> >> Jabiru and I am all listening to the advices from the list.
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Michel
> >>
> >>
> >> Jose M. Toro, P.E.
> >> Kitfox II/582
> >> "A slow flight in the Caribbean..."
> >>
> >>
> > > ---------------------------------
>
> --
>
>
---------------------------------
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> I will probably need to trailer a plane about 1300 miles in the near future
> and I am thinking of having an open trailer fabricated for the trip. Just
> wonder if anyone on the list has trailered a Kitfox that far and any
> suggestions you would have on trailer construction. Would be great if someone
in the
> Texas area has a trailer
Jimmie,
These are my personal thoughts on trailering a kitfox. The trailer must
be light and sprung only to carry the weight of the plane trailer, fuel,
tools and what ever else is normally carried. I would look at other than steel
leaf springs if possible (the ride should be near that of a fine car). The
trailer should have imbedded fuel tanks to hold the capacity of the planes fuel
tanks plus a 12 VDC fuel transfer pump. The trailer must have dual axles to
help transition any bumps in the road (at least 14" tires not the little ones
??). One should provide a separate tie back strap around the wing tips of both
wings in case the built in tie back bars should fail. A good set of support
rods from the fuselage to the leading edge of each wing is a must. Do not
trailer with fuel in the wing tanks (too heave). The tail of the plane must be
elevated to near flight position. There should be a method of supporting the
tail where there is no tension on the tail spring. I might even consider an
independent tail suspension system to support the aft section of the tail high
ramp.
An average homebuilt utility trailer designed to haul tons of weight can
exceed the "G" forces on a Kitfox. The trailer design should be such that you
yourself would ride very comfortable on during the 1300 mile trip.
My opinion on trailering a Fox................
Don Smythe
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 27
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| Subject: | Four Stoke Engines |
Seal-Send-Time: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 21:24:31 -0600
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dee Young" <henrysfork1@msn.com>
Has anyone on the list had experience with the Aero Vee carb. system? Would you
care to comment?
Thanks
Dee Young
Model II N345DY
Do not archive
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Gap Seal tape. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: <rex@awarenest.com>
Try this site:
http://www.wingsandwheels.com/page29.htm
Rex
On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 22:18:06 -0400
"roger augenstein" <raugenstein@fuse.net> wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "roger augenstein"
><raugenstein@fuse.net>
>
> Larry,
>
> Where do I find ski saver tape? I have asked for it at
>3 different ski
> shops and no one seems to know what it is. Maybe a
>company name or web
> address. Thanks for anyones help.
>
> Roger KY S5 Sub EJ22
Message 29
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| Subject: | Trailering a Kitfox |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" <donpearsall@comcast.net>
Those are all excellent point's Don. As has been mentioned here before, if
the 'fox is trailered on a trailer that was designed for something heavy,
like a boat or car, the plane will most likely encounter G-forces and
stresses far beyond its design limits. There have been reports of engine
mounts bending or cracking once the trailer hit a pothole or went over a
curb.
Don Pearsall
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
AlbertaIV@aol.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Trailering a Kitfox
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> I will probably need to trailer a plane about 1300 miles in the near
future
> and I am thinking of having an open trailer fabricated for the trip. Just
> wonder if anyone on the list has trailered a Kitfox that far and any
> suggestions you would have on trailer construction. Would be great if
someone in the
> Texas area has a trailer
Jimmie,
These are my personal thoughts on trailering a kitfox. The trailer must
be light and sprung only to carry the weight of the plane trailer, fuel,
tools and what ever else is normally carried. I would look at other than
steel
leaf springs if possible (the ride should be near that of a fine car). The
trailer should have imbedded fuel tanks to hold the capacity of the planes
fuel
tanks plus a 12 VDC fuel transfer pump. The trailer must have dual axles to
help transition any bumps in the road (at least 14" tires not the little
ones
??). One should provide a separate tie back strap around the wing tips of
both
wings in case the built in tie back bars should fail. A good set of support
rods from the fuselage to the leading edge of each wing is a must. Do not
trailer with fuel in the wing tanks (too heave). The tail of the plane must
be
elevated to near flight position. There should be a method of supporting
the
tail where there is no tension on the tail spring. I might even consider an
independent tail suspension system to support the aft section of the tail
high
ramp.
An average homebuilt utility trailer designed to haul tons of weight can
exceed the "G" forces on a Kitfox. The trailer design should be such that
you
yourself would ride very comfortable on during the 1300 mile trip.
My opinion on trailering a Fox................
Don Smythe
DO NOT ARCHIVE
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