Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:15 AM - Re: Heater Install (Ceashman@aol.com)
2. 04:45 AM - Re: Heater Install (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
3. 05:21 AM - Unfinished 6, $12,500 (Tom Edwards)
4. 05:57 AM - Classic IV - Problem with 912 Oil Tank (Grant Fluent)
5. 07:52 AM - Re: Classic IV - Problem with 912 Oil Tank (jdmcbean)
6. 08:17 AM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Paul)
7. 09:18 AM - Re: N2BH IS FLYING! (Steve Cooper)
8. 09:29 AM - Re: Heater Install (Wwillyard@aol.com)
9. 10:59 AM - TCP in 582 with AV-2 CPS (Harris, Robert)
10. 02:00 PM - Old CPS dual strobe system (Marco Menezes)
11. 02:05 PM - Re: TCP in 582 with AV-2 CPS (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
12. 02:27 PM - Re: Unfinished 6, $12,500 (Larry Huntley)
13. 02:36 PM - Re: Classic IV - Problem with 912 Oil Tank (Ceashman@aol.com)
14. 02:57 PM - Re: Classic IV - Problem with 912 Oil Tank (Grant Fluent)
15. 03:07 PM - Re: Old CPS dual strobe system (Torgeir Mortensen)
16. 03:33 PM - Re: Classic IV - Problem with 912 Oil Tank (Torgeir Mortensen)
17. 04:09 PM - More on the Jabiru (Jose M. Toro)
18. 05:20 PM - Re: Heater Install (John King)
19. 06:09 PM - Re: Four Stoke Engines (Jeffrey Puls)
20. 07:07 PM - Re: N2BH IS FLYING! (KITFOXPILOT@att.net)
21. 07:11 PM - Re: N2BH IS FLYING! (KITFOXPILOT@att.net)
22. 08:18 PM - Re: More on the Jabiru (Dee Young)
23. 08:18 PM - Re: More on the Jabiru (Jerry Liles)
24. 08:20 PM - Re: Four Stoke Engines (Dee Young)
25. 08:30 PM - Re: More on the Jabiru 582 (Aerobatics@aol.com)
26. 09:27 PM - Re: TCP in 582 with AV-2 CPS (jdmcbean)
27. 09:44 PM - Accident Update (Michael Gibbs)
28. 09:45 PM - Kitfox crash (Michael Gibbs)
29. 09:50 PM - Re: Kitfox crash I have a question .... (Aerobatics@aol.com)
30. 09:53 PM - Re: Accident Update (Roger L)
31. 10:02 PM - Re: Accident Update good point? (Aerobatics@aol.com)
32. 10:08 PM - Re: Accident Update (Aerobatics@aol.com)
33. 10:09 PM - Re: Accident Update lastly (Aerobatics@aol.com)
34. 11:49 PM - Re: Accident Update (Steve Cooper)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Heater Install |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ceashman@aol.com
Hello George.
For a couple of weeks it does get cold around Atlanta.
Last winter I looked at the Aircraft Spruce catalogue and found the Rans heat
muff, the type you wrap around the silencer. Well, I purchased this and had
to make some modification the get it to fit around the 912 exhaust system.
A very basic system, you cut a hole in the firewall and the tube sticks
through and there is a plastic cap that stops the warm/hot air flow. Trouble is,
the only way to get warm air was to carefully kick the plastic stopper off. When
you done that, in flight, there was no way to get the stopper back on...just
can't reach.
So out of aluminum tubes and some aluminum angle, I made an on/off switch
(that kind of looks like the choke system of a carburetor) and I purchased a
remote push/pull cable from the Spruce catalogue.
The system is ram air fed and I made a small scoop out of three aluminum
tubes welded in a Y shape, the two tops cut horizontal and pointing into the wind.
And this is spring attached to the heat muff (that I can take off in the
summer) The Y intake protrudes just behind the bottom of the bubble engine
cowling. I did have to drill a hole in the front of the lower cowling for the tube
to
penetrate.
The only problem with this heater system is that the blowing air does not get
to your toes, that is the way the air is directed as it comes through the
firewall. Most of the time I had the remote half closed. It does get warm.
This was my solution. Eric Ashman, Classic IV.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Heater Install |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 9/20/04 4:51:53 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
georgewells@adelphia.net writes:
>
> I presently have a KF 4 without a heater. I am looking for info on
> installing either a Heat Muff type or a unit using radiator water. Any info
> on both the pros and cons will be appreciated. My KF has a Rotex 912 80 HP
> engine.
> Thanks, Sorry if this is a double post !!
> George
>
George,
I fabricated a heat muff (from alum) that fits 1/2 the way around the
muffler and is held on with two large hose clamps. The muff sits off the muffler
about 1" and has baffle plates inside to force the air from one side to the
other and back again before going out the 2" scat tube to the firewall. At the
firewall, I used an alum electrical box from radio shack as a diverter that
has a flap valve operated from the cockpit (simple push/pull wire). When you
want heat, pull the wire and the flap opens to direct air into the cockpit.
Push the wire closed and the flap dumps the warm air back to the engine
compartment. The only problem I had was the input scoop. At first, I mounted
it
back about 1" from the large round cowl opening and could not get any flow
through to the cockpit. I moved the scoop fwd more into the opening and gained
much more flow. The air is nice and warm. I'm recently doing some cowl mods and
will fabricate a better scoop and fiberglass it into the opening of the cowl.
BTW, the fwd scoop is attached to the muff with more 2" scat tubing. I've
heard that you can add kitchen brass scrubbing pads inside the muff to pick up
more heat. Might try that sometime. I take the muff off during the summer.
My thoughts are that the water system is the life blood of the engine and
I didn't want to use water for heat. I want the cooling system to work
properly at cooling the engine and not tap the source for pilot warming. My system
is on a 582 but should work similar on a 912
Sorry, I don't have any pictures but may try to get some one day soon.
Don Smythe
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 3
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| Subject: | Unfinished 6, $12,500 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Tom Edwards" <k1kbl@msn.com>
I have lowered the price of my unfinished kit to $12,500. It is almost
finished to fuselage covering. Options include Quick Built wings and white
powdercoating. There are no firewall forward components or instruments. I
have not swept the wings so you can still choose your engine. I also have
the BlueSky strut brackets. E-mail k1kbl@msn.com or 8020985-5232 before 8
pm EST. The kit is located in northern Vermont.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Classic IV - Problem with 912 Oil Tank |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Hello All,
I am building a Classic IV and am working on the
firewall forward.The oil tank that came with the Rotax
912S has two flare fittings that screw onto the top of
the tank for the in/out hoses to connect to. The
fitting for the outlet sticks up higher than then the
oil cap interfering with the cowling. Has anyone else
had problems with this? Is this a 37 degree AN
fitting?
Thanks,
Grant Fluent
Newcastle, NE
Classic IV 912S
Message 5
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| Subject: | Classic IV - Problem with 912 Oil Tank |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
Grant,
Contact Dave Morris or Frank Miller at SkyStar. They modify a
fitting that has been shortened approx 1/2" for that very reason. Some have
interference and some don't
Blue Skies
John & Debra McBean
"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Grant Fluent
Subject: Kitfox-List: Classic IV - Problem with 912 Oil Tank
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Hello All,
I am building a Classic IV and am working on the
firewall forward.The oil tank that came with the Rotax
912S has two flare fittings that screw onto the top of
the tank for the in/out hoses to connect to. The
fitting for the outlet sticks up higher than then the
oil cap interfering with the cowling. Has anyone else
had problems with this? Is this a 37 degree AN
fitting?
Thanks,
Grant Fluent
Newcastle, NE
Classic IV 912S
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Paul <pwilson@climber.org>
I have never seen the air ride suspension on a trailer but it should work but
would be a custom design. The softest ride I know of is the torsion bar setup.
The bars ride in an elastomer bushing. This design is very common. Still the
rating of the axle and tire size/rating and inflation pressure make a lot of difference
in the ride smoothness. Forget about leaf springs for a smooth ride,
however that is what I use with low tire pressure, and I know it can be made
to work provided your payload is high enough to exercise the springs.
Shocks are pretty rare. But I have seen them on large box trailers. In fact I
have a 32' trailer with 4 shocks on 2 axles.
BTW, talking to a salesman is not the best way to get tech info. Try calling a
big name trailer manufacturer.
Regards, Paul
===============
At 1:39 PM -0700 9/20/04, Jimmie Blackwell wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie Blackwell" <jablackwell@ev1.net>
>
>Don
>
>Excellent ideas. One more question though. You mention using something
>other than steel leaf springs. Are you suggesting coil springs with shock
>absorbers or struts?
>
>I went to a very reputable trailer manufacturer today and asked about
>putting shocks on a trailer. The salesman looked at me like I was crazy as
>though he had never heard of trying to make a trailer ride smooth. You are
>very right that most trailers are made for carrying a much heavier load than
>a Kitfox.
>
>Jimmie
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Ben Baltrusaitis" <ben@gmpexpress.net>
>To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Trailering a Kitfox
>
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ben Baltrusaitis" <ben@gmpexpress.net>
>>
>> Yes Archive!
>> Don this is a great, through answer to a question that will come up again.
>I was going to ask the question related to 1000 miles and you saved me from
>wrecking a plane. Thanks!!
>> Ben
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>> Sent: Sunday, September 19, 2004 11:08 PM
>> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Trailering a Kitfox
>>
>>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>>
>>
>> > I will probably need to trailer a plane about 1300 miles in the near
>future
>> > and I am thinking of having an open trailer fabricated for the trip.
>Just
>> > wonder if anyone on the list has trailered a Kitfox that far and any
>> > suggestions you would have on trailer construction. Would be great if
>someone in the
>> > Texas area has a trailer
>>
>> Jimmie,
>> These are my personal thoughts on trailering a kitfox. The trailer
>must
>> be light and sprung only to carry the weight of the plane trailer,
>fuel,
>> tools and what ever else is normally carried. I would look at other
>than steel
>> leaf springs if possible (the ride should be near that of a fine car).
>The
>> trailer should have imbedded fuel tanks to hold the capacity of the
>planes fuel
>> tanks plus a 12 VDC fuel transfer pump. The trailer must have dual
>axles to
>> help transition any bumps in the road (at least 14" tires not the little
>ones
>> ??). One should provide a separate tie back strap around the wing tips
>of both
>> wings in case the built in tie back bars should fail. A good set of
>support
>> rods from the fuselage to the leading edge of each wing is a must. Do
>not
>> trailer with fuel in the wing tanks (too heave). The tail of the plane
>must be
>> elevated to near flight position. There should be a method of
>supporting the
>> tail where there is no tension on the tail spring. I might even
>consider an
>> independent tail suspension system to support the aft section of the
>tail high
>> ramp.
>> An average homebuilt utility trailer designed to haul tons of weight
>can
>> exceed the "G" forces on a Kitfox. The trailer design should be such
>that you
>> yourself would ride very comfortable on during the 1300 mile trip.
>>
>> My opinion on trailering a Fox................
>> Don Smythe
>> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> >
>>
>
>
--
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: N2BH IS FLYING! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
How is it that you are getting dual instruction in your Kitfox during Phase
I? Or is it an aircraft that has already completed the 40 hour phase I
testing. Just curious as the rules state that no flight instruction will be
given in an aircraft in Phase I.
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: <KITFOXPILOT@att.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: N2BH IS FLYING!
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: KITFOXPILOT@att.net
>
> Just thought I woulld let the list know, that my Kitfox is flying great!
two days in row and no problems. Today I was able to practice my first
landings with my tail wheel instructor I did great. Also played with the
flapperons and did some mid field take offs. I will say this, the 912S
pulls my Model IV 1200 like a rocket!! this was the best toy I ever payed
for.
>
> Ray
>
> <!-- BEGIN WEBMAIL STATIONERY -->
> <style type='text/css'>
> p {
> margin: 0px;
> }
> </style>
>
> <!-- WEBMAIL STATIONERY noneset -->
>
>
> Just thought I woulld let the list know, that my Kitfox is flying great!
two days in row and no problems. Today I was able to practice my first
landings with my tail wheel instructor I did great. Also played with the
flapperons and did some mid field take offs. I will say this, the 912S pulls
my Model IV 1200 like a rocket!! this was the best toy I ever payed for.
>
>
> Ray
>
>
> <!-- END WEBMAIL STATIONERY -->
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Heater Install |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Wwillyard@aol.com
I presently have a KF 4 without a heater. I am looking for info on installing either
a Heat Muff type or a unit using radiator water. Any info on both the pros
and cons will be appreciated. My KF has a Rotex 912 80 HP engine.
I used the single heater kit from SkyStar. I mounted the heater core centered next
to the firewall in a horizontal position so that the fan blows the heat down
onto the rudder peddles. I also made a radiator scoop with a controllable
damper to regulate the water temperature. I adjust the damper for about 175F
to 180F coolant temp and my feet stay nice and toasty during winter flights here
in Michigan. I also installed an automotive heater control valve in the cabin
heater coolant circuit so as not to add heat to the cockpit during warm weather.
This setup has not presented any problems. I also like the damper control
of air flow through the radiator for faster warm ups.
Bill W.
Classic IV 912UL
Message 9
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| Subject: | TCP in 582 with AV-2 CPS |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
John McBean and others,
Can TCP be used with AV-2? Does AV-2 already have a lead scavenger built
into it?(AV-2 is two cycle oil from California Power supply which is
designed to prevent Carbon build up.) I only use 100LL in my Rotax 582 and
want to minimize the carbon.
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jdmcbean
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: sparkplugs, 912, avgas
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
John,
It is a 16 oz container and one uses 1/2 oz per 10 gallons. The
container
has a measuring cup on the side.. loosen the cap over the measuring cup and
give the bottle a squeeze until you have the amount you want.
Blue Skies
John & Debra McBean
"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of John E. King
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: sparkplugs, 912, avgas
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John E. King " <kingjohn@erols.com>
John,
If you do not use a syringe to dispense the TCP, how do you know how
much to use at a filling? What size of container is used for the
$19.50 container?
--
John King
Warrenton, VA
jdmcbean wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
>
>I am a distributor for Decalin TCP. It is a competitior to Alcor but much
>safer, can be carried in the cockpit and is easy to dispense... Syringe not
>needed. If you are burning 100LL you really do want to use a Lead
Scavenger.
>I am only operating with 100LL and using the Decalin TCP. Plugs currently
>have 80 hours..
>
>Not sure about the 912.. but isn't .020 a small gap... ?
>
>Ps.. the TCP is $19.50 +S&H and treats up to 320 gallons.
>
>
>Blue Skies
>John & Debra McBean
>"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Old CPS dual strobe system |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Marco Menezes <msm_9949@yahoo.com>
My "partially completed" KF2 came with a CPS dual strobe system. There is no documentation
for the unit, nor is there a model number evident. It was probably
manufactured in the late 80's or early 90's. I'm unsure as to how the power
unit should be wired. Each of the wingtip mounted strobes has 3 leads (red, white
and black) which plug into the power unit's output. The power unit also has
3 input leads, red black and bare. CPS is no help, they "haven't sold it in
10 years."
Presumably, the red input would be wired to a 12 volt positive (overload protected)
power source. But are black and bare both grounds? I'd appreciate any advice.
Marco Menezes
N99KX
---------------------------------
vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today!
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: TCP in 582 with AV-2 CPS |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 9/21/04 11:00:24 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
Robert_Harris@intuit.com writes:
>
> Can TCP be used with AV-2? Does AV-2 already have a lead scavenger built
> into it?(AV-2 is two cycle oil from California Power supply which is
> designed to prevent Carbon build up.) I only use 100LL in my Rotax 582 and
> want to minimize the carbon.
>
> Robert
>
Robert,
Only to repeat what I have heard..."Never use TCP in a 2 stroke engine".
Don Smythe
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Unfinished 6, $12,500 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Larry Huntley" <asq1@adelphia.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Edwards" <k1kbl@msn.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Unfinished 6, $12,500
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Tom Edwards" <k1kbl@msn.com>
>
> I have lowered the price of my unfinished kit to $12,500. It is almost
> finished to fuselage covering. Options include Quick Built wings and
white
> powdercoating. There are no firewall forward components or instruments.
I
> have not swept the wings so you can still choose your engine. I also have
> the BlueSky strut brackets. E-mail k1kbl@msn.com or 8020985-5232 before 8
> pm EST. The kit is located in northern Vermont.
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Classic IV - Problem with 912 Oil Tank |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ceashman@aol.com
Yes.
If I remember well. I had the same problem. I think everyone has this problem!
It was either Skystar or someone I met at Sun & Fun, and they said heat that
steel tube until cherry red and carefully bend. All this is done in the vice.
It worked! But is painful, you'd think that there would be a fitting
available that would allow for the close space.
Best of luck...It can be done.
Eric Ashman Classic IV Atlanta.
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Classic IV - Problem with 912 Oil Tank |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
Thanks to John and Eric for responding to my question
about the oil tank fitting. I tried to call Skystar
today but couldn't reach anyone as their summer hours
are only until 3:30.
As for heating the fitting with a torch, I think I
can do a neater job if I cut out a section and weld it
back together.
Grant Fluent
Newcastle, NE
Classic IV 912S
Do not archive
--- Ceashman@aol.com wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ceashman@aol.com
>
> Yes.
> If I remember well. I had the same problem. I think
> everyone has this problem!
>
> It was either Skystar or someone I met at Sun & Fun,
> and they said heat that
> steel tube until cherry red and carefully bend. All
> this is done in the vice.
>
> It worked! But is painful, you'd think that there
> would be a fitting
> available that would allow for the close space.
>
> Best of luck...It can be done.
> Eric Ashman Classic IV Atlanta.
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Old CPS dual strobe system |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
Hi Marco,
The strobes 3 leads (red, white and black): Red is high voltage positive
+(350-400)VDC, the black is ground and the white is the trigger signal to
the strobe lamp. The trigger start the (discharge) flash.
For the input, it's normally red i.e. +12 VDC input. Also black is
normally ground.
The blank could be a general trigger, this is used to link several units
together for synchronization.
Just use an ohm meter to check if the black input wire is connected to
strobe chassis, if so, thats OK.
Also check the blank wire to see if this one is connected to chassis or
ground, if not -this wire "might" be a general trigger line. Then isolate
(endcap) it.
Sometimes, the black is isolated from chassis, this is to prevent squeal
(in the radio) from the strobe when used.
If the latter is true, then the white wire is to be connected to ground at
the strobe unit and the black is to be routed together (twisted) with the
red input wire. By using twisted shielded wire, eventually radio noise
might be suppressed.
This is an approach, IF you have noise from the strobe system.
Just checked my old building manual. This manual show a dual strobe system
with red + 12VDC and black ground. The output to the strobes is just named
"3 cond cable".
However, the above is kind of standard for most of the systems I've seen
over the years.
Torgeir.
On Tue, 21 Sep 2004 13:59:37 -0700 (PDT), Marco Menezes
<msm_9949@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Marco Menezes <msm_9949@yahoo.com>
>
> My "partially completed" KF2 came with a CPS dual strobe system. There
> is no documentation for the unit, nor is there a model number evident.
> It was probably manufactured in the late 80's or early 90's. I'm unsure
> as to how the power unit should be wired. Each of the wingtip mounted
> strobes has 3 leads (red, white and black) which plug into the power
> unit's output. The power unit also has 3 input leads, red black and
> bare. CPS is no help, they "haven't sold it in 10 years."
>
> Presumably, the red input would be wired to a 12 volt positive (overload
> protected) power source. But are black and bare both grounds? I'd
> appreciate any advice.
>
> Marco Menezes
> N99KX
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today!
>
>
--
Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Classic IV - Problem with 912 Oil Tank |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
Hi Grant,
Just uploaded two pictures of the "oil tank" problem. This is another
solution my friend Arnulf made on his Kitfox model 4.
Have a look here:
http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=view&epoch=1095805686
Torgeir.
On Tue, 21 Sep 2004 14:57:39 -0700 (PDT), Grant Fluent
<gjfpilot@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Grant Fluent <gjfpilot@yahoo.com>
>
> Thanks to John and Eric for responding to my question
> about the oil tank fitting. I tried to call Skystar
> today but couldn't reach anyone as their summer hours
> are only until 3:30.
> As for heating the fitting with a torch, I think I
> can do a neater job if I cut out a section and weld it
> back together.
> Grant Fluent
> Newcastle, NE
> Classic IV 912S
>
> Do not archive
>
>
> --- Ceashman@aol.com wrote:
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ceashman@aol.com
>>
>> Yes.
>> If I remember well. I had the same problem. I think
>> everyone has this problem!
>>
>> It was either Skystar or someone I met at Sun & Fun,
>> and they said heat that
>> steel tube until cherry red and carefully bend. All
>> this is done in the vice.
>>
>> It worked! But is painful, you'd think that there
>> would be a fitting
>> available that would allow for the close space.
>>
>> Best of luck...It can be done.
>> Eric Ashman Classic IV Atlanta.
>>
>>
>>
>> Contributions
>> any other
>> Forums.
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/chat
>>
>> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
>> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
>> http://www.matronics.com/archives
>> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
>> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
--
Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
Message 17
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| Subject: | More on the Jabiru |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jose M. Toro" <jose_m_toro@yahoo.com>
Hi Again:
My research on using a Jabiru 2200 on my Kitfox II shows that it is too slow to
provide proper cooling. Wth the 582, it cruises 65 mph at 5500 rpm. I've been
told that I need a cruise of 80 mph to provided adequate cooling. The only
thing that I could think about to make it faster is to use "Speedster" wings.
I have many questions on this "under evaluation" alternative:
Has any of you used Speedster wings on a Kitfox II?
What increase in speed could I expect?
Would this wing switch change the airplane's gross weight?
Thanks for your support!
Jose M. Toro, P.E.
Kitfox II/582
"A slow flight in the Caribbean..."
---------------------------------
Message 18
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|
| Subject: | Re: Heater Install |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: John King <kingjohne@adelphia.net>
Floran & George,
I installed a radiator cowl flap controllable from the cockpit which
ensures that I have adequate engine temperatures and sufficient heat
available for the cabin heater during the winter seasons.
--
John King
Warrenton, VA
Floran Higgins wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Floran Higgins" <CliffH@outdrs.net>
>
>Unless you have a thermostat, the water heater will not put out much heat
>when the weather gets cold.
>Floran H.
>----- Original Message -----
>
>
>From: "George Wells" <georgewells@adelphia.net>
>To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Kitfox-List: Heater Install
>
>
>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "George Wells"
>>
>>
><georgewells@adelphia.net>
>
>
>>I presently have a KF 4 without a heater. I am looking for info on
>>installing either a Heat Muff type or a unit using radiator water. Any
>>
>>
>info
>
>
>>on both the pros and cons will be appreciated. My KF has a Rotex 912 80 HP
>>engine.
>>Thanks, Sorry if this is a double post !!
>>George
>>
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | Four Stoke Engines |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jeffrey Puls" <pulsair@mindspring.com>
Dee,
I don't, but I would love to see an Aero Vee engine in a Kitfox. Just
imagine, one carb and such a clean installation. Jeff Classic IV
> [Original Message]
> From: Dee Young <henrysfork1@msn.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 9/19/2004 11:24:34 PM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Four Stoke Engines
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dee Young" <henrysfork1@msn.com>
>
> Has anyone on the list had experience with the Aero Vee carb. system?
Would you care to comment?
>
> Thanks
>
> Dee Young
> Model II N345DY
>
> Do not archive
>
>
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | Re: N2BH IS FLYING! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: KITFOXPILOT@att.net
-------------- Original message from "Steve Cooper" : --------------
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
>
> How is it that you are getting dual instruction in your Kitfox during Phase
> I? Or is it an aircraft that has already completed the 40 hour phase I
> testing. Just curious as the rules state that no flight instruction will be
> given in an aircraft in Phase I.
> Never said it was going through a 40 hrs test period!! Also never said I built
the Kitfox!
Ray
> Steve
> ----- Original Message -----
> From:
> To:
> Subject: Kitfox-List: N2BH IS FLYING!
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: KITFOXPILOT@att.net
> >
> > Just thought I woulld let the list know, that my Kitfox is flying great!
> two days in row and no problems. Today I was able to practice my first
> landings with my tail wheel instructor I did great. Also played with the
> flapperons and did some mid field take offs. I will say this, the 912S
> pulls my Model IV 1200 like a rocket!! this was the best toy I ever payed
> for.
> >
> > Ray
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Just thought I woulld let the list know, that my Kitfox is flying great!
> two days in row and no problems. Today I was able to practice my first
> landings with my tail wheel instructor I did great. Also played with the
> flapperons and did some mid field take offs. I will say this, the 912S pulls
> my Model IV 1200 like a rocket!! this was the best toy I ever payed for.
> >
> >
> > Ray
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
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-------------- Original message from "Steve Cooper" <SPDRFLYR@EARTHLINK.NET>: --------------
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <SPDRFLYR@EARTHLINK.NET>
How is it that you are getting dual instruction in your Kitfox during Phase
I? Or is it an aircraft that has already completed the 40 hour phase I
testing. Just curious as the rules state that no flight instruction will be
given in an aircraft in Phase I.
Never said it was going through a 40 hrs test period!! Also never said I built
the Kitfox!
Ray
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: <KITFOXPILOT@ATT.NET>
To: <KITFOX-LIST@MATRONICS.COM>
Subject: Kitfox-List: N2BH IS FLYING!
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: KITFOXPILOT@att.net
Just thought I woulld let the list know, that my Kitfox is flying great!
two days in row and no problems. Today I was able to practice my first
landings with my tail wheel instructor I did great. Also played with the
flapperons and did some mid field take offs. I will say this, the 912S
pulls my Model IV 1200 like a rocket!! this was the best toy I ever payed
for.
Ray
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> > p {
> > margin: 0px;
> > }
> > </STYLE>
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Just thought I woulld let the list know, that my Kitfox is flying great!
two days in row and no problems. Today I was able to practice my first
landings with my tail wheel instructor I did great. Also played with the
flapperons and did some mid field take offs. I will say this, the 912S pulls
my Model IV 1200 like a rocket!! this was the best toy I ever payed for.
Ray
<!-- END WEBMAIL STATIONERY -->
e Matronics Forums.
cs.com/emaillists
<!-- END WEBMAIL STATIONERY -->
Message 21
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|
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: KITFOXPILOT@att.net
-------------- Original message from "Don Pearsall" : --------------
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall"
>
> Ray,
> Congratulations! I bet you are having fun now. Also congratulations that you
> have the wisdom to get tailwheel training too. Post a photo of 28H on the
> Sportflight web site when you get a free moment.
>
> Don Pearsall
> Thanks Don, I will post some photo's soon. I was not the original builder, but
I have completed many upgrades to the Kitfox! I did a few hours in a Cub,
however the rest is going well in the Fox.
Ray
>
>
>
>
>
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-------------- Original message from "Don Pearsall" <DONPEARSALL@COMCAST.NET>:
--------------
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" <DONPEARSALL@COMCAST.NET>
Ray,
Congratulations! I bet you are having fun now. Also congratulations that you
have the wisdom to get tailwheel training too. Post a photo of 28H on the
Sportflight web site when you get a free moment.
Don Pearsall
Thanks Don, I will post some photo's soon. I was not the original builder, but
I have completed many upgrades to the Kitfox! I did a few hoursin a Cub, however
the rest is going well in the Fox.
Ray
ests: http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list
<!-- END WEBMAIL STATIONERY -->
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | More on the Jabiru |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dee Young" <henrysfork1@msn.com>
Not sure your information is correct Jose. I have amy flying with the KFM
and it cools fine. My cruise is 65 mph.
Dee Young
Model II
Do not archive
>From: "Jose M. Toro" <jose_m_toro@yahoo.com>
>Reply-To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Kitfox-List: More on the Jabiru
>Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 16:08:44 -0700 (PDT)
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jose M. Toro" <jose_m_toro@yahoo.com>
>
>Hi Again:
>
>My research on using a Jabiru 2200 on my Kitfox II shows that it is too
>slow to provide proper cooling. Wth the 582, it cruises 65 mph at 5500
>rpm. I've been told that I need a cruise of 80 mph to provided adequate
>cooling. The only thing that I could think about to make it faster is to
>use "Speedster" wings. I have many questions on this "under evaluation"
>alternative:
>
>Has any of you used Speedster wings on a Kitfox II?
>What increase in speed could I expect?
>Would this wing switch change the airplane's gross weight?
>
>Thanks for your support!
>
>
>Jose M. Toro, P.E.
>Kitfox II/582
>"A slow flight in the Caribbean..."
>
>
>---------------------------------
>
>
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Re: More on the Jabiru |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles <wliles@bayou.com>
I suspect with the Jabiru 2200 you'll get a cruise of at least 80mph
even with the long wing. You can help things by fairing the lift struts
if not already done and making simple fairings for the drag producing
parts. What is your airspeed at 5800 and 6000 rpm with the 582?
Jerry Liles
Jose M. Toro wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jose M. Toro" <jose_m_toro@yahoo.com>
>
>Hi Again:
>
>My research on using a Jabiru 2200 on my Kitfox II shows that it is too slow to
provide proper cooling. Wth the 582, it cruises 65 mph at 5500 rpm. I've been
told that I need a cruise of 80 mph to provided adequate cooling. The only
thing that I could think about to make it faster is to use "Speedster" wings.
I have many questions on this "under evaluation" alternative:
>
>Has any of you used Speedster wings on a Kitfox II?
>What increase in speed could I expect?
>Would this wing switch change the airplane's gross weight?
>
>Thanks for your support!
>
>
>Jose M. Toro, P.E.
>Kitfox II/582
>"A slow flight in the Caribbean..."
>
>
>
>---------------------------------
>
>
>
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | Four Stoke Engines |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dee Young" <henrysfork1@msn.com>
I have heard some discussion about the VW being to heavy but not sure about
the Aero Vee. I do like the looks of the engine though and have asked myself
the same question.
Dee Young
Model II
Do not archive
>From: "Jeffrey Puls" <pulsair@mindspring.com>
>Reply-To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Four Stoke Engines
>Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 21:09:09 -0400
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jeffrey Puls" <pulsair@mindspring.com>
>
>Dee,
>I don't, but I would love to see an Aero Vee engine in a Kitfox. Just
>imagine, one carb and such a clean installation. Jeff Classic IV
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: Dee Young <henrysfork1@msn.com>
> > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > Date: 9/19/2004 11:24:34 PM
> > Subject: Kitfox-List: Four Stoke Engines
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dee Young" <henrysfork1@msn.com>
> >
> > Has anyone on the list had experience with the Aero Vee carb. system?
>Would you care to comment?
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Dee Young
> > Model II N345DY
> >
> > Do not archive
> >
> >
>
>
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: More on the Jabiru 582 |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Aerobatics@aol.com
I have a standard Model 2 .... and used to cruise at 65ish
Then I faired in all struts, changes to an IVO and I cruise at about 80 at
5,500
Depending on day and weight, 5,600 can be as high as 85. Still have great
climb and I fly out of a strip less than 800 feet, easily.
Enjoy!
Dave
Message 26
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| Subject: | TCP in 582 with AV-2 CPS |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
Robert,
I will do some checking.. but I have been told not to use TCP in 2 strokes.
Never did get a good reason....
Blue Skies
John & Debra McBean
"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Harris, Robert
Subject: Kitfox-List: TCP in 582 with AV-2 CPS
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
<Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
John McBean and others,
Can TCP be used with AV-2? Does AV-2 already have a lead scavenger built
into it?(AV-2 is two cycle oil from California Power supply which is
designed to prevent Carbon build up.) I only use 100LL in my Rotax 582 and
want to minimize the carbon.
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jdmcbean
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: sparkplugs, 912, avgas
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
John,
It is a 16 oz container and one uses 1/2 oz per 10 gallons. The
container
has a measuring cup on the side.. loosen the cap over the measuring cup and
give the bottle a squeeze until you have the amount you want.
Blue Skies
John & Debra McBean
"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of John E. King
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: sparkplugs, 912, avgas
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John E. King " <kingjohn@erols.com>
John,
If you do not use a syringe to dispense the TCP, how do you know how
much to use at a filling? What size of container is used for the
$19.50 container?
--
John King
Warrenton, VA
jdmcbean wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
>
>I am a distributor for Decalin TCP. It is a competitior to Alcor but much
>safer, can be carried in the cockpit and is easy to dispense... Syringe not
>needed. If you are burning 100LL you really do want to use a Lead
Scavenger.
>I am only operating with 100LL and using the Decalin TCP. Plugs currently
>have 80 hours..
>
>Not sure about the 912.. but isn't .020 a small gap... ?
>
>Ps.. the TCP is $19.50 +S&H and treats up to 320 gallons.
>
>
>Blue Skies
>John & Debra McBean
>"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
>
>
Message 27
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|
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
Hi all,
Sorry for taking so long to write, but there's something about
hospital life that sucks up all of your time and leaves your mind too
groggy to put together a sentence. The good news is that, after a 3
week stay, I was released from the hospital last Saturday evening and
am resting at a friend's house. They have not yet put my legs back
together so I cannot walk and am not self-sufficient (and probably
won't be for many more weeks).
As I mentioned last time, there are parts of what happened that I
don't remember but based on what my passenger (also an experienced
pilot) and I each recall I'd have to say that the accident was caused
by a low-level windshear. The air was warm and choppy. I remember
glancing at the airspeed indicator and seeing it drop abruptly from
mid-speed cruise to well below stall speed. As you'd expect, the
nose dropped immediately and the plane rolled a little to the left (I
may not have had the ball quite centered).
I advanced the throttle and pulled back on the stick as we regained
flying speed but the ground rose up and smite us. I think another
100 feet of altitude would have allowed us to make it--we impacted in
a level attitude with our sink rate almost completely arrested.
I'm not sure what lessons for others there may be in this story
except to remember to respect how incredibly light the Kitfox/Avid
machines are and how much they can be affected by mother nature.
As I'm sure many of you have guessed, one of the most painful aspects
of this entire adventure has been the loss of my Kitfox. My father
and I put 11 years of our lives into building that machine and,
although he never got the chance to fly it, I spent 70 magnificent
flight hours falling head-over-heals in love with her. I feel like
I've lost a family member. I've tried not to think about it much
because I need to stay focused on my recovery, but every time I do,
it brings tears to my eyes.
Once again I want to thank everyone for the kind and encouraging
thoughts both on and off the list.
Mike G.
N728KF
Message 28
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
Michel asks:
>...I'd appreciate your comments on the injuries you and your friend
>suffered and how you see it could be prevented in a Kitfox. As you
>know, I fly with the compulsory helmet in Norway. Do you think a
>helmet would have helped you? Is there other things in the kockpit
>that need more securing, padding?
If I were to do it over again, I'd have built a much softer
instrument panel :-)
Both of us suffered facial injuries caused by hitting our faces on
the instrument panel. I think a helmet would only have helped if it
had a shatter-proof face shield of some type.
I suffered two broken legs below the knee while my passenger has a
fractured lumbar vertebrae and fractured pelvis. It seems that these
injuries were a result of how the airplane hit the ground. Both
seats had under-seat storage compartments that looked like accordions
after the crash--they had obviously absorbed a lot of energy. The
aircraft was equipped with Grove gear for the mains and SkyStar's
nosewheel, all of which did a good job of absorbing energy as well.
I'm not sure what the individual builder can do to improve the
crashworthiness of their 'fox, but the key to survival is for the
structure to absorb the impact energy to the extent possible, rather
than passing that energy on to the occupants.
I hope this helps, Michel.
Mike G.
N728KF
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox crash I have a question .... |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Aerobatics@aol.com
Do you think a BRS might have made a difference?
I dont have one, but use to on a Firestar2....
Dave
KF2
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Accident Update |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Roger L <yiotta@yahoo.com>
Michael,
I am indeed quite sorry for your loss but thankful that you survived the crash.
Your passenger is equally lucky as a pelvic fracture can be a life threatening
injury.
I am not a physicist but I don't understand why you think the light weight
of the kitfox is a factor in windsheer performance.
It is my understanding that windsheer is a rapid down draft that would
effect all flying objects equally, regardless of weight, is this not true.
Roger L
Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net> wrote:
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs
Hi all,
Sorry for taking so long to write, but there's something about
hospital life that sucks up all of your time and leaves your mind too
groggy to put together a sentence. The good news is that, after a 3
week stay, I was released from the hospital last Saturday evening and
am resting at a friend's house. They have not yet put my legs back
together so I cannot walk and am not self-sufficient (and probably
won't be for many more weeks).
As I mentioned last time, there are parts of what happened that I
don't remember but based on what my passenger (also an experienced
pilot) and I each recall I'd have to say that the accident was caused
by a low-level windshear. The air was warm and choppy. I remember
glancing at the airspeed indicator and seeing it drop abruptly from
mid-speed cruise to well below stall speed. As you'd expect, the
nose dropped immediately and the plane rolled a little to the left (I
may not have had the ball quite centered).
I advanced the throttle and pulled back on the stick as we regained
flying speed but the ground rose up and smite us. I think another
100 feet of altitude would have allowed us to make it--we impacted in
a level attitude with our sink rate almost completely arrested.
I'm not sure what lessons for others there may be in this story
except to remember to respect how incredibly light the Kitfox/Avid
machines are and how much they can be affected by mother nature.
As I'm sure many of you have guessed, one of the most painful aspects
of this entire adventure has been the loss of my Kitfox. My father
and I put 11 years of our lives into building that machine and,
although he never got the chance to fly it, I spent 70 magnificent
flight hours falling head-over-heals in love with her. I feel like
I've lost a family member. I've tried not to think about it much
because I need to stay focused on my recovery, but every time I do,
it brings tears to my eyes.
Once again I want to thank everyone for the kind and encouraging
thoughts both on and off the list.
Mike G.
N728KF
---------------------------------
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Accident Update good point? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Aerobatics@aol.com
Maybe more speed related? Maybe both are factors?
If flying low and slow.... well ..... there are inherent risks... and I do
it too ... but, where I am, its FLAT. And now that crops are done...
smoooooth everywhere.
But Cell towers are poping everywere and so on
Dave
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Accident Update |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Aerobatics@aol.com
my other 1/2 asked.......
Did you have shoulder straps?
Hmm great question....
Dave
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Accident Update lastly |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Aerobatics@aol.com
Most importantly......
Prayers are with you for a fast recovery
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Accident Update |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
Michael...time I chime in here. I've been thinking about you a lot. I agree
with your perspective regarding the Fox and Avid. I fly in an area where
wind and turbulant conditions is the norm. Morning flights are safest. God
speed to you and your passenger. Let me know if there is anything you need.
Steve Cooper
Avid Mark IV
N919SC
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Gibbs" <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Accident Update
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
>
> Hi all,
>
> Sorry for taking so long to write, but there's something about
> hospital life that sucks up all of your time and leaves your mind too
> groggy to put together a sentence. The good news is that, after a 3
> week stay, I was released from the hospital last Saturday evening and
> am resting at a friend's house. They have not yet put my legs back
> together so I cannot walk and am not self-sufficient (and probably
> won't be for many more weeks).
>
> As I mentioned last time, there are parts of what happened that I
> don't remember but based on what my passenger (also an experienced
> pilot) and I each recall I'd have to say that the accident was caused
> by a low-level windshear. The air was warm and choppy. I remember
> glancing at the airspeed indicator and seeing it drop abruptly from
> mid-speed cruise to well below stall speed. As you'd expect, the
> nose dropped immediately and the plane rolled a little to the left (I
> may not have had the ball quite centered).
>
> I advanced the throttle and pulled back on the stick as we regained
> flying speed but the ground rose up and smite us. I think another
> 100 feet of altitude would have allowed us to make it--we impacted in
> a level attitude with our sink rate almost completely arrested.
>
> I'm not sure what lessons for others there may be in this story
> except to remember to respect how incredibly light the Kitfox/Avid
> machines are and how much they can be affected by mother nature.
>
> As I'm sure many of you have guessed, one of the most painful aspects
> of this entire adventure has been the loss of my Kitfox. My father
> and I put 11 years of our lives into building that machine and,
> although he never got the chance to fly it, I spent 70 magnificent
> flight hours falling head-over-heals in love with her. I feel like
> I've lost a family member. I've tried not to think about it much
> because I need to stay focused on my recovery, but every time I do,
> it brings tears to my eyes.
>
> Once again I want to thank everyone for the kind and encouraging
> thoughts both on and off the list.
>
> Mike G.
> N728KF
>
>
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