Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:50 AM - SV: Coating on Inside of Cowl To Lowell (Michel Verheughe)
2. 02:47 AM - Re: SV: Coating on Inside of Cowl To Lowell (Ceashman@aol.com)
3. 03:02 AM - Carb filter change (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
4. 03:07 AM - Re: Second question, I'm thinking of changing the airfilter on m... (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
5. 03:13 AM - Re: 582 main jets (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
6. 03:17 AM - Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel filters (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
7. 03:28 AM - SV: SV: Coating on Inside of Cowl To Lowell (Michel Verheughe)
8. 03:32 AM - Re: SV: Coating on Inside of Cowl To Lowell (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
9. 03:36 AM - SV: Second question, I'm thinking of changing the airfilter on my 582 from the (Michel Verheughe)
10. 05:06 AM - NSI CAP 140 AD (Norm Beauchamp)
11. 05:12 AM - Re: 582 main jets (Gary Algate)
12. 05:13 AM - More Prop Stuff (Norm Beauchamp)
13. 06:02 AM - Clear plastic FiltersRe: Location of Fuel Filter (Harris, Robert)
14. 06:10 AM - Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel (Harris, Robert)
15. 06:21 AM - Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel (Harris, Robert)
16. 07:19 AM - Re: : REPLY: Wood Props/ Float Planes ()
17. 07:28 AM - SV: SV: Coating on Inside of Cowl To Lowell (Michel Verheughe)
18. 08:36 AM - Re: My 912 Won't Stop (jdmcbean)
19. 09:48 AM - Re: : REPLY: Wood Props/ Float Planes (Harris, Robert)
20. 12:47 PM - Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters (Lowell Fitt)
21. 01:26 PM - Re: My 912 Won't Stop (flier)
22. 02:42 PM - Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters (Fox5flyer)
23. 02:42 PM - Fuel filter Questions Re: Location of Fuel Filter (Harris, Robert)
24. 03:18 PM - Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
25. 03:24 PM - Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters (Dee Young)
26. 03:39 PM - Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
27. 04:19 PM - Re: Second question, I'm thinking of changing the airfilter on m... (Torgeir Mortensen)
28. 04:27 PM - Re: SV: Second question, I'm thinking of changing the airfilter on my 582 from the (Torgeir Mortensen)
29. 04:50 PM - Different plugs=smoother running down low. (Rex & Jan Shaw)
30. 04:55 PM - Other Rotax engines. (Torgeir Mortensen)
31. 04:59 PM - Re: Second question, I'm thinking of changing the airfilter on m... (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
32. 05:29 PM - Re: Fuel filter Questions Re: Location of Fuel Filter an d starvation: Fuel fil ters (Lowell Fitt)
33. 05:39 PM - Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters (Lowell Fitt)
34. 05:48 PM - Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters (Fox5flyer)
35. 05:49 PM - Re: Fuel filter Questions Re: Location of Fuel (Harris, Robert)
36. 06:00 PM - Re: Other Rotax engines. (chad lively)
37. 06:05 PM - Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters (STEPHEN ZAKRESKI)
38. 06:21 PM - Re: My 912 Won't Stop (Jimmie Blackwell)
39. 06:38 PM - Re: Other Rotax engines. (Steve Magdic)
40. 09:39 PM - Re: Second question, I'm thinking of changing the (Guy Buchanan)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Coating on Inside of Cowl To Lowell |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
> From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> Third and maybe most important, the addition of a light epoxy coating adds a
> tremendous amount of strength to the fiberglass cowl
I am not so sure, Don. From GRP yachts design, I know that the common home-builder
mistake is to think that polyester (or epoxy) gives strength. It is the glassfiber
that does that, the resin is simply the glue that keeps thing together.
When a production yacht is certified by Lloyd's or DnV, they cut a piece of the
hull, weight it, then burn away the resin in an oven, then weight again the glassfiber
left. That has to amount to at least 70% of the total weight. Also,
when moulding with glassfiber, one has to roll as much of it as possible, yet
avoiding dry spots and air bubbles.
But I agree that closing all the small holes in the surface will keep dirt and
oil to seep in the glassfiber. However, I think that a good paint, like polyurethane,
will do just as well.
Yacht hulls are moulded like this: First a layer of gelcoat that consists of polyester
with colour pigments and wax, is sprayed in the mould. Then either glassfiber
cloth is hand laid with polyester, or a mixture of polyester and short
glassfiber is sprayed. The later is faster but it is more difficult to control
the thickness. Since polyurethane is superior to gelcoat, a high quality mould
would be to spray polyurethane first, then gelcoat, then glassfiber & polyester.
But to my knowledge, no yard is doing that, the gelcoat looking good enough
for the first years.
My humble "old salt" contribution.
Michel
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Coating on Inside of Cowl To Lowell |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ceashman@aol.com
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe
First a layer of gelcoat that consists of polyester with colour pigments and
wax, is sprayed in the mould. Then either glassfiber cloth is hand laid with
polyester, or a mixture of polyester and short glassfiber is sprayed. The later
is faster but it is more difficult to control the thickness. Since
polyurethane is superior to gelcoat, a high quality mould would be to spray polyurethane
first, then gelcoat, then glassfiber & polyester. But to my knowledge, no
yard is doing that, the gelcoat looking good enough for the first years.
My humble "old salt" contribution.
Michel--<
Hello Michel.
Spraying a Polyurethane first could not be done. Even though, there are a lot
of manufacturers who would love this to be possible.
As you say, the mold is polished between layouts and a wax is applied for
easy plug release (whatever you are making should pop out when compressed air is
blown through little holes in the mold).
Then after the wax a release agent is sprayed (could be PVA, poly vinyl
acetate) which also helps separate the mould from the production unit. (by the
way
-- you can purchase stuff from Aircraft Spruce for mold lay up).
A life time ago. I used to work in a fabricating facility that made
fiberglass things!
A Polyurethane color / top coat, sprayed into the wax ridden, PVA mould,
would look bloody awful. Fish eye craters and silicone separation voids. The
Polyurethane would also like to cure out before the Polyester gel coat is sprayed
otherwise the curing would be hampered of the Polyurethane.
The trouble with the polyester gelcoat is that it does not like ultra violet
from the sun and does not last. After some time outside exposure you will
notice when you run your fingers across the surface that the top of the gelcoat
is
powdery. Clear gelcoat is more resistant (like bass boats. A more expensive
process, where matal flake color gelcoat is sprayed on top of a polyester
clear. Remember, the system is in reverse). But a lot of manufacturers would prefer
to spray a Polyurethane top coat after the object is made. The trouble is, it
is usually too cost prohibitive for them to do this.
Cheers. Eric.
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 3
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| Subject: | Carb filter change |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 10/27/04 5:32:06 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
rexjan@bigpond.com writes:
<< Somewhere in all my stuff I have an AD regarding this change and as I
remember a jet change is required. Probably no big deal if you are watching
your plugs anyway. Re the weight on the carby sockets I think the dual
filter has to be the better choice but what I've done is shorten up a octpus
strap and run it around under the carb/airfilter junction area to support >>
I'd be interested in hearing more about the do's and don't of using
single carb filters over the double one.
I also have a strap/springs/bracket assembly going from the top
thermostat bolt down across the face of the doubble carb filter and attaches below
at
the engine mount. I have the assembly just tight enough to support the carbs a
little without over tightening. However, there must be some good vibration
going on because the bracket across the doubble filter is slightly crushing the
filter. I'm not happy with that.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Second question, I'm thinking of changing the airfilter |
on m...
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 10/27/04 6:18:00 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
torgemor@online.no writes:
<< Hi Rex,
Don't change to two separate filters, -just like that..
Here's my why: >>
Just to clear things up, it is Don Smythe asking to change to single filters
not Rex.
I have logged the good reason into memory....
Thanks,
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Do Not Archive
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: 582 main jets |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 10/27/04 6:24:54 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
canpilot03@yahoo.ca writes:
<< When the weather gets colder (like now!!!) do all you 582ers, change your
main jets??? To what size??
Seems to me that since the cooler or colder weather is here ,my EGT's are
higher!!?????
Also what thermostat should I be running in a 582?
Thanx
Gil Levesque
C-IGVL >>
Gil,
Yes, you should change your jets. Use the jetting chart and select the
main based on the OAT's. Look ahead and anticipate future temps to help make
the decision. I change my jets twice a year. Right now I have the summer jets
in (165) I think. I will rejet soon based on an average temp in Va of about
35-40 degrees winter. This should take me all the way through to the Spring
when temps start going up and hitting high 50's or so.
I use the 165 degree thermostat year round. It's the one used for the
OMC outboard marine engine. Don't have the number handy. BTW, If you don't
presently have a thermostat installed, you will need to purchase a Rotax gasket
that fits around the flange of the OMC thermostat. The OMC stat does not come
with this special gasket.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel filters |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 10/27/04 7:42:32 PM Pacific Daylight Time, dafox@ckt.net
writes:
<< about the inline purolator filters between the wing tanks and the header
tank,
Is, you can always inspect them for fuel flow and contamination before,
during, and after when you fly. I think there are the best you can get.
>>
I might add one more good thing that I noticed about these filters. If
during a preflight you observe water in one of the filters, the water appears
not
pass through the filtler unless you induce flow (like start the engine). So,
it acts as a water trap and gives you the opportunity to stop and clean before
starting the engine.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 7
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| Subject: | Coating on Inside of Cowl To Lowell |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
> From: Ceashman@aol.com
> A Polyurethane color / top coat, sprayed into the wax ridden, PVA mould,
> would look bloody awful. Fish eye craters and silicone separation voids. The
> Polyurethane would also like to cure out before the Polyester gel coat is sprayed
> otherwise the curing would be hampered of the Polyurethane.
Ahhhh! That's the reason! Thanks a lot, Eric. Even on maritime questions, this
list has all the answers. What a source of information!
You see, Eric, my sailboat hull is red. Yes, I know, the worst colour, as red pigments
are the first to be faded by the sunlight. In fact, my hull is now more
like ... pink! :-(
And I have seen old red hulls bright and shiny. But they were polyurethane painted.
So, I wondered why that wasn't done from factory. But now I have the answer.
Thanks again.
Cheers,
Michel
do not archive ... (unless you are interested in yachting! :-)
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Coating on Inside of Cowl To Lowell |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 10/28/04 1:51:21 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
michel@online.no writes:
<< I am not so sure, Don. From GRP yachts design, I know that the common
home-builder mistake is to think that polyester (or epoxy) gives strength. It is
the glassfiber that does that, the resin is simply the glue that keeps thing
together.
>>
I totally agree with what you say about the glass fiber giving strength.
However, when I cut open my fuel tanks and re engineered the whole thing, I
coated the insides with very thin epoxy resin as a main reason to capture all the
fuzzie fiberglass hanging everywhere. The other reason was to penetrate any
cracks/pinholes to prevent fuel leaks (my Kreeme was peeling bad). That tank
seemed much stiffer when complete. Maybe it was my imagination??
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Do Not Archive
Message 9
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| Subject: | Second question, I'm thinking of changing the airfilter |
on my 582 from the
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
> From: Torgeir Mortensen [torgemor@online.no]
> This lower the mass in each unit, I.E. the resonant freq. will be higher
> (as less mass)!
Aha! A bit like the old sailing ships that hoisted heavy chains in the masts, when
riding a storm, Torgeir, isn't it? (sorry, can't help my maritime reference!
:-)
Good thinking! And let the good vibs overcome the bad ones, man! Far out, man!
:-)
Cheers,
Michel
do not archive
Message 10
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Norm Beauchamp <nebchmp@wcc.net>
This was posted on the Airsoob List. If it was on the Kitfox list I may have missed
it. If it is a double post, beg pardon. Norm
This summer an RAA member suffered the loss of a prop blade on his
amphibious 912S Kitfox, that was equipped with a NSI CAP 140 propellor. The
engine immediately broke from its mount, but fortunately was retained by
the hoses and cables. The pilot was able to make a successful emergency
landing with the departed blade stuck into his float.
The NSI CAP 140 prop is in-flight adjustable and has three Warp Drive
blades that are modified by the addition of an aluminum cuff that fits into
the NSI hub. There have so far been two versions of this cuff, with a third
version about to be released. Some applications will have their effective
lives limited by this AD, and others are grounded immediately. New version
3 parts are not yet ready, so some planes will be grounded until parts are
available near the end of this year.
Effective immediately, all 912S Rotax engines with either the version 1
or version 2 cuff are grounded. These parts may not be used any longer.
Ship your blades to NSI for installation of the version 3 cuff. Lance
Wheeler has told me this morning that the cost will be under $500 US.
Effective immediately, all 912 engines with the version 1 cuff are
limited to 500 hours. All 912 engines with the version 2 cuff are limited
to 1000 hours. Blades must then be shipped to NSI for installation of the
version 3 cuff.
Effective immediately, all 914 engines with the version 1 cuff are
limited to 700 hours. All 914 engines with the version 2 cuff are limited
to 1000 hours. Blades must then be shipped to NSI for installation of the
version 3 cuff.
In Lance Wheeler's estimate, blades fitted with the version 3 cuff will
have an effective life of 2000 hours. This estimate has been calculated by
Finite Element Analysis. The full story on this will be printed in the next
issue of the Recreational Flyer.
Gary Wolf
President, RAA Canada
____________________________________
Message 11
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
Gil
As you are "just down the road" our jetting should be pretty close. I am
still on the 165's at present but I have the needles in their highest
(richest) position. In the middle of summer I run the 165 jets in their
lowest (leanest) position.
As soon as the ambient temps drop below -5, I switch to the 170 jets and use
them throughout winter with the needles in their "mid" position.
I have the in-flight adjustable prop so I can manage my EGT's better than
fixed pitched props so you may have to experiment a little with the needle
settings on the 170 jets as the temps vary throughout winter.
I use the standard Rotax thermostat and don't have any problems with coolant
temps.
Gary Algate
Lite2/582
Barrie Ont
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 10/27/04 6:24:54 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
canpilot03@yahoo.ca writes:
<< When the weather gets colder (like now!!!) do all you 582ers, change
your
main jets??? To what size??
Seems to me that since the cooler or colder weather is here ,my EGT's are
higher!!?????
Also what thermostat should I be running in a 582?
Thanx
Gil Levesque
C-IGVL >>
Gil,
Yes, you should change your jets. Use the jetting chart and select the
main based on the OAT's. Look ahead and anticipate future temps to help
make
the decision. I change my jets twice a year. Right now I have the summer
jets
in (165) I think. I will rejet soon based on an average temp in Va of about
35-40 degrees winter. This should take me all the way through to the Spring
when temps start going up and hitting high 50's or so.
I use the 165 degree thermostat year round. It's the one used for the
OMC outboard marine engine. Don't have the number handy. BTW, If you don't
presently have a thermostat installed, you will need to purchase a Rotax
gasket
that fits around the flange of the OMC thermostat. The OMC stat does not
come
with this special gasket.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 12
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Norm Beauchamp <nebchmp@wcc.net>
From another e-mail list. Norm
http://www.ultralightnews.com/safety_bulletins/warpdrive_failure.htm
Message 13
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and starvation": kitfox-list@matronics.com
| Subject: | Location of Fuel Filter |
and starvation: Fuel filters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Thanks Roger,
I'll stop using the glass filters. Mine were made by "Pro-fuel" and look
just like the like the GLASS
PUROLATOR FILTERs.
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
r.thomas@za.pwc.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
filters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: r.thomas@za.pwc.com
Hi Robert
I guess I should have mentioned these ones were fitted to trikes and not a
KF. (I fly trikes too)
With my experience with them on the trike, I don't think I would be happy
to put one on my KF. My thinking is that if these glass ones have to be
well cared for, I would rather take my chances with a clear plastic, throw
away one, and change it every 25 hours to be safe. Excessive, yes maybe,
but I like the insurance.
Regards
Roger
"Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Sent by: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
27/10/2004 04:40 PM
Please respond to
kitfox-list@matronics.com
To
"'kitfox-list@matronics.com'" <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
cc
Subject
Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel filters
Size: 7 Kb
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
<Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
What were the locations of the filters that caused fuel starvation? My
GLASS
PUROLATOR FILTERS are located between the wing tanks and header tank and I
don't think an air leak would cause fuel starvation. Does the location
make
a difference?
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
r.thomas@za.pwc.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fuel filters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: r.thomas@za.pwc.com
Hi Gill
If you are referring to filters similar to this
http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/resources/images/list/fse_puro.jpg then:
A bunch of us used these filters. Out of about 5 of us, 4 failed within a
short space of time. Luckily mine was the 5th and I removed it before I
picked up any problems.
The problem appears to be the seals at each end between the glass and
housing. They seem to perish quickly and the filter begins to suck in air
and leads to fuel starvation.
Regards
Roger
"Jose M. Toro" <jose_m_toro@yahoo.com>
Sent by: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
27/10/2004 05:28 AM
Please respond to
kitfox-list@matronics.com
To
kitfox-list@matronics.com
cc
Subject
Re: Kitfox-List: Fuel filters
Size: 5 Kb
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jose M. Toro" <jose_m_toro@yahoo.com>
Gill:
I know of at least two occurrences of failures of those filters. I would
not use those filters. Engine failure + in-flight fire = undesiderable
combo.
Jose
Gill Levesque <canpilot03@yahoo.ca> wrote:
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Gill Levesque
Hey all Canadian listers,
Can you tell me where I could find the GLASS PUROLATOR FILTERS in
Canada??? Thanks
Gil Levesque
C-IGVL
Still alive and flyin!!!!
Gil
---------------------------------
Jose M. Toro, P.E.
Kitfox II/582
"A slow flight in the Caribbean..."
---------------------------------
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The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to
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Message 14
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fil ters
| Subject: | Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel |
fil ters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
I was going to go to a plastic but now I'm not sure. --r
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of david yeamans
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
filters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "david yeamans" <dafox@ckt.net>
I agree with Don Smythe,
I've had mine installed for over 4 years, and check them at the
annual
conditioning inspection. I've replaced the filters each inspection because
of
a slight fiberglass fuzz from the wingtanks. This last inspection they were
clear and no sign of contamination, so I didn't touch them. I've never
replaced any of the O rings, as they've always sealed just fine. One thing
about the inline purolator filters between the wing tanks and the header
tank,
Is, you can always inspect them for fuel flow and contamination before,
during, and after when you fly. I think there are the best you can get.
David N317DY
IV 1200 250 hrs
----- Original Message -----
From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 5:11 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
filters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 10/27/04 8:56:31 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
r.thomas@za.pwc.com writes:
<< I guess I should have mentioned these ones were fitted to trikes and
not a
KF. (I fly trikes too)
With my experience with them on the trike, I don't think I would be happy
to put one on my KF. My thinking is that if these glass ones have to be
well cared for, I would rather take my chances with a clear plastic,
throw
away one, and change it every 25 hours to be safe. Excessive, yes maybe,
but I like the insurance.
Regards
Roger >>
Roger,
This might be all apples and oranges situation. One thing you might
consider. The Purolators will show you if you have any water collected.
A paper
filter will "clog" if saturated with water. There is no special care
required
with the glass Purolator filters. You can see what's happening at a
glance.
If there is water or debris in the filter, it's easy to see and take care
of.
IMHO, the glass Purolators are the insurance you're looking for.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 15
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|
fil ters
| Subject: | Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel |
fil ters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
I was going to go to a plastic but now I'm not sure. --r
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Harris, Robert
ters@cleopatra.intuit.com
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
ters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
<Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Thanks Roger,
I'll stop using the glass filters. Mine were made by "Pro-fuel" and look
just like the like the GLASS
PUROLATOR FILTERs.
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of david yeamans
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
filters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "david yeamans" <dafox@ckt.net>
I agree with Don Smythe,
I've had mine installed for over 4 years, and check them at the
annual
conditioning inspection. I've replaced the filters each inspection because
of
a slight fiberglass fuzz from the wingtanks. This last inspection they were
clear and no sign of contamination, so I didn't touch them. I've never
replaced any of the O rings, as they've always sealed just fine. One thing
about the inline purolator filters between the wing tanks and the header
tank,
Is, you can always inspect them for fuel flow and contamination before,
during, and after when you fly. I think there are the best you can get.
David N317DY
IV 1200 250 hrs
----- Original Message -----
From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 5:11 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
filters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 10/27/04 8:56:31 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
r.thomas@za.pwc.com writes:
<< I guess I should have mentioned these ones were fitted to trikes and
not a
KF. (I fly trikes too)
With my experience with them on the trike, I don't think I would be happy
to put one on my KF. My thinking is that if these glass ones have to be
well cared for, I would rather take my chances with a clear plastic,
throw
away one, and change it every 25 hours to be safe. Excessive, yes maybe,
but I like the insurance.
Regards
Roger >>
Roger,
This might be all apples and oranges situation. One thing you might
consider. The Purolators will show you if you have any water collected.
A paper
filter will "clog" if saturated with water. There is no special care
required
with the glass Purolator filters. You can see what's happening at a
glance.
If there is water or debris in the filter, it's easy to see and take care
of.
IMHO, the glass Purolators are the insurance you're looking for.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 16
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|
| Subject: | Re: : REPLY: Wood Props/ Float Planes |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: <av8rps@tznet.com>
Wood props are fine on seaplanes as long as they utilize some sort of
leading edge protection (metal, epoxy, etc). In reality, they are probably
the best prop in the water (for aircraft around 100 hp) if they have leading
edge protection. They will need occasional maintenance varnishing so that
water never seeps in through a nick or scratch, but overall they hold up
very well. And one generally can do his own maintenance and upkeep, which
is generally not possible with a metal or composite prop. Plus, they are
just soooo pretty!
I put more than a thousand hours on Avids with wood props, mostly on floats.
No significant prop erosion or damage ever. Usually late fall I would
remove the prop and revarnish it due to minor nicks (which probably happened
when operating on wheels, incidentally). That kept them very nice. The
props I used all had epoxy leading edges. And fwiw, I wouldn't buy a wood
prop without leading edge protection, even for a land plane. Flying in the
rain without leading edge protection is tempting fate (IMHO).
Even aluminum props sustain damage if they are exposed to a lot of water
spray. My Lake amphibians' aluminum Hartzell has more water erosion damage
after 5 years of use (500+ hours) than all three of my wood props suffered
in 1000+ hours combined. And a Lake gets very little water mist/spray
through the prop compared to a regular float plane. So don't discount a
good wood prop when making your decision for a seaplane prop.
Paul Seehafer
Central Wisconsin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Barry Huston" <barryhuston@adelphia.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: : REPLY: Wood Props/ Float Planes
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Barry Huston"
> <barryhuston@adelphia.net>
>
>
>> Doug
>> Your point on wood props is right on --- Im starting to nibble the tips
>> off.
>>
>> Barry
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: <DPREMGOOD@aol.com>
>> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 9:19 AM
>> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: IVO PROP --- More Questions
>>
>>
>>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: DPREMGOOD@aol.com
>>>
>>> Barry,
>>>
>>> My understanding is that a wooden prop on floats is a no no.
>>>
>>> If any waterspray hits that prop, it is like kicking up stones. It will
>>> do
>>> damage to your prop.
>>>
>>> As for the IVO, there are many more people on the list that can answer
>>> that
>>> question better than I could.
>>>
>>> Take care,
>>>
>>> Doug Remoundos
>>> Classic IV
>>> Montreal, Canada
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 17
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|
| Subject: | Coating on Inside of Cowl To Lowell |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
Don wrote:
> The other reason was to penetrate any cracks/pinholes to prevent fuel leaks
Yes, epoxy will do that, Don. GRP yacht hulls suffer sometime from osmoze, i.e.
water having a lesser specific weight than styrene residues in the hull, will,
with time, penetrate the polyester and create blisters. To prevent that, careful
new owners coat the hull, under the waterline, with several layers of epoxy,
to make it really watertight.
> That tank seemed much stiffer when complete. Maybe it was my imagination??
I don't know, Don, but I fail to see how the tank can be stiffer. Unless, of course,
there was a lot of dry glassfiber that could flex on the surface.
Cheers,
Michel
do not archive
Message 18
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|
| Subject: | My 912 Won't Stop |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
Jimmie,
Could the switch have gone bad.. maybe. Most likely you have made the
ground continuous.. be very careful around the prop right now it is most
likely hot...
You need to re-check your grounds.. The switch should take the ignition to
ground..
Blue Skies
John & Debra McBean
www.sportplanellc.com
"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jimmie Blackwell
Subject: Kitfox-List: My 912 Won't Stop
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie Blackwell" <jablackwell@ev1.net>
Darn it. If something was to go right with my 912 I would be delighted.
Today, after improving the ground wires for the ignition switch and master
switch my engine would not shut down. Had to shut off the fuel to get the
engine to stop.
I did note that when starting I had to hold the key in just the right place
to get the starter to engage. What you folks think, did my ACS ignition
switch go bad suddenly or did my tinkering go bad.
One of these days I just might be an asset to this list after I get done
making all the mistakes.
Please someone help. I can't stand it anymore, I need to fly a little, not
work on it all the time.
Thanks
Jimmie
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | : REPLY: Wood Props/ Float Planes |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Paul,
What type and size of motor was on your Amphib Avid? What brand of wood prop
do you recommend?
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
av8rps@tznet.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: : REPLY: Wood Props/ Float Planes
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: <av8rps@tznet.com>
Wood props are fine on seaplanes as long as they utilize some sort of
leading edge protection (metal, epoxy, etc). In reality, they are probably
the best prop in the water (for aircraft around 100 hp) if they have leading
edge protection. They will need occasional maintenance varnishing so that
water never seeps in through a nick or scratch, but overall they hold up
very well. And one generally can do his own maintenance and upkeep, which
is generally not possible with a metal or composite prop. Plus, they are
just soooo pretty!
I put more than a thousand hours on Avids with wood props, mostly on floats.
No significant prop erosion or damage ever. Usually late fall I would
remove the prop and revarnish it due to minor nicks (which probably happened
when operating on wheels, incidentally). That kept them very nice. The
props I used all had epoxy leading edges. And fwiw, I wouldn't buy a wood
prop without leading edge protection, even for a land plane. Flying in the
rain without leading edge protection is tempting fate (IMHO).
Even aluminum props sustain damage if they are exposed to a lot of water
spray. My Lake amphibians' aluminum Hartzell has more water erosion damage
after 5 years of use (500+ hours) than all three of my wood props suffered
in 1000+ hours combined. And a Lake gets very little water mist/spray
through the prop compared to a regular float plane. So don't discount a
good wood prop when making your decision for a seaplane prop.
Paul Seehafer
Central Wisconsin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Barry Huston" <barryhuston@adelphia.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: : REPLY: Wood Props/ Float Planes
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Barry Huston"
> <barryhuston@adelphia.net>
>
>
>> Doug
>> Your point on wood props is right on --- Im starting to nibble the tips
>> off.
>>
>> Barry
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: <DPREMGOOD@aol.com>
>> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 9:19 AM
>> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: IVO PROP --- More Questions
>>
>>
>>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: DPREMGOOD@aol.com
>>>
>>> Barry,
>>>
>>> My understanding is that a wooden prop on floats is a no no.
>>>
>>> If any waterspray hits that prop, it is like kicking up stones. It will
>>> do
>>> damage to your prop.
>>>
>>> As for the IVO, there are many more people on the list that can answer
>>> that
>>> question better than I could.
>>>
>>> Take care,
>>>
>>> Doug Remoundos
>>> Classic IV
>>> Montreal, Canada
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Not to beat this to death, but.... I remember long ago when I was building
and thinking about fuel filters the glass ones were discussed. Among the
objections was the glass enclosure. I have waited for this to come up in
this discussion. The crux of that objection was the possibility of
ingesting something through the front of the cowl that might break the
glass. We had a report on the list a couple of years ago of a bird strike
in the engine compartment that tore out the primer line that did cause an
engine compartment fire.
The early discussion encouraged me to remove the one I had put in the engine
compartment. I still have the two in the lines that feed between the wing
tanks and header tank. I guess the plastic ones are OK, but I like the
metal tube that connects the inlet barb to the outlet barb. Somehow with
the plastic barbs, I can't get the image from my mind of fuel affected
plastic barbs becoming brittle and separating from the filter body.
To each his own. I guess it deals a lot with what we are already used to.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
ters
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
<Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
>
> I was going to go to a plastic but now I'm not sure. --r
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of david yeamans
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
> filters
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "david yeamans" <dafox@ckt.net>
>
> I agree with Don Smythe,
>
> I've had mine installed for over 4 years, and check them at the
> annual
> conditioning inspection. I've replaced the filters each inspection because
> of
> a slight fiberglass fuzz from the wingtanks. This last inspection they
were
> clear and no sign of contamination, so I didn't touch them. I've never
> replaced any of the O rings, as they've always sealed just fine. One thing
> about the inline purolator filters between the wing tanks and the header
> tank,
> Is, you can always inspect them for fuel flow and contamination before,
> during, and after when you fly. I think there are the best you can get.
>
> David N317DY
> IV 1200 250 hrs
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 5:11 PM
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
> filters
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 10/27/04 8:56:31 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> r.thomas@za.pwc.com writes:
>
> << I guess I should have mentioned these ones were fitted to trikes and
> not a
> KF. (I fly trikes too)
>
> With my experience with them on the trike, I don't think I would be
happy
> to put one on my KF. My thinking is that if these glass ones have to be
> well cared for, I would rather take my chances with a clear plastic,
> throw
> away one, and change it every 25 hours to be safe. Excessive, yes
maybe,
> but I like the insurance.
>
> Regards
> Roger >>
>
> Roger,
> This might be all apples and oranges situation. One thing you might
> consider. The Purolators will show you if you have any water collected.
> A paper
> filter will "clog" if saturated with water. There is no special care
> required
> with the glass Purolator filters. You can see what's happening at a
> glance.
> If there is water or debris in the filter, it's easy to see and take
care
> of.
> IMHO, the glass Purolators are the insurance you're looking for.
>
> Don Smythe
> N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
Message 21
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|
| Subject: | My 912 Won't Stop |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "flier" <FLIER@sbcglobal.net>
You really should have individual ground toggles in
order to be able to check each ignition during
runup. Then there is redundant grounding through the
ignition switch as well as the toggles. Sounds like
you've got one ignition that isn't grounding -- VERY
DANGEROUS.
Regards,
Ted
--- Original Message ---
From: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: My 912 Won't Stop
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean"
<jdmcbean@cableone.net>
>
>Jimmie,
> Could the switch have gone bad.. maybe. Most
likely you have made the
>ground continuous.. be very careful around the prop
right now it is most
>likely hot...
>You need to re-check your grounds.. The switch
should take the ignition to
>ground..
>
>Blue Skies
>John & Debra McBean
>www.sportplanellc.com
>"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On
Behalf Of Jimmie Blackwell
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Kitfox-List: My 912 Won't Stop
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie
Blackwell" <jablackwell@ev1.net>
>
>Darn it. If something was to go right with my 912 I
would be delighted.
>Today, after improving the ground wires for the
ignition switch and master
>switch my engine would not shut down. Had to shut
off the fuel to get the
>engine to stop.
>
>I did note that when starting I had to hold the key
in just the right place
>to get the starter to engage. What you folks think,
did my ACS ignition
>switch go bad suddenly or did my tinkering go bad.
>
>One of these days I just might be an asset to this
list after I get done
>making all the mistakes.
>
>Please someone help. I can't stand it anymore, I
need to fly a little, not
>work on it all the time.
>
>Thanks
>
>Jimmie
>
>
>_-
======================================================
==================
Contributions
any other
Forums.
>_-
======================================================
==================
>_-
======================================================
==================
http://www.matronics.com/subscription
http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
http://www.matronics.com/browse/kitfox-list
http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list
http://www.matronics.com/archives
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
list
http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>_-
======================================================
==================
>
>
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
As most aircraft engine failures are due to fuel problems, I think this is a
great thread and beating it to death once in awhile might just save
somebody's day.
Being a plumber I always try to get from point A to point B with as few
fittings as possible and a smooth unrestricted pathway. The Kitfox from
model IV on up has a belly drain (correct me if I'm wrong on this) that can
remove any debris that runs down the fuel line, therefore I felt that
placing the fuel filters in each tank line would not only be unecessary
redundancy, but it would also add several more potential leak points. This
would also place more restriction on the fuel flow. (How do you clean those
things without spilling fuel in your cockpit?) For this reason I chose to
not install anything in the tank-to-header lines and instead I installed an
38"id Earls (all aluminum) with internal sintered bronze filter on the
firewall as a last line of defense just prior to entering the fuel injector.
These filters are pretty rugged and well built and the internal filter is
replaceable. I know the clear filters look cool, but are they really
necessary?
Darrel
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
ters
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
> Not to beat this to death, but.... I remember long ago when I was
building
> and thinking about fuel filters the glass ones were discussed. Among the
> objections was the glass enclosure. I have waited for this to come up in
> this discussion. The crux of that objection was the possibility of
> ingesting something through the front of the cowl that might break the
> glass. We had a report on the list a couple of years ago of a bird strike
> in the engine compartment that tore out the primer line that did cause an
> engine compartment fire.
>
> The early discussion encouraged me to remove the one I had put in the
engine
> compartment. I still have the two in the lines that feed between the wing
> tanks and header tank. I guess the plastic ones are OK, but I like the
> metal tube that connects the inlet barb to the outlet barb. Somehow with
> the plastic barbs, I can't get the image from my mind of fuel affected
> plastic barbs becoming brittle and separating from the filter body.
>
> To each his own. I guess it deals a lot with what we are already used to.
>
> Lowell
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
> ters
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
> <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
> >
> > I was going to go to a plastic but now I'm not sure. --r
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of david
yeamans
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
> > filters
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "david yeamans" <dafox@ckt.net>
> >
> > I agree with Don Smythe,
> >
> > I've had mine installed for over 4 years, and check them at the
> > annual
> > conditioning inspection. I've replaced the filters each inspection
because
> > of
> > a slight fiberglass fuzz from the wingtanks. This last inspection they
> were
> > clear and no sign of contamination, so I didn't touch them. I've never
> > replaced any of the O rings, as they've always sealed just fine. One
thing
> > about the inline purolator filters between the wing tanks and the header
> > tank,
> > Is, you can always inspect them for fuel flow and contamination before,
> > during, and after when you fly. I think there are the best you can get.
> >
> > David
N317DY
> > IV 1200 250 hrs
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 5:11 PM
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
> > filters
> >
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> >
> > In a message dated 10/27/04 8:56:31 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> > r.thomas@za.pwc.com writes:
> >
> > << I guess I should have mentioned these ones were fitted to trikes
and
> > not a
> > KF. (I fly trikes too)
> >
> > With my experience with them on the trike, I don't think I would be
> happy
> > to put one on my KF. My thinking is that if these glass ones have to
be
> > well cared for, I would rather take my chances with a clear plastic,
> > throw
> > away one, and change it every 25 hours to be safe. Excessive, yes
> maybe,
> > but I like the insurance.
> >
> > Regards
> > Roger >>
> >
> > Roger,
> > This might be all apples and oranges situation. One thing you
might
> > consider. The Purolators will show you if you have any water
collected.
> > A paper
> > filter will "clog" if saturated with water. There is no special care
> > required
> > with the glass Purolator filters. You can see what's happening at a
> > glance.
> > If there is water or debris in the filter, it's easy to see and take
> care
> > of.
> > IMHO, the glass Purolators are the insurance you're looking for.
> >
> > Don Smythe
> > N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
> >
> >
>
>
Message 23
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|
an d starvation": kitfox-list@matronics.com
| Subject: | Location of Fuel Filter |
an d starvation: Fuel fil ters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Hi Lowell,
Did you buy glass filters from CPS? Who manufactures the filter you use? Do
you use black auto fuel hose (5/16?)from the wing tank to the header tank?
I have auto fuel hose but the new filter I have is for 1/4 hose.
I bought my glass filters from California Power Supply (CPS) and they are a
different brand than what I took out. Did you buy yours from CPS?
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
ters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Not to beat this to death, but.... I remember long ago when I was building
and thinking about fuel filters the glass ones were discussed. Among the
objections was the glass enclosure. I have waited for this to come up in
this discussion. The crux of that objection was the possibility of
ingesting something through the front of the cowl that might break the
glass. We had a report on the list a couple of years ago of a bird strike
in the engine compartment that tore out the primer line that did cause an
engine compartment fire.
The early discussion encouraged me to remove the one I had put in the engine
compartment. I still have the two in the lines that feed between the wing
tanks and header tank. I guess the plastic ones are OK, but I like the
metal tube that connects the inlet barb to the outlet barb. Somehow with
the plastic barbs, I can't get the image from my mind of fuel affected
plastic barbs becoming brittle and separating from the filter body.
To each his own. I guess it deals a lot with what we are already used to.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
ters
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
<Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
>
> I was going to go to a plastic but now I'm not sure. --r
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of david yeamans
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
> filters
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "david yeamans" <dafox@ckt.net>
>
> I agree with Don Smythe,
>
> I've had mine installed for over 4 years, and check them at the
> annual
> conditioning inspection. I've replaced the filters each inspection because
> of
> a slight fiberglass fuzz from the wingtanks. This last inspection they
were
> clear and no sign of contamination, so I didn't touch them. I've never
> replaced any of the O rings, as they've always sealed just fine. One thing
> about the inline purolator filters between the wing tanks and the header
> tank,
> Is, you can always inspect them for fuel flow and contamination before,
> during, and after when you fly. I think there are the best you can get.
>
> David N317DY
> IV 1200 250 hrs
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 5:11 PM
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
> filters
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 10/27/04 8:56:31 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> r.thomas@za.pwc.com writes:
>
> << I guess I should have mentioned these ones were fitted to trikes and
> not a
> KF. (I fly trikes too)
>
> With my experience with them on the trike, I don't think I would be
happy
> to put one on my KF. My thinking is that if these glass ones have to be
> well cared for, I would rather take my chances with a clear plastic,
> throw
> away one, and change it every 25 hours to be safe. Excessive, yes
maybe,
> but I like the insurance.
>
> Regards
> Roger >>
>
> Roger,
> This might be all apples and oranges situation. One thing you might
> consider. The Purolators will show you if you have any water collected.
> A paper
> filter will "clog" if saturated with water. There is no special care
> required
> with the glass Purolator filters. You can see what's happening at a
> glance.
> If there is water or debris in the filter, it's easy to see and take
care
> of.
> IMHO, the glass Purolators are the insurance you're looking for.
>
> Don Smythe
> N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 10/28/04 12:48:15 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
lcfitt@inreach.com writes:
<< this discussion. The crux of that objection was the possibility of
ingesting something through the front of the cowl that might break the
glass. We had a report on the list a couple of years ago of a bird strike >>
Lowell,
I thought hard on this one. I decided to put the final "glass" filter
under the instrument panel before it went into the engine compartment.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters |
Seal-Send-Time: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 16:23:04 -0600
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dee Young" <henrysfork1@msn.com>
Good choice Don, I mounted mine low enough you can view it while in flight. That
is a comfort to me
Dee Young
Model II
Do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: AlbertaIV@aol.com<mailto:AlbertaIV@aol.com>
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com<mailto:kitfox-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 4:18 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com<mailto:AlbertaIV@aol.com>
In a message dated 10/28/04 12:48:15 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
lcfitt@inreach.com<mailto:lcfitt@inreach.com> writes:
<< this discussion. The crux of that objection was the possibility of
ingesting something through the front of the cowl that might break the
glass. We had a report on the list a couple of years ago of a bird strike >>
Lowell,
I thought hard on this one. I decided to put the final "glass" filter
under the instrument panel before it went into the engine compartment.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
Darrel,
>>The Kitfox from model IV on up has a belly drain (correct me if I'm wrong
on this) that can remove any debris that runs down the fuel line,>>
IMHO, the drain on the bottom of the header is very poor to catch any debris
coming down from the wing tanks. The bottom of that header is not designed to
trap small amounts of debris that can be picked up by the little drain.
Also, for some reason, wing tanks are a haven for growing debris no matter how
careful you are in fueling your plane. After several fuelings, I always see some
stuff gathering in the wing tank "glass" filters. Again, IMHO.
>>but it would also add several more potential leak points. >>
The fittings on these filters simply don't leak, ever (knock on wood). Even
if they did, it would be a drop every three day's. I have never had the
smallest hint of a leak.
>>(How do you clean those
things without spilling fuel in your cockpit?) >>
I place a rag under mine and yes, I get a little fuel on the rag. In 15
minutes, all smell is gone. Not a problem.
>>For this reason I chose to not install anything in the tank-to-header lines
and instead I installed an 38"id Earls (all aluminum) with internal sintered
bronze filter on the firewall as a last line of defense just prior to entering
the fuel injector.>>
Almost for the same reason, I decided to "double" filter. The glass filters
I have below the wing tanks are always showing some small amount of junk. The
final "glass" filter under the instrument panel is always clean. Therefore,
the wing tank filters are doing an important part in keeping the final filter
clean.
>>These filters are pretty rugged and well built and the internal filter is
replaceable. I know the clear filters look cool, but are they really
necessary?>>
As stated above, I feel they are very important and the wing tank filters are
the most important. IMHO
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Second question, I'm thinking of changing the airfilter |
on m...
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
Aha. Don, -make sense... :) You know man, you're always asking good
questions. This is kind a of an art.. :) .
-
Then another good reason to keep your old filter as is:
In the past, I've been talking about an "alternative" true mixture system
for the two strokes.
Well, to recover- basically this system are using same method as the
"automatic mixture control - altitude corrected" made by "Rotax" ( "-" as
they hired a company to this project).
Of course, here's more details about the system:
http://www.greenskyadventures.com/bing/hacdetails.htm
The thing is, why not using a "manual system" in order to control the
mixture the same way as the old original..
OK. This is very simple, -and I don't understand why it takes so long for
the industries to come up with a manual system based on the original
Principe.
In January (maybe February :) ), Green Sky Adventures come up with the
"first" manual system, based on the original Principe.
Now, how does this work? It's that simple, you're using the pressure (the
true carburetor venturi pressure) to adjust the bowl chamber pressure. The
secret is the tiny vent loop at the carburetor. Put a T into this line,
then you adjust this pressure precisely - and this is your mixture control.
Some background here:
This "link line" (with the holes in the middle) make sure that the bowl
pressure is correct, our surrounding pressure. When we are pushing (our
throttle) more power, the venturi pressure decrease (our bowl pressure is
constant), the differential pressure increase - whola - more fuel.
OK. In the original system this is controlled by an aneroid bellows stack,
in the manual it is controlled with a needle valve - and a calibrated
leak, that's all folks. Yes, I know, because I've been using this thing
for four years..
So Don, this is the next thing for you (maybe under the Christmas
three??), just joking..
Here is the link to the "new" manual mixture system:
http://www.greenskyadventures.com/bing/manualMixPrelease.htm
Cheers
Torgeir.
http://www.greenskyadventures.com/bing/manualMixPrelease.htm
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 06:05:20 EDT, <AlbertaIV@aol.com> wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 10/27/04 6:18:00 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
> torgemor@online.no writes:
>
> << Hi Rex,
>
>
> Don't change to two separate filters, -just like that..
>
> Here's my why: >>
>
> Just to clear things up, it is Don Smythe asking to change to single
> filters
> not Rex.
> I have logged the good reason into memory....
> Thanks,
> Don Smythe
> N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
> Do Not Archive
>
>
--
Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Second question, I'm thinking of changing the airfilter |
on my 582 from the
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
Hi Old sailor... :)
One day we have to meet..
Comparing thing- seeing the similarity- thats makes life interesting.
I liked this one...
Cheers
Torgeir.
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 12:35:53 +0200 (CEST), Michel Verheughe
<michel@online.no> wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
>
>> From: Torgeir Mortensen [torgemor@online.no]
>> This lower the mass in each unit, I.E. the resonant freq. will be higher
>> (as less mass)!
>
> Aha! A bit like the old sailing ships that hoisted heavy chains in the
> masts, when riding a storm, Torgeir, isn't it? (sorry, can't help my
> maritime reference! :-)
>
> Good thinking! And let the good vibs overcome the bad ones, man! Far
> out, man! :-)
>
> Cheers,
> Michel
>
> do not archive
>
>
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Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
Message 29
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| Subject: | Different plugs=smoother running down low. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
I have been experimenting with some different NGK plugs. My previous
relavent experience is drastically modifying motors for Karts. My motive was
the rough running Rotax 582 in my MKIV Classic Speedster between 2 & 3
thousand revs. Also the often 300RPM difference on ignition check. I had
been running resistor caps and B8ES plugs. I swapped to non resistor caps
and resistor plugs because the plugs [ BR8EIX ] that I wanted only came in
resistor type. They really are running a lot better down low, 2 to 3,000 RPM
and on ignition check. We do tend to get a slight increase in ignition noise
in the radio though but we just need more squelch. I understand these plugs
are used when the 582 is run inverted so they have been proven in them. Plus
I have used them for about 10 hours now. The ignition noise increase comes
from the booster gap.
One day I may also experiment with an alternative idea. A B8ET. I don't
know if you can get this in BR8ET ie:- with resistor, but then if not one
simply runs resistor caps which I originally had anyway. The B8ET has three
earth electrodes. Old Alfa's used to run Golden Lodge plugs with 4 earth
electrodes and I know there was a marked difference swapping to Champion
single electrode. Also I put some multiple electrode Spitfire plugs in a
warmed 350 Chev motor in my Ski boat once and that idled much better. Really
I am happy with the BR8EIX plugs but am just curios re what the B8ET would
do.
Here is the relavent codes to the plugs I'm talking about.
"B" = 14mm thread
"R" = resistor plug
"8" = Heat range
"E" = 3/4" reach
"S" = standard 2.6mm centre electrode
"X" = booster gap to allow the votage to build higher before firing.
"T" = 3 ground electrodes.
"I" = Iridium. This is an extremely fine centre electrode giving a good
spark. Iridium is needed to stand up this fine and conduct the heat quickly
enough.
Note
BR8EIX is used in Ferarri and Porsche cars.
I present this as a matter of interest for anyone else that wants to
experiment.
Rex Shaw
Australia.
rexjan@bigpond.com
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | Other Rotax engines. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
Hi Folks,
We've often been discussing about the "other" Rotax combinations, most
often without much references.
Here is an "interesting" site, maybe not the one we'll prefer -but gives
some answer to us.
What about a two stroke Rotax delivering 105 HP, weight 110 lbs. (only one
ignition system (: ).
well it's kind of interesting, have a look:
http://www.rdaerosports.com/
Torgeir.
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Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Second question, I'm thinking of changing the airfilter |
on m...
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 10/28/04 4:20:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
torgemor@online.no writes:
<<
Then another good reason to keep your old filter as is:
In the past, I've been talking about an "alternative" true mixture system
for the two stroke >>
Torgeir,
I will keep your post for further study. Your post are usually heavy
enough that I can't get through them in a quick way. BTW, that's meant as a
complement.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Do Not Archive
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Location of Fuel Filter an |
d starvation: Fuel fil ters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Robert, I bought mine locally. They are 5/16" OD for the Auto hose. Yes I
do yes auto hose form the wing tanks to the header tank. Then aluminum the
rest of the way to the gascolator.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
starvation : kitfox-list@matronics.com>
Subject: Fuel filter Questions RE: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter an d
starvation: Fuel fil ters
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
<Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
>
> Hi Lowell,
> Did you buy glass filters from CPS? Who manufactures the filter you use?
Do
> you use black auto fuel hose (5/16?)from the wing tank to the header tank?
>
> I have auto fuel hose but the new filter I have is for 1/4 hose.
>
> I bought my glass filters from California Power Supply (CPS) and they are
a
> different brand than what I took out. Did you buy yours from CPS?
>
> Robert
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
> ters
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
> Not to beat this to death, but.... I remember long ago when I was
building
> and thinking about fuel filters the glass ones were discussed. Among the
> objections was the glass enclosure. I have waited for this to come up in
> this discussion. The crux of that objection was the possibility of
> ingesting something through the front of the cowl that might break the
> glass. We had a report on the list a couple of years ago of a bird strike
> in the engine compartment that tore out the primer line that did cause an
> engine compartment fire.
>
> The early discussion encouraged me to remove the one I had put in the
engine
> compartment. I still have the two in the lines that feed between the wing
> tanks and header tank. I guess the plastic ones are OK, but I like the
> metal tube that connects the inlet barb to the outlet barb. Somehow with
> the plastic barbs, I can't get the image from my mind of fuel affected
> plastic barbs becoming brittle and separating from the filter body.
>
> To each his own. I guess it deals a lot with what we are already used to.
>
> Lowell
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
> ters
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
> <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
> >
> > I was going to go to a plastic but now I'm not sure. --r
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of david
yeamans
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
> > filters
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "david yeamans" <dafox@ckt.net>
> >
> > I agree with Don Smythe,
> >
> > I've had mine installed for over 4 years, and check them at the
> > annual
> > conditioning inspection. I've replaced the filters each inspection
because
> > of
> > a slight fiberglass fuzz from the wingtanks. This last inspection they
> were
> > clear and no sign of contamination, so I didn't touch them. I've never
> > replaced any of the O rings, as they've always sealed just fine. One
thing
> > about the inline purolator filters between the wing tanks and the header
> > tank,
> > Is, you can always inspect them for fuel flow and contamination before,
> > during, and after when you fly. I think there are the best you can get.
> >
> > David
N317DY
> > IV 1200 250 hrs
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 5:11 PM
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
> > filters
> >
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> >
> > In a message dated 10/27/04 8:56:31 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> > r.thomas@za.pwc.com writes:
> >
> > << I guess I should have mentioned these ones were fitted to trikes
and
> > not a
> > KF. (I fly trikes too)
> >
> > With my experience with them on the trike, I don't think I would be
> happy
> > to put one on my KF. My thinking is that if these glass ones have to
be
> > well cared for, I would rather take my chances with a clear plastic,
> > throw
> > away one, and change it every 25 hours to be safe. Excessive, yes
> maybe,
> > but I like the insurance.
> >
> > Regards
> > Roger >>
> >
> > Roger,
> > This might be all apples and oranges situation. One thing you
might
> > consider. The Purolators will show you if you have any water
collected.
> > A paper
> > filter will "clog" if saturated with water. There is no special care
> > required
> > with the glass Purolator filters. You can see what's happening at a
> > glance.
> > If there is water or debris in the filter, it's easy to see and take
> care
> > of.
> > IMHO, the glass Purolators are the insurance you're looking for.
> >
> > Don Smythe
> > N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
> >
> >
>
>
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Hi Darrel,
How do I clean them? I clamp the hoses above the filters and after draining
a little fuel from the header tank, the filters are dry. A fuel spill from
the filters has never occurred to me before your post. I use this method
from time to time to check on my low fuel indicator unit.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
ters
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>
> As most aircraft engine failures are due to fuel problems, I think this is
a
> great thread and beating it to death once in awhile might just save
> somebody's day.
> Being a plumber I always try to get from point A to point B with as few
> fittings as possible and a smooth unrestricted pathway. The Kitfox from
> model IV on up has a belly drain (correct me if I'm wrong on this) that
can
> remove any debris that runs down the fuel line, therefore I felt that
> placing the fuel filters in each tank line would not only be unecessary
> redundancy, but it would also add several more potential leak points.
This
> would also place more restriction on the fuel flow. (How do you clean
those
> things without spilling fuel in your cockpit?) For this reason I chose
to
> not install anything in the tank-to-header lines and instead I installed
an
> 38"id Earls (all aluminum) with internal sintered bronze filter on the
> firewall as a last line of defense just prior to entering the fuel
injector.
> These filters are pretty rugged and well built and the internal filter is
> replaceable. I know the clear filters look cool, but are they really
> necessary?
> Darrel
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
> ters
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
> >
> > Not to beat this to death, but.... I remember long ago when I was
> building
> > and thinking about fuel filters the glass ones were discussed. Among
the
> > objections was the glass enclosure. I have waited for this to come up
in
> > this discussion. The crux of that objection was the possibility of
> > ingesting something through the front of the cowl that might break the
> > glass. We had a report on the list a couple of years ago of a bird
strike
> > in the engine compartment that tore out the primer line that did cause
an
> > engine compartment fire.
> >
> > The early discussion encouraged me to remove the one I had put in the
> engine
> > compartment. I still have the two in the lines that feed between the
wing
> > tanks and header tank. I guess the plastic ones are OK, but I like the
> > metal tube that connects the inlet barb to the outlet barb. Somehow
with
> > the plastic barbs, I can't get the image from my mind of fuel affected
> > plastic barbs becoming brittle and separating from the filter body.
> >
> > To each his own. I guess it deals a lot with what we are already used
to.
> >
> > Lowell
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
> > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
fil
> > ters
> >
> >
> > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
> > <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
> > >
> > > I was going to go to a plastic but now I'm not sure. --r
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> > > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of david
> yeamans
> > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
> > > filters
> > >
> > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "david yeamans" <dafox@ckt.net>
> > >
> > > I agree with Don Smythe,
> > >
> > > I've had mine installed for over 4 years, and check them at
the
> > > annual
> > > conditioning inspection. I've replaced the filters each inspection
> because
> > > of
> > > a slight fiberglass fuzz from the wingtanks. This last inspection
they
> > were
> > > clear and no sign of contamination, so I didn't touch them. I've
never
> > > replaced any of the O rings, as they've always sealed just fine. One
> thing
> > > about the inline purolator filters between the wing tanks and the
header
> > > tank,
> > > Is, you can always inspect them for fuel flow and contamination
before,
> > > during, and after when you fly. I think there are the best you can
get.
> > >
> > > David
> N317DY
> > > IV 1200 250 hrs
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > > Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 5:11 PM
> > > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation:
Fuel
> > > filters
> > >
> > >
> > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> > >
> > > In a message dated 10/27/04 8:56:31 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> > > r.thomas@za.pwc.com writes:
> > >
> > > << I guess I should have mentioned these ones were fitted to trikes
> and
> > > not a
> > > KF. (I fly trikes too)
> > >
> > > With my experience with them on the trike, I don't think I would be
> > happy
> > > to put one on my KF. My thinking is that if these glass ones have
to
> be
> > > well cared for, I would rather take my chances with a clear
plastic,
> > > throw
> > > away one, and change it every 25 hours to be safe. Excessive, yes
> > maybe,
> > > but I like the insurance.
> > >
> > > Regards
> > > Roger >>
> > >
> > > Roger,
> > > This might be all apples and oranges situation. One thing you
> might
> > > consider. The Purolators will show you if you have any water
> collected.
> > > A paper
> > > filter will "clog" if saturated with water. There is no special
care
> > > required
> > > with the glass Purolator filters. You can see what's happening at a
> > > glance.
> > > If there is water or debris in the filter, it's easy to see and take
> > care
> > > of.
> > > IMHO, the glass Purolators are the insurance you're looking for.
> > >
> > > Don Smythe
> > > N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 34
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|
| Subject: | Re: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
> IMHO, the drain on the bottom of the header is very poor to catch any
debris
> coming down from the wing tanks. The bottom of that header is not
designed to
> trap small amounts of debris that can be picked up by the little drain.
> Also, for some reason, wing tanks are a haven for growing debris no matter
how
> careful you are in fueling your plane. After several fuelings, I always
see some
> stuff gathering in the wing tank "glass" filters. Again, IMHO.
Actually Don, I have to respectfully disagree with your above statement.
Unless your header tank is different than mine, I think they do a pretty
good job. The feed tap is about 2 inches above the bottom of the tank and
the drain is in the bottom center. Any debris entering the tank falls to
the bottom to be drained out with the belly quick drain. Unlike the wing
tanks, it does have a sump.
> Almost for the same reason, I decided to "double" filter. The glass
filters
> I have below the wing tanks are always showing some small amount of junk.
The
> final "glass" filter under the instrument panel is always clean.
Therefore,
> the wing tank filters are doing an important part in keeping the final
filter
> clean.
Like I said in my previous post, the more fittings and gadgets you add into
the fuel line the more restriction to smooth fuel flow. I'm not saying that
the filters are bad or anything like that. I just don't think they're
necessary.
I guess the only thing that matters is that whatever works well and gives
peace of mind is what's important. I just think the fuel system should be
as simple as possible.
Also, my HO.
Darrel
Message 35
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|
Filte r an d starvation": kitfox-list@matronics.com
| Subject: | Location of Fuel |
Filte r an d starvation: Fuel fil ters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Thanks Lowell,
Did you know "Dub" William McFarland from the Sacramento/Fresbi area? He
built the KFII I have. He built it in the late 90's and originally had a BMW
engine in it but took it out due to poor performance. I'll check back
tomorrow. Got go
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
Subject: Re: Fuel filter Questions RE: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter
an d starvation: Fuel fil ters
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Robert, I bought mine locally. They are 5/16" OD for the Auto hose. Yes I
do yes auto hose form the wing tanks to the header tank. Then aluminum the
rest of the way to the gascolator.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
starvation : kitfox-list@matronics.com>
Subject: Fuel filter Questions RE: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter an d
starvation: Fuel fil ters
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
<Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
>
> Hi Lowell,
> Did you buy glass filters from CPS? Who manufactures the filter you use?
Do
> you use black auto fuel hose (5/16?)from the wing tank to the header tank?
>
> I have auto fuel hose but the new filter I have is for 1/4 hose.
>
> I bought my glass filters from California Power Supply (CPS) and they are
a
> different brand than what I took out. Did you buy yours from CPS?
>
> Robert
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
> ters
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
>
> Not to beat this to death, but.... I remember long ago when I was
building
> and thinking about fuel filters the glass ones were discussed. Among the
> objections was the glass enclosure. I have waited for this to come up in
> this discussion. The crux of that objection was the possibility of
> ingesting something through the front of the cowl that might break the
> glass. We had a report on the list a couple of years ago of a bird strike
> in the engine compartment that tore out the primer line that did cause an
> engine compartment fire.
>
> The early discussion encouraged me to remove the one I had put in the
engine
> compartment. I still have the two in the lines that feed between the wing
> tanks and header tank. I guess the plastic ones are OK, but I like the
> metal tube that connects the inlet barb to the outlet barb. Somehow with
> the plastic barbs, I can't get the image from my mind of fuel affected
> plastic barbs becoming brittle and separating from the filter body.
>
> To each his own. I guess it deals a lot with what we are already used to.
>
> Lowell
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil
> ters
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
> <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
> >
> > I was going to go to a plastic but now I'm not sure. --r
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of david
yeamans
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
> > filters
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "david yeamans" <dafox@ckt.net>
> >
> > I agree with Don Smythe,
> >
> > I've had mine installed for over 4 years, and check them at the
> > annual
> > conditioning inspection. I've replaced the filters each inspection
because
> > of
> > a slight fiberglass fuzz from the wingtanks. This last inspection they
> were
> > clear and no sign of contamination, so I didn't touch them. I've never
> > replaced any of the O rings, as they've always sealed just fine. One
thing
> > about the inline purolator filters between the wing tanks and the header
> > tank,
> > Is, you can always inspect them for fuel flow and contamination before,
> > during, and after when you fly. I think there are the best you can get.
> >
> > David
N317DY
> > IV 1200 250 hrs
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 5:11 PM
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel
> > filters
> >
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> >
> > In a message dated 10/27/04 8:56:31 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
> > r.thomas@za.pwc.com writes:
> >
> > << I guess I should have mentioned these ones were fitted to trikes
and
> > not a
> > KF. (I fly trikes too)
> >
> > With my experience with them on the trike, I don't think I would be
> happy
> > to put one on my KF. My thinking is that if these glass ones have to
be
> > well cared for, I would rather take my chances with a clear plastic,
> > throw
> > away one, and change it every 25 hours to be safe. Excessive, yes
> maybe,
> > but I like the insurance.
> >
> > Regards
> > Roger >>
> >
> > Roger,
> > This might be all apples and oranges situation. One thing you
might
> > consider. The Purolators will show you if you have any water
collected.
> > A paper
> > filter will "clog" if saturated with water. There is no special care
> > required
> > with the glass Purolator filters. You can see what's happening at a
> > glance.
> > If there is water or debris in the filter, it's easy to see and take
> care
> > of.
> > IMHO, the glass Purolators are the insurance you're looking for.
> >
> > Don Smythe
> > N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
> >
> >
>
>
Message 36
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|
| Subject: | Re: Other Rotax engines. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "chad lively" <chadl@compu.net>
I have some experience with Rotax 583, 500+ hours in a IV 1200, that
included 3 inflight engine failures. I'm going with a 912 now.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Torgeir Mortensen" <torgemor@online.no>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Other Rotax engines.
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
>
> Hi Folks,
>
> We've often been discussing about the "other" Rotax combinations, most
> often without much references.
>
> Here is an "interesting" site, maybe not the one we'll prefer -but gives
> some answer to us.
>
> What about a two stroke Rotax delivering 105 HP, weight 110 lbs. (only one
> ignition system (: ).
>
> well it's kind of interesting, have a look:
>
> http://www.rdaerosports.com/
>
>
> Torgeir.
>
>
> --
> Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
>
>
Message 37
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|
| Subject: | Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: STEPHEN ZAKRESKI <szakreski@shaw.ca>
I have a somewhat similar system to Don. I have Purolators between the wink
tank and the header tank, and an Earls fine filter between the header and the
engine. I also have strainers in the wing tanks. I wouldn't change a thing. They
all play a specific role. Some further comments.
1) Nothing makes me happier than being able to see the fuel flowing through the
glass filter while flying.
2)I have never had a hint of a leak from the Purolators, and just like others,
I consider the filters the best available for this purpose. I suspect the reported
failures are related to engine heat or something else we don't know.
3) Like Don says, I regularly see bits and pieces in the glass Purolators, and
never see much of anything in the Earls final filter. One day if I get a contaminated
batch of fuel, I will be able to see it visually immediatly.
4) A final filter between the header and engine is essential. Note that when the
wing tanks are completely filled, fuel can and does flow through the vent hose
back into the header...unfiltered. Not often, but a little bitty something
can bypass the Purolators this way.
5) I deleted the gascolator altogether. The header/filters provide all the functionality
of the gascolator but better. Gascolators are difficult to service,
and several failures have been reported because of these.
SteveZ
----- Original Message -----
From: AlbertaIV@aol.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Location of Fuel Filter and starvation: Fuel fil ters
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
> Darrel,
>
> >>The Kitfox from model IV on up has a belly drain (correct me if
> I'm wrong
> on this) that can remove any debris that runs down the fuel line,>>
>
> IMHO, the drain on the bottom of the header is very poor to catch
> any debris
> coming down from the wing tanks. The bottom of that header is not
> designed to
> trap small amounts of debris that can be picked up by the little
> drain.
> Also, for some reason, wing tanks are a haven for growing debris
> no matter how
> careful you are in fueling your plane. After several fuelings, I
> always see some
> stuff gathering in the wing tank "glass" filters. Again, IMHO.
>
> >>but it would also add several more potential leak points. >>
>
> The fittings on these filters simply don't leak, ever (knock on
> wood). Even
> if they did, it would be a drop every three day's. I have never
> had the
> smallest hint of a leak.
>
> >>(How do you clean those
> things without spilling fuel in your cockpit?) >>
>
> I place a rag under mine and yes, I get a little fuel on the rag.
> In 15
> minutes, all smell is gone. Not a problem.
>
> >>For this reason I chose to not install anything in the tank-to-
> header lines
> and instead I installed an 38"id Earls (all aluminum) with
> internal sintered
> bronze filter on the firewall as a last line of defense just prior
> to entering
> the fuel injector.>>
>
> Almost for the same reason, I decided to "double" filter. The
> glass filters
> I have below the wing tanks are always showing some small amount
> of junk. The
> final "glass" filter under the instrument panel is always clean.
> Therefore,
> the wing tank filters are doing an important part in keeping the
> final filter
> clean.
>
>
> >>These filters are pretty rugged and well built and the internal
> filter is
> replaceable. I know the clear filters look cool, but are they really
> necessary?>>
>
> As stated above, I feel they are very important and the wing tank
> filters are
> the most important. IMHO
>
> Don Smythe
> N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
> _-
> _-
> _-
> _-
> ========================================================================
>
>
>
>
Message 38
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|
| Subject: | Re: My 912 Won't Stop |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie Blackwell" <jablackwell@ev1.net>
Turns out I have a bad switch. Talked to Bob at ACS today. Bob was very
helpful and guided be through a test procedure. In my case the contact
points in the switch have worn to the point whereby I lost the ground to one
of the ignition systems. Anyone that has one of these switches and has the
first hint of trouble should open it up (easy to do) and check the contacts
for excessive wear. Mine were worn beyond repair. Eight years old but only
about 200 hours on the switch. Indeed a very dangerous situation. The prop
would have been hot, but I took the precaution of disconnecting the battery
while I was working on it.
Hope to have a new switch in tomorrow from Spruce.
Thanks
Jimmie
----- Original Message -----
From: "flier" <FLIER@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: My 912 Won't Stop
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "flier" <FLIER@sbcglobal.net>
>
> You really should have individual ground toggles in
> order to be able to check each ignition during
> runup. Then there is redundant grounding through the
> ignition switch as well as the toggles. Sounds like
> you've got one ignition that isn't grounding -- VERY
> DANGEROUS.
>
> Regards,
>
> Ted
>
> --- Original Message ---
> From: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: My 912 Won't Stop
>
> >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean"
> <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
> >
> >Jimmie,
> > Could the switch have gone bad.. maybe. Most
> likely you have made the
> >ground continuous.. be very careful around the prop
> right now it is most
> >likely hot...
> >You need to re-check your grounds.. The switch
> should take the ignition to
> >ground..
> >
> >Blue Skies
> >John & Debra McBean
> >www.sportplanellc.com
> >"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> >[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On
> Behalf Of Jimmie Blackwell
> >To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: Kitfox-List: My 912 Won't Stop
> >
> >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie
> Blackwell" <jablackwell@ev1.net>
> >
> >Darn it. If something was to go right with my 912 I
> would be delighted.
> >Today, after improving the ground wires for the
> ignition switch and master
> >switch my engine would not shut down. Had to shut
> off the fuel to get the
> >engine to stop.
> >
> >I did note that when starting I had to hold the key
> in just the right place
> >to get the starter to engage. What you folks think,
> did my ACS ignition
> >switch go bad suddenly or did my tinkering go bad.
> >
> >One of these days I just might be an asset to this
> list after I get done
> >making all the mistakes.
> >
> >Please someone help. I can't stand it anymore, I
> need to fly a little, not
> >work on it all the time.
> >
> >Thanks
> >
> >Jimmie
> >
> >
> >_-
> ======================================================
> ==================
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
> >_-
> ======================================================
> ==================
> >_-
> ======================================================
> ==================
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
> http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
> list
> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
> >_-
> ======================================================
> ==================
> >
> >
>
>
Message 39
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|
| Subject: | Other Rotax engines. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Magdic" <steve.magdic@1psg.com>
I have many, many hours flying the MZ202 in the single engine(SlipStream Revelation)and
twin configuration(SlipStream SkyBlaster).
I also have some time with the use of the MZ302(SlipStream Genesis).
All I can say is that I hope they have fixed all the little "problems"
that made for some very interesting forced emergency landings.
Some time I'll tell you the story of flying cross country while holding the
fiberglass engine fairing on so it wouldn't push the spark plug wires off
the plugs and stop the engine (MZ202 inverted installation).
Steve M.
-----Original Message-----
From: chad lively [mailto:chadl@compu.net]
Cc:=09
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Other Rotax engines.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "chad lively" <chadl@compu.net>
I have some experience with Rotax 583, 500+ hours in a IV 1200, that
included 3 inflight engine failures. I'm going with a 912 now.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Torgeir Mortensen" <torgemor@online.no>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Other Rotax engines.
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Torgeir Mortensen <torgemor@online.no>
>
> Hi Folks,
>
> We've often been discussing about the "other" Rotax combinations, most
> often without much references.
>
> Here is an "interesting" site, maybe not the one we'll prefer -but gives
> some answer to us.
>
> What about a two stroke Rotax delivering 105 HP, weight 110 lbs. (only one
> ignition system (: ).
>
> well it's kind of interesting, have a look:
>
> http://www.rdaerosports.com/
>
>
> Torgeir.
>
>
> --
> Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
>
>
Message 40
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|
| Subject: | Re: Second question, I'm thinking of changing the |
airfilter on m...
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com> airfilter on
m...
At 01:17 AM 10/29/2004 +0200, you wrote:
>In the past, I've been talking about an "alternative" true mixture system
>for the two strokes.
Torgier,
Thanks for keeping us abreast of what I consider "essential"
modifications.
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582 / 99% done, thanks to Bob Ducar.
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