Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:16 AM - Re: Sport Planes (kurt schrader)
2. 12:21 AM - Re: Tank Vents (kurt schrader)
3. 01:12 AM - Tailwheel question (Kerry Skyring)
4. 02:06 AM - Re: Right fabric door panel lost (Howard Firm)
5. 04:48 AM - Re: Tailwheel question (Clifford Begnaud)
6. 05:20 AM - Tailwheel question (Dee Young)
7. 05:24 AM - Re: Tank Vents (Dee Young)
8. 06:07 AM - Re: Tailwheel question (flier)
9. 06:40 AM - Worlds uglist airplane (Bob Unternaehrer)
10. 06:46 AM - Re: Sport Planes (Lowell Fitt)
11. 06:53 AM - Re: Hello list (Brett Walmsley)
12. 06:54 AM - Re: Hello list (Brett Walmsley)
13. 07:01 AM - Steel prop plate. (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
14. 07:22 AM - Re: Hello list (Brett Walmsley)
15. 07:27 AM - Re: Steel prop plate. (Fox5flyer)
16. 07:49 AM - Re: Worlds uglist airplane (~~Shorty~~)
17. 08:22 AM - Re: Tank Vents (Marco Menezes)
18. 08:37 AM - Tail spring question? Kitfox-List (Harris, Robert)
19. 11:38 AM - Re: Tail spring question? Kitfox-List (Fox5flyer)
20. 11:55 AM - Re: Tail spring question? (Harris, Robert)
21. 03:30 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
22. 04:06 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (Randy Daughenbaugh)
23. 04:26 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (Glenn Horne)
24. 04:35 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (Jerry Liles)
25. 05:21 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
26. 05:30 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (Brett Walmsley)
27. 05:33 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (Brett Walmsley)
28. 05:36 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (Jerry Liles)
29. 05:45 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (Steve Cooper)
30. 06:39 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (Fox5flyer)
31. 06:42 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (Don Pearsall)
32. 07:18 PM - Re: Steel prop plate. (Steve Cooper)
33. 07:55 PM - Re: Tank Vents (Wwillyard@aol.com)
34. 09:25 PM - Kitfox 5 w/Jabiru 3300 Details ()
35. 09:25 PM - Re: Sport Planes (kurt schrader)
36. 09:25 PM - Re: Tank Vents (kurt schrader)
37. 09:33 PM - Oil Injection Tank (David Savener)
38. 09:37 PM - Recall: Kitfox 5 w/Jabiru 3300 Details ()
39. 10:24 PM - Re: Oil Injection Tank (kurt schrader)
40. 10:28 PM - Re: Kitfox 5 w/Jabiru 3300 Details (kurt schrader)
41. 10:47 PM - Re: Tank Vents (kurt schrader)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Sport Planes |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
I went to a local flying club meeting tonight and got
some surprising info. The club is thinking about
adding sport class planes to the inventory. We have
an FAA rep in the club and he passed on the following:
You can take many planes with sufficiently low empty
weight and STC them to Sport Plane use. You can then
fly one in either category as long as you stay within
that category's rules for the flight. A sport pilot
could fly it under 1320 lbs gross as STC'd, solo if
they had to for weight, right after riding with a
rated pilot in the normal category to which it was
origionally approved. I asked him about homebuilts.
He said we could do almost anything, once we stc'd it
that way. Certainly STC ours to sport pilot.
They are talking C-120/140's and Champs for the club.
They are also talking certified European planes that
meet the sport plane criteria. Oh, it is a
taildragger's club. :-)
On the plus side, our Fox's are wide open for use
under both catregories. On the bad side, where does
this leave SS? There are so many more contenders when
old certified light planes are STC'd to fly 'both'
ways. I suppose when SS sells completed Fox's as
Soport Planes, they can still do well, if the price is
right.
Kurt S.
__________________________________
http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
Message 2
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Hi Dee,
Can you post a picture of it?
It would be nice if we could find a float type check
valve and mount it inside the fuel cap. It would
breath both ways, but stop fuel from escaping.
Kurt S.
--- Dee Young <henrysfork1@msn.com> wrote:
> Something has worked well for me is I purchased a
> small automotive vacuum type check valve. I has a
> nipple on each side with 1/8 dia. hole in each
> nipple. The area where the check valve is contained
> is about the size of a nickel thus the thing is
> shaped something like a top you would spin with your
> fingers. I drilled a small hole in the top of the
> wind screen at the highest point possible and
> secured it to the to wind screen. The vent hose
> comes up from the header tank and is routed along
> the wing root and plugs in to the bottom nipple with
> the other nipple sticking out of the wind screen.
> The check valve allows air in but doesn't want to
> let fuel out. I have seen a few drops of fuel on my
> screen only one time. I use 100LL so its very
> obvious if a leak happens. Maybe this is a good way
> for someone else also.
>
>
> Dee Young
> Model II
> N345DY
__________________________________
Message 3
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| Subject: | Tailwheel question |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kerry Skyring" <kerryskyring@hotmail.com>
Cliff wrote...
"Consider the 6" Homebuilders Special Tailwheel from Aircraft Spruce. I flew
about 750 hours with one on our first Kitfox and just loved it."
My question is - does this Tailwheel come with leaf springs that fit the
Kitfox? We are an S5, yet to fly, and have the standard Skystar tailwheel
and are worried about the reports of broken springs.
We are aware of the Grove aluminium spring but wonder if the Spruce
Homebuilders special is an alternative and stronger set-up than the
original. Any other simple and not-too-expensive suggestions gratefully
received.
Kerry
PS The list continues to provide great information and encouragement.
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Right fabric door panel lost |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Howard Firm" <pianome2@mchsi.com>
I did not use mine......let me check and see if I still have it...I'll let
you know later today!
Howard Firm
508 12th St. South
Virginia MN 55792
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Smathers" <jsmathers@cybcon.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Right fabric door panel lost
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jeff Smathers <jsmathers@cybcon.com>
>
> Hi all,
>
> I need to replace the fabric covered door panel with the
> sewn pocket that SS sells. I lost mine last summer when the
> velcro gave way just enough to pucker a hole into the airstream,
> it then inflated in about 1/2 second and then ripped itself away and
> landed in some field that was just plowed about 75 miles from
> home.
>
> Mine was a cordura blue. Any ideas?
>
> Thanks, Jeff Smathers
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Tailwheel question |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
Kerry,
No tailwheel comes with a spring, these are two separate items. The HBS
tailwheel comes with an adapter so that it will fit either 1.25" or 1.5"
wide springs.
Right now, the only spring available is the grove aluminum. Skystar told me
some time ago that they were working on a steel leaf replacement. Anyone
talk to them about this lately?
Best Regards,
Cliff
>
> Cliff wrote...
>
> "Consider the 6" Homebuilders Special Tailwheel from Aircraft Spruce. I
> flew
> about 750 hours with one on our first Kitfox and just loved it."
>
> My question is - does this Tailwheel come with leaf springs that fit the
> Kitfox? We are an S5, yet to fly, and have the standard Skystar tailwheel
> and are worried about the reports of broken springs.
> We are aware of the Grove aluminium spring but wonder if the Spruce
> Homebuilders special is an alternative and stronger set-up than the
> original. Any other simple and not-too-expensive suggestions gratefully
> received.
>
> Kerry
> PS The list continues to provide great information and encouragement.
>
>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Tailwheel question |
Seal-Send-Time: Wed, 5 Jan 2005 06:18:52 -0700
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dee Young" <henrysfork1@msn.com>
Homebuilders special is an alternative and stronger set-up than the
original. Any other simple and not-too-expensive suggestions gratefully
received.
Kerry you might consider using what you have for a while. I have had no problems
with the Maule wheel to date.
Dee Young
Model II
N345DY
Do Not Archive
Message 7
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Seal-Send-Time: Wed, 5 Jan 2005 06:23:19 -0700
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dee Young" <henrysfork1@msn.com>
Kurt I am on the road for a few days but will when I come return. Have a nice week.
----- Original Message -----
From: kurt schrader<mailto:smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com<mailto:kitfox-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 05, 2005 1:21 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Tank Vents
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com<mailto:smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>>
Hi Dee,
Can you post a picture of it?
It would be nice if we could find a float type check
valve and mount it inside the fuel cap. It would
breath both ways, but stop fuel from escaping.
Kurt S.
--- Dee Young <henrysfork1@msn.com<mailto:henrysfork1@msn.com>> wrote:
> Something has worked well for me is I purchased a
> small automotive vacuum type check valve. I has a
> nipple on each side with 1/8 dia. hole in each
> nipple. The area where the check valve is contained
> is about the size of a nickel thus the thing is
> shaped something like a top you would spin with your
> fingers. I drilled a small hole in the top of the
> wind screen at the highest point possible and
> secured it to the to wind screen. The vent hose
> comes up from the header tank and is routed along
> the wing root and plugs in to the bottom nipple with
> the other nipple sticking out of the wind screen.
> The check valve allows air in but doesn't want to
> let fuel out. I have seen a few drops of fuel on my
> screen only one time. I use 100LL so its very
> obvious if a leak happens. Maybe this is a good way
> for someone else also.
>
>
> Dee Young
> Model II
> N345DY
__________________________________
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Tailwheel question |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "flier" <FLIER@sbcglobal.net>
I agree with Dee. Over 300hrs on the Maule and stock
steel springs on my IV. I put the homebuilder tire
on only because it gives a little softer ride and it
was only $26...
Regards,
Ted
--- Original Message ---
From: "Dee Young" <henrysfork1@msn.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Tailwheel question
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dee Young"
<henrysfork1@msn.com>
>
>
>Homebuilders special is an alternative and stronger
set-up than the
>original. Any other simple and not-too-expensive
suggestions gratefully
>received.
>
>Kerry you might consider using what you have for a
while. I have had no problems with the Maule wheel to
date.
>
>
>Dee Young
>Model II
>N345DY
>
>Do Not Archive
>
>
>_-
======================================================
===============
Contributions
any other
Forums.
>_-
======================================================
===============
http://www.matronics.com/subscription
http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
http://www.matronics.com/browse/kitfox-list
http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list
http://www.matronics.com/archives
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
list
http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>_-
======================================================
===============
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Worlds uglist airplane |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Unternaehrer" <shilohcom@c-magic.com>
<<<http://www.qksrv.net/click-1622388-8417593?lochttp%3A//cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll%3FViewItem%26rd%3D1%26item%3D4516102651%26category%3D63679%26sspagename%3DWDVW>>>>
It wouldl be nice if posted links gave a "hint" as to what they were about, but
anyway this one has got to be a candidate for the "ugliest" air plane contest.
Talking about a ground looper, more so than a "standard kitfox"
Blue Skies
Bob Unternaehrer
shilohcom@c-magic.com
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Sport Planes |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Kurt, I have not followed this whole issue that closely as my airplane is a
IV with the 1200 lb gross wt, but it seems this is in opposition to other
information we have had in the past. It is my experience that FAA guys
sometimes will tell us certain things and then sometimes forget what they
told us after a while. Just curious, but is your source willing to put his
information in writing for the sake of the club and then put his name on it.
Not many are willing to do that.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "kurt schrader" <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Sport Planes
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
<smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>
> I went to a local flying club meeting tonight and got
> some surprising info. The club is thinking about
> adding sport class planes to the inventory. We have
> an FAA rep in the club and he passed on the following:
>
> You can take many planes with sufficiently low empty
> weight and STC them to Sport Plane use. You can then
> fly one in either category as long as you stay within
> that category's rules for the flight. A sport pilot
> could fly it under 1320 lbs gross as STC'd, solo if
> they had to for weight, right after riding with a
> rated pilot in the normal category to which it was
> origionally approved. I asked him about homebuilts.
> He said we could do almost anything, once we stc'd it
> that way. Certainly STC ours to sport pilot.
>
> They are talking C-120/140's and Champs for the club.
> They are also talking certified European planes that
> meet the sport plane criteria. Oh, it is a
> taildragger's club. :-)
>
> On the plus side, our Fox's are wide open for use
> under both catregories. On the bad side, where does
> this leave SS? There are so many more contenders when
> old certified light planes are STC'd to fly 'both'
> ways. I suppose when SS sells completed Fox's as
> Soport Planes, they can still do well, if the price is
> right.
>
> Kurt S.
>
>
> __________________________________
> http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
>
>
> BEGIN-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Teach CanIt if this mail (ID 72492973) is spam:
> Spam:
http://login.safereach.com/b.php?c=s&i=72492973&m=f1ae2a37ef27
> Not spam:
http://login.safereach.com/b.php?c=n&i=72492973&m=f1ae2a37ef27
> Forget vote:
http://login.safereach.com/b.php?c=f&i=72492973&m=f1ae2a37ef27
> ------------------------------------------------------
> END-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS
>
>
Message 11
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" <kitfox4@numail.org>
Hello Pete and welcome,
I am building a '95 vintage IV that came with a 912 and it has a steel
plate with holes that match the prop hub. When put on the engine it
"sandwiches" the prop. I can e-mail you a photo if you like.
> When a stock GSC prop is bolted to the flange of the 912, do the bolts go
> directly into the machined aluminum hub or is there a round plate between
> the bolt heads and the hub.
>
> Thanks again
>
>
Message 12
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" <kitfox4@numail.org>
Hello Pete and welcome,
I am building a '95 vintage IV that came with a 912 and it has a steel
plate with holes that match the prop hub. When put on the engine it
"sandwiches" the prop. I can e-mail you a photo if you like.
> When a stock GSC prop is bolted to the flange of the 912, do the bolts go
> directly into the machined aluminum hub or is there a round plate between
> the bolt heads and the hub.
>
> Thanks again
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/5/05 6:55:12 AM Pacific Standard Time,
kitfox4@numail.org writes:
<< Hello Pete and welcome,
I am building a '95 vintage IV that came with a 912 and it has a steel
plate with holes that match the prop hub. When put on the engine it
"sandwiches" the prop. I can e-mail you a photo if you like.
>>
Hmmmm, mine has an alum plate which I made myself. Just wondering if steel
or alum is correct or does it make a difference? What do most use?
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 14
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" <kitfox4@numail.org>
Hello Pete and welcome,
I am building a '95 vintage IV that came with a 912 and it has a steel
plate with holes that match the prop hub. When put on the engine it
"sandwiches" the prop. I can e-mail you a photo if you like.
> When a stock GSC prop is bolted to the flange of the 912, do the bolts go
> directly into the machined aluminum hub or is there a round plate between
> the bolt heads and the hub.
>
> Thanks again
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
What is the purpose of the plate? I thought they were used only for wooden
props with wooden hubs.
Deke
----- Original Message -----
From: <AlbertaIV@aol.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Steel prop plate.
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 1/5/05 6:55:12 AM Pacific Standard Time,
> kitfox4@numail.org writes:
>
> << Hello Pete and welcome,
> I am building a '95 vintage IV that came with a 912 and it has a steel
> plate with holes that match the prop hub. When put on the engine it
> "sandwiches" the prop. I can e-mail you a photo if you like.
> >>
>
> Hmmmm, mine has an alum plate which I made myself. Just wondering if
steel
> or alum is correct or does it make a difference? What do most use?
>
> Don Smythe
> N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Worlds uglist airplane |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "~~Shorty~~" <shortnaked@golden.net>
read topic
----- Original Message -----
From: "~~Shorty~~" <shortnaked@golden.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox for sale
>
http://www.qksrv.net/click-1622388-8417593?loc=http%3A//cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll%3FViewItem%26rd%3D1%26item%3D4516102651%26category%3D63679%26sspagename%3DWDVW
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Unternaehrer" <shilohcom@c-magic.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Worlds uglist airplane
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Unternaehrer"
<shilohcom@c-magic.com>
>
>
<<<http://www.qksrv.net/click-1622388-8417593?lochttp%3A//cgi.ebay.com/ebaym
otors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll%3FViewItem%26rd%3D1%26item%3D4516102651%26category%3D
63679%26sspagename%3DWDVW>>>>
>
> It wouldl be nice if posted links gave a "hint" as to what they were
about, but anyway this one has got to be a candidate for the "ugliest" air
plane contest. Talking about a ground looper, more so than a "standard
kitfox"
>
Message 17
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Marco Menezes <msm_9949@yahoo.com>
Missed beginning of string but if you're talking header tank vents, there's an
Andair check valve available thru Aircraft Spruce that should do the job. Be sure
to specify the bleeder feature. See tech sheet at:
http://www.andair.co.uk/pdfs/check.pdf
Marco Menezes
KFII N99KX
kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com> wrote:
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
Hi Dee,
Can you post a picture of it?
It would be nice if we could find a float type check
valve and mount it inside the fuel cap. It would
breath both ways, but stop fuel from escaping.
Kurt S.
--- Dee Young wrote:
> Something has worked well for me is I purchased a
> small automotive vacuum type check valve. I has a
> nipple on each side with 1/8 dia. hole in each
> nipple. The area where the check valve is contained
> is about the size of a nickel thus the thing is
> shaped something like a top you would spin with your
> fingers. I drilled a small hole in the top of the
> wind screen at the highest point possible and
> secured it to the to wind screen. The vent hose
> comes up from the header tank and is routed along
> the wing root and plugs in to the bottom nipple with
> the other nipple sticking out of the wind screen.
> The check valve allows air in but doesn't want to
> let fuel out. I have seen a few drops of fuel on my
> screen only one time. I use 100LL so its very
> obvious if a leak happens. Maybe this is a good way
> for someone else also.
>
>
> Dee Young
> Model II
> N345DY
__________________________________
---------------------------------
Message 18
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| Subject: | Tail spring question? Kitfox-List |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Do the Grove tail spring break?
Is the stock tail spring on the V a Grove Spring? (It looks it)
I have a Series 1999 model V Kitfox with a stock tail spring and 8" Maule
tundra tail wheel. I'm worried the tail spring will break.
My model II Kitfox has a steel tail spring that looks stronger than the
Grove.
Robert
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Tail spring question? Kitfox-List |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
I've been on this list for over ten years and in that time I can recall only
one Grove spring breaking. It wasn't very long ago. Lots of steel one's
have broken.
Most of my takeoffs and landings are on rough ground and my Grove spring
with Maule Tundra Tailwheel has stood the test very well. I don't think you
have much to worry about.
Deke
S5
----- Original Message -----
From: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Tail spring question? Kitfox-List
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
<Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
>
>
> Do the Grove tail spring break?
> Is the stock tail spring on the V a Grove Spring? (It looks it)
>
> I have a Series 1999 model V Kitfox with a stock tail spring and 8" Maule
> tundra tail wheel. I'm worried the tail spring will break.
>
> My model II Kitfox has a steel tail spring that looks stronger than the
> Grove.
>
> Robert
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Tail spring question? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
Thanks Deke,
Robert
I've been on this list for over ten years and in that time I can recall only
one Grove spring breaking. It wasn't very long ago. Lots of steel one's
have broken.
Most of my takeoffs and landings are on rough ground and my Grove spring
with Maule Tundra Tailwheel has stood the test very well. I don't think you
have much to worry about.
Deke
S5
> Do the Grove tail spring break?
> Is the stock tail spring on the V a Grove Spring? (It looks like it)
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/5/05 7:27:51 AM Pacific Standard Time,
morid@northland.lib.mi.us writes:
<<
What is the purpose of the plate? I thought they were used only for wooden
props with wooden hubs.
Deke
>>
Deke,
That is a good question??? I fabricated a 1/8"+ alum plate when I
originally installed my GSC. I used the same plate when I switched to the Warp.
I
most likely would not have done this on my own without having been told to do
so from somewhere. Of course, I can't remember where I got the information to
do so.
I would think the plate helps to distribute the force on the prop flange.
Since I don't remember why I did this, I'm very interested in finding out
the reason. Apparently, from your post, you don't have one???
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 22
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| Subject: | Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh" <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
Don, et. al,
I don't know if this helps, but for my Power Fin prop, they said to use the
plate or (OR) washers.
Randy
.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
AlbertaIV@aol.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Steel prop plate.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/5/05 7:27:51 AM Pacific Standard Time,
morid@northland.lib.mi.us writes:
<<
What is the purpose of the plate? I thought they were used only for wooden
props with wooden hubs.
Deke
>>
Deke,
That is a good question??? I fabricated a 1/8"+ alum plate when I
originally installed my GSC. I used the same plate when I switched to the
Warp. I
most likely would not have done this on my own without having been told to
do
so from somewhere. Of course, I can't remember where I got the information
to
do so.
I would think the plate helps to distribute the force on the prop
flange.
Since I don't remember why I did this, I'm very interested in finding out
the reason. Apparently, from your post, you don't have one???
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Glenn Horne" <glennflys@rcn.com>
Hi Don,
Didn't put the plate on when I installed my gsc prop.
Remember Don.
Glenn
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
AlbertaIV@aol.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Steel prop plate.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/5/05 7:27:51 AM Pacific Standard Time,
morid@northland.lib.mi.us writes:
<<
What is the purpose of the plate? I thought they were used only for wooden
props with wooden hubs.
Deke
>>
Deke,
That is a good question??? I fabricated a 1/8"+ alum plate when I
originally installed my GSC. I used the same plate when I switched to the
Warp. I
most likely would not have done this on my own without having been told to
do
so from somewhere. Of course, I can't remember where I got the information
to
do so.
I would think the plate helps to distribute the force on the prop
flange.
Since I don't remember why I did this, I'm very interested in finding out
the reason. Apparently, from your post, you don't have one???
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles <wliles@bayou.com>
Aluminum crush plate came with my wood prop. Steel would be OK just
heavier.
Jerry Liles
AlbertaIV@aol.com wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
>In a message dated 1/5/05 6:55:12 AM Pacific Standard Time,
>kitfox4@numail.org writes:
>
><< Hello Pete and welcome,
> I am building a '95 vintage IV that came with a 912 and it has a steel
> plate with holes that match the prop hub. When put on the engine it
> "sandwiches" the prop. I can e-mail you a photo if you like.
> >>
>
>Hmmmm, mine has an alum plate which I made myself. Just wondering if steel
>or alum is correct or does it make a difference? What do most use?
>
>Don Smythe
>N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
>
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/5/05 4:27:01 PM Pacific Standard Time, glennflys@rcn.com
writes:
<< Hi Don,
Didn't put the plate on when I installed my gsc prop.
Remember Don.
Glenn
>>
That's why the question is being asked. Is the plate desired, required or, a
fiction of the imagination?
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 26
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|
| Subject: | Re: Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" <kitfox4@numail.org>
If memory serves me my GSC came with the steel plate in the prop box. The
whole thing was puchased as a kit ,fuse, wings, fwf, engine and prop from
skystar in 95, (not by me) so I have to assume it is meant to be used. I
will call GSC and check, they have been helpful in the past.
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles <wliles@bayou.com>
>
> Aluminum crush plate came with my wood prop. Steel would be OK just
> heavier.
>
> Jerry Liles
>
> AlbertaIV@aol.com wrote:
>
>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>>
>>In a message dated 1/5/05 6:55:12 AM Pacific Standard Time,
>>kitfox4@numail.org writes:
>>
>><< Hello Pete and welcome,
>> I am building a '95 vintage IV that came with a 912 and it has a steel
>> plate with holes that match the prop hub. When put on the engine it
>> "sandwiches" the prop. I can e-mail you a photo if you like.
>> >>
>>
>>Hmmmm, mine has an alum plate which I made myself. Just wondering if
>> steel
>>or alum is correct or does it make a difference? What do most use?
>>
>>Don Smythe
>>N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" <kitfox4@numail.org>
p.s.
My bolts are too long if I don't use the plate......
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 1/5/05 4:27:01 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> glennflys@rcn.com
> writes:
>
> << Hi Don,
> Didn't put the plate on when I installed my gsc prop.
> Remember Don.
> Glenn
> >>
> That's why the question is being asked. Is the plate desired, required
> or, a
> fiction of the imagination?
>
> Don Smythe
> N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
Message 28
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|
| Subject: | Re: Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles <wliles@bayou.com>
The plate is necessary for a wood prop and optional for others. It
serves to distribute the pressure of the mounting bolts over a wider
area to reduce crushing of the wood fibers and also to increase the
surface area providing friction to hold the prop in place. Wood props
are largely held in place by friction with the prop hub and crush
plate. If the fit is loose, like happened to me once, the prop can heat
up to the smoking point where it is rubbing against the hub. Not a good
thing.
Jerry Liles
AlbertaIV@aol.com wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
>In a message dated 1/5/05 7:27:51 AM Pacific Standard Time,
>morid@northland.lib.mi.us writes:
>
><<
> What is the purpose of the plate? I thought they were used only for wooden
> props with wooden hubs.
> Deke
>
>
>
Message 29
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|
| Subject: | Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
I have a question for you more experienced guys...I have a prop that
originally came with 1/4" bolts. I drilled them out to fit 5/16" bolts. Did
I ruin the prop? I haven't run it yet.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Liles
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Steel prop plate.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles <wliles@bayou.com>
The plate is necessary for a wood prop and optional for others. It
serves to distribute the pressure of the mounting bolts over a wider
area to reduce crushing of the wood fibers and also to increase the
surface area providing friction to hold the prop in place. Wood props
are largely held in place by friction with the prop hub and crush
plate. If the fit is loose, like happened to me once, the prop can heat
up to the smoking point where it is rubbing against the hub. Not a good
thing.
Jerry Liles
AlbertaIV@aol.com wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
>In a message dated 1/5/05 7:27:51 AM Pacific Standard Time,
>morid@northland.lib.mi.us writes:
>
><<
> What is the purpose of the plate? I thought they were used only for
wooden
> props with wooden hubs.
> Deke
>
>
>
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
I've never used crush plates on any metal prop hub, only on wood hubs.
That's what I thought they were for--spreading the load so it doesn't crush
the wood fibers. My GSC didn't come with one, nor did the NSI.
Deke
>
> In a message dated 1/5/05 4:27:01 PM Pacific Standard Time,
glennflys@rcn.com
> writes:
>
> << Hi Don,
> Didn't put the plate on when I installed my gsc prop.
> Remember Don.
> Glenn
> >>
> That's why the question is being asked. Is the plate desired, required
or, a
> fiction of the imagination?
>
> Don Smythe
> N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
Message 31
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|
| Subject: | Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" <donpearsall@comcast.net>
Steve, most small props such as on the Kitfox really do not have enough
stress to require the larger bolts. If you have ever read the specs of the
AN bolts, they are about 125,000 PSI tensile strength. I don't know what it
would take to get the bolts to fail, but I am sure that the rest of the prop
or plane would fail before your prop bolts broke. I used to carve my own
wood props and even tested them to failure. In all cases the props broke
long before the hub or bolts even showed any stress.
The main thing is to torque them to the proper specs so the prop does not
move on the hub, like Jerry Liles just mentioned. So I don't think you
wrecked the prop, it just wasn't needed.
Don Pearsall
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve Cooper
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Steel prop plate.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
I have a question for you more experienced guys...I have a prop that
originally came with 1/4" bolts. I drilled them out to fit 5/16" bolts. Did
I ruin the prop? I haven't run it yet.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Liles
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Steel prop plate.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles <wliles@bayou.com>
The plate is necessary for a wood prop and optional for others. It
serves to distribute the pressure of the mounting bolts over a wider
area to reduce crushing of the wood fibers and also to increase the
surface area providing friction to hold the prop in place. Wood props
are largely held in place by friction with the prop hub and crush
plate. If the fit is loose, like happened to me once, the prop can heat
up to the smoking point where it is rubbing against the hub. Not a good
thing.
Jerry Liles
AlbertaIV@aol.com wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
>In a message dated 1/5/05 7:27:51 AM Pacific Standard Time,
>morid@northland.lib.mi.us writes:
>
><<
> What is the purpose of the plate? I thought they were used only for
wooden
> props with wooden hubs.
> Deke
>
>
>
Message 32
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|
| Subject: | Steel prop plate. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
Thanks for the information. I didn't have any choice...the lug inserts in my
prop flange were 5/16. The prop is a Graphite Prince P-tip, 68" diameter.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Don Pearsall
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Steel prop plate.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" <donpearsall@comcast.net>
Steve, most small props such as on the Kitfox really do not have enough
stress to require the larger bolts. If you have ever read the specs of the
AN bolts, they are about 125,000 PSI tensile strength. I don't know what it
would take to get the bolts to fail, but I am sure that the rest of the prop
or plane would fail before your prop bolts broke. I used to carve my own
wood props and even tested them to failure. In all cases the props broke
long before the hub or bolts even showed any stress.
The main thing is to torque them to the proper specs so the prop does not
move on the hub, like Jerry Liles just mentioned. So I don't think you
wrecked the prop, it just wasn't needed.
Don Pearsall
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve Cooper
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Steel prop plate.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
I have a question for you more experienced guys...I have a prop that
originally came with 1/4" bolts. I drilled them out to fit 5/16" bolts. Did
I ruin the prop? I haven't run it yet.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Liles
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Steel prop plate.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles <wliles@bayou.com>
The plate is necessary for a wood prop and optional for others. It
serves to distribute the pressure of the mounting bolts over a wider
area to reduce crushing of the wood fibers and also to increase the
surface area providing friction to hold the prop in place. Wood props
are largely held in place by friction with the prop hub and crush
plate. If the fit is loose, like happened to me once, the prop can heat
up to the smoking point where it is rubbing against the hub. Not a good
thing.
Jerry Liles
AlbertaIV@aol.com wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
>In a message dated 1/5/05 7:27:51 AM Pacific Standard Time,
>morid@northland.lib.mi.us writes:
>
><<
> What is the purpose of the plate? I thought they were used only for
wooden
> props with wooden hubs.
> Deke
>
>
>
Message 33
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|
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Wwillyard@aol.com
In a message dated 1/5/2005 3:22:03 AM Eastern Standard Time,
smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com writes:
It would be nice if we could find a float type check
valve and mount it inside the fuel cap. It would
breath both ways, but stop fuel from escaping.
--------------------------------------------
I modified the Andair check valve that Aircraft Spruce sells to make it a
float type check valve. I chose the non-bleed version, but either would work. I
removed the internal spring and turned up cork floats on the lathe. I use 3M
structural adhesive to bond the cork to the check plunger. I also started out
with new NAPA fuel caps. I drilled the caps and used brass tubing to
penetrate the cap so that it could be soldered at the fuel side of the cap after
being flared. I check for free operation of the float every time I refuel. Those
who are adding farings to their fuel caps will not appreciate my
application, but I no longer get fuel stains on the tail surfaces during hard
slips.
I sent this information to Andair, but never got a response.
I have submitted photos to the Metronics photo share.
Bill W.
Classic IV 912UL
Message 34
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|
| Subject: | Kitfox 5 w/Jabiru 3300 Details |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: <Lonnie_D._Tillinghast@oxy.com>
I am a fan of this list for a few months now, have posted a few comments
(but not a daily participator), and have had several people ask a few
questions about my 5 and Jabiru combination as they are not real common.
I thought I would throw a few details out there especially for those
pondering engine choices and offer any help that I could.
In Nov. I bought a 2-year old 5 with a 6-cylinder Jabiru 3300 in it
after looking for more than a year at all the engine combinations that
are available. The Fox is decked out and weighs 812lbs with a Sensinich
W64ZK-44 prop (44"), Grove landing gear, Grove/Maule tail wheel, wheel
pants, 6-pack instrument cluster, radio, transponder, color moving map
GPS, Rocky Mountain engine analyzer, 5-function stick grip, CD player,
etc. It had 145 hours on it when I bought it, has 160 now...only
limited by rainy weather. It was built by an A&P for Southwest Airlines
in Phoenix. Cruises easily under 75% power at 120mph and 6gph. Can
push it to 85% power at 130mph at 7gph, but the extra 10mph is not worth
the 1gph...besides, who that fly's a Fox is in a hurry??? Personally, I
like flying it around at 90-110mph and 4.5-5.0gph, sometimes slower with
the doors off. Full power is not needed to takeoff...I often don't use
it. I can not believe the performance and how quiet and smooth the
Jabiru is...I especially like the simplicity of it. It makes no
difference if you have one or two people in the Fox...quarter full of
gas or topped off, she JUMPS off the ground!
I have had people ask about the cowling fit as that seems to be a common
challenge...it is the Safari cowl and was extended to accommodate the
longer 6-cylinder engine by a company that does boat repairs.
From another post, I saw the following table re. weights and engine
choices, I added my 3300 and the hp's:
Engine Empty weight
912s (100hp) 750 lbs
3300 (120hp) 812lbs
O-200 (100hp) 850 lbs
O-235 (118hp) 900 lbs
O-240 (125hp) 900 lbs
Obviously all engine choices have their pros & cons and I'll stay away
from that. I would, however, encourage anyone that is trying to decide
which engine to use to take a look at a Jabiru (you are welcome to come
fly mine) and their website is www.usjabiru.com. For those that already
have an engine and don't want to spend any more money, I'd stay away
from them...;-)
Please let me know if I can help.
Thanks,
Lonnie
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Sport Planes |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Lowell,
This one suprised me too. When this FAA rep/member
told our club how to do it, I specifically asked him
pointed home-built questions after the meeting. It
seems that he is prepared now to clear the way for the
club to STC a manufactured plane. But this is not the
FAA rep that signed my KitFox off and I don't know him
well enough to say it is written in stone.
I would like to see a home-built STC'd to Sport Flight
status before I totally believe it. But I throw this
out to you all as a subject anyone can address with
their FAA rep and see if it sells.
Kurt S.
--- Lowell Fitt <lcfitt@inreach.com> wrote:
> Kurt, I have not followed this whole issue that
> closely as my airplane is a IV with the 1200 lb
gross
> wt, but it seems this is in opposition to other
> information we have had in the past. It is my
> experience that FAA guys sometimes will tell us
> certain things and then sometimes forget what they
> told us after a while. Just curious, but is your
> source willing to put his information in writing for
> the sake of the club and then put his name on it.
> Not many are willing to do that.
>
> Lowell
__________________________________
http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo
Message 36
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Great Dee,
--- Dee Young <henrysfork1@msn.com> wrote:
> Kurt I am on the road for a few days but will when I
> come return. Have a nice week.
Do not archive
__________________________________
Message 37
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| Subject: | Oil Injection Tank |
Seal-Send-Time: Wed, 5 Jan 2005 23:30:31 -0600
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "David Savener" <david_savener@msn.com>
I am replacing my 532 with a 582 with oil injection.
I have a 10 Gallon fuel tank. I'm thinking that I should have about a 48 oz. capacity
in my oil tank.
Does that sound about right?
Does anyone know of an ideal tank for a reasonable price. I bought one from CPS
but if I mount it on the firewall behind the engine, it nearly touches the top
of the head. I'm concerned that it might get too hot.
I've been looking for just the right Coolant recovery tank or Washer fluid reservoir.
Haven't found it yet.
How about I make one out of PVC pipe or something similar. I'd need a sight gauge
in that case.
Dave S
Message 38
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| Subject: | Recall: Kitfox 5 w/Jabiru 3300 Details |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: <Lonnie_D._Tillinghast@oxy.com>
Tillinghast, Lonnie D. would like to recall the message, "Kitfox 5 w/Jabiru 3300
Details".
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: Oil Injection Tank |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
David,
Don't know about the size for sure. In my old 2 cycle
days we used 20:1 fuel to oil. A little extra oil
capacity is better than not enough.
You can check for oil overflow and breather tanks at
High Performance auto suppliers. I checked JEG's.
They have several 1 QT (32 oz) size cans starting at
$20. You could tie 2 together if you need the volume.
They are small enough for most places and made for
the application. The aluminum ones are better, but
cost $40 and up. They have a 48 oz tank for cooling
systems that could be used, but it is $100.
Try here for samples:
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=6829&prmenbr=361
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/CategoryDisplay?cgmenbr=361&cgrfnbr=762
and:
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=2462&prmenbr=361
kurt S.
--- David Savener <david_savener@msn.com> wrote:
> I am replacing my 532 with a 582 with oil injection.
>
> I have a 10 Gallon fuel tank. I'm thinking that I
> should have about a 48 oz. capacity in my oil tank.
>
> Does that sound about right?
>
> Does anyone know of an ideal tank for a reasonable
> price. I bought one from CPS but if I mount it on
> the firewall behind the engine, it nearly touches
> the top of the head. I'm concerned that it might
> get too hot.
>
> I've been looking for just the right Coolant
> recovery tank or Washer fluid reservoir. Haven't
> found it yet.
>
> How about I make one out of PVC pipe or something
> similar. I'd need a sight gauge in that case.
>
> Dave S
__________________________________
http://my.yahoo.com
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox 5 w/Jabiru 3300 Details |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Lonnie,
Just heard that you had one of these. Thanks for the
info. Could you also post the climb rates you get as
well. Some may question the loss due to the shorter
props.
Kurt S. S-5/NSI
--- Lonnie_D._Tillinghast@oxy.com wrote:
> I am a fan of this list for a few months now, have
> posted a few comments (but not a daily
participator),
> and have had several people ask a few
> questions about my 5 and Jabiru combination as they
> are not real common. I thought I would throw a few
> details out there especially for those
> pondering engine choices and offer any help that I
> could.
Message 41
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Bill,
I think someone posted a pic of your vents awhile
back. Very innovative!
I was thinking of just caging a ball or cork float
under the vent tube in the fuel cap. It would only
stop fuel from exiting, but air could go both ways.
Haven't done it yet.
Maybe one of our three aftermarket KF suppliers on the
list would like to tackle this one?
Kurt S.
--- Wwillyard@aol.com wrote:
> I modified the Andair check valve that Aircraft
> Spruce sells to make it a
> float type check valve. I chose the non-bleed
> version, but either would work. I
> removed the internal spring and turned up cork
> floats on the lathe. I use 3M
> structural adhesive to bond the cork to the check
> plunger. I also started out
> with new NAPA fuel caps. I drilled the caps and
> used brass tubing to
> penetrate the cap so that it could be soldered at
> the fuel side of the cap after
> being flared. I check for free operation of the
> float every time I refuel. Those
> who are adding farings to their fuel caps will not
> appreciate my
> application, but I no longer get fuel stains on the
> tail surfaces during hard slips.
>
> I sent this information to Andair, but never got a
> response.
>
> I have submitted photos to the Metronics photo
> share.
>
> Bill W.
> Classic IV 912UL
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