Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:24 AM - Re: model IV wing tanks (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
2. 05:16 AM - Re: Kitfox-DOOR LATCH QUESTION (Barbara & Keith Schneider)
3. 05:17 AM - alum vs steel wheels (Fox5flyer)
4. 05:39 AM - Chemical information MEK vs. Acetone ()
5. 05:47 AM - Re: door latch question (David Savener)
6. 06:14 AM - wing tanks vents (Dee Young)
7. 07:29 AM - Re: door latch question (Lynn Matteson)
8. 07:51 AM - Re: Chemical information MEK vs. Acetone (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
9. 07:53 AM - Re: door latch question (Jeffrey Puls)
10. 08:31 AM - Re: Kitfox 4 engine upgrade (John Larsen)
11. 09:48 AM - Re: Tailwheel question (Kerry Skyring)
12. 10:04 AM - Re: Chemical information MEK vs. Acetone (Jim Crockett)
13. 10:38 AM - Re: door latch question (Lowell Fitt)
14. 10:54 AM - Re: Ground Handling (Lowell Fitt)
15. 10:55 AM - Re: door latch question (Lowell Fitt)
16. 11:12 AM - long XC (Fox5flyer)
17. 11:26 AM - Re: Ground Handling (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
18. 11:48 AM - Re: Ground Handling (roncarolnikko@webtv.net (Ron Schick))
19. 11:49 AM - Re: wing tanks vents (kurt schrader)
20. 11:50 AM - Re: Ground Handling (~~Shorty~~)
21. 12:23 PM - Re: Ground Handling (Lowell Fitt)
22. 02:00 PM - Re: Ground Handling (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
23. 02:46 PM - Re: Ground Handling (roncarolnikko@webtv.net (Ron Schick))
24. 02:50 PM - Fuel tank thread sealer ()
25. 03:22 PM - Re: Fuel tank thread sealer (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
26. 03:33 PM - Re: Ground Handling (kurt schrader)
27. 03:40 PM - Hi Rex- (Rex & Jan Shaw)
28. 04:02 PM - 8" Aluminium rims (Rex & Jan Shaw)
29. 04:19 PM - Door pins (Rex & Jan Shaw)
30. 04:20 PM - Re: Fuel tank thread sealer (Brett Walmsley)
31. 04:25 PM - Grove undercarriage (Rex & Jan Shaw)
32. 04:34 PM - Re: Fuel tank thread sealer (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
33. 04:37 PM - Re: Engine coatings?? (Joel Mapes)
34. 04:43 PM - Re: Ground Handling (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
35. 04:54 PM - Re: Rad flap test (Guy Buchanan)
36. 04:57 PM - Re: Ground Handling (Lowell Fitt)
37. 05:05 PM - Re: 8" Aluminium rims (~~Shorty~~)
38. 05:11 PM - Re: Ground Handling (Lowell Fitt)
39. 05:12 PM - Re: Rad flap test (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
40. 05:21 PM - Re: Grove undercarriage (~~Shorty~~)
41. 05:22 PM - Re: model IV wing tanks (paul wilson)
42. 05:41 PM - Re: 8" Aluminium rims (Lynn Matteson)
43. 06:02 PM - Radio Noise (Jimmie Blackwell)
44. 06:07 PM - Re: Grove undercarriage (Cudnohufsky's)
45. 06:16 PM - Re: long XC (Jeffrey Puls)
46. 06:19 PM - Re: 8" Aluminium rims (Lynn Matteson)
47. 06:37 PM - Re: 8" Aluminium rims (~~Shorty~~)
48. 07:04 PM - Re: Sport Planes (kirk hull)
49. 07:11 PM - Re: long XC (kirk hull)
50. 08:42 PM - [ William Willyard ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Email List Photo Shares)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: model IV wing tanks |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/8/05 5:39:22 PM Pacific Standard Time,
pwilson@climber.org writes:
<< You can choose where expanded fuel drips. On top of the wing the way
Skystar does it. out at the wing tip like Don does it. and under the wing
like mine. >>
Paul,
One little correction. Mine exits out the bottom half way to the wing tip
not all the way to the wing tip
Do Not Archive
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox-DOOR LATCH QUESTION |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Barbara & Keith Schneider" <bkls1@earthlink.net>
My 1994 IV came to me (4th owner) with the original door latch
Lynn, I have the original two pin latch instructions from SkyStar. The IV
kit I purchased second hand had this option, and a couple small parts were
missing. I was able to purchase them from SkyStar, along with the
constructiohn manual insert that covered instalation. This was a speedster
option as I understand it. I would be glad to make you a copy and send to
your address. Please let me know.
Keith Schneider
III & IV Waynesville Oh.
Message 3
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| Subject: | alum vs steel wheels |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Well, you've got me on this one Rex. I wasn't aware there were any steel
wheels out there. Maybe it was something that Skystar changed? Dunno, but
I do know that the earlier Denny wheels were aluminum with the bosses welded
on as you describe. Then again, maybe Denny supplied some steel wheels?
Anybody out there that can clear this up?
Deke
Standing corrected in NE Michigan
>
> Hi ! Deke,
> thanks for that info. I've had a few discussions on wheels
> before and they have all been steel like mine, chromed with brake disc
> mounting lugs welded on the back and the valve placed in line with a stud
> making it arkward. Once at least I remember the person got back to me and
> said "Yes their wheels were steel" They had thought they were aluminium.
So
> I was under the impression they were all steel. Obviously you know
different
> and I'm pleased to learn from you. On my posting I did however mention
> things like the valve position for clarification in case I was wrong
> assuming they probably had steel not aluminium. I seem to remember this
> discussion was on the Skystar message board if that ever comes back.
> I was talking at one stage with either Frank or Ed at Skystar re tyres as
my
> old scrubbed down ATV tyres were useless due to punctures all the time and
> in course of that conversation these old 8" steel wheels were mentioned.
So
> in all it is obvious that Kitfox's did have 8" steel rims at one stage.
> What I didn't know but did wonder about was that there ever was 8"
aluminium
> rims. Now that makes me jealous as I like the 8" part but I would prefer
> lighter weight aluminium. I'm now curious if the brake dics on the
aluminium
> wheels were mounted direct on the rims with 3 welded on lugs and the
> calipers operating from the inside of the disc annulus.
> Rex
> Classic IV 582
> rexjan@bigpond.com
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Chemical information MEK vs. Acetone |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: <brettandsandy@numail.org>
I am having a little trouble understanding the different uses of MEK an
Acetone. I know Stits uses MEK as a solvent for Poly-tak etc. And Skystar
has recommended that I use Acetone to get the loose coating out of my fuel
tanks. I wonder if MEK will melt the polyfiber fabric? Just curious if
someone can post a quick and dirty on the most common uses and more
importantly the "gotchas" concerning these two chemicals. I am aware of the
health risks involved.
Thanks, Brett
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: door latch question |
Seal-Send-Time: Sun, 9 Jan 2005 07:45:10 -0600
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "David Savener" <david_savener@msn.com>
Lynn,
I have installed a "Double Pin Door Latch" system in my model II. I have the instructions.
I can scan them then email them to you if that will help. However.
My instructions state that "AIRCRAFT MUST BE EQUIPPED WITH DOUBLE CROSS TUBE
DOORS #15062 AND #15063. ALSO, PART #82048 TABS SHOULD BE WELDED TO FUSELAGE.
Also, you have to Manufacture four #13008 Pins from AN4C25A bolts. You have to
cut the head off the bolt, then make it bullet shaped then they attach to the
push-pull tubes that attach to the bellcranks.
Mine work well, though they took a long time to fabricate and install. If I had
it to do over again, I would use a much simpler design, like a "pull it shut
and turn the knob" system.
I could send digital pictures of my system if you like.
Dave S
----- Original Message -----
From: Lynn Matteson<mailto:lynnmatt@jps.net>
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com<mailto:kitfox-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 08, 2005 10:48 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: door latch question
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net<mailto:lynnmatt@jps.net>>
Thanks for the answer, Jeff. That makes perfect sense, however I worry
about the whole lower half of the door is "not latched" with this
design. And SS DID change their design for whatever reason. Anyway, I
haven't figured out yet what the actual "pin" is, unless the four bolts
that don't seem to go anywhere else are somehow shaped to use as the
pins. Without the instruction manual or sheet, I'm having to imagineer
how they intended it to work. I'll lay out all the parts and see if it
makes more sense then. I understand the bellcrank part and the two
actuating rods, just not the pin design.
Lynn
On Saturday, January 8, 2005, at 11:13 PM, Jeffrey Puls wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jeffrey Puls"
> <pulsair@mindspring.com<mailto:pulsair@mindspring.com>>
>
> Lynn,
> I have flown both and have been very disappointed with the retro kit.
> The
> double pin is far superior. The single latch has a tendency to bow out
> in
> the slip stream. The pins are solid. I had to redo my doors with a
> double
> locking system. Go for the bellcrank, more work but you will be
> happier.
> Jeff Classic IV
>
>
>> [Original Message]
>> From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net<mailto:lynnmatt@jps.net>>
>> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com<mailto:kitfox-list@matronics.com>>
>> Date: 1/8/2005 3:11:23 PM
>> Subject: Kitfox-List: door latch question
>>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net<mailto:lynnmatt@jps.net>>
>> I have no instructions for the
>> Speedster/Double-pin kit. I have the later manual which shows how to
>> deal with the "retro-fit kit". Which is the better of the two systems,
>> and does anybody have the instructions for either?
>>
>> Lynn
>>
>>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | wing tanks vents |
Seal-Send-Time: Sun, 9 Jan 2005 07:13:43 -0700
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dee Young" <henrysfork1@msn.com>
Kurt, did you get the photos I sent a couple days back?
Dee
Do not archive
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: door latch question |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Thanks for all the input regarding the door latch question. I've
responded to folks via email and am getting some instructions headed my
way. I've got all the parts that Dave mentions below, just lacking
instructions and maybe a part or two.
Lynn
do not archive
On Sunday, January 9, 2005, at 08:45 AM, David Savener wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "David Savener"
> <david_savener@msn.com>
>
> Lynn,
>
> I have installed a "Double Pin Door Latch" system in my model II. I
> have the instructions. I can scan them then email them to you if that
> will help. However. My instructions state that "AIRCRAFT MUST BE
> EQUIPPED WITH DOUBLE CROSS TUBE DOORS #15062 AND #15063. ALSO, PART
> #82048 TABS SHOULD BE WELDED TO FUSELAGE.
>
> Also, you have to Manufacture four #13008 Pins from AN4C25A bolts.
> You have to cut the head off the bolt, then make it bullet shaped then
> they attach to the push-pull tubes that attach to the bellcranks.
>
> Mine work well, though they took a long time to fabricate and install.
> If I had it to do over again, I would use a much simpler design, like
> a "pull it shut and turn the knob" system.
>
> I could send digital pictures of my system if you like.
>
> Dave S
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Lynn Matteson<mailto:lynnmatt@jps.net>
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com<mailto:kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Saturday, January 08, 2005 10:48 PM
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: door latch question
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Chemical information MEK vs. Acetone |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
<< I am having a little trouble understanding the different uses of MEK an
Acetone. I know Stits uses MEK as a solvent for Poly-tak etc. And Skystar
has recommended that I use Acetone to get the loose coating out of my fuel
tanks. I wonder if MEK will melt the polyfiber fabric? Just curious if
someone can post a quick and dirty on the most common uses and more
importantly the "gotchas" concerning these two chemicals. I am aware of the
health risks involved.
Thanks, Brett
>>
Brett,
Here is my 2 cents. I assume the loose coatings you are referring to is
"Kreeme" tank sloshing compound. I also assume you're talking about all Poly
Fiber products. First, MEK will not melt the Poly Fiber "Fabric" but will
play havoc on paint and other Poly Fiber coatings (Poly Brush/Spray).
For removing Kreem inside the tanks, I would use Acetone. It is much
cheaper than MEK, probably safer and does just as good a job.
Poly Fiber sells a reducer for their Poly Tone paints and Poly
Brush/Spray. When I painted my stripes on the plane, I was out of the Poly Fiber
reducer and was in a hurry to get the job done. I used straight MEK as a reducer
for the Poly Tone paint and it worked just fine. There again, MEK is a lot
cheaper than Poly Fiber reducer. I'm not ready to say that I would never use
their reducer and opt for straight MEK but in a pinch, it worked fine.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: door latch question |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jeffrey Puls" <pulsair@mindspring.com>
I'm sure someone on the list can send you a copy of the plans out of their
manual.
> [Original Message]
> From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 1/8/2005 11:47:44 PM
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: door latch question
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
> Thanks for the answer, Jeff. That makes perfect sense, however I worry
> about the whole lower half of the door is "not latched" with this
> design. And SS DID change their design for whatever reason. Anyway, I
> haven't figured out yet what the actual "pin" is, unless the four bolts
> that don't seem to go anywhere else are somehow shaped to use as the
> pins. Without the instruction manual or sheet, I'm having to imagineer
> how they intended it to work. I'll lay out all the parts and see if it
> makes more sense then. I understand the bellcrank part and the two
> actuating rods, just not the pin design.
>
> Lynn
>
> On Saturday, January 8, 2005, at 11:13 PM, Jeffrey Puls wrote:
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jeffrey Puls"
> > <pulsair@mindspring.com>
> >
> > Lynn,
> > I have flown both and have been very disappointed with the retro kit.
> > The
> > double pin is far superior. The single latch has a tendency to bow out
> > in
> > the slip stream. The pins are solid. I had to redo my doors with a
> > double
> > locking system. Go for the bellcrank, more work but you will be
> > happier.
> > Jeff Classic IV
> >
> >
> >> [Original Message]
> >> From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
> >> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> >> Date: 1/8/2005 3:11:23 PM
> >> Subject: Kitfox-List: door latch question
> >>
> >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
> >> I have no instructions for the
> >> Speedster/Double-pin kit. I have the later manual which shows how to
> >> deal with the "retro-fit kit". Which is the better of the two systems,
> >> and does anybody have the instructions for either?
> >>
> >> Lynn
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox 4 engine upgrade |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: John Larsen <jopatco@mindspring.com>
After writing the Engine Beat column for Kitplanes for years and
spending a lot of time on engine comparison, I can only say Steve had a
poor 618 Rotax.
Steve Cooper wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
>
>OK! Lets hold our horses right there. I fly an Avid with a Jabiru 2200.
>While I do not fly with floats...I have NO DOUBT that the engine delivers
>sufficient power to handle them. My previous engine was a 670 RAVE. The Jab
>produces equal to better performance than the Rotax "winder-upper" at about
>3.5 gallons per hour. Now wait a minute! Which 2200 did you friend have? Was
>it the one with the bigger cam and steel rods? Or was it an early 65 horse
>version? I bought a prince prop from a guy who flys an older version Jabiru.
>His engine would NOT turn that prop any faster than 3300 rpm. I put the prop
>on my engine and I see 3760 on CLIMB OUT for crying out loud!. And what this
>milarky about prop diameter? Check the charts friends. Max RPM on the Jab is
>3300 rpm, hell; a 68" prop is still only 85% of supersonic! Both the 2200
>and the 3300 run the same max RPM: 3300 and yes, there is no
>gearbox...neither does a Lycoming or Continental!!!:)
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
>av8rps@tznet.com
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox 4 engine upgrade
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: <av8rps@tznet.com>
>
>Ron:
>
>A friend switched his Avid Mark IV over to a Jabiru after flying on a 582
>for years. He too wanted to go to floats, although just straight
>(non-amphib) type. He liked the Jabiru for it's fuel economy, smoothness,
>and reliability. The first year he operated on wheels. But the second year
>
>when he put it on floats he was disappointed with the performance. Even
>solo in that light Avid airframe (530 lbs on wheels if I remember correctly)
>
>it was underpowered. He crashed the airplane shortly after it was put on
>floats in an accident that happened from hitting large waves after not being
>
>able to lift off in a reasonable distance. It was his opinion that the
>engine just doesn't develop enough thrust for what a seaplane needs (a
>seaplane needs all the thrust as you can get). Consequently large diameter
>props are typically required. The Jab spins too many rpm's to turn a long
>propellor efficiently. Possibly the larger Jabiru might work better, but I
>believe it also runs higher rpms without aid of a gearbox (??). So that one
>
>I'm not sure about. But if it were me I'd go with the sure thing for a
>Model IV amphib, the 100 hp 912 Rotax. And if your floats and airframe are
>light, even that 582 will work ok. I've flown lots of Avids and Kitfoxes on
>
>straight floats with 532-582 engines. They are great performers off the
>water with that engine, so they will still be ok as an amphib I'm sure. But
>
>that 912s will put you in the Supercub class.
>
>But....this is just my opinion after flying Avids and Kitfoxes for 1200+
>hours, mostly on floats...
>
>Paul Seehafer
>Central Wisconsin
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Ron & Nancy Smith" <ronal@dca.net>
>To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Kitfox-List: Kitfox 4 engine upgrade
>
>
>
>
>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ron & Nancy Smith" <ronal@dca.net>
>>
>>I recently bought a flying kitfox 4 with a rotax 582. I want to put the
>>A/C on amphib floats, and the 582 doesn't have the horses. It seems to me
>>
>>
>
>
>
>>that the Jabiru engine is the most cost effective for greater hp. Can The
>>
>>
>
>
>
>>Jabiru 3300 be put in a kitfox 4, or is the 2200 a better option. I would
>>
>>
>
>
>
>>like to sell or trade my present engine. What could I expect to get for
>>the 582 firewall forward with a GSC prop, presently 35 hours on the
>>engine. I also would appreciate other suggestions for engine
>>alternatives. Thanks, Ron
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | RE: Tailwheel question |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kerry Skyring" <kerryskyring@hotmail.com>
Thanks to all those who replied. We are going to stay with the standard set
up for the first 200
hours or so and then change over to grove springs or whatever Skystar comes
up with. The
question actually was about the leaf springs rather than the tailwheel
itself - this being the
(apparently) weak point. We figure we have enough problems to solve at the
moment without creating another one.
Kerry
PS today we riveted the flaperon brackets to the wing. All went well. And I
haven't forgotten that
us European Kitfoxers once, on this list, talked about getting together
somewhere in France.
We should be flying in the summer. But I think I said that last summer.
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Chemical information MEK vs. Acetone |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Crockett <jimc@prodigy.net.mx>
I echo everything Don had to say about Acetone & MEK. In addition - I
believe MEK to be much more dangerous to use than Acetone. But the
principal difference is that MEK is a slow-drying solvent and Acetone
much faster. Thus, in cases where you need a slow drying solvent, MEK
is the way to go. But in all other cases I use Acetone. It also works
great to clean out your paint gun and is cheap.
Jim Crockett
AlbertaIV@aol.com wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
><< I am having a little trouble understanding the different uses of MEK an
> Acetone. I know Stits uses MEK as a solvent for Poly-tak etc. And Skystar
> has recommended that I use Acetone to get the loose coating out of my fuel
> tanks. I wonder if MEK will melt the polyfiber fabric? Just curious if
> someone can post a quick and dirty on the most common uses and more
> importantly the "gotchas" concerning these two chemicals. I am aware of the
> health risks involved.
> Thanks, Brett
> >>
>
>Brett,
> Here is my 2 cents. I assume the loose coatings you are referring to is
>"Kreeme" tank sloshing compound. I also assume you're talking about all Poly
>Fiber products. First, MEK will not melt the Poly Fiber "Fabric" but will
>play havoc on paint and other Poly Fiber coatings (Poly Brush/Spray).
> For removing Kreem inside the tanks, I would use Acetone. It is much
>cheaper than MEK, probably safer and does just as good a job.
> Poly Fiber sells a reducer for their Poly Tone paints and Poly
>Brush/Spray. When I painted my stripes on the plane, I was out of the Poly Fiber
>reducer and was in a hurry to get the job done. I used straight MEK as a reducer
>for the Poly Tone paint and it worked just fine. There again, MEK is a lot
>cheaper than Poly Fiber reducer. I'm not ready to say that I would never use
>their reducer and opt for straight MEK but in a pinch, it worked fine.
>
>Don Smythe
>N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: door latch question |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Hi, Lynn,
When the kits were being sold, the "Double Pin Door Latch" was sold as an
upgrade. It was later discontinued. I believe it was because builders
found that the door would flare out at the bottom with the double pin latch
system - something about Bernoulli, I believe - and they were adding the
bottom latch also to keep the door closed. Then they moved to just the
bottom latch.
I have the bottom latch only - likely to budgetary issues at the time of kit
purchase - and have had no issues with it. It is simple and positive.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lynn Matteson" <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: door latch question
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
> My 1994 IV came to me (4th owner) with the original door latch
> (uninstalled) which mounts midway up the door height, and has a
> bellcrank and two latches...fore and aft of the door opening. Parts
> bags for this option are called"Speedster fuselage kit" and all parts
> are powdercoated with the same color as the fuselage (and everything
> else). Other parts bags are marked "Door latch-double pin kit". The
> plane also came with a "Door latch retro fit kit", which mounts the
> single latch at the bottom of the door. I have no instructions for the
> Speedster/Double-pin kit. I have the later manual which shows how to
> deal with the "retro-fit kit". Which is the better of the two systems,
> and does anybody have the instructions for either?
>
> Lynn
>
>
> BEGIN-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS
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Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Handling |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
For builders and those that are ready to fly. Ground handling is not an
issue on the Kitfox if the wheels are aligned properly. For anyone that
finds the Kitfox skittish on the ground, the first thing to do is check the
main wheel alignment. Toe in will make our airplanes feel uncontrollable at
worst and uncomfortable at best.
I don't think there will be any difference in controllability with the Grove
vs. the bungee if everything is straight. If one were to get to the limits
of controllability with inadequate rudder control, I think there would be a
bit more margin for error with the Grove due to it's wider track.
The alignment is accomplished by bending the tube gear weldment,and using
shims on the Grove gear assembly.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jimmie Blackwell" <jablackwell@ev1.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: I need an 8 inch original aluminum wheel.
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie Blackwell"
<jablackwell@ev1.net>
>
> Lynn
>
> Having flown with the bungee and Grove gear, I highly recommend the Grove
> gear. Makes the Kitfox a lot easier to handle on the ground. If I
learned
> to handle it with bungee gear I am sure you could. The Grove gear just
> makes it feel a lot more controllable.
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: door latch question |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Jeff, thanks for your post. I stand corrected. I do have the single latch
at the bottom and have no problems with door bowing.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeffrey Puls" <pulsair@mindspring.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: door latch question
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jeffrey Puls" <pulsair@mindspring.com>
>
> Lynn,
> I have flown both and have been very disappointed with the retro kit. The
> double pin is far superior. The single latch has a tendency to bow out in
> the slip stream. The pins are solid. I had to redo my doors with a double
> locking system. Go for the bellcrank, more work but you will be happier.
> Jeff Classic IV
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
> > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > Date: 1/8/2005 3:11:23 PM
> > Subject: Kitfox-List: door latch question
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
> >
> > My 1994 IV came to me (4th owner) with the original door latch
> > (uninstalled) which mounts midway up the door height, and has a
> > bellcrank and two latches...fore and aft of the door opening. Parts
> > bags for this option are called"Speedster fuselage kit" and all parts
> > are powdercoated with the same color as the fuselage (and everything
> > else). Other parts bags are marked "Door latch-double pin kit". The
> > plane also came with a "Door latch retro fit kit", which mounts the
> > single latch at the bottom of the door. I have no instructions for the
> > Speedster/Double-pin kit. I have the later manual which shows how to
> > deal with the "retro-fit kit". Which is the better of the two systems,
> > and does anybody have the instructions for either?
> >
> > Lynn
> >
> >
>
>
> BEGIN-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS
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Message 16
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Next Wednesday I'll be flying commercial from here in Michigan to Florida.
The purpose is to pick up a Kitfox and fly it home shortly after as the
weather permits. I don't really know what my route will be, but I've got
all the charts, directories, and current GPS196. The plan is to fly point
to point about 2.5 hours per leg with refueling at each stop, close old
flight plan and open a new one each time. The reason for point to point is
to keep my route and stops flexible. It's nearly 1200 miles and I figure
about 11-12 hours flying time so I plan to take at least two days to make
the trip, however with weather it can easily take longer.
My route will be generally direct from Tampa area, northward to somewhere
near Knoxville, and onward up to NE Michigan. If flying conditions allow
I'm hoping to get 8 hours in the first day, but it's flexible.
Anybody along that route that can recommend some fuel/food stops? Any
airports that have accomodations within walking or courtesy car distance? I
haven't made a long cross country in a long time so any help or advice would
be appreciated.
Thanks,
Deke Morisse
NE Michigan
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Handling |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/9/05 10:54:58 AM Pacific Standard Time,
lcfitt@inreach.com writes:
<<
The alignment is accomplished by bending the tube gear weldment,and using
shims on the Grove gear assembly.
>>
Lowell,
Speaking of shim on the Grove gear. My tires wear quickly on the outside
edge due to not sitting square on the ground. I've had to remove and turn
the tires around once. Can you shim for this condition?
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Handling |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: roncarolnikko@webtv.net (Ron Schick)
Lowell my Speedster project has a tailwheel that looks like it is
mounted wrong. The swivel pin is angled such that it wants to turn
sideways rather than go straight. When it is straight the tail comes up
and then falls down and sideways. Is the solution to bend the spring up
in the back to make the swivel pin exactly vertical, or can I go even
farther so it prefers to "fall" as the wheel aligns straight? Hardly a
problem for taxiing yet, but is a pain pushing the bare frame around the
garage. Still flyin a tricycle that needs no tail so I can see my
problems ahead. Thanx Ron
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: wing tanks vents |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Sorry Dee,
I got busy again.
No, all I got were the captions, but not the pics.
Please try again with them as attachments (to my
e-mail address again) OK?
Been too busy lately. Haven't finished my annual
since October, so I am scheduled to fly a Champ in an
hour instead. Can't NOT fly ya' know. :-)
Kurt S.
--- Dee Young <henrysfork1@msn.com> wrote:
> Kurt, did you get the photos I sent a couple days
> back?
>
>
> Dee
>
> Do not archive
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Handling |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "~~Shorty~~" <shortnaked@golden.net>
Don,
Have you measured your toe? In or out ? You can first make sure you spn your
wheels to make sure they are tru( no wobble)
Then if true just measure from inside the wheels at front at axle height
then Measure at the same heigth on tire at the same point of inside of tire
at rear of asle.
Or just use actual rim - just make sure if the same on both sides --front
and rear for accuracy.
You can do with tail on ground or raised in air or both as they should be
close to the same unless you got a really bent axle stub.
Improper toe wil cause wear as well and scalloping if extreme but you would
notice the ground handling to be more wandering if it was that bad one would
think.
Excessive Camber could also contribute to tire wear But then agai ntoo
excessive tilt would casue a pulling to the higher postive camber
(Camber is viewed from straight on looking from front of plane. It is the
angle of tilt from perpendicular to the ground. )
I have flown KF and Avids with both cambers (postive and negative) and never
really noticed much control issues or tire wear. But i rarely visit those
asphault strips or are they called runways? LOL When you figure how
much you really are on ground i cannot see tire wear an issue for many of
hundred s of hours unless you a trainer on Pavement.
Also the as the knee action of the suspension compresses and unloads you
camber will change with the weight as well. But once again this should not
change the handling much.
Hope this helps yah.
Shorty
----- Original Message -----
From: <AlbertaIV@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Ground Handling
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 1/9/05 10:54:58 AM Pacific Standard Time,
> lcfitt@inreach.com writes:
>
> <<
> The alignment is accomplished by bending the tube gear weldment,and using
> shims on the Grove gear assembly.
> >>
>
> Lowell,
> Speaking of shim on the Grove gear. My tires wear quickly on the
outside
> edge due to not sitting square on the ground. I've had to remove and turn
> the tires around once. Can you shim for this condition?
>
> Don Smythe
> N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Handling |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Ron, From your post, I am assuming that you are in the early stages of
construction, If so you might shim with washers to correct the problem as
it is now for ease as you say of moving the project around in the garage,
but when you finish putting the airplane together, the weight will collapse
the spring a bit and should correct the pivot alignment. That said, the
alignment is pretty important to reduce the tailwheel from shimmying like
all the shopping carts I seem to get stuck with.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Schick" <roncarolnikko@webtv.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Ground Handling
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: roncarolnikko@webtv.net (Ron Schick)
>
> Lowell my Speedster project has a tailwheel that looks like it is
> mounted wrong. The swivel pin is angled such that it wants to turn
> sideways rather than go straight. When it is straight the tail comes up
> and then falls down and sideways. Is the solution to bend the spring up
> in the back to make the swivel pin exactly vertical, or can I go even
> farther so it prefers to "fall" as the wheel aligns straight? Hardly a
> problem for taxiing yet, but is a pain pushing the bare frame around the
> garage. Still flyin a tricycle that needs no tail so I can see my
> problems ahead. Thanx Ron
>
>
> BEGIN-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS
> ------------------------------------------------------
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>
>
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Handling |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/9/05 11:50:23 AM Pacific Standard Time,
shortnaked@golden.net writes:
<< Don,
Have you measured your toe? In or out ? You can first make sure you spn your
wheels to make sure they are tru( no wobble)
Then if true just measure from inside the wheels at front at a >>
Shorty,
I must admit, I have never checked wheel alignment. High and Low speed
taxi is very stable. When standing in front of the plane, it is obvious to the
eye that the outsides of the tires are holding all the weight (that's the
wear side). I asked Grove about this once and they said that everything would
come together once the plane was complete and all the weight was added. Well,
it didn't. I have a C-180 traildragger sitting next to me in the hanger. He
has about the same visual profile as mine but, his tires don't wear as bad. On
the other hand, I have about 300 more landing than his during the same time
frame. It could be alignment and I've always thought it was the spring gear
not bent just right.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Handling |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: roncarolnikko@webtv.net (Ron Schick)
Lowell the plane had been assembled to the point that the wings were on.
Even with the wings folded back the spring did not collapse to any
improvement.
the washers would have to be permanent, or some other method of
alignment used. It looks as though I need to bend the spring about five
degrees or more. Does everyone elses spring work as delivered? Ron
Message 24
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| Subject: | Fuel tank thread sealer |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: <brettandsandy@numail.org>
I'm just full of questions today. Is Permatex 9A still the best thread
sealer for the rotomolded header tank and fiberglass fuel tank fittings?
Brett
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel tank thread sealer |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/9/05 2:51:07 PM Pacific Standard Time,
brettandsandy@numail.org writes:
<< I'm just full of questions today. Is Permatex 9A still the best thread
sealer for the rotomolded header tank and fiberglass fuel tank fittings?
Brett
>>
Brett,
The discussion of the best thread sealant has been going on since
forever. One thing that was once mentioned was, to slightly pre-heat the poly
threads prior to assembly (using whatever threadsealer). Worked for me and have
never had a leak at the poly tank end.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Handling |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Don,
Maybe you don't weigh enough? Make sure you look at
the plane with 2 pax in the seats and see where the
wheels are. Also, the shims can be installed in any
of 4 directions - toe in or out, and wheels tilted in
or out. Problem is that the shims only change the
angle a little. I think the largest shim is 3
degrees. Longer bolts and maybe 2 shims might help,
but maybe a picture of your plane to grove might do
better. They migh adjust it for you??
Kurt S.
--- AlbertaIV@aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 1/9/05 11:50:23 AM Pacific
> Standard Time,
> shortnaked@golden.net writes:
>
> << Don,
>
> Have you measured your toe? In or out ? You can
> first make sure you spn your
> wheels to make sure they are tru( no wobble)
> Then if true just measure from inside the wheels at
> front at a >>
>
> Shorty,
> I must admit, I have never checked wheel
> alignment. High and Low speed
> taxi is very stable. When standing in front of the
> plane, it is obvious to the
> eye that the outsides of the tires are holding all
> the weight (that's the
> wear side). I asked Grove about this once and they
> said that everything would
> come together once the plane was complete and all
> the weight was added. Well,
> it didn't. I have a C-180 traildragger sitting next
> to me in the hanger. He
> has about the same visual profile as mine but, his
> tires don't wear as bad. On
> the other hand, I have about 300 more landing than
> his during the same time
> frame. It could be alignment and I've always
> thought it was the spring gear
> not bent just right.
>
> Don Smythe
> N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 27
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
Hi Rex-
I just checked my original(?) 8" wheels with a magnet, and they are
definitely aluminum.
Lynn I,ve answered you off list as it might take up too much room but
basically the tyres to replace the buffed down ATV"s are called Lawnmower or
Turf tyres. The ATV's are 20 x 7 x 8 2ply scrubbed down and the turf tyres
are 18 x 6.50 x 8 4 ply. They have a fine tread that won't worry you. I
fitted tubes in mine. The tyres cost about $50US each and are readilly
available. I run 14 PSI. They sit perhaps1" lower but otherwise fill the
pant the same but don't touch at all. They are brilliant.
Rex.
rexjan@bigpond.com
Message 28
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| Subject: | 8" Aluminium rims |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
Hi Rex-
I can tell you for certain that the wheels on my IV are 8", are
aluminum, do have the brake lugs welded onto the inside of the rims,
and that the calipers (Matco) operate on the inner portion of the brake
disc. I just this past day or so disassembled them and lightened the
discs according to the drawing in my manual. The discs were at 26 oz.
to start with and following the instructions, they were reduced to 13
oz each. There was a lot of unnecessary metal at the outer periphery of
those discs....not any more! Ninety-six 1/4" holes drilled (on the two
discs) and some time spent with the band saw took care of that.
Lynn
Thanks Lynn
for that detail. I've learnt a fair bit here. I thought
with the ATV tyres replaced on my rims I wanted for nothing else. However it
sounds like your aluminium rims might be a direct replacement and lighter.
It also seems they don't have the valve inline with a wheel stud so in all I
would consider the aluminium rims an improvement on my steel ones. I now see
some pictures of similar rims on the Douglas site. They have 4 wheel studs.
I have more and I'm almost certain it's 6. How many do you have.
Rex.
rexjan@bigpond.com
Message 29
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
Anyway, I
haven't figured out yet what the actual "pin" is, unless the four bolts
that don't seem to go anywhere else are somehow shaped to use as the
pins.
Hope mine is not different and I confuse you but I have square pins.
Rex.
rexjan@bigpond.com
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel tank thread sealer |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" <kitfox4@numail.org>
Don,
Did you use Permatex 9A?
Brett
> never had a leak at the poly tank end.
>
> Don Smythe
> N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
Message 31
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| Subject: | Grove undercarriage |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
I'm really debating this Grove gear thing...I like the looks of the IV
with the bungee gear...looks nostalgic. I'm gathering info right now,
so thanks for that, Jimmie. Yeah, I hear you on the "so many things I
want to buy" thing...without a wife as a check on my checkbook, I can
get real stupid about buying things. : )
I'm with Jimmie, I think the grove gear is the way to go having it on my
plane but not experienced the bungee gear admittedly. However talking to
others with the bungee gear they envy my Grove gear and I have never seen
sign of a ground loop yet and feel it's due to tha Grove gear.
Rex.
rexjan@bigpond.com
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel tank thread sealer |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/9/05 4:20:39 PM Pacific Standard Time,
kitfox4@numail.org writes:
<<
Don,
Did you use Permatex 9A?
Brett
>>
I used a Permtex brand but, 9N doesn't ring a bell. Go For a good sealant
and see what happens. I personally don't think it makes a big difference. I
have all the same connections as you and everyone else. Leaks are rare...
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Engine coatings?? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Joel Mapes" <FoxFloatFlyer@hotmail.com>
Wow! for 59 bucks it's too bad I can't powder coat Poly Fiber.
Joel series 5 912 ULS Aerocomp Amphibs
"be flying this year"
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Handling |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/9/05 3:34:16 PM Pacific Standard Time,
smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com writes:
<< Don,
Maybe you don't weigh enough? Make >>
Kurt,
A little history...The List helped name my airplane. FAT ALBERT was the
first choice but we decided on FAT ALBERTA to give it a feminine nature. That
carries through also to my email name. To say that my plane does not weigh
enough is on the other side of the scale. My original empty weight was 667.
That is a Classic IV with 582. I definitely weigh enough.
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Rad flap test |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com>
At 04:53 PM 1/8/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>Initial conclusion: The two independently controlled rad flaps allow great
>control of the overall water temps.
>
>Don Smythe
>N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Don,
Wonderful! Thanks so much for doing this testing. I'm looking
forward to driving the flaps with a thermocouple driven servo.
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582 / 99% done, thanks to Bob Ducar.
Do not archive
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Handling |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
Don,
I suspect that the visual look is engineered into the gear legs with the
idea of predicting the relaxation of the gear under load, moving the contact
on the tire more toward the center. I suspect it has to do with where it
should be at maximum gross wt. Actually, I only remember seeing one Kitfox
with the spring gear that didn't look a bit bow legged and that was Michael
Harter's. I like the light on it's wheels look - but that is an opinion - I
don't really know if the tires should ride on the center of the tread. I
talked to a fellow this morning on the phone and his wears only on the edge
of only one tire. I think that is unusual and deserves some thought.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: <AlbertaIV@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Ground Handling
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 1/9/05 10:54:58 AM Pacific Standard Time,
> lcfitt@inreach.com writes:
>
> <<
> The alignment is accomplished by bending the tube gear weldment,and using
> shims on the Grove gear assembly.
> >>
>
> Lowell,
> Speaking of shim on the Grove gear. My tires wear quickly on the
outside
> edge due to not sitting square on the ground. I've had to remove and turn
> the tires around once. Can you shim for this condition?
>
> Don Smythe
> N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
> BEGIN-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS
> ------------------------------------------------------
> Teach CanIt if this mail (ID 75707428) is spam:
> Spam:
http://login.safereach.com/b.php?c=s&i=75707428&m=ec2f55557427
> Not spam:
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> Forget vote:
http://login.safereach.com/b.php?c=f&i=75707428&m=ec2f55557427
> ------------------------------------------------------
> END-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS
>
>
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: 8" Aluminium rims |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "~~Shorty~~" <shortnaked@golden.net>
The douglas Site does not seem to show the 6 lug version as used on the
Kitfox.
However they are alum and look like they started as about 1/4" and it is a
spun wheel . The wheel Bolts to the Turned Billet hub with 6 AN bolts.
If i go out to hangar tonight I wil take some pics for you.
Lynn - The Matco do not operate on one side if the rotor, they work on
both sides. As the fluid pressure increases, the piston will come out and
excert a pressure on the one side but as that happens the caliper slides and
excerts equal or near equal pressure to the other side of the rotor. If your
calipers do not slide your brakes will work at less efficiency and will wear
one pad only.
Glad to hear you lightened your rotors, now are you gonna turn the inside
of the spindle as well? you will save I think about 1 or 1 1/2 pounds more
from lightening them.
Hope this helps you,
Shorty
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: 8" Aluminium rims
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
>
> Hi Rex-
> I can tell you for certain that the wheels on my IV are 8", are
> aluminum, do have the brake lugs welded onto the inside of the rims,
> and that the calipers (Matco) operate on the inner portion of the brake
> disc. I just this past day or so disassembled them and lightened the
> discs according to the drawing in my manual. The discs were at 26 oz.
> to start with and following the instructions, they were reduced to 13
> oz each. There was a lot of unnecessary metal at the outer periphery of
> those discs....not any more! Ninety-six 1/4" holes drilled (on the two
> discs) and some time spent with the band saw took care of that.
>
> Lynn
>
> Thanks Lynn
> for that detail. I've learnt a fair bit here. I
thought
> with the ATV tyres replaced on my rims I wanted for nothing else. However
it
> sounds like your aluminium rims might be a direct replacement and lighter.
> It also seems they don't have the valve inline with a wheel stud so in all
I
> would consider the aluminium rims an improvement on my steel ones. I now
see
> some pictures of similar rims on the Douglas site. They have 4 wheel
studs.
> I have more and I'm almost certain it's 6. How many do you have.
> Rex.
> rexjan@bigpond.com
>
>
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: Ground Handling |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@inreach.com>
OK Ron, that clears it up a bit. The washer suggestion was only if you
wanted to improve the angle temporarily. Regarding the work as designed,
mine did. I have the original factory double leaf spring and have had both
the Maule and Home Builder's Special tail wheel. Both worked as advertised.
If you would like to try a shim contact me direct. lcfitt@inreach.com I can
make the tail wheel shims. I am not very good at trig anymore, so give me
the width, length and thickness desired at the thick end assuming the thin
end to be zero.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Schick" <roncarolnikko@webtv.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Ground Handling
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: roncarolnikko@webtv.net (Ron Schick)
>
> Lowell the plane had been assembled to the point that the wings were on.
> Even with the wings folded back the spring did not collapse to any
> improvement.
> the washers would have to be permanent, or some other method of
> alignment used. It looks as though I need to bend the spring about five
> degrees or more. Does everyone elses spring work as delivered? Ron
>
>
> BEGIN-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS
> ------------------------------------------------------
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> Spam:
http://login.safereach.com/b.php?c=s&i=75822682&m=7394a823833a
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> Forget vote:
http://login.safereach.com/b.php?c=f&i=75822682&m=7394a823833a
> ------------------------------------------------------
> END-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS
>
>
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: Rad flap test |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 1/9/05 4:54:41 PM Pacific Standard Time, bnn@nethere.com
writes:
<< Don,
Wonderful! Thanks so much for doing this testing. I'm looking
forward to driving the flaps with a thermocouple driven servo.
>>
Guy,
It's all about experimentation. However, be careful because every good
idea has drawbacks. Stand by to be bit????
Don Smythe
N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re: Grove undercarriage |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "~~Shorty~~" <shortnaked@golden.net>
Rex,
<< However talking to
others with the bungee gear they envy my Grove gear and I have never seen
sign of a ground loop yet and feel it's due to tha Grove gear.
>>
I have flown KT and Avids as well as many other taildraggers woth a bungee
suspension and Never have ground looped.
(i will add YET -- just in case :-) )
I think the Grove gear is fine but Also feel that pilot proficency is a
must. If you cannot fly a taildragger or are a lazy on the ground trigear
pilot the choice of gear will only be a vsion in your mind that will
benefit you.
Mind you if any gear is not properly aligned you will have difficulty.
Perhaps anyone having handling issues should have another Type rated pilot
to try out your and see what they think. My opinion is it no matter if
you on wheel , skis or floats.you are in a flying machine and you better
learn all aspects of slow flight adn landing in all kinda of conditions now
matte what gear you got. Havin Grove gear may look nice but it ain;t gonna
save your bacon when you cannot land your fox ina 500 foot strip with ease.
Hope this helps you Rex,
Shorty
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Grove undercarriage
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
>
> I'm really debating this Grove gear thing...I like the looks of the IV
> with the bungee gear...looks nostalgic. I'm gathering info right now,
> so thanks for that, Jimmie. Yeah, I hear you on the "so many things I
> want to buy" thing...without a wife as a check on my checkbook, I can
> get real stupid about buying things. : )
>
> I'm with Jimmie, I think the grove gear is the way to go having it on my
> plane but not experienced the bungee gear admittedly. However talking to
> others with the bungee gear they envy my Grove gear and I have never seen
> sign of a ground loop yet and feel it's due to tha Grove gear.
> Rex.
> rexjan@bigpond.com
>
>
Message 41
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|
| Subject: | Re: model IV wing tanks |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: paul wilson <pwilson@climber.org>
Just curious. What is the reason for the place you used?
Thanks. Paul
==========
At 07:22 AM 1/9/05 -0500, you wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
>In a message dated 1/8/05 5:39:22 PM Pacific Standard Time,
>pwilson@climber.org writes:
>
><< You can choose where expanded fuel drips. On top of the wing the way
> Skystar does it. out at the wing tip like Don does it. and under the wing
> like mine. >>
>
>Paul,
> One little correction. Mine exits out the bottom half way to the wing tip
>not all the way to the wing tip
>
>Do Not Archive
>
>Don Smythe
>N-998DS Classic IV W/ 582
>
>
Message 42
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| Subject: | Re: 8" Aluminium rims |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Rex-
My wheels have three mounting holes. Interestingly enough, the hubs
have six holes.
Lynn
On Sunday, January 9, 2005, at 07:03 PM, Rex & Jan Shaw wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw"
> <rexjan@bigpond.com>
>
> I now see
> some pictures of similar rims on the Douglas site. They have 4 wheel
> studs.
> I have more and I'm almost certain it's 6. How many do you have.
> Rex.
> rexjan@bigpond.com
>
>
Message 43
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie Blackwell" <jablackwell@ev1.net>
Flying today I noticed that my radio receiver was noisy above 4000 rpm. Below
4000 rpm the receiver is very clear. My radio is a KX125.
Would appreciate any thoughts on were to look for this problem.
Also, I am about to try mounting a vertical card compass in my dash. Has anyone
been successful with a vertical card compass mounted in the dash?
Jimmie
Model IV Speedster 912 UL
Message 44
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| Subject: | Re: Grove undercarriage |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Cudnohufsky's" <7suds@chartermi.net>
List,
I ran the bungee gear on my IV for four years and never had an incident with
ground loop or ground handling, I did however envy the guys with the Grove
for the simple reason they did not have to change their bungee's every year,
I however did not go to the grove because of the added weight and expense.
Lloyd
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Grove undercarriage
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
>
> I'm really debating this Grove gear thing...I like the looks of the IV
> with the bungee gear...looks nostalgic. I'm gathering info right now,
> so thanks for that, Jimmie. Yeah, I hear you on the "so many things I
> want to buy" thing...without a wife as a check on my checkbook, I can
> get real stupid about buying things. : )
>
> I'm with Jimmie, I think the grove gear is the way to go having it on my
> plane but not experienced the bungee gear admittedly. However talking to
> others with the bungee gear they envy my Grove gear and I have never seen
> sign of a ground loop yet and feel it's due to tha Grove gear.
> Rex.
> rexjan@bigpond.com
>
>
>
Message 45
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jeffrey Puls" <pulsair@mindspring.com>
Deke,
I am based in Columbus, Ohio at Bolton Field KTZR. They have a resturant on
the field and I can run you any whrere you need to go. My number is
614-871-3155. If you have any problems in Ohio call me. Jeff puls Classic
IV.
> [Original Message]
> From: Fox5flyer <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
> To: Kitfox List <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 1/9/2005 2:12:12 PM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: long XC
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>
> Next Wednesday I'll be flying commercial from here in Michigan to Florida.
> The purpose is to pick up a Kitfox and fly it home shortly after as the
> weather permits. I don't really know what my route will be, but I've got
> all the charts, directories, and current GPS196. The plan is to fly point
> to point about 2.5 hours per leg with refueling at each stop, close old
> flight plan and open a new one each time. The reason for point to point
is
> to keep my route and stops flexible. It's nearly 1200 miles and I figure
> about 11-12 hours flying time so I plan to take at least two days to make
> the trip, however with weather it can easily take longer.
> My route will be generally direct from Tampa area, northward to somewhere
> near Knoxville, and onward up to NE Michigan. If flying conditions allow
> I'm hoping to get 8 hours in the first day, but it's flexible.
> Anybody along that route that can recommend some fuel/food stops? Any
> airports that have accomodations within walking or courtesy car distance?
I
> haven't made a long cross country in a long time so any help or advice
would
> be appreciated.
> Thanks,
> Deke Morisse
> NE Michigan
>
>
Message 46
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| Subject: | Re: 8" Aluminium rims |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Shorty-
I guess I didn't describe very well what I was trying to say, when I
said "operate on the inner portion of the brake disc." What I meant to
say was that the calipers operate on the inner (RADIALLY inner) portion
of the disc...that is, the smaller diameter portion of the whole disc,
with the outer (radially outer) portion being there to allow mounting
to the wheel.
Yes, I probably will bore the axle/spindle out too. In looking at the
axle from the threaded end, there is already a hole there...it is
probably 3/16" in dia., and about 1" deep, and apparently a bit
off-center. I'll have to chuck this up in my lathe and use a boring bit
to straighten out the concentricity of this hole before I can use any
drill. After the initial hole is straight/concentric, then I will be
able to use drills to go through the axle and lose some weight.
Lynn
>> aluminum, do have the brake lugs welded onto the inside of the rims,
>> and that the calipers (Matco) operate on the inner portion of the
>> brake
>> disc.
On Sunday, January 9, 2005, at 08:07 PM, ~~Shorty~~ wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "~~Shorty~~" <shortnaked@golden.net>
>
> The douglas Site does not seem to show the 6 lug version as used on the
> Kitfox.
> However they are alum and look like they started as about 1/4" and it
> is a
> spun wheel . The wheel Bolts to the Turned Billet hub with 6 AN bolts.
>
> If i go out to hangar tonight I wil take some pics for you.
>
> Lynn - The Matco do not operate on one side if the rotor, they
> work on
> both sides. As the fluid pressure increases, the piston will come out
> and
> excert a pressure on the one side but as that happens the caliper
> slides and
> excerts equal or near equal pressure to the other side of the rotor.
> If your
> calipers do not slide your brakes will work at less efficiency and
> will wear
> one pad only.
>
> Glad to hear you lightened your rotors, now are you gonna turn the
> inside
> of the spindle as well? you will save I think about 1 or 1 1/2
> pounds more
> from lightening them.
>
> Hope this helps you,
>
>
> Shorty
Message 47
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| Subject: | Re: 8" Aluminium rims |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "~~Shorty~~" <shortnaked@golden.net>
Lynn, You your are correct he outter part of the rotor is to facilitae the
3 mounting screws and the safety wire holes.
Your blood must be boiling try to get this plane done by spring eh. !!
Shorty
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lynn Matteson" <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: 8" Aluminium rims
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
> Shorty-
>
> I guess I didn't describe very well what I was trying to say, when I
> said "operate on the inner portion of the brake disc." What I meant to
> say was that the calipers operate on the inner (RADIALLY inner) portion
> of the disc...that is, the smaller diameter portion of the whole disc,
> with the outer (radially outer) portion being there to allow mounting
> to the wheel.
> Yes, I probably will bore the axle/spindle out too. In looking at the
> axle from the threaded end, there is already a hole there...it is
> probably 3/16" in dia., and about 1" deep, and apparently a bit
> off-center. I'll have to chuck this up in my lathe and use a boring bit
> to straighten out the concentricity of this hole before I can use any
> drill. After the initial hole is straight/concentric, then I will be
> able to use drills to go through the axle and lose some weight.
>
> Lynn
>
>
> >> aluminum, do have the brake lugs welded onto the inside of the rims,
> >> and that the calipers (Matco) operate on the inner portion of the
> >> brake
> >> disc.
>
> On Sunday, January 9, 2005, at 08:07 PM, ~~Shorty~~ wrote:
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "~~Shorty~~" <shortnaked@golden.net>
> >
> > The douglas Site does not seem to show the 6 lug version as used on the
> > Kitfox.
> > However they are alum and look like they started as about 1/4" and it
> > is a
> > spun wheel . The wheel Bolts to the Turned Billet hub with 6 AN bolts.
> >
> > If i go out to hangar tonight I wil take some pics for you.
> >
> > Lynn - The Matco do not operate on one side if the rotor, they
> > work on
> > both sides. As the fluid pressure increases, the piston will come out
> > and
> > excert a pressure on the one side but as that happens the caliper
> > slides and
> > excerts equal or near equal pressure to the other side of the rotor.
> > If your
> > calipers do not slide your brakes will work at less efficiency and
> > will wear
> > one pad only.
> >
> > Glad to hear you lightened your rotors, now are you gonna turn the
> > inside
> > of the spindle as well? you will save I think about 1 or 1 1/2
> > pounds more
> > from lightening them.
> >
> > Hope this helps you,
> >
> >
> > Shorty
>
>
Message 48
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kirk hull" <kirkhull@sbcglobal.net>
If the aircraft is deregistered it is no longer an aircraft. Then you are
starting with parts weather they be new or salvige to build your new
aircraft. If you can prove that you built over 51% of the aircraft ( the
origional must have beel in prety bad shape and probably listed as destroyed
in the crash report) then yes you should be able to get the repairman cert.
You will have to have receipts for the parts you have purchased and of
coarse your building log to prove your time. by the way, was the origional
a/c crashed or dammaged in another way.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: customtrans@qwest.net
This confuses me, reregister the aircraft. Are you saying you can start all
over with the certification of the aircraft, can I even get a repairmans
cert. of such. If so tell me how? I want to do this with my 4. Now
remember, I'm rebuilding the fox and I can prove over 51% build.
steve a
-----Original Message-----
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kirk hull" <kirkhull@sbcglobal.net>
Only a couple of problems that I can . First of all you dont need an STC
(supplemental type certificate) for an experimental as we have no type
certificate to supplement. Second of all if you deregister your aircraft
and the re register it with the new weight limit you want you should not
have any problems. just a lot of work and ofcourse a new 40 hour test time.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
<smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Message 49
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|
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kirk hull" <kirkhull@sbcglobal.net>
Kansas City is a little out of the way but if weather pushes you west 0N0
(Zero November Zero )Roosterville ( Liberty Mo.) is a good fuel stop with
food close by. The owner , Paul Stuber lives on the field and will pump
fuel 24/ 7 . He caries 100LL and auto gas. The runway is more then
suitable for a fox with parallel paved and grass .
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Next Wednesday I'll be flying commercial from here in Michigan to Florida.
The purpose is to pick up a Kitfox and fly it home shortly after as the
weather permits. I don't really know what my route will be, but I've got
all the charts, directories, and current GPS196. The plan is to fly point
to point about 2.5 hours per leg with refueling at each stop, close old
flight plan and open a new one each time. The reason for point to point is
to keep my route and stops flexible. It's nearly 1200 miles and I figure
about 11-12 hours flying time so I plan to take at least two days to make
the trip, however with weather it can easily take longer.
My route will be generally direct from Tampa area, northward to somewhere
near Knoxville, and onward up to NE Michigan. If flying conditions allow
I'm hoping to get 8 hours in the first day, but it's flexible.
Anybody along that route that can recommend some fuel/food stops? Any
airports that have accomodations within walking or courtesy car distance? I
haven't made a long cross country in a long time so any help or advice would
be appreciated.
Thanks,
Deke Morisse
NE Michigan
Message 50
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| Subject: | [ William Willyard ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Email List Photo Shares <pictures@matronics.com>
A new Email List Photo Share is available:
Poster: William Willyard <Wwillyard@aol.com>
Subject: Kitfox fuel vent check valve photos
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/Wwillyard@aol.com.01.09.2005/index.html
o Main Photo Share Index
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
o Submitting a Photo Share
If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please include the
following information along with your email message and files:
1) Email List or Lists that they are related to:
2) Your Full Name:
3) Your Email Address:
4) One line Subject description:
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic:
6) One-line Description of each photo or file:
Email the information above and your files and photos to:
pictures@matronics.com
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