---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 03/18/05: 29 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:03 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (AlbertaIV@aol.com) 2. 12:33 AM - Great Site (AlbertaIV@aol.com) 3. 04:53 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (AlbertaIV@aol.com) 4. 05:00 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (Sterling) 5. 05:24 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (Sterling) 6. 05:24 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (Sterling) 7. 05:24 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (Sterling) 8. 05:41 AM - Warning (hausding, sid) 9. 06:12 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning not MEK (flier) 10. 06:20 AM - Re: Warning (AlbertaIV@aol.com) 11. 06:22 AM - Gas Gauge Balls (Napier, Mark) 12. 06:27 AM - EAA Chapter 517 (Dee Young) 13. 06:49 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (Steve Zakreski) 14. 07:34 AM - Re: Warning (Randy Daughenbaugh) 15. 07:51 AM - Re: Warning (AlbertaIV@aol.com) 16. 08:22 AM - Re: Warning Well Said (Aerobatics@aol.com) 17. 09:17 AM - Re: Warning Well Said (Gary Algate) 18. 10:10 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (Bob Robertson) 19. 10:22 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (John Perry) 20. 10:27 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning ............ Polyester (Aerobatics@aol.com) 21. 10:55 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (AlbertaIV@aol.com) 22. 11:12 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (Lynn Matteson) 23. 11:32 AM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (FREDERICKSON, JOHN L [AG/2067]) 24. 03:05 PM - Dumb idea (Rex & Jan Shaw) 25. 03:08 PM - Dunking engine in water (Rex & Jan Shaw) 26. 04:12 PM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (Mdkitfox@aol.com) 27. 06:44 PM - Attn: Charles Cook () 28. 07:26 PM - Model 5 Rudder (Cudnohufsky's) 29. 07:41 PM - Re: West Epoxy System Warning (Sterling) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:03:17 AM PST US From: AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com In a message dated 3/18/2005 2:46:36 AM Eastern Standard Time, donpearsall@comcast.net writes: So I sympathize with you Don! I hope your face heals quickly. Did you go to a Dr yet? Maybe there is something they can do to make it heal faster. Don Pearsall Well, it's 3:00 AM and sitting here looking at this stupid computer because sleeping is out of the question. Will go to the Doc when the sun comes up. Do Not Archive Don Smythe ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:33:30 AM PST US From: AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Kitfox-List: Great Site --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com As I said, it's 3:00 AM and decided to do some web searching on 2 stroke case leaks. The first site that came up is below. I had run across this site before but could never get it to work with my old computer. With a new computer/software, it works like a champ. The site is live radio about mostly Rotax 2 stroke engines and features Mike Stratman, Tom Olenik (one of our own) plus others. If you haven't tried it, give it a whirl. It is full of archived discussions with the above guys and others on all kinds of Rotax maintenance and other topics. _http://www.ultraflightradio.com/bytopic/engine.html_ (http://www.ultraflightradio.com/bytopic/engine.html) Don Smythe ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:53:27 AM PST US From: AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com In a message dated 3/18/2005 3:56:33 AM Eastern Standard Time, eskflyer@pld.com writes: airplanes . Big ones that is . we used many 55 gallon drums of polyester and epoxy over the years and did not use resperators or any type of skin protection . I am paying for it John, You've hit on something that I've been wondering about. Would switching to Polyester give any relief or do they both give the same results as far as burning your skin off? I still have to finish off my cowlings after the mod (waiting for warmer weather). Right now, it looks like I'll have to hire someone to do the work. Don Smythe Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:00:11 AM PST US From: "Sterling" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" My father retired with an A&P as well as 5 type ratings in jets. He spent a good deal of time around solvents, epoxy and other things typically found in and around airplane hangers. He developed colon cancer two years ago and it soon spread to this liver. A surgeon was able to cut out a tumor the size of a golf ball out of his colon (and 1/3rd of the colon as well.) The liver can only be addressed with chemotherapy. I took my dad to every visit to various oncologists. When he listed his occupation as a commercial pilot, the oncologist asked him if he had an exposure to solvents. Over the years my dad and I worked on various "garage" projects to include several cars I had in high school, an Avid Flyer I built back in the early 90s and recently, I recall how much we used solvents and worked around epoxy (both in fiberglass work and in spraying...) Back in the early 1970s, he was given some left over epoxy paint that was used to paint the Saberliner jet he flew. We painted a Volkswagen with it. Long story made short, the compounds in MEK, Acetone and other solvents and those found in epoxy cause cancer. West Epoxy isn't the culprit, any epoxy made by any company has similar compounds in it. It is VERY important to use PPE when working with this stuff. I always use gloves and ventilation and when sanding anything having an epoxy base, a very good respirator. Sterling Brooks Knot-2-Shabby Airport & Texas Longhorn Cattle Ranch 5TA6 San Antonio Sectional ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Pearsall" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" > > Don, I have to echo your warnings to everyone. I built a KR-1 over 28 years > ago, then a KR-2. Both are built using epoxy as the resin for fiberglass > cloth (more flexible than polyester.) During construction, I did not wear > gloves at all, and often had my hands and arms dripping with the stuff. It > even got into my hair. I sensitized my hands after the KR-1. Every time I > was exposed to the epoxy, or even its fumes, it was like someone poured > scalding water over my skin. My skin would just act exactly like it was > badly burned, and hurt as bad too. Luckily, the sensitized areas were just > my hands and arms, but not ALL areas. There were patches of my skin that > were not affected. > > Needless to say, after the KR-2, I said bye-bye to building composite > planes. > > To this day, many years later, I still get burned by just being near epoxy > fumes. And I sure do not work with it. > > So I sympathize with you Don! I hope your face heals quickly. Did you go to > a Dr yet? Maybe there is something they can do to make it heal faster. > > Don Pearsall > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > AlbertaIV@aol.com > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > I posted a few days back that I had another episode with West Epoxy. Once > a > person becomes sensitized to epoxy, it is for life (that is per West > Epoxy). > A couple weeks ago, my Son wanted to fill a small crack on his boat and I > offered to help. He mixed it up while I watched close by. Even that > close > and it nailed me good. I have lost at least two layers of skin around my > nose > and mouth. Tonight, it had stopped peeling and starting to itch. I gently > > rubbed my face to make it feel better and all of a sudden, I had two > palmfuls > of blood. There isn't enough skin left on my face to hold back the blood. > We've talked about MEK and other chemical we use and how bad they can > be > to an airplane builder. Trust me folks, you don't want to become > sensitized > to epoxy. West says that it will get worse and worse at each exposure. > They are telling the truth. > When you use this stuff, you better get into full dress with an > external > air source. I'm having a hard time understanding how they can even sell > this stuff. > BTW, I've used West Epoxy rarely on and off for years and it never > bothered me until I built the Fox. I put out this warning tonight because, > quite > frankly, I'm a bit worried this time. All you tough guys that might say, > "stuff don't bother me". STAND-BY > > Don Smythe > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:24:44 AM PST US From: "Sterling" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" A link to the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) for West resin. It mainly suggests that skin contact is a problem. But check out MSDS for various solvents (MEK, Acetone etc) to be best informed. http://www.westsystem.com/webpages/userinfo/safety/MSDS105.pdf ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sterling" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" > > My father retired with an A&P as well as 5 type ratings in jets. He spent a > good deal of time around solvents, epoxy and other things typically found in > and around airplane hangers. He developed colon cancer two years ago and it > soon spread to this liver. A surgeon was able to cut out a tumor the size of > a golf ball out of his colon (and 1/3rd of the colon as well.) The liver can > only be addressed with chemotherapy. > > I took my dad to every visit to various oncologists. When he listed his > occupation as a commercial pilot, the oncologist asked him if he had an > exposure to solvents. > > Over the years my dad and I worked on various "garage" projects to include > several cars I had in high school, an Avid Flyer I built back in the early > 90s and recently, I recall how much we used solvents and worked around epoxy > (both in fiberglass work and in spraying...) Back in the early 1970s, he > was given some left over epoxy paint that was used to paint the Saberliner > jet he flew. We painted a Volkswagen with it. > > Long story made short, the compounds in MEK, Acetone and other solvents and > those found in epoxy cause cancer. > > West Epoxy isn't the culprit, any epoxy made by any company has similar > compounds in it. > > It is VERY important to use PPE when working with this stuff. I always use > gloves and ventilation and when sanding anything having an epoxy base, a > very good respirator. > > Sterling Brooks > Knot-2-Shabby Airport & Texas Longhorn Cattle Ranch > 5TA6 San Antonio Sectional > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Don Pearsall" > To: > Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" > > > > > Don, I have to echo your warnings to everyone. I built a KR-1 over 28 > years > > ago, then a KR-2. Both are built using epoxy as the resin for fiberglass > > cloth (more flexible than polyester.) During construction, I did not wear > > gloves at all, and often had my hands and arms dripping with the stuff. It > > even got into my hair. I sensitized my hands after the KR-1. Every time I > > was exposed to the epoxy, or even its fumes, it was like someone poured > > scalding water over my skin. My skin would just act exactly like it was > > badly burned, and hurt as bad too. Luckily, the sensitized areas were just > > my hands and arms, but not ALL areas. There were patches of my skin that > > were not affected. > > > > Needless to say, after the KR-2, I said bye-bye to building composite > > planes. > > > > To this day, many years later, I still get burned by just being near epoxy > > fumes. And I sure do not work with it. > > > > So I sympathize with you Don! I hope your face heals quickly. Did you go > to > > a Dr yet? Maybe there is something they can do to make it heal faster. > > > > Don Pearsall > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > > AlbertaIV@aol.com > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > > > I posted a few days back that I had another episode with West Epoxy. > Once > > a > > person becomes sensitized to epoxy, it is for life (that is per West > > Epoxy). > > A couple weeks ago, my Son wanted to fill a small crack on his boat and > I > > offered to help. He mixed it up while I watched close by. Even that > > close > > and it nailed me good. I have lost at least two layers of skin around my > > nose > > and mouth. Tonight, it had stopped peeling and starting to itch. I > gently > > > > rubbed my face to make it feel better and all of a sudden, I had two > > palmfuls > > of blood. There isn't enough skin left on my face to hold back the > blood. > > We've talked about MEK and other chemical we use and how bad they can > > be > > to an airplane builder. Trust me folks, you don't want to become > > sensitized > > to epoxy. West says that it will get worse and worse at each exposure. > > They are telling the truth. > > When you use this stuff, you better get into full dress with an > > external > > air source. I'm having a hard time understanding how they can even sell > > this stuff. > > BTW, I've used West Epoxy rarely on and off for years and it never > > bothered me until I built the Fox. I put out this warning tonight > because, > > quite > > frankly, I'm a bit worried this time. All you tough guys that might say, > > "stuff don't bother me". STAND-BY > > > > Don Smythe > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:24:46 AM PST US From: "Sterling" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" A link to the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) for West resin. It mainly suggests that skin contact is a problem. But check out MSDS for various solvents (MEK, Acetone etc) to be best informed. http://www.westsystem.com/webpages/userinfo/safety/MSDS105.pdf ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sterling" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" > > My father retired with an A&P as well as 5 type ratings in jets. He spent a > good deal of time around solvents, epoxy and other things typically found in > and around airplane hangers. He developed colon cancer two years ago and it > soon spread to this liver. A surgeon was able to cut out a tumor the size of > a golf ball out of his colon (and 1/3rd of the colon as well.) The liver can > only be addressed with chemotherapy. > > I took my dad to every visit to various oncologists. When he listed his > occupation as a commercial pilot, the oncologist asked him if he had an > exposure to solvents. > > Over the years my dad and I worked on various "garage" projects to include > several cars I had in high school, an Avid Flyer I built back in the early > 90s and recently, I recall how much we used solvents and worked around epoxy > (both in fiberglass work and in spraying...) Back in the early 1970s, he > was given some left over epoxy paint that was used to paint the Saberliner > jet he flew. We painted a Volkswagen with it. > > Long story made short, the compounds in MEK, Acetone and other solvents and > those found in epoxy cause cancer. > > West Epoxy isn't the culprit, any epoxy made by any company has similar > compounds in it. > > It is VERY important to use PPE when working with this stuff. I always use > gloves and ventilation and when sanding anything having an epoxy base, a > very good respirator. > > Sterling Brooks > Knot-2-Shabby Airport & Texas Longhorn Cattle Ranch > 5TA6 San Antonio Sectional > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Don Pearsall" > To: > Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" > > > > > Don, I have to echo your warnings to everyone. I built a KR-1 over 28 > years > > ago, then a KR-2. Both are built using epoxy as the resin for fiberglass > > cloth (more flexible than polyester.) During construction, I did not wear > > gloves at all, and often had my hands and arms dripping with the stuff. It > > even got into my hair. I sensitized my hands after the KR-1. Every time I > > was exposed to the epoxy, or even its fumes, it was like someone poured > > scalding water over my skin. My skin would just act exactly like it was > > badly burned, and hurt as bad too. Luckily, the sensitized areas were just > > my hands and arms, but not ALL areas. There were patches of my skin that > > were not affected. > > > > Needless to say, after the KR-2, I said bye-bye to building composite > > planes. > > > > To this day, many years later, I still get burned by just being near epoxy > > fumes. And I sure do not work with it. > > > > So I sympathize with you Don! I hope your face heals quickly. Did you go > to > > a Dr yet? Maybe there is something they can do to make it heal faster. > > > > Don Pearsall > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > > AlbertaIV@aol.com > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > > > I posted a few days back that I had another episode with West Epoxy. > Once > > a > > person becomes sensitized to epoxy, it is for life (that is per West > > Epoxy). > > A couple weeks ago, my Son wanted to fill a small crack on his boat and > I > > offered to help. He mixed it up while I watched close by. Even that > > close > > and it nailed me good. I have lost at least two layers of skin around my > > nose > > and mouth. Tonight, it had stopped peeling and starting to itch. I > gently > > > > rubbed my face to make it feel better and all of a sudden, I had two > > palmfuls > > of blood. There isn't enough skin left on my face to hold back the > blood. > > We've talked about MEK and other chemical we use and how bad they can > > be > > to an airplane builder. Trust me folks, you don't want to become > > sensitized > > to epoxy. West says that it will get worse and worse at each exposure. > > They are telling the truth. > > When you use this stuff, you better get into full dress with an > > external > > air source. I'm having a hard time understanding how they can even sell > > this stuff. > > BTW, I've used West Epoxy rarely on and off for years and it never > > bothered me until I built the Fox. I put out this warning tonight > because, > > quite > > frankly, I'm a bit worried this time. All you tough guys that might say, > > "stuff don't bother me". STAND-BY > > > > Don Smythe > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:24:46 AM PST US From: "Sterling" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" A link to the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) for West resin. It mainly suggests that skin contact is a problem. But check out MSDS for various solvents (MEK, Acetone etc) to be best informed. http://www.westsystem.com/webpages/userinfo/safety/MSDS105.pdf ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sterling" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" > > My father retired with an A&P as well as 5 type ratings in jets. He spent a > good deal of time around solvents, epoxy and other things typically found in > and around airplane hangers. He developed colon cancer two years ago and it > soon spread to this liver. A surgeon was able to cut out a tumor the size of > a golf ball out of his colon (and 1/3rd of the colon as well.) The liver can > only be addressed with chemotherapy. > > I took my dad to every visit to various oncologists. When he listed his > occupation as a commercial pilot, the oncologist asked him if he had an > exposure to solvents. > > Over the years my dad and I worked on various "garage" projects to include > several cars I had in high school, an Avid Flyer I built back in the early > 90s and recently, I recall how much we used solvents and worked around epoxy > (both in fiberglass work and in spraying...) Back in the early 1970s, he > was given some left over epoxy paint that was used to paint the Saberliner > jet he flew. We painted a Volkswagen with it. > > Long story made short, the compounds in MEK, Acetone and other solvents and > those found in epoxy cause cancer. > > West Epoxy isn't the culprit, any epoxy made by any company has similar > compounds in it. > > It is VERY important to use PPE when working with this stuff. I always use > gloves and ventilation and when sanding anything having an epoxy base, a > very good respirator. > > Sterling Brooks > Knot-2-Shabby Airport & Texas Longhorn Cattle Ranch > 5TA6 San Antonio Sectional > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Don Pearsall" > To: > Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" > > > > > Don, I have to echo your warnings to everyone. I built a KR-1 over 28 > years > > ago, then a KR-2. Both are built using epoxy as the resin for fiberglass > > cloth (more flexible than polyester.) During construction, I did not wear > > gloves at all, and often had my hands and arms dripping with the stuff. It > > even got into my hair. I sensitized my hands after the KR-1. Every time I > > was exposed to the epoxy, or even its fumes, it was like someone poured > > scalding water over my skin. My skin would just act exactly like it was > > badly burned, and hurt as bad too. Luckily, the sensitized areas were just > > my hands and arms, but not ALL areas. There were patches of my skin that > > were not affected. > > > > Needless to say, after the KR-2, I said bye-bye to building composite > > planes. > > > > To this day, many years later, I still get burned by just being near epoxy > > fumes. And I sure do not work with it. > > > > So I sympathize with you Don! I hope your face heals quickly. Did you go > to > > a Dr yet? Maybe there is something they can do to make it heal faster. > > > > Don Pearsall > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > > AlbertaIV@aol.com > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > > > I posted a few days back that I had another episode with West Epoxy. > Once > > a > > person becomes sensitized to epoxy, it is for life (that is per West > > Epoxy). > > A couple weeks ago, my Son wanted to fill a small crack on his boat and > I > > offered to help. He mixed it up while I watched close by. Even that > > close > > and it nailed me good. I have lost at least two layers of skin around my > > nose > > and mouth. Tonight, it had stopped peeling and starting to itch. I > gently > > > > rubbed my face to make it feel better and all of a sudden, I had two > > palmfuls > > of blood. There isn't enough skin left on my face to hold back the > blood. > > We've talked about MEK and other chemical we use and how bad they can > > be > > to an airplane builder. Trust me folks, you don't want to become > > sensitized > > to epoxy. West says that it will get worse and worse at each exposure. > > They are telling the truth. > > When you use this stuff, you better get into full dress with an > > external > > air source. I'm having a hard time understanding how they can even sell > > this stuff. > > BTW, I've used West Epoxy rarely on and off for years and it never > > bothered me until I built the Fox. I put out this warning tonight > because, > > quite > > frankly, I'm a bit worried this time. All you tough guys that might say, > > "stuff don't bother me". STAND-BY > > > > Don Smythe > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:41:34 AM PST US From: "hausding, sid" Subject: Kitfox-List: Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "hausding, sid" Don, My impertinence aside, I wonder how much fresh air you had moving over and through the work area you and your son were inside of? Just a thought that most of the posts miss the fact that all the composite and resin based manufacturers have for years posted warnings about fresh air........most anything that tingles the nose might be harmful in too large quantities or confined spaces. I have years of working with the West System(s), and other toxic chemicals in the composite build and repair fields (marine and aviation) and so far have not seen or experienced your unusual and serious reaction. Allergic reaction to the extreme? Although we must all be aware and keen to the possibility our bodies are changing with age, yours seems to be very unusual. Sorry to hear that, but then there are alternatives for us to use. Happy flying.........any news from the Dekester? Sid ----------------------- John, You've hit on something that I've been wondering about. Would switching to Polyester give any relief or do they both give the same results as far as burning your skin off? I still have to finish off my cowlings after the mod (waiting for warmer weather). Right now, it looks like I'll have to hire someone to do the work. Don Smythe Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:12:02 AM PST US From: "flier" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning not MEK --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "flier" Let's not drag MEK into this discussion as there's been a ton of discussions in the past in this forum about the true issues with MEK and the wives tales... --- Original Message --- From: "Sterling" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" > >A link to the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) for West resin. It mainly >suggests that skin contact is a problem. But check out MSDS for various >solvents (MEK, Acetone etc) to be best informed. > >http://www.westsystem.com/webpages/userinfo/safety/MS DS105.pdf >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Sterling" >To: >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > > >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" >> >> My father retired with an A&P as well as 5 type ratings in jets. He spent >a >> good deal of time around solvents, epoxy and other things typically found >in >> and around airplane hangers. He developed colon cancer two years ago and >it >> soon spread to this liver. A surgeon was able to cut out a tumor the size >of >> a golf ball out of his colon (and 1/3rd of the colon as well.) The liver >can >> only be addressed with chemotherapy. >> >> I took my dad to every visit to various oncologists. When he listed his >> occupation as a commercial pilot, the oncologist asked him if he had an >> exposure to solvents. >> >> Over the years my dad and I worked on various "garage" projects to include >> several cars I had in high school, an Avid Flyer I built back in the early >> 90s and recently, I recall how much we used solvents and worked around >epoxy >> (both in fiberglass work and in spraying...) Back in the early 1970s, he >> was given some left over epoxy paint that was used to paint the Saberliner >> jet he flew. We painted a Volkswagen with it. >> >> Long story made short, the compounds in MEK, Acetone and other solvents >and >> those found in epoxy cause cancer. >> >> West Epoxy isn't the culprit, any epoxy made by any company has similar >> compounds in it. >> >> It is VERY important to use PPE when working with this stuff. I always >use >> gloves and ventilation and when sanding anything having an epoxy base, a >> very good respirator. >> >> Sterling Brooks >> Knot-2-Shabby Airport & Texas Longhorn Cattle Ranch >> 5TA6 San Antonio Sectional >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Don Pearsall" >> To: >> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning >> >> >> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" >> >> > >> > Don, I have to echo your warnings to everyone. I built a KR-1 over 28 >> years >> > ago, then a KR-2. Both are built using epoxy as the resin for fiberglass >> > cloth (more flexible than polyester.) During construction, I did not >wear >> > gloves at all, and often had my hands and arms dripping with the stuff. >It >> > even got into my hair. I sensitized my hands after the KR-1. Every time >I >> > was exposed to the epoxy, or even its fumes, it was like someone poured >> > scalding water over my skin. My skin would just act exactly like it was >> > badly burned, and hurt as bad too. Luckily, the sensitized areas were >just >> > my hands and arms, but not ALL areas. There were patches of my skin that >> > were not affected. >> > >> > Needless to say, after the KR-2, I said bye-bye to building composite >> > planes. >> > >> > To this day, many years later, I still get burned by just being near >epoxy >> > fumes. And I sure do not work with it. >> > >> > So I sympathize with you Don! I hope your face heals quickly. Did you go >> to >> > a Dr yet? Maybe there is something they can do to make it heal faster. >> > >> > Don Pearsall >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com >> > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of >> > AlbertaIV@aol.com >> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com >> > Subject: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning >> > >> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com >> > >> > I posted a few days back that I had another episode with West Epoxy. >> Once >> > a >> > person becomes sensitized to epoxy, it is for life (that is per West >> > Epoxy). >> > A couple weeks ago, my Son wanted to fill a small crack on his boat >and >> I >> > offered to help. He mixed it up while I watched close by. Even that >> > close >> > and it nailed me good. I have lost at least two layers of skin around >my >> > nose >> > and mouth. Tonight, it had stopped peeling and starting to itch. I >> gently >> > >> > rubbed my face to make it feel better and all of a sudden, I had two >> > palmfuls >> > of blood. There isn't enough skin left on my face to hold back the >> blood. >> > We've talked about MEK and other chemical we use and how bad they >can >> > be >> > to an airplane builder. Trust me folks, you don't want to become >> > sensitized >> > to epoxy. West says that it will get worse and worse at each exposure. >> > They are telling the truth. >> > When you use this stuff, you better get into full dress with an >> > external >> > air source. I'm having a hard time understanding how they can even >sell >> > this stuff. >> > BTW, I've used West Epoxy rarely on and off for years and it never >> > bothered me until I built the Fox. I put out this warning tonight >> because, >> > quite >> > frankly, I'm a bit worried this time. All you tough guys that might >say, >> > "stuff don't bother me". STAND-BY >> > >> > Don Smythe >> > >> > >> >> > > >_- ====================================================== =============== Contributions any other Forums. >_- ====================================================== =============== http://www.matronics.com/subscription http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm http://www.matronics.com/browse/kitfox-list http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list http://www.matronics.com/archives http://www.matronics.com/photoshare list http://www.matronics.com/emaillists http://www.matronics.com/contribution >_- ====================================================== =============== > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:20:39 AM PST US From: AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com In a message dated 3/18/2005 8:42:17 AM Eastern Standard Time, sidh@charter.net writes: I have years of working with the West System(s), and other toxic chemicals in the composite build and repair fields (marine and aviation) and so far have not seen or experienced your unusual and serious reaction. Allergic reaction to the extreme? Sid, I've used it all my life too but not to a large degree. When this thing first hit me (about half way through the Kitfox build) I was on the phone with the West people. Basically, you can use this stuff all your life and then overnight, you can become "sensitized" (their quote). Once this happens, you will forever get the reaction (their quote). Also, the reaction will worsen at each attack (their quote). I say "quote", but it's been several years and this is about what they said. Every thing they told me has come true right down to the worsen part. On my last trip to the Doctor, he said that the skin reaction was more of a pain and suffering thing but not too much to worry about. However, sanding epoxy dust could be a killer. In other words, he was more concerned about the sanding portion than the mixing of the chemicals. Oh, we were in the back yard completely outside and I kept an arms length away from the mixed material. Don Smythe Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:22:51 AM PST US From: "Napier, Mark" Subject: Kitfox-List: Gas Gauge Balls --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Napier, Mark" Hey Charles, I'm also posting this to the kitfox list in case your email is still down. This is the info I have on the little red balls that will float in gasoline: Fletcher Aviation 800-FA-WINGS 800-329-4647 Contact: John AA1 Fuel Balls 401129-5 F113 $3.88 each. I bought a couple but haven't made the sight gauges using them yet. They are 1/4" in diameter, painted florescent red, and appear to be made out of sealed cork. They are also PMA'ed parts for whatever that's worth. I'm planning on using 5/8" ID clear tubing with these but not sure what material would be best. FWIW, Mark Napier - - - - - - - Appended by Scientific-Atlanta, Inc. - - - - - - - This e-mail and any attachments may contain information which is confidential, proprietary, privileged or otherwise protected by law. The information is solely intended for the named addressee (or a person responsible for delivering it to the addressee). If you are not the intended recipient of this message, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy or disseminate this message or any part of it. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete it from your computer. ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 06:27:08 AM PST US From: "Dee Young" Subject: Kitfox-List: EAA Chapter 517 --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dee Young" EAA Chapter is having a Sweepstakes for a great looking plane. Its a Kitfox Model V with an 0-240. The money is going to be used to pay for the EAA hanger located in Stevensville, Montana. Go to this site and you can check it out. http://www.eaa517.org/Sweepstake.htm Thought you guys would be interested Dee Young Model II N345DY Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 06:49:50 AM PST US From: Steve Zakreski Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Steve Zakreski Over the years of this list we have had several warnings about the bad things these substances do to you, but nobody ever really pointed out specifically what kind of things they can do. Gosh, had I known what I have just learned, I would have been more careful. In fact, I would probably have avoided some of the substances altogether. Thanks guys. It takes these specific examples to drive the message home. We need to revisit these recent stories every 6 months or so. Don, keep us informed on how you are progressing, first, because we care about how you are doing, and second, it is a very powerful way of driving the message to the rest of us what these substances can do. Damn. SteveZ Calgary -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" My father retired with an A&P as well as 5 type ratings in jets. He spent a good deal of time around solvents, epoxy and other things typically found in and around airplane hangers. He developed colon cancer two years ago and it soon spread to this liver. A surgeon was able to cut out a tumor the size of a golf ball out of his colon (and 1/3rd of the colon as well.) The liver can only be addressed with chemotherapy. I took my dad to every visit to various oncologists. When he listed his occupation as a commercial pilot, the oncologist asked him if he had an exposure to solvents. Over the years my dad and I worked on various "garage" projects to include several cars I had in high school, an Avid Flyer I built back in the early 90s and recently, I recall how much we used solvents and worked around epoxy (both in fiberglass work and in spraying...) Back in the early 1970s, he was given some left over epoxy paint that was used to paint the Saberliner jet he flew. We painted a Volkswagen with it. Long story made short, the compounds in MEK, Acetone and other solvents and those found in epoxy cause cancer. West Epoxy isn't the culprit, any epoxy made by any company has similar compounds in it. It is VERY important to use PPE when working with this stuff. I always use gloves and ventilation and when sanding anything having an epoxy base, a very good respirator. Sterling Brooks Knot-2-Shabby Airport & Texas Longhorn Cattle Ranch 5TA6 San Antonio Sectional ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Pearsall" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" > > Don, I have to echo your warnings to everyone. I built a KR-1 over 28 years > ago, then a KR-2. Both are built using epoxy as the resin for fiberglass > cloth (more flexible than polyester.) During construction, I did not wear > gloves at all, and often had my hands and arms dripping with the stuff. It > even got into my hair. I sensitized my hands after the KR-1. Every time I > was exposed to the epoxy, or even its fumes, it was like someone poured > scalding water over my skin. My skin would just act exactly like it was > badly burned, and hurt as bad too. Luckily, the sensitized areas were just > my hands and arms, but not ALL areas. There were patches of my skin that > were not affected. > > Needless to say, after the KR-2, I said bye-bye to building composite > planes. > > To this day, many years later, I still get burned by just being near epoxy > fumes. And I sure do not work with it. > > So I sympathize with you Don! I hope your face heals quickly. Did you go to > a Dr yet? Maybe there is something they can do to make it heal faster. > > Don Pearsall > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > AlbertaIV@aol.com > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > I posted a few days back that I had another episode with West Epoxy. Once > a > person becomes sensitized to epoxy, it is for life (that is per West > Epoxy). > A couple weeks ago, my Son wanted to fill a small crack on his boat and I > offered to help. He mixed it up while I watched close by. Even that > close > and it nailed me good. I have lost at least two layers of skin around my > nose > and mouth. Tonight, it had stopped peeling and starting to itch. I gently > > rubbed my face to make it feel better and all of a sudden, I had two > palmfuls > of blood. There isn't enough skin left on my face to hold back the blood. > We've talked about MEK and other chemical we use and how bad they can > be > to an airplane builder. Trust me folks, you don't want to become > sensitized > to epoxy. West says that it will get worse and worse at each exposure. > They are telling the truth. > When you use this stuff, you better get into full dress with an > external > air source. I'm having a hard time understanding how they can even sell > this stuff. > BTW, I've used West Epoxy rarely on and off for years and it never > bothered me until I built the Fox. I put out this warning tonight because, > quite > frankly, I'm a bit worried this time. All you tough guys that might say, > "stuff don't bother me". STAND-BY > > Don Smythe > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 07:34:03 AM PST US From: "Randy Daughenbaugh" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh" Don, I haven't seen this yet, so am putting out my understanding of this problem. Yes, it is an allergic reaction. Once you are sensitized to it, it only gets worse. People don't react to poison ivy until they get sensitized to it (several exposures) and then they are sensitive to it for life. Another point. It is likely not the epoxy, but rather the catalyst in it that is the problem. These are amines. Don't make the mistake of thinking that you can use other epoxys instead of West Systems. It is likely that the others use the same catalyst systems. Get well soon. Randy . -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com In a message dated 3/18/2005 8:42:17 AM Eastern Standard Time, sidh@charter.net writes: I have years of working with the West System(s), and other toxic chemicals in the composite build and repair fields (marine and aviation) and so far have not seen or experienced your unusual and serious reaction. Allergic reaction to the extreme? Sid, I've used it all my life too but not to a large degree. When this thing first hit me (about half way through the Kitfox build) I was on the phone with the West people. Basically, you can use this stuff all your life and then overnight, you can become "sensitized" (their quote). Once this happens, you will forever get the reaction (their quote). Also, the reaction will worsen at each attack (their quote). I say "quote", but it's been several years and this is about what they said. Every thing they told me has come true right down to the worsen part. On my last trip to the Doctor, he said that the skin reaction was more of a pain and suffering thing but not too much to worry about. However, sanding epoxy dust could be a killer. In other words, he was more concerned about the sanding portion than the mixing of the chemicals. Oh, we were in the back yard completely outside and I kept an arms length away from the mixed material. Don Smythe Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 07:51:28 AM PST US From: AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com In a message dated 3/18/2005 10:35:08 AM Eastern Standard Time, rjdaugh@rapidnet.com writes: Another point. It is likely not the epoxy, but rather the catalyst in it that is the problem. These are amines. Don't make the mistake of thinking that you can use other epoxys instead of West Systems. It is likely that Don't want to make this thread too long but, I'm pretty sure that part A or part B of Epoxy won't bother me until they are mixed together. BTW, I should drop using the name West, I have tried several other types of epoxy (PC-7, Epoxy Plumbers Putty, etc.). They all kick my rear end. Do Not Archive Don Smythe ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 08:22:43 AM PST US From: Aerobatics@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Warning Well Said --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Aerobatics@aol.com I am in the radio control hobby business and all epoxies are bad... some worse than others... Lastly, the habit of heating to thin the epoxy is particularly bad. The faster curing epoxies are worse... the older formulas are worse...and there is no such thing as a "safe epoxy" just less bad..... These epoxies are hydroscopic, and when they do absorb some moisture, it dramatically effects the cure and strength. I carefully warm in a microwave. resin and hardener separately ....... this heat will release the water and renew the product. Again warm it not hot and in a very well ventilated room... I have a microwave in my garage and leave door open and leave the room.... PS 10 seconds really warms it fast! :-) Dave ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 09:17:27 AM PST US From: "Gary Algate" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Warning Well Said --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Gary Algate" I also used to build large scale RC models and experimented with epoxies. On one occasion I found that I could reduce 5 Min Epoxy with Methanol which made a great fuel proofing coating for fuel and engine bays. As I was sloshing it around with a brush I started to become incredibly itchy and then started having problems breathing. I ended up in hospital overnight having injections of Anti histamines. Evidently the vapors that I had inadvertently produced set up an allergic reaction that was quite dangerous. GaryA Lite2/582 These epoxies are hydroscopic, and when they do absorb some moisture, it dramatically effects the cure and strength. I carefully warm in a microwave. resin and hardener separately ....... this heat will release the water and renew the product. Again warm it not hot and in a very well ventilated room... I have a microwave in my garage and leave door open and leave the room.... PS 10 seconds really warms it fast! :-) ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 10:10:50 AM PST US From: "Bob Robertson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Robertson" Don, You are surely not alone with your epoxy alergies. For three years my hands looked like hamburger because no one knew about expoy alergies in the 70's. I finished KR-1 without the aid of a resperator or other protection. I wish you the best of luck... I'm sure your Dr will be able to sort you out. regards and good luck Bob Robertson ----- Original Message ----- From: Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com > > > In a message dated 3/18/2005 2:46:36 AM Eastern Standard Time, > donpearsall@comcast.net writes: > > > So I sympathize with you Don! I hope your face heals quickly. Did you go to > a Dr yet? Maybe there is something they can do to make it heal faster. > > Don Pearsall > > > Well, it's 3:00 AM and sitting here looking at this stupid computer because > sleeping is out of the question. Will go to the Doc when the sun comes up. > > Do Not Archive > Don Smythe > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 10:22:34 AM PST US From: "John Perry" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Perry" Don in your condition i would not mess with any of it at all .let someone else do the work. It isnt worth your life and health . As far as I know it is all bad it does not matter what brand or company or type DO NOT GET IT ON YOU OR BREATH THE VAPORS. I would gladly volunteer to help you on your project just to keep you form breathing any more of this stuff , or absorbing it into your skin just from being around it . John Perry -------Original Message------- From: AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com In a message dated 3/18/2005 3:56:33 AM Eastern Standard Time, eskflyer@pld.com writes: airplanes . Big ones that is . we used many 55 gallon drums of polyester and epoxy over the years and did not use resperators or any type of skin protection . I am paying for it John, You've hit on something that I've been wondering about. Would switching to Polyester give any relief or do they both give the same results as far as burning your skin off? I still have to finish off my cowlings after the mod (waiting for warmer weather). Right now, it looks like I'll have to hire someone to do the work. Don Smythe Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 10:27:28 AM PST US From: Aerobatics@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning ............ Polyester --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Aerobatics@aol.com Need to look as the MSDS info on these products and talk to manufacturer.... However.... My understanding is Polyester is not as bad..... except that the catalist is very dangerious..... Dave Patrick ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 10:55:57 AM PST US From: AlbertaIV@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com In a message dated 3/18/2005 1:23:19 PM Eastern Standard Time, eskflyer@pld.com writes: I would gladly volunteer to help you on your project just to keep you form breathing any more of this stuff , or absorbing it into your skin just from being around it . John, I could never dream of asking anyone to help me finish off the radiator and engine cowl mods. On the other hand, what time is your plane arriving? Do Not Archive Don Smythe ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 11:12:29 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning From: Lynn Matteson --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson What is PPE? I'm guessing a personal respirator of some sort? I use a dual filter face mask (for organic vapors) and plenty of ventilation...exhaust fan on, door open, whenever I am using MEK, Hysol, any of the Polyfiber chems., epoxies, and the worst one of them all for me is cyanoacrylate (CA) glue. I used to use this quite often during my recent modeling years, and that stuff used to kick butt....MINE. Lynn On Friday, March 18, 2005, at 07:59 AM, Sterling wrote: > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" > > It is VERY important to use PPE when working with this stuff. I > always use > gloves and ventilation and when sanding anything having an epoxy base, > a > very good respirator. ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 11:32:49 AM PST US From: "FREDERICKSON, JOHN L [AG/2067]" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "FREDERICKSON, JOHN L [AG/2067]" PPE is Personal Protection Equipment, such as gloves, apron, safety glasses, respirator, whatever the MDSS says. This is a Material Data Safety Sheet. ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 03:05:53 PM PST US From: "Rex & Jan Shaw" Subject: Kitfox-List: Dumb idea --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" I did not mean to imply spraying any liquid "into" the rear part of the > engine or any other part of the engine. The test I was referring to simply > will > enrich the air around the engine with a more combustible material. Any > suction of the engine due to a leak should pull this enriched air into the > case > and cause an increase of RPM. The spray should not be directed into an > opening of the engine in a concentrated form but, sprayed in the area so it > will > mix with the surronding air. > On the other hand, forget it. It's probably a dumb a_ _ idea anyway Don, your idea is not dumb. It may have problems under various circumstances but so have most ideas. The important thing is you tried to help. Your idea is commonly used in auto repair shops. Rex. PS I hope your sensitivity to West Epoxy problem improves real soon. rexjan@bigpond.com ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 03:08:04 PM PST US From: "Rex & Jan Shaw" Subject: Kitfox-List: Dunking engine in water --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" As an A&P I would never consider dunking any engine in water Well OK I have no problem with it though as the engine is pressurised and no water is going to get in. Further we ran our Kart engines a lot lot harder than any aircraft engine. Perhaps you would feel happier dunking it in kerosene. Any way it's only a suggestion. I could come up with more problems re using engine starting fluid etc around the seals while the motor is running. Rex. rexjan@bigpond.com ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 04:12:26 PM PST US From: Mdkitfox@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Mdkitfox@aol.com Don, Good grief! I never realized that just being in the area of this stuff could cause the problems you are experiencing. Thanks for the warning! Sure hope you went to the Doctor and are on the fast track to healing! Hang in there buddy! Rick Weiss Series V Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 06:44:13 PM PST US From: Subject: Kitfox-List: Attn: Charles Cook --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Charles, I have been trying to contact you via email but it keeps getting kicked back. I live just down the road from you between Palmetto and Newnan off of 29. I am just now covering a classic IV I bought from an estate. Brett Walmsley ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 07:26:56 PM PST US From: "Cudnohufsky's" <7suds@chartermi.net> Subject: Kitfox-List: Model 5 Rudder --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Cudnohufsky's" <7suds@chartermi.net> List, Help please, I am working on rebuilding a Model 5 - 1550 gross Kitfox, I removed all covering and replaced some damaged tubing in the rear and am now replacing the vertical stab formers and fiberglass vertical rudder fairing, my question is this, should the fiberglass fairing at the rear of the vertical lay tight against the rear post of the vertical all the way down or close at the top and farther away as it goes down? The 3 hinge posts each protrude farther out as you go down the fin. I have a new construction manual from skystar but it does not say specifically what the orientation of the fiberglass fairing should be in reference to the rear stab post. If it is supposed to taper away does anyone know why? Thanks Lloyd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Cooper" Subject: Kitfox-List: UMA Tachoometers? > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" > > I've read recently that the UMA Tachometer is a pretty good instrument. > Does > anyone have any experience with these? > > Steve > > > ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 07:41:43 PM PST US From: "Sterling" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" Sorry... Personal Protective Equipment. I bought a set of chemical gloves and use them everytime I work around MEK, Acetone, Naptha and the other stuff that we typically use. I got my gloves from an Army Surplus Store and they are double lined. I have to admit I'm bad at using the respirator. I wear glasses and the respirator doesn't seal off too well with the glasses, but I make certain I have a fan on blowing fresh air my way. Sterling Brooks (former Avid builder and producer of the Avid Marketing Videotapes) Knot-2-Shabby Airport & Texas Longhorn Cattle Ranch ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lynn Matteson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: West Epoxy System Warning > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson > > What is PPE? I'm guessing a personal respirator of some sort? > > I use a dual filter face mask (for organic vapors) and plenty of > ventilation...exhaust fan on, door open, whenever I am using MEK, > Hysol, any of the Polyfiber chems., epoxies, and the worst one of them > all for me is cyanoacrylate (CA) glue. I used to use this quite often > during my recent modeling years, and that stuff used to kick > butt....MINE. > > Lynn > > On Friday, March 18, 2005, at 07:59 AM, Sterling wrote: > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Sterling" > > > > It is VERY important to use PPE when working with this stuff. I > > always use > > gloves and ventilation and when sanding anything having an epoxy base, > > a > > very good respirator. > >