Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:23 AM - Re: Realistic Speed (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
2. 04:27 AM - Re: magneto tach? (Fox5flyer)
3. 04:42 AM - Loose Fuel tank fabric (Fox5flyer)
4. 06:03 AM - RK400 clutch $375 Re: RK400 clutch (Harris, Robert)
5. 06:45 AM - Re: magneto tach? (Fred Shiple)
6. 06:55 AM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (Lowell Fitt)
7. 08:18 AM - Sold-RK400 clutch (Harris, Robert)
8. 08:21 AM - Re: Realistic Speed (kerrjohna@comcast.net)
9. 08:33 AM - Re: Anybody in Utah? (kerrjohna@comcast.net)
10. 08:50 AM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
11. 08:59 AM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (AlbertaIV@aol.com)
12. 10:31 AM - Re: Anybody in Utah? (Steve Cooper)
13. 10:44 AM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (Chenoweth)
14. 10:58 AM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (flier)
15. 11:54 AM - Re: Props (joakley@ida.net)
16. 01:50 PM - Another 5 coming alive. (Flybradair@cs.com)
17. 02:13 PM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (Fox5flyer)
18. 02:18 PM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (Fox5flyer)
19. 02:20 PM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (Fox5flyer)
20. 02:22 PM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (Fox5flyer)
21. 02:23 PM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (Steve Cooper)
22. 02:24 PM - Re: Anybody in Utah? (Steve Cooper)
23. 02:28 PM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (Lowell Fitt)
24. 02:37 PM - Re: Anybody in Utah? (kerrjohna@comcast.net)
25. 02:47 PM - Re: Another 5 coming alive. (Don Pearsall)
26. 02:55 PM - Re: CHT Probe (Donna and Roger McConnell)
27. 04:35 PM - Re: Another 5 coming alive. (Ed Akerstrom)
28. 06:40 PM - Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric (Rick)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Realistic Speed |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 4/20/2005 6:42:17 AM Eastern Standard Time,
jimshumaker@sbcglobal.net writes:
Graeme,
Don is, of course, correct. Also, is there any restriction against cruising
at redline? or is it just temperature restricted.
Jim Shumaker
I've seen it written (I believe in my Rotax manual) Max RPM's for Max 1
minute. So , based that one statement, I'd be a little concerned with cruising
at 6800.
Don Smythe
Classic IV w/ 582
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: magneto tach? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Possibly use a Tiny Tach?
Deke
> I've heard my new babies' first cry, it is the sound of a VW pinned on the
> kitfox. Now it dawns on me that I may have a hard time getting a tach on
the
> engine. Does anyone know of a magneto operated tach? I have a slick 4316 I
> think it is. Thanx in advance Ron.
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
After a recent cross country when parking the airplane I noticed what appeared
to be loose fabric on the rear half of the left wing tank of my S5. Upon close
inspection I found that it was indeed loose in an area about 12"X10". It was
a cool morning flight in the low 40s [very nice I might add]. I parked the airplane
in the hangar and when I returned about 4 hours later for a closer look
the fabric was tight again and everything appeared fine. Assuming I wasn't hallucinating,
something has happened here and I'm a little concerned that it will
reoccur and probably get worse.
I seem to recall some dialog on this subject, but can't remember what the best
technique was for a permanent repair. I'm not real excited about having to remove
the wing.
Anybody have any input on this?
The airplane has about 300 hours over 4 years and is painted with Polytone Tennessee
Red, if that matters.
Deke
Message 4
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
I'm selling a brand new RK400 clutch for $375. I paid $475 for it from
California Power Supply. I'm selling it because I bought a plane with a
Continental 0200 and will not need it. This RK400 is new in the box and has
never been opened. By the way my old ROTAX 582 and C Drive had a RK400
clutch installed and it worked great. Your Idle can be set to 1,000 RPM and
the engine will not vibrate at all. The prop engages at 2,500 RPM and is
very smooth. The RK400's have been well tested and are also used on AIR
BOATS with very large props and much abuse with thousands of hours without
maintenance and they have not had any problems. But even if there was a
mechanical failure with the clutch the worst that would happen would be that
your propeller would work just like any other plane without a clutch. I
highly recommend the clutch and wish this was an option to other
powerplants. You will not be disappointed. By the way it is very easy to
install.
Robert
Call or e-mail if you have questions
Robert_harris@intuit.com
Cell phone 760-415-1810
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Graeme Toft
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: RK400 clutch
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" <msm@byterocky.net>
HI Rex, this sounds good. I have been following it with interest for the
last few days. Keep me posted if you get a result.
Graeme
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: RK400 clutch
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
>
>> is there an RK400 and an RC400 clutch? do these only work with C-boxes
>> and not E-boxes?
>
> The number is RK400 and the clutch comes from California Power Systems at
> a
> cost of $475. Look up their catalogue online. In this they strictly claim
> it
> is for "C" gearbox's only.
> About 6 months ago I contacted them as I have an "E" box [ 3 to 1 ratio ]
> and their first response was that it was no good for an "E" box as the
> electric starter would not work. They were assuming that the starter was
> mounted on the box but in my case the starter is at the rear of the motor
> so
> I advised them this was not an issue. They then told me that in that case
> they couldn't see why it would not work with the "E" box as all the parts
> were the same. However they had not tried it and therefore if I chose to
> do
> so it would be at my risk. Personally I now feel it would fit and work but
> wonder if there is some issue with moment of momentum ratings or such and
> if
> that is a practical problem in my case. I have an IVO 3 blade composite
> ground adjustable prop on a 582. Now if this is OK on a "C" box and one
> can
> use the clutch in that case I fail to see why it won't work on the "E" box
> considering all the gearbox parts are reported to be the same. Never the
> less at this point in time I haven't done it but probably will in the
> future
> if I don't come across some reason why not.
> Incidentally I saw a comment that these clutches are a modified Volvo
> part
> but know no more than that or if it is correct.
>
> Rex.
>
> rexjan@bigpond.com
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: magneto tach? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Fred Shiple <fredshiple@sbcglobal.net>
I'm using a Tiny Tach on my 912S (until I get the motor's sending unit fixed).
The Tiny Tach works well, installs easily, and is available from Aircraft Spruce.
You may need to talk to the manufacturer about the proper model to use (it
reads the induction current off your spark plug). I got the manufacturer's phone
number by googling Tiny Tach.
Fred
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Deke, I notice this on my Mod IV on cold mornings especially when it is out
overnight. I get a little puckering between the fuel filler neck and the
second rib. When building - it seems a long time ago - it was advised not
to glue the fabric to the tank tops and I did some real tinkering to avoid
it. The argument was that the tank wouldn't touch the fabric uniformly and
where it did touch it would leave a line at the edge of contact so in the
finish paint there would be a marble effect ( I had seen it on other
Kitfoxes). I don't have the marble effect, but I do have the cold weather
pucker - so to speak.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>
> After a recent cross country when parking the airplane I noticed what
> appeared to be loose fabric on the rear half of the left wing tank of my
> S5. Upon close inspection I found that it was indeed loose in an area
> about 12"X10". It was a cool morning flight in the low 40s [very nice I
> might add]. I parked the airplane in the hangar and when I returned about
> 4 hours later for a closer look the fabric was tight again and everything
> appeared fine. Assuming I wasn't hallucinating, something has happened
> here and I'm a little concerned that it will reoccur and probably get
> worse.
>
> I seem to recall some dialog on this subject, but can't remember what the
> best technique was for a permanent repair. I'm not real excited about
> having to remove the wing.
>
> Anybody have any input on this?
>
> The airplane has about 300 hours over 4 years and is painted with Polytone
> Tennessee Red, if that matters.
>
> Deke
>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Sold-RK400 clutch |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
The RK400 clutch only adds 4lbs of installed weight and I believe it reduces
torsional vibration better than the factory rubber donut. By the way I
already sold the one I had but recommend getting one even if you have to pay
full price.
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Harris, Robert
Subject: RK400 clutch $375 RE: Kitfox-List: RK400 clutch
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert"
<Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
I'm selling a brand new RK400 clutch for $375. I paid $475 for it from
California Power Supply. I'm selling it because I bought a plane with a
Continental 0200 and will not need it. This RK400 is new in the box and has
never been opened. By the way my old ROTAX 582 and C Drive had a RK400
clutch installed and it worked great. Your Idle can be set to 1,000 RPM and
the engine will not vibrate at all. The prop engages at 2,500 RPM and is
very smooth. The RK400's have been well tested and are also used on AIR
BOATS with very large props and much abuse with thousands of hours without
maintenance and they have not had any problems. But even if there was a
mechanical failure with the clutch the worst that would happen would be that
your propeller would work just like any other plane without a clutch. I
highly recommend the clutch and wish this was an option to other
powerplants. You will not be disappointed. By the way it is very easy to
install.
Robert
Call or e-mail if you have questions
Robert_harris@intuit.com
Cell phone 760-415-1810
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Graeme Toft
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: RK400 clutch
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" <msm@byterocky.net>
HI Rex, this sounds good. I have been following it with interest for the
last few days. Keep me posted if you get a result.
Graeme
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: RK400 clutch
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" <rexjan@bigpond.com>
>
>> is there an RK400 and an RC400 clutch? do these only work with C-boxes
>> and not E-boxes?
>
> The number is RK400 and the clutch comes from California Power Systems at
> a
> cost of $475. Look up their catalogue online. In this they strictly claim
> it
> is for "C" gearbox's only.
> About 6 months ago I contacted them as I have an "E" box [ 3 to 1 ratio ]
> and their first response was that it was no good for an "E" box as the
> electric starter would not work. They were assuming that the starter was
> mounted on the box but in my case the starter is at the rear of the motor
> so
> I advised them this was not an issue. They then told me that in that case
> they couldn't see why it would not work with the "E" box as all the parts
> were the same. However they had not tried it and therefore if I chose to
> do
> so it would be at my risk. Personally I now feel it would fit and work but
> wonder if there is some issue with moment of momentum ratings or such and
> if
> that is a practical problem in my case. I have an IVO 3 blade composite
> ground adjustable prop on a 582. Now if this is OK on a "C" box and one
> can
> use the clutch in that case I fail to see why it won't work on the "E" box
> considering all the gearbox parts are reported to be the same. Never the
> less at this point in time I haven't done it but probably will in the
> future
> if I don't come across some reason why not.
> Incidentally I saw a comment that these clutches are a modified Volvo
> part
> but know no more than that or if it is correct.
>
> Rex.
>
> rexjan@bigpond.com
>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Realistic Speed |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kerrjohna@comcast.net
If memory serves, the manual had an offset measurement from the leading edge spar
an a diagram to set the flaperon at neutral. I am not where I can check what
that is but others may have it at their finger tips
-------------- Original message --------------
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft"
>
> Thanks Jerry, I'll make the adjustments this week end and post the results
> on the list. Should be an interesting exercise. I measured the flapperon
> deflection last night and I believe it is out of wack by about 11/2". Thanks
> for the description of the adjustment process.
>
> Cheers
> Graeme
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jerry Liles"
> To:
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Realistic Speed
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles
> >
> > The adjustment is at the mixer bellcrank behind the seat. There are two
> > rods from the end of the flap handle bellcrank located above the mixer
> > bellcrank that extend to the ends of the flapperon cranks in the center
> > of the mixer bellcrank. There are rod ends on either end of these rods
> > to allow you to adjust the length. I don't have the diagram or airplane
> > in front of me so I'm not certain whether you need to lengthen or
> > shorten to raise the flapperons but it should be apparent after a bit of
> > study. Moving the flap handle while observing should make it clear.
> > Make certain you do both sides the same amount other wise the stick will
> > not center side to side in level flight. There should be enough
> > adjustment to allow the airplane to be trimmed for level flight with the
> > flap handle.
> >
> > Jerry Liles
> >
> > Graeme Toft wrote:
> >
> >>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft"
> >>
> >>Thanks Jerry, any idea on where the adjustment point is to correct the
> >>flapperons. I only have the assembly manual and as it has been photo
> >>copied
> >>over and over again the pictures are just a black mess.
> >>
> >>Graeme
> >>----- Original Message -----
> >>From: "Jerry Liles"
> >>To:
> >>Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Realistic Speed
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles
> >>>
> >>>On the Model I the flapperons are the trim. If you cannot trim for
> >>>level flight with the flapperons they need adjusting. If they are
> >>>deployed, even a bit, and it sounds like they are, it will increase lift
> >>>and therefore increase induced drag. Check the tach and adjust the
> >>>flapperons. You should be able to fly hands off if the airplane is
> >>>properly rigged. You may also be able to use a prop with a bit more
> >>>pitch to improve cruise.
> >>>
> >>>Jerry Liles
> >>>
> >>>Graeme Toft wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft"
> >>>>
> >>>>Thanks for the comments Jerry. I suppose what triggered my initial email
> >>>>is
> >>>>the reports of speed achieved by similar models to my own. I fly with a
> >>>>group of aircraft and as you have rightly mentioned the low speed
> >>>>characteristics of the model 1 are great and Im certainly not
> >>>>complianing
> >>>>about this, but another 5 - 8 knots would allow me to keep up with the
> >>>>tribe. I have compared speed with a number of other aircraft and my
> >>>>airspeed
> >>>>indicator is reasonably accurate. The tacho is an area I havent
> >>>>investigated
> >>>>at length but I believe there is some error there. I may have some
> >>>>issues
> >>>>with the flapperons hanging a bit low on the trailing edge. This is
> >>>>being
> >>>>offset by using elevator to hold the nose up. Not a lot of pressure
> >>>>required
> >>>>but enough between flapperons down and elevators up to give some induced
> >>>>drag possibly. Any further comments would be appreciated.
> >>>>
> >>>>Cheers
> >>>>Graeme
> >>>>----- Original Message -----
> >>>>From: "Jerry Liles"
> >>>>To:
> >>>>Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Realistic Speed
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Graeme
> >>>>>I think 65 kts is not too bad for a Model I. It actually isn't bad for
> >>>>>later versions with the 582. What you need to do is confirm the
> >>>>>accuracy of your ASI. Many homebuilts have an ASI that is useful as a
> >>>>>rate indicator but isn't otherwise terribly accurate, being
> >>>>>terrifically
> >>>>>optimistic or pessimistic. I usually just ignore reports of airspeed
> >>>>>unless I know the speeds have been properly confirmed. You also need
> >>>>>to
> >>>>>confirm the accuracy of your Tach. Many, if not most, Tachs used in
> >>>>>these airplanes are even less accurate, often being off by several
> >>>>>hundred rpm. The Westach on Tootie Mae reads 250 to 300 rpm high when
> >>>>>indicating 5800rpm. I use an optical tach to find prop rpm and have a
> >>>>>chart to convert to engine rpms and use that to determine cruise and
> >>>>>max
> >>>>>rpms on the tach. So, as you can see, if your ASI reads low and your
> >>>>>tach reads high you won't see the speeds you have or get all the
> >>>>>performance you can. By the way, the Model I is not particularly
> >>>>>speedy, but it is a blast for short field and low and slow sight seeing
> >>>>>with the doors open. If it hasn't been built too heavy, almost nothing
> >>>>>else can touch it for STOL and slow flight. Finally a different prop
> >>>>>may well improve cruise speed at the expense of STOL performance.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Jerry Liles
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Graeme Toft wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft"
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Hi guys, for some time I have read about the speeds that those of you
> >>>>>>with
> >>>>>>582's are getting from their early models and am wondering what I can
> >>>>>>do
> >>>>>>to my model 1 to achieve similar results. I am flat out getting 65
> >>>>>>knots
> >>>>>>ground speed at 5800 rpm and have faired everything but the wheels.
> >>>>>>I'm
> >>>>>>not after miracles but is 75 knots achievable with some further
> >>>>>>tinkering
> >>>>>>and if so where do I begin
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Graeme
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>-----------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>Scanned by Bayou Internet for all known viruses.
> >>>>>>http://www.bayou.com
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>-----------------------------------------------
> >>Scanned by Bayou Internet for all known viruses.
> >>http://www.bayou.com
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
If memory serves, the manual had an offset measurement from the leading edge spar
an a diagramto set the flaperon at neutral. I am not where I can check what
that is but others may have it at their finger tips
-------------- Original message --------------
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" <MSM@BYTEROCKY.NET>
Thanks Jerry, I'll make the adjustments this week end and post the results
on the list. Should be an interesting exercise. I measured the flapperon
deflection last night and I believe it is out of wack by about 11/2". Thanks
for the description of the adjustment process.
Cheers
Graeme
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerry Liles" <WLILES@BAYOU.COM>
To: <KITFOX-LIST@MATRONICS.COM>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Realistic Speed
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles <WLILES@BAYOU.COM>
The adjustment is at the mixer bellcrank behind the seat. There are two
rods from the end of th
e flap handle bellcrank located above the mixer
bellcrank that extend to the ends of the flapperon cranks in the center
of the mixer bellcrank. There are rod ends on either end of these rods
to allow you to adjust the length. I don't have the diagram or airplane
in front of me so I'm not certain whether you need to lengthen or
shorten to raise the flapperons but it should be apparent after a bit of
study. Moving the flap handle while observing should make it clear.
Make certain you do both sides the same amount other wise the stick will
not center side to side in level flight. There should be enough
adjustment to allow the airplane to be trimmed for level flight with the
flap handle.
Jerry Liles
Graeme Toft wrote:
-- Kitfox-List message posted by:
"Graeme Toft" <MSM@BYTEROCKY.NET>
Thanks Jerry, any idea on where the adjustment point is to correct the
flapperons. I only have the assembly manual and as it has been photo
copied
over and over again the pictures are just a black mess.
Graeme
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerry Liles" <WLILES@BAYOU.COM>
To: <KITFOX-LIST@MATRONICS.COM>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Realistic Speed
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles <WLILES@BAYOU.COM>
On the Model I the flapperons are the trim. If you cannot trim for
level flight with the flapperons they need adjusting. If they are
deployed, even a bit, and it sounds li
ke they are, it will increase lift
and therefore increase induced drag. Check the tach and adjust the
flapperons. You should be able to fly hands off if the airplane is
properly rigged. You may also be able to use a prop with a bit more
pitch to improve cruise.
Jerry Liles
Graeme Toft wrote:
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" <MSM@BYTEROCKY.NET>
Thanks for the comments Jerry. I suppose what triggered my initial email
is
the reports of speed achieved by similar models to my own. I fly with a
group of aircraft and as you have rightly mentioned the low speed
>
;characteristics of the model 1 are great and Im certainly not
complianing
about this, but another 5 - 8 knots would allow me to keep up with the
tribe. I have compared speed with a number of other aircraft and my
airspeed
indicator is reasonably accurate. The tacho is an area I havent
investigated
at length but I believe there is some error there. I may have some
issues
with the flapperons hanging a bit low on the trailing edge. This is
being
offset by using elevator to hold the nose up. Not a lot of pressure
required
but enough between flapperons down and elevators up to give some induced
drag possibly. Any further comments would
be appreciated.
Cheers
Graeme
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerry Liles" <WLILES@BAYOU.COM>
To: <KITFOX-LIST@MATRONICS.COM>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Realistic Speed
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles <WLILES@BAYOU.COM>
Graeme
I think 65 kts is not too bad for a Model I. It actually isn't bad for
later versions with the 582. What you need to do is confirm the
accuracy of your ASI. Many homebuilts have an ASI that is useful as a
ra
te indicator but isn't otherwise terribly accurate, being
terrifically
optimistic or pessimistic. I usually just ignore reports of airspeed
unless I know the speeds have been properly confirmed. You also need
to
confirm the accuracy of your Tach. Many, if not most, Tachs used in
these airplanes are even less accurate, often being off by several
hundred rpm. The Westach on Tootie Mae reads 250 to 300 rpm high when
indicating 5800rpm. I use an optical tach to find prop rpm and have a
chart to convert to engine rpms and use that to determine cruise and
max
rpms on the tach. So, as you can see, if your ASI reads low and your
tach reads h
igh you won't see the speeds you have or get all the
performance you can. By the way, the Model I is not particularly
speedy, but it is a blast for short field and low and slow sight seeing
with the doors open. If it hasn't been built too heavy, almost nothing
else can touch it for STOL and slow flight. Finally a different prop
may well improve cruise speed at the expense of STOL performance.
Jerry Liles
Graeme Toft wrote:
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" <MSM@BYTEROCKY.NET>
&g
t;Hi guys, for some time I have read about the speeds that those of you
with
582's are getting from their early models and am wondering what I can
do
to my model 1 to achieve similar results. I am flat out getting 65
knots
ground speed at 5800 rpm and have faired everything but the wheels.
I'm
not after miracles but is 75 knots achievable with some further
tinkering
and if so where do I begin
Graeme
-----------------------------------------------
>
;Scanned by Bayou Internet for all known viruses.
http://www.bayou.com
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e,
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Anybody in Utah? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kerrjohna@comcast.net
John Kerr, Logan, Classic IV/912UL
-------------- Original message --------------
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
>
> Is anyone on the list living in Utah?
>
> spdrflyr@earthlink.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
John Kerr, Logan, Classic IV/912UL
-------------- Original message --------------
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <SPDRFLYR@EARTHLINK.NET>
Is anyone on the list living in Utah?
spdrflyr@earthlink.net
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 4/20/2005 7:45:50 AM Eastern Standard Time,
morid@northland.lib.mi.us writes:
Anybody have any input on this?
The airplane has about 300 hours over 4 years and is painted with Polytone
Tennessee Red, if that matters.
Deke
Just curious, how did you prep the tanks when covering? Also, when I did
the temp differential checks for Poly Fiber on different color paints, I found
that Red (especially a dark red) is one of the hotter colors. Can heat be a
contributing factor to the fabric letting loose. Just an off the wall
thought.
Don Smythe
Classic IV w/ 582
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
In a message dated 4/20/2005 10:52:19 AM Eastern Standard Time,
lcfitt@sbcglobal.net writes:
second rib. When building - it seems a long time ago - it was advised not
to glue the fabric to the tank tops and I did some real tinkering to avoid
it. The argument was that the tank wouldn't touch the fabric uniformly and
Lowell,
Just goes to show you, I was advised just the opposite. Poly Fiber
advised me to put on several coats of Poly Brush to the tank tops. Then, come
along with another heavy coat on the fabric (once installed) to bind them
together. Can't remember if some MEK was mentioned in this process or not. I
don't see any tell tell marks in the paint. The fabric has debonded a little
around where I put the slightly raised recessed filler caps. I assume it's a
pressure thing. The rest of the tank is tight.
I've thought of using a long hypodermic needle to inject some 50/50 Poly
Tack/MEK under where the debonding is. Don't know if this would work or not
especially on a larger area as Deke has.
Don Smythe
Classic IV w/ 582
Message 12
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| Subject: | Anybody in Utah? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
Hi John. I'll be relocating to Utah soon. I'm flying an Avid Mark IV
Jabiru powered. I'll be working in Salt Lake City but I don't mind a
reasonable commute. Do you have a recommendation for Airport and hangar
location? I like small town so I will probably be looking at renting a
house or condo until I get the "lay of the land". Is there an area hat
you would recommend?
Thanks,
Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
kerrjohna@comcast.net
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Anybody in Utah?
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kerrjohna@comcast.net
John Kerr, Logan, Classic IV/912UL
-------------- Original message --------------
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
>
> Is anyone on the list living in Utah?
>
> spdrflyr@earthlink.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
John Kerr, Logan, Classic IV/912UL
-------------- Original message --------------
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
<SPDRFLYR@EARTHLINK.NET>
Is anyone on the list living in Utah?
spdrflyr@earthlink.net
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Chenoweth" <chenoweth@gwi.net>
Deke,
What I've read (in the PolyFiber manual, I think) is that if the fabric
wasn't properly shrunk during installation it will loosen/bag when things
cool off. If that's what's going on in your case you might be able to solve
it with careful application of heat (via calibrated iron) but if you decide
you might do that I'd strongly suggest discussing it with PolyFiber first -
you don't want to screw up the tapes.
I glued my fabric to my tanks and have had no problem even in our Maine
winters.
Bill
IV-1200
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>
> After a recent cross country when parking the airplane I noticed what
appeared to be loose fabric on the rear half of the left wing tank of my S5.
Upon close inspection I found that it was indeed loose in an area about
12"X10". It was a cool morning flight in the low 40s [very nice I might
add]. I parked the airplane in the hangar and when I returned about 4 hours
later for a closer look the fabric was tight again and everything appeared
fine. Assuming I wasn't hallucinating, something has happened here and I'm a
little concerned that it will reoccur and probably get worse.
>
> I seem to recall some dialog on this subject, but can't remember what the
best technique was for a permanent repair. I'm not real excited about having
to remove the wing.
>
> Anybody have any input on this?
>
> The airplane has about 300 hours over 4 years and is painted with Polytone
Tennessee Red, if that matters.
>
> Deke
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "flier" <FLIER@sbcglobal.net>
I'd suspect that the fabric in the small area behind
the tank didn't shrink to the max during covering.
The fabric adheres to the tanks during the first
brush coat of Polybrush anyway unless you somehow
keep the fabric up off the tank top during covering
so I don't think that's the cause.
I recovered one of my wings four yrs ago during the
summertime. When it's above 50F, my leading edge is
smooth as glass. When it gets colder, I notice some
random small bubbles in the LE finish tape that
apparently didn't get fully ironed down. They go
away when it's warm.
I'd suspect the suction created on the upper wing
surface likely stretched the fabric when it was cold
then it recovered when it got warm. Personally, I
wouldn't worry about it.
Regards,
Ted
--- Original Message ---
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
<lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
>
>Deke, I notice this on my Mod IV on cold mornings
especially when it is out
>overnight. I get a little puckering between the
fuel filler neck and the
>second rib. When building - it seems a long time
ago - it was advised not
>to glue the fabric to the tank tops and I did some
real tinkering to avoid
>it. The argument was that the tank wouldn't touch
the fabric uniformly and
>where it did touch it would leave a line at the edge
of contact so in the
>finish paint there would be a marble effect ( I had
seen it on other
>Kitfoxes). I don't have the marble effect, but I do
have the cold weather
>pucker - so to speak.
>
>Lowell
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>To: "Kitfox List" <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
>
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
<morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>>
>> After a recent cross country when parking the
airplane I noticed what
>> appeared to be loose fabric on the rear half of
the left wing tank of my
>> S5. Upon close inspection I found that it was
indeed loose in an area
>> about 12"X10". It was a cool morning flight in the
low 40s [very nice I
>> might add]. I parked the airplane in the hangar
and when I returned about
>> 4 hours later for a closer look the fabric was
tight again and everything
>> appeared fine. Assuming I wasn't hallucinating,
something has happened
>> here and I'm a little concerned that it will
reoccur and probably get
>> worse.
>>
>> I seem to recall some dialog on this subject, but
can't remember what the
>> best technique was for a permanent repair. I'm not
real excited about
>> having to remove the wing.
>>
>> Anybody have any input on this?
>>
>> The airplane has about 300 hours over 4 years and
is painted with Polytone
>> Tennessee Red, if that matters.
>>
>> Deke
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>_-
======================================================
======
browse
Subscriptions page,
FAQ,
List
>_-
======================================================
======
>
>
Message 15
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: joakley@ida.net
Tim,
did your partner look at the sensenich at sun and fun?
I can tell lyou that my first prop, like the gsc that you had was nothing
when replaced by a warp drive prop. take off distance and climb was
inproved a bunch.
My cap is now ready to fly and inproves flight even more.
As we talked before, in the fixed pitch area I don't believe that many of
the group have tried any of the hollow type carbon blades, and that is
where I would be looking for myself.
some one one the list several months ago asked about the Kiev prop but I
have not heard any more.
Good luck, John Oakley
Message 16
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| Subject: | Another 5 coming alive. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Flybradair@cs.com
Weight and Balance done on my 5 outback.
The numbers;
Left main--437, Arm -2.00
Right main--432, Arm -2.00
Tail wheel--52, Arm +164.00
Total weight 921.
Lycoming o-235L2C. No weight reduction parts.
Sensenich wood prop with SN-2 spinner.
Full panel, (no gyro)
Transponder/encoder.
Icom transceiver.
Intercom.
GPS 196--hard wired in panel.
Full engine instruments with quad CHT/ quad EGT.
Spring gear.
Maul tail wheel.
Odyssey 26 pound 935 battery in tail.
8.00--6 oversize tires.
Max Gross 1550
Max Forward CG 9.96
Max Aft CG 14.75
Empty weight CG of aircraft is 7.37
With designated FAA 170 pound pilot and 15 pounds of fuel,
24 pounds will be added to cargo bay for CG of 9.98.
Cant get it past the rear CG----pretty much anything loaded
in any configuration under gross will be within rear CG of 14.75.
Had to put the larger 26 pound odyssey in the tail to bring CG within
limits.
(You heavy engine builders might want to keep that in mind!)
Impressions;
Man am I happy!
Was worried about the CG from the time I started building,
my goal was under 950---beat it by 29 pounds even with the
heavy battery.
Carrying 24 pounds in the cargo bay is not a problem, my
tool kit weighs 25 and it stays in the aircraft.
First start of the Lycoming was a great experience! Its Alive!
Followed the Lycoming manual for initial engine break-in--took
about 25 minutes to complete the test including full static run
with the aircraft tied to the tractor----what a blast!
The Lycoming is smoooooth as silk with very little vibration.
Got a call out to JR (plain and simple), I am sure some of you remember him
from this list a few years ago--he is my EAA Tech Counselor. Then will
schedule the
DAR to get this thing done.
Paperwork is all done----Aircraft is done-----Just About There!
Brad Martin
Wichita
N232WB
Message 17
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|
| Subject: | Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Thanks Lowell. The fabric lifting is actually at the last half of the rear
of the tank where the fabric is/was glued to the tank.
Deke
>
> Deke, I notice this on my Mod IV on cold mornings especially when it is
out
> overnight. I get a little puckering between the fuel filler neck and the
> second rib. When building - it seems a long time ago - it was advised not
> to glue the fabric to the tank tops and I did some real tinkering to avoid
> it. The argument was that the tank wouldn't touch the fabric uniformly
and
> where it did touch it would leave a line at the edge of contact so in the
> finish paint there would be a marble effect ( I had seen it on other
> Kitfoxes). I don't have the marble effect, but I do have the cold weather
> pucker - so to speak.
>
> Lowell
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
> To: "Kitfox List" <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
<morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
> >
> > After a recent cross country when parking the airplane I noticed what
> > appeared to be loose fabric on the rear half of the left wing tank of my
> > S5. Upon close inspection I found that it was indeed loose in an area
> > about 12"X10". It was a cool morning flight in the low 40s [very nice I
> > might add]. I parked the airplane in the hangar and when I returned
about
> > 4 hours later for a closer look the fabric was tight again and
everything
> > appeared fine. Assuming I wasn't hallucinating, something has happened
> > here and I'm a little concerned that it will reoccur and probably get
> > worse.
> >
> > I seem to recall some dialog on this subject, but can't remember what
the
> > best technique was for a permanent repair. I'm not real excited about
> > having to remove the wing.
> >
> > Anybody have any input on this?
> >
> > The airplane has about 300 hours over 4 years and is painted with
Polytone
> > Tennessee Red, if that matters.
> >
> > Deke
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 18
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|
| Subject: | Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Good question Don. As I recall I went according to Skystar instructions by
painting several coats of poly brush on the tank then laying the fabric with
initial tightening to about 250 degrees, paint on more poly brush to bond
the fabric to the tank, then tighten up the rest of the wing without further
tightening of the fabric over the tank. Yes, red is a hot color, but that
wasn't the problem as it was an early morning flight just after sun up.
Obviously the lifting action of the wing lifted the fabric off the tank and
I'm concerned that now that it's begun it'll just continue pealing off until
during flight I'll have a big pillow-like bubble on top of my wing. Not
much lift there.
> Deke
>
>
> Just curious, how did you prep the tanks when covering? Also, when I did
> the temp differential checks for Poly Fiber on different color paints, I
found
> that Red (especially a dark red) is one of the hotter colors. Can heat
be a
> contributing factor to the fabric letting loose. Just an off the wall
> thought.
>
> Don Smythe
> Classic IV w/ 582
>
>
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
Good advice to call PolyFiber prior to taking any action. Anybody have a
good phone number?
Deke
>
> Deke,
> What I've read (in the PolyFiber manual, I think) is that if the fabric
> wasn't properly shrunk during installation it will loosen/bag when things
> cool off. If that's what's going on in your case you might be able to
solve
> it with careful application of heat (via calibrated iron) but if you
decide
> you might do that I'd strongly suggest discussing it with PolyFiber
first -
> you don't want to screw up the tapes.
> I glued my fabric to my tanks and have had no problem even in our Maine
> winters.
> Bill
> IV-1200
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
> To: "Kitfox List" <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
<morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
> >
> > After a recent cross country when parking the airplane I noticed what
> appeared to be loose fabric on the rear half of the left wing tank of my
S5.
> Upon close inspection I found that it was indeed loose in an area about
> 12"X10". It was a cool morning flight in the low 40s [very nice I might
> add]. I parked the airplane in the hangar and when I returned about 4
hours
> later for a closer look the fabric was tight again and everything appeared
> fine. Assuming I wasn't hallucinating, something has happened here and I'm
a
> little concerned that it will reoccur and probably get worse.
> >
> > I seem to recall some dialog on this subject, but can't remember what
the
> best technique was for a permanent repair. I'm not real excited about
having
> to remove the wing.
> >
> > Anybody have any input on this?
> >
> > The airplane has about 300 hours over 4 years and is painted with
Polytone
> Tennessee Red, if that matters.
> >
> > Deke
> >
> >
>
>
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
As you stated below, mine does the same thing. As for the area behind the
tank, that area was tight. It was the area that was [supposed to be] bonded
to the tank that is lifting from the rear half.
Deke
> I'd suspect that the fabric in the small area behind
> the tank didn't shrink to the max during covering.
> The fabric adheres to the tanks during the first
> brush coat of Polybrush anyway unless you somehow
> keep the fabric up off the tank top during covering
> so I don't think that's the cause.
>
> I recovered one of my wings four yrs ago during the
> summertime. When it's above 50F, my leading edge is
> smooth as glass. When it gets colder, I notice some
> random small bubbles in the LE finish tape that
> apparently didn't get fully ironed down. They go
> away when it's warm.
>
> I'd suspect the suction created on the upper wing
> surface likely stretched the fabric when it was cold
> then it recovered when it got warm. Personally, I
> wouldn't worry about it.
>
> Regards,
>
> Ted
>
>
> --- Original Message ---
> From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
>
> >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
> <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
> >
> >Deke, I notice this on my Mod IV on cold mornings
> especially when it is out
> >overnight. I get a little puckering between the
> fuel filler neck and the
> >second rib. When building - it seems a long time
> ago - it was advised not
> >to glue the fabric to the tank tops and I did some
> real tinkering to avoid
> >it. The argument was that the tank wouldn't touch
> the fabric uniformly and
> >where it did touch it would leave a line at the edge
> of contact so in the
> >finish paint there would be a marble effect ( I had
> seen it on other
> >Kitfoxes). I don't have the marble effect, but I do
> have the cold weather
> >pucker - so to speak.
> >
> >Lowell
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
> >To: "Kitfox List" <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> >Subject: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
> >
> >
> >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
> <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
> >>
> >> After a recent cross country when parking the
> airplane I noticed what
> >> appeared to be loose fabric on the rear half of
> the left wing tank of my
> >> S5. Upon close inspection I found that it was
> indeed loose in an area
> >> about 12"X10". It was a cool morning flight in the
> low 40s [very nice I
> >> might add]. I parked the airplane in the hangar
> and when I returned about
> >> 4 hours later for a closer look the fabric was
> tight again and everything
> >> appeared fine. Assuming I wasn't hallucinating,
> something has happened
> >> here and I'm a little concerned that it will
> reoccur and probably get
> >> worse.
> >>
> >> I seem to recall some dialog on this subject, but
> can't remember what the
> >> best technique was for a permanent repair. I'm not
> real excited about
> >> having to remove the wing.
> >>
> >> Anybody have any input on this?
> >>
> >> The airplane has about 300 hours over 4 years and
> is painted with Polytone
> >> Tennessee Red, if that matters.
> >>
> >> Deke
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >_-
> ======================================================
> ======
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
> List
> >_-
> ======================================================
> ======
> >
> >
>
>
Message 21
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|
| Subject: | Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
Thin out some polybrush and inject it under the fabric using a metal
horse syringe.
steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of flier
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "flier" <FLIER@sbcglobal.net>
I'd suspect that the fabric in the small area behind
the tank didn't shrink to the max during covering.
The fabric adheres to the tanks during the first
brush coat of Polybrush anyway unless you somehow
keep the fabric up off the tank top during covering
so I don't think that's the cause.
I recovered one of my wings four yrs ago during the
summertime. When it's above 50F, my leading edge is
smooth as glass. When it gets colder, I notice some
random small bubbles in the LE finish tape that
apparently didn't get fully ironed down. They go
away when it's warm.
I'd suspect the suction created on the upper wing
surface likely stretched the fabric when it was cold
then it recovered when it got warm. Personally, I
wouldn't worry about it.
Regards,
Ted
--- Original Message ---
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
<lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
>
>Deke, I notice this on my Mod IV on cold mornings
especially when it is out
>overnight. I get a little puckering between the
fuel filler neck and the
>second rib. When building - it seems a long time
ago - it was advised not
>to glue the fabric to the tank tops and I did some
real tinkering to avoid
>it. The argument was that the tank wouldn't touch
the fabric uniformly and
>where it did touch it would leave a line at the edge
of contact so in the
>finish paint there would be a marble effect ( I had
seen it on other
>Kitfoxes). I don't have the marble effect, but I do
have the cold weather
>pucker - so to speak.
>
>Lowell
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>To: "Kitfox List" <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
>
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer"
<morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
>>
>> After a recent cross country when parking the
airplane I noticed what
>> appeared to be loose fabric on the rear half of
the left wing tank of my
>> S5. Upon close inspection I found that it was
indeed loose in an area
>> about 12"X10". It was a cool morning flight in the
low 40s [very nice I
>> might add]. I parked the airplane in the hangar
and when I returned about
>> 4 hours later for a closer look the fabric was
tight again and everything
>> appeared fine. Assuming I wasn't hallucinating,
something has happened
>> here and I'm a little concerned that it will
reoccur and probably get
>> worse.
>>
>> I seem to recall some dialog on this subject, but
can't remember what the
>> best technique was for a permanent repair. I'm not
real excited about
>> having to remove the wing.
>>
>> Anybody have any input on this?
>>
>> The airplane has about 300 hours over 4 years and
is painted with Polytone
>> Tennessee Red, if that matters.
>>
>> Deke
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>_-
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browse
Subscriptions page,
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List
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Message 22
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| Subject: | Anybody in Utah? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
Sorry...this was meant to go back channel. My goof
Please do not arcive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve
Cooper
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Anybody in Utah?
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
<spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
Hi John. I'll be relocating to Utah soon. I'm flying an Avid Mark IV
Jabiru powered. I'll be working in Salt Lake City but I don't mind a
reasonable commute. Do you have a recommendation for Airport and hangar
location? I like small town so I will probably be looking at renting a
house or condo until I get the "lay of the land". Is there an area hat
you would recommend?
Thanks,
Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
kerrjohna@comcast.net
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Anybody in Utah?
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kerrjohna@comcast.net
John Kerr, Logan, Classic IV/912UL
-------------- Original message --------------
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
>
> Is anyone on the list living in Utah?
>
> spdrflyr@earthlink.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
John Kerr, Logan, Classic IV/912UL
-------------- Original message --------------
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
<SPDRFLYR@EARTHLINK.NET>
Is anyone on the list living in Utah?
spdrflyr@earthlink.net
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Don, This makes sense as we go. I suspect that Polyfiber determined that
it is pretty hard to shrink the fabric appropriately with the tank top
acting as a heat sink.
The only time I see a problem is on a fairly cold morning and as mentioned
that occurrs mostly when out with the guys on one of our trips.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: <AlbertaIV@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
>
>
> In a message dated 4/20/2005 10:52:19 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> lcfitt@sbcglobal.net writes:
>
> second rib. When building - it seems a long time ago - it was advised
> not
> to glue the fabric to the tank tops and I did some real tinkering to avoid
> it. The argument was that the tank wouldn't touch the fabric uniformly
> and
>
>
> Lowell,
> Just goes to show you, I was advised just the opposite. Poly Fiber
> advised me to put on several coats of Poly Brush to the tank tops. Then,
> come
> along with another heavy coat on the fabric (once installed) to bind them
> together. Can't remember if some MEK was mentioned in this process or
> not. I
> don't see any tell tell marks in the paint. The fabric has debonded a
> little
> around where I put the slightly raised recessed filler caps. I assume
> it's a
> pressure thing. The rest of the tank is tight.
> I've thought of using a long hypodermic needle to inject some 50/50
> Poly
> Tack/MEK under where the debonding is. Don't know if this would work or
> not
> especially on a larger area as Deke has.
>
> Don Smythe
> Classic IV w/ 582
>
>
>
Message 24
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| Subject: | Anybody in Utah? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kerrjohna@comcast.net
I don't know if you got the reply I sent but briefly, South to North: Provo, Cedar
Valley, Salt Lake #2, Bountiful, Ogden with Tooele to the west. Depends on
where you actually settle. People commute from all those areas.\
John
-------------- Original message --------------
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
>
> Hi John. I'll be relocating to Utah soon. I'm flying an Avid Mark IV
> Jabiru powered. I'll be working in Salt Lake City but I don't mind a
> reasonable commute. Do you have a recommendation for Airport and hangar
> location? I like small town so I will probably be looking at renting a
> house or condo until I get the "lay of the land". Is there an area hat
> you would recommend?
>
> Thanks,
> Steve
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> kerrjohna@comcast.net
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Anybody in Utah?
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kerrjohna@comcast.net
>
> John Kerr, Logan, Classic IV/912UL
>
> -------------- Original message --------------
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
> >
> > Is anyone on the list living in Utah?
> >
> > spdrflyr@earthlink.net
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> John Kerr, Logan, Classic IV/912UL
>
> -------------- Original message --------------
>
> -- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
>
>
> Is anyone on the list living in Utah?
>
> spdrflyr@earthlink.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
I don't know if you got the reply I sent but briefly, South to North: Provo, Cedar
Valley, Salt Lake #2, Bountiful, Ogden with Tooele to the west. Depends on
where you actually settle. People commute from all those areas.\
John
-------------- Original message --------------
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper" <SPDRFLYR@EARTHLINK.NET>
Hi John. I'll be relocating to Utah soon. I'm flying an Avid Mark IV
Jabiru powered. I'll be working in Salt Lake City but I don't mind a
reasonable commute. Do you have a recommendation for Airport and hangar
location? I like small town so I will probably be looking at renting a
house or condo until I get the "lay of the land". Is there an area hat
you would recommend?
Thanks,
Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
kerrjohna@comcast.net
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Anybody in Uta
h?
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: kerrjohna@comcast.net
John Kerr, Logan, Classic IV/912UL
-------------- Original message --------------
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
Is anyone on the list living in Utah?
spdrflyr@earthlink.net
John Kerr, Logan, Classic IV/912UL
-------------- Original message --------------
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
<SPDRFLYR@EARTHLINK.NET>
Is anyone on the list living in Utah?
spdrflyr@earthlink.net
e
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | Another 5 coming alive. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" <donpearsall@comcast.net>
Congratulations on your new build Brad! Thank you for all the info on your
"new" Five. I am sure these numbers will be useful to other builders. Sure
we all remember JR, Mr. Plain and Simple. Great guy. Tell him we said hi.
Now your assignment is to give us a full report when you get in and fly the
plane.
Thanks again
Don Pearsall
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Flybradair@cs.com
Subject: Kitfox-List: Another 5 coming alive.
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Flybradair@cs.com
Weight and Balance done on my 5 outback.
The numbers;
Left main--437, Arm -2.00
Right main--432, Arm -2.00
Tail wheel--52, Arm +164.00
Total weight 921.
Lycoming o-235L2C. No weight reduction parts.
Sensenich wood prop with SN-2 spinner.
Full panel, (no gyro)
Transponder/encoder.
Icom transceiver.
Intercom.
GPS 196--hard wired in panel.
Full engine instruments with quad CHT/ quad EGT.
Spring gear.
Maul tail wheel.
Odyssey 26 pound 935 battery in tail.
8.00--6 oversize tires.
Max Gross 1550
Max Forward CG 9.96
Max Aft CG 14.75
Empty weight CG of aircraft is 7.37
With designated FAA 170 pound pilot and 15 pounds of fuel,
24 pounds will be added to cargo bay for CG of 9.98.
Cant get it past the rear CG----pretty much anything loaded
in any configuration under gross will be within rear CG of 14.75.
Had to put the larger 26 pound odyssey in the tail to bring CG within
limits.
(You heavy engine builders might want to keep that in mind!)
Impressions;
Man am I happy!
Was worried about the CG from the time I started building,
my goal was under 950---beat it by 29 pounds even with the
heavy battery.
Carrying 24 pounds in the cargo bay is not a problem, my
tool kit weighs 25 and it stays in the aircraft.
First start of the Lycoming was a great experience! Its Alive!
Followed the Lycoming manual for initial engine break-in--took
about 25 minutes to complete the test including full static run
with the aircraft tied to the tractor----what a blast!
The Lycoming is smoooooth as silk with very little vibration.
Got a call out to JR (plain and simple), I am sure some of you remember him
from this list a few years ago--he is my EAA Tech Counselor. Then will
schedule the
DAR to get this thing done.
Paperwork is all done----Aircraft is done-----Just About There!
Brad Martin
Wichita
N232WB
Message 26
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Donna and Roger McConnell" <rdmac@swbell.net>
Yes Sir,
I'll have a full report when I get those. I only ordered the CHT
probe but I'll still need to order the oil temp as well. I was thinking I
might already have that one but I didn't. The EGT and Oil Pressure are OK.
Roger Mac
DO NOT ARCHIVE
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
aerocon1@telusplanet.net
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: CHT Probe
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: aerocon1@telusplanet.net
Roger,
Let us know how you made out with Westach re: the 912 sensors
Bob R
Quoting Donna and Roger McConnell <rdmac@swbell.net>:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Donna and Roger McConnell"
> <rdmac@swbell.net>
>
> John,
> Thanks, I'm calling Westach right now.
> Roger Mac
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jdmcbean
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: CHT Probe
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
>
> Roger,
>
> Been following the thread and just thought this could make it a little
> easier...
>
> I believe the 1" tip is for the CHT and the 1/2" is for the Oil Temp.
> You'll need to replace the VDO sensors that are in the engine.
>
> Westach Temperature Sensor 399S10-1.5L
> 10x1.5 mm thrd 1" Tip
>
> Westach Temperature Sensor 399S10-1.5S
> 10x1.5mm thrd 1/2" Tip
>
> Westach Thermocouple 712-2DWK EGT
> 48" Type K
>
> Fly Safe !!
> John & Debra McBean
> www.sportplanellc.com
> "The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Donna and
Roger
> McConnell
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: CHT Probe
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Donna and Roger McConnell"
> <rdmac@swbell.net>
>
>
> Bob,
> You are correct. I looked today and the heads have a counter bore that is
> just big enough to allow for the O.D. of the plug. There is no room for
that
> type of sensor. I'm calling Westach tomorrow and see what they recommend
for
> a CHT probe on a Rotax engine. I do agree with Steve that I want to
monitor
> the health of my engine as much as I can.
> Roger Mac
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Robertson
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: CHT Probe
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob Robertson"
> <aerocontrols@clearwave.ca>
>
> Steve,
>
> There is no way to get a CHT probe under the plug on a 912...There is
simply
> no room.
>
> regards
>
> Bob Robertson
> Light Engine Services Ltd.
> Rotax Service Center
> St. Albert, Ab. T8N 1M8
> Ph: (Tech Support) 1-780-418-4164
> Ph: (Order Line) 1-866-418-4164 (TOLL FREE)
> www.rtx-av-engines.ca
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Cooper" <spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: CHT Probe
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Steve Cooper"
<spdrflyr@earthlink.net>
> >
> > If it was my bird and I was risking my butt in it I'd sensor up. That is
> > to say that regardless of what's provided by Rotax, I would install Quad
> > CHT, Quad EGT, AND Coolant Temp. I monitor mine closely. CHT under the
> > plug?...we've been do'in it that way for years. It's accepted method.
> >
> > steve
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> > AlbertaIV@aol.com
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: CHT Probe
> >
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: AlbertaIV@aol.com
> >
> >
> > In a message dated 4/17/2005 3:30:41 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> > pwilson@climber.org writes:
> >
> >
> > BTW, I think the sensors on the coolant pipe is a good way to go,but
> > its not
> > what Rotax recommends.
> >
> > Thanks Paul
> >
> >
> > Paul,
> > This is something I tried in order to be able to measure in/out
> > water
> > temps at the radiator. I still have the normal coolant temp probe
> > installed.
> > I've always heard it's basically a waste of time to install CHT on a
> > water
> > cooled 582. I simply used the probes as a temporary setup to get the
> > above
> > differential readings. However, it worked so well and I believe it
> > gives maybe
> > more useful information than it did when hooked to the plugs for CHT.
> > I may
> > keep it this way.
> > I offer this disclaimer that I did not intend to suggest different
> > hookup over what's recommended by Rotax. Now, I can't get sued.
> >
> > Don Smythe
> > Classic IV w/ 582
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Another 5 coming alive. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ed Akerstrom" <e.akerstrom@sbcglobal.net>
Brad,
Congratulations!
Could you please tell me the model of Sensenich that you have?
Thank you,
Ed Akerstrom
Brad wrote:
Paperwork is all done----Aircraft is done-----Just About There!
Brad Martin
Wichita
N232WB
Message 28
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|
| Subject: | Loose Fuel tank fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rick" <turboflyer@comcast.net>
I have experienced the same problem. I thought about injecting glue under
the fabric but was fearful it would bubble the paint. Only happens when it
real cold.
Rick N656T
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Chenoweth
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Loose Fuel tank fabric
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Chenoweth" <chenoweth@gwi.net>
Deke,
What I've read (in the PolyFiber manual, snip...............
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