---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 09/17/05: 39 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:02 AM - Selling Kitfox (Rex & Jan Shaw) 2. 06:59 AM - Re: Re: Skystars facts about flaperonsSV: landings FLapperons (Paul Seehafer) 3. 06:59 AM - Re: Skystars facts about flaperonsSV: landings FLapperons (Lmar) 4. 07:00 AM - Re: wing recovering (Paul Peerenboom) 5. 07:12 AM - Re: Re: Skystars facts about flaperonsSV: landings FLapperons (Don Smythe) 6. 07:57 AM - bunggy cord proublem (randy bortree) 7. 08:25 AM - Re: bunggy cord proublem (Don Pearsall) 8. 08:33 AM - Re: jimcarriere@yahoo.com (Lowell Fitt) 9. 10:35 AM - Prop Pitch (George Wells@adelphia.net) 10. 11:31 AM - Re: wing recovering (NELSON GOGUEN) 11. 11:42 AM - Re: wing recovering (Don Smythe) 12. 11:57 AM - Re: wing recovering (ron schick) 13. 01:54 PM - Re: bunggy cord proublem (joe) 14. 02:12 PM - Re: Re: Skystars facts about flaperons (Michael Gibbs) 15. 02:31 PM - Re: Skystars facts about flaperons (Michel Verheughe) 16. 02:36 PM - Re: Re: Skystars facts about flaperons (Michel Verheughe) 17. 02:45 PM - Re: bunggy cord problem (ron schick) 18. 03:04 PM - Re: bunggy cord problem (joe) 19. 04:35 PM - Flaperon angle info on Sportflight (Brett Walmsley) 20. 05:00 PM - Re: bunggy cord problem (Graeme Toft) 21. 05:46 PM - New plane (Graeme Toft) 22. 06:09 PM - Re: New plane (Steve Zakreski) 23. 06:37 PM - thing ma jig? (Steve Zakreski) 24. 06:37 PM - Re: Night VFR (Jeffrey Puls) 25. 06:41 PM - Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 27 Msgs - 09/16/05 (Jim Carriere) 26. 06:43 PM - Re: New plane (Graeme Toft) 27. 06:45 PM - Re: thing ma jig? (KITFOXZ@aol.com) 28. 06:49 PM - Vent Line (jareds) 29. 06:55 PM - Re: thing ma jig? (Andrew Matthaey) 30. 06:56 PM - Re: New plane (Andrew Matthaey) 31. 07:00 PM - Re: thing ma jig? (John Perry) 32. 07:03 PM - Re: Rotec R2800 (Jim Carriere) 33. 07:13 PM - Re: thing ma jig? (Brett Walmsley) 34. 07:32 PM - Re: thing ma jig? (Ron Liebmann) 35. 07:42 PM - Oil System question (Mdkitfox@aol.com) 36. 07:42 PM - Re: thing ma jig? (ron schick) 37. 09:53 PM - Re: Oil System question (jdmcbean) 38. 09:57 PM - Re: Vent Line (Marco Menezes) 39. 10:50 PM - Re: Vent Line (Rick) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:02:21 AM PST US From: "Rex & Jan Shaw" Subject: Kitfox-List: Selling Kitfox --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rex & Jan Shaw" --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Peter Brookes" Friends, What can I say? I have not been a major contributor to this list, but have enjoyed the useful tips and information found here. It is with some sadness that I say goodbye to you all, and a lot of sadness I say farewell to my Fox! It has been a hard decision, but due to work and family commitments I have not been able to fly as much as I want, and the Fox should be flown and enjoyed as much as possible! It is sad to have her in sat in the hangar for weeks at a time. I have found a keen buyer who is looking to take her places and fly as much as possible, so my sadness is lightened a little! I will be buying a share in another aircraft yet to be determined, but it will be the most cost effective way for me to continue flying! My heart will always flutter every time I see a Fox fly past :-) Thanks for your support and assistance I have received over recent years. Pete. Well Pete I bet it was a hard decision. I hope you don't regret it too badly but I'm keeping mine. Goodluck to you anyway. Rex from Australia. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:59:34 AM PST US From: "Paul Seehafer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Skystars facts about flaperonsSV: landings FLapperons --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" Michael, Maybe you could just send a copy of the flapperon adjustment bulletin to me so I have it? I plan on readjusting mine and would like to have the factory scoop on it prior to changing anything. Thnx. Paul ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Gibbs" Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Skystars facts about flaperonsSV: landings FLapperons > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs > > Paul, > >>Without the bulletin, one would tend to believe what the >>manufacturer writes in a Pilot Guide when that is all the >>information he can find on the specific subject. > > I suspect that the Pilot's Guide (which is an excellent resource and > very well written) simply pre-dates the bulletin. So what Ed says in > it is accurate as of that time. > >>Incidentally, does that bulletin say why it is limiting it to 22 degrees? > > The rationale was that the flaperons, when used as flaps, primarily > produce lift and there is very little additional lift provided past > 20 to 25 degrees. Beyond that point, though, there is a substantial > limiting of aileron authority, therefore 22 degrees was deemed the > "optimal" max. > > I'm going out to the shop today so I'll get the reference for that > bulletin for you. > >>I would definitely suggest posting that bulletin of sportflight and >>any others the rest of us aren't aware of. > > That would be a big job, since I don't know which ones people may > have missed so I'd have to post all of them! :-) > > I'd be surprised if there isn't a master list somewhere already. > > Mike G. > N728KF > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:59:34 AM PST US From: Lmar Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Skystars facts about flaperonsSV: landings FLapperons --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lmar Don, With all due respect, was the rudder travel not enough to co-ordinate the airplane with full flap, or was the amount required available, but not normally required to use that amount? The Canadian Tiger Moth does not have any aileron differential, and it requires a ton of rudder. Given your experience, I plan to test my airplane at exagerated/normal extremes; hopefully by Monday. Will let you knoow what I find. Thanks for sharing, Larry ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:00:04 AM PST US From: "Paul Peerenboom" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: wing recovering --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Peerenboom" When I recovered my wings Model IV I also had to derived the flapron brackets. I cut the fabric off and held the ends of the rivets to prevent them from spinning and damaging the ribs. Also number the brackets to get them back in the same location. Paul N102DG ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Smythe" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: wing recovering > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Smythe" > > I would think you would have to remove the brackets to get a good cover > job. > As far as the little side windows, I covered over them with fabric (no > side > windows). Looks good, can't see much out of them anyway and saves weight > (IMO) > Don Smythe > Classic IV W/ 582 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "ron schick" > To: > Subject: Kitfox-List: wing recovering > > >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" >> >> >> I am going to recover a previously done wing. Do I need to remove the >> flaperon attach brackets? The previous cover is under the hanger >> brackets >> which are riveted to the ribs. Also has anyone made plexiglass side >> windows >> instead ot the plastic stock ones? Thanks Ron NB Ore. >> do not archive >> >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:12:24 AM PST US From: "Don Smythe" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Skystars facts about flaperonsSV: landings FLapperons --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Smythe" I don't think there was enough rudder to correct the situation. Either way, I think full flaps could get you into trouble under certain conditions like high cross winds, etc. On the other hand, having the full flap capability "might" have it's good side on other situations???? Don Smythe Classic IV W/ 582 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lmar" Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Skystars facts about flaperonsSV: landings FLapperons > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lmar > > Don, > > With all due respect, was the rudder travel not enough to co-ordinate the > airplane with full flap, or was the amount required available, but not > normally required to use that amount? The Canadian Tiger Moth does not > have any aileron differential, and it requires a ton of rudder. Given > your experience, I plan to test my airplane at exagerated/normal extremes; > hopefully by Monday. Will let you knoow what I find. > > Thanks for sharing, > Larry > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:57:16 AM PST US From: "randy bortree" Subject: Kitfox-List: bunggy cord proublem --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "randy bortree" Hi All I started to put bunggys on my Kit Fox 1, and finding it hard to get it wraped tight enough. has any body found a easy way to do this simple little job, that I can't seem to do. Thanks Randy > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:25:04 AM PST US From: "Don Pearsall" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: bunggy cord proublem --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall" Randy, You will get lots of advice on this one. The trick is to make one tight wrap, then secure it from moving, then make another wrap, and so on. After making a wrap, most people use a heavy duty plastic zip-tie. You could also use wire, tape, Vice Grips or whatever will hold. Of course having an extra person there to help is ideal. One could be on the upper side, and the other on the lower side. Just pass the bungee to the other person after making a wrap. Don't allow it to come loose and smack you in the face. That hurts. Don Pearsall http://www.soundappraisal.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of randy bortree Subject: Kitfox-List: bunggy cord proublem --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "randy bortree" Hi All I started to put bunggys on my Kit Fox 1, and finding it hard to get it wraped tight enough. has any body found a easy way to do this simple little job, that I can't seem to do. Thanks Randy > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:33:41 AM PST US From: "Lowell Fitt" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: jimcarriere@yahoo.com --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" Rick, I re-read your post several times and don'y understand what you are referring to. Skystar, NSI, maybe? Lowell ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rick" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: jimcarriere@yahoo.com > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rick" > > Hummm, I know fire everyone and bring in folks that just care about making > money but have no creative genius or enthusiasm for the sport or product. > Make sure the name is changed to something close but distant enough to > allow > product association without carrying over any negative aspects. Don't come > forth with a public announcement in any aviation magazine or web forum so > as > to keep it a mystery or rumor until they find out if they can really pull > it > off. Look familiar. > > Rick > N656T > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of > RV73HL@aol.com > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kitfox-List: jimcarriere@yahoo.com > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: RV73HL@aol.com > > Can you give me a short history on Skystar for the past 10 years. From > what > I am reading on the list, I'm hearing good and bad from their customers. > If > they are having problems, what do you think they are and why? > > Thanks Jim. > > Howard > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:35:09 AM PST US From: "George Wells@adelphia.net" Subject: Kitfox-List: Prop Pitch --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "George Wells@adelphia.net" I have a 912S with a ground Adj. Warp Drive Prop. What is a recommended RPM Full Throttle static Prop setting for a good all around Climb and Cruse -- i.e. Average setting. Thanks ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:31:15 AM PST US From: "NELSON GOGUEN" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: wing recovering --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "NELSON GOGUEN" Ron, You have received some good advise in removing the flaperon hangers. Just one more thought; when the fabric is removed check to make sure that the aluminum strip is still in place, where the rivits come through the cap strip. Not strong enough without the aluminum back up. Fly safe, Nelson ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fox5flyer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: wing recovering > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" > > Ron, you'll probably have to drill them out. Not a real big deal. Just > keep track of which brackets go in each spot so when you re-rivet they'll > match up. Actually, all the hard work is already done for you. > As for the side windows, by all means, use plexi glass. Just rig up some > sort of frame work and glue it in there with double sided sticky tape or > something. It'll look much better than the sewn in type. > Deke > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "ron schick" > To: > Subject: Kitfox-List: wing recovering > > >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" > >> >> I am going to recover a previously done wing. Do I need to remove the >> flaperon attach brackets? The previous cover is under the hanger >> brackets >> which are riveted to the ribs. Also has anyone made plexiglass side > windows >> instead ot the plastic stock ones? Thanks Ron NB Ore. >> do not archive >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:42:52 AM PST US From: "Don Smythe" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: wing recovering --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Smythe" Very good point. I had a couple of mine come loose during the initial build and considered replacing them with a little thicker aluminum and better adhesive. When drilling through those alum plates the drill bit has a tendency to try and push off the plate. Don Smythe Classic IV W/ 582 ----- Original Message ----- From: "NELSON GOGUEN" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: wing recovering > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "NELSON GOGUEN" > > Ron, > > You have received some good advise in removing the flaperon hangers. Just > one more thought; when the fabric is removed check to make sure that the > aluminum strip is still in place, where the rivits come through the cap > strip. Not strong enough without the aluminum back up. > > Fly safe, > > Nelson > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Fox5flyer" > To: > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: wing recovering > > >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" >> >> >> Ron, you'll probably have to drill them out. Not a real big deal. Just >> keep track of which brackets go in each spot so when you re-rivet they'll >> match up. Actually, all the hard work is already done for you. >> As for the side windows, by all means, use plexi glass. Just rig up some >> sort of frame work and glue it in there with double sided sticky tape or >> something. It'll look much better than the sewn in type. >> Deke >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "ron schick" >> To: >> Subject: Kitfox-List: wing recovering >> >> >>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" >> >>> >>> I am going to recover a previously done wing. Do I need to remove the >>> flaperon attach brackets? The previous cover is under the hanger >>> brackets >>> which are riveted to the ribs. Also has anyone made plexiglass side >> windows >>> instead ot the plastic stock ones? Thanks Ron NB Ore. >>> do not archive >>> >>> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 11:57:28 AM PST US From: "ron schick" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: wing recovering --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" Yes thank everyone for the info on recovering. I noticed one rivet had pushed the aluminum backer loose from the rib. Makes me want to test the adhesion of other parts. Ron NB ORE Do not archive >From: "NELSON GOGUEN" >Reply-To: kitfox-list@matronics.com >To: >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: wing recovering >Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 14:29:24 -0400 > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "NELSON GOGUEN" > >Ron, > >You have received some good advise in removing the flaperon hangers. Just >one more thought; when the fabric is removed check to make sure that the >aluminum strip is still in place, where the rivits come through the cap >strip. Not strong enough without the aluminum back up. > >Fly safe, > >Nelson >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Fox5flyer" >To: >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: wing recovering > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" > > > > > Ron, you'll probably have to drill them out. Not a real big deal. Just > > keep track of which brackets go in each spot so when you re-rivet >they'll > > match up. Actually, all the hard work is already done for you. > > As for the side windows, by all means, use plexi glass. Just rig up >some > > sort of frame work and glue it in there with double sided sticky tape or > > something. It'll look much better than the sewn in type. > > Deke > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "ron schick" > > To: > > Subject: Kitfox-List: wing recovering > > > > > >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" > > > >> > >> I am going to recover a previously done wing. Do I need to remove the > >> flaperon attach brackets? The previous cover is under the hanger > >> brackets > >> which are riveted to the ribs. Also has anyone made plexiglass side > > windows > >> instead ot the plastic stock ones? Thanks Ron NB Ore. > >> do not archive > >> > >> > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:54:51 PM PST US From: "joe" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: bunggy cord proublem --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "joe" has any body found a easy way to do this simple > little job, that I can't seem to do. ++++++ This is a difficult job for sure. The only tip we've seen is that you get someone to place a nylon pull-tie on your previous wrap while holding tension so as not to lose the progress you have made. HOWEVER, we just tried to install new bungees on our model 3. The manual calls for 6 wraps. We could only get five, and it seems that there is only enough room on the brackets for five. The original bungees were a little thinner, but that might be due to age, and I got 7 wraps with them. I thought after 9 years flying that I should maybe replace them. Does anyone know what date the color codes indicate? My old ones were black, black, red. The new ones are green, gold, gold. Thanks for any info, Regards, Joe ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:12:16 PM PST US From: Michael Gibbs Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Skystars facts about flaperons --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs >Well ... Mike, my friend ... here it is, for the fourth time: > >The year was 1991. A fine year it was. And that year, Denney >Aerocraft Corportation wrote in its Owner Manual for the Kitfox >model III Michel, my friend...I know you've posted that 4 times, but... Not everyone has a Model III, as you know, and the manuals for each are different. Given the number of folks that claim to have found no reference to the flap limiter in their respective manuals, I thought a reference to SkyStar's bulletin would be helpful. I'm not completely daft, you know... :-) Mike G. N728KF ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:31:55 PM PST US From: Michel Verheughe Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Skystars facts about flaperons --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe James Shumaker wrote: > I was quite surprised to find that the total deflection was 9 degrees. Ah! Finally, another model III like mine! :-) > Pay no attention to those that do not seem to respond to your clarification > of the max flap deflection. Don't worry, Jim, I am used to it. My wife never responds when I talk about aviation ... ha, ha, ha! :-) Seriously, my only interest in the discussion was to know how my conservative 10 degrees was giving such an awkward feeling of the plane, when others use up to 30 degrees of deflection. Could the difference between the model III and model IV be so great that flaperons can be deflected three times as much? Cheers, Michel do not archive ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 02:36:15 PM PST US From: Michel Verheughe Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Skystars facts about flaperons --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe Michael Gibbs wrote: > I'm not completely daft, you know... :-) Of course not, Mike, and I apologize if I gave the impression that you would. The interesting part here, is that, in 1991, Denney wrote about limiting the deflection of the flaps, while Skystar removed the comment in later manuals. One can but wonder why. Cheers, Michel ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 02:45:01 PM PST US From: "ron schick" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: bunggy cord problem --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" Joe just a thought, but you are supporting the plane so the gear is down all the way. I added two wraps to my nosegear (AVID) while my big friend held the tail down for me. Ron NB OR >From: "joe" >Reply-To: kitfox-list@matronics.com >To: >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: bunggy cord proublem >Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 16:53:57 -0400 > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "joe" >The only tip we've seen is that >you get someone to place a nylon pull-tie on your previous wrap >Thanks for any info, >Regards, >Joe > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 03:04:27 PM PST US From: "joe" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: bunggy cord problem --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "joe" <> Joe just a thought, but you are supporting the plane so the gear is down all > the way. ++++ I tie a wire between the gear legs to hold the tubes up tight to the airframe. ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 04:35:53 PM PST US From: "Brett Walmsley" Subject: Kitfox-List: Flaperon angle info on Sportflight --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" I have added 10 scans from the Skystar Classic IV manual dated June '03 and a Kitfox Times article that I saved. They are posted under "Text/Articles". ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 05:00:34 PM PST US From: "Graeme Toft" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: bunggy cord problem --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" I had a similar issue with bungies some time back and with the help of many listers made my own bungies and installed them without hassle. I found that the easiest way to fit them was with one person under and another in the plane to feed the loose end back. I placed the plane off the ground on a padded saw horse so the gear would droop. I found that just pressing firmly on the bungy with my thumb was enough pressure to hold it in place while the free hand passed the loose end up to my mate. It was dead easy and completed in 10 minutes per side. One thing I did find however was that given the length prescribed by sky star for each bungy, I ended up with seven wraps instead of 6. It has made absolutely no difference to the way the suspension works. Cheers Graeme Toft ----- Original Message ----- From: "ron schick" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: bunggy cord problem > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" > > > Joe just a thought, but you are supporting the plane so the gear is down > all > the way. I added two wraps to my nosegear (AVID) while my big friend held > the tail down for me. > Ron NB OR > > >>From: "joe" >>Reply-To: kitfox-list@matronics.com >>To: >>Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: bunggy cord proublem >>Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 16:53:57 -0400 >> >>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "joe" >>The only tip we've seen is that >>you get someone to place a nylon pull-tie on your previous wrap >>Thanks for any info, >>Regards, >>Joe >> >> > > > -- > > ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 05:46:24 PM PST US From: "Graeme Toft" Subject: Kitfox-List: New plane --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" HI guys, I am in the process of looking seriously at a Model 1V 1200 with an NSI Subaru motor and electric adjustable 3 blade prop. Its quite a step up from my 582 powered Model 1 so would really appreciate comments on performance by those with similar aircraft. I realise this is a very general request but I need to source as much info as I can before I travel 2500 klm to see the plane. Issues such as cruise speed, full burn, reliability, issues to check on inspection etc. Anything to put me into a more knowledgeable position would be great. Cheers and thanks in advance Graeme Toft ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 06:09:24 PM PST US From: Steve Zakreski Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: New plane --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Steve Zakreski Whatdya want to know? Where are you located? szakreski@shaw.ca SteveZ Calgary IV/NSI-EA81/CAP -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Graeme Toft Subject: Kitfox-List: New plane --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" HI guys, I am in the process of looking seriously at a Model 1V 1200 with an NSI Subaru motor and electric adjustable 3 blade prop. Its quite a step up from my 582 powered Model 1 so would really appreciate comments on performance by those with similar aircraft. I realise this is a very general request but I need to source as much info as I can before I travel 2500 klm to see the plane. Issues such as cruise speed, full burn, reliability, issues to check on inspection etc. Anything to put me into a more knowledgeable position would be great. Cheers and thanks in advance Graeme Toft ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 06:37:30 PM PST US From: Steve Zakreski Subject: Kitfox-List: thing ma jig? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Steve Zakreski What's the generic name for that thing ma jig that looks like a shock absorber that stops the door from opening too fast?! SteveZ ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 06:37:30 PM PST US From: "Jeffrey Puls" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Night VFR --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jeffrey Puls" Bill, I bought my light from Beam Distributing, Inc. There address is PO Box 71884 Richmond, Va. 23255 Phone 804-440-6489 e-mail beam_dist@hotmail.com Item Code QTY Description Price Ea. Amount 1930C black 1 L1 LED flashlight $14.80 $14.80 Shipping & Handling $6.95 $6.95 TOTAL $21.75 Hope this helps. They had same day shipping. I have two and they are great! > [Original Message] > From: Jeffrey Puls > To: > Date: 9/16/2005 9:51:26 PM > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Night VFR > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jeffrey Puls" > > Bill, > I'll look at my receipts and tell you where I bought it. Jeff > > > > [Original Message] > > From: Chenoweth > > To: > > Date: 9/16/2005 4:02:59 PM > > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Night VFR > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Chenoweth" > > > > Jeff, > > Nothing is simple. I found that the Pelican people won't sell to me so > I'm > > in contact with a local marine outfit which carries the lights. > > On Pelican's web site I found an L1 LED light (no price on the web site) > > that fit your description but had only a white lens. > > I found another one that was part of a kit including mounting hardware and > > some kind of swivel thing and it had both red and green lenses. But it > > turns out to be $32 more or less. > > Not to be an ongoing pest but do you happen to have a part number or > > something equivalent that I can use to get one of these things? > > > > Actually, the $32 kit didn't sound all that bad, but being nearly three > > times what you paid I figure I should investigate further. > > Bill > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Jeffrey Puls" > > To: > > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Night VFR > > > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jeffrey Puls" > > > > > > > Bill, > > > It is the L-1 LED. It is 2 5/8' long, is 6,000 candle power and burns > for > > > 130 hours. The cost is only $11.52. 2 5/8" long is perfect for the > KItfox > > > cockpit. Jeff > > > > > > > > > > [Original Message] > > > > From: Chenoweth > > > > To: > > > > Date: 9/12/2005 6:23:36 PM > > > > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Night VFR > > > > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Chenoweth" > > > > > > > > Jeff, > > > > What is the model number or name of the flashlights you bought? > > > > Bill > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Jeffrey Puls" > > > > To: > > > > Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Night VFR > > > > > > > > > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jeffrey Puls" > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you guys want some cool instrument lighting here is a > suggestion. I > > > > went > > > > > to the Pelican website. They sell flashlights. There is a very small > > one > > > > > that has a little clip on it. I bought two of these and put adel > > clamps > > > on > > > > > them and put them on the overhead braces each side. I tilted them > > > > downward. > > > > > They come with red and green lens. Plenty of light and they look > cool > > on > > > > > the instruments. They take about three nicad batteries (wafer type) > > and > > > > > will go about 200 hours (So they say). They look professionally > > mounted > > > > and > > > > > they look like they belong there. Cheap! Jeff Classic IV > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Original Message] > > > > > > From: Andrew Matthaey > > > > > > To: > > > > > > Date: 9/9/2005 10:58:03 PM > > > > > > Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Night VFR > > > > > > > > > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andrew Matthaey" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Wow - I took the 'Fox up tonight...It was NOTHING short of > > incredible > > > - > > > > > > there aren't words. I haven't installed the instrument lighting, > but > > I > > > > > went > > > > > > up anyway with a flashlight, though I didn't end up using it. I > > could > > > > > just > > > > > > make out the white hands on the instruments, and I knew where they > > > > should > > > > > be > > > > > > - and I was able to keep altitude/airspeed very nicely. > > > > > > > > > > > > I climbed up to two thousand feet and just cruised with the doors > > > open, > > > > > > enjoying the warm night air (a temp. inversion had already > begun). A > > > > > local > > > > > > airport - Sanford, ME, had one of the runways lit up like a > > christmas > > > > > tree, > > > > > > complete with the "rabbit" for the ILS. Portsmouth, NH was > gorgeous, > > > and > > > > > I > > > > > > even saw some fireworks! If it weren't for my buddy waiting for me > > on > > > > the > > > > > > ground, I would never have come down :) > > > > > > > > > > > > I started my descent and just crossed the threshold on short final > > > when > > > > > the > > > > > > runway lights went out. I fiddled with the handheld to turn them > > back > > > on > > > > > and > > > > > > then went around for another shot. I watched the landing light hit > > the > > > > > > pavement and made a greaser of a wheel-landing - absolutely > perfect! > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm still grinning ear-to-ear, two hours later! What a privilege! > > > > > > > > > > > > Andrew > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: "Andrew Matthaey" > > > > > > >Reply-To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > > > > > >To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > > > > > >Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Night VFR > > > > > > >Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 00:31:49 -0400 > > > > > > > > > > > > > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andrew Matthaey" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Of course, Canada always follows suit! LoL...j/k > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Andrew > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Steve Zakreski > > > > > > > >Reply-To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > > > > > > >To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > > > > > > >Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Night VFR > > > > > > > >Date: Thu, 08 Sep 2005 21:17:35 -0600 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Steve Zakreski > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >... and Canada > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >SteveZ > > > > > > > >Calgary, Canada > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > > > > > > >From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > > > > > > > >[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > > Andrew > > > > > > > >Matthaey > > > > > > > >To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > > > > > > >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Night VFR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andrew Matthaey" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Oh god I love sailing...that's my next project, when I get out > of > > > > > school > > > > > > >- > > > > > > > >a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >little two-person, seaworthy sailboat. I would love to see > > > > Norway...I'm > > > > > > > >mostly Norwegian through my grandparents...When I worked for > > Virgin > > > > > > > >Atlantic > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Airways after High School, I was sent to London for training. I > > > > almost > > > > > > >got > > > > > > > >a > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >non-rev standby ticket to Oslo...had to go to Hong Kong instead > > > > though! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >I hear that the United States is one of very few countries to > > allow > > > > > > >pilots > > > > > > > >to fly at night, VFR, without an Instrument ticket... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Andrew > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Michel Verheughe > > > > > > > > >Reply-To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > > > > > > > >To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > > > > > > > >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Night VFR > > > > > > > > >Date: Thu, 08 Sep 2005 21:41:46 +0200 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Andrew Matthaey wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I love flying at night > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >That's my only regret, Andrew: with my Norwegian Utralight > > > license, > > > > I > > > > > > > >can't > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >fly > > > > > > > > >at night. But I'd love to. I have sailed a lot at night and I > > > like > > > > it > > > > > > > >very > > > > > > > > >much. In fact, I find it easier because I can easily find my > > > > position > > > > > > > >from > > > > > > > > >bearings on lighthouses. The Norwegian and Swedish > archipelago > > is > > > > > very > > > > > > > > >complex > > > > > > > > >but well lit by sector lights. You just follow the white > > sector. > > > > > When > > > > > > >it > > > > > > > > >gets > > > > > > > > >red or green, you're too much on one or the other side. It's > > very > > > > > > > >exciting > > > > > > > > >to > > > > > > > > >pass between islands you don't see, knowing that you're on > the > > > > right > > > > > > > >track > > > > > > > > >because, before you, many fishermen have used the same > channel > > > and > > > > > made > > > > > > > >it > > > > > > > > >safe. ... but, I am getting off-topic, here! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Enjoy your night flying, friend! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Cheers, > > > > > > > > >Michel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >do not archive > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 06:41:20 PM PST US From: Jim Carriere Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 27 Msgs - 09/16/05 --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Carriere > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: RV73HL@aol.com > > Can you give me a short history on Skystar for the past 10 years. > From what > I am reading on the list, I'm hearing good and bad from their > customers. If > they are having problems, what do you think they are and why? Howard, try searching the archives http://www.matronics.com/search/ That goes back to late 2003, before then http://groups.yahoo.com/group/kitfoxlist/ There is quite a bit of material in there to swallow, I know. Skystar's own website has a well written history about the line of airplanes. The company's problems are obviously money related. This has put them behind on kit deliveries for the last few years. If you had to narrow it down to an event, I'd say a runaway small plane crashed into their hangar a few years ago, and neither party was very well insured (or insured at all). Personally, my single biggest problem with them is customers repeatedly being told unrealistic delivery dates. Jim in NW FL Series 7 in progress __________________________________ ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 06:43:33 PM PST US From: "Graeme Toft" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: New plane --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" Hi Steve, Im in Australia. Any performance figures, weight and balance issues, engine reliability/performace/common problems and hidden costs would be a good start. Maybe just your own experience with the plane. Im not after specifics, just general info before I jump into the car and drive for 30 hours to check it out. Do not archive. Cheers Graeme Toft ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Zakreski" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: New plane > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Steve Zakreski > > Whatdya want to know? Where are you located? > > szakreski@shaw.ca > > > SteveZ > Calgary > IV/NSI-EA81/CAP > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Graeme Toft > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kitfox-List: New plane > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" > > HI guys, I am in the process of looking seriously at a Model 1V 1200 with > an > NSI Subaru motor and electric adjustable 3 blade prop. Its quite a step up > from my 582 powered Model 1 so would really appreciate comments on > performance by those with similar aircraft. I realise this is a very > general > request but I need to source as much info as I can before I travel 2500 > klm > to see the plane. Issues such as cruise speed, full burn, reliability, > issues to check on inspection etc. Anything to put me into a more > knowledgeable position would be great. > > Cheers and thanks in advance > Graeme Toft > > > -- > > ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 06:45:06 PM PST US From: KITFOXZ@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: thing ma jig? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: KITFOXZ@aol.com In a message dated 9/17/2005 9:38:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, szakreski@shaw.ca writes: What's the generic name for that thing ma jig that looks like a shock absorber that stops the door from opening too fast?! SteveZ That would be your chin Steve John P. Marzluf Columbus, Ohio Outback, (out back in the garage) ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 06:49:30 PM PST US From: jareds Subject: Kitfox-List: Vent Line --> Kitfox-List message posted by: jareds On a recent trip my fuel flow slowed down considerably and was not keeping the header full. Turbulence had knocked the vent line off it's shelf where it was coiled up and was hanging beside the header in a loop like the trap in you kitchen sink. Do ya'll think that may have restricted flow and how do you guys route your vent line, yet keep it long enough to accomodate wing folding? Thanks Jared ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 06:55:01 PM PST US From: "Andrew Matthaey" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: thing ma jig? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andrew Matthaey" Depends on who you speak to...some call it a Lift-Strut (automotive guys mostly), some just call it a gas shock/strut, and some just call it a thingamajig :) Andrew >From: KITFOXZ@aol.com >Reply-To: kitfox-list@matronics.com >To: kitfox-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: thing ma jig? >Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 21:44:49 EDT > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: KITFOXZ@aol.com > > >In a message dated 9/17/2005 9:38:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, >szakreski@shaw.ca writes: > >What's the generic name for that thing ma jig that looks like a shock >absorber that stops the door from opening too fast?! > >SteveZ > > >That would be your chin Steve > >John P. Marzluf >Columbus, Ohio >Outback, (out back in the garage) > > http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 06:56:22 PM PST US From: "Andrew Matthaey" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: New plane --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andrew Matthaey" You can drive for 30 hrs and still not be across Australia? LoL...Might end up in the Pacific :) Andrew do not archive >From: "Graeme Toft" >Reply-To: kitfox-list@matronics.com >To: >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: New plane >Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 11:43:39 +1000 > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" > >Hi Steve, Im in Australia. Any performance figures, weight and balance >issues, engine reliability/performace/common problems and hidden costs >would >be a good start. Maybe just your own experience with the plane. Im not >after >specifics, just general info before I jump into the car and drive for 30 >hours to check it out. > >Do not archive. > >Cheers >Graeme Toft >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Steve Zakreski" >To: >Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: New plane > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Steve Zakreski > > > > Whatdya want to know? Where are you located? > > > > szakreski@shaw.ca > > > > > > SteveZ > > Calgary > > IV/NSI-EA81/CAP > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Graeme Toft > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Kitfox-List: New plane > > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Graeme Toft" > > > > HI guys, I am in the process of looking seriously at a Model 1V 1200 >with > > an > > NSI Subaru motor and electric adjustable 3 blade prop. Its quite a step >up > > from my 582 powered Model 1 so would really appreciate comments on > > performance by those with similar aircraft. I realise this is a very > > general > > request but I need to source as much info as I can before I travel 2500 > > klm > > to see the plane. Issues such as cruise speed, full burn, reliability, > > issues to check on inspection etc. Anything to put me into a more > > knowledgeable position would be great. > > > > Cheers and thanks in advance > > Graeme Toft > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Dont just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 07:00:03 PM PST US From: "John Perry" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: thing ma jig? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Perry" Gas spring , hydraulic damper , thing a ma jig that goes in and out and holds the whatcha ma callit open , John in sw wind blowin no water flatland KS. -------Original Message------- From: Steve Zakreski Subject: Kitfox-List: thing ma jig? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Steve Zakreski What's the generic name for that thing ma jig that looks like a shock absorber that stops the door from opening too fast?! SteveZ ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 07:03:48 PM PST US From: Jim Carriere Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Rotec R2800 --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Carriere > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh" > Jim, > Hurry up and get that thing in the air! I want a report on how > that engine > performs. Hi Randy, That'll happen soon enough. I have about 300 hours of work done right now, still quite a ways to go. I get between 0 and 40 hours done each month, depending on what else is going on. Probably at least a year until I take flight. By all accounts, I'm expecting to be pleased. The prop turns slightly faster than 2400rpm max, which combined with a large diameter (74" or greater) climb/STOL prop is supposed to give impressive static thrust. I may try to fit an IVO inflight adjustable prop on there (the engine uses a 912 type hub). I have the wing strut fairings, wing fales ribs, and tail feather ribs, so I'm also hopeful my top speed will be respectable (that is if I don't build too heavy...). One of the reasons I picked this airplane is for occasional cross country flying (emphasis occasional). Rotec's website has a couple of Kitfox articles and plenty of pictures that may either satisfy your appetite or whet it even more. Jim in NW FL Series 7 in progress __________________________________ ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 07:13:48 PM PST US From: "Brett Walmsley" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: thing ma jig? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" Gas cylinder.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Zakreski" Subject: Kitfox-List: thing ma jig? > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Steve Zakreski > > What's the generic name for that thing ma jig that looks like a shock > absorber that stops the door from opening too fast?! > > SteveZ > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 07:32:03 PM PST US From: "Ron Liebmann" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: thing ma jig? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ron Liebmann" Steve, Here is the info for the gas struts. I pulled up the site for H.A.Guden at www.guden.com and there were my original ones. I have part # GGS43-060-K which is a 60 pound type with the plastic ends. I ordered 2 of them at a price of $9.27 each plus shipping. Ron N55KF > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Steve Zakreski > > What's the generic name for that thing ma jig that looks like a shock > absorber that stops the door from opening too fast?! > > SteveZ > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 07:42:23 PM PST US From: Mdkitfox@aol.com Subject: Kitfox-List: Oil System question --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Mdkitfox@aol.com I just finished installing the oil tank and cooler on my 912S and then began to install the oil lines. The oil tank has two fittings welded on that look to accept a B-nut and 37 degree flared tube. I can't find any parts in the kit that would allow the oil lines to be installed on these fittings nor could I find any parts in the Aircraft Spruce catalog that goes from flared tube to a hose connection. Do any of you gents who have a series V, VI, or VII have any suggestions on how to install the oil lines? Rick Weiss N39RW, 912S Series V Speedster DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 07:42:23 PM PST US From: "ron schick" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: thing ma jig? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" Steve I think strut was what the manual called it, but if it really is the chin then I'm sure you've called it plenty! LOL Ron NB OR do not archive >From: Steve Zakreski >Reply-To: kitfox-list@matronics.com >To: kitfox-list@matronics.com >Subject: Kitfox-List: thing ma jig? >Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 19:19:52 -0600 > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Steve Zakreski > >What's the generic name for that thing ma jig that looks like a shock >absorber that stops the door from opening too fast?! > >SteveZ > > ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 09:53:50 PM PST US From: "jdmcbean" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Oil System question --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" Rick, The oil tank fittings come with the engine.... There is a small box that should be with your engine.. the fittings should be in there.... Fly Safe !! John & Debra McBean www.sportplanellc.com "The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground" -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Mdkitfox@aol.com Subject: Kitfox-List: Oil System question --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Mdkitfox@aol.com I just finished installing the oil tank and cooler on my 912S and then began to install the oil lines. The oil tank has two fittings welded on that look to accept a B-nut and 37 degree flared tube. I can't find any parts in the kit that would allow the oil lines to be installed on these fittings nor could I find any parts in the Aircraft Spruce catalog that goes from flared tube to a hose connection. Do any of you gents who have a series V, VI, or VII have any suggestions on how to install the oil lines? Rick Weiss N39RW, 912S Series V Speedster DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________ Time: 09:57:20 PM PST US From: Marco Menezes Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Vent Line --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Marco Menezes Hi Jared. Your problem could be related to air trapped in the header tank. There was a long string awhile ago on venting header tanks. You should check the archives, there were many good opinions and ideas. What I settled on was routing the vent line along the right side of cabin at the wing root and, at the highest point, venting out though the lexan into a rearward facing aluminum tube. I also put an Andair check valve (bleeder type) in the vent line to keep fuel from getting sucked out but this didn't seem to work. So now I just cap the vent after fueling and checking that all air is bled out of the header. Since the system is all inside the cabin, it doesn't affect wing folding at all. If you want, I can send you a photo. jareds wrote: --> Kitfox-List message posted by: jareds On a recent trip my fuel flow slowed down considerably and was not keeping the header full. Turbulence had knocked the vent line off it's shelf where it was coiled up and was hanging beside the header in a loop like the trap in you kitchen sink. Do ya'll think that may have restricted flow and how do you guys route your vent line, yet keep it long enough to accomodate wing folding? Thanks Jared Marco Menezes Model 2 582 N99KX --------------------------------- Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. ________________________________ Message 39 ____________________________________ Time: 10:50:59 PM PST US From: "Rick" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Vent Line --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Rick" I have found that my right tank always flows faster than the left. I think this is due to the vent being in the right tank. I plan on adding a second header vent to the left tank, but this is not number one on things to do. FYI. Rick -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Marco Menezes Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Vent Line --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Marco Menezes Hi Jared. Your problem could be related to air trapped in the header tank. There was a long string awhile ago on venting header tanks. You should check the archives, there were many good opinions and ideas. What I settled on was routing the vent line along the right side of cabin at the wing root and, at the highest point, venting out though the lexan into a rearward facing aluminum tube. I also put an Andair check valve (bleeder type) in the vent line to keep fuel from getting sucked out but this didn't seem to work. So now I just cap the vent after fueling and checking that all air is bled out of the header. Since the system is all inside the cabin, it doesn't affect wing folding at all. If you want, I can send you a photo. jareds wrote: --> Kitfox-List message posted by: jareds On a recent trip my fuel flow slowed down considerably and was not keeping the header full. Turbulence had knocked the vent line off it's shelf where it was coiled up and was hanging beside the header in a loop like the trap in you kitchen sink. Do ya'll think that may have restricted flow and how do you guys route your vent line, yet keep it long enough to accomodate wing folding? Thanks Jared Marco Menezes Model 2 582 N99KX --------------------------------- Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.