Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:27 AM - Re: how to recharge Matco Brakes (Paul Seehafer)
2. 06:19 AM - SV: Spins in a model III (Michel Verheughe)
3. 07:35 AM - Re: Looking for SB #35-Inboard Flaperon Hinge Installation (Tom Jones)
4. 08:11 AM - Re: Looking for SB #35-Inboard Flaperon Hinge (Guy Buchanan)
5. 08:20 AM - Re: how to recharge Matco Brakes (Marco Menezes)
6. 09:31 AM - Re: Looking for SB #35-Inboard Flaperon Hinge Installation (Ted Palamarek)
7. 09:50 AM - Re: SDM Fly-in (Harris, Robert)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: how to recharge Matco Brakes |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Paul Seehafer" <av8rps@tznet.com>
Mike,
I just finished bleeding my matco brakes on my amphib float installation. I
had similar problems because my passenger side brake cylinders were too
tight on the adjustment. In other words, make sure the rods that attach to
the pedals have a little free play in them when at rest. If they don't, you
won't be able to get fluid to the main masters on the pilots side.
Now, if you don't have a setup for the passenger, you want to check the
pilots side cylinders for the same thing. If there is any pressure at all
on the rod when at rest, the cylinder is partly activated and you won't get
fluid past there.
I used the method of a small hand pump oil can with a hose attached at the
brake bleeder on the wheel, attached a hose to the fill hole on topside of
the brake cylinder (I don't have a separate reservoir) down to a coffee can,
so when I pumped fluid from the oil can up to the cylinder once it was full
it ran down the clear line into the coffee can. I ran enough fluid through
to make sure there were no bubbles, turned my brake bleeder handtight while
the oil can was still attached to the bottom, and I had a nice firm pedal.
Hopefully this makes sense to you when reading it. Otherwise you can call
me.
Btw - two things I learned about matco brake cylinders. If you have the
reservoir type cylinders it is common for fluid to seep out of the top of
the cylinder around the actuator rods. I thought initially my cylinders
were bad because of this, but after getting them overhauled by Matco, then
calling Matco's technical support, I learned this is common.
Second thing I learned is that if you have MC-1 Matco cylinders (Dark in
color with built in reservoir, traditionally installed on the pilots side
only) along with a passenger brake setup, if you both hit the pedals at the
same time in just the right sequence, the brake will lock up and you won't
be able to release it! Nice, huh? Especially when thinking about an
instructor trying to teach you how to fly your Kitfox. Matco has a simple
modification they can do if you send the cylinders to them for a rebuild,
but they rebuilt my MC-1's without installing the modification because I
didn't tell them I had dual brakes in my airplane, or asked for it. (Of
course they never asked if I had dual brakes, and I wasn't aware of the
problem until after I had the new cylinders back and installed). I
obviously disagree with their policy of not doing the modification
automatically. I wonder how many guys might have wrecked their airplanes
because of this problem, thinking it was their fault when really it was the
brakes? Incidentally, after concern for Skystars site being shut down, I
was copying Service bulletins and found that Skystar had acknowledged this
problem in Service Letter number 23. I sent you a copy to your personal
e-mail.
Paul Seehafer
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Ford" <fordm2003@yahoo.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: how to recharge Matco Brakes
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Mike Ford <fordm2003@yahoo.com>
>
> Does anyone know if there is a trick to filling Matco
> brakes? I think Im missing something.
>
> When I fill the brakes, I uncap the reservoir.
>
> Then loosen the nipple by the wheel until it's loose
> enough that brake fluid starts flowing.
>
> Then I connect the oil can after clearing the hose of
> air.
>
> When filling, the oil pressure from the hand pump
> forces oil out from the filling tube where it meets
> the oil can before oil gets into the brake lines.
>
> It seems that the pressure required to fill the brakes
> lines should be quite light. Is there maybe another
> plug that needs to be loosened?
>
> Thanks,
> Mike
>
>
> __________________________________
> http://farechase.yahoo.com
>
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Spins in a model III |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
Thanks Jim, Rex, Bruce and Alan.
From: James Shumaker [jimshumaker@sbcglobal.net]
> It is interesting that your flight model fits my experience.
Well, I'd rather say the other way around, Jim! :-)
But you and Bruce seem to have a different experience of how easily the spin develops.
Of course, you have two slightly different aircraft.
The reason I try to sharpen my knowledge is that I am reaching nearly 200 hours
in my Kitfox and I believe this is the dangerous time when one thinks one can
fly, yet one has still a lot to learn. And I'd rather learn from other's experience!
:-)
When I do a gentle idle-engine stall, I notice that one wing (often the left one
in my plane) drops first. It is easily corrected by nose down and rudder right.
But if I didn't, would I end up in a spin?
I try to fly very carefuly, always keeping the speed far from the two red lines
and never turning more than 45 degrees bank (on the model 3, that is one of the
crossbars in front of the windscreen, parallel to the horizon). But I am afraid,
one day, to be taken in what I think you call, a Moose Stall. It's so easy,
especially with a passenger insisting to take a photo of something.
An interesting fact that I discovered in the X-Plane simulator is that, the more
the CG is aft, the faster a wing will drop in a stall. Is that true to reality?
Unfortunately, beyond the initial stall, no simulator can simulate reality. That
is because everything is calculated from modelled airfoils and there are no
data when the apparent wind comes at say, 90 degrees of the normal flow. Then
there is the shading of surfaces as, e.g. the tail shades one side of the horizontal
stab. To do this correctly one should use Computational Fluid Dynamics
(CFD) and that could take hours per single animation frame. Not a real-time simulation,
is it?
So, spins have to be tested in real life and my ambition is to stay out of them
therefore that's why I enjoy reading the experience of those who dare.
Cheers,
Michel
do not archive
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Looking for SB #35-Inboard Flaperon Hinge Installation |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Tom Jones <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
I just checked the Sportflight/Skystar web site and most of it worked
except service bulletin #35. Some wierd computer quirk going on with it
I guess. Guy, I already had both of the ones you need and just sent
them to your email address.
Tom Jones, Classic 4, Ellensburg, WA
RV73HL@aol.com wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: RV73HL@aol.com
>
>Sorry group....I just rechecked the web site, and the SB and SL or listed,
>but I was unable to open the files...The site is reported closed...
>
>_http://www.sportflight.com/skystar/_ (http://www.sportflight.com/skystar/) _
>
>Howard
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Looking for SB #35-Inboard Flaperon Hinge |
Installation
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com> Installation
Thanks Tom. I had already tried the Sportflight web site and found what you
did. I assumed that applied to all SB's, so I'm glad you looked a little
further.
Guy
At 07:32 AM 11/11/2005, you wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Tom Jones <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
>
>I just checked the Sportflight/Skystar web site and most of it worked
>except service bulletin #35. Some wierd computer quirk going on with it
>I guess. Guy, I already had both of the ones you need and just sent
>them to your email address.
>Tom Jones, Classic 4, Ellensburg, WA
>
>RV73HL@aol.com wrote:
>
> >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: RV73HL@aol.com
> >
> >Sorry group....I just rechecked the web site, and the SB and SL or listed,
> >but I was unable to open the files...The site is reported closed...
> >
> >_http://www.sportflight.com/skystar/_
> (http://www.sportflight.com/skystar/) _
> >
> >Howard
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: how to recharge Matco Brakes |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Marco Menezes <msm_9949@yahoo.com>
Hi Mike. You might consider pulling the cylinder and rebuilding it. Matco has kits for every model, they're cheap and it's really an easy job. I couldn't get all the air out of one of mine, rebuilt it and it's as good as new. You can order kits on-line. Check 'em out. http://matcomfg.com
ike Ford <fordm2003@yahoo.com> wrote:
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Mike Ford
I checked the main cyl. they are fully open.
I don't believe that there is air in the line. I
can't really see the whole line, as it runs under the
floor board and through the grove gear... Air would
make it's way up through the line, wouldn't it? Would
air make it's way all the way to the reservoir?
Actually, my guss is that it would not. I can imagine
that one would not want any running up to the res.,
but rather only the res to feed the pumps. Can anyone
confirm that?
As for the vented cap, no. I don't believe it is of
that type. However, I did remove it when I tried
filling the lines. What is the functional difference
between a vented and not vented reservoir cap?
Filling at the res. might work just fine. However, I
started down this road because the brakes seem a
little mushy and they have a slight leak. The
reservoir, however still has a fair amount of fluid,
maybe half full.
Can one open up the res, open up the nips by the wheel
and then pump the brakes to get fluid and any air to
come out the bottom (nips)?
Mike
--- kerrjohna@comcast.net wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by:
> kerrjohna@comcast.net
>
> if everything is connected properly, the only
> resistance should be the 4' or so of head pressure
> to the reservoir. If there is no air bubbles in the
> lines, then it would be acceptable to fill at the
> reservoir. Do you have the vented cap on the
> reservoir?
>
> John
>
> -------------- Original message --------------
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Mike Ford
> >
> > Does anyone know if there is a trick to filling
> Matco
> > brakes? I think Im missing something.
> >
> > When I fill the brakes, I uncap the reservoir.
> >
> > Then loosen the nipple by the wheel until it's
> loose
> > enough that brake fluid starts flowing.
> >
> > Then I connect the oil can after clearing the hose
> of
> > air.
> >
> > When filling, the oil pressure from the hand pump
> > forces oil out from the filling tube where it
> meets
> > the oil can before oil gets into the brake lines.
> >
> > It seems that the pressure required to fill the
> brakes
> > lines should be quite light. Is there maybe
> another
> > plug that needs to be loosened?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mike
> >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________
> > http://farechase.yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> if everything is connected properly, the only
> resistance should be the 4' or so of head pressure
> to the reservoir. If there is no air bubbles in the
> lines, then it would be acceptable to fill at the
> reservoir. Do you have the vented cap on the
> reservoir?
>
> John
>
> -------------- Original message --------------
>
> -- Kitfox-List message posted by: Mike Ford
>
>
> Does anyone know if there is a trick to filling
> Matco
> brakes? I think Im missing something.
>
> When I fill the brakes, I uncap the reservoir.
>
> Then loosen the nipple by the wheel until it's
> loose
> enough that brake fluid starts flowing.
>
> Then I connect the oil can after clearing the hose
> of
> air.
>
> When filling, the oil pressure from the hand pump
> forces oil out from the filling tube where it meets
>
> the oil can before oil gets into the brake lines.
>
> It seems that the pressure required to fill the
> brakes
> lines should be quite light. Is there maybe another
>
> plug that needs to be loosened?
>
> Th
> anks,
> Mike
>
>
> __________________________________
> http://farechase.yahoo.com
>
>
> =======================================
>
>
>
> Click on
> about
> provided
> www.buildersbooks.com,
> Admin.
> _->
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
http://farechase.yahoo.com
Marco Menezes
Model 2 582 N99KX
---------------------------------
Message 6
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| Subject: | Looking for SB #35-Inboard Flaperon Hinge Installation |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ted Palamarek" <temco@telusplanet.net>
Tom
Could you please send me a copy of SB#35 direct to my E-mail
address
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Thank You.
Ted Palamarek
Edmonton, Ab
---------SNIP-------
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Looking for SB #35-Inboard
Flaperon Hinge
Installation
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Tom Jones
<nahsikhs@elltel.net>
I just checked the Sportflight/Skystar web site and most of
it worked
except service bulletin #35. Some wierd computer quirk
going on with it
I guess. Guy, I already had both of the ones you need and
just sent
them to your email address.
Tom Jones, Classic 4, Ellensburg, WA
Message 7
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Harris, Robert" <Robert_Harris@intuit.com>
I just talked to Jim Chapman and he says it is scheduled for Saturday the
Nov, 19th and I read that on one of the Brown Field newsletters posted on
the internet.
Robert
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Guy Buchanan
Subject: Kitfox-List: SDM Fly-in
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com>
All,
EAA Chapter 14 is showing the Kitfox Fly-in as TBA. Desert Fox is
showing it as 11/19. Does anyone have updated status?
Thanks,
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582 / 99.9% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
Do not archive
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