Kitfox-List Digest Archive

Tue 01/17/06


Total Messages Posted: 16



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 02:46 AM - Re: I caught my wing on FIRE! (Ceashman@aol.com)
     2. 04:48 AM - Re: I caught my wing on FIRE! (Fox5flyer)
     3. 07:10 AM - Re: Flying Kitfoxes (but somewhat off topic) (Kerry Skyring)
     4. 08:36 AM - Re: I caught my wing on FIRE! (Brett Walmsley)
     5. 08:56 AM - OT request for Apollo data cable (Bradley M Webb)
     6. 09:33 AM - Re: Best RPM for takeoff with IVO prop and 912ULS REFERENCE CARD (kitfoxjunky)
     7. 03:23 PM - Re: I caught my wing on FIRE! (Ceashman@aol.com)
     8. 03:54 PM - Re: I caught my wing on FIRE! (Brett Walmsley)
     9. 04:02 PM - Anyone have Series 5,6,or7 with 0-235 or 0-200? (michael burkhardt)
    10. 04:07 PM - Re: Anyone have Series 5,6,or7 with 0-235 or 0-200? (Forfun3@aol.com)
    11. 05:28 PM - Re: I caught my wing on FIRE! (flier)
    12. 06:14 PM - Re: Anyone have Series 5,6,or7 with 0-235 or 0-200? (eccles)
    13. 07:25 PM - Static RPM (Andrew Matthaey)
    14. 07:36 PM - Cold weather (Kirk Martenson)
    15. 08:03 PM - Re: Static RPM (Malcolmbru@aol.com)
    16. 09:36 PM - Static RPM (Andrew Matthaey)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 02:46:08 AM PST US
    From: Ceashman@aol.com
    Subject: Re: I caught my wing on FIRE!
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ceashman@aol.com Hi Brett. Did you get my response to the first message? Way below is the response What is C-2210? Is it water borne or solvent borne? Be careful with a lot of packaged rags, there could be a blend of nylon, polyester and cotton. More chance of static shock in the winter when the humidity is down (under 40% RI) and less chance when there is water in the air. We all know this, we walk across an office area and get zapped by the door handle. Because the central air heater is removing even more of the humidity in the office environment. Actually, the best rag to use would be cotton terry towels. Little chance for creating static and a wonderfully soft and porous surface to pick up the sanding sludge and debris. No matter what rag you use, move slower while wiping the surface with the wet towel or when using the clean towel to dry off. More speed and the chance for friction goes up and the chance for depositing a charge goes up. You want to convert your Kitfox into a Zippo, use mineral spirits or any solvent degreaser, grab old shirt material (the collar, evening wear type) and wipe down industriously and you have the makings of a hazard. If you want something that is really good, we have a product used in our sign division that is used for cleaning down acrylic and polycarbonate sign faces before painting. The back lit signs you see at fast food restaurants, gas stations and that kind of thing. But you will have to get that solvent off a friendly sign painting shop! But when painting my IV, I used the home brew of 50 : 50 alcohol and distilled water. You can use rubbing alcohol from the drug store or IPA, isopropyl alcohol from Home Depot and the likes. And if you want the ultimate cloth. Use a real chamois cloth, natural leather, so no chance of static. This is what they use in the plastic face sign industry. >>Kevin and Brett. >I am very familiar with Anti Static Degreaser, used for plastic and >fiberglass parts, that kind of stuff. I have worked for Akzo Nobel for 27 years. >DO NOT USE THE NORMAL SOLVENT DEGREASERS WHEN WIPING DOWN >ANYTHING THAT IS >NYLON, POLYESTER OR FIBERGLASS. >Brett. Go to the local drug counter and purchase a bottle of rubbing alcohol, a gallon of distilled water and also one of those trigger sprayers. Mix the alcohol 50 / 50 with distilled water and now you have a very good static free cleaner. It is easy to spray on with the pump sprayer and you wipe off/dry off with some cotton towels (old T shirts). You can use this on plexiglass or anything you want to clean down. It is not a very good wax remover Kevin, that is why we have the Anti Static Degreaser for car repair. This in fact will be superior to a solvent degreaser to remove the dried out traces of the wet sanding sludge of the silver Polyspray. So using the alcohol wipe will not build up electricity = SAFER, and because you do not charge the surface with static electricity you should have a much cleaner paint job because the trash will not be attracted by the static charge. >All the best, Eric.


    Message 2


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    Time: 04:48:10 AM PST US
    From: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
    Subject: Re: I caught my wing on FIRE!
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us> I'd like to add just a few cents to this. When refueling we often spill a little gas on the wing and the first thing many of us do is to grab a rag to wipe it off. Just remember that the act of wiping up the gas can create a static charge. At least replace the cap first, but it's a good idea to use Allan's method below to kill any possible buildup. Deke > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Alan & Linda Daniels <aldaniels@fmtc.com> > > I have been preaching a product called static guard for a lot of years > now. It is a product that women use on dresses and the same stuff that > you use around computes. It is at your grocery store. When painting > spray it inside the wing or in whatever you are working on. A ground > wire is also a good idea. It will really help in the painting as static > will mess up the paint and pull everything into the wet paint, and it > might help keep you from blowing it up. If you refuel yourself, spray it > on the funnel, the wing and the gas can before you pour gas. > > Brett Walmsley wrote: > > >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" <N93HJ@numail.org> > > > >I changed the subject so more people might read the message. > >Hoping I will to prevent a repeat for someone else. > > > >There has been some discussion in the past regarding some of the dangers of static > >electricity and refueling. Well, I have a story to share. Some of you know > >me and know I have been working on this model IV for two years now. Seems like > >I started it yesterday. It has been the most rewarding project I have ever been > >involved with. I am finished covering and I am in the painting stage now. > >I must confess it is much easier than I thought it would be. Just like the poly-fiber > >book says, "poly-tone is dead easy". Well, the tail feathers are silver > >the fuse is white and today I started painting on the wings. I had one wing > >on the rotating fixture in the booth (garage) and was wiping it down with C-2210 > >to prep for the first spray coat of poly-brush. I could "feel" the static electricity > >popping as I wiped the wing as I had felt it numerous times before > >in the painting process when all of a sudden, "woof", the rag ignited and I had > >a nice fire on my hands. The wing was burning and so was the rag. Luckily, I > >blew the fire on the wing out almost instantly (no damage other than some soot > >and pride), but the rag was saturated with C-2210 and as I threw it to the floor > >it flared up pretty good. I kicked it to the door, got the door open and > >stomped it out, but, WOW what a scare. This is my third incident in my life with > >static electricity. Y'all be careful out there. > >Any input on how to prevent this would be greatly appreciated. I am not done painting > >yet, but I am a little nervous about wiping down with C-2210. I was using > >painters rags from Home Depot (t-shirt type material). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >


    Message 3


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    Time: 07:10:26 AM PST US
    From: "Kerry Skyring" <kerryskyring@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Flying Kitfoxes (but somewhat off topic)
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kerry Skyring" <kerryskyring@hotmail.com> Michel wrote > >If the wind brings you up north, friend, you know how to find me! Hi Michel, One day my plan is to fly north and I will definitely find the Norwegian Fox. And I too have read everything by Bach and St. Ex. Still cold, still no thaw. K. do not archive > >


    Message 4


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    Time: 08:36:05 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: I caught my wing on FIRE!
    From: "Brett Walmsley" <n93hj@numail.org>
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" <n93hj@numail.org> Yes, I did get your first message. Thanks I appreciate your input and will take measures to prevent a recurrence. C-2210 is a product recommended and sold by the Poly-fiber folks. They suggest wiping down between spraying coats of their products. I was using the terry cloth but it had too many pieces left behind. I am going to 1. slowdown the wiping action and 2. attempt to ground myself and the work. Again, thanks for your advice. Brett > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ceashman@aol.com > > Hi Brett. > > Did you get my response to the first message? > Way below is the response > > What is C-2210? Is it water borne or solvent borne? > > Be careful with a lot of packaged rags, there could be a blend of nylon, > polyester and cotton. > More chance of static shock in the winter when the humidity is down (under > 40% RI) and less chance when there is water in the air. We all know this, > we > walk across an office area and get zapped by the door handle. Because the > central > air heater is removing even more of the humidity in the office > environment. > > Actually, the best rag to use would be cotton terry towels. Little chance > for > creating static and a wonderfully soft and porous surface to pick up the > sanding sludge and debris. > > No matter what rag you use, move slower while wiping the surface with the > wet > towel or when using the clean towel to dry off. More speed and the chance > for > friction goes up and the chance for depositing a charge goes up. > You want to convert your Kitfox into a Zippo, use mineral spirits or any > solvent degreaser, grab old shirt material (the collar, evening wear type) > and > wipe down industriously and you have the makings of a hazard. > > If you want something that is really good, we have a product used in our > sign > division that is used for cleaning down acrylic and polycarbonate sign > faces > before painting. The back lit signs you see at fast food restaurants, gas > stations and that kind of thing. But you will have to get that solvent off > a > friendly sign painting shop! > But when painting my IV, I used the home brew of 50 : 50 alcohol and > distilled water. You can use rubbing alcohol from the drug store or IPA, > isopropyl > alcohol from Home Depot and the likes. > And if you want the ultimate cloth. Use a real chamois cloth, natural > leather, so no chance of static. This is what they use in the plastic face > sign > industry. > >>>Kevin and Brett. >>I am very familiar with Anti Static Degreaser, used for plastic and >>fiberglass parts, that kind of stuff. I have worked for Akzo Nobel for 27 > years. >>DO NOT USE THE NORMAL SOLVENT DEGREASERS WHEN WIPING DOWN >ANYTHING THAT >> IS >>NYLON, POLYESTER OR FIBERGLASS. > >>Brett. > Go to the local drug counter and purchase a bottle of rubbing alcohol, a > gallon of distilled water and also one of those trigger sprayers. > > Mix the alcohol 50 / 50 with distilled water and now you have a very good > static free cleaner. > It is easy to spray on with the pump sprayer and you wipe off/dry off with > some cotton towels (old T shirts). You can use this on plexiglass or > anything > you want to clean down. It is not a very good wax remover Kevin, that is > why > we > have the Anti Static Degreaser for car repair. > > This in fact will be superior to a solvent degreaser to remove the dried > out > traces of the wet sanding sludge of the silver Polyspray. > So using the alcohol wipe will not build up electricity = SAFER, and > because > you do not charge the surface with static electricity you should have a > much > cleaner paint job because the trash will not be attracted by the static > charge. > >>All the best, Eric. > >


    Message 5


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    Time: 08:56:53 AM PST US
    From: "Bradley M Webb" <bmwebb@cox.net>
    Subject: OT request for Apollo data cable
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bradley M Webb" <bmwebb@cox.net> Does anyone, by chance, have a PC interface cable for an old Apollo Precedus GPS? Mine unit works fine, but I would like to get the database updated. Thanks, Bradley KF2 N1836 Middle GA


    Message 6


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    Time: 09:33:04 AM PST US
    From: kitfoxjunky <kitfoxjunky@decisionlabs.com>
    Subject: Best RPM for takeoff with IVO prop and 912ULS REFERENCE
    CARD --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kitfoxjunky <kitfoxjunky@decisionlabs.com> No..the reference card is not on the site..but if you call them I am sure they will send it out. They gave them out for free at a seminar I attended. They also have a log book for the 912 series that is very useful. It has all of the recommended maintenance listed at vaious engine times. Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox do not archive "Randy Daughenbaugh" <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com> Sent by: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com 01/14/2006 02:18 PM Please respond to kitfox-list To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com> cc: Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Best RPM for takeoff with IVO prop and 912ULS --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh" <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com> Gary, Is the reference card on the website? I couldn't find them. It does sound like something of value. Thanks, Randy - Series 5/7 912S . -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxjunky Sent: Friday, January 13, 2006 6:26 AM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Best RPM for takeoff with IVO prop and 912ULS --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kitfoxjunky <kitfoxjunky@decisionlabs.com> Sorry...in my last email I mean to provide the links for the Rotax 912 series quick in cockpit reference card for operating parameters. Here is where you can find the source for these. http://www.rotaxservice.com/rotax_tips/rotax_age.htm http://www.rotaxservice.com/rotax_tips/rotax_vibration.htm Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox do not archive


    Message 7


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    Time: 03:23:53 PM PST US
    From: Ceashman@aol.com
    Subject: Re: I caught my wing on FIRE!
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ceashman@aol.com >>Yes, I did get your first message. Thanks I appreciate your input and will take measures to prevent a recurrence. C-2210 is a product recommended and sold by the Poly-fiber folks. They suggest wiping down between spraying coats of their products. I was using the terry cloth but it had too many pieces left behind. I am going to 1. slowdown the wiping action and 2. attempt to ground myself and the work. Again, thanks for your advice. >>Brett Hi Brett. I went looking for info on the Polyfiber product C-2210 Paint Cleaning Solvent. Could not find too much info on the PF site, only to use it before the tack off procedure and paint. In the Aircraft Spruce catalogue the description shows; "a mild solvent formulated to remove oil, silicone and wax" I don't know, but this sound like a mineral based product for it to be able to cut silicone and wax. I have no idea what it states on the label it probably states something that will lead us to understand what the product is made of. If it is mineral based then be careful when using on fabric or any kind of plastic. Now of course, as long as you haven't been eating hamburgers while sanding. You should not have a problem with contaminants like grease, oil and wax. I have packed my Polyfiber manual away so I dot really know what this C-2210 is. Try a quick sniff, if it smells kind of like kerosene then watch out. Cheers Eric.


    Message 8


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    Time: 03:54:48 PM PST US
    From: "Brett Walmsley" <N93HJ@numail.org>
    Subject: Re: I caught my wing on FIRE!
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" <N93HJ@numail.org> I suspect it is toluene (sp?) I am sure it is not kerosene.. I am just trying to follow directions. This painting stuff is just not my bag. They state in the manual if you able to read and follow instructions you will get the desired result. So far they have been correct, except for the fire.... LOL.... I may give them a ring. They really need a caution note in the manual.. Thanks How's the skybolt coming. I need to pay a visit one day. Say hello to Carin from Hailey and me. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Ceashman@aol.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 6:22 PM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: I caught my wing on FIRE! > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ceashman@aol.com > >>>Yes, I did get your first message. Thanks > I appreciate your input and will take measures to prevent a recurrence. > C-2210 is a product recommended and sold by the Poly-fiber folks. > They suggest wiping down between spraying coats of their products. > I was using the terry cloth but it had too many pieces left behind. > I am going to 1. slowdown the wiping action and 2. attempt to ground > myself and the work. > Again, thanks for your advice. >>>Brett > > Hi Brett. > I went looking for info on the Polyfiber product C-2210 Paint Cleaning > Solvent. Could not find too much info on the PF site, only to use it > before the tack > off procedure and paint. > In the Aircraft Spruce catalogue the description shows; "a mild solvent > formulated to remove oil, silicone and wax" > I don't know, but this sound like a mineral based product for it to be > able > to cut silicone and wax. I have no idea what it states on the label it > probably > states something that will lead us to understand what the product is made > of. > If it is mineral based then be careful when using on fabric or any kind of > plastic. > Now of course, as long as you haven't been eating hamburgers while > sanding. > You should not have a problem with contaminants like grease, oil and wax. > I have packed my Polyfiber manual away so I dot really know what this > C-2210 > is. > Try a quick sniff, if it smells kind of like kerosene then watch out. > > Cheers Eric. > > >


    Message 9


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    Time: 04:02:49 PM PST US
    From: michael burkhardt <mjbavid@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Anyone have Series 5,6,or7 with 0-235 or 0-200?
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: michael burkhardt <mjbavid@yahoo.com> Does anyone have a series 5,6,or7 with a 0-235 or 0-200? Would like to hear how the performance is? Regards, Mike


    Message 10


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    Time: 04:07:00 PM PST US
    From: Forfun3@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Anyone have Series 5,6,or7 with 0-235 or 0-200?
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Forfun3@aol.com 0-235, Vixen, 120mph cruise, 900 pounds empty.


    Message 11


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    Time: 05:28:12 PM PST US
    From: "flier" <flier@sbcglobal.net>
    Subject: I caught my wing on FIRE!
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "flier" <flier@sbcglobal.net> Unless you accumulate contaminates on the surfaces then C2210 isn't needed. C2210 is really made to remove contaminates from previously painted surfaces prior to recoating. At least that's what good ole Norm at NormAero told me some yrs ago. I have used it on PolyTone surfaces that have set around for quite a while (months) between coats but that's about it. I wouldn't use it on fresh surfaces (within a couple of weeks of final coating anyway) as there's no real need. Regards, Ted -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Brett Walmsley Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 5:54 PM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: I caught my wing on FIRE! --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Brett Walmsley" <N93HJ@numail.org> I suspect it is toluene (sp?) I am sure it is not kerosene.. I am just trying to follow directions. This painting stuff is just not my bag. They state in the manual if you able to read and follow instructions you will get the desired result. So far they have been correct, except for the fire.... LOL.... I may give them a ring. They really need a caution note in the manual.. Thanks How's the skybolt coming. I need to pay a visit one day. Say hello to Carin from Hailey and me. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Ceashman@aol.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 6:22 PM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: I caught my wing on FIRE! > -


    Message 12


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    Time: 06:14:49 PM PST US
    From: "eccles" <eccles@Chartermi.net>
    Subject: Anyone have Series 5,6,or7 with 0-235 or 0-200?
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "eccles" <eccles@chartermi.net> Series V 0-200 ,, 115 MPH cruise 860 empty ,just installed warp drive 3 blade so should have new results soon, gets off quick . haven't been anywhere that was a problem getting out of -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of michael burkhardt Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 6:02 PM Subject: Kitfox-List: Anyone have Series 5,6,or7 with 0-235 or 0-200? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: michael burkhardt <mjbavid@yahoo.com> Does anyone have a series 5,6,or7 with a 0-235 or 0-200? Would like to hear how the performance is? Regards, Mike


    Message 13


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    Time: 07:25:05 PM PST US
    From: "Andrew Matthaey" <spaghettiohead@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Static RPM
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andrew Matthaey" <spaghettiohead@hotmail.com> Hello List, I have the 3-Blade GSC Wood Prop coupled to a C-Box (3.47:1) and 582. GSC states that static RPM should be about 6200...the previous owner had static RPM way up at about 6500. I'm awfully tired of fine-tuning this thing - whats the best static RPM in your opinions? BTW, right now I'm lucky to push 6200 in climb-out. Thanks! Andrew KF3


    Message 14


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    Time: 07:36:11 PM PST US
    From: "Kirk Martenson" <kirk@mninter.net>
    Subject: Cold weather
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kirk Martenson" <kirk@mninter.net> For those of you who fly with a Rotax 912 in cold weather (20 to -20 degrees F), what are your cylinder head temps, and oil temps? Do you use a radiator flap? Does anyone use a cowling blanket between flights? Thanks, Kirk Martenson Classic IV Rotax 912


    Message 15


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    Time: 08:03:29 PM PST US
    From: Malcolmbru@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Static RPM
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Malcolmbru@aol.com I would leave it at that U will be fine


    Message 16


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    Time: 09:36:32 PM PST US
    From: "Andrew Matthaey" <spaghettiohead@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Static RPM
    --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andrew Matthaey" <spaghettiohead@hotmail.com> Hello List, I have the 3-Blade GSC Wood Prop coupled to a C-Box (3.47:1) and 582. GSC states that static RPM should be about 6200...the previous owner had static RPM way up at about 6500. I'm awfully tired of fine-tuning this thing - whats the best static RPM in your opinions? BTW, right now I'm lucky to push 6200 in climb-out. Thanks! Andrew KF3




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