Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:17 AM - Re: which weld (Clifford Begnaud)
2. 04:09 AM - Re: nameplate location (Lynn Matteson)
3. 04:54 AM - off topic (Mike Chaney)
4. 05:48 AM - Re: Tow Bar (Jim Burke)
5. 06:28 AM - Re: Tow Bar (mscotter@comcast.net)
6. 08:13 AM - Re: Tow Bar (Jim Burke)
7. 11:44 AM - Re: nameplate location (ron schick)
8. 01:34 PM - Trailing edge mod (ron schick)
9. 01:44 PM - Re: Trailing edge mod (Jay Fabian)
10. 01:44 PM - Re: which weld (Cudnohufsky's)
11. 02:18 PM - Re: Trailing edge mod (Vic Baker)
12. 02:46 PM - Re: Tow Bar pictures (Jim Burke)
13. 04:14 PM - Re: nameplate location (Lynn Matteson)
14. 04:41 PM - Re: Trailing edge mod (Lynn Matteson)
15. 05:23 PM - Re: Re: Trailing edge mod (Paul Wilson)
16. 05:39 PM - Re: Trailing edge mod (jdmcbean)
Message 1
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
Numerous Kitfoxes have had broken welds on motor mounts, rudder pedals and
landing gear.
Many of these can be found in the archives and many more have gone
unreported. I don't know all that much about welding, but I wouldn't use mig
in critical high stress areas based upon the failures that I know about.
Cliff
I know we want the best welds, but... the factory used mig on all of our
planes, I havn't seen a problem with that in 20 years now... humm... 22
years.
john Oakley
over a thousand hours in fox's now.. and not nearly enough.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: nameplate location |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Thanks everybody for all the suggestions about the nameplate/data plate
locations. I finally called my DAR-to-be and he wouldn't approve the
tail access covers, so I made a backing plate and placed it behind the
fabric, below and to the rear of the access cover on the left side, and
far enough rearward to catch the vertical member that I had made to
streamline the fin/rudder junction. This member is aluminum, and I
caught two rivets in it, and the other two go through the fabric and
the backing plate. Very sturdy, and no chance of buffeting, I'm pretty
sure.
Lynn
Message 3
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Mike Chaney <mdps_mc@SWOCA.NET>
Sorry to go off topic.
A co-worker of mine is moving to the Bend, Oregon area next month and I told
her and her husband that I may have some contacts through this list to that
area. If anyone in that area wouldn't mind giving her the low-down on that
area I'm sure it would be appreciated.
Please contact me off list at this email address or at poasttown@yahoo.com
Thanks
Mike Chaney
Message 4
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke <jeburke94je@direcway.com>
Hi Mark, What are you calling the drop box? I have some pictures and I would
more then happy to post them if the members are interested.
Jim N94JE
----- Original Message -----
From: "mscotter" <mscotter@comcast.net>
Sent: Monday, February 06, 2006 10:21 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Tow Bar
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "mscotter" <mscotter@comcast.net>
>
> Hey guys, with so much interest maybe some pics should be posted in the
> dropbox. Just an idea.
>
> Mark Scott
> Elkton, MD
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Burke
> Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 12:28 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Tow Bar
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke <jeburke94je@direcway.com>
>
> Good point John, I think the pictures I sent the guys will help, But they
> may want to take there own measurements.
>
> Jim,N94JE
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <kerrjohna@comcast.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 11:59 AM
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Tow Bar
>
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kerrjohna@comcast.net
>>
>> be alert to the fact that the width of the IV's vary some at the tow bar
>> carry through points. There are the IV-1050's, the IV-1200, and the IV
>> Classic. It might be necessary to make some modifications in order to
>> obtain the desired fit.
>>
>> John Kerr
>>
>> -------------- Original message --------------
>> From: Jim Burke <jeburke94je@direcway.com>
>>
>>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke
>>>
>>> Graeme, I will send you pictures with measurements that should help. I
>>> also
>>> think you should have the drawing Don has. I think I have seen it and it
>>> was
>>> a good reference.
>>>
>>> Jim N94JE
>
>
>
Message 5
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: mscotter@comcast.net
Jim, the dropbox is a repository for kitfox list stuff that is of value to all
the membership. There is a wealth of info in there on everything from engines,
to interiors, panels, trailers, and basically anything to do with the kitfox.
Get ready to blow a few hours sifting through it. I have spent more than one
late night checking out the great ideas in there. The address is:
http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=main
I've never added anything to it, but as far as I know any list member can put things
up in the dropbox. It's a heck of a lot more efficient than emailing the
same thing to a bunch of different people, and then it benefits us all.
-------------- Original message --------------
From: Jim Burke <jeburke94je@direcway.com>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke
>
> Hi Mark, What are you calling the drop box? I have some pictures and I would
> more then happy to post them if the members are interested.
>
> Jim N94JE
Jim, the dropbox is a repository for kitfox list stuff that is of value to all
the membership. There is a wealth of info in there on everything from engines,
to interiors, panels, trailers, and basically anything to do with the kitfox.
Get ready to blow a few hours sifting through it. I have spent more than one
late night checking out the great ideas in there. The address is:
http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=main
I've never added anything to it, but as far as I know any list member can put things
up in the dropbox. It's a heck of a lot more efficient than emailing the
same thing to a bunch of different people, and then it benefits us all.
-------------- Original message --------------
From: Jim Burke jeburke94je@direcway.com
-- Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke <JEBURKE94JE@DIRECWAY.COM>
Hi Mark, What are you calling the drop box? I have some pictures and I would
more then happy to post them if the members are interested.
Jim N94JE
Message 6
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke <jeburke94je@direcway.com>
Thanks Mark, I have Been there done that,I guess the words drop box had me a
little confused. I will post some pictures of my tow bar yet this week, for
the ones that are interested to view.
Jim, 94JE
----- Original Message -----
From: <mscotter@comcast.net>
Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 9:07 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Tow Bar
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: mscotter@comcast.net
>
> Jim, the dropbox is a repository for kitfox list stuff that is of value to
> all the membership. There is a wealth of info in there on everything from
> engines, to interiors, panels, trailers, and basically anything to do with
> the kitfox. Get ready to blow a few hours sifting through it. I have
> spent more than one late night checking out the great ideas in there. The
> address is:
>
> http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=main
>
> I've never added anything to it, but as far as I know any list member can
> put things up in the dropbox. It's a heck of a lot more efficient than
> emailing the same thing to a bunch of different people, and then it
> benefits us all.
> -------------- Original message --------------
> From: Jim Burke <jeburke94je@direcway.com>
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke
>>
>> Hi Mark, What are you calling the drop box? I have some pictures and I
>> would
>> more then happy to post them if the members are interested.
>>
>> Jim N94JE
>
> Jim, the dropbox is a repository for kitfox list stuff that is of value to
> all the membership. There is a wealth of info in there on everything from
> engines, to interiors, panels, trailers, and basically anything to do with
> the kitfox. Get ready to blow a few hours sifting through it. I have spent
> more than one late night checking out the great ideas in there. The
> address is:
>
> http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=main
>
> I've never added anything to it, but as far as I know any list member can
> put things up in the dropbox. It's a heck of a lot more efficient than
> emailing the same thing to a bunch of different people, and then it
> benefits us all.
> -------------- Original message --------------
> From: Jim Burke jeburke94je@direcway.com
>
> -- Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke <JEBURKE94JE@DIRECWAY.COM>
>
> Hi Mark, What are you calling the drop box? I have some pictures and I
> would
> more then happy to post them if the members are interested.
>
> Jim N94JE
>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: nameplate location |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" <roncarolnikko@hotmail.com>
Good call Lynn. Where is your dar coming from?
Ron NB Ore
do not archive
>From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: nameplate location
>Date: Tue, 7 Feb 2006 07:11:29 -0500
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
>Thanks everybody for all the suggestions about the nameplate/data plate
>locations. I finally called my DAR-to-be and he wouldn't approve the
>tail access covers, so I made a backing plate and placed it behind the
>fabric, below and to the rear of the access cover on the left side, and
>far enough rearward to catch the vertical member that I had made to
>streamline the fin/rudder junction. This member is aluminum, and I
>caught two rivets in it, and the other two go through the fabric and
>the backing plate. Very sturdy, and no chance of buffeting, I'm pretty
>sure.
>
>Lynn
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Trailing edge mod |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" <roncarolnikko@hotmail.com>
The consensus of the group was that I should add the 3/8" aluminum tubing to
my trailing edge before covering. As my manual does not cover this I was
wondering how close to the ribs this should come. Any other tips? No
3/8" aluminum tubing in my town, but lots of used 3/8" aluminum arrow
shafts. Thanks. Ron NB Ore
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Trailing edge mod |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jay Fabian" <experimental208nd@comcast.net>
I used the expandable foam. Just prayed it in let it over flow, and cut it
off with a razor blade. Just get the regular type not the super expand type.
Jay
----- Original Message -----
From: "ron schick" <roncarolnikko@hotmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 4:32 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Trailing edge mod
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick"
> <roncarolnikko@hotmail.com>
>
> The consensus of the group was that I should add the 3/8" aluminum tubing
> to
> my trailing edge before covering. As my manual does not cover this I was
> wondering how close to the ribs this should come. Any other tips? No
> 3/8" aluminum tubing in my town, but lots of used 3/8" aluminum arrow
> shafts. Thanks. Ron NB Ore
>
>
> --
>
>
Message 10
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Cudnohufsky's" <7suds@chartermi.net>
Mark,
I repaired the aft section of my Model 5 fuselage using mig, I contacted the
factory and asked what wire they were using and bought the exact wire. I
copped all joints / clusters for a tight fit, I used straight burrs of
various sizes in my drill press with a block of wood clamped on the table as
a steady rest (crude but effective). I then emery papered and de-burred the
ends before assembly. Before welding I pre-heated the joints. I would always
cut the end of my wire before starting my weld so the bead that was left
from the last weld was gone. After all was welded I used a heavy black sand
(can't remember the name) to sand blast all the tubing and especially the
weld joints (has some stress relieving attributes) before priming and
painting. I am very happy with the results. One last thing, I used our
local EAA Chapter tech counselor as a resource, he is an A&P and an
inspector so he checked my work along the way, made sure I didn't do
something dumb. And yes, practice is good. What I found was as I built
clusters they required more attention to pre-heat and weld technique as the
mass would tend to weld cold if you did not direct your arc heat there as
opposed to the tube you were adding to the cluster, hope that makes sense to
you.
Good luck, and have fun!!
Lloyd
----- Original Message -----
From: <Mark.Summers@lwbref.com>
Sent: Monday, February 06, 2006 7:59 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: which weld
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Mark.Summers@lwbref.com
>
>
> I sure appreciate everyone's comments and opinions, I believe I will let
> my
> friend give the mig a try on some extra .035 1/2" tube pieces to get a
> feel and if he says go , we go. I have heard or read that 100% argon
> sheilding gas is recommended over the argon co2 mix. I hate to keep asking
> questions butttt. Thanks again Mark
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Trailing edge mod |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Vic Baker" <vr_baker@nvbell.net>
I installed 5/16 tubing, zero clearance between ribs. (3/8 tubing would not quite
fit my trailing edge) The tubing is available from ACS. I used a full 350
degree heat shrink and I could still see a very slight deformation in that
trailing edge.
--------
Vic Baker
Series 7
Carson City, Nevada
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=10689#10689
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Tow Bar pictures |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Burke <jeburke94je@direcway.com>
I have posted pictures of my tow bar on sportFlight in trailers and towing.
http://www.sportflight.com/cgi-bin/uploader.pl?action=view&epoch=1139351404
If someone wants to build there own I hope the pictures help. I would think
you would want to do your own measurements for you plane to make sure it
fits correct. Mine is a mod. IV-1200.
Jim,N94JE
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: nameplate location |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
From Pontiac, Michigan...I'm in Grass Lake, MI.
Lynn
On Tuesday, February 7, 2006, at 02:40 PM, ron schick wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick"
> <roncarolnikko@hotmail.com>
>
> Good call Lynn. Where is your dar coming from?
> Ron NB Ore
> do not archive
>
>> From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: nameplate location
>> Date: Tue, 7 Feb 2006 07:11:29 -0500
>>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>>
>> Thanks everybody for all the suggestions about the nameplate/data
>> plate
>> locations. I finally called my DAR-to-be and he wouldn't approve the
>> tail access covers, so I made a backing plate and placed it behind the
>> fabric, below and to the rear of the access cover on the left side,
>> and
>> far enough rearward to catch the vertical member that I had made to
>> streamline the fin/rudder junction. This member is aluminum, and I
>> caught two rivets in it, and the other two go through the fabric and
>> the backing plate. Very sturdy, and no chance of buffeting, I'm pretty
>> sure.
>>
>> Lynn
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Trailing edge mod |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
3/8" arrow shafts, Ron? Wow, that seems huge. My Dad was an archer and
I've got a lot of his old arrows around here, mostly fiberglas, and
none are over 5/16".
I'd hate to be on the receiving end of a 3/8" arrow! : )
Anyway, I got 3/8" tubing from Aircraft Spruce, 6061-T6, item
#03-35500, $.99/ft., and I got two 12 ft lengths of it, because mine is
a Speedster with wings just 12' long each. I cut each to fit between
the ribs/rib caps.
Skystar manual calls for .028-.035" wall thickness. This is in the
Classic IV manual, Aug '03 revision. With this stiffening, SS says you
can go to 350 degrees on the fabric....that seems like a bit much to
me, and I quit at 310...very tight.
As far as how close to the ribs, I left mine short about 1/8" to allow
for any condensation to be free to find the drain holes in the fabric.
I smeared structural adhesive the length of the individual tubes, then
rolled them in the trailing edge, and rotated them to spread the epoxy.
Lynn
On Tuesday, February 7, 2006, at 04:32 PM, ron schick wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick"
> <roncarolnikko@hotmail.com>
>
> The consensus of the group was that I should add the 3/8" aluminum
> tubing to
> my trailing edge before covering. As my manual does not cover this I
> was
> wondering how close to the ribs this should come. Any other tips?
> No
> 3/8" aluminum tubing in my town, but lots of used 3/8" aluminum arrow
> shafts. Thanks. Ron NB Ore
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Trailing edge mod |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Paul Wilson <pwmac@sisna.com>
Is there a link I have missed with a picture of the installation?
Thanks, Paul
=============
At 02:17 PM 2/7/2006, you wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Vic Baker" <vr_baker@nvbell.net>
>
>I installed 5/16 tubing, zero clearance between ribs. (3/8 tubing would
>not quite fit my trailing edge) The tubing is available from ACS. I used
>a full 350 degree heat shrink and I could still see a very slight
>deformation in that trailing edge.
>
>--------
>Vic Baker
>Series 7
>Carson City, Nevada
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=10689#10689
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Trailing edge mod |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "jdmcbean" <jdmcbean@cableone.net>
Ron,
We did this on the Series 7 and then again on the Sport.. It became part of
the manual shortly after... .375 x .035 wall aluminum tubing cut to fit
just inside rib to rib.. Watch the edges.. there is a Hysol bead that will
keep the tubing too high.. After you get them fitted use Hysol to bond them
in and then rivet to the inside edge... Shrunk to 350 on several different
aircraft including the factory aircraft.. worked great.
Fly Safe !!
John McBean
www.sportplanellc.com
"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of ron schick
Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 2:32 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Trailing edge mod
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" <roncarolnikko@hotmail.com>
The consensus of the group was that I should add the 3/8" aluminum tubing to
my trailing edge before covering. As my manual does not cover this I was
wondering how close to the ribs this should come. Any other tips? No
3/8" aluminum tubing in my town, but lots of used 3/8" aluminum arrow
shafts. Thanks. Ron NB Ore
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