---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 07/18/06: 31 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:29 AM - Engine choices. (Dave G.) 2. 03:51 AM - Re: Plane for sale (Mark Thompson) 3. 03:53 AM - Re: Watermellon social (Paul Seehafer) 4. 04:40 AM - Re: Watermellon social (Fox5flyer) 5. 04:49 AM - Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (kitfoxjunky) 6. 05:16 AM - Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (Fox5flyer) 7. 05:22 AM - Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (Dave) 8. 05:58 AM - Re: Fuse Holder - Panel Mount 250v 30A ??? (RichWill) 9. 05:58 AM - Re: Kitfox Meeting in Oshkosh (Fox5flyer) 10. 06:17 AM - Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (kitfoxjunky) 11. 06:50 AM - Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (Ted Palamarek) 12. 06:50 AM - Re: Kitfox Meeting in Oshkosh (Gary Olson) 13. 07:15 AM - Re: Plane for sale (Algate) 14. 07:15 AM - Re: Fuse Holder - Panel Mount 250v 30A ??? (Bill Hammond) 15. 07:35 AM - Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (Dave) 16. 09:44 AM - Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (Ted Palamarek) 17. 11:29 AM - Re: Engine choices. (Aerobatics@aol.com) 18. 12:20 PM - Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (Noel Loveys) 19. 12:23 PM - Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (Noel Loveys) 20. 12:37 PM - Kitfox crash (Fox5flyer) 21. 01:41 PM - Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (Richard Rabbers) 22. 02:36 PM - Re: Kitfox Meeting in Oshkosh (Flybradair@cs.com) 23. 02:53 PM - Re: Plane for sale (Lowell Fitt) 24. 03:42 PM - Re: Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (Fox5flyer) 25. 04:58 PM - Re: Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (Dave) 26. 05:56 PM - Re: Engine choices. (Bradley M Webb) 27. 06:31 PM - Re: Engine choices. (Dee Young) 28. 07:55 PM - Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables (Richard Rabbers) 29. 09:16 PM - Re: Re: Fuel level sensor (Clint Bazzill) 30. 09:56 PM - Re: Interesting Weekend (somewhat Kitfox related) (James Shumaker) 31. 10:13 PM - Re: Kitfox Meeting in Oshkosh (Ron Liebmann) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:29:14 AM PST US From: "Dave G." Subject: Kitfox-List: Engine choices. I am not planning to change engines, I will overhaul my 582 and fly it but recent threads have me wondering what engines a M. IV will accept. Mine is a Denney aircraft and the assembly manual allows only for the 582 and 912. There is no advice as to weight and HP recomendations and I got to wondering. If I did change engines I expect that the HKS would be the lightest/simplest suitable engine. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:51:29 AM PST US From: "Mark Thompson" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Plane for sale Hi Dave,I would be interested in what kind of performance your friend was getting on the mosler vw,I also have a kitfox 4 with a mosler,I would be interested in ant statts you might have..... Thanks Mark ----- Original Message ----- Sent: 7/17/2006 12:35:50 PM --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "David Dawe" location in NS >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." > >Oooh!! Usable wings!!! > > >----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, July 17, 2006 9:46 AM > > >> >>Anybody interested in a really reasonable project I have a friend >>who >>purchased a nice Model 4 with Moesler VW engine. He didn't like the >>performance so he decided to change the powerplant to a 582. He >>purchased ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:53:45 AM PST US From: "Paul Seehafer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Watermellon social Deke, For anyone wanting to know more about the Watermelon Social at the Seaplane Base, just check out our website at www.oshkoshseaplanebase.com There is info on that event under activities and the pricing is listed under "seaplane base info" under "what will it cost". Buy tickets early as they sell out fast. Date of WMS is Saturday July 29th at the Seaplane Base. Paul Seehafer ----- Original Message ----- From: Fox5flyer Subject: Kitfox-List: Watermellon social I asked about the watermellon social previously and I think somebody said it was at the seaplane base, but I don't recall hearing a date-time. Can anybody fill us in? Deke ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:40:38 AM PST US From: "Fox5flyer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Watermellon social Thanks Paul. I'll definitely visit the seaplane base, however I won't be at the O long enough to make the social. I was hoping it would be earlier in the week. Maybe something will change. Deke do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Seehafer To: kitfox-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 6:53 AM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Watermellon social Deke, For anyone wanting to know more about the Watermelon Social at the Seaplane Base, just check out our website at www.oshkoshseaplanebase.com There is info on that event under activities and the pricing is listed under "seaplane base info" under "what will it cost". Buy tickets early as they sell out fast. Date of WMS is Saturday July 29th at the Seaplane Base. Paul Seehafer ----- Original Message ----- From: Fox5flyer Subject: Kitfox-List: Watermellon social I asked about the watermellon social previously and I think somebody said it was at the seaplane base, but I don't recall hearing a date-time. Can anybody fill us in? Deke ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:49:17 AM PST US From: kitfoxjunky Subject: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables I spent the last couple of years puttering around fixing my anphib floats. A blade departure took out the nose gear, among other things. I finally got them done and back on the plane. When I tried to cycle the gear it was binding...the Johnson bar would not budge. I removed cables and isolated it down to the passenger side main gear. The cable was seized. I got a good grip on it from inside the float, and with someone working the Johnson bar it came loose. The section inside of the cable sleeve was covered in rust. Rubbing it with my fingers the strands disintegrated. I checked the other side and it was going the same direction, only not nearly as bad. All of the other cables are fine...shiny silver everywhere. It was only the main gear upper cables...the ones that run into the cabin. Checking the drawings, all these cables are speced as stainless steel. I am going to take a section in and have it looked at ... but I am betting the ones that went are really galvanized vs SS. The fittings are identical to the others...so I am betting it came from the factory this way. If you are running these floats...have a close look at your cables. Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox do not archive ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:16:58 AM PST US From: "Fox5flyer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables Gary, have you called Aerocet? Deke ----- Original Message ----- From: kitfoxjunky To: kitfox-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 7:44 AM Subject: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables I spent the last couple of years puttering around fixing my anphib floats. A blade departure took out the nose gear, among other things. I finally got them done and back on the plane. When I tried to cycle the gear it was binding...the Johnson bar would not budge. I removed cables and isolated it down to the passenger side main gear. The cable was seized. I got a good grip on it from inside the float, and with someone working the Johnson bar it came loose. The section inside of the cable sleeve was covered in rust. Rubbing it with my fingers the strands disintegrated. I checked the other side and it was going the same direction, only not nearly as bad. All of the other cables are fine...shiny silver everywhere. It was only the main gear upper cables...the ones that run into the cabin. Checking the drawings, all these cables are speced as stainless steel. I am going to take a section in and have it looked at ... but I am betting the ones that went are really galvanized vs SS. The fittings are identical to the others...so I am betting it came from the factory this way. If you are running these floats...have a close look at your cables. Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox do not archive ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:22:55 AM PST US From: "Dave" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables Aercoet has nothing to do with 1100s anymore Deke. I have SS cables on mine. Dave ----- Original Message ----- From: Fox5flyer To: kitfox-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 8:15 AM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables Gary, have you called Aerocet? Deke ----- Original Message ----- From: kitfoxjunky To: kitfox-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 7:44 AM Subject: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables I spent the last couple of years puttering around fixing my anphib floats. A blade departure took out the nose gear, among other things. I finally got them done and back on the plane. When I tried to cycle the gear it was binding...the Johnson bar would not budge. I removed cables and isolated it down to the passenger side main gear. The cable was seized. I got a good grip on it from inside the float, and with someone working the Johnson bar it came loose. The section inside of the cable sleeve was covered in rust. Rubbing it with my fingers the strands disintegrated. I checked the other side and it was going the same direction, only not nearly as bad. All of the other cables are fine...shiny silver everywhere. It was only the main gear upper cables...the ones that run into the cabin. Checking the drawings, all these cables are speced as stainless steel. I am going to take a section in and have it looked at ... but I am betting the ones that went are really galvanized vs SS. The fittings are identical to the others...so I am betting it came from the factory this way. If you are running these floats...have a close look at your cables. Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox do not archive ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:58:47 AM PST US From: "RichWill" Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Fuse Holder - Panel Mount 250v 30A ??? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "RichWill" Bradley, thanks good site... found just the ones.. Rich -------- Semper Fi 15 ITT G2 HqCo HqBn 1st MarDiv Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=48196#48196 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 05:58:47 AM PST US From: "Fox5flyer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox Meeting in Oshkosh --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" Thanks Ed. OK folks. The link below is a map of where the Acee-Duecee is located. I'm proposing we meet up on Wednesday evening about 6pm. I plan to go anyway and hopefully some of you will be able show up so I can meet you great people. It's an excellent place for dinner too. For those who are on foot, I can load a few into my pickup. I can fit three in the back seat and whatever I can get away with in the bed. Just a simple matter of a reasonable and convenient meeting place for the pick-up. Perhaps by the shuttle stop in the main parking area with a post-it note saying KITFOX on your forehead? Anybody have a suggestion? Print out the map on the link below. If you want me to pick you up, my cell is 989 736 8264. Hope to see you there! Deke http://www.nightlifenightclubs.com/night-clubs/listing/435261/us/wi/oshkosh/ ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, July 17, 2006 6:17 PM > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ed Veneck > > You have the spelling wrong. > It's the Acee-Deucee Lounge > 1329 Oregon St. > 920-235-6050 > It is a cool place, and everyone that attends Oshkosh > should go there at least once. > Ed Veneck > > --- Peter Graichen wrote: > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Peter Graichen" > > > > > > > > Hello Fellow Kitfox Builders/Drivers: > > > > It has been suggested by some that we get together > > at Acey Ducey some > > evening during Airventure 2006. However nobody seems > > to know where > > Acey-Ducey is located. > > Oshkosh information has no idea. There is no > > telephone number listed for > > them. I have used every search engine I could think > > of without success. > > Today I called EAA and the lady in membership > > services said that Acey-Ducey > > is located on Oregon Street and 14th Street. > > Can anybody confirm that location? If not, may I > > suggest that we meet on > > Tuesday 25 July at 19:30 local time at Kelly's. > > Kelly's is located at the > > University at the corner of Wisconsin & High Street. > > Peter Graichen > > http:/home.neo.rr.com/n10pg/kitfox.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > browse > > Subscriptions page, > > FAQ, > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List > > > > > > Admin. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:17:21 AM PST US From: kitfoxjunky Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables The rights for the floats have passed thru several hands. A friend was looking at my serial number...and it could be I have number 3 off the line. For those who checked and feel they have SS..check again. In the cabin, the cable looks very much like the other cables. Not sure how you can really tell without removing it and having it tested. Anyone know of a test for SS that is quick and easy? Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox do not archive "Fox5flyer" Sent by: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com 18/07/2006 08:15 AM Please respond to kitfox-list To: cc: Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables Gary, have you called Aerocet? Deke ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 7:44 AM I spent the last couple of years puttering around fixing my anphib floats. A blade departure took out the nose gear, among other things. I finally got them done and back on the plane. When I tried to cycle the gear it was binding...the Johnson bar would not budge. I removed cables and isolated it down to the passenger side main gear. The cable was seized. I got a good grip on it from inside the float, and with someone working the Johnson bar it came loose. The section inside of the cable sleeve was covered in rust. Rubbing it with my fingers the strands disintegrated. I checked the other side and it was going the same direction, only not nearly as bad. All of the other cables are fine...shiny silver everywhere. It was only the main gear upper cables...the ones that run into the cabin. Checking the drawings, all these cables are speced as stainless steel. I am going to take a section in and have it looked at ... but I am betting the ones that went are really galvanized vs SS. The fittings are identical to the others...so I am betting it came from the factory this way. If you are running these floats...have a close look at your cables. Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox do not archive ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:50:26 AM PST US From: "Ted Palamarek" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables Gary Use a magnet --- if it's stainless the magnet will not be attracted. If its steel, coated with zinc then the magnet will be attracted to it. DO NOT ARCHIVE Ted Edmonton, Ab _____ [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxjunky Sent: July 18, 2006 7:12 AM The rights for the floats have passed thru several hands. A friend was looking at my serial number...and it could be I have number 3 off the line. For those who checked and feel they have SS..check again. In the cabin, the cable looks very much like the other cables. Not sure how you can really tell without removing it and having it tested. Anyone know of a test for SS that is quick and easy? Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 06:50:26 AM PST US From: Gary Olson Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox Meeting in Oshkosh Gentlemen, The map is incorrect!!!! Proceed down 20th ave. as shown on the Google map. Turn LEFT on Oregon St., go 6 blocks and the bar is on the left. Trust me, I live here. If there is anything I can help anyone with before/during/after the show please feel free to contact me. I would also be able to transport anyone that needs a ride Wednesday evening. Gary Olson 920 379-6668 Fox5flyer wrote: --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" Thanks Ed. OK folks. The link below is a map of where the Acee-Duecee is located. I'm proposing we meet up on Wednesday evening about 6pm. I plan to go anyway and hopefully some of you will be able show up so I can meet you great people. It's an excellent place for dinner too. For those who are on foot, I can load a few into my pickup. I can fit three in the back seat and whatever I can get away with in the bed. Just a simple matter of a reasonable and convenient meeting place for the pick-up. Perhaps by the shuttle stop in the main parking area with a post-it note saying KITFOX on your forehead? Anybody have a suggestion? Print out the map on the link below. If you want me to pick you up, my cell is 989 736 8264. Hope to see you there! Deke http://www.nightlifenightclubs.com/night-clubs/listing/435261/us/wi/oshkosh/ ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, July 17, 2006 6:17 PM > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ed Veneck > > You have the spelling wrong. > It's the Acee-Deucee Lounge > 1329 Oregon St. > 920-235-6050 > It is a cool place, and everyone that attends Oshkosh > should go there at least once. > Ed Veneck > > --- Peter Graichen wrote: > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Peter Graichen" > > > > > > > > Hello Fellow Kitfox Builders/Drivers: > > > > It has been suggested by some that we get together > > at Acey Ducey some > > evening during Airventure 2006. However nobody seems > > to know where > > Acey-Ducey is located. > > Oshkosh information has no idea. There is no > > telephone number listed for > > them. I have used every search engine I could think > > of without success. > > Today I called EAA and the lady in membership > > services said that Acey-Ducey > > is located on Oregon Street and 14th Street. > > Can anybody confirm that location? If not, may I > > suggest that we meet on > > Tuesday 25 July at 19:30 local time at Kelly's. > > Kelly's is located at the > > University at the corner of Wisconsin & High Street. > > Peter Graichen > > http:/home.neo.rr.com/n10pg/kitfox.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > browse > > Subscriptions page, > > FAQ, > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List > > > > > > Admin. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:15:27 AM PST US From: "Algate" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Plane for sale For those interested I the Model 4 that I mentioned the owners name is Marc Arsenault and he used to be a Kitfox dealer. His email address is northernultralights@sympatico.com And his cell number is +1 (705) 688-3591 I know that he sold the Moesler because of performance issues and purchased the new cowling kit from Skystar. He purchased the cowlings for the 582 engine as this was his preferred choice however I don't know that there is a lot of difference for the 912. I know that there is a full instrument panel but the engine gauges would relate to the VW engine. The plane was registered as experimental so there would be no problem in bringing the plane to the USA and re-registering as Experimental/ Homebuilt. The best way to get Marc is by email as he is traveling back and forward to N.Ontario with his work. He is a really nice guy and very honest so if anybody is interested they won't have any problems. Regards Gary Algate _____ [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave G. Sent: Monday, July 17, 2006 5:26 PM The owner is likely in Sudbury, his aircraft is registered there. I am in Nova Scotia, rebuilding wings. To those who wrote me looking to buy his plane I think you need to contact algate@attglobal.net thanks. ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, July 17, 2006 1:26 PM --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "David Dawe" location in NS _____ >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." > >Oooh!! Usable wings!!! > > >----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, July 17, 2006 9:46 AM > > >> >>Anybody interested in a really reasonable project I have a friend >>who >>purchased a nice Model 4 with Moesler VW engine. He didn't like the >>performance so he decided to change the powerplant to a 582. He >>purchased >>new cowlings but it still needs the engine an engine =========================Navigator to Photoshare, and http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List =========================List Wiki! =========================http://www.matronics.com/contribution ==================================== ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 07:15:35 AM PST US From: Bill Hammond Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fuse Holder - Panel Mount 250v 30A ??? --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Bill Hammond I used two of the bussman holders for the main and essential bus distributions. I chose to use a single 30 amp circuit breaker to protect the main feed. Bill Hammond Parker, CO RichWill wrote: > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "RichWill" > > Does anyone know where I can buy a "bussmann" fuse holder as above.. Aircraft Spruce, Wicks, Leading Edge, ect ect... all have 10a or 15a , but I have not found an aircraft parts dealer or other that has the 30a for a main fuse holder... > > tks > Rich > > -------- > Semper Fi > 15 ITT > G2 HqCo HqBn > 1st MarDiv > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=48062#48062 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 07:35:45 AM PST US From: "Dave" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables Ted, Stainless steel comes on many grades. You cannot say that all SS is not magnetic because that is not true. I just went out and check over a bunch of SS hardware on my floats . All AN SS bolts and nuts very strongly attracted to magnet. SS cables -- gear cables 1/8 and 3/32 were magnetic but less than the AN bolts. 1/16 cable for water rudder were magnetic as well. I think the hardness of the stainless steel might have something to do with the magnetics of it. We have a SS Fridge and magnets do not stick to it but yet the Kids run into the freezer door on bottom and dent it . Go figure !!! Also I think most hardware on the Aerocet floats are made from 303 or 403 grade SS and it is not allot stronger than mild steel. I will guess 30% stronger. Whereas 4130 will be 40 to 70% stronger than the SS. When Dan Denney got Hamilton Stoddard to make the 1100 floats he insisted on SS so they would fit all applications and have no corrosion issues. I have replaced some of the amphibian gear parts with 4130 and it is stronger now. The Aerocet 1100s are a decent float in straight or Amphibian operation. They aren't made anymore but still a few sets around with happy owners. Dave ----- Original Message ----- From: Ted Palamarek To: kitfox-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 9:48 AM Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables Gary Use a magnet --- if it's stainless the magnet will not be attracted. If its steel, coated with zinc then the magnet will be attracted to it. DO NOT ARCHIVE Ted Edmonton, Ab ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxjunky Sent: July 18, 2006 7:12 AM To: kitfox-list@matronics.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables The rights for the floats have passed thru several hands. A friend was looking at my serial number...and it could be I have number 3 off the line. For those who checked and feel they have SS..check again. In the cabin, the cable looks very much like the other cables. Not sure how you can really tell without removing it and having it tested. Anyone know of a test for SS that is quick and easy? Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 09:44:24 AM PST US From: "Ted Palamarek" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables Dave You are correct there are different types of SS. However, you can still determine, reasonably close as to whether a piece of material is more towards ferrous or more towards nickel by the amount of attraction it has for a magnet. I have quite a selection of different grades of SS sheet and hardware and when I need something requiring corrosion resistance and strength is not a factor then I select a piece which has very little magnetic attraction. These are scrap pieces of material I got from a fabrication shop and the entire grade marking are no longer visible, so a magnet is a pretty simple way of judging whether the piece has high stainless consistency or is more towards the ferrous side. Thanks for you comments DO NOT ARCHIVE Ted Edmonton, Ab _____ [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Sent: July 18, 2006 8:35 AM Ted, Stainless steel comes on many grades. You cannot say that all SS is not magnetic because that is not true. I just went out and check over a bunch of SS hardware on my floats . All AN SS bolts and nuts very strongly attracted to magnet. SS cables -- gear cables 1/8 and 3/32 were magnetic but less than the AN bolts. 1/16 cable for water rudder were magnetic as well. I think the hardness of the stainless steel might have something to do with the magnetics of it. We have a SS Fridge and magnets do not stick to it but yet the Kids run into the freezer door on bottom and dent it . Go figure !!! Also I think most hardware on the Aerocet floats are made from 303 or 403 grade SS and it is not allot stronger than mild steel. I will guess 30% stronger. Whereas 4130 will be 40 to 70% stronger than the SS. When Dan Denney got Hamilton Stoddard to make the 1100 floats he insisted on SS so they would fit all applications and have no corrosion issues. I have replaced some of the amphibian gear parts with 4130 and it is stronger now. The Aerocet 1100s are a decent float in straight or Amphibian operation. They aren't made anymore but still a few sets around with happy owners. Dave ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 9:48 AM Gary Use a magnet --- if it's stainless the magnet will not be attracted. If its steel, coated with zinc then the magnet will be attracted to it. DO NOT ARCHIVE Ted Edmonton, Ab _____ [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxjunky Sent: July 18, 2006 7:12 AM The rights for the floats have passed thru several hands. A friend was looking at my serial number...and it could be I have number 3 off the line. For those who checked and feel they have SS..check again. In the cabin, the cable looks very much like the other cables. Not sure how you can really tell without removing it and having it tested. Anyone know of a test for SS that is quick and easy? Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 11:29:32 AM PST US From: Aerobatics@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Engine choices. In a message dated 7/18/2006 5:30:57 A.M. Central Daylight Time, occom@ns.sympatico.ca writes: I am not planning to change engines, I will overhaul my 582 and fly it but recent threads have me wondering what engines a M. IV will accept. Mine is a Denney aircraft and the assembly manual allows only for the 582 and 912. There is no advice as to weight and HP recomendations and I got to wondering. If I did change engines I expect that the HKS would be the lightest/simplest suitable engine. The HKS is a wonderful engine, but has significantly less power than the 582. All choices have their benifits. Personally, I like my 582 in my KF 2. Will not change. almost 250 hrs to date. good luck Dave ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 12:20:34 PM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables test the cable with a good strong magnet. Stainless is non ferrous, won't rust and won't stick to a magnet. Noel -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxjunky Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 10:42 AM The rights for the floats have passed thru several hands. A friend was looking at my serial number...and it could be I have number 3 off the line. For those who checked and feel they have SS..check again. In the cabin, the cable looks very much like the other cables. Not sure how you can really tell without removing it and having it tested. Anyone know of a test for SS that is quick and easy? Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox do not archive "Fox5flyer" Sent by: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com 18/07/2006 08:15 AM Please respond to kitfox-list To: cc: Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables Gary, have you called Aerocet? Deke ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 7:44 AM I spent the last couple of years puttering around fixing my anphib floats. A blade departure took out the nose gear, among other things. I finally got them done and back on the plane. When I tried to cycle the gear it was binding...the Johnson bar would not budge. I removed cables and isolated it down to the passenger side main gear. The cable was seized. I got a good grip on it from inside the float, and with someone working the Johnson bar it came loose. The section inside of the cable sleeve was covered in rust. Rubbing it with my fingers the strands disintegrated. I checked the other side and it was going the same direction, only not nearly as bad. All of the other cables are fine...shiny silver everywhere. It was only the main gear upper cables...the ones that run into the cabin. Checking the drawings, all these cables are speced as stainless steel. I am going to take a section in and have it looked at ... but I am betting the ones that went are really galvanized vs SS. The fittings are identical to the others...so I am betting it came from the factory this way. If you are running these floats...have a close look at your cables. Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox do not archive ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 12:23:15 PM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables I like my 1100s only wish they were amphib! Noel -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 12:05 PM Ted, Stainless steel comes on many grades. You cannot say that all SS is not magnetic because that is not true. I just went out and check over a bunch of SS hardware on my floats . All AN SS bolts and nuts very strongly attracted to magnet. SS cables -- gear cables 1/8 and 3/32 were magnetic but less than the AN bolts. 1/16 cable for water rudder were magnetic as well. I think the hardness of the stainless steel might have something to do with the magnetics of it. We have a SS Fridge and magnets do not stick to it but yet the Kids run into the freezer door on bottom and dent it . Go figure !!! Also I think most hardware on the Aerocet floats are made from 303 or 403 grade SS and it is not allot stronger than mild steel. I will guess 30% stronger. Whereas 4130 will be 40 to 70% stronger than the SS. When Dan Denney got Hamilton Stoddard to make the 1100 floats he insisted on SS so they would fit all applications and have no corrosion issues. I have replaced some of the amphibian gear parts with 4130 and it is stronger now. The Aerocet 1100s are a decent float in straight or Amphibian operation. They aren't made anymore but still a few sets around with happy owners. Dave ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 9:48 AM Gary Use a magnet --- if it's stainless the magnet will not be attracted. If its steel, coated with zinc then the magnet will be attracted to it. DO NOT ARCHIVE Ted Edmonton, Ab _____ [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxjunky Sent: July 18, 2006 7:12 AM The rights for the floats have passed thru several hands. A friend was looking at my serial number...and it could be I have number 3 off the line. For those who checked and feel they have SS..check again. In the cabin, the cable looks very much like the other cables. Not sure how you can really tell without removing it and having it tested. Anyone know of a test for SS that is quick and easy? Gary Walsh KF IV Anphib 912S C-GOOT www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 12:37:36 PM PST US From: "Fox5flyer" Subject: Kitfox-List: Kitfox crash http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/wales/5191552.stm ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 01:41:06 PM PST US From: "Richard Rabbers" Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" > > > All AN SS bolts and nuts very strongly attracted to magnet. > SS cables -- gear cables 1/8 and 3/32 were magnetic but less than the AN bolts. > > Anyone know of a test for SS that is quick and easy? > Magnetic ? 300 series stainless is non-ferrous and should be non-magnetic but... can become magnetic with cold working. I'm not sure but the rolling of thread on an AN bolt may creating slight magnetic attraction. SS wire is also worked (drawn) so will probably be mildly magnetic. 400 series stainless is ferous and is magnetic. A test My experience with stainless wire is mostly with sailboat rigging. Sometimes sleeved cable in use on a sailboat for lifelines around the hull. This is one wire you don't want to count on - but if needed, you don't want it to break! There are plenty of poor grades of wire - mostly with a clear sleeve. If rusted, the rust color should show the stain. A good way to 'test' cable (wire rope) that is intended to be flexible would be to bend it slightly - and expect it to 'feel' flexible with some engergy to return to the orginal shape. Rusted or over worked wire will feel stiffer (not return) or .... you may even feel the strands break as you bend. If it does not feel very flexible or looks bad... it probably is. Stainless Steel - Magnetic Properties http://www.mceproducts.com/knowledge-base/article/article-dtl.asp?id=18 > -------- Richard in SW Michigan Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=48326#48326 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 02:36:32 PM PST US From: Flybradair@cs.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox Meeting in Oshkosh Unfortunately we plan on arriving this Saturday and leaving Wednesday. One of the guys that I am going with has to be at work Thursday. If something changes I will see you guys there! Brad Martin Wichita N232WB In a message dated 7/18/06 8:04:52 AM Central Daylight Time, morid@northland.lib.mi.us writes: > > > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" > > Thanks Ed. > OK folks. The link below is a map of where the Acee-Duecee is located. I'm > proposing we meet up on Wednesday evening about 6pm. I plan to go anyway > and hopefully some of you will be able show up so I can meet you great > people. It's an excellent place for dinner too. > For those who are on foot, I can load a few into my pickup. I can fit three > in the back seat and whatever I can get away with in the bed. Just a simple > matter of a reasonable and convenient meeting place for the pick-up. > Perhaps by the shuttle stop in the main parking area with a post-it note > saying KITFOX on your forehead? Anybody have a suggestion? > Print out the map on the link below. > If you want me to pick you up, my cell is 989 736 8264. > Hope to see you there! > Deke > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 02:53:38 PM PST US From: "Lowell Fitt" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Plane for sale --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" > I know that he sold the Moesler because of performance issues and > purchased > the new cowling kit from Skystar. He purchased the cowlings for the 582 > engine as this was his preferred choice however I don't know that there is > a > lot of difference for the 912. I helped with the cowl on a 582 to 912 conversion. It was not too difficult. As I recall it requierd adding about 2" to the back of the ring cowls and that was about it. Lowell ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 03:42:31 PM PST US From: "Fox5flyer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" My rudder cables that were part of my 1995 S5 kit were specified as SS and appeared to be SS, but a magnet would show attraction. Not as much as 4130 would, but it definitely indicates that they have some iron in there. I suspect it's an alloy that has just enough nickel to keep them flexible and corrosion resistant. I haven't got a clue about metallurgy. Just my experiences. Deke ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 4:39 PM > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" > > > > > > > > All AN SS bolts and nuts very strongly attracted to magnet. > > SS cables -- gear cables 1/8 and 3/32 were magnetic but less than the AN bolts. > > > > Anyone know of a test for SS that is quick and easy? > > > > > Magnetic ? > 300 series stainless is non-ferrous and should be non-magnetic but... can become magnetic with cold working. > > I'm not sure but the rolling of thread on an AN bolt may creating slight magnetic attraction. SS wire is also worked (drawn) so will probably be mildly magnetic. > > 400 series stainless is ferous and is magnetic. > > > A test > My experience with stainless wire is mostly with sailboat rigging. > Sometimes sleeved cable in use on a sailboat for lifelines around the hull. This is one wire you don't want to count on - but if needed, you don't want it to break! There are plenty of poor grades of wire - mostly with a clear sleeve. If rusted, the rust color should show the stain. > > A good way to 'test' cable (wire rope) that is intended to be flexible would be to bend it slightly - and expect it to 'feel' flexible with some engergy to return to the orginal shape. Rusted or over worked wire will feel stiffer (not return) or .... you may even feel the strands break as you bend. If it does not feel very flexible or looks bad... it probably is. > > Stainless Steel - Magnetic Properties > > http://www.mceproducts.com/knowledge-base/article/article-dtl.asp?id=18 > > > > > -------- > Richard in SW Michigan > Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration) > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=48326#48326 > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 04:58:30 PM PST US From: "Dave" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave" Deke, Yes that is my findings on my SS cable and hardware today. AN SS hardware had more attraction than the SS cable but they both were magnetic. No idea why but I wold imagine the different grades have more or less nickel and chromium ? Dave ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 6:39 PM > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" > > My rudder cables that were part of my 1995 S5 kit were specified as SS and > appeared to be SS, but a magnet would show attraction. Not as much as > 4130 > would, but it definitely indicates that they have some iron in there. I > suspect it's an alloy that has just enough nickel to keep them flexible > and > corrosion resistant. > I haven't got a clue about metallurgy. Just my experiences. > Deke > > ----- Original Message ----- > Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 4:39 PM > > >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" >> >> >> > >> > >> > All AN SS bolts and nuts very strongly attracted to magnet. >> > SS cables -- gear cables 1/8 and 3/32 were magnetic but less than > the AN bolts. >> > >> > Anyone know of a test for SS that is quick and easy? >> > >> >> >> Magnetic ? >> 300 series stainless is non-ferrous and should be non-magnetic but... can > become magnetic with cold working. >> >> I'm not sure but the rolling of thread on an AN bolt may creating slight > magnetic attraction. SS wire is also worked (drawn) so will probably be > mildly magnetic. >> >> 400 series stainless is ferous and is magnetic. >> >> >> A test >> My experience with stainless wire is mostly with sailboat rigging. >> Sometimes sleeved cable in use on a sailboat for lifelines around the > hull. This is one wire you don't want to count on - but if needed, you > don't > want it to break! There are plenty of poor grades of wire - mostly with > a > clear sleeve. If rusted, the rust color should show the stain. >> >> A good way to 'test' cable (wire rope) that is intended to be flexible > would be to bend it slightly - and expect it to 'feel' flexible with some > engergy to return to the orginal shape. Rusted or over worked wire will > feel > stiffer (not return) or .... you may even feel the strands break as you > bend. If it does not feel very flexible or looks bad... it probably is. >> >> Stainless Steel - Magnetic Properties >> >> http://www.mceproducts.com/knowledge-base/article/article-dtl.asp?id=18 >> > >> >> >> -------- >> Richard in SW Michigan >> Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration) >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=48326#48326 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 05:56:25 PM PST US From: "Bradley M Webb" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Engine choices. My understanding is that you have the most choices on your Model IV. The tubing used in my Model 2 is smaller than the 4, therefore I had to be reasonably careful what I hung on it. I have not specifically looked for that in a 4, but I was told this when asking about different engines, particularly the VW options. Bradley _____ [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave G. Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 6:24 AM I am not planning to change engines, I will overhaul my 582 and fly it but recent threads have me wondering what engines a M. IV will accept. Mine is a Denney aircraft and the assembly manual allows only for the 582 and 912. There is no advice as to weight and HP recomendations and I got to wondering. If I did change engines I expect that the HKS would be the lightest/simplest suitable engine. ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 06:31:39 PM PST US From: "Dee Young" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Engine choices. The Jabiru 2200 is a good choice too. Dee Young Do not archive ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 07:55:13 PM PST US From: "Richard Rabbers" Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Aerocet 1100 Anphib floats - check your cables --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" Stainless Steel The term for grades of steel that contain more than 10% chromium, with or without other alloying elements. Stainless steel resists corrosion, maintains its strength at high temperatures, and is easily maintained. For these reasons, it is used widely in items such as automotive and food processing products, as well as medical and health equipment. The most common grades of stainless steel are: TYPE 304 The most commonly specified austenitic (chromium-nickel stainless class) stainless steel, accounting for more than half of the stainless steel produced in the world. This grade withstands ordinary corrosion in architecture, is durable in typical food processing environments, and resists most chemicals. Type 304 is available in virtually all product forms and finishes. TYPE 316 Austenitic (chromium-nickel stainless class) stainless steel containing 2%-3% molybdenum (whereas 304 has none). The inclusion of molybdenum gives 316 greater resistance to various forms of deterioration. TYPE 409 Ferritic (plain chromium stainless category) stainless steel suitable for high temperatures. This grade has the lowest chromium content of all stainless steels and thus is the least expensive. TYPE 410 The most widely used martensitic (plain chromium stainless class with exceptional strength) stainless steel, featuring the high level of strength conferred by the martensitic. It is a low-cost, heat-treatable grade suitable for non-severe corrosion applications. TYPE 430 The most widely used ferritic (plain chromium stainless category) stainless steel, offering general-purpose corrosion resistance, often in decorative applications. http://www.makinamuhendisi.com/idx/0/046/article/A-Beginners-Guide-to-Robotics-Projects-Using-the-PIC-Micro-.html Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=48445#48445 ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 09:16:18 PM PST US From: "Clint Bazzill" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Fuel level sensor --- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found --- A message with no text/plain MIME section was received. The entire body of the message was removed. Please resend the email using Plain Text formatting. HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section in their client's default configuration. If you're using HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings and switch to a default mail option that uses "Plain Text". --- MIME Errors No Plain-Text Section Found --- ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 09:56:40 PM PST US From: James Shumaker Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Interesting Weekend (somewhat Kitfox related) Great Story Lowell Sign me up for a copy of the flight. Jim Shumaker ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 10:13:22 PM PST US From: "Ron Liebmann" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox Meeting in Oshkosh --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ron Liebmann" Herb Gottelt ( Model 4 Speedster ) & Ron Liebmann ( Model 2/582 ) will be there at 6pm to meet up with ya'll.. Do Not Archive ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, July 17, 2006 5:17 PM > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Ed Veneck > > You have the spelling wrong. > It's the Acee-Deucee Lounge > 1329 Oregon St. > 920-235-6050 > It is a cool place, and everyone that attends Oshkosh > should go there at least once. > Ed Veneck > > --- Peter Graichen wrote: > >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Peter Graichen" >> >> >> >> Hello Fellow Kitfox Builders/Drivers: >> >> It has been suggested by some that we get together >> at Acey Ducey some >> evening during Airventure 2006. However nobody seems >> to know where >> Acey-Ducey is located. >> Oshkosh information has no idea. There is no >> telephone number listed for >> them. I have used every search engine I could think >> of without success. >> Today I called EAA and the lady in membership >> services said that Acey-Ducey >> is located on Oregon Street and 14th Street. >> Can anybody confirm that location? If not, may I >> suggest that we meet on >> Tuesday 25 July at 19:30 local time at Kelly's. >> Kelly's is located at the >> University at the corner of Wisconsin & High Street. >> Peter Graichen >> http:/home.neo.rr.com/n10pg/kitfox.htm >> >> >> >> >> >> browse >> Subscriptions page, >> FAQ, >> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List >> >> >> Admin. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > __________________________________________________ > > >